Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Gorgeous coed leaves college party for dorm, DISAPPEARS. Hear LATEST in search for Kristin Smart.

Episode Date: February 28, 2020

After 24 years, new search warrants have been executed in the search for missing college student Kristin Smart. The 19-year-old California Polytechnic State University student was last seen walking back to her dorm room from an off-campus party. A spokesman for the San Luis Obispo County Sheriff’s Office says “some items of interest" have been recovered.Joining Nancy Grace today: Joe Scott Morgan- Forensics expert, Professor of Forensics Jacksonville State University, & author of"Blood Beneath My Feet" Caryn Stark- NYC Psychologist Shera LaPoint - Genetic Genealogist, "The Gene Hunter" Anne Emerson- WCIV ABC 4 Charleston reporter Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. What happened to Kristen Smart? What went wrong? Is there a new break in the case? 364 supplemental reports serving 18 search warrants. The sheriff is saying 37 pieces of evidence from the early days of the case are now being submitted to modern DNA testing. Is there light at the end of the tunnel? What happened to Kristen Smart? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Paul Flores was the last person to be seen with her, according to witnesses.

Two days later, May 27th, Kristen's resident hall neighbor reported her missing. Nearly a month after her disappearance, Cal Poly police turned the case over to the San Luis Obispo County Sheriff's Office, and hundreds of volunteers went on an organized search for Kristen on June 29th. In July 1996, investigators named Paul Flores a key witness. Kristen's parents, Stan and Denise Smart, have filed several lawsuits against Flores, starting just months after she went missing. In this November 1997 deposition, you can hear James Murphy, the Smart Family's attorney, asking Flores about his parents' name, place of work, and Kristen's disappearance.

But Flores refused to answer each question except to say this. On the advice of my attorney, I refuse to answer that question based on the Fifth Amendment of the United States Constitution. You are hearing our friends at KSBY NBC6 reporter Megan Healy speaking just then. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Joining me in all-star panel, Floyd Steiger, Joseph Scott Morgan, Karen Stark, Cheryl LaPointe, and Ann Emerson, WCIV ABC4. Ann Emerson, let's start at the beginning. When did Kristen Smart go missing? She went missing from San Luis Obispo on Memorial Day weekend about 24 years ago. According to reports, it was early in the Saturday morning on Memorial

Day weekend before it was kicking off, and this 19-year-old girl had gone, been headed back to her dorm, and that's when she went missing. We have not seen her since her trip back to the dorm. So she goes missing en route or after she had already gone back to her dorm at California Polytechnic State University. Poly, Cal, Cal, Poly. That is where she goes missing. I want you to hear this. Her family, Denise and Stan Smart.

Denise, what do you recall of that day? Obviously, we didn't know the first day. We didn't know the second day. We didn't know the third day because Cal Poly did not take a request from her friends to look for her. So by the time Monday evening came around, which was she disappeared Friday night, we didn't hear anything until Monday evening. And we got a call from the campus if we knew where she was. And I think every parent will tell you you have a gut reaction

when you know something's not right. And someone calling you out of the blue and saying, do you know where your daughter is? And she's 200 miles away. Thumbs again just going back to there and i think it says you referenced that it it comes back it just always comes back and whenever you hear about a missing child um you relive it for that that family as well when you say you relive it, when you hear about a missing child or a missing teen, what do you mean by relive it? Well, that probably that first day, that first week,

it just comes back into your psyche. You are thinking again about how this family is having to cope with something that is a nightmare beyond anyone's comprehension. And, you know, as we move forward, it's a very long and lonely road to have such a long unknown, to not know where your child is. Unfortunately, there are way too many families who lose their children to illness or accidents. And I don't want to say that there's resolution there, but when you are having to fight for justice and deal with so much frustration, highs and lows, anxiety,

even though people, friends and family may feel you need to move on, when you don't know where your child is, you really cannot move on. In addition to Denise Smart, Kristen's mother, with us is Stan Smart, her father. Stan, back to May 25th. That night, your absolutely beautiful and brilliant daughter, Kristen, had gone to a party, a get-together. She was a student there at Cal Poly, and two of her friends, Cheryl Anderson and Tim Davis, were also leaving the

party, and they walked Kristen back to her dorm that night, right? What do you recall the first you heard Kristen was missing? What happened? Well, if you're asking me, initially the campus police thought our daughter had gone camping with friends, and this is why she had not returned to campus, that she had overstayed the vacation time. And so initially I was a little upset, and although after a week it appeared that something horrible had happened. And so I had gone down there to take a look and meet with the campus police. And the campus police were very ill-equipped to deal with a missing person. I think probably they would be able to handle students that had been drinking or if there'd been a party or a car parked where it shouldn't be, but they had no idea what to do for an investigation into a missing person.

And so I was rather disappointed. And they were real quick to point out that it was our daughter who had made an error, had gone to a party like many students going to college and away from home, and that she'd gotten into trouble and disappeared. And so they left really the blame with us and with our daughter, and that was very disappointing. Anyway, after that and after looking for her and she wasn't appearing and they had found her purse and her belongings in the room, she had not taken those things with her. It was real apparent that something had happened to her.

So it's a nightmare, like my wife had mentioned. I spent a lot of weeks down there, in fact, the whole summer looking for my daughter. And I think I could have been a tour director for San Luis Obispo County. And just, you know, a lot of heartache from it. And as my wife had mentioned, when we hear about other people who have lost a child and they're looking for their child, our hearts go out to them. To Joseph Scott Morgan joining me, professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon. Joe Scott, what do we know about the facts surrounding her disappearance? It's almost as if this young girl who was a freshman in college has kind of

dropped off the face of the earth. She was last seen leaving the party. She was allegedly accompanied by this fellow who has been, you know, kind of named as a key witness, I think, a person of interest. And she's nowhere to be found. It's like she just vanished off the face of the planet. And so that's left the investigators with a dead end. And there were a lot of complications along the way early on in working with campus police and the local authorities. And, of course, state gets involved, and I would imagine the feds at one level. So there was a real lack of communication from Jump Street. Although the case has been stymied after this young girl disappears following a party on the way back to her dorm. Take a listen to our friends at KSBY NBC6.

The sheriff's office confirmed it has the possession of two trucks that belonged to the Flores family in 1996. Ever since Kristen Smart's disappearance, a cloud of suspicion has followed Paul Flores around. It's believed that Flores, who was also a Cal Poly student, was one of the last people to see Kristen. According to investigators, Flores has been referred to as a person of interest in the case since the beginning.

Kristen's family has been very vocal in their belief that Flores killed her. The two trucks, which sheriff's officials say belonged to family members of Paul Flores in 1996, have been a hot topic in recent episodes of the Your Own Backyard podcast. The sheriff's office says closing the case has always been a priority. Now, since 2011, which is when Ian Parkinson became the sheriff, investigators have searched 140 new items of evidence. They have also conducted physical evidence searches at nine separate locations and have resubmitted 37 evidence items from the beginning of the case for modern DNA testing. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. crime stories with nancy grace the sheriff's office confirmed it has the possession of two trucks that belong to the flores family in 1996 ever since kristin smart's disappearance a cloud of suspicion has followed paul fl around. It's believed that Flores,

who was also a Cal Poly student, was one of the last people to see Kristen. According to investigators, Flores has been referred to as a person of interest in the case since the beginning. Kristen's family has been very vocal in their belief that Flores killed her. The two trucks, which sheriff's officials say belonged to family members of Paul Flores in 1996, have been a hot topic in recent episodes of the Your Own Backyard podcast. The sheriff's office says closing the case has always been a priority. Now, since 2011, which is when Ian Parkinson became the sheriff, investigators have searched 140 new items of evidence. They have also conducted physical evidence searches at nine separate locations and have resubmitted 37 evidence items from the beginning of the case for modern DNA testing.

Investigators have now seized two trucks as evidence that belong to the family of what many believe is a prime suspect in the disappearance of a California college girl, Kristen Smart, who vanishes near her dorm. We know that cops have revealed details about the new evidence. It's a long, long overdue break in the disappearance of the 19-year-old girl. These two trucks are now in evidence, and they were confiscated from the family of this so-called key witness, Paul Flores.

What do we know about Flores? We know he has long been the prime suspect in Smart's disappearance, but he's never had any formal charges filed against him. Listen to her family, Denise and Stan Smart. What happened, Stan Smart? How is it that suddenly it's Paul Flores there, alone with Kristen? Well, that's the big question. I really can't respond to that. You know, that being the last person seeing her alive, more than likely she was under the influence from alcohol or drugs given or taken at the party. And I imagine he steered her over towards his dorm.

His roommate wasn't there. His roommate was gone for the weekend. And I suspect that our daughter ended up in his room. There was a follow-up, I'm sure you're going to mention, with some dogs that ended up going to his room of all the rooms on the campus, and that someone had died there is what they could determine. But that was the last we had heard of our daughter, and that was... Wait a minute, wait a minute. Could you back that up, Stan? What did you say about evidence suggesting someone had died there? Right. When there was a search of the campus, they used independent cadaver dogs at different times to go by,

and they zeroed in on his room and the bed in his room and the wastebasket. All they could determine was somebody had died in that room. They didn't know if it was our daughter or someone else, but that was the evidence that they had. And at the time, and still, they've not been able to determine what chemicals, you know, when a body, when a person dies, they leave a scent, I guess you would say, that a dog can determine, but a human can't. And that's what, you know, the dog handlers indicated. So it looks like someone died in Paul Flores' dormitory room. Then the university cleaned the room, and they put students back in the room for the oncoming term in the fall,

which is hard for me to believe that no one went in there and looked for forensic evidence and did not go through the room before they cleaned it, put students in it again to use it. We asked if a forensic team had been brought into the room, and they point blank told us they didn't need it. They were just looking for evidence that Paul may have left behind. So there were no hair fibers had to be found or fingerprints because they never brought a forensic team.

When he was first confronted by Cal Poly police, he had black eye bruises, scrapes on his knees. Did they take a photograph? No, they didn't take a photograph. And the only reason we know about those is he turned himself in over the weekend for an outstanding DUI, and they happened to have taken his pictures. And in the picture, he was holding up his number so you can see the scrapes and bruises on his hands and the black eye that he has. But yeah, Cal Poly police did none of that. So it's, you know,

it's been frustrating from the get-go. Let's take a listen to Paul Flores. Where did you attend high school? On the advice of my attorney, I refuse to answer that question based on the Fifth Amendment of the United States Constitution. What is the name of your father? On the advice of my attorney, I refuse to answer that question based on the Fifth Amendment of the United States Constitution. What is your mother's name? On the advice of my attorney, I refuse to answer that question based on the Fifth Amendment of the United States Constitution. There you hear a person of interest, Paul Flores, repeatedly taking the Fifth Amendment, even to the point he won't even say who his mom and dad are. He's taking the Fifth Amendment on that.

The right to remain silent is as if his parents' names could somehow incriminate him in Kristen Smart's disappearance. To Joe Scott Morgan joining me, Professor of Forensics, Jacksonville State University. Joe Scott, he's been a prime suspect all these years, but he's never been charged. Why? You know, I think that they were lacking some type of physical evidence to tie him back to her disappearance. And absent that, you don't have a proverbial nail to essentially hang the evidence on the wall here. So they need something. Forensics and investigations is all about connection, Nancy. And if they don't have that one central tieback point, that's a problem. We were on the air together, I think, back in 2016, Nancy, and I really got my hopes up about this case because don't you remember they went out to the scene. They actually had a physical location where they were going to take heavy equipment and begin excavating an area because at that point in time, we thought that we had a body.

And of course, that turned out to be a dead end. You're right. This is what we know about the timeline. Take a listen to our friends at KSBY. June 19, 2000, the San Luis Obispo County Sheriff's Office searched the Arroyo Grande backyard of Susan Flores, Paul's mother. It would be one of several home searches over the years. On May 25, 2002, exactly six years after she disappeared, Kristen Smart was declared legally dead. As part of a discovery process in a civil suit, crews dig up the yard of the Flores family home in May 2007. The search yields no new evidence.

Ian Parkinson is then elected as sheriff in 2011, pledging to review the Smart case. I would be equally frustrated not having this case solved after all these years. Fast forward to September 6, 2016, when investigators excavated this Cal Poly hillside after FBI cadaver dogs alerted in surrounding areas. Deputies have not said what they found there, remaining tight-lipped about the investigation. Then through a series of major mistakes, Kristen is not reported missing for days. Take a listen to this. So we had a standard Sunday night call. So she would call every Sunday night. And when she didn't call on Memorial Day weekend Sunday, we weren't alarmed because it was a long weekend and she left us a message on Friday night and she had missed us and we were out. And she said, I've out and she said I've got good news I've got good news I can't wait to talk to you so we weren't alarmed on that Sunday night

and of course so the next call we got was from you know Cal Poly security police when her roommate who had been gone for the weekend came home and was alarmed and had a note from some of her other friends do you know where Kristen is and her purse and her belongings were on the bed just where her roommate had seen them when she had left. Every newspaper article that came out in that first six months was about this drunk girl, and it just made us livid. It has nothing to do with whether you've got shorts on,

whether you've got long hair, short hair. It doesn't matter. What matters is this is a life, and we have to value the life and not point a finger and blame victims. And as we referenced, Cal Poly was certainly ill-equipped and inexperienced in dealing with this. And in 1998, they passed the Kristen Smart Campus Safety Act, which requires California campuses to have a local agreement with law enforcement if they are even beginning to look at a violent crime on campus. So everyone said, well, doesn't that make you feel better? Well, yes, but it's a little late for Kristen. Guys, Nancy Grace here. We are heading straight into breaking crime and justice news. But first, how can you keep yourself and your children safe? I have investigated and prosecuted

literally thousands of felony cases. I have covered literally thousands of cases of missing people, adults and children, unsolved homicides, violent crimes. After all the cases, after speaking to all the victims, all the police, all the witnesses over years, what can we do about it? I don't want to just sit back and report on it. I want to take action. And I know you must feel the same way. You don't want to just hear about crime. You want to do something about it and do something to stop it. And here is the news. Don't Be a Victim, Fighting Back Against America's Crime Wave, a brand new book. After interviewing literally hundreds of crime victims and police, we put our knowledge into Don't Be a Victim. This book is for everyone who wants to stay safe or who wants to keep your loved ones safe.

CrimeOnline.com, pre-order now and know that portions of our proceeds goes to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. You can't live under a dark cloud forever. You have to look back at the joy and the life that your child has. That's Denise Smart speaking to me about the disappearance of her daughter. To Joe Scott Morgan, what do you know about the new so-called new evidence and what impact it may have on the case? Well, you reflect back, Nancy, to, say, the way things were back in 1996

when we had to take huge samples in order to search for DNA contained within a sample. I'm thinking back to all of these cases, these infamous cases from our past. But jumping forward, I think that it's fascinating they have these two trucks. Now, I don't know if they're in pristine condition. Chances are they are not. But what they're going to be looking for, Nancy, with these two vehicles that we've talked about, is these things that are absolutely unseen with the naked eye. Is there any remnant of any contact DNA that is left behind, whether it be skin cells or maybe dried blood?

And then another question we have to ask, is the sample going to be viable? But they have got a good start because they've got both of these trucks in their possession at this point in time. And they'll be digging through the seats, going into the fibers of the seats. They'll look on the door panels, on the carpet, if there is carpeting in the vehicle, anywhere that they can find that could be protected, that could hold some keys. Joe Scott, I don't understand. These are possessions that were owned by the suspect, the only suspect we've got. Why are we just getting them? Two trucks now seized belonging to the family of Paul Flores. Why are we just getting them?

I don't know. That's a question I think that that's key here, Nancy. I'm wondering if there hasn't been some kind of resistance on the part of the family, you know, that they're, you know, come hell or high water, they're not going to release these. Or are the police casting a wider net now thinking that maybe one of these vehicles could have been used in this particular case, either as a conveyance or maybe a location where something horrible happened, and now they're going back and they're going to sift through because now, you know, contextually we're looking at the world that we live in now with the abilities that we have in DNA that did not exist when this first happened. Say they may have thought back then, well, yeah, he may have used the trucks,

but we don't have any way to go back and collect this evidence. Now we do. Now we can go back in, we can dig these things out, we can root it out, and hopefully they're going to be able to collect something at a level that most people, and even I, can't comprehend. What we are learning is that California police have seized two vans, vans belonging to the family of the primary suspect in Kristen Smart's disappearance from her California college campus. Now, what do we know about the vans? What was inside of the vans?

It could be a plethora of information, but we know that Sheriff Ian Parkinson states that 140 new items of evidence and 37 items of evidence for DNA testing is being, all of it is being examined.

We know that the office has executed 18 search warrants conducting physical evidence searches at nine separate locations, and they are doing a complete re-examination of every item of physical evidence seized by all agencies. It's confusing to me what's new and what's old. Listen to her family, Denise and Stan Smart. Denise, you were talking about searches, searches of structures. Explain. Well, as you referenced before, Cal Poly police refused to let in outside help. And apparently the DA's office was working on the site and working

on it. But it took 30 days before the jurisdiction was released. We had a meeting with local legislators, and her case was released officially to the sheriff's department, and there was an immediate search for, and we talk about the cadaver dogs that hid on his room. But then after that, his family had two homes in a nearby town of Arroyo Grande, and based on the cadaver dogs alerting on his room, a search warrant was issued for his father's house in Arroyo Grande.

And once again, and this is the Sheriff's Department, these are the people that you want to trust, they did a search at the house, but they didn't bring a forensic team. They didn't bring the dogs. They just did a walk through the house and found newspaper articles about Kristen under both the father's and the mother's bed, found a police baton, and they left and they were done. And this property probably is at least a half an acre. You could have a cemetery in the backyard. And so we've asked repeatedly

through multiple sheriffs, multiple investigators to go back to the house and to look again and to actually do a search. So it's just unreal to us that they didn't even bring a forensic team. And when we asked why, they were very straightforward with us. And they said they were looking for her keys because they'd found in criminal cases of violence against women that the perpetrator likes to hold on to an item. So they didn't need a forensic team because they were just looking for her keys. And on the same lines, they had a search warrant. Well, they didn't have a search warrant, but maybe they did. They went to the mother's house, which was about.

Well, wait a minute. There were headlines, lots of headlines. Trumpeting, for instance, is Kristen Smart buried in this backyard? Neighbors and a wonder dog say yes. What are they talking about, Stan? Well, the information that we had is that there's a possibility that our daughter could be in the backyard of the residence where the mother resides in Roya Grande. There was a search with some ground-penetrating radar on some of the property, but not all the property. There's interest afterwards.

My wife can give you better details on it. A person from the university came with another dog and felt that the residue or the body was still in the yard, that it hadn't been searched completely. And so that's the big question, whether or not there could be a search warrant to go back in and look further in the yard for our daughter's body. Let me understand about an ex-FBI agent suggests that Kristen's remains may be under a cement slab poured by the last man to see her alive, Denise.

Right. Well, there are a couple of things I'd like to insert here. And one is that, yes, the FBI agent went forward and he wrote up a subpoena to go back to the house. And apparently, they took a vote in the Sheriff's Department and they opted not to follow that lead. They voted not to go back to dig in the yard. Now, subsequent to that, Paul Flores' mother and her boyfriend filed a civil lawsuit against my husband and I for their emotional distress. So I can't begin to tell you how stressful that was and unbelievable. But in the course of that, the mother allowed an FBI person and others to go in and selected areas in the

backyard. And they did do a dig in the areas that the mother approved that they could go to. And the dogs that my husband was referencing were from Dr. Vass from the University of Tennessee. And he looks for, again, the scent or the aroma in the land that possibly leads to a human remain in the yard. And he picked up the scent by going somewhere around the perimeter of the yard. So, I mean, I don't know where she is. I just know that we, as a family, want to feel at the end of the day, if we don't find her, that everything possible was done that could be done. And when these things are only halfway done, there's no peace.

But what I do know is that until you do the job 100%, you won't have an answer. And it could be that Kristen was in the yard, is no longer in the yard. She may have been moved to the parent, to the father's yard. But if you bring in the correct team, they can analyze and they can tell you if she was or she wasn't there. That's not something I can do. But I believe she's not far away. The parents are not revered in the community, yet they hold two houses. They could easily move down the road and be anonymous citizens,

but they have chosen to stay and protect these two homes. And normal people don't do that. And there's a billboard with Kristen's picture on it that they have to pass every single day to go to their houses. So is she in one of those yards? I would say the chances are yes. What happened to Kristen Smart? I know that the new DNA techniques are part of the relaunch of the investigation, but what was seized in those vans? Joining me, Cheryl La now? Nancy, with, again, the new techniques in DNA testing, they don't need the amounts of DNA that was needed in 1996 to possibly nail down a perpetrator or actually, in this case, nail down the DNA of Ms. Smart. It's very possible that they can scourge these vehicles and find minute particles of DNA that will prove that she possibly was in one of the vehicles. And I believe at this

point, that's what they're looking for. They are taking items that were in the vehicles, but they're also going through the carpets, the seats, looking for blood samples, like Joseph Scott Morgan said. And I think that, you know, it's very possible nowadays that if it's there, they will find it. crime stories with nancy grace 140 pieces of new evidence wow uh 364 supplemental reports serving 18 search warrants the sheriff is saying saying 37 pieces of evidence from the early days of the case are now being submitted to modern DNA testing. To Ann Emerson, WCIV, ABC4, what can you tell me about a podcast about Kristen Smart?

Well, we know there was a podcast about Kristen Smart. Well, we know there was a podcast that's hosted by a man named Chris Lambert called Your Own Backyard. And from what I've gathered, he actually grew up right around the corner from where this happened. And I think this just kept on sticking with him and kind of he wanted to know more about it. And as he kind of started unraveling things, he was learning more and more and more. It became this podcast as of September. And honestly, the Kristen Smart family thinks that this has really raised the awareness about this case again. And we've seen it happen in other crime podcasts. We've seen it happen a couple of times now where the profile of this case just goes through the roof and it puts a lot of pressure

on the Sheriff's Department to come forward with some answers when you have so many people calling in saying, what are you doing about this young girl's disappearance? And I'm looking over what the Sheriff actually said about what they've released. You know, this is what they did was they don't they said they don't generally practice on comments on items of evidence in an active investigation, which is extraordinary in itself, because we're talking about a 20, 24 year old case that's older than this young girl was when she disappeared. She's been missing longer than she's actually was with her family. Now, what's so interesting is that this case has been, since 2011, he kind of gives us a

laundry list of all the work that they've done. And from what we also understand from the Lambert work with this podcast is that this is generating more interest and possibly more tips. So this is an opportunity for the sheriff to get in front of his case and say, you know, I came in, I was going to do something about this. I told you I was going to keep this investigation open and here we go. And you know what? You know, the Smart family has a lot of hope that something may be coming down the pipeline soon. Take a listen to our friends at KSBY NBC6. Chris Lambert, creator of Your Own Backyard podcast, recently sat down with the San Luis Obispo County Sheriff's Office.

Now he says he always intended on doing so, but wasn't able to include them in any of the episodes in his series. Now the meeting didn't only help with his research. He says he was able to bring new episodes in his series. N only help with his resea able to bring new ideas a Chris Lambert released si own backyard, a podcast s the disappearance of Cal smart, a case that's been Lambert says he wasn't a

before his last episode was released has, it was a lot of how like, does this check out more about this? Is this I'm getting tips that are look in this location and a lot of time going to th already positive that it'

says the face to face mea helped with sheriffs helped with his research, and he believes some of the information he's received has helped investigators. You're hearing our friend Michael Torres talking about the Chris Lambert, Your Own Backyard podcast credited with bringing the case back to the highlight. But it sounds like more than that, there are tips that Lambert got that maybe police didn't. Karen Stark with me, New York psychologist joining me. You can find her at karenstark.com. Karen, all these years, the family has waited for answers.

And now, I hate for them to get their hopes up if there's not a break in the case, but there's really no alternative. What are they going through, Karen Stark? Nancy, it's unimaginable what they're going through because they have no, look, you don't ever get closure when someone is dead and they can't get her back again, but they suffer not knowing what happened. Will they ever have a chance to really bury a body, to know where she's located? And so it's been excruciatingly difficult for them. There is no doubt that they've been suffering mentally, mostly missing her, not knowing what happened. So if they can come up with anything, it's the best thing that can happen to this family. To Jessica and

Morgan, I'm still not able to nail down exactly what the new evidence is. Now, some outlets report it to be vans. Some outlets report it to be two trucks. But it's my understanding that the vehicles have belonged to the chief suspect, Paul Flores. His family had them and the state got them. I got to wonder what took them so long to get them. But do you believe that these are vans full of items, say from an apartment? Are they just simply the vehicle itself? What's your understanding, Joe Scott, as to what the evidence actually is? I don't know. I think it's the fact that they've mentioned these two vehicles. And my one thought is this, maybe this is a line of logic the police are tracking down, is that since no one has been able to locate her remains, I'm wondering if they're not viewing one of these two vehicles as a conveyance for her remains to a specific location. she was injured either outside the van or vehicle and then placed in or maybe she was injured within the vehicle that's going to create a whole new spectrum of evidence in and of itself regardless

of what else is in there as far as other objects if she contacted the floor if her blood contacted the floor anything skin cells whatever it is if they think that these things have been locked down well enough to preserve the evidence, they're going to go in and they're going to take this thing apart, these things apart piece by piece and examine each and every inch of this thing in order to analyze it for potential evidence. We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.