Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Finding Chase Massner Episode 6: Answering your questions

Episode Date: April 10, 2017

Our Crime Stories team has worked for months uncovering new information and taking a fresh look at old evidence in the search for answers in the mysterious disappearance of Chase Massner. We now ask you to help by raising questions about what you’ve heard so far. Nancy Grace and the team discuss those questions in this 6th episode. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. This is a special edition of Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Finding Chase Masner, Episode 6. This week marks three years since her son, Chase Masner, vanished in Cobb County. Living the last three years with the not knowing and without him here is pure hell. Chas Massner is an Iraq War veteran, a husband, a father. His wife told us she dropped him off at a quick trip in Cobb County where he works. His family says he was last seen at a friend's house in Kennesaw three years ago on March 27th.

It's like he vanished from that home not to be seen or heard from again. If he was able to reach out to any one of us, he would. Despite some intense searching, few clues have been found. She tells me that as a mother, in her heart she feels her son Chase is dead. We have absolutely no answers at all. Not even the slightest clue in three years.

Every night, she goes to sleep with no idea where her son is. I'm talking about Stephanie Kadena, who brings us the story of her missing son, Chase Masner, Crime Online Audit, and with us, special guest Daniel Wilkerson from CBS Channel 46 also on the story as well as Lee Egan from Crime Online and of course the Duke Alan Duke and our search as it goes on for missing Iraqi war vet father son husband Masner. I'm Nancy Grace. Thank you for being with us. This is Crime Stories.

Today, we are taking your calls. Let's go to the first call, Alan. Nancy, this caller wants to talk about Brad Clement, the last known person to see Chase Masner alive. Just curious. Personally, I think this guy is full of garbage. Why would he have to bring over residue for her to smoke if she was worried about, you know, getting caught because they were growing their own pot? Just seems like this guy is just searching for answers.

Everything's like, you know, like, like, you know, doesn't seem like he has any straightforward answers about anything. Well, I agree with you 200%. And let me tell you something, caller. When I heard the wild card, as I call Brad Clements, different stories and inconsistencies, I was very, very suspicious. Then when I met him, Daniel and I went banging on his door. He opened the door wide, let us in, and was very open. Some of his inconsistencies can be explained away. Some of them I'm not so sure can be explained away by me anyway. Maybe

he can. But let me remind you of a judge I used to have. His name was Luther Alverson. He was the oldest judge on the bench when I was trying cases, and he was so old, as a matter of fact, he was grandfathered in because he was already past retirement when they came up with a mandatory retirement, so it didn't apply to him. But his calling was to try more cases and handle more volume than any other judge in the courthouse to show he was fit to be on the bench. And he would tell every jury, it is your duty to make all witnesses speak the truth in puning perjury on no one. In other words, if there's a way to make Brad's story be truthful, make sense, understandable, then that's our duty.

Let me go out to our guest, Daniel Wilkerson. Daniel, what do you think about the caller's question regarding Brad? I mean, he does have inconsistencies. He does. And you know, Brad has said in the past that one of his main gripes or his main frustrations was that people have said that his story has changed. He admits that, you know, it has changed a little, he says. But he says that he didn't know at the time, on the 26th and the 27th of March back in 2014, that he was going to have to take note of specific times. And so that's his side. That's what he's saying.

Okay, Lee, I know that what Daniel is saying is correct, that he says, yeah, I know, got some inconsistencies. Well, that's all well and good, but that doesn't explain them away, right? No, it does not. Especially ones where he said right to us that it's very like Chase to just disappear, but yet in other times he said that it's not like him. I just don't see how he can get those two mixed up because that has nothing to do with his timeline. Okay, let's go to our next caller. I am wondering how Amanda and Chase could afford a house with a rent payment of close

to $1,200 a month with a small child and a brand new baby and all the expenses that come with a small child and a brand new baby, and how they afforded their bills with Chase working at Quick Trip. So how did they afford all of their bills to keep them paid and catch up and pay all of their credit card debts off, which they did, because the problem that I understood monetarily was that Chase's father and stepmother ran their credit cards back up right before Chase, not long before Chase disappeared. Thank you. Okay, good question.

And like so many other people in America, I guess including all of us, everybody needs more money, bottom line. But I agree. How could he support a wife who was not working and had no plans to work and two little children? So let me go to you, Alan, what do we know? What's his business about the father? Well, I've been checking into this and talking to some family sources and people who know. First of all, a quick trip is a corporation that pays pretty well for that kind of a convenience store. But still, Chase was only making about $10 an hour as an overnight cashier there. And it is difficult.

Their rent was about $1,200 a month on this house that they had. How could they meet their bills? Well, they actually did. And what I found out is they took out a consolidation loan to pay off debts in December. And they were doing pretty good then, and the pressure was off. But then Chase's father, who had quit his trucking job, and Chase's stepmom moved in with them and that increased the bills stop stop stop stop stop okay slow down the roller coaster did you say his father just quit work corbin corbin masner so the father quits work and moves in with the already economically challenged Chase Masner? This is one of the things that happened, yes, and was there for a couple of months.

It caused a lot of, you know, you have your in-laws move in. You can only imagine how that is in such cases. And they were there for about two months, and finally they left. But it was the middle of March, about a week or week and a half before Chase vanished, the credit card bills came in, and I'm told that they were as much as $3,500 that they had accumulated after having cleared them up. And as for Amanda, part of the tension between Amanda and Chase was that, in fact, Amanda got a part-time job.

Just two weeks before Chase disappeared, she started working a part-time job, and apparently Chase wasn't too happy about that. Where? It was some kind of motorsports company or car company, something to do with that. She worked administration. Okay, hold on. Let me understand this. So she gets a job two weeks before he disappears. Okay.

And I still don't get the father quitting his job just like that. And I mean, I'm not going to say the word freeloading, but this is one of the controversies. Why did he quit? Was he ill or did he just say, I'm tired of working from a family source? He didn't like the job. And so he quit. But before he found something else, he quit. Can I tell you something? I remember prosecuting all day long at the courthouse. I'd get off at best at six to seven, then going to teach. On Mondays and Wednesdays, I taught in the undergrad program at Georgia State. And on Tuesdays and Thursdays, I taught in the law school, teaching trial strategy. And I tried to get a weekend job editing manuscripts. I mean, and this guy decides

he doesn't like his job and just quits and moves in. No wonder they were having problems. When he left, the father signed a promissory note to Chase and Amanda saying, I'm going to pay this money back. But that didn't pay March's credit card bills. The timing was that the bills were coming in in the middle of March. And that is when reality hit that, oh my goodness, we are in debt again, despite this consolidation loan. Hold on. Hold on. What day, Daniel, did he go missing? What was the date? He went missing on March 27th, Thursday. What a coinkydink.

What a coinkydink, a coincidence in regular people talk, that they get this bill for $3,500 and then, bam, he goes missing. I'm telling you, the love of money is the root of evil. Money problems, credit cards, I mean, dang. But, you know, Lee, I don't know if you've ever been in this spot before, but I remember in law school, I was so broke, so broke. I remember a big night. I think it was Del Taco or Taco Bell would have three tacos for 99 cents,

and me and my study partner, Frank, I mean, we would go, like, stuff ourselves to last for the rest of the week. And I would have to drive through the bank to make sure how much money I had before I would write a check. I would have to drive through the bank teller. You know, that is very pitiful, right? Okay, so it happens. It happens. I want to addiful, right? Okay, so it happens. It happens. I want to add this, too.

Go, Daniel. I wanted to add, the way I understand it, too, Amanda's sister was living with them, and so she may have, and we don't have this confirmed, but she may have been contributing some money toward the expenses. The other thing is this. I went out probably about a month ago to Chase and Amanda's, their own home. And it is a huge home. I mean, it's a winding driveway. They sit probably on two acre lots. But the way that I understand it, a family source told me

that they got a super deal as far as monthly rent. And I think Alan, you said what it was around 11 or $1,200. Yes, that's what I heard. Wow. Yeah. I think that was because, uh, they had some kind of connection to the landlord, but still a thousand dollars, $1,100 is a lot off of $10 an hour. Okay. Yeah. And plus when you have family moving in and not, and not eating all your food and using your hot water and running up your energy bill and not paying any money. No, not judging, just observing. Next question. Hit me.

One of the big questions that I have is, Brad gave Chase his phone back. Chase disappears on March the 26th, 27th with the phone and the debit card never to be found again I have a recording with Brad on April the 16th of 2014 where Brad calls Amanda in a three-way call he's asking her about a drug dealer in the neighborhood if Amanda has talked with that person to see if that person knows where Chase might be. And Amanda is sleepy. It's about 2 in the morning.

And Amanda says, I will look in Chase's phone in the morning and give you that number. I will call you back with that number. So Amanda admitted on April the 16th that she had Chase's phone. Now, this was his current phone because Chase had just bought a phone a month before and did have a new phone. Okay, Alan, take that one. We actually have that recording where Brad called Amanda at 2 a.m. on the 16th of April. Let's first listen to that recording and you hear it for yourself. Hey, Amanda. Yeah. You sleeping? Mm-hmm. Hey, I'm sorry to call you so late. Um, I was just thinking, I was kind of, um, walking through the neighborhood and, uh, I just remembered,

do you think a guy that lives down the street from me that chases to get, um, that, uh, stuff from? Because I remembered he lived in my neighborhood. And I couldn't remember. Have you tried to call that guy? Or do you know who he is? Do you know who I'm talking about? No, I don't. He said that he lived right in my neighborhood. And I think that is a big step to this.

We could just figure out who that guy is. You're talking about the guy that, like he got weed for that one day? Yeah, yeah, that's the guy I'm talking about. That's like some 45-year-old, his name is Bo. Bo? Bo or something. Do you know him well?

Do you think that he could have gone there that day? No, Chase doesn't really know him that well either. He just met him a few weeks ago. He's like some old business guy, like kind of a nerd. Chase just hooked him up and got him a few times. Okay. Well, I was just wondering. But I think the number should be in Chase's phone.

Okay. Tomorrow I'll try to get that number. Okay. Cool. Cool. I'm just, you know, still doing what I can, man, and trying to find him and get this, you know, get some closure. And, you know, just all of us are finally getting, you know, accused of just all kinds of stuff, I feel like. So I just want to get it done, you know.

Yeah, definitely. So definitely just, well, sleep tight, and I hope everything's doing all right with you, all right? And if you, you know, like I said, need anything, don't hesitate to call me if you, you know, if you need anything that's not going to get you in trouble from talking to me. But I just thought that that guy, you know, really could have some importance for this, because I don't think we've gone that route at all, so. Yeah, I'll look at his number. Okay, well, sleep tight.

I'll talk to you soon, all right? Okay, thank you. Take care. Bye. So what I get out of this is that Amanda is dead asleep and probably could even not remember this phone conversation the next morning. And in that sleep mode, probably didn't even remember who had what phone. Also keep in mind that Chase had two telephones. He had a phone that was older and

a new phone. The new phone is the one he had that is now missing. And maybe the number was in the older phone and she still had that and was going to check it there. But if Chase's phone had been turned on at all in the time after his missing, it would have been picked up by law enforcement. They would have been able to ping. But there is plenty of evidence to believe that the phone was destroyed, disabled, battery taken out because as far as we know, it wasn't being used and it wasn't being pinged afterward. Bottom line, Lee Egan, where does that leave me i mean alan i know you're a journalist and you're all la hollywood blah blah but can you put anything

in a nutshell for pete's sake i mean lee what did he just say uh he basically said that she got the call while she was sleeping and she could have just mumbled something without thinking so there's no proof that she had chase's phone although she said it she could have just mumbled something without thinking. So there's no proof that she had Chase's phone, although she said it. She could have just been saying something in her sleep that she didn't remember. Okay, wait a minute. Wait, wait. So in her quote, sleep, she says she'll check his phone. Is that what she says, Alan?

Yes. Yes, no, Alan. Yes. Okay. Well, okay, now we've got the I was asleep, the dog ate my homework thing okay let's go i i'm not buying you just say it in your sleep because if the phone wakes me up and i'm talking on the phone i hit answer and i've got that much sense and i answer then i'm like i forgot it the next i'm not like totally buying that.

It could have been the older phone too. If you had just gotten a new phone, sometimes it takes time to get numbers transferred over. And so she could have been referring to his old phone. Yeah, okay. And maybe the little green men from Mars came in and answered the phone and impersonated her. Okay, fine people. All right, whatever you want. I'm just saying, again, nobody's a suspect. Nobody's a person of interest. But a lot of people have really unusual stories, okay? I'll leave it at that.

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even she likes it. And my two picky eaters love it they love blue apron in fact when my son saw the box he said mom we got blue apron i'm like how did you know about blue apron john david and he had i guess seen it when i wasn't spying on him on his ipad so we love it Love it. And this is the other thing. You can afford it. It's all fresh, farm-to-table recipes. They tell you how to make it, and it's 30 minutes or under to cook the meal. Okay, so we got meals for four, and it was plenty enough for five people with fresh veggies and produce, and a little under ten dollars a person and i mean when you compare that to going to a restaurant you got to get in the car you got to load everybody up you got to fight about where you're going you got to get in there a couple of people got to whine about the menu then you have to pick something then you have to wait

you may get a surly waiter waitress then you eat then you pay then you pay the tip then you have to pick something, then you have to wait. You may get a surly waiter, waitress, then you eat, then you pay, then you pay the tip, then you get in the car and come home, and it's late, and the children have to go to bed for school. This is so much better. Blue Apron, thank you for sponsoring our podcast and our search for Chase Masner, and thank you for what you are offering everyday working people moms that want to cook a great meal for their family but just really don't have the time to go to the grocery store that day thank you Blue Apron I'm really proud you have partnered with us now let's get back to Chase Masner next question hi Alan and nancy um my name is jennifer sullivan and i was a friend of chase masters there has been permission given to anyone who's qualified or can to luminol or whatnot the whatnot, the roofer's big trash bin that was never searched,

they know still which one it was and have authorized whomever to come out and look at it or use luminol or anything like that. So I just wanted to throw that out there as an option. I'm not sure if you guys could handle it.

But thank you and have a wonderful day. Well, yeah, I would love to have had the dumpster luminoled. I would actually like for someone to have looked in the correct dumpster. But we're a day late and a dollar short. The cops searched the wrong dumpster

after Stephanie Kadena, the mother, begged and begged and begged for them to search a dumpster. They then searched the wrong dumpster. So a time for luminol is gone, long gone. Daniel, jump in. Yeah, and the thing is, how many times has that dumpster been used since then? I'm sure after this happened, they didn't just set that dumpster to the side. I mean, you have all kinds of things that could have been thrown in there since then. But like you said, yeah, Cobb County, and I've talked to them, they have admitted that they searched the wrong dumpster. In fact, Stephanie Kadena, Chase's mother, says that they,

an officer came to her house and said, hey, look, we dropped a ball. We cannot dig down. You know, it's going to cost over a million dollars. What else can we do to satisfy you? And we're talking about a dumpster that was parked in the driveway at Brad's house where Chase disappeared. And it was there the last day, right? On March 27th. Yes, it was in front of the house March 27th. Alan, hit me with the next call. I'm calling about Brad's response to Daniel in episode four when Daniel says, Brandon Buck said he tripped over what appeared to be a grave in your backyard. As you laugh and say, yes, he tripped over a tiny stone that says bandit. I, Mr. Clemens, made initial contact with Brandon and his exact words to me were, there appears to be a spot dug up, almost grave-like, were Brandon's exact words.

It may be a tiny stone now, Mr. Clements, but it wasn't on March 27, 2014. Okay, yeah, when we heard, oh, there's a body in the backyard, all of our ears perked up. But I spoke to Brad Clements face to face he explained that it was an ex-girlfriend's dog he was very upfront about it and then we actually managed to track down the roofing guy and put the question to him listen there was something you tripped over in the backyard? Yeah, it was a, like a little grave that he said was for, I think, a dog or something. And it was right outside the fence. There's like a little headstone.

Next question. Okay, I have a couple questions. On the end of one of the voicemails for Brad, he says that it isn't like Chase to leave. But then on the other hand, he states that he always just leaves, that Amanda just always picks him up, that that's normal. And I also wanted to know, why would Brad say this isn't like you to leave on Chase's voicemail, but tell everyone he always left? But pretty much the same question. Yeah, you're right about that.

For the most part, when Daniel and I were with him anyway, he seemed to say this was Chase's MO. He would just get up and leave. I always thought it was a little bit rude without saying goodbye or anything. Daniel, do you remember that? I do. And you know what? Like I said, this is a really good question because it's something that I keep thinking of in my head, but I haven't brought it up. And if you remember, when Brad left a voicemail on Chase's phone on the 27th. I think it was around three or four.

He stated he said Brad said, man, it's not like you to just leave like this. And there have been several times when Brad has told me directly that it was his M.O. And he's gone back and told me at other times it wasn't Chase's M.O. So I didn't think it was huge, but when you put everything all together and the other inconsistencies, you know, you get a mountain. Okay, from what we are understanding, this case, Chase's disappearance is going to the cold case division at Cobb County. Does that mean it's going to get special attention, or does that mean it's really gone cold and it's on the back burner? So far, it's off the stove.

Next question, please. I did hear your podcast with Chase's mom and the last person to see Chase alive, and you did ask him if he would submit to a polygraph test. I was just wondering if the polygraph was going to happen because I have a feeling that the last person to see him alive, that he's not telling something. I have a couple questions about the, regarding Chase Magner and about the wild card.

My name is Brad. I know you, in the last episode, discussed him taking a polygraph. I was wondering if that was actually going to happen or not. I don't think he's telling the whole truth. I think maybe he's afraid to take a polygraph because of the drug use. You don't live, if you've had an opioid addiction, you don't live with people using opiates. So maybe that's why he doesn't want to take a polygraph.

And also, where are the girls? Is Stephanie allowed to see them? Keep up the good work. I enjoy your podcast. Thank you. Let's talk about the polygraph. Daniel, when you and I were with Brad Clements, he said, sure, I'll take a poly. But when he was asked earlier on in the investigation, he said he wouldn't because his emotions were, quote, all over the place.

Where does it stand now? I told him I'd set up the poly and he skipped town. Yes, and he said that he had some work to do out of town. He said that this case all along has really just wrecked his life. But the last time I talked to him, he said that he would. I have not tried to contact him in the last two weeks or so. I will say every time I've contacted him, he's called me back. And so I just sent a message to him just about 20 minutes ago.

And that's one of the things that I will address with him. But the last time we spoke again, he says that he will take it. Let's talk about the little girls. Lee, where are the little girls? Have they been interviewed? Do you think they know anything? And will Amanda take a polygraph? The little girls, they're living with Amanda in Iowa, and I believe Stephanie did see them last Thanksgiving. As far as them knowing anything, possibly the oldest, the oldest girl, about five or six, I guess, may know something. She may have heard and seen some things. And Amanda taking the polygraph, I don't know. I can't get in touch with her.

I've tried several times, and she's not returning my messages. So I have no idea. We played on our last episode a section of a phone call where early in the investigation, Amanda was saying she would take a polygraph test. So maybe let's leave that open. Maybe she will. And as far as Amanda goes, let me give a little perspective as I've dug in more and more to this. You know, I got two grandkids who are this, who are about the same age that Chase and Amanda's kids were at the time. I cannot do anything. I mean, you know,

women I know can do a lot that a man can't do. But how do you take care of two little girls and kill somebody and hide the body in the perfect cover up? I don't know how you do that. I'm trying to get my mind about doing that. And that makes me really, really wonder if Amanda had any reason, which I can't even imagine, to kill her husband, how could she possibly pull it off? She had those two little girls with her at all times. No evidence there was a babysitter around. Stop, stop, stop, stop.

Oh, ow, you're making my teeth hurt. Okay? All the words. Okay, Alan, people kill people every day with children at home and in spite of all sorts of obstacles okay so saying oh i couldn't commit a murder because uh my children were home no okay now it's a nice thought and i have no reason to believe amanda had anything to do with chase's death i I'll put it out there. Dead. He's not alive anymore. No reason to think that. But as far as you're saying,

it would be way too inconvenient to commit a murder because I don't have a babysitter. Are you serious? Please. Come on, man. Whoa. Okay. I'm going to take a slug of coffee now.

And I'm off the tee because of you, Alan Duke. I'm off the tea, and I'm on the hard stuff. What? I wanted to add this. I mean, I've been talking to Amanda. I've spoken with Amanda in just the last 24 hours, and she has said that she is excited that the cold case unit is taking on this case and that she really had to pull back. And they moved because of all the speculation. And she says that she was being stalked and she said it was just really getting to her.

So for her protection, for her girls protection, they had to move away. And she sent me this text message the other day. And because I asked her, I said, what do you think happened to Chase? Do you feel he's still alive? And I want to read it. She says, for so long, each day I had so many different gut feelings about what could have happened. I have gone back and forth and driven myself crazy for months on end. Finally, God pulled me out and showed me that I don't need to know. I don't need to guess. I'm not moving on. So if he's alive, I'll rejoice to reunite with my husband and the love of my life. And if he's passed away, then I hope I'll see him she take a polygraph and will she join us on our podcast? You know the answer to either one of those? I don't know the answer, no. I don't.

Lee, do you know the answer? Not yet. We're working on it. Alan? Well, we are working on it. And I do know that she is paying attention to what we're doing here with the podcast. So maybe she'll see that we are being fair. Alan, you can just say, I don't know. If you don't know, just say, don't know. I'm hopeful. I'm saying maybe. And again, thank you to Blue Apron for being our partner in our podcast today. Thank you for making home-cooked meals available for so many working moms and dads that don't have all the extra time to go to the grocery store, come home after work, and put a homemade dinner on the table for their children. You know, I'm not so sure it's so much the food, it's the family time together at home that means so much to me. And

more important, Blue Apron, thank you for making our podcast available and possible today for so many people joining us in our search for Chase Masner. You know, a lot of people have forgotten about Chase Masner. They've forgotten he's missing. They forgot he ever lived. But I really believe that one day his two little girls will thank us or at least appreciate us trying to find Chase Masner. Thank you, Blue Apron. Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, signing off. Goodbye, friend. You're listening to an iHeart Podcast.