Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Lori Vallow’s New Hubby Clairvoyant? PREDICTS WIFE TAMMY’S DEATH...then she dies

Episode Date: July 7, 2020

Two of the felony charges against "cult mom" Lori Vallow have been dismissed. They are the felony counts of desertion and nonsupport of children. This comes three weeks after investigators found the remains of Lori Vallow's children on property owned by her new husband Chad Daybell. Today Nancy Graces talks with Julie Rowe, a former friend of Daybell, who says he predicted his wife Tammy's death. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. J.J. Vallow and Tylee Ryan are dead. We may have thought so all along, but now we know. We know that their remains were destroyed and buried in the backyard of cult mom Lori Vallow's new husband's home. What now? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Joining us right now is a very special guest. It is Julie Rowe. Julie is a former friend of cult leader Chad Daybell. She is a current friend of his deceased wife Tammy Daybell, the author and founder of the Greater Tomorrow Relief Fund and that relief

fund helps create safe houses for human trafficking victims. To be applauded, I may add. Julie Rowe, I'm so happy to talk to you because you are such a dear friend of Tammy Daybell, now dead to this world anyway. Yes. And a former friend of Chad Daybell. Let's just start at the beginning. Julie Rowe, in the process of Chad Daybell publishing many of your books, you become friends with Tammy Daybell and Chad Daybell. Is it true that Chad Daybell predicted Tammy's death? Yes. About three years before she died, he came to me. said he'd had a vision that she had passed away and and he thought she was gonna die in a car accident he described a scene wait a minute when was that that was in 2017 did Chad Daybell at that time have a life insurance policy on Tammy Daybell?

He told me at that time he had about $300,000. He didn't tell me that right away. He told me that probably three months later in the summer of 2017. And then he told me that again in the summer of 2018. In 2017, when Chad Daybell tells you he thinks Tammy Daybell, his wife, is going to die in a car crash, he already had about $300,000 life insurance policy on her. Did he, at that time, time in 2017 know Lori Vallow? Not to my knowledge. I never heard of him knowing Lori until October of 2018. In fact, I warned Chad about Lori. I

warned him about all of the whole situation because of what I saw coming. What did you tell him? I talked to him in October and December and in January and February because I'm visionary. I can sometimes see when people are texting or emailing or having phone conversations. And I basically told him I could see what he was doing and I wasn't okay with him having conversations with different women. So the last time I saw Tammy was the summer of 2018. I used to go to their house in Rexburg every month or two and stop in and see Chad and Tammy and the kids, or sometimes just Chad and Tammy. Um, and I saw her that summer and then I came back to Rexburg to do some work and wanted to stop by. I think it was September of 2018. And Chad told me not to, that Tammy had been off of her antidepressant medications.

She was irritable. And his words were that she was struggling with jealousy and it would be best if I didn't come over. Tammy Daybell was struggling with jealousy and it would be best if I didn't come over. Tammy Daybell was struggling with jealousy when? As early as September of 18 is the first time I remember him telling me that. He told me not to come over. And I honored that. I never talked to Tammy about it because I didn't want to get involved in their marriage issues when was the last time you spoke to Tammy daybell the summer of 2018 we just talked about like you know what was going on with their kids and their family they we went out and looked at their ducks and their family. They, we went out and looked at their ducks and their, you know, the improvements

they'd made on their property. Um, actually the last time I saw her, she was sitting on a love seat with Chad and they, you know, he had his heart, his hand on her leg and his arm around her, um, or they were holding hands the whole time. And I was sitting opposite them on another couch. We talked for about an hour. And then they asked me if I wanted to go to Dairy Queen and they treated me to Dairy Queen. And we went all three of us, which we had never done just the three of us before. Usually we got to dinner and get pizza with the kids or something, which we didn't do a lot. We probably did that four times. One time me and my husband and my kids, when we went to Utah, um, and they were still living in Utah, we went out to dinner and, you know, things like that. What was her demeanor the last time you

saw her? They were affectionate with each other. She, she actually looked really, really good. This might kind of sound weird, but she looked better than I'd ever seen her in the time that I knew her. She seemed really happy as far as what was going on in other areas of her life with work and things. What was her work? What was her job? She's working as a local school librarian at the Sugar City Library School, elementary school. She designed all the covers to my books. Let me ask you this. So Chad Daybell predicted his wife's death many, many times.

Did she, Tammy Daybell, know chad daybell predicted she would die as of 2018 he when i asked him that he told me he had not told his kids or tammy in fact to my knowledge as of the summer of 18 i was the only person that knew other than another woman in Arizona that Chad had been texting before he met Lori. I believe he was having an emotional affair with her. Why do you say that? Why did you disapprove of his text to the other woman? What were the nature of the text? He believed he had been married to her before. So did she. I heard from Chad's own mouth that her husband had intercepted their text messages and had threatened Chad to go public if he didn't leave his wife alone.

Chad never told me what he was texting, but that was enough for me to know that obviously they had some kind of emotional affair going on if the husband wasn't okay with it. Chad's take on it was the guy was just controlling. And I would learn these in sessions. Cause I, I do energy work with clients and, um, I don't disclose what my clients say, but Chad was not a client. But the reason he would tell me these things is because we'd have phone conversations about book stuff. And then he would need to quote unquote clear energy. And he, I don't know why he would tell me this stuff.

You know, you learned from Chad Daybell that he had been texting another woman before he started with Lori and that the other woman husband told him to leave his wife alone or he would go public with the text. Right. And I attributed Tammy's jealousy that Chad told me about to whatever was going on with that woman. I didn't know that. Yeah. I didn't know that Chad had met Lori yet. What do you know about the nature of the text between Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow? What were those texts about? I learned that they had corresponded at least as early as October of 2018

and that he had written a list of her family members that she had requested and rated them on a scale with labeling light to dark. There's a scale that he used. He showed me his laptop with several times with lists of people that he had gathered. So I saw those with my own eyes. That was another point of doctrine that we disagreed on. He sent me a list of what he thought were my probations and he labeled my family members. What's a probation? It's basically a life, a life on earth. You can have a premortal probation to a spirit life, but

it's basically a life on earth. I never heard of Christ mentioning any of that. Well, there's some lost records there. Christ actually did teach it. It's a true gospel doctrine, but Chad's viewpoint is distorted. I knew for at least a year and a half to two years before I had a falling out with him

that he was being talked to by deceiving spirits, that he wasn't correct on some of it. And quite honestly, what I saw was some spiritual ego and pride and some lust energy that bothered me. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. When Chad Daybell dying. What was his demeanor? Initially, he actually was very upset. He was very distraught. He, he cried to me a couple of different times, at least. The reason I think he told me is because I am visionary and I had never said anything to him at all. I usually keep stuff like that to myself because of agency and respect for people and boundaries. I don't if I see things like that, I don't tell people. But he did come to me and asked me if I'd seen anything. And then he described what he'd been shown and told.

And I basically said, I don't know, like I haven't seen that, but I. I was told that Tammy will pass away at some point. Other than her dying in a car crash, did he have any other visions about how his wife was going to die? Three weeks before, that's the last he told me, was in December of 2018. And one of the other reasons we had a falling out is I was very disturbed at something he said to me in 2018. He was frustrated, and he said, I feel like the plans can't move on until the spouses are gone. Julie, could you repeat that very slowly, please? I feel like my plan can't move

on until the spouses are gone. My what cannot move on? My plan. Like, his life plan. My plan. Uh-huh. My plan cannot move on. That was... Spouses. Two spouses.

He said spouses. And when did he say that? December of 2018. And then three weeks before Tammy died, I had a conversation with him, which was the first time since March of 2019, when we agreed to just continue publishing my books. And I was prompted by my angels to ask him, do you still see Tammy dying? And he said, yes, but I didn't ask how I remained silent. And then he said in a frustrated, almost angry voice, very frustrated. I feel like my plan can't move on until, until Tammy has died. I'm very curious about his visions about how she was going to die.

I'm also very curious about him crying at one point when he described Tammy Daybell, his wife, dying, because he sure wasn't crying in that photo of him and Lori Vallow on the beach in Hawaii so he got through that grief pretty quickly have you spoken to Tammy Daybell's children the only one I've talked to is Emma Daybell I was teaching a group energy class in San Diego, California, on the morning that Tammy had passed away. And I received a phone call, a text message to one of my security team members who is friends with the family as well. And I was notified that Tammy had passed away in the middle of the night and that Chad supposedly found her body at about 6 a.m. on October 19th.

I got in my car during my lunch break, as soon as I could break for lunch, and I called Emma. I was told not to call Chad, but to call Emma. She answered her phone and I talked to her for 40 minutes. I basically gave her a 40-minute energy session. She was crying. She was in shock. She was upset.

And she said that she and her siblings had no idea that their mom was going to die. And she asked me point blank if her dad knew and if I knew. And I am an honest person, so told her yes he did. What was her response when you told her her dad knew? Her response was she was sobbing she was she was absolutely like anybody would be if they just found out their mom died especially suddenly. She said my dad thinks her veil was thinning and And I said, why? And she said, because about a week ago, my mom was at home in the driveway and a man dressed in black with a black ski mask came in and he had a gun. And she said, it looked like a paintball gun,

but he tried to shoot at her a couple of times and missed, and then he ran away. And she said her dad tried to tell the kids that he thought she had a fin veil and that she was seeing with her spirit eyes and that it was not a paintball gun, but some kind of space gun. What did Emma or any of other Tammy's children make of the fact a guy shoots at their mom and then shortly after that she dies in her sleep well I never got to talk to Emma again because she wouldn't answer my calls Chad had told all of his kids especially Emma not to talk to me or respond to me at all. And so I've not been able to talk to Emma. And then I received a text message through a friend from Emma saying,

Emma texted a friend and said, please tell Julie to quit talking about my family as if my life isn't bad enough. Did you go to the funeral? I was told by my angels to stay completely away for my protection. I didn't know what that meant entirely. Although I listened the best I can to my angels, so I stayed away. And also because I had had a falling out with Chad, and I knew that some of his extended family did not care for me and my story I just thought that was what it was about so I respected them so they could you know grieve is it true that you believe you have spoken to Tammy Daybell since her

death I talked to Tammy often at least twice a week Tammy came to visit me at my class in San Diego the afternoon that she died. And she was in good spirits. They had a big, huge family reunion for her in spirit realm, basically like a big party. They'd been preparing for her to come. She had a great time. And I saw that for about three weeks. And then I was on another trip, um, three weeks later and she came to my hotel room and told me that she was very distraught at what she had learned, that she was very upset with Chad and very concerned about her children. Her heart was heavy. And she told me to tell the truth at all costs that I needed to do this, that it was important that I spoke my truth

no matter what people think. And that is the main reason that I went public and changed my viewpoint. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. crime stories with nancy grace joining us right now is a very special guest it is julie row julie you believe you have been contacted by tammy daybell did she have any thoughts on this? I know that I have. Yes. So what I was told by her was that when she went to the other side of the veil, they did not disclose to her how she had died. And, and she did not know at that time, she did not have it confirmed to her that Chad had been having an affair, or that he had told his kids, you know, whatever he told them. So she was able to have three weeks of fun, basically, and reuniting with family and friends on the other side in spirit realm before they disclosed to her exactly what had happened. And then she turned her energy to ministering to her kids on earth. I do know that he told his children and some other contacts of mine, he's claiming that Tammy came to him shortly after she died

and encouraged him to marry Lori Vallow, which I know is a lie. Because you tell me, what woman in spirit realm or on earth is going to be okay with her husband turning around within a week and being in love with somebody he's had an affair with the last year you've been alive and say, you know, I think you should go marry her. In fact, don't grieve my death at all. Go marry her right now. Go to Hawaii and have the time of your life and abandon your kids in Idaho for the holidays while they're grieving my death. It's got Satan's MO all over it. But he's told people that. One of the children ever told you they were worried their dad would remarry?

Yes. Emma Daybell told that to me when I was in the 40-minute call with her. She was crying, and she initiated it. And she said, you know what I'm most worried about? And she was crying. And I said, what's that, Emma? And she said, my dad getting remarried. And I said, why are you worried about that? And she said,

because he's talked to me about multiple probations and I have a problem with polygamy. You know, that is just the oddest thing to me, Julie, because when my dad passed away, the last thing on my mind was my mom remarrying that never even entered my mind and I'm I'm curious as to why his daughter Emma would say and this is the day we find out Tammy has passed away I'm worried my dad's gonna remarry which tells me that he had had conversations with at least some of his kids, especially Emma, to quote-unquote prepare them to lay the groundwork for him to get remarried super fast, and that he had distorted the doctrine and had used it to justify his actions.

Because when I talked to him, the last time I talked to him about multiple verbations related to anything to do with this family he had talked to Tammy about it he had talked to a couple of his boys about it he had not talked to Emma about it and so he told her whatever he told her sometime in 2019 and you're saying probate provisionsations are past lives, correct? They're past lives. But I know Chad this way and the way he started to disclose his thought patterns in 2018 to me, which is he had this long list of people he thought he'd been married to before that he was reconnecting with and lori valo was one of them and when he told me that i said i'm not getting that but um i'm getting a big caution on lori valo actually chad you need to be careful i'm getting a caution there and he kind of smirked uh did this little kind of smirky laugh we were

talking over a regular phone call and then then that was like October of 18. And then I said it again in December. I said it again in January. Julie, remember, I've never heard of any of what you're saying. But it sounds like a dating website, a bizarre dating website, where you think you've had previous lives and you've been married to all these women and now in the current here and now you are now reaching out to these women to connect with them yeah i understand why tammy daybell was jealous i guess so it's one thing to have a past life

but it's another thing to be texting and calling women here in the here and now trying to hook up with them. Right. And that was, um, the leading cause for my falling out with Chad Daybell because of conversations we had in December, me not being okay with what was going on with him and what he was doing and choices he

was making and Lori was a big part of that and I I sent him a text and basically said you have patriarchal energy you need to clear and I'm not okay with what you're doing. He sent me a text back and said, wow, you really know how to burn bridges. You don't know me at all. But then he texted some other stuff that basically let me know I nailed it. I was spot on with my discernment of what he was up to. In all the conversations you have had with Tammy Daybell after her death, she's never once told you how she died? Not directly. And I'm not sure why that is,

but I hear more than anything. We want the energy to flush out and we want natural consequences to come about. And what the light side does is they give every opportunity for people to repent, to come clean, to speak truth, to change course, to correct their actions, to come forward on their own before they get caught or are charged with something, whether they're on this side or the other side of the veil. They have just told me they're waiting for the energy to flush out. Julie, do you believe Tammy Daybell's children have been brainwashed? Yes, I know. I know it. And I think they're very confused. They're heartbroken because I know those kids and I think they're very confused they're heartbroken because I know those kids and I can discern it and I can feel their energy they feel like I've betrayed them and all this news

media and everything going on they don't know who to trust and so it's easier to distrust me and the media and the law enforcement than to distrust your dad it's horrific this is very makes me very complicated well it's got satan's mo all over it and he's a complex strategist and there's a higher well i agree with you on that because that many dead bodies connected to one to two people, it defies logic. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Joining us right now is a very special guest. It is Julie Rowe. Julie is a former friend of cult leader Chad Daybell.

She is a current friend of his deceased wife, Tammy Daybell, the author and founder of the Greater Tomorrow Relief Fund and that relief fund helps create safe houses for human trafficking victims what is your message to Tammy's children if you could speak to them now first and foremost I would tell them that I love them with all of my heart and that I'm so sorry for what's happened and for their pain and I'm sorry I know that they feel like I've betrayed them but I'm doing this for the best interest of all parties involved, and I have to speak the truth as I know it, that it is to date one of the hardest things I have ever experienced in my life, and that I feel extremely betrayed by Chad.

So I can only imagine how they must feel the confusion as you try to sort out all the emotion with the guy that I I knew because I I know I knew Chad to you know quite well for at least three years I've got a question for you Julie and the time that you need Chad Daybell did he ever hit on you yes what happened and my husband knows it my husband's aware of everything in fact three years ago my husband's the one that said are you you sure you can trust chad and i was like yes yes yes i can trust chad and my husband picked up on the energy way before i did did chad daybell think you were one of his past wives too

yes so this is his line every attractive woman he tells them he knew them in a previous life and they were married so basically why not just have sex right now because you've already been married in another life?

I mean, to me, I'm not a member of the LDS. I'm not familiar with a lot of what you're saying, but I'm seeing a pattern. You work closely with him. Yes. You're attractive. And bam, suddenly he remembers, hey, I was married to you in another life. Yes. Then there's Lori Vallow.

Then there's the other lady you told me about that he was texting and her husband found out. That's three right there. And he also told me that he thought he was married to Melanie Gibb. And you were the first person I've said that to other than the people in three people in my closest circle. And my husband, of course. You have just given me chill bumps all down my arms. Because talking to you and looking at you i just knew it i just knew daybell hit on you and now you're telling me that about melanie how did you find out she also was married to chad daybell in another life i only heard it from chad i don't know what

it is about chad daybell apparently a lot of women fall for this. They actually believe it. He had all kinds of women coming after him. All kinds of women. Because he's misusing his spiritual gifts, which is what Satan does. People that follow Satan, the occult have spiritual gifts too, right? He sucks them in with his gifts, and he uses it as a control and manipulation tactic. I can learn from you what may have been his M.O.

So he says you were one of his you were a wife in a past life. What did he want from that? Did he want to rekindle a sex relationship i don't know because he he didn't he never said and i didn't ask and i didn't want to know what did he say how do you tell somebody how do you break it to him you were married in a past life I don't remember he had he had been testing like asking questions and he had this necklace that he said he found one time he told me he found it on a church bench then he found it in the library church and then one time he said it was an old necklace of Tammy's that he found he gave me three different stories on the necklace but he would use it like a pendulum and it was an owl necklace, which I also know is an occult symbol. So I don't,

and I always told him, I don't like that necklace and you can get false answers by using pendulums. But he would swing it back and forth? Yeah. And he, he would, he would neutralize it and then he'd swing it to try to get a yes or no. And I would tell him all the time I would sit there and use my gifts when we would, when we would discuss, you know, things like, um, am I seeing correctly, um, X, Y, and Z. Right. And I would never tell him what I was actually seeing in my head, but he would always ask it with me there. He tried to get me to say it and then he'd use his necklace and then he would get an answer and sometimes I'd go I guess it worked but most of the time I'd say

I don't like your necklace Julie you have to promise me something when Tammy Daybell finally tells you how she died you have to call me I need to know i will and i am clairvoyant and i don't want to be wrapped up in the legal issue but i don't know how i won't be but i i would testify in court if tammy told me right if anybody knows me they know i speak truth at all costs. I will do everything I can to see justice. I am absolutely sick to my stomach at what's gone on. I am concerned. Thank you for being with us. And we wait as justice unfolds. Thank you, Julie. Thank you, Julie. Thank you.