Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Missing Autistic Boy, Sebastian Rogers, MOLESTED?

Episode Date: April 8, 2024

A vigil was held over the weekend in the Hendersonville community as the search for Sebastian Rogers moves into its sixth week. The Rogers family says they are holding onto hope that the teen will come home safe.  This, as father Seth Rogers says his son was molested in the past.  Joining Nancy Grace Today: Sheryl McCollum  – Forensics Expert & Cold Case Investigative Research Institute Founder; Host of Podcast: “Zone 7;” X: @149Zone7    Joe Scott Morgan – Professor of Forensics: Jacksonville State University, Author, “Blood Beneath My Feet,” and Host: “Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan;” Twitter/X: @JoScottForensic Dave Mack- CrimeOnline Investigative Reporter See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. In the last hours, the bio dad and grandparents of missing autistic boy, Sebastian Rogers, Hold a vigil where everyone vows that Sebastian will be brought home safe and sound. Will he? I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories as we continue joining in the search for Sebastian. First of all, take a listen to this. Have the

two of you taken a polygraph? I have. I have not. Would you be willing to? I've offered and volunteered on many occasions to take a polygraph and I was told directly by law enforcement because of my whereabouts, I did not need one. I understand. Ms. Proudfoot, did you pass your polygraph? I did. That's not exactly what has been stated before by Sebastian Rogers' stepfather, Mr. Proudfoot. Listen, and Mr. Proudfoot. Listen. And Mr. Proudfoot, you have volunteered to take a poly?

Yes, ma'am. If I were to set up a poly for you, would you take it? Name the place and time, ma'am. I'll be there. Joining me in All-Star Panel to make sense of what we're hearing right now, but first to Dave Mack, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. Dave Mack, isn't it true that CrimeOnline.com did set up a polygraph? Absolutely true. And what happened? Chris Proudfoot told us that he had to, he could not take it now.

He wanted to, but he can't because the TBI told him not to. It's my understanding to Cheryl McCollum joining us. Cheryl McCollum, founder and director of the Cold Case Research Institute, forensics expert and host of Zone 7 podcast. Cheryl, it's my understanding that specifically Sebastian's stepfather said he could no longer do interviews, including with us, because he had been instructed so by the TBI and Jackie. Correct me if I'm wrong, that they did not want any of his interviews to interfere with the investigation and that even though he had agreed to do our polygraph, he now says that the TBI is going to set up their own polygraph and he can't take our polygraph until after that. And once he does that, then quote, we'll take it from there.

What do you make of it? You know, you and I always go back to Mark Klass. If you want to make sure that the law enforcement has everything they need to get rid of looking at you, you can do that. He can set up a private polygraph through an attorney. He can take yours. He can demand that TBI give him one so that they can stop focusing on him and this polygraph business and move on and find out where Sebastian is at. Period. I mean, Cheryl McCollum, you and I can go right now and pay for a polygraph. They'd be happy to take our money. Hey, just put it on a credit card and take a polygraph. And here's the other thing. TBI would be happy to accept those results.

A polygraph is a polygraph is a polygraph. And the examiner, that's who you're relying on. So you've got somebody that's going to be willing to testify and put their reputation on the line. Again, he could make this happen today if he wanted to. Let's go straight out to Joseph Scott Morgan, a professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon and star of a hit series, Body Bags with Joe Scott Morgan. Joe Scott, thank you for being with us. You know what? This is like static in my ears because I know tick, tock, tick, tock. As long as we focus on the stepfather and the mother, Mr. and Mrs. Proudfoot, I'm losing time if by some stretch of the imagination, Sebastian is still alive. If he's alive, he won't be much longer. What are the stats show?

What is your opinion? I need it and I need it now, Joe Scott. Yeah, the biggest thing that we're looking at is this idea of time. We're talking about a young man that went missing back in February, Nancy, late February. And as we move down that timeline, you know, the odds are stacked against him. I think one of the most important pieces that's kind of arisen out of this, other than all of the comments that have been made to this point relative to polygraphs and those sorts of things, are those eyeglasses.

And I love the shot the producers put up of him standing in front of that rack of eyeglasses, because that's going to tell the tale. I think if they can specifically tie those to him, that's very important. They can take that script off of those glasses, determine. I don't think they're his glasses, Joe Scott. I don't think they're his glasses, Joe Scott. I don't think they're his glasses. Well, at this point in time, you have to work with what you have. If they're not his, then that points us down a different road, doesn't it? Okay, let's go with they're not his glasses.

And I'll tell you why I'm saying that, Joe Scott. I was thrilled. I mean, you know, you might want to jump in on this, Cheryl. Remember, we're not having high tea at Windsor Castle, but it's a sad day when you're excited, when you're thrilled, you think you find a missing boy's glasses. Why was I thrilled? Because it was a clue for a moment. And then the TBI confirmed they're not his glasses. So I see where you're going, Joe Scott. But it's a sad day when we're all thrilled to find a pair of beat up glasses on the side of the road.

But I was. So where does that leave me, Joe Scott? As we're all like, take a poly, take a poly. Why won't he take a poly? What really happened? Was he at work? Was he not at work? While we're all gnashing our teeth and switching our tails trying to figure out about Mr. Proudfoot, if this kid, this child is out there with his autism kicking in, giving him problems, what's going to happen?

The likely scenario, Joe Scott, as we're spinning our wheels on proudfoot. Yeah, if this is, you know, we're talking about Hendersonville, Tennessee, Nancy, which is 10 miles outside of Nashville. But, you know, really quickly up there, that area becomes very rural. And so if he has wandered off or been taken off in any number of directions, his ability or survivability is greatly diminished here. And what the police are doing right now is, if you think about the last known location of him, that's the center of the target. And they're working from concentrically to eccentrically. They're moving out in these big circles, but it's such a broad, densely wooded area.

This is a Herculean task, to say the least. I think that some of the answers are going to rest in the idea that whoever had control over him, his comings and goings. We're talking about a kid that has been diagnosed with autism. Whoever had control over his comings and goings, their electronics need to be tracked, Nancy. Those ideas of where did they go at those times when he was last seen alive? And that's going to be one of the threads that you're going to want to pull in this investigation. You know, Cheryl McCollum, host of Zone 7, is a forensic expert.

As you know, Joe Scott Morgan, death investigator. Cheryl, you've had quite a lot to say online. What about now? Cat got your tongue because I don't like that. No, you're pretty bold when nobody's questioning you. No, but what about now? I want to hear your analysis. Here's my problem. They're statements. You've got inconsistencies. As soon as somebody changes their story at all, they should become the focus. Period. Mom has said different things. Now you've got a stepdad that looks like he's co-signing with everything that she says, but he allegedly wasn't there. So how can he agree with anything that she's saying?

You've got mom saying she heard a thud. I don't like that word. That sounds like a body hitting the floor. When people use the word thud, that's not sounded like he hit the wall, sounded like something dropped. No, it's never a good thing. It's usually preceded by an adjective, sickening, a sickening thud. Right. And Nancy, you've got other things. You've got mom saying he went to the end of the driveway to put out the trash. And then you've got law enforcement searching a landfill. They're searching lakes. They're searching ponds. If you're watching and paying attention to law enforcement,

it does not seem to me that they are looking to recover a child alive. They are searching for remains. You and I both know, and Joe Scott knows, when a child goes missing, the first three hours are critical. We're at six weeks. Six weeks that this child has not been seen or heard from. Okay, hold on. Why are you saying, Cheryl McCollum, that you believe they don't expect to find Sebastian alive based on their actions?

I'm talking about LA law enforcement. They're searching. They're searching landfills, lakes, ponds. That is not indicative of somebody that is alive. And again, you've got a child that has gone six weeks without his medicine, six weeks without food that we know of. He didn't have a source, no shoes. and mama herself says, oh, a flashlight's missing. Again, that's such an odd thing for her to know is missing until they show her video that looks like a flashlight. And then the stat dad says, well, we were sure hoping it was, but we're sad to report it wasn't a flashlight. Well, if you've got two flashlights out there, why are you glad that it's not that? That, to me, would signify that somebody was out there in the wee hours of the morning with two flashlights, meaning two separate people, the night your child went missing.

I mean, it's just odd. What do you make of a three-hour conversation held between Mrs. Proudfoot and Mr. Proudfoot the night Sebastian disappears. The three-hour phone call bothers me because, again, that's a long time to be on the phone. And, you know, you're hearing your son supposedly. He's answering you supposedly during that time. But you don't go check on him at all. You know, did somebody leave their phone just on while they went and did something else?

I don't know. But I agree with Joe Scott. The electronics are going to tell the story. When his mama first entertained the idea that somebody had him, what did she base that on? His phone's not missing. He didn't take shoes, didn't take clothes, didn't take money. Nothing on his cell phone, nothing on his computer

says that he's been talking to anybody. I mean, she's entertaining something that we have no facts for. Well, I'm concerned about the, and you're right, whenever I hear inconsistent statements, as I've discussed many, many times in front of juries, it's one thing to add or embellish your original statement because maybe you weren't asked the right questions first time around. Maybe you remembered something in addition, triggered by questions. But when you change your story, that's a problem. To Joe Scott Morgan joining us, a professor at Jacksonville State University.

Joe Scott, let's look at where the searches are being conducted. We know the law enforcement search has been scaled back. I want to hear, since you are a death investigator, we all three have been on many, many searches for missing people and who we believe to be dead. I want to hear your analysis. What can we glean from looking at what law enforcement is doing? Back to Cheryl's point about landfills and ponds. Ponds are water, bodies of water. You can think that, well, you have people that can just wander into these locations, okay? Particularly somebody that might be in a compromised state like this young man from a mental and a physical status at this point in time.

But when you start to talk about landfills, Nancy, this is a rather dark, dark thing. I've been to landfills multiple times conducting death investigations. And those are locations where we're talking about the discarding of remains. Now, here's another interesting point. The fact that the landfill is all the way up in Kentucky. You mean he didn't just walk into a landfill and fall over? No, and certainly not in Kentucky. This is specifically targeted. Now, from my understanding is that landfill is used to serve this particular area. And landfills are very complex environments. They're gridded off. Essentially, they know where they're going to do dumpings. It's not like they randomly go into these locations and just back the truck up. They go to specific locations. But with landfills, they're highly complex.

They're layered. And so as you begin to stack items in there, they then run over them with this heavy equipment. And it makes the going very, very tough. As a matter of fact, anything that gets in there begins to degrade and decompose very quickly. That's the purpose of it. And so that is not a good sign, Nancy. And the fact that they are searching a landfill is rather ominous to me. Nancy, I want to jump in here real quick. I don't want to be rude. No, I was just coming to you because I wanted to talk to you, Dave Mack,

on two issues and whatever else you want to interject. Please, I need everybody's thoughts. One, I want to get from you any previous inconsistent statements as correctly stated by Cheryl McCollum. And two, allegations that Sebastian, this autistic boy, was molested have emerged. Let's start with the inconsistent statements very quickly. From the very beginning, Nancy, Chris Proudfoot made statements in interviews online claiming, he actually said, somebody asked the question, was a polygraph taken and has it been passed? Yes. I didn't specify who or when, but what I can tell you, everything has been vetted completely. Polygraphs have come back as past.

So I'm confused as in why they are all wondering if myself, my wife and the biological father took. OK, we know that's a lie. We know that is absolutely a lie because of what he told you on your show. Well, you're saying that that's what Proudfoot said, that he had taken a polygraph. He and his wife and had been, quote, vetted. OK, yes, he did say that on a podcast. Go ahead. Okay.

And then we also have the belt. You know, we have hitting Sebastian with the belt. I don't know if you caught this, but, you know, when Seth Rogers was on your show last week when we were talking about the belt, he started crying. I saw later Seth referred to it as he was aware of the corporal punishment that Chris Proudfoot was handing out to his son, to Seth Rogers' autistic son. And, you know, we pointed out that Proudfoot claimed it was years ago and it was one spank with the belt on his butt, but through clothing, which makes no sense to any parent in the history of mankind or any teacher at school that they would actually look into something through clothing like that. But they couldn't remember when, how long ago it was.

And in another interview, he said 15, which means it had to have been in the last several months. So we've got a number of serious issues here. Didn't Sebastian turn 15 in December? Correct. And it went missing February 26th. So if he was 15 when he got a whack with a belt, that would have been in the last few months just before he disappears. So which one is true? Was it three years ago or was it when he was 15 years old? Another question.

Allegations that Sebastian was molested have now emerged. What can you tell us? Sebastian's biological father, Seth Rogers, said that when the Proudfoots, when Katie and Chris Proudfoot and Sebastian were living in an apartment in California a couple of years, several years ago that Katie Proudfoot allowed a boy that was five years older than Sebastian to play with Sebastian. And the boy was 13. Sebastian was eight this time. She allowed it. Seth Rogers said that Katie Proudfoot allowed a 13-year-old boy to play with Sebastian, who was eight, without any kind of involvement from Katie Proudfoot. And that during the time this 13 year old molested and raped Sebastian Rogers. It seems the more we investigate, the murkier the facts become. This is what I know. Every day, literally every hour that Sebastian Rogers is missing is one hour closer to him being dead. Can we tune out all the static and the noise

and try to focus on finding this autistic boy? And to you, Mr. Proudfoot, our offer is still on the table for a polygraph, free of charge to you. I'll pay for it out of my pocket. We wait as the search goes on. Goodbye, friend. You're listening to an iHeart Podcast.