Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Nashville Mayor's cemetery sex romps with police bodyguard trigger criminal probe

Episode Date: February 27, 2018

Nashville Mayor Megan Barry admits she had an extramarital affair with her police bodyguard, but investigators want to know if taxpayers picked up the tab for some of her romantic adventures. Nancy Grace looks at the scandal with private investigator and former Nashville police officer Vincent Hill, psychologist & lawyer Dr. Brian Russell -- host of Investigation Discovery's "Fatal Vows" series, Chicago defense lawyer Joel Brodsky, and reporter Pamela Furr. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph, Channel 132. Who said it was wrong to have sex in the cemetery? Okay, well, for me, that is scary, creepy. And plus, just from my point of view, you're likely to get mugged or arm dropped or carjacked in an empty cemetery in the middle of the night. But who am I to judge? It's not a crime. It's a moral issue. I'm not the church lady, but this case is so much bigger than that.

Sex in a cemetery seemingly has rocked the foundation of a political so-called genius. And now it's a crime, an actual crime involved. All from sex and the Cemetery. Actually, it sounds like a horrible mixed alcoholic drink. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. Okay, let's just start at the beginning. Joining me right now from the scene, I hope you're not in the cemetery, Pamela Furr, Crime Stories investigative reporter. Before we get to the crime, why do we care if two nuts sneak off to a cemetery to get it on? I mean, I don't really want to think about it, but now it's been forced

into my psyche. What happened? Right. Well, I mean, you're right. Nobody cares if two people want to do whatever they do. But the reason why we care here, it's the Nashville mayor and her bodyguard. Well, wait a minute. Didn't you see Bodyguard with Kevin Costner Whitney Houston? Didn't you see that? So what's the problem? I don't care what they do. I just really don't want to hear about it. Well, here's the problem. Taxpayers pay this bodyguard. He is an employee of the Metro Nashville Police Department. And a lot of overtime hours were scheduled in the two years that Nashville Mayor Megan Berry admitted to having this affair. She put in more than $170,000 worth of overtime during that time. And so Nashville taxpayers are very upset about this. And now the TBI... Wait a minute, wait a minute. I lost my breath when you said $170,000.

Hold on, let me... Jackie, Jackie, you may need to give me a baby aspirin because now my chest is hurting. Wait a minute. Did you... $170,000 of overtime on top of his regular salary. Correct. Okay. So to me, two, two fiscal, two fiscal years.

So two years here to me, I've got two questions. One, these are yes, no. So let me draw upon my cross examination skills such as they are. Did the mayor sign off on the overtime? She did not, but from my understanding, the police chief did.

And this is her personal bodyguard? Correct. And second, can we show that he charged for his duties, quotey, air quotey, at the time they were, well, there's just really no nice way to say it, having sex in the cemetery. Were those some of the hours or do we know that piece of the puzzle yet? That is the part that the TBI believes is a yes, because he clocked in during the hours that the cemetery activity was taking place. I like the way you said that, Pam, for the cemetery activity. You make it sound like there's somebody like two guys out there in the middle of the day landscaping or arranging flowers, a cemetery activity. That's not what was going on. Joel Brodsky, renowned defense attorney, known best for his defense of the killer, the wife killer, Drew Peterson.

Don't take that the wrong way, Joel Brodsky. Joel Brodsky joel brodsky joining me you have quite the reputation and the um let me just say history of dealing with corruption what what do you have to say i mean when we when i first said sex in the cemetery it sounds almost laughable but now that i found out somebody's getting paid about 200 grand for it that's a whole nother can of worms you know my mother joel brodsky 86 years old still teaches piano lessons to make a living and i don't take kindly to somebody stealing from the taxpayers yeah i mean clearly that's you know it's like a larceny, like a theft.

But in public corruption cases, what you have to watch out for is the difference between what's a criminal act or if we're just taking some regulation that's created in somebody's job and then saying if you violate a rule of your job, all of a sudden that's a felony. Because that allows, you know, people who just, employers who make rules to now all of a sudden legislate crime. Wait a minute. Wait a minute, Joel Brodsky. Hold on. Hold on. It's a whole other can of worms. If it's a private corporation and somebody's padding their expense report. Oh, I had a three martini lunch here with this one and that one, and it cost me $400 because we went to Jean Georges in New York City. And okay, that's one thing that's

bad. But what about when you're defrauding the taxpayers? Now that is a crime where the other one is, I guess I would call it a tax violation. I mean, there's a big difference when you're defrauding the taxpayers versus your private employer. Well, I guess maybe I'm getting a little bit technical, but what was he, you know, if he was putting in overtime knowing that he was not going to be, you know, doing his job as a bodyguard at the time when he was doing the overtime, that would, you know, doing his job as a bodyguard at the time when he was doing the overtime, that would, you know, be theft. But if... Okay, wait a minute, wait a minute, Jackie Howard, you're going to have to control yourself. Jackie is here making very, very inappropriate jokes

and writing inappropriate comments on her whiteboard at me while I'm trying to focus on crime. You know what? There's no doubt it went down. Okay, that's not a good choice of words. There's no doubt it happened. Listen to this. I, as a public official, have had a private event in my with a member of my security detail, and I am deeply sorry for that.

And I am embarrassed, and I am sad, and I am so sorry for all the pain that I have caused my family and his family. And I know that God will forgive me, but that Nashville doesn't have to. And I hope that I can earn their trust and I can earn your trust back and that you will forgive me. What I did was wrong. I should not have had an affair. I would have had the security detail with me as part of my mayor responsibilities, regardless of who that person was, but I should not have had that affair. Is it possible that you could have, once the affair started, maybe relieve him of his duties or ask him to resign because you caused yourself so much problems by having this affair while he was still on duty i mean you understand now all these

these normal things like a trip to blank now get scrutiny like it'll never get before every single trip every meal every hotel bill it was wrong and i and i should have gone to the chief, and I should have said what was happening, and I should have made a better decision about that. But everything that Sergeant Forrest did in the course of his responsibility to be my detail was business-related. I think as a public official and with the conversations that were starting to swirl, it was clear that our personal lives were going to become public. And we had made a serious mistake and we needed to step up and we needed to own it. And that's what I'm doing today. I will look forward to continuing to work for Nashvillians. We have an agenda in this office that is robust, and we have been focused on transit and housing and education, and we'll continue to do that.

I think that today I'm here to admit that I have personal failings. I am only human, and I didn't stop being a human when I became the mayor. And I believe that as the mayor, I've been able to do a lot of really good things in this city with the Metro Council and with the people I work with. And I have disappointed them terribly. And that is my biggest sadness today. Okay, so to Dr. Brian Russell, you know, it's going to take me the rest of the hour

to explain all of his credentials. No offense, Brodsdsky Furrin Hill but Dr. Brian Russell psychologist and lawyer host of the hit show on Discovery ID Fatal Vows and as if that weren't enough for one person he informed me just before we go to air that he also wrote a book called Stop Moaning and Start Owning. I really like that title. I wish I could steal it, but sadly now I know about it. Dr. Brian Russell, I mean, you deal with disastrous relationships. Obviously, this is a disaster in the making. I mean, Dr. Brian Russell, I guess I'm going through life with blinders on, but I don't want to look at another guy.

I don't want to get involved. I don't want to even know about another guy. Period. I'm in it to win it. Okay, I learned that at Dancing with the Stars. Everybody else was saying it, so I started saying it too. I'm in it to stay. I don't even want to be tempted. You know, I want to find happiness in my own home with my children, my husband, my 86-year-old

mother who lives with me, a cat and a dog and two guinea pigs. With all that on my plate, I don't have time to look at another guy. Dr. Brian Russell, I mean, people get tempted all the time. That doesn't mean you have to follow through with it. And it's great that you don't want to because let me tell you, Nancy, if somebody wanted to be on my show, if somebody wanted to be on Fatal Vows, getting involved in an extramar the public because it exposes the politician to blackmail. And the kind of a person who would rationalize and justify cheating on their spouse may very well also be the kind of a person who would rationalize and justify doing some kind of a favor for a blackmailer rather than leaving office. Now, hold on. You're making a giant leap legally. Dr. Brian Russell, host of I.D.'s Fatal Vows, to say because she would go have sex in a cemetery with the bodyguard while he's charging overtime, according to reports. OK, that's got to be proven

that she would be open to blackmail. I don't think we've gotten as far as a blackmail. What I'm saying is people get tempted. No offense, guys, but it's usually guys. I'll just put it out there. That's just an anecdote. I don't have a statistic, but they get tempted all the time. That doesn't mean you've got to follow through. That's where impulse control comes from.

Vincent Hill, former Nashville police officer. He knows this beat and now a very well-known private eye. Vincent Hill, how do you go about actually proving the nuts and bolts of this thing? Well, Nancy, you talk about secret service. Boy, were there some secrets going on here. But I think it'd be pretty easy to determine if Rob Fortz, who I knew personally on the police department, was submitting overtime while he was actually engaging in sexual acts with the mayor. powder kegs for this you have police officer and women find police officers attractive it's about power you have the mayor she's about power so you have these two high-powered individuals who unfortunately took advantage of taxpayer dollars and did not fulfill their duties while they said they were doing it's very very disturbing so you know this guy? You know the bodyguard? Well, we definitely didn't hang out, but I knew of him.

He had been on the department, you know, years before I joined. You know, I wouldn't suspect him of doing this. But again, you never know. And as you say, people get tempted all the time, especially us as guys, like you said. So it's definitely not a surprise that it could have happened this is what we know the nashville mayor megan berry has admitted having an extramarital affair with sergeant rob forest her bodyguard the nashville mayor's bodyguard well they don't have to work too hard at proving it the mayor is caught on camera in the early morning hours

in cemetery visits with her bodyguard lover while he claimed overtime and nude photos apparently found on his work phone i mean you know back to you dr brian russell psychologist and lawyer they're not really even trying to cover it up. I mean, what idiot would send nude photos? This is the biggest question that I get asked in these cases. Why would someone smart enough to get to the high level position be dumb enough then to jeopardize everything by doing stuff like that to get caught cheating. And you think about, you know, you go back to Bill Clinton, you look at this woman in Nashville, you can list a lot of them. And it really comes down to the narcissistic entitlement

in the personality. They surround themselves with sycophants and yes, men, they rationalize that their achievements and sacrifices for us, the masses are so wonderful that they're entitled to do things, which by the way, they would never tolerate being done to themselves. And here you go. And it does, it really does make them not just narcissistically entitled, but it really does make them susceptible, vulnerable to blackmail. Because if somebody finds out about this, you know, they can be threatened with disclosure unless they do something for the person who finds out. Well, this is what else we know. Pamela Furge joined me, Crime Stories investigative reporter.

Now, I love this. Okay. The footage, the surveillance footage shows her white SUV entering the graveyard, usually around 7 a.m. On several occasions during their two-year sex affair before she heads to the back of the graveyard, sometimes re-emerging in about 12 minutes. Okay. Now, I'm just gonna, that's not a crime, of course, but I'm just gonna let that sink in for a moment. But listen to this. Listen to what her spokesperson says. Quote, sometimes she would go for a walk. Other times, she would sit in the car and either reflect, make calls, catch up on emails, or report issues with vandalism in a cemetery. Okay, then the nude photos emerge. Pamela Furr, please take a listen to the mayor herself insisting that people still want her on the job. Listen.

Why not take a leave of absence? Why not just? I have lots of work to do in this city, and every day I get up and I do it. And today is a great example. We are here cutting a ribbon on affordable housing. And that's what the voters asked me to do when I ran two years ago, and that's what I'm going to do. Can your administration survive? Can your administration survive everything that's come out in the last week? You know, I've been very forthcoming with

everything, and I think that the citizens of Davidson County continue to want us to get up every day and go to work, and I have a great team. We have great Metro employees who get up every day and make sure that this city runs. I want to continue to do that. To Pamela Furr. Pamela, what do we know? Well, we know that there is now a move on to recall the mayor. There is a process through Metro government, and so it takes 60,000 signatures to start that process, and it has begun. Nashvilleians are not very happy with the affair. They're not very happy of the alleged possible criminal wrongdoing. But more importantly, now they're embarrassed about cemetery sex and nude photos, which, by the way, Rob Forrest not only allegedly took with his phone, but he also emailed to himself to his Metro Police email account, which is so reckless and careless.

Oh, man. Joel Brodsky, high-profile defense attorney. Joel Brodsky, he emailed all of this to his work email? It's like he's begging to be caught yeah it is but is it you know is it is it a crime because i remember one time i had a case where a police officer had you know there was a rule police officers aren't supposed to go outside of their zone their beat during during hours and a guy went outside his zone and they all do all the time you know to go out to lunch or whatever but in this case he did something that they didn't like so they they accused him of of

official misconduct which is a crime and the appellate court said that's not a crime uh despite making work rules you cannot criminalize work violations so you know bad overtime or uh improper emailing we have to make sure. I mean, why they could be work violations, why they can't be grounds for removing somebody from office, perhaps, if the voters don't like it. But is it a crime? You know, is this what we want? Do we want to give employers, even if they're municipalities, the power to criminalize actions without the state legislature doing it. And that is a concern I have, why obviously the behavior is inappropriate and probably should result in their,

especially if the overtime, result in their removal from office. I just am concerned that we're making too many things criminal. Well, that's spoken like a true criminal defense attorney. Now, Forrest had served in the police force for 31 years. He led security details for three mayors. He accompanied Mayor Berry on out-of-town trips beginning in June 2016, nine trips in 2017, claiming they were all for legitimate business purposes. Now, Barry has told USA Today that their affair began in spring 2016, but has declined to say when it ended. We know that the cop has stepped down

and is no longer with the department. Now, this is another thing I know. Photos were discovered, as we pointed out, on Forrest's work email, according to official filings, 260 deleted chats between Forrest's phone and the mayor's phone, and 35 deleted call logs, according to the affidavit. To Vincent Hill, former Nashville police officer where all of this occurred, and current PI, private investigator, sounds like he's trying to get rid of evidence. Yeah, that's exactly what it sounds like, Nancy. But unfortunately, you, as well as I know, that you can delete something doesn't mean it can't be found. And, you know, the fact that he was sending this on a work email, as secure as that's supposed to be,

because you're supposed to talk about cases and things of that nature. You know, there's a big problem there, big problem. So what happens now, back to Pamela Furr, Crime Stories investigative reporter, what's the rest on the legal end? Well, on the legal end, the mayor is asking for the DA, Glenn Funk here, to recuse himself from this case. He's the one that called for the investigation. So there's a DA's office investigation, a TBI investigation. The DA's office, his budget comes before the mayor. She has to approve it. So she thinks he should recuse himself altogether. She

called for that on Friday. Here is what the mayor has to say. We actually, Glenn Funk raised this issue to my attorney last week. He was concerned about a potential conflict of interest. We took that very seriously when he said that, and we did our due diligence. We got the head of the Tennessee Bar Association to give an opinion on that. He absolutely says that Glenn has a conflict and should recuse and that there is precedent out there based on other case law. We take that very seriously. We wanted that opinion because Glenn had raised it. Back to Pamela Furr, Crime Stories investigative reporter. What's the rest?

The other, as far as the investigation goes, there are rumors that possible indictments could come down this week. Those are just rumors, but the investigation continues from a criminal standpoint of theft of property is what they're investigating and official misconduct, which are taken care of with the state legislature. They have those laws here in Tennessee. The other part of this, Rob Forrest's wife has now filed for divorce. That happened on Friday. So now you've got that investigation going on as well. She left him officially, according to the divorce documents, on February the 1st, the day after it was announced there was this affair, and she filed for divorce on Friday.

And you have the city council also investigating the mayor for official misconduct through the Metro investigation. So there's a special committee with the Metro City Council. So there's four different investigations going on right now with Mayor Megan Berry. I'm deeply sorry, and I made a mistake. And I am human, and I have human failings. As I said, I didn't stop being human when I became the mayor, and I deeply regret this. And my hope is that as we continue to do the good work of the city, that the Nashvillians who have always expected me to do what's best for our city will continue to have that expectation. Let me just pause as we discuss. I never thought I'd say these words, sex in the

cemetery. Again, it sounds like a horrible alcoholic drink, but it deals with the public. It deals with people that work every day like us and expect our leaders that we elect and we pay to behave themselves and focus on our business during work hours at the very least. The thought of my mother still teaching piano at her age and somebody sucking up taxpayer money so they can have sex in a cemetery, $200,000 of overtime, uh-uh. I want to thank our sponsor making this and all our investigations possible at sirius xm 132 it's legal zoom you all know small business is a hot topic this year national small business month at legal zoom is perfect timing whether you're just

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during National Small Business Month. Don't miss it. Check out LegalZoom.com today. Special savings when you enter code Nancy, N-A-N-C-Y in the referral box at checkout. LegalZoom, where life meets legal. LegalZoom.com, thank you for being our sponsor and our partner today on Series XM 132. And I'm very embarrassed and I'm deeply ashamed and I'm very sorry. Sorry, but when I had an extramarital affair since I've been in the mayor's office,

and I have hurt a lot of people. We are live in Nashville today, and the latest regarding a lady mayor married who apparently was having a sex affair with her chief bodyguard in a cemetery in early morning hours and charging the taxpayers to boot. Now, that is an issue that will have to be determined. It's alleged right now. Megan Berry has long been viewed as rising within the Democratic Party and insists she does not want this affair to impact the Me Too movement in any way since this was between consenting adults. I mean, I don't know at this point if she can be a rising star in any party,

but that's really not my concern. My concern is, was there a crime committed? Here is what the mayor has to say. It was inappropriate for us to have this affair, but I think that when we talk about the Me Too movement and those conversations, I think I want to be clear because I don't want to muddy the Me Too movement. The Me Too movement is about women who have been sexually harassed and economically disadvantaged for hundreds of years. This is about two middle-aged consenting adults who had feelings for each other, and were human and had failings. I think I'm going to go back and say this again.

This is a consensual relationship between two middle-aged people who had feelings for each other. And what we did was wrong. I'm not running away from that. But this is not the Me Too movement. This is not about sexually harassing and economically disadvantaging women, which is what that's about. Now, Joel Brodsky thinks that this is no violation of criminal statutes. To Dr. Brian Russell, psychologist, lawyer, and host of Fatal Vows, as well as author of Stop Moaning and Start Owning. Talk about entitlement, okay? They're married

and they think they won't get caught meeting in a public cemetery and then coming up with that ridiculous story that she goes there to reflect. Dr. Russell, I mean, sending each other, sending photos, naked photos, deleting chats. I mean, they of all people should know that this is a powder keg waiting to blow up. Well, absolutely. And as much as I don't want to defend this guy, either one of them, the lawyer in me has to point out that, you know, the best defense that the bodyguard might over time and to direct to me where to be, told me all this was fine. But absolutely, it's total narcissistic entitlement driving this. It's why people who seem so smart in some respects do such dumb things in other respects. The TBI, the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, says it obtained nude photos of a woman taken on the phone

of Sergeant Rob Forrest. Evidence, investigators say, shows that the mayor engaged in that affair with her bodyguard. She is saying she doesn't know whether it's her. But there is the issue of a black

purse, Pamela Furr. Why does a black purse Pamela Furr why does a black purse factor into these nude photos apparently in the nude photo the black purse was laying beside this woman who was partially clothed here and it was laying beside her on the bed. It's my understanding that there has been a picture maybe two hours later of her at an event with that same exact purse. It looks like the same exact purse. So that's what investigators are saying could prove that he, during the hours that he clocked in, that he was on duty, he took the picture. And then two hours later, there she is with the same purse. And that again, that's what they're saying.

Pamela, for her, she insists she's cooperating. Listen to this, Pamela. We have absolutely cooperated with the TBI. We said we would. We have been the original affidavit. We asked for that so that we could see what the underlying piece was. The district attorney denied us that. We didn't see that until it was already given to the press, so we needed to review it. And then after having spent time

with the director of the TBI, we got the assurances that we need. We have always been cooperating with them. We've given them over thousands of pages of documents, and we're continuing to cooperate. Pamela, if she violates the public trust and possibly a law that's yet to be determined, I guess what, she wants the gold star for cooperating, is that correct? She wants the gold star, but evidence shows that she was not cooperating at all at first. She was refusing. She handed over her cell phone because that was requested in the search warrant, but she would not turn over the passcode to actually open that phone.

Her attorney was trying to negotiate terms, which she says she felt was reasonable that they would not look at her personal text messages and photos of her son, who, by the way, passed away not too very long ago. Also, messages with her mother, with her sisters, with her family, with her husband. She didn't want any of that looked at. She just wanted messages that had to do with the investigation. The TBI said, no, we have to look at all of it. And so she refused for quite a while to give that passcode until the end of the day. I mean, people were blasting her for that, being hypocritical, saying she's cooperating when she wasn't.

That's right. The mayor's office contended certain information and documents relating to the two-year affair should be kept from the public. Pamela, for what happened to her son? Her son actually passed away back in the summer from an accidental drug overdose. He had been having some problems anyway with drugs, and he took way too many and ended up passing away. So at first the question was, was she going to that cemetery by chance to visit her son? Well, her son's not buried there. Her son was cremated, and so she still has the ashes, hasn't actually interred those ashes yet. And so that was the first question that popped up. Maybe she really is going for silent reflection to visit her son, but he's not buried there. So that's not the case at all. And some had said, you know, maybe because of this, the death, tragic death of her son, maybe this is why she engaged in the

affair. But the affair happened long before her son passed away. You can't give her any of those benefits of the doubt. Mayor Berry tells Nashville News Channel 5 that it is her son's death that helps her keep what is going on right now in perspective. Listen. You know the political world. Yeah. There may be some people who say she cannot govern. She must resign. What do you say to them?

No. No. This is a bad day. I'm going to have a lot more bad days coming up. I've already had my worst day. And I know the difference between a mistake and a tragedy. And this is a mistake. And I think that we've been able to show in this administration over the last two years that we've done a lot of really good things, and that's going to continue to be my focus. What happens now, back to the information and records the mayor's office has declined to release, include the number of employees in her office who have been involved responding to the unfolding scandal instead of their usual duties for the taxpayers. The hours they spent on the scandal. All these employees are paid by taxpayers.

Written communications between the mayor, her aides, and officials in the police department about the affair. State law gives members of the public the right to review government records, including texts and emails involving public officials. They are refusing to release written communications between the mayor, her aides, and a private individual working on behalf of the mayor that reference to the affair. She keeps saying we'll give any records over to anyone who would like them in a news conference where she admitted the affair, but it hasn't been that easy.

It's been more like pulling a tooth to Joel Brodsky, defense attorney. So what do you make of it? Will there be some sort of a prosecution or no? Probably. Probably under a theft theory, it would sound to me that there would be. Now, that's $100,000 theft. It's probably a felony. So it's a serious crime. I don't know if it's putting anybody in jail but i i wouldn't be surprised to uh to see something along those lines i don't know about official misconduct because

it has to be violation of a law as opposed to a rule or a regulation but um yeah i could i could see a theft charge here and i think it'd be very difficult to beat if you could show that he knowingly put in a request for overtime pay for a time when he knew he was involved in a tryst with the mayor. It would be a difficult case to defend, except if you could definitively show that he knowingly put in a time slip for a period when he knew he was not working. Yeah. Well, what I see, Vincent Hill with me, private eye and former national police officer in this very jurisdiction, the search affidavits and warrants state that state statutes for misconduct of public officials and employees, as well as theft of property.

Now, what do you make of theft of property charges, Vincent Hill? How will that be supported by the law? Well, I think you have all the elements of that, Nancy. I mean, you're submitting these documents for this overtime, which turns out to be false. And anything over, I believe, $500 last I remember is considered a felony in Nashville. And we're talking about $170,000 worth. So, you know, for Rob, it's definitely not looking that great for him. Not only is he going through a divorce now, he's possibly looking at some serious jail time as well. Well, here's my issue. Back to Joel Brodsky, the photos taken without the mayor's knowledge. She's claiming she didn't know about these photos.

That seems, those allegations seem to be the most serious to me of what's being alleged right now. What do you think of that? Well, yeah, obviously, you know, and this happens more and more with the new technologies, cell phones, everybody has cameras, of taking pictures of people in compromising situations in places where, you know, normally you wouldn't expect for your photograph to be taken. So they have an invasion of privacy issue there that has been criminalized in a lot of jurisdictions. If unknowingly taking nude photographs of a woman without their knowledge or consent is morally wrong, but potentially criminally wrong. Listen. You mentioned that those pictures were taken, if they were of you, they were taken without your permission. Are you prepared to press charges against her? I haven't seen the pictures, and so I don't know what they contain.

I don't know what that looks like. And at the moment, that's not what my focus is. My focus is on dealing with this investigation and cooperating with the TBI. So what about that? Did Dr. Brian Russell, psychologist, lawyer, and host of Discovery ID's Fatal Vows, you know, you deal with relationship issues that end in crime. What about if she's telling the truth that these nude photos, assuming they're her, and based on the black pocketbook, they are, unknowingly taking nude photos. That is a crime, I believe, Dr. Brian Russell, but you have to see it all the time.

Well, and it's absolutely not surprising that the person who would do the other things that this guy allegedly did, you know, well, it's hard to sympathize much with this woman in this case because of her culpability in this. If you think about just the guy and the taking of the pictures, it's not hard at all. It's not much of a stretch from the kind of a person who would engage in all of the other things we've been talking about to also then engage in that, which is why you don't want to get involved with a person like that. You know, everybody, when they think about cheating, they just think about, you know, how bad it is for the spouse to be betraying their spouse. Well, you know what? The other people involved in these affairs, even if they're

not married, usually are not a lot more moral people. I mean, almost always they know that the person they're involved with is cheating on a spouse and they don't care. A lot of times there are kids involved. They don't care about that either. So, you know, what a surprise that she got involved with this guy and he turns out to, if he did, turns out to have victimized her in this way with the pictures. What a shocker. Well, here's the other thing. Legally, Joel Brodsky, for instance, if a cop is walking along and they see open in your car a bag of Coke, that is not an illegal search. Because any pedestrian can look in your car and see that.

That's just the cop hasn't done anything wrong. In this case, if she claims that the naked photos violated her privacy, she's, according to allegations, having sex in a public area that anybody walking by could have seen. So the photos aren't anything that a passerby couldn't see. Well, we don't know where those photos were taken. I don't know if they were taken in the cemetery or perhaps when they were on one of their quote-unquote business trips or monkey business trips. It could have been taken there. Obviously, if they were taken in the public place and they're having sex in a public place,

I think that may also be a crime, even though I don't know if it's a very serious one. Oops, another crime. That's right. Yeah. I mean, clearly, if they're taking the photos in a place where she had no expectation of privacy, then it wouldn't be a criminal act to take the photos then. So, Pamela, where does it stand now? Again, where it stands now is that you've got four different investigations going on. My sources say there could be some indictments handed down this week from the DA's office. And at this point, she's refusing to resign. There is a divorce that's starting to happen. Rob Forrest seems to be out of the public eye. Nancy, Sergeant Forrest did

release a statement through his attorney. I'll read it. For over 31 years, I've been honored to serve in the Metropolitan Nashville Police Department. I devoted 14 years of that time supervising the mayor's protective detail during three administrations. I deeply regret that my professional relationship with Mayor Barry turned into a personal one. This has caused great pain for my wife, my family, friends, and colleagues. At no time did I ever violate my oath as a police officer or engage in actions that would abuse the public trust. I have recently retired from the police department. I hope that the media and public respect my privacy and that of my family as I seek to rebuild the trust of the ones I love the most. That's where it stands. And Nashville is embarrassed at this point.

Well, here's the other thing. Men do it all the time. And they get away with it. And they continue successful political careers and all sorts of careers. I'm not saying that's a good thing. But is she being more persecuted because she's a woman? Or does it have to do with the overtime and stealing from the taxpayers? That's the big question. And that is a question that I will say Nashville voters,

that's what they care about. They honestly don't care about the sex. Now listen to what the mayor tells Nashville News Channel 5. Were all of those legitimate business trips? Absolutely, every single one of them. And if it hadn't been Sergeant Forrest, who would have been traveling with me as detail, there would have been other detail traveling with me. The detail security policy is set by the police department, and they say I have to travel with security. Some people will look at that and say that taxpayers are paying for this relationship.

What would you say to them? I think what this reflects is, again, the policy that the police have about making sure that when I'm working that I have detail. And I don't think it's a secret that I do work a lot and I do have a pretty aggressive schedule. Was he getting paid by taxpayer at any point when you all were having your personal time? No. How can taxpayers know that all of that overtime was completely legitimate? I think that the records will show if you look at my schedule versus his overtime, you will see that my schedule reflects that I was out there working.

When it comes to the city of Nashville, you were Sergeant Forrest's boss. Why did you not say at some point, if I'm going to have this relationship, he needs to be removed from my detail? That was a mistake, and I should have. So that was a failure as the mayor? That was a failure from a personal perspective to say, you know, this is something that's happening, and I should remedy this. I mean, what I should have done is not remedy him being a part of my security detail, whether or not I should have owned up and not had the affair. Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, signing off. Goodbye, friend.

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