Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Missing Mollie Tibbetts: Did Iowa college student vanish during evening jog?

Episode Date: July 24, 2018

College student Mollie Tibbetts disappeared from the small Iowa town of Brooklyn, Iowa, last week and her family pleads for clues and answers about where the 20-year-old woman has gone. Police believe the former high school track star mave have been out jogging when she vanished. Nancy Grace explores the mystery with Phil Vetrano, father of Long Island jogger murder victim Karina Vetrano, private investigator Vincent Hill, lawyer and psychologist Dr. Brian Russell -- host of Investigation Discovery's "Fatal Vows" series, Atlanta lawyer and juvenile judge Ashley Willcott, and reporter Chuck Roberts. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. Did you know a recent law can leave your personal data exposed online for anybody to find? If you've turned on the news lately, you know the internet has created a dangerous new world. It's time you take back the power by using a new website called Truthfinder. Have you been issued a speeding ticket? Received a lien from the IRS? Did you forget about an embarrassing social media profile? That info may already be online. Truthfinder can help you find it. Truthfinder searches millions of public records, assembling

the data together in one report. Members get unlimited searches, so you can also look up those close to you and make sure they're not hiding something. Visit truthfinder.com slash Nancy. Enter your own name. Get started. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph, Channel 132. An excruciating search as we are listening now for a gorgeous young Iowa college sophomore who vanishes when she goes jogging in her own neighborhood. Where is Molly? Right now, we are calling out to you to help us bring Molly home. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. Molly goes missing on a regular

jog. How many times have all of us gone out for a walk, out for a jog without any question that in 40 minutes, an hour, would be back home. How many times have I left my twins to go jogging, never thinking I wouldn't be back to them? Straight out now to Chuck Roberts, Crime Stories investigative reporter. Chuck, let's start at the beginning. Tell me about Molly Tibbetts going to jog. Well, she went out late Wednesday evening. She was staying at the house of her boyfriend and her boyfriend's brother, sort of dog sitting during the summer. She had a job about 30 miles away.

And she went out for a jog after texting her mom and after Snapchatting her boyfriend and has not been seen since. This is late Wednesday night in a town called Brooklyn, Iowa. It's about an hour east of Des Moines, a little west of Iowa City. She's a college student at Iowa City. And searchers have tried everything they know. 250 searchers went out. There have been door-to-door searches. Every farm building has been checked. Even kayakers searched miles along the small rivers on both sides of the town. No sign of Molly. She apparently left with her cell phone, but all calls to her cell phone immediately go to voicemail. So it's either dead or it's been turned off. She left her ID

and her car keys at home home and she left her glasses. And her boyfriend, who was not home, he's working in Dubuque about two hours away, said that she also left her glasses and she can't see anything without her glasses. Wait a minute, right there, that's giving me pause for concern because if she can't see anything without her glasses, how can she go jogging without her glasses i want to make sure she actually left that apartment let me ask you a series of rapid fire cross-examination questions chuck roberts are we sure the boyfriend was in dubuque at the time she goes missing uh i don't have confirmation but he has a job in Dubuque, and apparently everyone, the sheriff would have said if he didn't show up for work.

You're right. He left her on Monday. I'm taking that as a yes. So he left her on a Monday? Mm-hmm. Monday the 16th. So he has to, what, travel to work and stay away from home? It's a summer job.

He's a construction worker in Dubuque, which is on the Mississippi River about two hours east of Brooklyn. He lives in Brooklyn, which is on I-80. So let me just try to rephrase this in a capsule. This is what I'm understanding. The boyfriend worked out of town and was away. He was not coming home every night from his job. He would go away and stay away to work and then I guess come home, I guess on weekends. Is that right, Chuck? I don't know that he was coming home on weekends, but you're right. She stayed alone at the house. Okay, that's all I need to hear right now. The boyfriend's brother. Do we know where he was at the time she goes missing? I have not been able to determine, but he was not

at home, and she was sort of dog sitting. She was all alone and the house dog sitting. Her boyfriend's brother was about to get married, and they were all to fly to the Dominican Republic in three weeks in early August for the wedding. Right, for a destination wedding. I got it. Right now, I love hearing about weddings. I really, really do, but what I'm interested in right now is this timeline. So with me is CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter Chuck Roberts. I want to go to a very special guest joining me right now. It's Phil Vetrano. We all know that name. For months, I covered the case of his beautiful daughter, Karina Vetrano. She had gone out jogging. She asked her dad to go with her he always jogged with her just like my

dad always worked out with me phil i've told you that story or let me say i worked out with him and that day that evening he was having an ailment i can't recall was it your leg or your back and that one time you didn't go an hour passes he. He knows something is wrong. Something's wrong. He tries her cell phone. Phil's father's instinct was right. Karina had been attacked while jogging, and right now we are awaiting the trial of her killer. Phil, please explain why a timeline is so important. To find the missing, either still alive or not still alive, it's critical in the beginning to mount up the largest search you possibly can. And I was, I'm going to say lucky enough, but, you know, I'm not lucky in this situation.

But I was lucky enough to start my search within a half hour, and we found her four hours later. But between that half hour and that four-hour period, I knew she was no longer with us. I knew that. It seems like they're doing everything they can as far as searching for her in the area where she was living. So I don't get a good feeling about Molly being alive. I don't. You know, Phil, you're so right regarding how you start the search. For instance, right now, I'm trying to figure out, and there is no, none at all, no suggestion the boyfriend or the boyfriend's brother is involved in her disappearance. But that's how you start an investigation.

With me, Dr. Brian Russell, lawyer, psychologist, host of Investigation Discoveries hit series, Fatal Vows. Brian, that's how every investigation starts. You start with who you're closest to, who you're living with at the time, who has access to you. That's why you have to rule out the boyfriend and the boyfriend's brother because that was their place. She was just their dog sitting. Again, they are not under suspicion. And Dr. Brian Russell, I've got to determine how we know she ever made it out of the house to go jogging. Because am I looking at the home as a potential crime scene or am I looking at the jogging route as a potential crime scene?

Because that makes a world of difference, Brian. Well, that's absolutely right. And people who don't necessarily listen to your show regularly or watch Fatal Vows on Investigation Discovery may not know that they may believe that when someone goes missing in a situation like this, it's more likely to be a stranger that's the perpetrator, when statistically speaking, it's actually more likely to be somebody with whom the victim has had prior contact. So you're absolutely right that you want to begin with the people who are closest to the person and work your way out to the stranger possibility. The other thing that

I would point out here is that often in these cases at this point, at the risk of being labeled a victim blamer, I'm able to sit here and say, okay, for those who are fortunate enough to have not ever been in a situation like this, here are some lessons to be learned from this about things that the victim or potential victim could have done differently, maybe to have kept themselves safer. And in this case so far, we don't really have anything. You know, we often unfortunately see these cases where the young woman maybe met somebody and, you know, went home with them alone when they didn't know them very well and it turned out to be a sex offender or they walked home late at night by themselves in a dangerous area or something.

Again, never blaming the victim, but just trying to glean lessons for other people to avoid the same thing. I don't think she went home with anybody. I don't think that that happened. No, she didn't. That's what I'm saying. We don't have anything at this point that I can point out to you that apparently this girl did that was out of the ordinary, dangerous, anything. I've got a conflict in the evidence, and i'm having a failure to launch right here because the boyfriend says that and correct me if i'm wrong chuck because this is all unfolding right now that he got a a routine good night text

around 10 p.m now is that the night she goes missing, Chuck? Because if she texted him goodnight, then she went jogging after that? Or had she already been jogging when she sent the text? No, it was, she texted her mother about 7 p.m. Then at 10 p.m., Wednesday night, he opens a Snapchat message from her. It's not that she sent it at 10 p.m. That night, he opens a Snapchat message from her. It's not that she sent it at 10 p.m.

That's when he opened it, and that's the last communication that he had with her. But it wasn't a live interaction. He simply opened a Snapchat when he got at some point where he could do that. Well, if a Snapchat is saying goodnight, are you telling me regarding the timeline that she went jogging after that? Why would she say goodnight if she hadn't already been jogging? I think she may have sent it as early as 7 p.m. And he simply didn't open it until 10 p.m.

That would be my supposition. Okay, maybe I'm not making myself clear. Vincent Hill, I think it's me. Vincent Hill with me, former Nashville PD, now private investigator. What I'm saying is, did she really go jogging? Are we sure? And this is the reason I ask. I'm not just accepting any fact until I know it.

Why would she send him goodnight before she goes jogging and she's not going to bed? That doesn't make sense to me. You write goodnight when you're going to bed, right? Yeah, that's right, Nancy. And there's so many other red flags too. I mean, the boyfriend saying she was missing without her glasses that she can't see, you would assume she would have those glasses on while she's jogging, especially if it may be late at night or early in the morning when it still may be dark out. So there's so many red flags with this case going on right now. And the fact that her phone has essentially gone dead, I think this was something of a crime of opportunity.

Someone likely wouldn't be worried about taking her phone and making sure it's dead and whatnot so something is amiss here nancy yeah the the fact i can't say that this is a missing jogger that's what everybody's saying why are they saying that i don't know i'm also getting reports that she was last seeing wearing gym shorts a black sports bra and running shoes okay when when was that was that the day before. Okay. When was that? Was that the day before? Was that the night? Was that the morning? Was she taking a jog before work?

What I'm saying is we can't even launch this until we know. Was she taken from the home? Was she taken while jogging? Here's another question to you, Chuck Roberts. Was she wearing a Fitbit? She was, according to her boyfriend, but apparently does not have a GPS device with it, so they can't, you know, find it. Now, you know, if she had an iPhone, find my iPhone always works. But apparently if it's dead, if the battery is dead or it's been, you know, turned off. You can't find an iPhone and the user that way.

But, yes, she did have an activity monitoring device called a Fitbit on her. Okay, this is what I can say regarding the timeline. 730 a.m., 730 a.m., and I'm assuming this is the following morning her brother texts her asking if she needs to use the car that they share that goes unanswered that is not like her the boyfriend Dalton texts her good morning and she never looks at it you can tell whether somebody's read your text or not Molly's mom texts her several times during the day. They all go unanswered. In the afternoon, her brother calls their mom to tell her Molly missed work. Mom immediately calls police. I've got a lot of questions. Right now, take a listen to our friend at weareiowa.com, Angelina Salcido speaking

to the boyfriend. This is not like her. Dalton Jack is living in a nightmare. I figured, you know, I'd speak to her in an hour or so. And right now, it's one he can't wake up from. I came home as soon as her mom said that she called the hospital and she wasn't there. The last time the 20-year-old NOW IT'S ONE HE CAN'T WAKE UP FROM. 3 I CAME HOME AS SOON AS HER MOM SAID SHE CALLED THE HOSPITAL AND SHE WASN'T THERE. THE LAST TIME THE 20-YEAR-OLD SAW MOLLY WAS ON WEDNESDAY AT 10 P-M WHEN HE OPENED A SNAPCHAT FROM HER. 3

IT WAS JUST A SELFIE WITH A CAPTION AND I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT THE CAPTION SAID BUT IT LOOKED LIKE SHE WAS INSIDE. HE NEVER THOUGHT HE WOULDN'T HEAR FROM HER AGAIN. WHEN HE TEXTED HER EARLY THURSDAY MORNING HE DIDN'T NOTICE THE

MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 3 ONE OF HER COWORKERS CALLED ME AND SAID MOLLY HAD NOT CALLED IN TO WORK THAT DAY AND SHE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE

DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE

DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE

DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T BEEN READ UNTIL HER FRIEND CALLED LATE THAT AFTERNOON. 1ST MINUTE OF THE MORNING HE

DIDN'T NOTICE THE MESSAGE HADN'T and everybody came up with the same thing. No, I haven't seen her since yesterday. Dalton says the three years the two have been together, they've been inseparable. She's so sweet. I've never seen her be angry or mean to anybody in the almost three years that we've been dating. To not know where she is is unsettling, and he's gone numb. If this is her running off,

this is just nobody would have seen it coming. Nobody in the world, not her family, not me, nobody would have ever guessed that she would just take off and not tell anybody. While law enforcement continue to search for her, there's just one thing he wants Molly to know. I miss you so much and I love you. If you answer yes to any of those questions, you may need Truthfinder. Public records are only recently easily available online. Before websites like Truthfinder, you'd most likely have to visit a courthouse to get that information. Now, it's as simple as entering a name. Truthfinder sifts through millions of public records from all over the country, assembling them into one easy-to-read report.

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She's so sweet. I've never seen her be angry or mean to anybody in the almost three years that we've been dating. To not know where she is is unsettling, and he's gone numb. If this is her running off, this is just, nobody would have seen it coming. Nobody in the world, not her family, not me, nobody would have ever guessed that she would just take off and not tell anybody. While law enforcement continue to search for her, there's just one thing he wants Molly to know. I miss you so much, and I love you. You are hearing our friend at WeAreIowa.com, Angelina Salcedo,

speaking to Molly Tibbetts' boyfriend, Dalton. Right now, the search is on for a missing Iowa student. I find very interesting his words that she might take off and not tell anybody. 20-year-old Molly Tibbetts, University of Iowa student, missing now several days. Her family, friends, police are desperate to find her. She's a college student there in Brooklyn, Iowa. Last seen, according to reports, Wednesday, Wednesday, July 18, while going for a run in her hometown. She messaged her boyfriend later that night, we believe, but has not been seen or heard from since.

Straight out to Phil Vetrano, special guest joining us, the father of Long Island jogger Karina Vetrano. We are awaiting the murder trial of her killer. Phil, what can you tell me about a red T-shirt that has sparked your interest? Well, I've read that Molly worked for a daycare, and the next day, which would be Thursday, they were going to a fair and they gave all the counselors the same red shirt to wear and along with her glasses and her contacts the red shirt is missing they cannot find a red shirt where she lived so it is my impression that she was wearing the shirt when she was I'm going to say abducted or went missing

because they can't find it. So she wasn't wearing that shirt to jog. I think she put it on the next morning. You know what, Phil Vetrano, that is an excellent point. I think they've got this thing bass-ackwards. I'm telling you, Phil, because her texting him goodnight tells me she had already been for her jog. Yes, maybe people saw her jogging, but that doesn't mean she went missing on the jog. With me, in addition to Phil Vetrano, Vincent Hill, private investigator, the host of Investigation Discovery's hit series, Fatal Vows, Dr. Brian Russell, Chuck Roberts, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, and joining me right now, Ashley Wilcott, lawyer, judge, founder of ChildCrimeWatch.com.

This is my problem, Ashley. I've been a jogger my whole life. I don't text my now husband, but before I would jog, you know, no matter where I was living, be it Atlanta, be it in inner city Atlanta, be it Manhattan, I don't text goodnight before I jog and then go jogging and don't tell anybody anything the rest of the night. No. Absolutely. No, I agree, Nancy. But here's the thing. I think that we have to consider all possible what has happened

to this girl, beautiful young girl, scenarios. Because as you and I know, it's one of two things. Either A, she did take off. And like you said, you're not going to text her bye before you go jog. Or B, or goodnight. Or B, something happened to her. And we've seen cases where you have both scenarios. So we just don't know yet. We've to consider both i know people say oh she'd never take off she'd never do that well guess what we've seen it happen again and again it could be either scenario yeah i mean i'll never forget jennifer will banks alan do you believe you have to color that cover that remember that the runaway bride the real runaway bride that was was a crazy story. And that was in Georgia, right? Oh, yeah. They had one of these huge wedding plans where you've got like 10, 12 bridesmaids and 10, 12 groomsmen.

The whole kit and caboodle. As we say where I come from, they were putting on the dog. Okay. So then right before the wedding, she goes missing. Everybody turns hell upside down trying to find her then she shows up thousands of miles away blaming as she said her words not mine for hispanics okay let me just say she did yard work for months as restitution for the big search for her but i i don't I don't feel Vetrano. I'm just not feeling that this person, Molly Tibbetts,

just took a powder and wouldn't call her mom and dad, nothing? I don't think so. And the idea that you brought up to Brian Russell, Dr. Brian Russell, lawyer, psychologist, host of Fatal Vows on ID, the red shirt, that's disturbing me. It's not in her car or the car she shared with her brother. It's not in her apartment. It's not in her backpack.

And more significant, Phil Vetrano, you're the one that's bringing this to my attention. She was going to wear that shirt the day we all know she's gone. The jog was the night before. She was going to wear that on a field trip with the daycare. know she's gone. The jog was the night before. She was going to wear that on a field trip with the daycare. She was a counselor. That's gone. It sounds like a Jennifer Kessy situation where she was getting ready to go to work.

She put on the red shirt. She hadn't gotten her cell phone and her stuff together, and then something goes wrong. That red shirt is disturbing me, Dr. Russell. Yeah, it really does sound like the timeline that you've been talking about is off in terms of when the disappearance happened. There are seeming to me to be more things pointing to her having disappeared after sometime between the jog after the jog and going to work the next day. I want to go back on why we're all focused so much on this on this job. But guys, I want to review the facts very quickly in a capsule, in a nutshell, with Chuck

Roberts, our CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. For those of you just joining us, and Jackie, thank you for the tip line. 641-623-5679. 641-623-5679. It's not too late to make a difference in finding Molly. Her parents distraught. That's the number for the Paraschik Sheriff's Office. Okay, Chuck, in a nutshell, what do we think happened to Molly for those just joining us? Well, this is a young girl, 20 years old, slight build, 120 pounds, 5'3", last seen wearing, according to her boyfriend, jogging shorts, a sports bra, and running shoes. And she was last seen Wednesday evening

from her home in Brooklyn, Iowa, a little town of about 1,400. But it's a girl with everything to live for. She's a psych major at the University of Iowa, just entering her sophomore year. She was preparing for a wedding, a destination wedding in the Dominican Republic in two weeks. No indication of a fight with her boyfriend, Dalton Jack, who was away at the time. He has a construction job in Dubuque, Iowa, but maybe two hours away. But she was alone in the house at the time in little brooklyn iowa they have searched cornfields and right now the corn is nine feet tall so you have to basically walk down every single row because apparently she liked to jog in the cornfields and even the planes flying overhead wait a minute i was just

talking about this with the twins last night okay last night we we love those little bitty corn on the cobs that you know they're frozen ashley you know what they are and you can get them ready in like three minutes in the microwave well we wanted yeah we wanted fresh corn okay the kind you have to shuck i wish i'd taken a picture ashley but i had the twins shucking corn last night. So we were eating it at dinner, and we started talking about the corn maze, that we go to a corn maze and pick out pumpkins every year. Well, we're the people that got lost in the corn maze. That was us, okay? And David, who knows what had happened to him.

I just assumed he was dead in the corn maze because I hadn't seen him in about an hour and we finally you know that the place was closing it was getting dark okay out in some rural area and they were closing and we were in the corn maze me and the twins and so finally I just looked up at a giant tall tree and started going through the corn itself to get out. And we went through the fence and that's how we finally got out. So my point is what Chuck Roberts is saying. Why would you be jogging through a cornfield? But I guess she was raised that way.

So it wasn't it did not present a problem to her. But he's right. The corn right now is eight or nine feet tall and the only way you can really search it as chuck said is to walk down the rows even planes overhead can't look down in between the rows so that is what one of the one of the obstacles that they are trying to overcome in this search for her. She's last thing wearing gym shorts, a black sports bra, running shoes. She's 5'3", 120 pounds.

I'm not convinced that she went missing while jogging, and that's the problem. This is the problem. Right or wrong to Phil Vetrano, the father of Long Island jogger Karina Vetrano, if you've got your timeline wrong, you are spinning your wheels and you're wasting valuable time in finding the missing person. Hours count, minutes count. If they've got the timeline wrong and she did not disappear while jogging, they're truly barking up the wrong tree. Exactly, Nancy. Exactly. Like I said before, I was fortunate enough to know exactly when my daughter went out and where she went. So within a half hour, my search started. They could be off as much as what, 18 hours,

maybe 24 hours. And looking in the wrong place. And looking in the wrong place. Hey, Nancy, let me just caveat that, too. This is a lot of assumptions, right? This is his theory, the boyfriend's theory, that she was jogging in these shorts. And the fact that he said, well, if she's just taking off, it's very disturbing. Because if you're in love with your girlfriend and you care for your girlfriend and you're under the assumption she went jogging and now she's missing and possibly in a cornfield laid out somewhere that's not the thing you would say

and we're under the assumption too that he was at work two hours away that hasn't been proven yet and just because he may have been seen at work sometime during that day doesn't mean he couldn't have gotten back there and done something so all of this is a lot of assumptions and this timeline is very crucial guys speaking of the family a desperate right now and phil you've lived through this the hours the minutes ticking by. Every minute counts. Every minute could matter in the search for Molly. Listen to Molly's mom. Oh, wait, wait. Hold on. Let's go to Phil on that. Phil? I was going to say, I believe the family right now is going through false hope. I really do. These situations never work out where you're going to find her. Fine. I don't think this woman, this lady, this little

girl took off and ran away. There's no way. She had too much going for her. She had aspirations of success. She was working a job. She was going to school. She reminded me a lot of Karina, you know, that she was a hardworking girl. And I think she's going to be found someday, hopefully, shortly, but I do not think she's alive. Take a listen to what Molly's mom tells ABC7. Hundreds of friends and volunteers have been out searching for Molly, combing cornfields where she's known to run. Her mother, Laura, spoke to us by phone. It's exhausting because I don't know where she is. I don't know if she's safe. We're just hoping for her safe return. Laura Calderwood says her daughter had no enemies. Investigators say Molly was last seen wearing gym shorts, a black sports bra, and running shoes.

Her NIDs all left behind at the home she shares with her boyfriend. Molly is one of the most caring people you'll ever meet. She's a great hard worker. It doesn't matter the situation. She'll put herself second and put whoever else needs the support before she does herself. You're praying to hear good words that they found her, that she's okay. Those words would mean mean everything we could really use everybody's help that we can get molly tibbett's gone missing and right now i think this theory that she was jogging may very well be bass ackwards she's 5'2 about 120 pounds long brown hair brown eyes tip line 641-623-5679 repeat 641-623-5679 now yeah i'm sorry can i throw this

is ashley i wanted to throw something in as you're saying the tip line as a judge on the bench here's what i see all the time somebody knows exactly what has happened, where she is, what they've seen, and they may feel like, oh, it's not a big deal that I saw her with so-and-so six hours ago. I don't care. If anybody knows anything at all, it is so imperative that they step up, step forward, and report it. You know, another issue, investigators hoping they can access her computer and online accounts to zone in on her whereabouts. But I don't understand why this late in the game they still don't have access to that. Vincent Hill, private investigator, what's the holdup?

Nancy, the only thing I can think of on that is that they're probably waiting for a warrant. Because at the end of the day, we're talking about a missing adult, not a missing child, where there could be a possible Amber Alert. So there's some legal ramifications anytime you're touching electronic data like that. Wow. I just, I mean, a warrant though. Dr. Brian Russell, not only host of Discovery's Fatal Vows, but lawyer as well, a warrant. You walk into a judge, there's a magistrate on duty 24-7, 365. I'm talking Christmas, Easter, Thanksgiving, New Year's. There's always a magistrate on duty 24-7, 365. I'm talking Christmas, Easter, Thanksgiving, New Year's.

There's always a magistrate on duty, period, bam. You can even get a search warrant over the phone. So getting a warrant takes, I mean, I've gotten many, many warrants and wiretaps. You write up an affidavit. You have somebody swear to it. I say um alan dee raise your right hand do you swear what you're about to tell the magistrates the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth so help you god yes i do i assume i can get a yes out of alan on that yes and then you say why do you want her molly's computer records and he'll spit out three five sentences about why

they're vital and the time of the essence. And bam, the judge signs the warrant typically. And that's all it takes. So why are we still waiting on a search of her, for instance, cell phone? Does this mean, Brian, that they haven't been able to triangulate it as to its last ping? I think there are a number of possibilities, Nancy. One thing that I think is good for our listeners to know is that in today's world, we've seen many cases in which the providers of the cell phone and computer services are, you know, they are trying to balance concerns for the individual user's privacy versus concerns for helping law enforcement. And they don't always operate, they don't always make those

decisions the way you and I would, or certainly not as quickly as you and I might. And so this is a tip for people. This is a reason why it is good to utilize some of the apps and programs that are out there that allow your loved ones to be able to see where you are or to go. Basically, what I'm saying is you create a situation in which people can get at your location data without having to go through this process in case, for whatever reason, law enforcement's taking a long time, the company is dragging its feet or being wishy-washy about whether or not they've got enough to release the data. The other thing I just want to say quickly is, the reason I was saying earlier that there's nothing that I can identify so far that this

girl did that would have possibly put herself in any kind of harm's way. The reason that's important is that in the absence of that, in the absence of, you know, she walked home late at night by herself in a dangerous area or something like that where you could say, OK, you know, I can see how a crime of opportunity might have happened. A perpetrator who never planned this at all, but happened to come across her, saw an opportunity and took it. There's nothing like that here, which makes it all the more likely that whoever did something to her, knew about her, knew she was alone in that house and planned to victimize her.

We've just gotten disturbing information. Police are calling off their searches and are saying they are, quote, going in a different direction. What does that mean? Out to Chuck RobertsCrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. What does that mean? It's certainly frustrating for the town folk in Brooklyn and the hundreds and hundreds of volunteers who have been spending days in that cornfield looking for her. You're right. The PowerSheik sheriff says they are pursuing other leads.

He also says that they're scouring the laptop and online messaging. And apparently the FBI has joined the investigation. So maybe the digital forensics requires FBI analysis in one of their laboratories. But you're right. It is it's a mystery why they would call off the searches when they have so many so many volunteers and so much anxiety in that area. I'm trying to read the tea leaves out to you, Ashley Wilcott, a lawyer, judge, founder of childcrimewatch.com. They've actually issued a statement. Am I wrong about that, Jackie? Just show me where you got that information, Jackie. Why would they say we're calling off the search and we're going in a different direction? Let's decipher that, Ashley. So here's my opinion. One of two things. Either number one, they've got some kind

of evidence that they know who did it, person and interest, and who's perhaps disclosed where she is. And so instead of a general search, they're going to go to one area or one place. I hope that's not it. And the alternative, perhaps they've gotten evidence that she has voluntarily left on her own free will, and they're going to locate her. So I'm assuming there's some new evidence. We don't know, and one of those two things is true, or else they would still be searching for her. Well, wait a minute, wait a minute. Let me confirm something with Chuck Roberts.

Chuck, go off on her own. How? Without her glasses, she can't see. She's as blind as a minute. Wait a minute. Let me confirm something with Chuck Roberts. Chuck, go off on her own. How? Without her glasses? She can't see. She's as blind as a bat. Unless she had her contacts on, but you're right. She probably has two means of visual aids. But yeah, that's true. Without her glasses, she's lost. But her boyfriend claims that the glasses were at the home. Well, you know what? I've been looking at pictures of her, Chuck, and there are plenty of pictures of her without glasses. So it's got to be contacts.

But I'm still saying we're handicapped, we're dog bit by not having the time. Nancy, her contacts were found at home. Phil Vetrano saying not only about the red T-shirt, but the contacts at home. I don't know about a lot of people. I don't know about her, but a lot of people that wear contacts have multiple pairs. They like buy them by the box. So I'm wondering if, Phil, that they're saying they found contacts at home, or, for instance, her contacts that you put in those little cases at night and put liquid in them if people still do that.

What's surprising me right now, quote, search called off for Molly Tibbetts, the Iowa college student who vanishes while out for a jog. I'm not convinced that's right. Authorities calling off the search for a missing Iowa student who vanishes while out for a jog. Now, this is according to the sheriff's office no organized search party going on at this time to find the missing 20 year old now we're also learning police are saying they're following other leads following other leads we're also learning police are suggesting she went for the jog at about 10 p.m which is different from going for a jog at 7 p.m now according to the Des Moines Register a neighbor saw her jogging certainly they can confirm the time and that's where we're getting the description of Jim Shorts

black sports bra and running shoes this is after hundreds of volunteers come out, helicopters, the works looking for her. The town is plastered with missing person posters of her. The parents are distraught. We're waiting to find out why would they call off the physical search. To Phil Vetrano, the father of Long Island jogger Karina Vetrano, Phil, what does this say to you? They're going in a different direction. What does that mean? Well, to me, it means they no longer think she is missing by her house, by her home. Either that or they have a suspect. Either that or they actually found her.

You know, it could be one of the above, you know. The tip line is 641-623-5679. I find it very difficult to believe, Dr. Brian Russell, that they could keep a lid on it if they found her body or found her. You know, I do get a feeling, I hope I'm wrong, but I do get a feeling

that they know where she is. So I hope that, as Ashley said, I hope that they know where she is and she's alive in a well somewhere and they just have to catch up with her and figure out what happened. But I have this feeling, it sounds like everybody who knows her well, we'll parcel out the boyfriend for a minute, everybody else who knows her well saying that this is just so totally out of her character to be incommunicado this way. I accept that. And I'm going to say I think that's likely

correct. And so the fact that they are no longer looking around intensively in the area where the jogging allegedly happened, unfortunately suggests to me that they know that that would be fruitless to continue that. And that suggests to me that they know where she is. To Chuck Roberts, Crime Stories investigative reporter, Chuck, it could mean that they have found evidence such as blood evidence, that they have found her phone discarded somewhere far away from the cornfields they've been searching. It could mean any number of things, but don't you think? Well, it could also mean that they've been able to open her laptop and they put together messages

and they have gleaned from those messages that she was unhappy and, you know, wanting to go to California where her dad lives in Oakland. I don't know, but you're right. The fact that they've called off the search and that they're going in a different direction does suggest that there's been a major development. Well, also, when you're saying go to California where her dad is, I mean, if her I.D. was still at the home, if she doesn't have a car, what's she going to take an Uber to California from Iowa? Exactly. That's not going to happen. Yeah. So I've heard nothing about her.

You say her ID, but I'm not sure whether she had credit cards, but maybe they have found some use of her credit cards. I don't know. I'm just guessing. This is the first I'm hearing anyone suggest that she was unhappy. On the contrary, she's just about to move into her own, her first apartment. She's in a happy relationship with the boyfriend. The boyfriend's out of town in Dubuque at work. She's got a job that she's happy about. She was to report the next morning to work to go on a field trip, as Phil Vetrano has told us, with the children that she worked with where she was a

counselor. Phil Vetrano, you've been there. You've lived through this when Karina went missing. Yes. What is the family going through right now? Well, mine was a little different situation. I mean, Karina had an iPhone and we were able to unlock it within an hour because we told Apple that she had asthma and she left without her inhaler. And without her inhaler, she might die. So they unlocked the phone and we pinged it. And that's actually how I found the location.

But it was four hours between she went missing and that I found her. And every second, you know, you felt worse and worse. And as every minute went by, you lost more and more hope. And I knew I was not going to find her alive. And this is going to be a week now, or it's going to be a week on Wednesday. I believe they're going through false hope, if there is hope, because she left her wallet and all her ID home. I believe she was abducted.

And you don't want to believe that as a parent. You always want to hope. I mean, children are missing for 20 years, and their parents are still waiting for them to walk through the door. But that's unrealistic. It's false hope. And it's horrible. After Phil Vetrano's daughter, Karina, goes missing and he discovers her body, he has waged a battle like no other for the courts to allow familial DNA.

For instance, when you find DNA at a crime scene or on a body, it doesn't match anybody in the system. You can then compare it to family members that may be in the system, in jail, having jobs where they had to give DNA, or even through Ancestry.com. Then you find the family member, and that family member leads you to the killer. In many jurisdictions, this is not allowed.

Familial DNA, and thanks to Phil Vetrano, who goes public with his battle, it is now being accepted, and there's really no way for crime victims to thank you. Well, Nancy, what I have to to say and you probably don't know this because i've never told you before when we met on the dr oz show that was december 6th and that was the first public appearance and outcry that i made for familiar dna so i believe that was a great instrument a launching pad for my campaign for Familiar DNA with you and Dr. Oz, because after that, it took off. You know, that was a great media venue for me. And that was the first time was December 6th. I remember it like it was yesterday, Phil. Phil Vetrano with me the father of Long Island Jogger Karina Vetrano Phil, if you could explain

to so many listeners thank God they haven't lived through what you've lived through and explain what Molly's family is going through right now heartbreaking, heartbreaking no sleep

they're just wandering around like zombies and wondering what's going on. Someone hoping that she will turn up, you know, her body is found or there's blood evidence. They still have hope that she will be walking through that door. But, you know, since that moment when she went missing, their lives have changed forever until she does come home. If she never comes home, they're a mere shell of what they once were. Their life is no longer the same. It's something I wish upon no one to feel this. You know, Phil, after my fiancé was murdered, I never saw his body again. I guess at the time I could just emotionally could not take seeing him in a coffin,

seeing him at the medical examiner's office. Do you ever look back and wish you had not been the one to find Karina? No, no, she absolutely positively needed me to find her. She needed her daddy to bring her home. And I would have it no other way, even though every time I close my eyes at night, I see that. You know, I see her. I would have had it, I'd never had it any other way. I needed to find her. A horrible, horrible thing, but no, it needed to be me.

The search, the search for Molly goes on. If you know anything or think you know anything, any small detail, 641-623-5679. Repeat, 641-623-5679. Nancy Grace, grace crime story signing off goodbye friend there's a brand new website causing a lot of trouble for people with something to hide have you ever had a bad feeling about somebody suspect that a partner of cheating worried about your online reputation if you answer yes to any of those questions, you may need Truthfinder. Truthfinder may reveal court records, bankruptcies, contact information, social, dating profiles, assets, and a lot more. You get it all in one easy to read report.

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