Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Jodi Arias Stabs Naked Lover Dead In Shower, Continues Flirting Behind Bars

Episode Date: December 3, 2022

Jodi Arias stabs her boyfriend, Travis Alexander, 28 times, shoots him and leaves him to die in a shower. Nancy takes a look back at the trial, finds out more about Arias' life behind bars and comments made by her cellmates. Why does she still get dozens of love letters? Joining Nancy Grace today  Judge Ashley Willcott: Judge & Trial Attorney Dr. Brian Russell: Host of "Fatal Vows"  Caryn Stark: Psychologist Alexis Tereszcuk- Crime Online Investigative Reporter  Chris Hughes - Friend  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Why won't this woman go away? Ugh! I'm talking about Jodi Arias. Some people, not me, but some people think she's very attractive, and I know for sure she's got a great singing voice. But does that really erase the memory of Travis Alexander's body stabbed at least 29 times, shot in the head, and left to decompose? And a very soggy, damp shower stall?

I don't think so. But yet she is here again, rearing her face. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation and Sirius XM 111. Jodi Arias is a big flirt. Their words, not mine. With a lot of hate.

Jodi Arias is, quote, a flirt, okay, I already knew that, and has a lot of hate. I know that too, but it's not just me analyzing evidence. It's her roommate, or should I correct that, her cellmate. Take a listen to Donovan Bearing, Jodi Arias' cellmate, speaking to our friends at Lifetime. She got away with things that other inmates didn't get away with. She was a very attractive young girl who liked to flirt and the male guards just ate it up. That's from Cellmate Secrets, Jodi Ariasrias and it's sharing very disturbing information surrounding the murder as travis alexander including a lot of bombshell theories about his slaying so the fact that jody arias is a big flirt we knew that she managed to bag one guy after the next change her appearance and come across either simpering as a victim as a woman scorned full of jealousy as a sex siren

she can change her appearance like a chameleon you should have heard her on the stand. I did. How did the whole thing unfold? Listen. What's going on? A friend of ours is dead in his bedroom. We hadn't heard from him for a while. We think he's dead. His roommate just went in there and said there's lots of blood.

I didn't go in, but I can give you the phone to someone who went in there. Yes, please, can you? Hello. Hi, so what's going on? He's dead. He's in his bedroom in the shower. Okay. How did this happen? Do you have any idea? No, we have no idea. Everyone's been wondering about him for a few days.

She said that there was blood, so is it coming from his head? Did he have a friend? You know, it's all over the place. Hold on just a moment. Okay, you're a good friend of Travis's, correct? Yes, I am. Yeah. Has he been depressed at all, thinking about committing suicide, anything like that? I don't think he's been thinking about committing suicide. He's been really depressed because he broke up with with this girl and he was all upset about that but i i don't think he would

actually kill himself over that has he been threatened by anyone recently yes he has he has a he has an ex-girlfriend that's been bothering him and and um following him and slashing tires and things like that and you know the ex-girlfriend's name? Her name is Jody. Joining me right now, along with Ashley Wilcott, juvenile judge, lawyer, founder of ChildCrimeWatch.com, Dr. Brian Russell, renowned New York psychologist, Karen Stark, Alexis Tereszczuk joining me. Alexis, why won't she go away? Because she can't. She craves the attention.

Alexis, what can you tell me about Travis Alexander in life? What was he like? Travis was the nicest guy. He was a Mormon, the religion that he had committed himself to as he was older. And he was full of life. He had so many friends. He was a respected business guy. He was the one who had the whole house

and had all the roommates. So everybody depended on Travis to take care of them and that's what he did. He took care of everybody. He was funny. He was adventurous. He was always going on trips. And in fact, when he and Jody started dating,

they went on a lot of trips together. Fun trips to waterfalls and to San Diego, lots of places. He was an up and coming entrepreneur. He was running his own business through the organization and he was really climbing up in the company because people liked him. He had a quick smile. His sister just said he was the nicest guy you would ever meet. Everybody that met him said he was so nice. And he was also struggling with his religion. He wanted to follow the tenets so strictly.

But he also, like any other young person in their late 20s, early 30s, he wanted to have sex with his girlfriend. It's interesting. I'm going to go to Karen Stark on this in a moment. But all of his friends and family that knew her did not want him to be with her. And I've questioned them about that repeatedly saying, what was it about her? And they all said, I don't know. It was just a freaky, hinky feeling. She was just, we just thought she was weird and crazy. There was just something about her. Dr. Brian Russell, she's, many people believe, beautiful. She's got a beautiful face. Many

people think she's got a beautiful body. I don't find her beautiful, people believe, beautiful. She's got a beautiful face. Many people think she's got a beautiful body. I don't find her beautiful, but many people do. She's got tons of people writing her and sending her money behind bars. The thing is, when Travis Alexander, who I understand at the time was a devout Mormon, got tangled up with Jodi Arias, at some point, he wanted to break it off. He said things like he did not think they would ever get married. He wanted to start dating other people. She would have none of it. So she finds out he's going on a trip to Cozumel with another woman, and that just throws her into a fit. Drives literally across the desert. she's moved away with all the gas cans in her

trunk so she doesn't have to stop to use her credit card or be on a surveillance video at a 7-11 gets to his home they have crazy fetish sex all day complete with photos which were played over and over and over at trial and then he still refuses to cancel the Cozumel date. And when that happens, she stabs him 29 times and shoots him in the head, leaving his body to decompose in the shower. Help me out, Dr. Brian Russell. I'm glad you just gave that rundown, Nancy, because, you know, she said she killed him while he was beating her. There'd be a self-defense argument, but physical evidence from the scene clearly suggested that didn't happen that way. I never saw solid evidence that he'd ever beaten her.

Let's just look at the facts. As you accurately point out, Dr. Brian Russell, there were many ways, if it were indeed true, which no one but Aria says is true. They were broken up. She had moved away, hours away. They were not living together. They were never married. They never had children, nothing. They had a fling. He broke up. She moved away, scorned. She left. She was living somewhere else, had a brand new place to live, had a car, a job, the works, and they'd been apart for a while. As a matter of fact, I'm reading directly from the autopsy report. Travis Alexander's jugular vein, his throat was slit.

The common carotid artery, the trachea, had been slashed. He had defensive wounds on his hand. He may have even been dead at the time she shot him in the head. Also, the crime scene revealed that when he first was stabbed, he realized he was dying. He stumbled to the bathroom mirror and actually looked in the mirror as he was dying. And we know this because of the blood evidence. There were drops, not spatter, not throwback, not transfer, drops of blood that dropped down from his neck and his nose and his face onto the sink as he looked into the mirror as he died. And he was left naked and bloody, bleeding out in the shower. As a matter of fact, it's really not even contested how he died. Listen to Jodi Arias at trial admitting she slit his throat. Would you agree that you're the person who actually slit Mr. Alexander's throat from ear to ear?

Yes. To Ashley Wilcott, a veteran trial lawyer and judge, it gives me no pleasure to replay the rendition of how Travis Alexander was murdered. He didn't see it coming. He had no idea what was about to happen. But we also know, Ashley, that at the beginning, she claimed that she wasn't there. She had nothing to do with it at all. Then when evidence turned up that she had been there she actually claimed that ninjas showed up all dressed in black and for no reason burst into the home stole nothing she ran and saved her own life but they killed travis and left like shadows in the night i mean ashley really right really so she was lying from the get-go obviously with the story that she initially told with the ninjas. But here's what I love about our justice system.

During this trial, it went from story to story to story to story. But as you just played, finally, on the stand, under oath, she admits she slit his throat, period. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. You know, when Jodi Arias' roommate first saw Arias walking through the door at the Arizona Correctional Institute, she thought Arias was a model, not a murderer. But she's speaking out on a true crime documentary called Sailmate Secrets. Jodi Arias, listen. It's weird, but there was just no signs that she was capable of doing that.

She was a very quiet, soft-spoken, very well-spoken person. It was not the Jody that was sitting there next to me. What really happened in the murder of Travis Alexander? His family still devastated by his gruesome death? Well, this is what we know. Travis Alexander didn't see it coming. He had no idea what was about to happen. She stabs him 29 times and then shot him, cleaned up the scene as best she could, put a lot of clothes in the washer, including her digital camera. Hello. And on the camera to Karen Stark were actual photos. They had been, she had been taking sex photos the whole day. Okay. But forget about that. On the digital camera that she left in the washing machine are photos, we think, accidentally taken during Travis's murder.

Karen Stark, New York psychologist, what about that? This is a person who really is not only a pathological liar, but has absolutely no guilt about anything that happened and documented it as it was happening. Now, even if it was accidental, somehow she knew that she should wash things up, clean them up, despite the ninjas or whatever she was saying. And she very clearly is a psychopath who committed this murder. There is no doubt in my mind that she knew exactly what she was doing and that it had to do with rage and jealousy and her inability to let go of this man. Alexis Therese Chuck, you also cover the case every single day. I was in the courtroom almost every day and was broadcasting from a couple blocks

away from the courthouse. The digital camera evidence to me is overwhelming. It places her there at the time of the murder in the room with Travis. It does. It's right up to and after she murders him. There are pictures of him naked in the shower. He's got the water running over him. He's looking directly at the camera. These were not secret photos that he didn't know were being taken. Then there's the picture of his foot in the shower. And there's the picture of his foot in the shower and there's another picture of the blood on the floor and they're taking there's a time stamp so you can tell that they were taken just moments literally less than two minutes after he was alive in the shower she's taking pictures and then he's dead she when she went into her frenzy her spree killing

spree and stabbed him repeatedly and the thing was, she also shot him, but the bullet casing was found on top of the blood. So what the evidence was presented in court is that there's no way she shot him first. Otherwise, that would be on the bottom and be covered with blood. It happened afterwards and it wasn't disturbed. And this is everything that was shown on her camera. She didn't even take the camera with her. Alexis, exactly where is Jodi Arias housed? Has she been moved?

What's the name of her correctional facility? And what do we know specifically about security there? Is it a pod? Does she have a roommate? Can she decorate herself like a dorm room? So she is in the Perryville prison. She has not been moved. She entered there in 2015, April 13th, 2015. It is a very standard 12 by 7 cell, I believe, with a bed and a sink.

With me here in the studio, Jackie Howard. Jackie, what do you know? According to a May 2022 posting on Jodi Arias's website, Jodiariasisinnocent.com. She's located now in the Lumley unit. She writes that unit has undergone many changes. Arias is now in medium custody. And according to the website, maximum custody was eliminated at Perryville. She's working full time but not taking college courses anymore. According to the website, she hated them despite her 4.0 GPA.

She is, however, still working on her art. I understand that Jodi Arias perceives herself to be quite the artiste. Okay. Is that true? Let me say, is that still true? Because I've seen some of it. To me, it looks like she's just tracing pictures out of magazines. But that, I'm no art critic, Alexis.

You tell me. Jodi Arias was drawing so many pieces of art. And she has been in this prison. She's not allowed to sell it or profit off of this. But she is sending people her artwork. And it's on her website from before. So if people wanted to go check that out, JodiArias.com has her art.

It's disgusting. To Dr. Bethany Marshall, Psycho Analyst joining me out of L.A., Dr. Bethany, behind bars, she's somewhat of a celebrity. She gets hundreds of love letters. People put money in her commissary account. She, quote, draws, end quote, and then sells them.

It's quite the life, quite the life. Dr. Bethany, explain how is she still manipulating people from behind bars? Well, she's highly manipulative. You know, I was thinking about borderline personality disorder as you were talking to Alexis. She definitely has borderline personality disorder. I actually was looking it up in the DSM-5, which is the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. And one of the characteristics is intense, unstable, and conflicted close relationships marked by mistrust, neediness, and anxious preoccupation with real or imagined abandonment, close relationships often viewed in extremes of idealization and devaluation, alternating between over-involvement and withdrawal. And I can see

that in her relationship with Travis Alexander, that it started with the idealization and then it went through to the devaluation. The idealization is when he was dating her, right? When they were together, when they were going out. And then do you remember that she found out that he was planning a vacation with another woman? Then it went from the idealization to the devaluation. Jodi Arias, again, some people think she's a looker. I don't. I think she looks like the devil. But she did manage to win over cellmates and make friends behind bars, even winning the coveted

America's Got Talent behind bars. Listen. Oh, holy night, the stars are brightly shining. It is the night of our dear Savior's birth. Long lay the world in sin and error pining, till He appeared and the soul felt its worth. A thrill of hope the weary world rejoices for yonder breaks

a new and glorious morn. Fall on your knees O hear the angel voices O night divine O night when Christ was born O night divine. Oh night, oh night divine. Yes, I made Jackie play the whole thing.

I wanted to make sure Arias was hitting the high note and she did. Well, that's quite a feather in her cap. America's Got Talent behind bars. But the jealous rage that overtook her when she learned Travis Alexander was taking another woman on an island getaway was intense. So intense, she went out of control. Now, that's one theory. Other people argue she planned Travis Alexander's murder for a long time, even crossing a desert, carrying gas cans in the trunk of her

car so she wouldn't have to stop for gas so no one would see her in or out. No receipts, no trail, no nothing. If it hadn't been for Arius's own bizarre behavior during her courtship with Travis Alexander, she may never have been a suspect. But all of Travis's friends and relatives advised him, get away from her, man. And he tried to. He did. Take a listen to Aaron Dewey speaking to me. Aaron, you told me that you lived with Travis during the time he dated Jodi Arias. What was that relationship like? What did you observe, if anything? You know, when they first met, Travis was on Cloud Nine. Here was a very attractive young lady that he that he had met at that convention in Las Vegas. They shared a lot of similar interests and similar passions, a real drive and ambition in life.

And so he thought he had found the one. And at the beginning of the relationship, everything seemed like it was going to go perfectly and possibly go all the way. You know, things deteriorated quickly. There were lots of trust issues. admitted in some of her statements that she would go through his emails, his social media accounts, his text messages. There was a time when they were on vacation together and he was a sleeper in the shower and a text message came in from another girl and she responded to that girl as if she was Travis, telling telling her how happy that he was to be with her and she's the best thing that ever

happened and it's in an attempt to scare this girl away from Travis okay right there Alexis I want to come to you for the the facts behind that but just right there Karen Stark renowned psychologist joining us out of Manhattan going through somebody's text messages, their emails much less, doing it on the sly when the person is asleep or in the shower, I mean, waiting for that moment, and then actually responding to someone as if you are the owner of the phone, that's beyond the pale, Karen, right there. Not beyond the pale for somebody who has an antisocial personality nancy this is somebody who has to have possession of the other person in dominance it's pathological possessiveness oh where he was what he was doing and had total

control well you know what travis was really no match for that kind of single-mindedness. But listening to his friends, things slowly began to change. Take a listen to our friends at CrimeOnline.com. It didn't take long for the relations to cool, partly because of Travis Alexander's interest in other women. Here's Picture Perfect author Shana Hogan. Jody went through his phone and discovered these flirty messages to other women. Here's picture-perfect author Shana Hogan. Jodi went through his phone and discovered these flirty messages to other women and she decided to end the relationship at that point. But at the same time, Travis was looking to end the relationship. And partly

because of Arius's possessiveness. The couple did end the relationship but continued to be friends with benefits. You know what, that whole friends with benefits, that sounds way off kilter to me. You're supposed to be friends, but you're sleeping together. I just don't see how that can ever work out in any good way. Never a good ending there. So Alexis Tereszczyk joining me, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. Things finally began to cool down. How?

Well, Jody actually moved about 1,000 miles away from Travis. He was living in Phoenix, Arizona. She, at this point, had no job. She wasn't living with him. She wasn't living with any of her other ex-boyfriends. She kind of had no options. She had no boyfriend, no job. So she moved back home to Wairika,

California, which is kind of right on the border of California and Oregon. It's very northern California. Her family owned a restaurant and she moved back there. So they were not really in contact in person, but they kept up their very spicy sex phone phone sex so they break up whole wait wait let me go to chris hughes uh longtime friend of travis alexander's did he reveal to you that he and jody had broken up you know it's all so fuzzy to me and I mean, I really in all the conversations I had with Travis, I don't ever remember him telling me he was with her. You know, hey, she's my girlfriend now. You know, we're in a committed, loving relationship. We never had that conversation. So there was no there was no conversation to be had on the back end, you know, to say, hey, we're update. We're broken up now. But the only thing that he ever did say to me is, is he would complain, he would complain about her. You know,

little things here and there. He never told me about the big things. Because if he told me about the big things, like, like, slashing his tires and and stealing things from his house, you know, I would have been like, you know, I told you, did I tell you? Didn't I tell you she was nuts? So he would never tell me about the big, really violating, psychotic things that she was doing. And I had to find out about much of this after the fact, unfortunately.

Well, you're absolutely right, Chris Hughes. Take a listen to our friends at ABC's 2020. I absolutely know that she was stalking him many times. Just like when she went in through the back door when he was kissing another girl in his couch. She's spying on him. That's what's really happening there. She slashed his tires. She broke into his email account.

She hacked into his Facebook page. She broke into his house and stole his journals. She read his diary. She just did these crazy stalking behaviors. Okay, whoa, wait. It's just like drinking from the fire hydrant. There's just so much here. You can't drink it all in at once. Alexis Tereschuk, speaking of her showing up after they're broken up, okay, so they she shows up at his home what a coinkydink that is when he has a date with another woman now you know she was hacking into his email and text his phone messages she knew they had a date and so she was hanging around stalking out as a you know

really watching could have been arrested could have been arrested for being like a peeping tom for trespassing and can you imagine you've got a date you don't really know the person and you're potentially sharing your first kiss on the sofa and then out of the corner of your eye you see jody aries's head loom up behind the bushes and this terrified not only travis but all his roommates were really afraid of her and then he gets up one morning and his tires are splashed his new car and they immediately there's not even a question anyone's mind they're not thinking oh this is maybe some teenage pranksters in the neighborhood nope everybody knew it was Jodi Arias there wasn't a share what What is the phrase? An ounce of doubt. I'm losing.

A shred of doubt. Shred. Oh, thank you. Yeah. And what about that, Chris Hughes? He never told you that he suspected Jody Arias of slitting his tires? Towards the very end, he did. Because it was, I mean, it had gotten out. You know, we were all talking about it.

Because it happened twice. It didn't just happen one time it happened twice and it was on his bmw and anybody's ever owned a bmw those tires are about you know three to five hundred dollars each and it was a big it was devastating you know financially he wasn't in a good spot and here's this psychopath cutting his tires and i remember the second time he didn't even know what he's going to do. He was so distraught financially, you know, he couldn't pay for, he couldn't pay for another tire. It's like, how many times do I have to do this with this woman?

Wow. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. crime stories with nancy grace now we have jody arius's cellmate describe me arius as a quote flirt is that a surprise according to travis alexander her murder victims friends family, she often used sex to get what she wanted. Now, according to the roommate, Baring, Arias used her sexuality to get things from other inmates, flirting with guards. No problem with talking to male guards. They became, her words words good friends these two became very closely bonded baron claiming that she and another woman allowed arias to tattoo them behind bars six tattoos using a rubber band a staple and a pencil with a drop of shampoo and baby powder both excel maids now have permanent

reminders of their time in jail with Jodi Arias. Tattoos personally inked and signed by the notorious killer who made the tattoos using mascara and lead from a pencil which she sharpened into a needle. Arias also tattooed this delicate crystal on Tracy's chest.

But Tracy has since tattooed a butterfly over the original artwork. Why did you cover it up? I didn't want that constant reminder. You are hearing our friend at Inside Edition, Alexis Tereschuk, investigative reporter. Alexis, you and I covered the Arias murder trial together, as well as the death penalty phase. For those who don't know about Jodi Arias and her murder conviction please explain what happened

to Travis Alexander when he tried to break up with her she plotted his murder lured him in you know went down to his house in Arizona but but it took her four days to get there she stopped along the way to buy a bunch of things that she was going to use where she ended up slaughtering him. She attacked him while he was in the shower. Wait a minute, though. Alexis, hold on. Hold on. You're skipping some good stuff.

Because when she travels, you know, I don't know how many hundreds of miles to go murder him. She did not want to leave a trail. Describe it, Alexis. So she rented a car in Northern California, about 60 miles away from her house, so nobody would recognize her. First, they gave her a red car. She said, I don't want a red car. That's too noticeable. I want something different because she didn't want the cops to see her. She then hid out with a boyfriend in another town. She dyed her hair back to its natural brunette from the bleach blonde she'd been sporting.

She then bought a gas can, had multiple gas cans in her car, filled them up with gas, not using a credit card so that she couldn't be traced, and then trekked across the desert hiding so she couldn't be stopped anywhere and had no record of her being near Travis. Now, I don't recall that he knew she was coming. They'd had a couple of phone calls. She had called him repeatedly, but once she entered the area near his house, she turned off her phone and did not turn it back on until hours after she murdered him to hide the fact that she was even at his house. She was very devious. She knew exactly what to do to try to cover her tracks. What do you think was the motive,

Alexis, and why? Joe Darius was jealous that Travis Alexander had moved on. He didn't want to date her anymore. He did not want to be her boyfriend. And he was actually even going on a trip down to Cancun with another girl. And it was a company trip. And she had worked for this company. So she was humiliated. But she was filled with rage because he wouldn't be her boyfriend. And he didn't love her. And he treated her like she felt like trash. They had sex.

He didn't care. He lied about it because he was a Mormon. But he moved on. And she could never move on. And she thought, if I can't have him, no one else will. Chris Hughes, you're hearing Alexis Tereschuk. You really made no bones about it. He said, we're broken up.

I'm dating somebody else. I'm taking her to Cancun. Not you. He was very clear. He was not misleading her, Chris. Yeah, and so why she showed up that night, I mean, it's just, I wish I even knew the truth. But really, Chris, was it out of the ordinary? Didn't she always show up when she wasn't supposed to?

Yeah, she did, but they had a terrible fight where, I mean, it looked like the end. You know, they were fighting on Google Chats and going back and forth. Fighting about what? They broke up. What's there to fight about? It's over. Well, that's a really good question,'s it's another one of those mysteries but it was the last it was the last interaction that i know about that went back and forth between them and he

was saying things to her like you hurt me worse than the passing of my own father you know you're a terrible person you're despicable you're the devil's daughter. I mean, he was so angry about something and we don't know exactly what that was. And she never defended herself. It was so weird. She just sat there and took it. And then the conversation ended and later she comes back online and says,

two things that you're wrong about. And she said, I didn't steal your journals and I didn't flash your tires. She didn't defend herself against all the other things that he said about her. And when I saw that, I just said to myself, you know what, that's her trying to cover up for what she's about to do.

She picked the two violent things that he said and she disputed them. She said, you're wrong about those things but she never defended herself against all the other attacks and then she shows up in the middle of the night and does what she does chris hughes where were you when the guilty verdict was announced i was in the courtroom can you describe that moment uh yeah i mean it felt like it would never come. And every second felt like an eternity. And I remember my heart felt like it was, you know, going to beat out of my chest. And I remember feeling short of breath and always having to remind myself to breathe and taking deep breaths. And, um, you know, it feels it, it almost, as I look back now, I mean, it feels like a dream state, but when we got the guilt, the guilty verdict, um, you know, it doesn't make any of this go away. Right. It was a weird thing. You'd think that there would be

some sort of relief. And I guess there was some relief to a degree, but it just wasn't what I had hoped, you know, because I realized in that moment that though she was guilty, Travis wasn't coming back. This, while Travis Alexander's family still grapples with his murder. Nancy Grace, Crown Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.