Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Fake heiress caught scamming thousands of dollars says 'I'M NOT SORRY'

Episode Date: July 25, 2019

Fake German heiress, Anna Sorokin, convicted of grand larceny after swindling banks, hotels and even her friends says she's not sorry about it. Hear what Nancy Grace has to say about that along with h...er expert panel. With us today, California prosecutor Wendy Patrick, Former FBI Special Agent Jeff Cortese, Psychologist and reporter John Lemley. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. The thing is, I'm not sorry. Wow. You know, when you hear some defendant claim, the thing is, I'm not sorry. Doesn't that just get under your nerves? That is a direct quote. Her words, not mine. Wait till you hear who said this. I'm Nancy Grace.
Starting point is 00:00:37 This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. I'm talking about the fake heiress, Anna Sorokin. We were talking about this the other day. Anna Sorokin passed herself off in the elite circles of Manhattan as an heiress, an heiress. And what she did, well, she just got off trial and she was found guilty. A jury convicts Anna Sorokin, one of her many names, and sentences her, the judge sentences her, to four to 12 years behind bars. of thousands of dollars from banks ritzy hotels to bankroll a really lavish lifestyle in manhattan believe it or not she gives a jailhouse interview to who the new york times where she says she would She would do it all over again. Who is her lawyer for Pete's sake?
Starting point is 00:01:47 I mean, when this thing goes up on appeal or her sentence is examined to see if she's getting early release, and she says she would do it all over again, that is not what a parole board wants to hear. Now, as you know, Anna Sorkin, she she got so many names, I can hardly remember which one is the real name, but the fake German heiress, passing herself off as a multi-millionaire under the name Anna Delvey, she pretended to be the heir to a 60 million euro fortune, and she ripped off about $200,000 from banks, hotels, a private jet company. How did she do it? And tried to lie her way into getting a $25 million loan. Well, in the last hours, Anna Sorokin, or Anna Delvey, or whatever her name is, gives a jailhouse interview. Nothing could make me happier than a jailhouse interview. Because in court, defense lawyers try their best for the jury
Starting point is 00:02:54 not to find out who the defendant really is, to keep their yaps shut, to have them dressed beautifully. Oh yeah, you know what I loved about this, this girl? She delayed court multiple times crying in the chambers outside of court because she didn't like her outfit. Yes. She actually had a stylist dressing her in name brands. And when I say name brand, I'm not talking about like Target. I'm talking about Gucci. So many high-priced items. I could not believe the judge allowed it. On the other hand, if the judge had forced her in, she would sit there crying about her outfit, and you'd have to declare a mistrial for Pete's sake, so the judge did what she had to do. Long story short, Miss Thing is yakking behind bars and I cannot wait. Interview with the fake socialite aside, how in the hay did we land here?
Starting point is 00:03:53 This girl, Anna Sorokin, also known as Anna Delvey, somehow manages to con Soho Elite out of a quarter of a million dollars. Joining me in all-star lineup, Jeff Cortese, former FBI special agent, Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Red Flags, Dr. William July, psychologist, and John Limley, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, John Limley. Help me out. This girl shows up. Her skin is so pale. She looks like a ghost and she's got this long brown hair, parted, usually slightly on the side, big glasses, and the hair hangs down like curtains over her face. You can barely see the eyes. You know, the hair is so close down right there. I can't see your face. That makes me suspicious. But who would buy into my dad is a Russian billionaire. Give me your money. Oops,
Starting point is 00:04:52 I forgot my credit card. What happened? Let's just start at the beginning. Well, Nancy, apparently a lot of people were just just hungry to buy into this story. If New York City is a city of dreams, which we hear it called all the time, Anna had enough for the entire island. She had longed to be a member of the upper echelon of Manhattan society. Let me understand something, John Limley, Crime Online investigative reporter. Did you just call her giant fraud, ripping people off tens of thousands of dollars including one woman that took the stand a working class person who goes on an all-expense-paid trip with her to Morocco and then she gets stiffed with a $65,000 bill wait are you calling that a dream how wait how dare you even say dream is another person's nightmare.
Starting point is 00:05:46 Don't offend yourself with cliches. Don't. The American Dream, my rear end, Jeff Cortese, I call it something a lot different than the American Dream. Oh, absolutely. I mean, this was a, at least on the front end, a well-executed fraud. Over the long term, it well-executed fraud. Over the long term, it didn't have the legs to remain sustainable. The long term, I mean, she managed to pull it off, Wendy Patrick, for, you know, what, two years? I forgot how long she managed to pull the wool over everybody's eyes. Going on trips to Morocco, staying at, I think it's 11 Howard, some ritzy,
Starting point is 00:06:25 I don't even know how you find that hotel in New York. It's one of those places I don't think is even marked. Only rich people go there. Wendy, Patrick, what happened to John Limley? The voice of reason. He just called this the American dream. What? Well, I think John Limley, what he was talking about is there are some misguided, vulnerable people that really are
Starting point is 00:06:45 subjected to social predators like Anna. And, you know, some people just are absolutely, you guys mentioned the glamor, the glitz. It's like they want to believe and this fake it till you make it lifestyle. You know, nobody even took the time to say, show me the money, show me the funds, show me the corroboration behind your wild stories. Because caught up in the moment in an Instagram-savvy society, people want to be in the company of people like Anna. And sadly, as a prosecutor, I am just, we are just absolutely just terrified of people like this that are able to so easily infiltrate our social network. Dr. William July, psychologist, he did acquit her off, which I was shocked about because
Starting point is 00:07:26 this girl actually took the stand. Grand larceny for allegedly stealing $62,000 from a friend that she said, come along, I'll pay for everything on a trip to Morocco. When you go on a luxurious trip to Morocco, you stay in a five-star hotel. They went to spa treatments that were costing like $300 a treatment. Yeah, I mean, at worst, Nancy, what you're looking at in cases like this, at worst is a psychopathological level of narcissism. At best, what you're looking at is a person who has so much greed
Starting point is 00:08:01 and desire to please herself that she doesn't care what the consequences are for other people. You were asking earlier, and I just want to address what you were asking earlier about why and how can this sort of thing happen. We're all baffled when we see this, but it's age old. It's a tale as old as time. The charlatan comes in and fools everyone. So there's a part of people that are looking at this who want to believe this because they want to hang out with a person who has this kind of social, these types of social credentials. And they want to believe that she's an heiress so that they can be with her. And people are blaming social media.
Starting point is 00:08:41 It's not the fault of social media. Social media is just a facilitator to the neediness of other people who want to believe and accept it. Why are you piling on everybody on the panel except Cortese? Thank goodness, as keeps talking about the Instagram society. You know what? Instagram didn't have a dang thing to do with this. It was all Miss Thing. Take a listen to friend Rachel Williams speaking to Deborah Roberts. Nightline. She just was very impulsive and free-spirited and charming. I really liked her. Anna Delvey made an impression on everyone she met. Were you sort of seduced by her and her behavior in some ways? I'd say yes. I was captivated by it. I was sort of fascinated
Starting point is 00:09:26 by her willingness to just challenge boundaries. Claiming to be a German heiress with a 67 million dollar trust fund, she talked her way into exclusive New York parties and nightclubs, which is how she met Rachel Williams in 2016, then a 28-year-old photo editor at Vanity Fair magazine. In my late 20s, it was a period of major transition for me and my friends. A lot of them were getting married or having babies or leaving the city. And I was so glad to have this person who was available and seemed really excited to be my friend. No pictures, no pictures.
Starting point is 00:09:59 The pair soon became inseparable, living the glamorous life of two young women in Manhattan. Why do you think she was able to sort of walk into rooms and sort of do what she wanted? To some degree, probably because she's a young white female. Also, a lot of it had to do with her specific charm. She seemed good-willed. And good world. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Welcome back, everybody.
Starting point is 00:10:41 I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. We're talking about the fake heiress, Anna Sorkin. You know, a lot of people will puff themselves up. And, you know, it reminds me of a little boy at the twin school. And John David always comes home and says, Mom, he brags all the time that he has the newest iPhone, that he has this, that he has that. And I said, John David, that's just to make himself feel better about himself. He must feel bad about himself if he has to lie or brag about what he owns or what his parents own. And you should feel bad for him. Why? I can't imagine what possessed this woman to do what she did,
Starting point is 00:11:27 bilking banks and friends out of a quarter of a million dollars. But the New York Times manages to snag an interview with her. And I was reading the article and it says nothing about interviewing the fake heiress Anna Sorkin was normal. Apparently, the fake heiress spoke quickly, excitedly as she talked about her time faking everyone out as Anna Delvey, the books she is now writing, and the fact that she made the right decision to go to trial, even though she was sentenced to more than she was offered on an original plea deal. She went on to reveal that she did not regret anything that she did. A fake German heiress.
Starting point is 00:12:25 How did she manage to do it? I mean, if I even try to write a check at the grocery store, I have to show ID and credit cards. How did she bilk banks and friends out of 200, nearly a quarter of a million dollars? Well, I know 12 people that could see through her fake act, the jury. She not only assumed different an identity for herself, but she also created a whole team of imaginary assistants. An assistant, an accountant, a manager. Limley, is this true? All of her imaginary assistants?
Starting point is 00:13:01 Well, and some were not so imaginary. She even had the concierge at a hotel, essentially on her staff at her beck and call. She was able to convince people of not only her wealth, but all of her aspirations, her dreams. She really wanted to build this members-only arts club on Park Avenue South and was even working to get the financing for it and was not too far away. This John Limley, she lied to a bank using phony records. She was not working to get funding. Listen to this. Anna, who interned at a trendy French magazine, reportedly managed to scam extended stays in swanky Manhattan hotels, dinner at high-end restaurants,
Starting point is 00:13:49 and flights on chartered jets. To finance her lavish lifestyle and keep the grift going, she allegedly built banks out of thousands in cash. And that's not all. The fake heiress reportedly fleeced her friend out of $62,000 for a world-class trip to Morocco. But Anna went too far when she attempted to take out a loan for $22 million to finance a visual arts center she called the Anna Delvey Foundation. In all, Anna reportedly scammed a total of $275,000. Anna's double life began to crumble as hotels went after her unpaid debts
Starting point is 00:14:28 and banks began to investigate her alleged assets. Wow, that's Jesse Palmer over at Daily Mail TV. Wow, okay, so friends and acquaintances say Sorokin spent years playing the part of an art-obsessed German heiress. Sometimes she'd be Russian, sometimes she'd be German. She had an accent to go with it. Rubbing shoulders with the fashion elite at Paris Fashion Week, frequently spotted in London night spots.
Starting point is 00:14:57 Then those who knew her saw her at a party in Berlin. She told everybody she had just flown in on a private jet. How did she pull it off, scamming nearly $300,000? It was only when these ritzy hotels in New York went after her to pay her bills that the whole thing fell apart. But what it really amazed me, you know, I don't know if you do this or not, Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Red Flags on Amazon. Wendy, under the Constitution, you can't force a defendant into court in handcuffs or leg irons or waist shackle. You can't force them to come in in inmate jumpsuit, prison prison blues, or orange, or stripes, whatever the case may be. But I would always keep a jacket and pants in a couple of different sizes in my office.
Starting point is 00:15:54 So when a defendant would show up on Monday morning trial calendar and say, oh yeah, I want to go to trial, but I don't have a suit. I go, oh, I do have a suit for you. And they, of course, I never had it claimed ever in the 10 years that I prosecuted. So they would just have to wear this suit. But she was more concerned about what she wore to court. Every day she had, she actually had a personal dresser, stylist, dressing her for court, Wendy. It's this entire mentality of, I don't want to say just not getting it. That would be too kind. It's a complete underappreciation, or I should say non-appreciation, for the fact that the rest of us work for a living. Her family works for a living. There is so much more to life than clothes and appearances and image. You know, one of the things
Starting point is 00:16:41 that distinguishes this case is the fact that this overemphasis on image, on money, on glamour sounds like it absolutely overrode every ounce of judgment that she had. And to take that into the courtroom, as you mentioned, Nancy, is probably a little bit beyond the pale. Listen to our friends at Inside Edition. This is Diane McInerney. This woman may look like she is dressed for a fashion show and her designer duds, but the wannabe socialite is actually on trial for swindling hundreds of thousands of dollars from unsuspecting people. She was so concerned about how she looked in court, she actually hired a stylist. Is she in a courtroom or at a red carpet event? Anna Sorokin is accused of posing as an heiress to live an extravagant lifestyle, But it's what she's wearing to trial
Starting point is 00:17:25 that is making headlines. The 27-year-old defendant showed up wearing a form-fitting black dress with a plunging neckline and choker necklace. It's a look that could backfire, warns stylist Dawn Caron. Black dress, definitely a no-no. It hyper-sexualized her. It makes her appear to be like a seductress.
Starting point is 00:17:44 The choker kind of shows to me that she's trying to be overtly sexy. The more sexy she appears to be, it hurts her. Sorokin is so obsessed with her clothes, she refused to enter the courtroom because the outfit she was given to wear was not up to her standards. The angry judge told her this is unacceptable and inappropriate. This is not a fashion show. Sorokin's lawyer Todd Spodek says accounts of his client delaying the trial because of fashion are being blown out of proportion. It's not that she didn't want to come out only because of the clothes. She's going through a major criminal trial that's publicized every day. It's emotional and it's her life. Don't cry too
Starting point is 00:18:25 much for Anna Sorokin because apparently there's a bidding war going on for her story. I guess it's going to end up on Netflix or HBO or maybe even on the big screen. Jackie, what do you know? Nancy, Netflix did win the rights to that story and Hollywood executive Shonda Rhimes secured the deal. Reportedly, the streaming giant agreed to pay $100,000 for the story plus $7,500 royalty and $15,000 per episode consulting fee. Now, Sorkin received $30,000 of that up front, but it went to her lawyer for fees. Now, the rest of the money is being kept in escrow by the state attorney general's office, which is trying to invoke a son of Sam law. That's the name for any law that seeks to prevent criminals from profiting off their crimes. It's named after son of Sam killer David
Starting point is 00:19:18 Berkowitz, the serial killer who was prevented in 1977 from selling the TV or film rights to his murder rampage. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Welcome back. For years, Anna Sorkin dreamed about being someone else. A Russian immigrant with dreams of becoming a member of Manhattan's elite society. Sorkin hopped around Germany and Paris before finally coming to New York. But she came there with a brand new identity, a fake identity of a wealthy German a private jet company out of nearly a quarter million dollars. How did she do it?
Starting point is 00:20:33 Then she launches into a month-long trial, a jury trial, rejecting a pretty lenient plea deal offered to her. The trial got more and more bizarre. There were the challenges of styling the inmate. In court, she appeared to still be the character of Anna Delvey. She would be decked out in designer clothes, and I found out the name of the stylist, Anastasia Walker. Now at the very beginning, she was wearing revealing outfits, but toned that down as the trial went on. One witness that really stood out in my mind was a close friend of Anna Sorkin's who testified extensively about the luxury lifestyle the two of them lived. Very expensive dinners, sauna treatments, personal trainers, all paid for by Anna Sorkin.
Starting point is 00:21:38 Then they decided to take a dream trip to Marrakesh. There, she ended up sticking the friend with the bill to the tune of around $60,000. How do you feel about Anna Sorensen today? I believe she's a sociopath. Rachel's now speaking on camera for the first time about how she says her former friend betrayed her. A tale she recounts in her new book, My Friend Anna, the true story of a fake heiress. I don't actually feel a lot of anger. Mostly I just feel like I would like to never cross paths with her again. In the spring of 2017, Rachel tells us Anna offered an all
Starting point is 00:22:11 expenses paid trip to Marrakesh in a lavish $7,500 a night villa. It was shockingly opulent. Your eyes must have been popping out of your head. Absolutely. In New York, we did nice things, but Morocco, that's when I was kind of like, oh, I thought I understood your world, but actually, this is ridiculous. It was, I mean, it was amazing until it wasn't. That's because Rachel says suddenly Anna's credit cards mysteriously weren't working when it was time to settle up with the hotel. The managers began to pull Anna
Starting point is 00:22:45 aside and it sort of is slowly escalating that there's some tension between Anna and the hotel. After a few days of hounding Anna, the hotel had had enough. The men just stood in our villa and they were waiting for her to fix it. And they want payment. Yes, they want a credit card that works right there right now. Like they're done waiting. Rachel tells us she's fearful of being stranded in a foreign country, so she offers her credit cards as a temporary backup, even though she can't afford it. I leave early on Friday morning. When I land, I get a text message that the whole bill is being charged to my cards.
Starting point is 00:23:21 How much? $62,000. $62,000. How did you even wrap your mind around that? It was such a complex, paralyzing moment for me. She owed me more money than I made in a year. Back in New York, Anna doesn't send Rachel the money, instead making excuse after excuse, texting, I will get it sorted so you have it this week. Rachel replying, I'm in serious trouble, Anna. What friend leaves another person in this situation for this long? What is going on for you internally? I am late with my rent. I'm late with my credit card
Starting point is 00:23:57 payments. I'm in a lot of trouble. You know, that's the kind of trip people plan their whole lives. And Anna Sorkin managed to do it. A $60,000 trip to Morocco. Spending time in a private villa. A steam room. A private pool. Shopping. Spending nearly $1,500 on Moroccan-style dresses because Anna only had her New York black clothing with her.
Starting point is 00:24:31 I mean, it just goes on and on. Many influential people conned by Sorkin were never asked to take the stand during the trial. It goes on and on in the courtroom, but ultimately the jury saw through the whole thing. The charade goes on as she gives an interview to a New York Times reporter. But I want to focus on the trial and how she ends up with a sentence of four to 12 years behind bars. There was one story that came out at trial, how she hired a PR firm to organize her birthday party in Soho. It emerged she never
Starting point is 00:25:08 paid the bill. During her stay at 11 Howard, she struck up a friend there in addition to the concierges to and asked for the recommendations for the very, very, very best food in Soho. We also learned that on one occasion she invited friends to dinner at Soho's San Ambro, and the friend ended up paying a whopper, massive bill when Sorokin's 12 credit cards were all declined. But Sorokin paid her back triple the amount the following day in cash we also learned that she would go to unique treatments like infrared saunas in the east village go out to dinner after celebrity training sessions with Casey Duke, which Sorokin also paid for. John Limley, how did she get money from one bank to get a loan from another bank? How'd that work? It's a very interesting line to follow, how she did this. She would go to a bank and ask for a certain line of credit based on a lot of times just a
Starting point is 00:26:30 promise of the fact that she had millions overseas that she could repay the loan. And she would go from one bank with that money to another bank and get an even larger. In fact, here's an example. She talked to an executive with Citi National Bank into giving her a line of credit on her account for $100,000, promising to repay it with a wire transfer from a European account. She used that money in a failed attempt to secure a $25 million loan from Fortress Investment Group. And one of the managing directors at Fortress has said that she ran into problems providing details about the origin of her wealth. Someone actually thought to ask about that. You know, her lies became more and more spectacular.
Starting point is 00:27:27 Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor. In fact, she even managed to charter a private plane on one occasion with absolutely zero money. Wendy, how do you do that? Yeah, the level of sophistication, Nancy, as John was explaining, and as we know now, looking back, was absolutely stunning. It was almost as if
Starting point is 00:27:46 she was daring authorities to catch her in this escalating scheme of sophistication. And, you know, the answer to how you do that is the same way we see people committing other crimes, is sometimes people are so trusting because image matters. You know, this is something I talk about in my book. We tend to attribute all these positive qualities to somebody who comes across as believable, whether they're pretty or that we like what they say or we're enamored with their accent or their clothes. All the types of things that Anna used to get ahead can fool other people into letting them acquire the kind of wealth and, as you point out, tangible benefits that this young lady did. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Welcome back. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. We're talking about Anna Sorkin, the fake German heiress that managed to bilk Manhattan socialites out of hundreds of thousands of dollars. Now she gives a jailhouse interview.
Starting point is 00:28:57 Talk about narcissism. But she did manage to get a leading publication, the New York Times, at her beck and call to interview her. What is it about Anna Sorkin, aka Anna Delvey, that transfixed so many people who were willing to open their homes and their wallets to her? Take a listen to friend Rachel Williams speaking to Deborah Roberts. Nightline. Rachel's convinced that she's been duped and goes to authorities. In the summer of 2017, police arrest Anna Sorokin in Malibu, California. If she did this to me and I was her friend, she would do it to anybody. And I just wanted to protect other people. Anna is charged with grand larceny, attempted grand larceny and theft of services. During the trial, prosecutors arguing
Starting point is 00:29:45 she stole more than a quarter of a million dollars from banks, hotels, and a private jet operator to fund a lavish lifestyle. Anna's attorney insisting Rachel is not a victim. I don't believe a criminal act occurred. She made a voluntary choice to put this debt on her credit card. She didn't have to.
Starting point is 00:30:04 Rachel testified facing her former friend in court. I wasn't sure what to expect. When I did look at her, she was smirking at me. Did it unnerve you? No, shockingly. I thought it would, but I think understanding her for who she was, it caused her to lose her power, and she became no longer scary to me. In May, 28-year-old Anna Sorokin was convicted of eight charges against her,
Starting point is 00:30:30 including grand larceny, but found not guilty of defrauding Rachel. Some of the jurors didn't feel sympathetic for your situation with Anna. How did that feel for you? Oh, that was devastating to have shared so publicly something that was so deeply personal and painful for me. It was extremely hard. And then to have that come out as the takeaway was extremely upsetting.
Starting point is 00:30:56 Anna was sentenced to four to 12 years in prison and ordered to pay nearly $200,000 in restitution. As for that huge credit card bill... Did you have to pay nearly $200,000 in restitution. As for that huge credit card bill... Did you have to pay that money? Ultimately, thank goodness, American Express did protect me from the hotel charge, which was the bulk of the expenses. Another aspect to this, John Lumley, is I remember one day when John David came running home and went,
Starting point is 00:31:24 so-and-so's mom is so cool. She works for Chick-fil-A and she gets free t-shirts and she gets this and she gets that. I think the lady who's very lovely was in marketing or PR and would bring home, you know, like a t-shirt or a moocow or whatever they had. And I thought briefly of creating a different persona to try to impress John David's friends who were then four years old. Okay. But I just decided, no, I'm just going to stick with the truth, you know, and let the chips fall where they may. But John Lumley, I mean, that would hurt me if I found out the twins were lying about their mom and dad, that what we are isn't good enough to fit in to their self-image they're
Starting point is 00:32:17 projecting. That would really hurt my feelers. And that's exactly the way her parents felt about the whole thing. They actually did help fund her through college and as she was getting out on her own. But there was never any sort of trust fund. She moved to Germany in 2007. And after she dropped out of college, she interned in public relations before then moving to Paris and became an intern at Purple Magazine. Once she arrived in New York City, she just somehow managed to be in all the sort of right places. And she was this German heiress, according to her, with a father that you would think was... Wait a minute. I thought she was supposed to be a Russian heiress.
Starting point is 00:33:02 Well, no. She was from Russia, but she told people she was a German heiress. What's really funny, though, is that her German, according to a lot of people, was terrible. Hmm, hmm. I want you to take a listen to what the defense claims in closing arguments. She had to fake it until she could make it. Those words from the defendant's own attorney, who claims she never intended to commit a crime. But prosecutors call her fraud and a liar who would do almost anything to prolong her life of luxury. This morning, the fate of an alleged scam artist, the style savvy defendant, even turning heads in court wearing an animal print dress. She called herself Anna Delvey,
Starting point is 00:33:42 a fashionable globetrotter who prosecutors say was pretending to be a high-flying German heiress living a fairytale life of glitz and glam among Manhattan's elite. I urge you to come to the only verdict that is in accord with both the law and the evidence and that is the defendant is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Prosecutors say the 28-year-old, whose real name is Anna Sorokin, stole $275,000 from banks, hotels, and friends, all part of an elaborate scheme to keep up her illusion of grandeur. Prosecutors also allege Sorokin tried securing a $22 million loan to operate a private club, claims her lawyer denies. I do not believe she had the intent to ever commit a crime. Whether she owes people money, that's a fact of life. That's the reality
Starting point is 00:34:31 of doing business in New York. Now facing charges of grand larceny and theft, she could spend up to 15 years in prison if convicted. But officials say even if acquitted, she will be deported to Germany. Sorkin's attorney says she got in over her head, but was just buying time until she could pay everyone back. You're hearing our buddy Whit Johnson at GMA at ABC pay everybody back. I saw no signs of paying everybody back and calling this doing business. That's certainly putting perfume on the pig. Now, you know, there's a problem, Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor and author of Red Flags, when the defense to theft and fraud is fake it till you make it. Okay, I would not say
Starting point is 00:35:14 that that's a valid defense in a fraud case. You're admitting you're faking it. It's probably not a good theme for the defense. One, I'm sure they're rethinking right about now. That's kind of playing right into the prosecutor's case. Now, what they probably were trying to do, interestingly, in trial, and Nancy, you and I have both seen this, is really kind of painting this vulnerability picture of the defendant to try to make somebody feel sorry for her, that she was caught up in this false lifestyle, felt she had to pretend she was somebody she wasn't who can't relate to that. There's a little bit of Anna in all of us. You know, some of the themes we've seen. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I want to isolate what you just said. The defense
Starting point is 00:35:51 argued at trial as if Anna Sorokin, aka Anna Delvey, was some type of a renegade and a rebel, someone who was, you know, making her own path in the world creatively. B.S. Don't tell me there's a little bit of Anna Sorokin in me because that was their defense. There's a little bit of Anna in all of us. No, because she is a fraud, a thief, and she ripped people off and they're never going to get repaid, Wendy. Right. That's what I'm saying. Well, that's probably why she was convicted, because these defenses are just not realistic
Starting point is 00:36:29 to jurors, to hardworking jurors that go on camping trips like you did and just cannot relate to the fact that we are anything like this picture of Anna. Nonetheless, we have seen this defense time and again, and thankfully it is not successful. You know, and speaking of my little camping trip, God willing, I get to go on another one. Take a listen to this. The courtroom drama played out late into the evening. At one point, the jury appeared deadlocked, the defense asking for a mistrial, but then the verdict. Jurors agreeing with the prosecution that Anna Sorokin built her fairytale life on a foundation of theft and lies. Overnight, a New York City jury finding socialite Anna Sorokin, a so-called Soho grifter, guilty on eight counts,
Starting point is 00:37:15 including grand larceny, attempted grand larceny, and theft of services. Prosecutors arguing the 28-year-old stole a quarter of a million dollars from banks, hotels, and friends to fund a lavish lifestyle. The jurors obviously believed our point of view and followed our logic and acquitted her of the top charges. I'm saddened that she was convicted of some of the other charges. Prosecutors say the Russian-born Sorokin, who called herself Anna Delvey, was pretending to be a high-flying German heiress, living a life of glamour among Manhattan's elite. Authorities say she even forged financial documents, hoping to get a $22 million loan to open a private club in the Big Apple.
Starting point is 00:37:53 While she was turned down, she did convince one bank to loan her $100,000, which she never paid back. Her lawyer saying she meant to, but had gotten in over her head and was just buying time. Well, I guarantee you, she's not getting breakfast in bed, fresh watermelon and rosé at Rikers. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.

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