Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Karlie Guse stepmom admits: I gave the wrong description of my daughter's clothes

Episode Date: October 26, 2018

Karlie Guse disappeared from her home in a small California town nearly two weeks ago. Nancy Grace talks in this episode with the last person known to have seen the 16-year-old -- stepmother Melissa Guse -- and the teen's father, Zachery Guse. Nancy's expert panel includes Dr. Brian Russell, lawyer and psychologist and host of Investigation Discovery’s “Fatal Vows” series, forensics expert Joseph Scott Morgan, and reporter Robyn Walensky. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. something that matters. And what matters the most? Protecting your child. What do you love the most in the world? Your children. I do. And I will do anything to protect my twins. Go to crimestopshere.com. It is a five-part series with action information that you can use to change your life and protect your child's life. Payment starting at $6.99. Give that as a gift, not another onesie or a plastic toy. Give them something that matters. Find out how to protect your child out and about at the mall, at the store, at the grocery store, in the parking lot, at home. Find out about protection regarding babysitters and daycare, even online cyber security. Oh yes, my children are online and you better bet I'm doing everything within my power to protect them. Payment starting $6.99.

I would much rather have that than yet another plastic baby doll or, God forbid, a toy gun. Just what I don't want. Join the Justice Nation. Crimestopshere.com Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. crime stories with nancy grace they're searching for a 16 year old girl missing in mono county east of yosemite national park carly goosey was last seen early saturday morning in chalfont about 14 miles north of bishop authorities say she doesn't have her cell phone or any personal belongings with her and may be disoriented.

Police dogs and helicopters have been assisting in the search, but as of last night, they've not been able to locate her. Carly described to be 5'7", 110 pounds, with dark blonde hair and blue eyes. Where is Carly Guse? Tipline 760-932-7549. This is Crime Stories. I'm Nancy Grace. We are trying to find answers in the disappearance of a gorgeous young girl, Carly Guse. We know that investigators have searched nearby neighborhoods and the desert terrain using helicopters and scent dogs. They have not found any clue. Listen.

She's 5'7", about 115 pounds. She has blue eyes and the cutest little nose and a great smile. And her hair goes all the way down past her, like to her belly, let's say mid waist. And she left in her jeans and a T-shirt. So I'm putting it out there, and just go for it. Everybody help me out here. I love you all. Everybody please watch. Share your friend's share, my friend's share. Everybody just share the shit out of it.

All right? Thank you. You are hearing the stepmother of missing Carly Gusset. That is Melissa Gusset begging for help. Carly is missing and joining me right now is that stepmom, Melissa Gusset and the bio dad of Carly Gusset, Zachary Gusset. Zachary and Melissa, thank you so much for being with us. Thank you for having us. Thank you.

Melissa, my first question is this. I understand that you last saw Carly in bed with you at around 5.30 a.m. Is that right? Around 5.45, yes. Okay. I've gotten 5.30 and I've gotten 6.30, but now you're clarifying it's 5.45. Now, in your Facebook Live, you said that she was wearing jeans, I think. Yeah.

I only said that because she always wears her skinny jeans, so I just assumed that she had her skinny jeans on. Would she have worn blue jeans to bed? I had picked her up and she had her skinny jeans on. I know, but I mean, when you were in bed with her at 545 a.m., did she still have on her jeans? No. Okay. So yeah, a t-shirt and just her underwear. Okay. Let me understand because in the Facebook live, I'm trying to get the description of what she had on the last time you saw her out there. So in the Facebook last time I saw her in our home, she only had a t-shirt and her undergarment. Okay. Then that Facebook Live that she blasted out saying, look for her in the skinny jeans, what are we supposed to do with that?

Yeah. That's not right. Well, yeah, I was in a panic. And she's not one to go out of the house in sweatpants or even butter skinny jeans. Okay. All right. So the last time you saw her, she was not wearing what was on the Facebook Live. She was wearing a T-shirt and undies.

All right. Question. Were her PJs, the T-shirt, was the T-shirt found in the home after she disappeared? No. Okay. What was on the t-shirt? What was it? From what I can remember, it was like a Vans t-shirt or some kind of t-shirt that had a logo on the back and then the small one over like where your heart is.

Got you. Was it white, blue? What was it? It was like a white, creamish color. Okay. Do you know what the T-shirt said? No. Okay.

Do you know the colors of the T-shirt? It was like a white, creamish, and then the logo was also very light okay got it and that t-shirt that she was in bed with wearing at 5 45 is not in the home that tells me she's still in the t-shirt yeah she i could not find that in her laundry or anywhere. Okay, got it. Now, what about her skinny jeans? Are they missing? You know, I wouldn't even be able to say yes or no because she has so many clothes. She has like 20 pairs of skinny jeans and 50 different shirts.

She has a lot of clothes. Okay. Regarding the skinny jeans, were they black or blue? The ones that she had worn the night before were light blue. Light blue. Are those missing, the ones she wore the night before, are they in the dirty clothes? Where are they? I'm trying to figure out what was she wearing when she disappeared i don't know

because the two confirmed neighbors said that she had the white shirt and gray sweatpants okay are the gray sweatpants missing? I don't know. Okay. She has so many clothes, I can't even. Let me ask you this. Her cell phone. The boyfriend that came over said the cell phone, her cell phone, which I'm surprised she left it behind, but

that the cell phone was by the bed. When the cops got there, the cell phone was on the island or in the kitchen. Is that part right? No. The cell phone was in the kitchen the whole time. Okay. Got it. Let me think.

Do you know the code to get into her cell phone yes okay did you go into it to find out who she last texted yes okay who was she last speaking to in what time i don't remember the time but um I was the last person that had called her. Yeah, it was 8.30 the night before because we got home at 9. So she was in the home at 9 p.m. Friday night. Correct. Okay. Friday night. Correct. Okay, got it.

Joining me also, in addition to Carly Gousset's stepmother, Melissa, is her biological dad, Zachary. Zachary, thank you for being with us. We have got callers, callers, callers trying to nail down what happened and what the timeline is. Tell me what your recollection is, Zachary, of the night Carly, your little girl, goes missing. The night or the morning of? Well, what you recall. I assume you went to bed.

Right, right. Well, I got home just after work. I had a drink, drink a couple beers Melissa and Carly showed up Carly was acting whoa. What do you mean by that? Why was she acting paranoid? She had admitted to smoking marijuana. Yeah, she had added to it. Whoa, whoa, whoa. I want to go to Zachary.

What was she doing to seem paranoid to you? She had admitted to smoking marijuana. And that's the reason why Melissa went to go pick her up early. What was she doing that was acting paranoid to you? Scared. I know, but what did you observe

about her that seemed she was paranoid? She had just about her that seemed she was paranoid. She just was acting very nervous and scared about, you know, her phone, about us being around her at moments. And then at other moments, she'd change and just, you know, say she loves us and ask us if she was okay. And of course, we said, yeah, you're the best.

When you said she was acting nervous and afraid to be around you, what was she doing to make you think that? I don't know. She smoked pot. I don't know what was wrong with her. I know, but you're telling me that she told you or told your wife she had had marijuana. All right. You're saying she's acting paranoid.

What was she doing? Was she pacing the floor? Was she biting her fingernails? Was she twitching? Was she crying? Was she anxious? Was she on her phone? Did she call 911?

What was she doing to make you tell me that she was acting paranoid? Because I've never seen my children act paranoid. I don't know what that even looks like for a child. What was she doing? She was just standing in the corner, afraid, afraid of not being safe. Did she say that? Yeah, she felt like she not being safe. Did she say that? Yeah, she felt like she wasn't safe. Okay, well, now I'm hearing something after many questions.

She said she was afraid. What was she afraid of? I really wish I knew. So when she said, Dad, I'm afraid, you didn't say, well, why are you afraid? What are you afraid of? Yeah, I knew. So when she said, Dad, I'm afraid, you didn't say, why are you afraid? What are you afraid of? Yeah, I did. I asked her several times, and she said, I don't know. Melissa, what do you recall?

What was she saying? I'm trying to figure this out so I can figure out what may have happened to her. What was she afraid of? Because to me, the fact that she's telling you guys she's afraid and then she goes missing can't be separated. That's important, Melissa. What was she saying she was afraid of? She kept saying, I don't know. I said, what are you afraid of?

You're home. We're safe. And she said, I don't know. And I was like, well, we're here. You're home. You're safe. It's okay. And then she's just very up and down with being paranoid.

And then the next minute she was like, fine. It was like a roller coaster with her. And then that's when we said well maybe it was laced with something but we don't know because nobody's saying anything and everybody says it was just marijuana. Melissa did you video Carly that evening? Yeah. Why? Because I wanted to show her the next morning how she was acting. And what does the video show? It's just a voice clip. It wasn't like a video of anything.

Okay. What was she saying? She was saying all sorts of things. She wanted me to spend the night with her. She wanted me to paint her toenails. She wanted to paint my toenails. She wanted to color. She wanted to read the Bible. She wanted to write. There's just so many things.

Okay, that sounds crazy right there. Let me think this through. So where is the video now? Have police seen the video? No. Why? Did they not want to see it? Did you say boys? Police. Police.

Oh, police. Yeah, I believe they have it because our phones have all been flashed. I mean, did you show it to them? Yes. Yes. Good, good, good. Let me ask you this. Was the door locked when you guys went to sleep that night? No.

We don't lock our house. Was there any... I spent the whole night with Carly in her bed. Yeah. Did you guys have a dog? Is there any way you would be alerted if there was an intruder? Yeah, we have a dog. She would have started barking.

And nothing like that happened? No. Okay. I was in her bed laying with her. Okay. The whole night. Then at 5.45, what happened? You say you saw her the last time at 5.45 in the morning in bed with her.

What happened at 5.45? Yes. And then I fell back to sleep. Okay. And then when I woke back up, it was like 7.15, 7.30, and she was gone. So the working theory is between 5.45 and 7.30, she disappears. Are any of her shoes missing? Yeah.

Okay, let me ask the obvious next question. What shoes? No. What? There's several pairs of her shoes missing now. Investigators and everything. But she always wears bands, and her one pair of bands was missing when they went into her closet.

So that's why I believe that she was in her band. Were those missing that morning? Yeah. Okay. To Robin Walensky, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, what do you make of it? Well, I think that the clothing and the shoes is critical because the weather in that area of the country at night is going to be very cold. So did she leave on foot? Did she indeed have those sneakers on? Was she barefoot? Did she wander off? Did someone else come into the house and say, hey, come with me? I think the clothing is absolutely critical.

I think that any video from any other homes in the area, any, you know, the local stores, you know, a 7-Eleven, a gas station, has she been seen? I think security tapes really need to be reviewed. But I think it's critical if someone had on sneakers or they're leaving barefoot or they're in socks. I think that the, what she was wearing, there needs to be an inventory done of her clothing as to really what she was wearing at the time. Just got Morgan joining. Oh, go ahead, Zachary. I was going to ask how many people in the world know the exact amount and what clothes their kids have. Because I have three. Trust me, I just don't know.

I wish I did. Zachary, I can tell you right now that my son is wearing a pair of black, laceless tennis shoes. And my daughter is wearing a pair of tan, low-cut Converses. I know exactly what shoes and my daughter was wearing a pair of tan low-cut converses I know exactly what shoes and what socks they're wearing but on the other hand they're younger and I laid those clothes out for them so I know what they have on right now I'm just wondering you know if she as you were saying was disoriented the night before did she take off her clothes and leave them in the floor? Did she wake up and put those back on? Because right now, we can't even tell people what to look for if she's wandering around because we don't know.

Well, as far as we know, it's tennis shoes, vans, a dark pair of sweatpants, and a white T-shirt. That's what we know. And that was confirmed by three different people. Two neighbors and then one... Okay, now I'm just hearing that for the first time. Tell me about that. What did the three neighbors say?

Okay, so when we first went out searching in the morning, we searched for two hours. And one neighbor that lives on our street, he's older. And I asked him, I said, did you see my daughter walking down the street, you know, young girl? And he said, yeah, actually I did. And I said, do you know what time? And he says, it was about 630. And I was like, okay. And then as this searching and everything keeps going on, we have had three more people to our neighbors who live right in this community that saw her wearing a white t-shirt, gray sweatpants, and tennis shoes, walking west on our road. And then the other one confirmed person was a wooder, which is like somebody who goes out to chop wood. He saw her at 7.30 down by Highway 6. Where in the world do you think she was headed?

I have no idea. Not a clue. I wish I knew. Do you know another parent or a soon-to-be parent and expecting mom or dad? Please don't give them another onesie or another toy that you know is going to end up in the garage or at the Goodwill. Give them something that matters. And what matters the most? Protecting your child.

What do you love the most in the world? Your children. I do. And I will do anything to protect my twins. Go to crimestopshere.com. It is a five-part series with action information that you can use to change your life and protect your child's life. Payment starting at $6.99. Give that as a gift, not another onesie or a plastic toy. Give them something that matters. Find out how to protect your child

out and about at the mall, at the store, at the grocery store, in the parking lot, at home. Find out about protection regarding babysitters and daycare, even online cyber security. Oh yes, my children are online and you better bet I'm doing everything within my power to protect them. Payment starting $699. I would much rather have that than yet another plastic baby doll or, God forbid, a toy gun. Just what I don't want. Join the Justice Nation. Crimestopshere.com. dot com.

My name is Melissa Gousset. If you're going to watch this video, please do not have the kids around. Carly Lane Goususe is missing still. She's been missing since, breathe. She's been missing since 6.30 a.m. The last time that I spoke to her was 5.30. She didn't take her cell phone.

We're coming up on 10 hours that she's been missing. And I want to put this on blast because I don't think she's out in the desert. I think that she could have been abducted or taken because we do live by a highway, and it happens. And I'm being real. Where is Carly?

Help us bring her home. Tip line 760-932-7549. Let me ask to Robin Walensky. I'm hearing that police have not been able to confirm those neighbors saw Carly. What do you know about that, Robin? Yeah, I think it's still being looked into. I think that everyone on the block is going to be interviewed in depth. And they're going to, you know. Well, when?

When are they going to confirm it? I mean, that's a great question. I will tell you this, though, that you know this, Nancy, that people have very selective memories. They've done studies. You know, you put somebody in a room and someone's wearing a black shirt, you know, and red pants or white sneakers So they're going to have to take those neighbors and interview them separately and find out, you know, what's up and what's down. Did they really see her or not? At 6.30 in the morning, 7.30 in the morning on a Saturday, why are these people outside? How did they see her? I have a lot of questions, a lot of questions. Zach and Melissa are telling us three neighbors saw it. If even one of them are correct, then that was her. Also, the fact that three of them separated in time and space have all three stated,

at least to Melissa and Zachary, if not police, that they saw her. One corroborates the other. You see what I mean? What was her demeanor? The key thing is her demeanor. Was she running around in circles alone, acting crazy? Was she having some sort of breakdown? Was she with the boyfriend? Was she with some stranger? There's a lot of questions here. She was by herself. She was by herself. And all witnesses have already been questioned and confirmed that, yes, it was her. Oh, so police have confirmed the sightings, Melissa?

Yes. Yes. Okay, so let me go out to Joseph Scott Morgan, a forensics expert. Joe Scott, this investigation is going in so many directions, but if these three witnesses are real, okay, then that is, that's a serious, serious lead. if those three are real and I know what Robin Walensky is saying I've had defense attorneys say that in court a million times and there is a grain of truth to it there is that eyewitnesses can be wrong but when you've got three different witnesses out of the neighborhood in three different locations that have not gotten together and cooked up a story, I can't imagine why they would,

then that is a credible lead. Yeah, yeah, it is. And plus, if they're marking time along this way, where you have these benchmarks, where they're seeing this young girl at various locations that that kind of match up. I think my question to the dad is this. You guys live in this very isolated area that's just adjacent to a lot of wilderness. And I'm just curious, do you guys actually live north of the community of Bishop? Yes, about 10-12 miles north of the community of Bishop Hills. Okay, and then northbound of y'all is just kind of vacant.

I mean, there's not a lot around that area. Was she seen headed toward Bishop or away from Bishop with all of these neighbors on this timeline? There's no clue to that. The clue of her heading down towards Highway 6 was good because then it corroborated with the man who was going and waiting in the morning that she was just standing on the side of highway six. No idea in which direction she had gone on highway six. If I had to guess, I would say south back to Bishop because of friends,

boyfriend, whatever. Is that where, yeah. Is that where you said her friends and whatnot, the boyfriend, is that where the school was located that she, or where the school is located that she currently attends? Is it in that area there, or is it some, okay. Alrighty, well, I was just curious, because it's so desolate out in that area, and am I correct in stating that you guys live

adjacent to a national forest, or is that an Indian reservation? Yeah, we, to a national forest or is that an Indian reservation yeah we well or in the we do not live on an Indian reservation there are Indian reservations in the town of Bishop that is south of us there's an Indian reservation in the town of Benton which is north of us okay um i don't specifically live on an indian resident i guess what he's trying to ask is the terrain around where she was headed is it desert is it mountainous is it populated what is it well it's high desert and it's high desert and when and in that you're i mean we live not far from the sierra mountains i live my house backs up to the white mountains um yeah it's desert the mountains here it's not what can you tell me okay i've we've established the terrain, Joe Scott. So percolate on that for a moment. I want to ask about a call-in of a possible sighting of Carly in LaBette, California, at a gas station.

What, if anything, do we know about that, Robin Walensky? Yeah, I am not 100% sure on that. I will tell you, Nancy, that the question that I have to the biological dad and stepmom is really what the state of mind was. And when she was being recorded by her stepmom, what were the exact statements? Was she suicidal? Was she upset with the boyfriend? Was there some other kind of spat going on with another girlfriend? 16-year-old girls fight all the time.

Was she suicidal? What was her state of mind? She wasn't suicidal. She was just very paranoid. She was scared. And then when she wanted to go to Beth, she didn't want to leave my side. So I spent the whole night with her. Guys, we are trying to find Carly Gousset. She's a gorgeous young girl missing. Tip line 760-932-7549. You were just hearing from the biological father of Carly Gousset. That would be Zachary and the stepmother, Melissa Gousset. Remember, all three of these parents have been working with police, and they all three say that foul play is involved.

What do we really know? Joseph Scott Morgan, author of Blood Beneath My Feet, professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University. Joe Scott, what's your take on the evidence? One of the problems, Nancy, is that the waters are so muddied that you can't accomplish the task that's at hand, and that is finding this girl. That's the most critical thing here, because nobody can get on the same sheet of music. I'm hoping that the trail has not gone cold as

far as physical evidence goes, that it hasn't been destroyed, that hopefully we can peg down some answers to try to get her found. Joining me right now, Robin Walensky, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, where we are on this, bringing you the very latest updates by the hour on CrimeOnline.com. She's also an author of The Beautiful Life, the CSI behind the Casey Anthony trial. Robin Walensky, you and I have seen a lot of investigations. And let me just tell you something, Robin. I can tell you right now what John David and Lucy even had in their snack and what was in their backpack. The whole shebang right down to their socks. Okay. Maybe I'm crazy and I own it. I own that. But they're all I've got. And I'm going to know everything I can about them, protect them, watch them.

The works. I'm not taken away from these parents. Maybe they're doing that in their own way. Plus, their kid is a teen. All right. I imagine it's going to get harder as the years go by. But I want to know, Robin, what you believe the facts really are. What is going on? Because none of this is making sense to me. Yeah, I'm with you. I have a little bit of a different take on it than your other guests. I think that the biological mother, it sounds to me that she was not there. Clearly, she may have known of dysfunction in the home if her daughter was unhappy with

the stepmother. There's no consistency to anything. And here's another thing. And I'm going to have to go to Dr. Bryan on this. When I was talking to Melissa and Zachary, and I don't know if I could detect that or not with the mother, the bio mom, usually parents are like falling over trying to give you all the facts that they possibly can. Okay. I felt like I was pulling teeth.

I felt like it was a kind of a little bit of a confrontation trying to get facts out of the stepmother and the dad. On the other hand, Brian, they may have felt like they've been under attack. All right. So, and they're responding in that way.

When anybody's in a corner and they're under attack, they come out in that way. When anybody's in a corner and they're under attack, they come out defensive, right? So I don't know what the truth of that is, but I, look, I'm a JD. I'm not a DDS have talked to a lot of parents, sadly, unfortunately, whose kids have actually gone missing due to actual abduction and foul play. They sound desperate to give us every piece of information that could possibly help find their child. They want to take a lie detector to rule themselves out. They want to give an inventory of the clothes. They want to get an accurate timeline. But if we really have witnesses saying they saw the girl outside the house, then it really doesn't matter if she had underwear or jeans or whatever on in the house. She left the house of her own under her own power, it sounds like to me. That's a runaway. Yeah, I'm with you on that. And it's again, whenever I have family

members or somebody missing, they are beside themselves trying to give you facts. And also, I mean, you know, my model is always Mark Klass. I mean, that guy practically laid on the courthouse steps begging for people to take his polygraph, take his DNA, take his fingerprints, whatever to help. OK, in this case, maybe they all feel guilty or maybe they all feel attacked in some way by, you know, media, by everybody. So maybe that explains it all. But I would be in there going through her clothes, trying to find out what's missing, trying to find out where if the shoes are there so I could get an accurate description of what she's wearing. Also, the cell phone.

Joining me right now, in addition to Robin Walensky, Joseph Scott Morgan, and Dr. Brian Russell, is our crime online investigative reporter and journalist, Lee Egan. Lee, tell me one thing off the bat is have those three witness IDs in the neighborhood been confirmed by police? We did confirm with Sheriff Ingrid Braun with the Mono County Sheriff's Department in California that three different people did indeed say that they saw someone who looked like Carly walking through her neighborhood early morning, October 13th. Now, two of those people live inside the neighborhood, and then the other person lives outside of the neighborhood

and said he saw her around a mile away from her neighborhood by a barbed wire fence. Two of the people have never met Carly before so they wouldn't know who she was if they saw her but they did give a description of the person that they saw which matched Carly's description. The other person that has met Carly before said that they could not be 100% sure it was her, but it was somebody that looked like her. Tip line, 760-932-7549. Hold on, stop everything.

We have got breaking news out of a D.C. jury trial. The so-called mansion murderer who allegedly breaks into a home, many people believe under the disguise of delivering a pizza, and wipes out almost the entire Savopolis family, the mom, the dad, the 10-year-old little boy, and the housekeeper. For what? We now are learning the jury returned a verdict. First, take a listen to this. The trial went on for about six weeks and took the jury about a day and a half to go through all the evidence and they returned with their verdict. The judge brought the jury in, they had the foreman stand and then had the foreman go through the 20 counts in the indictment, and it was guilty on every single count.

Darren Wint stood next to his defense attorneys. He was dressed in a dress shirt and a tie. He bowed his head as he was listening to the guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty, one after another after another. Straight out now to Alan Duke joining me. Alan, what happened in that courtroom? Well, there was some blockbuster testimony. First, a little background. Savas Savopoulos, his wife Amy, their 10-year-old son Philip,

their housekeeper, found beaten, strangled, stabbed to death inside this mansion in northwest Washington, D.C. back in May of 2015. First, investigators thought several people were involved, but then finally they arrested Darren Wendt, the only person arrested and charged. It took him three years to build their case against Wendt. The case relied heavily on DNA evidence, including some DNA taken from pizza crust that was ordered apparently during the incident. Some eyewitness testimony at the

trial was far from definitive, but it was forensic scientists testifying that Wendt's DNA was found on the pizza crust and also in a vest, a green vest that was found inside the family's Porsche that he stole from the house and set fire in Prince George's County in Maryland. A lot of bombshell testimony. In fact, Wendt took the stand in his own defense. His brothers, Stefan Wendt and his half-brother, Daryl, who helped investigators, testified against him. His former fiancée, his brother-in-law, also testified against him.

Jordan Wallace, who worked as an assistant for the family, took the stand and spoke publicly for the first time since he was asked to hand-deliver $40,000 in ransom to the home. You know, one family member was not at home. The other child, her life has been totally devastated. I don't think there's any such thing as closure in a case like this, but I pray to God at least she feels some sense of justice. All we can do now is pray for remaining family and to the so-called mansion murderer rot in hell. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.