Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - FRIDAY NIGHT SPECIAL: GIRL, 7, FOUND LOCKED IN CLOSET STARVED, MOM " I WANT TO FIGHT FOR MY KIDS" SPEAKS OUT IN COURT

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Starting point is 00:00:36 Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Okay, it's Friday night and it is special. Good evening. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Story's Friday night special. When I say special, I mean special. Now, here's a woman nobody will forget. I don't know if you're going to remember her name,

Starting point is 00:01:03 Virginia Gonzalez, but you'll remember this. The mom of multiple children, including a seven-year-old little girl found locked in a dark closet that was barricaded down to about 26 pounds, fed one corn dog a day. If that, well, I'm looking at her mugshot whoa whoa whoa what happened to those massive fake eyelashes where did they go oh here she is in the raw and miss thing comes into court and demands to speak of course I could not be happier.

Starting point is 00:01:45 That's right. A mom of a little girl, just seven years old, at 26 pounds, I think John David weighed that at five months, for Pete's sake, locked in a closet, barricaded in the closet, the closet dark, in there 24-7, 365, one corn dog a day if that speaks out in court. Now before I tell you what Ms. Thing says in court, let me jog your memory about what happened. On April 3rd, 2025, Austin Police Department responded to a 911 call for a 7 year old child

Starting point is 00:02:26 that was found locked in a closet and starving. The 7 year old was immediately taken to a local hospital for medical treatment. And is currently recovering. There were six other children found in the home that appeared physically healthy. Police officers at an

Starting point is 00:02:43 Austin apartment find a severely malnourished seven-year-old girl who is barricaded in a bedroom closet. The child is found soiled, weighing just 29 pounds, and has been confined to a three-foot by two-foot closet space for approximately a month. Investigators find the child has been given one corndog and a half a cup of water a day. Doctors at Dell Children's Medical Center determine the little girl is suffering moderate to severe cerebral atrophy from prolonged malnutrition, damage from which she will never recover. And now new details emerging in a case out of Austin, Texas. Authorities first learn a

Starting point is 00:03:18 seven-year-old girl is locked in a closet. Who knows how long? She weighs 26 pounds. When they go to inspect that, they find out her sister has been missing for years. Mommy, Virginia Gonzalez, facing charges including injury to a child inflicting serious injury after her daughter fell locked in a closet and starving. But it was only after that arrest police learned she never reported the disappearance of the other child, a nine-year-old little girl missing since December 2017. Now many people have asked me online, why didn't the grandmother do anything? Well the grandmother did call police when she went to the home and found the seven-year-old in the closet, but no one

Starting point is 00:04:19 called police about the missing sister. And I wanna remind you, this closet was less than five feet by two feet. Five by two, five feet tall, two feet wide. There were other objects in there. What? Other objects in there, no light, no ventilation. And it was barricaded by 75 pounds of boxes in front of it. Can you imagine the life that child had in a closet? Her living space about 3 by 1 foot 10 inches, 3 by 2.

Starting point is 00:04:57 Let's be generous. No light, no ventilation, barricaded on the outside by 75 pound boxes in front of him. The little girl was soiled of course. She had TT'd and defecated. I said 26, it's 29 pounds. 29 pounds when she was rescued. She's already suffered moderate to severe cerebral atrophy. That's permanent brain damage, due to prolonged nutrition. This is what we are just learning. Quote, she will never recover according to the state's affidavit. Now the other six children in the home from 2 to 14 told grandma they were ordered to lock her in there

Starting point is 00:05:46 because she had quote bladder control issues and was quote always getting into stuff and quote eating things she was not supposed to what like food a 10 year old brother told police he was told he had to clean the closet because the little sister would have to defecate and urinate in the closet. The little girl gets just a corn dog a day and a half a cup of water. How can a child survive day after day, week after week, month after month locked in a dark closet living off nothing? Straight out to Christina Awayo joining us, investigative reporter.

Starting point is 00:06:27 Christina, this child locked in a closet. What happened? Well, according to the affidavit, when police got there, when the caller called in for the welfare check and police got there, they found a seven-year-old little girl locked in a closet. It was barricaded by 75 pounds of boxes. They opened that door, they found that child in there. She was soiled, surrounded by feces. She was severely malnourished. She had dark spots all over her body, which is a sign of severe malnourishment. They took her, of course, to the hospital

Starting point is 00:06:59 where she weighed 29 pounds. And medical personnel say that because of the prolonged starvation of that little girl that she will have permanent brain damage. Permanent brain damage caused by starvation. Joining me, Virginia Bagby, Director of Child Help National Child Abuse Hotline. Child Help. Virginia, thank you for being with us. Many people don't know that

Starting point is 00:07:26 starving a child can result in permanent brain damage. Have you ever seen anything like it before, Virginia? We have definitely heard about cases like this and they happen all too often. Dr. Kendall Crowns, Chief Medical Examiner Tarrant County, that's Fort Worth. Never a lack of business. He is the esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU and has just launched a hit podcast, Mayhem in the Morgue. Dr. Kendall Crowns, thank you for being with us. I know that you heard this, but let me repeat it again. A seven-year-old little girl barricaded in a locked bedroom closet lot from the

Starting point is 00:08:05 outside soiled a seven-year-old weighing just 29 pounds confined to a 3 by 2 foot closet she is being given at most one corn dog and a half cup of water a day. She is now suffering permanent moderate to severe cerebral atrophy from prolonged malnutrition. The doc states she will never recover. Could you interpret that please? Certainly. So she's not being given much food or water. I mean, a corn dog and a cup of water is not much for a child or anybody for that matter. Her body is losing its, depleting its muscle, depleting its fat stores. So she, her muscles are wasting away. Her bones are starting to not form properly and she's being starved. And part of being starved results in your cardiac muscle

Starting point is 00:09:06 or your heart muscle mass starting to also fade away or go away which reduces your heart's ability to pump your blood which results in your kidneys failing and you go into kidney failure. You also start having gut issues as well and this can all affect your brain and your brain's development, especially in a child. So, all those factors combined will result in her having these issues that the doctors are describing. Dr. Kendall Crowns, a child of seven years old should weigh around 70 pounds, 40, 45 to 70 pounds. Is that right? Yes. That would be about the average weight of a child at seven.

Starting point is 00:09:47 A seven-year-old average, of course they grow at different weights. The average is 51 pounds for a seven-year-old child, but it ranges from 43 to 70. So where would you place 29 pounds in that spectrum? 29 pounds. If a seven-year-old can weigh up to 73, she's not even half the weight of a seven-year-old. Yeah, the weight you're describing is a severely malnourished child. So she's been starved for

Starting point is 00:10:25 a prolonged period of time. How does that make a child brain damaged? It's from the body shutting down, the lack of food, the lack of loss of muscle mass, the heart muscle mass being lost, it not circulating properly, the organs aren't getting enough oxygenated blood. And of course, the brain's part of this. So the brain's not getting proper oxygenation. Also the brain relies on glucose or sugars to grow and develop and it's not getting that as well. So the brain is basically maldeveloped, not getting enough oxygen. So you get brain damage. Dr. Crowns, isn't it true that a child weighing 29 pounds typically, and I'm basing this on charts and statistics that I prepared, is typically a 22-month

Starting point is 00:11:14 old child at 29 pounds? Yes, that would be correct. A seven-year-old little girl, Dr. Kendall Crowns, that should weigh 71 pounds, 51 to 71 pounds, weighs 29 pounds. With a child starving, what would she be enduring on the floor of that locked closet, Dr. Crowns? She would be enduring confusion, dehydration, or a very dry mouth. Her throat would be dry. She'd have trouble, dehydration, or a very dry mouth. Her throat would be dry. She'd have trouble swallowing. She'd be very tired and just not able to even move.

Starting point is 00:11:51 And then you would add on to that the fact that without the food, she'd start hallucinating and then eventually just slip into a coma and finally die. Dr. Kendall Crowns, would the child lose her hair? I know that she's losing all muscle tone. Would she be losing her hair? Would her faculties, her hearing, her sight, would that be intact? And what would her brain function be?

Starting point is 00:12:20 Lying on the floor of a dark closet, starving. So yes, hair often will fall out in individuals who are starved. Her brain function would be very minimal. She'd be confused, even possibly hallucinating and just completely fatigued and not even feeling like moving. Is it true, Dr. Kimmel Krause, that when someone has been starved for a prolonged period of time, as in this case, When you give them food, they can't even eat it.

Starting point is 00:12:46 Yes, you can have what is called, if you give a person who's been starved, you feed them too quickly, you can have what is called re-feeding syndrome, where they actually will, from the food intake, it will cause so much of a shock to their body that they can die. Guys, when police show up to a home, they find six children and then a seventh locked in a closet, weighing just 29 pounds. But ironically, amazingly, listen to the condition of the other six children. Six other children in the apartment ranging in age from 2 to 14 years old are found to be in apparently good physical condition. The apartment's pantry, refrigerator and freezer are stocked with various food items.

Starting point is 00:13:36 The oldest children were given strict orders to put the little girl in the closet because she had bladder control issues and she was trying to eat things she wasn't supposed to. During the investigation, police learned there's an eighth child, Ava Marie, who is not in the home with the other children. We've got one starved child who has permanent brain damage, a seven-year-old little girl weighing 29 pounds locked in a closet. Now I've got a missing child, too. But to Dr. Angela Arnold joining me, renowned psychiatrist

Starting point is 00:14:06 out of the Atlanta jurisdiction at angelaarnaldmd.com. Dr. Angie, thank you for being with us. Did you hear what was just reported? That there were six other children in the home seemingly healthy, And they were encouraged to keep the little girl locked in a closet starving her because the little girl would eat things she wasn't supposed to eat. You know what, Dr. Angie? I've heard every excuse in the book about why parents starve the children. Oh, the child ate a candy bar.

Starting point is 00:14:43 I'll starve it. The child eats too much. I'll starve it. The child misbeh bar. I'll starve it. The child eats too much. I'll starve it. The child misbehaved. I'll starve it. I mean, there are a million excuses I have heard as to why moms and dads starve the baby dead. But yet, we see six other children seemingly healthy.

Starting point is 00:15:02 And this is oftentimes what we do see in cases like this, Nancy. So the other children need to be taken care of as well as this goes on because they have been suffering something called Stockholm syndrome. They want to, they are so scared of the abuse that they see being heaped on this other child, that they go into it with their mother literally to protect themselves. Okay? Because Nancy, imagine how scared these other children are. They never know who's going to be next to be locked in that closet.

Starting point is 00:15:40 So they're going to listen to their mama. They're going to do what she says. And I think that they could probably also psychologically sort of break off from feeling towards the child that is being locked in the closet so that they can protect themselves. Because this is chaos that this family is living in. It is complete and utter chaos. And all of those other children are suffering. They may not be brain dead, brain damaged. Excuse me. They are not being, you know, they're not being starved,

Starting point is 00:16:16 but they are also being damaged by the so-called mother of theirs. A missing child case takes a dark turn after a disturbing discovery inside a family home. It brings to mind the case of another seven-year-old child, Adrian Jones. There was just handed down a multimillion dollar verdict against the state of Kentucky. Adrian Jones was systematically starved, forced by his mother and father to watch the rest of the family eat. They would put bars of soap in his mouth while everyone else ate, force him to stand outside, chin deep in a pool, until finally the boy died.

Starting point is 00:17:16 They killed the boy. Listen. Former bail bondsman Michael Jones is awarded custody of his son Adrian Jones and takes the boy away from his mother. For the next four years, Adrian is regularly starved, brutally beaten, tortured, tased, and locked in a shower naked for months. Adrian's brothers and sisters do not suffer the same fate. Adrian is singled out by his father and stepmother. When the child dies, Michael Jones buys two pigs and doesn't feed them while Adrian's body is left in the shower for two weeks. When the pigs are starving, Michael Jones feeds his son to the pigs. Michael and

Starting point is 00:17:49 Heather Jones plead guilty to first degree murder and are serving 25 years to life. So in one closet, we've got the child starved and a missing child. And back to you, Dr. Angie Arnold, you said the other siblings are gonna have to be in treatment. You're right, because they didn't just watch their sister starve slowly to death. They were forced to keep her in the closet themselves. They're gonna go the rest of their lives thinking they starved their sister and now she's got permanent brain damage, Angie.

Starting point is 00:18:20 That's exactly correct, Nancy. These children have been abused in a different way and it's all for a matter of control. It's to keep all of those children in control, Nancy, because you can only imagine there's one mother, all of these children. If somebody got old enough to decide, you know, we really shouldn't be treating this person this way, they could possibly escape or something like this, right? But that mother is making sure that they are so terrified, they are so terrified in the home that they live in, and she feeds them so that they have this odd relationship with

Starting point is 00:19:00 the mother where they still need her, but they're scared of her so that none of them will go against her. To Browyn Blake joining us, Adjunct Professor, University of Texas School of Law, Chief Legal Officer, Texas Advocacy Project. Browyn, thank you for being with us. I've seen it many, many times, like in Adrienne Jones, like in this case, where one child out of the whole group is singled out and they're the ones that starved. That child is the one that's abused.

Starting point is 00:19:35 I don't understand the phenomena, but I accept it because I've seen it over and over. Even cases that are prosecuted, other children would go unscathed, while the one child would end up dead. The idea that abuse is all about power and control really helps explain this dynamic. This person is not out of control. They're being very calculated and systematic in who they abuse and how. So all of those children experienced abuse just in different ways. Guys, not only do we have a child starved near death, languishing on the floor of a locked closet, we have a missing child. Listen. During the investigation,

Starting point is 00:20:18 police discovered that there was an eighth child who was not found inside the home. The missing nine-year-old child was identified as Ava Marie Gonzalez. Missing persons detectives determined that Ava was last seen in December 2017 when she was two years old and in the custody of her mother, Virginia Marie Gonzalez. Learning there should be eight children in the apartment, not just the seven they found, police opened an investigation and quickly determined Ava Marie has not been seen by family or friends

Starting point is 00:20:49 since she was two years old in 2017 in custody of her mother, Virginia Gonzalez. Considering the condition of Ava's seven-year-old sister when she was found, Austin police detectives are very concerned about Ava's welfare. So you've got six children, seemingly healthy. You've got one child starved

Starting point is 00:21:05 locked in a closet, and now you've got a missing child. Joining me is a special guest. This is Leanne Marie, friend of the children's mother, Virginia Gonzalez. Leanne, thank you for being with us. Yes ma'am. Leanne, Marie, tell me about Virginia Gonzalez. So from what I know, she was just a normal person. I mean, honestly, she never really had her kids with her. Like, you know, presence. The only one that I've seen with her in the past year was the oldest one, the 14 year old. Besides that, um, we never knew that she had, you know, the little girl, we only knew

Starting point is 00:21:52 of boys. Um, so she was just a typical person, partying out in the clubs and the bars. Um, I mean, she, she was just, she never lived like she even had nine eight nine kids Very very okay, you're scaring me now. There's mommy. Hi mom Yeah, there she is party down mom. Where are your children right now? Liam already just said something that scared me. Okay, hold on So I know that there are six children in the home, healthy-ish, one starved in a closet and one missing.

Starting point is 00:22:30 That's eight, but you mentioned nine, the possibility of a ninth child? Yes, ma'am. Is there a ninth child? Yes, so right now they're saying that this ninth child, he does not have a social security here in Texas. So he's not registered here in Texas. Okay. Daryl Parker, I need you and I need you now. There's another missing child. Did you hear that? Daryl Parker, former lieutenant, Fannie County Sheriff's Office,

Starting point is 00:22:59 former Marine, former Texas police officer. Help me. So, we're learning right now that there's a ninth child that's in the wind. Nobody knows how old the child is, where it is. It doesn't have a Texas social security number. Yeah, Nancy, that's pretty concerning. I know that the mom has already made several statements to police

Starting point is 00:23:20 that are inconsistent about the child that is missing already that they already know about. And it'll be interesting to see if some follow-up questioning can reveal anything about this ninth child, the possible ninth child. Virginia Bagby, joining us from Child Help National Abuse Hotline. Going into this right now, I knew that there were eight children, six in the home, one starved near death with brain damage and one missing since 2017. Now I'm hearing about child number

Starting point is 00:23:52 nine. Is that child dead? I mean, what do you do when you get a call like this, the child help hotline? Well, this is a really difficult one. I would encourage somebody to reach out to the local hospitals, potentially where the other children have been born, to see if they have any record. This is very concerning to have two children missing. Now these other children have probably are aware that they have siblings that are missing. Add that to the terror they've been experiencing. Get ready for a celebration of play like no other at the all-new LEGO Summer of Play event

Starting point is 00:24:30 at LEGOLAND Discovery Center Toronto, now through August 3rd. I'm master model builder Noel inviting you to discover your play mode with awesome build activities, experiences, and even some fresh new dance moves. Enjoy the ultimate indoor LEGO playground with rides, a 4-day theater, and millions of Lego bricks at Legoland Discovery Center. Build the best day ever with your family by getting tickets online now at legolanddiscoverycenter.com slash Toronto. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. In court, Ms. Thing, Virginia Gonzalez states, I instructed them not to let her out of the bedroom, but not the closet.

Starting point is 00:25:12 So she would basically blame the other children. Quote, we catch her in the restroom doing something bad. What? What would she be doing in the bathroom at seven years old? Quote, it was easier for my sons to watch her that way. Well, what were you doing? What was grandma doing? Why weren't they watching her?

Starting point is 00:25:32 Why would you leave a 10-year-old boy in charge of six other children? Text messages uncover. Gonzales texting one of her children. Quote, clean the closet, then throw her back in. In the affidavit we obtained, the detective describes a child, the fat in her cheeks was non-existent.

Starting point is 00:25:52 Her body had used those stores to sustain itself. Now wait a minute, Gonzalez speaks more. She insists the children had, quote, adequate food. I don't dispute I was wrong. I know what I've done is wrong. I want to fight for my kids. Are you serious? I'm ready to do whatever I need to keep my children in my life. Well, you know what?

Starting point is 00:26:18 They can be your pen pals from behind bars, woman. A shocking discovery inside a home leads police to investigate a long buried secret. Okay, Leanne Marie is joining us, a friend of the mom, Virginia Gonzalez. Ms. Marie, thank you because what you just said could save a child's life. Yes, ma'am. However, do you know Leanne is the ninth child,

Starting point is 00:26:44 older, younger girl, boy? It's a boy and he is around age 9 to 10 years old. So she has a 14, an 11, a 10, a 9, a 7. I know she has two 3-year-olds, the newborn. So there's nine from what I'm hearing right now. Okay, hold on, let me add this up. There's a 14-year-old, an 11-year-old, a 10-year-old, a nine-year-old is the boy that you think is missing.

Starting point is 00:27:18 A seven-year-old is a little girl starved in the closet. Two three-year-olds, okay, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. I'm missing somebody. Fourteen, eleven, ten, nine, seven, three, and three. And a newborn. What now? So Ava's around eight, nine years old, and then the little boy is right after her. Eleven months difference. You stated that Virginia Gonzalez, the mother, the starving little girl and the other missing girl was, quote, normal, would go partying at the clubs and the bars. Hey, I don't have a problem with that. Party down, mommy.

Starting point is 00:28:00 But what would she ever mention? Who is taking care of the children while she's at the bar? So from what we understand was that the kids, all the kids were left with the grandmother of, she has three kids that belong to one father and that was who she was with the past seven years. And so they were supposedly all living with the grandmother. You're seeing mommy now out partying on a boat drinking straight out of a vodka mini bottle. Oh There she is in a bar Why bother with a glass?

Starting point is 00:28:35 Seriously, why who needs a glass when you can drink straight from the bottle? There's mommy chowing down on some Fritos and chips on a boat while her 29-pound, 7-year-old daughter is locked in a closet at home. Okay, Dr. Angie Arnold, I need to shrink because why is she out on a boat partying while her child is starving in a closet and two children are missing? Right. And Nancy, how can she just be so unattached from all of these children that she's having? So my question is, why is she having all of these children? And I'm sorry, is it to support her lifestyle? And where are the fathers of these children? We always have to ask, why

Starting point is 00:29:24 isn't the mother taking care of them? Okay, yes, she is a horrible person that has done horrible things to at least two of her children that we know about. Where are the fathers of these children and why aren't any of them involved? But Nancy, I don't believe she should be out partying on a boat. I think that when you have children, you should be at home taking care of your children and not relying on someone else to take care of them. Because again, we don't know how children take that. But oftentimes, when mothers are not around, children do sense a fear of abandonment when

Starting point is 00:29:57 their mother is not taking care of them. But to Bronwyn Blake joining us, adjunct professor, University of Texas School of Law, Bronwin, I'm not the church lady. If mom wants to party, go ahead. If mom wants to vape and smoke, have at it. The issue is intent. When she is out partying in her club and bar finery, her child is at home starving and two of them are missing. Now, that goes to intent when I'm trying to prove felony child neglect to a jury. That's when that

Starting point is 00:30:36 type of video, let's see the video again, comes into play. I couldn't care less what mommy wears or what bar she goes to, don't care. But if your child is at home, starving in a closet, suddenly your behavior, your actions during that time are relevant. Absolutely, I can tell you're thinking like a prosecutor, the contrast between the images you're showing of this child and then her mother partying,

Starting point is 00:31:04 it tells the whole story there. And unfortunately, many abusers present one face to some people can be very charming to some people. And then we hear about these horrible things happening at home. To Dr. Kimball Crowns joining me, Chief Medical Examiner, Tarrant County, that's Fort Worth. Dr. Kimball Crowns, I've got one child starved almost beyond recognition, her bones sticking out, you know, like they're visible through the skin. I've got that child starved almost dead, permanent brain injury. I've got a missing little girl and now I'm learning from Leanne Marie, there's another boy missing that is about one, two, three, fourth in the progression line of children. Leanne Marie

Starting point is 00:31:53 joining us, a friend of mom, Virginia Gonzalez. Did you know that Ava was missing? No, we had no idea. Back in 2018, when I originally first met Virginia, we only knew of three little boys. So after talking to mutual friends and all concluding that she had Ava's hair shaved like a boy. She never had Ava in her, I mean, she never let us know that it was a girl. She had her presented as a boy to all of us. So we're all in shock. We didn't, nobody knew that she had Ava. Leanne, I don't understand this.

Starting point is 00:32:38 So she showed you Ava, but this is the missing child, not the starving child. Right. You saw Ava and she had her dressed like a boy with her head shaved? She had her hair. She had him hatch. He had a fade. He had a fade. I definitely confirmed this with her landlord and roommates that she lived with back in 2018. Everybody concluded that and confirmed that it was a little boy. It was not a little, nobody knew she had a little girl. Leanne, knowing the mother,

Starting point is 00:33:14 why do you think she shaved the little girl's head and passed her off as a boy? I feel like that she had a anger issue with the little girls because of the way her mother treated her back when she was little. And I think that she was taking it out on these little girls because from all the evidence and information that I've collected, it's all based on the girls. So, you know, she sold the baby who was a little girl that just got sold Well, apparently for my investigations online and none of this has been confirmed yet

Starting point is 00:34:13 But she did have this newborn baby and according to a person who says that they are a close relative of the family She did have a newborn baby, it was sold to a couple. So if that is in fact the case, there could be a possibility that Ava Marie Gonzalez was also sold and that's something that will have to be looked into because it would be myopic of us to think that that possibility isn't out there. You know what, Christina Araya, I can only hope and pray that she was sold only hope and pray that she was sold and that she's alive and being treated better than little seven-year-old. To Leann Marie, a friend of mom, Virginia Gonzalez, why did she sell her baby? I'm guessing financial issues, but at the same time, you know, all the money was going

Starting point is 00:35:02 downtown Sixth Street and at the strip clubs. I mean, she was just making a reign with money and buying bottles after bottles and buying everybody buying the bar out. I mean, that's where I seen the money going. I don't I didn't see anything else that she had. I mean, she didn't even have a vehicle. You know what I mean? So I mean, I think all the money was just going to party in. I don't think it was ever to just take care of her and the rest of the kids. You know what I mean? I noticed in the party video, she's got a Gucci bag strapped around her front. Was that a fake?

Starting point is 00:35:35 Was that a fruity, a fake Gucci? From my understanding, everything that the police found in her room was everything was name brand. I don't think it was fake. But I do now know that a video was taped back in May a year ago. She would just cover up her her her stomach. I mean, she would honestly, now that I'm thinking, I'm thinking she was trying to hide the pregnancy.

Starting point is 00:36:02 Why? Because she was out there partying. I mean, on the boat party that which was in September of 2024, my birthday. You can see in the video, she was kind of close. She didn't take the whole shot. And I got other, you know, videos of footage of her putting the shots on the side when people weren't watching. So I think she knew she was pregnant, but she just didn't want the other the world to know that she was pregnant. So she just didn't want the other, the world

Starting point is 00:36:25 to know that she was pregnant. So she would literally buy bottles, get everybody drunk and guess what? Then nobody notices anything. Leigh Ann, question. Did she discuss openly that she was selling the baby? No, no ma'am. I found that out through the, one of the children's families, the ones that I've been speaking with since the very beginning of the case when it first started getting investigated.

Starting point is 00:36:50 Do you know who she sold the baby to? I do not know them personally. I just know that it was a couple. Leigh Ann, why did she keep having children if she hated them so much? I don't think that she was having the children to just be this mother and to take care of them.

Starting point is 00:37:08 I think she was living off the benefits, the SNAP and the EBT and the fathers. I think that was how she would hold some of these men, you know, in her life because a lot of them didn't deal with the children. They only dealt with her and a lot of them didn't want the children. They just wanted her. So I think that it was like the kids were like a tool for the men. She was a, you know how they say there's womenizers. I think she was like that with the men, like where she idolized men before her children. Did anyone ever wonder who would be taking care of the children while she's out partying?

Starting point is 00:37:45 So, from my friendship experience with her, she would come and go. So, one minute she was out here popping bottles for about two or three months, and then she'll go ghost for six months a year, and then she'll pop out out of nowhere again. So, it wasn't really... she was real discreet with the children. Like I said, I only went to her that apartment where they found the child that was starving and the other six children. I only went to that apartment one time, which was to go pick her up. And she it was clean. It was the 14 year old was the only one there. I didn't I didn't ask because every time I asked about the children, it was that

Starting point is 00:38:25 they were with her, the grandmother, because her baby daddy was crazy after her, so she just left the children with him so he would be calm, is what she would tell us. Get ready for a celebration of play like no other at the all-new LEGO Summer of Play event at LEGOLAND Discovery Center Toronto, now through August 3rd. I'm master model builder Noel, inviting you to discover your play mode with awesome build activities, experiences, and even some fresh new dance moves. Enjoy the ultimate indoor LEGO playground with rides, a 4-day theatre, and millions of LEGO bricks at LEGOLAND Discovery Center. Build the best day ever with your family by getting tickets online now

Starting point is 00:39:06 at legolanddiscoverycenter.com slash Toronto. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Now regarding the missing sister, Gonzales spouts off again in court and says a man named Saul Jimenez took little Ava from her and the man was the girl's father, but she now claims he was deported back to Mexico before Jimenez sister took little Ava with her to Mexico as well. I only hope and pray that's true.

Starting point is 00:39:53 Although Austin police say they are handling little Ava's disappearance, quote, as a homicide investigation, adding they, quote, don't have any evidence she is alive. Gonzalez in court reports she did not kill her daughter. Well, her bond has been raised to a quarter million dollars. How do people have children? Over and over and over, seven children we now believe, and treat them like this. Has nobody ever heard of a condom? Has nobody ever heard of the birth control bill?

Starting point is 00:40:29 Locking the child in the closet and starving her, one child already missing, believed to be dead? What more do we know? Leah Marie is joining us, a friend of the mom, Regina Gonzalez. So you think that she's having the children in order to get state benefits?

Starting point is 00:40:46 I don't think it's just state benefits. I think, like I said, it's more of a tool for the men that she was in love with. I mean, I mean, some of them, some of the from what I'm understanding too, is some of the kids, I mean, she don't even know who the father is to some of the kids. I mean, she was known for being in the club, you know, with multiple men. So I mean, I don't think that she used the children just for the benefits. I think it was just more of tools to keep the men in her life to help benefit her with the money and the pain for this and pain for that. And that's what I think.

Starting point is 00:41:18 To Daryl Parker joining me, former Lieutenant Fannin County Sheriff's Office at BlackFishIntel.com, Darrell, how do we go about finding the two missing children? You've got the little girl missing. We've got an age-progress photo of her. You've got her missing. You've got a nine-year-old boy missing. I believe the little newborn girl that was sold has been recovered. But how do you go about finding the two missing children?

Starting point is 00:41:47 Well, you know, Nancy, I see a lot of parallels between this case and the Casey Anthony case. And if you recall, the thing that really bogged down that investigation was Casey Anthony's multiple stories where she gave the police all these different versions of what happened to her child. And so in this case, I think the mom has given them some inconsistent stories. They're all they're going to have to track these down. And this is over a period of time to seven years is a lot longer period of time than when Casey Anthony's child was missing. So it's going to be a lot more difficult for law enforcement to piece that together. But she couldn't have done all this without other adults being aware of what was going

Starting point is 00:42:29 on, at least collaterally. So I think there are going to be some other collateral witnesses that can help provide some information to try and find the kids. Brahman Blake, I don't understand how the mother can be getting government benefits but they're not in school because the government does know they exist and they're of school age. How does that work? This is not supposed to happen. When you hear a story like this, multiple systems have failed. This mother was purposely not taking her children to school, I'm sure, because the teachers would have seen something. She's not taking them to their doctor's appointments because the doctors would have seen something. Here in Texas, every single adult is a

Starting point is 00:43:12 mandatory reporter of child abuse, not just those professionals I mentioned. Neighbors, family members, if anyone saw something, it's the law that they had to report it. Christina O'Waaya, what more do you know? Well, the woman who is online identifying as a very close family member, she revealed that their newborn baby was sold. She also is revealing some of the details about what Virginia was telling each one of the family members. It kind of lines up with what Virginia Gonzalez's friend was telling us about the story she

Starting point is 00:43:44 was saying. She pitted the two families against each other. She allegedly told one family that the kids were in the care of the other family. Her side of the family told her mom the same thing vice versa. This woman also claims that the father of three of Virginia Gonzalez's children

Starting point is 00:43:59 actually took care of six of the children for two years until he went to jail jail allegedly back in December. And that's when she's saying that Virginia Gonzalez went and picked up all the kids. She had kept the 14 year old with her originally and then went back and picked up all the kids. So that was in December, which means that if she picked up

Starting point is 00:44:19 the little seven year old girl who they are calling Riri in December, then that means that little girl was suffering most likely six months of abuse before that 911 call came in and they discovered her in the closet. So apparently this woman is describing Virginia Gonzalez as very manipulative and it's crazy because they also say that she didn't allow any of the children to go to school and there are no records of any of the children being in school and And as for Ava Marie Gonzalez, there's no medical records, there's no legal records. So this is a really convoluted case. And if it's true what they're saying about the baby being sold to a couple,

Starting point is 00:44:56 the possibility of Ava Marie Gonzalez being sold to a couple is there as well. But it might have been sold, the baby might have been sold to a more nefarious outfit, which means we could be looking at something concerning child trafficking, which we hope that's not the case. But either way, there is a lot of avenues that investigators need to go down and there are a lot of leads that they need to investigate. Lee Ann Marie, now that you realize the extent of what Virginia Gonzalez was doing to her children, are you surprised? Very. I'm very shocked. of what Virginia Gonzalez was doing to her children. Are you surprised?

Starting point is 00:45:26 Very. I'm very shocked. I'm very disbelief. I just, I can't believe it. I mean, she put up this image. I would have never in my right state of mind thought that she was starving a kid or abusing the children like that.

Starting point is 00:45:43 I would have said something. To Dr. Angela Arnold, how can you present one facade to the public and live such a dark, private life? You know what? That comes from years and years of abuse. Because people who have been abused learn how to compartmentalize different things in their life.

Starting point is 00:46:05 So this woman, because of the purported abuse that she experienced as a child, has learned how to contain the different parts of her life and separate them. It all stems from her abuse. If you know or think you know anything regarding these missing children, please dial 512-572-8477. Repeat, 512-572-8477. We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye, friend. as justice unfolds. Goodbye, friend.

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Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - FRIDAY NIGHT SPECIAL: GIRL, 7, FOUND LOCKED IN CLOSET STARVED, MOM " I WANT TO FIGHT FOR MY KIDS" SPEAKS OUT IN COURT

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