Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Natalee Holloway update; child dies as mom gets high; Texas realtor goes missing

Episode Date: August 30, 2017

Natalee Holloway's parents wait as a forensics expert performs tests on what may be their daughter's bones. Investigative reporter Art Harris, medical examiner Dr. William Morrone and Nancy Grace discuss the process of confirming if the missing Alabama woman has been found in an Aruba grave. Reporter Drew Nelson joins Grace and Morrone to talk about a mom who allegedly was high on heroin while her child choked on a car seat belt. Grace also details the search for a Texas woman who went missing just before Hurricane Harvey hit Houston. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. plus job sites with one click and then their powerful technology matches the right people to your job better than anybody else. And that's why ZipRecruiter is different. Unlike other job sites, ZipRecruiter does not depend on candidates finding you. It finds them. In fact, over 80% of jobs posted on ZipRecruiter. Get a qualified candidate in just 24 hours. You heard me right, 24 hours. No juggling emails or calls to your office. You just simply screen, rate, and manage candidates all in one place with ZipRecruiter's easy-to-use dashboard.

Find out today why ZipRecruiter has been used by businesses of all sizes to find the most qualified job candidates with immediate results. Right now, our listeners can post jobs on ZipRecruiter for free. F-R-E-E. That's right, free. Go to ZipRecruiter.com slash Nancy Grace. ZipRecruiter.com Nancy Grace. ZipRecruiter.com, Nancy Grace, ZipRecruiter.com slash Nancy Grace. One more time to try it for free. Go to ZipRecruiter.com slash Nancy Grace.

ZipRecruiter. Thanks so much for being our partner. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph, Channel 132. 2005, on the small island of Aruba, Natalie Holloway was with friends at a local bar where she was last seen getting a ride with Euron Vandersloat. Natalie's disappearance remains a mystery. Her dad says that he, in a private eye, found human remains in Aruba. We took those remains and had those remains tested and they just returned last week that they're human remains. Will there be able to be some kind of test, Dave, that will answer

once and for all whether this is Natalie's? We're in the process of doing a DNA test. Dave Holloway says that a friend of a man who was once suspected in her disappearance tipped him off. I know that there's a possibility that this could be someone else, and I'm just trying to wait and see. Your daughter goes on her senior trip. Everything's fine. Heavily chaperoned. She has a sunny disposition. She's surrounded by friends that seemingly won't leave her side when she's at home, the next thing you hear, she doesn't make her playing back. You never see your daughter dead or alive again. That's what has happened, the fate of the parents of Natalie Holloway. And at this hour, is there new hope in the case?

I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. Quote, I hope we can bring peace and justice to Natalie's family. This from a forensic scientist that I'm calling Dr. Bones. This guy's name is Dr. Jason Kalowski, and he is now working with Natalie Holloway's parents, Dave and Beth Holloway, to hopefully end this 12-year case. Now, this is a break. We now learn that a saliva sample from the mother, Beth Holloway, has been used. She gave a buccal swab. That saliva sample from Beth has been used. She gave a buccal swab. That saliva sample from Beth has been tested. That is going to be compared to bones that we have been directed to. And as it turns out,

this informant, Art Harris, Emmy award-winning reporter joining us who covered the case in Aruba along with me when Natalie first went missing. In a prior podcast on the Natalie Holloway case on Wednesday, August 30th, we mistakenly identified a person named Gabriel as someone Nancy had previously interviewed when the Holloway case was ongoing. And we made comments about Gabriel thinking he was the person Nancy had interviewed before. In fact, the person named Gabriel is not that person. Nancy Grace and Crime Stories apologize for the confusion. But aside from Gabriel, what does this mean that they brought in Dr. Jason Kalowski?

With me is Art Harris, investigative reporter and a renowned medical examiner joining me out of Madison Heights, Wisconsin, Dr. William Maroney, the author of a brand new book, American Narcan. Okay, Art, what about this doctor? Why has he been brought in, this specialist? What does he know that other doctors may not know? Dr. Kowalski worked at Ground Zero after 9-11. He's an expert on the DNA that you described, mitochondrial DNA. It comes from the mother. They have Beth Holloway saliva, and that is what they use to trace these bone fragments found in Aruba to someone from an Eastern European heritage. That's Natalie. So they have narrowed it to something generic or general.

They know it's a woman. They know she's from Eastern Europe. Now they've got to get a more definitive answer about Natalie, and that is what this Dr. Kalofsky is doing, similar testing to what he did with remains at Ground Zero and other accidents. That's pretty impressive. I was there in New York the day of 9-1-1, September 11, and I'll never forget it as long as I live. And to the brave heroes that worked Ground Zero, God bless them. And now he's back,

back on the scene. Joining me, renowned medical examiner, Dr. William Maroney. Dr. Maroney, I can't get away, though, that this is based on something that we have gotten sideways through Tom, then Dick, then Harry, including Gabriel. Take a listen to what this informant Gabriel had to say. I've been undercover working with John. He is not a person that you want to be around, because he's not mentally stable. To get more out of John, I actually started living with him three months ago. That's when he told me everything.

How did you meet him? How? Well, before I ever moved to Aruba, my aunt gave me an opportunity to move to her house there and take care of business for a while and live alone. So I took the opportunity and went. And I meet your aunt. We bumped into each other one day.

He gave me his number, and we ended up chilling and s***. He was my friend at the beginning, but then I found out what kind of individual he really, really was. She should rot in her grave over what she did to my guy, putting him in jail for all these years. I should piss on her f***ing grave for that s***. It's really hard to listen to somebody talk that way, you know? He disgusts me.

Because me as a father, I have two girls, And if I was in Dave Holloway's position, I would do anything to try to find my daughter. You guys do not know what it is to live with John. So bottom line, Dr. William Maroney, the bones will speak for themselves, but we are partially relying on tricking somebody, an undercover person being mic'd up and getting somebody to talk about the night Natalie Holloway's body was supposedly disposed of. Dr. Maroney, you're the expert.

Explain to me how a buccal swab, a saliva swab from her mother is going to identify these bones? Well, you need genetic material. You need material from the nucleus of cells. That's the center of the cell that contains all the information, how things are reproduced and replicated and re-manufactured in the cells over and over. And they use a buccal swab because we don't like blood tests for this because red blood cells don't have a nucleus. They have one when they're first manufactured and then they get rid of it. So that's not a good

cell. The only reason we did blood testing in the beginning is genetics came from blood labs um and then we soon learned that that was the wrong cell and buccal cells are going to have that nucleus everybody learns in biology that every cell has a nucleus and that's where the genetic material is and maternal dna from the mitochondria is shorter and easier to repeat. If I had to give you like a picture in your head, mitochondrial DNA is like a bowl of SpaghettiOs, and regular DNA flopping around is like a big long bowl full of mixed up, tied up knots of linguini. And SpaghettiOs are easier to manufacture and study than tied up knots of linguini. That's the difference pictorially of regular DNA versus mitochondrial DNA. And the most important part of that is all of those SpaghettiOs,

whether you're a man or a woman, are inherited from the mother only. And that's why it's an easier match. And this DNA expert has got some of the credentials from really good schools out of New York, and he's been a crime scene investigator. And mitochondrial DNA in the last 10 years has really become more standard. It was way too experimental 15 or 20 years ago. Well, learn something else, Dr. Maroney. According to Dr. Jason Kalowski, he's analyzing bone fragments.

I thought that full bones were found art harris i thought they found bones that they knew were human bones but this says he's analyzing bone fragments i mean what do we know art about where the bones were found and the condition of the bones what we know is that this informant was friends with jordan vandersuit's good friend who helped him bury the body. You're telling me that he secretly wired himself to get this guy, John Tom, to confess about hiding the body, right? Dave Holloway, they go to this remote area and they do a dig and they come back with, as you said, fragments, bone fragments that the Aruba prosecutors dismiss as animal bones, Nancy, but they apparently did not do the testing as they never have.

And so these were secreted out of the country and tested and determined to be human remains, according to Dave Holloway's scientist. And then those human remains were traced, as we've discussed, to a woman of Eastern European descent giving hope that it could be Natalie. So that's what they're waiting for now. Well, hold on. I want to go back and visit an issue. You know, I don't have any use at all for the government in Aruba, none whatsoever, because these prosecutors, A, when the family came down there desperate to find their daughter,

they didn't so much as lift a finger to help them. Everything was a dead end, and they let Paulus Vandersloot, Vandersloot's father, who was a judge in Aruba, cover up the whole thing. Now they're claiming that this wasn't human bones. These were not human bones that Dave Holloway, Natalie's dad, found. But here I've got Dave Holloway, her father, saying it's human bones. And Dr. William Maroney, you kind of know this doctor, Jason Kalowski. He is saying not only are they human bones, but it's a female of Eastern European descent.

So who am I going to believe? The prosecutors that, you know, you got to take what they say with a box of salt, okay? Not a dab, not a spoon, but a box of salt. And I'm going to believe them over Dave Holloway and a guy that even you, Dr. Maroney, seem to respect. Yeah, I think what's really important is he comes with the credentials and at least 10 or 15 years of good experience. He started out as a crime scene investigator in New

York. And oftentimes we see people after months and months or years and they are remains. They are not intact skeletons and there's nothing there. Why would a leg bone that's been buried suddenly turn into fragments? I don't understand that. Part of that comes in the decay process, there are animals and insects later in the last stage of decay that gnaw, separate, and sequester bones away. So it's not a biological problem where it breaks down. Or the victim was chopped up. And you have to be able to see those if they took bones out of the country and they find blade and serrated marks on the bones then we'll know that you're in vander

sloot cutting in natalie holloway into pieces to get her into a car into a a truck. I pray to God, I pray to God that the Holloways are not listening to this. Go ahead, Arne. To support that, Nancy, this so-called Gabriel, this witness and friend of Jorn Vandersloot reported that the judge, his father, came to the beach where Natalie supposedly had OD'd or choked on her own vomit after taking GHB, slipped to her by Yorne Vanderson. There she is on the beach, unconscious, and then dies, according to this witness.

The father says she's dead, Yorne. He then helps put her into a burlap bag he's brought from the house and has to push her and bend her over to get her into the bag and then into the trunk,ap bag he's brought from the house and has to push her and bend her over to get her into the bag and then into the trunk and then it's off to the forest to dig the hole and that is supposedly where they found her after this guy goes back to the original place marked by a cactus and takes the remains to a forest and that is where okay you lost me art i i you know hold on you got me as far as you believe judge paul's vandersloot shows up with a burlap bag bends her and contorts her to put her in the bag said okay says she's dead puts her in the bag and then what did you say about a cactus

slow it down man slow it down okay nancy so after that. Okay, Nancy. So after that, Jorn directs his son to put the body in the trunk and drive to a remote area, dig a hole and mark that spot by a cactus. And according to this documentary, tells him don't ever say a word to anybody about this.

But later, he feels a need to move the body and recruits this guy. Who is he? Jorn or Paulus? J he feels a need to move the body and recruits this guy. Who is he? Yorn or Paulus? Yorn feels a need. He feels he's got to move the body and find this friend, Ludwig, who then goes and digs it up with him. And they take it to another area and bury the bones, bury the body that are now turned into fragments.

And this was done with the help of, then the witness that we have hears the story and tells the father and investigator, T.J. Ward. That leads them to this spot. They've harvested these fragments and they have gotten them out of the country. And contrary to what the women authorities say, they are human remains, not animal remains. So that is what's being analyzed. We won't know the results until sometime next month. You know, Dr. William Maroney, joining me along with Art Harris, Dr. Maroney, you know what really burned me up, another thing, is that while all of this is going on with the father tromping as far away as Nicaragua to find out about his daughter,

you know what they have to say when all this happens? Thanks to the Oxygen Network, who basically sponsored the whole thing. They're saying, well, hey guys, that's a crime to take a human bone out of the body. You know what? Really? That's what they've got to say? I mean, according to this doctor, and according to Dave Holloway, two people I tend to trust, it is a human bone, and very possibly Natalie's. And that's all they've got to say. They should be saying, you know, let us help you. Let us be part of this because if this is Natalie, we want to prosecute. Instead, they're going nanny, nanny, boo, boo. You can't take the bone out of the country. There is no way in H-E-L-L I would hand that fragment over to Aruban authorities, Dr. Maroney, because

without that, there may be no case. And there's only two kinds of animals in Aruba that they could possibly be. If you want to talk about native animals to Arubas, it would be goats and donkeys. So they're saying that goat or donkey bones were found because they're saying they're animals. Except for geckos and lizards, there's nothing else on Aruba. Some goats and donkeys. And they will definitely be able to tell the difference between human bones and goat or human bones and donkeys. All across America, the first thing you learn in forensic anthropology is how to tell the difference between, like, deer bones and human bones in rural settings.

So it's a primary skill, so they'll really be able to nail that one hard. I mean, this guy is no slouch, Dr. Maroney. He went to Cornell and CUNY. He's written a textbook on forensic science. And he helped set up New York's first mitochondrial DNA lab. I mean, so he is no schlump. And if he says this and you respect him, it's very hard for me to believe that Dave Holloway would lie about this.

One more thing, Dr. Maroney. Since we know Beth Holloway has provided a buccal swab, a saliva swab, and we know these are human bones, according to this doctor, how long till we get a result? You're probably looking at six to eight weeks because of the chemical processes. It's difficult in time, but they need six to eight weeks, almost two months before they get the DNA data back. Art Harris, Dr. William Maroney, we are on it. Do you remember what your children were like at age two? I do. They barely came up to my knee.

They had just learned to walk. They were extremely premature, and everything took longer for them. And they would be fascinated by something as simple as a water sprinkler. And I would spend every single moment I could with them. I remember giving them a bath and it would be time for me to go to CNN's HLN to work. And they would be so upset when I would leave. I would have to walk out without shoes on. I'd have the shoes outside, climb out the playroom window, soaking wet from the bath. My clothes would be wet, and put my shoes on

outside. Because if they saw me put my shoes on, they would know I was going somewhere. Or if they saw me change into any nice clothes at all, they were so dependent and so precious. And that is why the story of a mother of four getting high on heroin in the front seat of her car while her two-year-old tot girl, just two years old, hanged herself on a seat belt trying to escape. And here's the kicker. This is mommy's third, one, two, three, repeat,

third child neglect charge. Mm-hmm. The two-year-old little girl, the talk girl, is dead. All this occurs while the mom, Deanna Joseph, gets high in the car. The little girl got tangled in the seatbelt trying to escape the car. This after Deanna Joseph was already convicted of sleeping while her son was in a hot bathtub. This time, police say they found heroin residue

and rocks of crack with her. Oh, oops, I almost forgot. Then she was arrested another time for leaving her other two children home alone. She was in a parking lot then too. Hi. She's been convicted many times over the last 20 years. She's just 39 for drugs and other charges. And now this little girl is dead. I wish you could see the selfie that she posted for online and a tight pink V-neck t-shirt looking all uh kim kardashian at the screen i mean you know what she ain't gonna look that good behind bars that's all i can say joining me right now in addition to dr william maroney we're now a medical examiner out of madison heights wisconsin and author of a brand new book available on amazon american narcan how, How to Fight the Opioid Epidemic and Save Your Own Family. Also with me, Crime Stories contributing reporter Drew Nelson.

Drew, tell me, let me understand exactly what happened. I know this much. Cops say Deanna Joseph is stoned out of her gourd yet again, this time on heroin. She was arrested by Alloway Township Police in New Jersey. High on heroin, like you said. The story is she had this little girl strapped into the car seat in the back seat. She went driving after she got loaded. And then she came home.

She parked in the driveway. We have no idea how long she was parked there before she woke up and called 911 to say that the two-year-old little girl, she couldn't wake her up in the back seat. And then the police say she, now I'm quoting from the police here, they say that she injured herself struggling in the car seat.

So now they have to do the autopsy to confirm the official cause of death. Dr. William Maroney, Drew Nelson just said they still are trying to determine exactly what happened. Wait, I thought it was decided that the little girl, the two-year-old little girl, was trying to get out of the car and was struggling with the seatbelt and hung herself. Wait, is there a possibility something even more sinister happened? I mean, they can't tell that. I mean, I know mommy was high in the car, according to police on heroin. Is there a suggestion it could be another reason the girl was strangled no uh the the way it happens though is at that age and at many different um stages of development the head of a child is disproportionately

larger than the body and and while they can walk and crawl sometimes they have difficulty using arms and legs to escape things. And that's probably what happened. She tried to get out of the chair and what ordinarily would be a seat belt strapped across her chest and shoulders suddenly pulled up into her throat and neck. and with a disproportionately large head in a tight seat belt her tight buckle down would not have allowed her hands or legs to free her and that's struggling to get out then she'd lose consciousness. And however long she was there, we don't know. I mean, this child may have been hungry. This child may have had urine on her. She could have been there for hours and hours. When somebody nods out on heroin, you don't know how long it's going to

take for them to revive. This woman needed treatment. Okay, you know, Dr. Maroney, every time I could, every time I could, for 10 years in inner city Atlanta, I would try to send addicts to rehab. Sometimes they'd have to wait in jail for months before they could get a spot in state paid rehab. But if they couldn't get into rehab and there was no way, no room, no bed for them, they'd have to go to jail. There's nothing I could do about it. So I know typically you'd want me to feel sorry for the addict and I hear you and I get it and I do. But that only goes so far with me when you've got a two-year-old dead girl, Maroney. Well, we needed Child Protective Services to intervene a lot sooner than what they did.

They've been intervening. Come on, Drew Nelson, tell them Deanna Joseph's record. She served five years probation. This was from the first child cruelty and neglect conviction. She was found high. Police found her high wandering around a parking lot back in 2008. Her children at the time were age 11 and 2, and they were home alone. And that's not the only time. This is the third arrest.

So she could get high in the parking lot. Hold on. The 2008 incident, mommy was arrested again. She left the children, 11 and 2, alone at home so she could go get high in the parking lot. And that was the first time. The second time she was convicted of child cruelty and neglect. This was back in 2015. She was passed out in her apartment. And she had her infant son in the bathtub, in a bath, and she was passed out.

She just got out of jail in August of last year off of that charge. According to NJ.com, what happened in that one that Drew's telling you about, Dr. Maroney, mommy was convicted of child cruelty and neglect. Cops found her unconscious beside her 11-month-old son, who was partially submerged in the bathtub. And that is just the tip of the iceberg. She has been in and out of jail for 20 years, and she's only 39, okay, for 20 years. Seven arrests that range from heroin to cocaine to resisting a police officer, eluding a police officer after being told to stop. I mean, and this time, according to the police report, she gets high on heroin.

She also has crack. And she has a daughter in the car and is just driving around high on heroin when she finally parks in the driveway and just passes out high. So, Dr. Maroney, what is that sensation? I mean, why did she let the little girl die in the car? She sat there high on heroin and as her daughter about one foot away from her died. It's not a long-term high that people seek. It's oblivion and euphoria that often leads to sleep.

That's the best you can seek. And you keep getting higher doses to get there because you're tolerant and dependent. And I'm just really torn up that there's a criminal justice system that keeps putting these children back in her care without compulsory probationary drug testing. I'm a very strong proponent of drug testing to make sure this kind of stuff doesn't happen. The last time she was in her apartment and the child was in the bathtub, that's what happened the very last time.

I mean, there have been so many times, it's hard to keep up with it. But the last time, she was unconscious while her child, the infant actually, was submerged in the water. It goes on from there. There were spoons and glassine envelopes containing heroin residue. More crack that time as well. After a hospital exam, Deanna Joseph was charged with possession of a dangerous substance and endangering a child.

This is what I don't understand. In this case, the current case where the child is dead, Drew Nelson, the child is dead. While mommy's passed out on heroin, she dies about one foot away from her. Last time her son was one foot away from her, submerged in the water while she was high. Why is she only charged with child endangerment? Because to me, this is felony child abuse or felony child endangerment and a death occurred. That's felony murder. Right now, she faces that second degree child endangerment charge, like you said, Nancy, but when the autopsy comes back, there is the possibility that the charges could be upgraded. A felony, from the way that the police

were describing this, she was in the process of committing a felony and somebody died. Ergo, felony murder could be the charge she faces. As of right now, she faces the second-degree child endangerment charge, 10-year maximum sentence, and $150,000 maximum fine. I've learned something else, Dr. Maroney. Authorities say that the little girl, the two-year-old Tot, had no signs of blunt force trauma, and they're still trying to determine the exact cause of death. It was a cool night, but Deanna Joseph had the heater on. The car was parked and running for all this time. How does that factor into the autopsy, Dr. Maroney?

Well, if it was a child that was strapped in that was trying to get out of a chair, it's most likely strangulation. And if she had the heater on, that child was overheating and she was trying to get out of a chair because she was uncomfortable. Mommy didn't know what was happening. Mommy was unconscious. Mommy was asleep. But anytime somebody's hot, they try to get away. A young child doesn't understand, open the door, do the crank. It just tries to writhe and struggle out of a tight car seat. And again, the head is oversized. The straps are across the chest and shoulders. And if a child slips down, they pull up, and it's likely asphyxiation or strangulation. You know what?

I am not siding with a mom, even though I know she's got this drug problem. I'm siding with a little girl. The child is dead. The two-year-old little girl is dead. This mom has been in and out of the system for child neglect and child abuse. And right now, we don't even know. It's not clear whether mommy was even being monitored by the Department of Child and Family Services. What is going on in New Jersey?

Why aren't they taking care of their children? When a mom can't do the job, I don't like this, but that is when a child has got to be placed in foster care, and I don't like foster care. But this child is dead, and I can guarantee you this. We may not know the cause of death right now, but I can guarantee you this. We may not know the cause of death right now, but I can guarantee you this. The last thing that baby saw was mommy. Hurricane Harvey wreaking havoc throughout Texas,

but there is one family in particular that is reacting very differently to Hurricane Harvey, and this is why. It could destroy the hurricane, could destroy any hope of ever finding missing Texas realtor Crystal McDowell. Apparently, this beautiful young realtor goes missing just before Hurricane Harvey. Straight out to reporter Drew Nelson, Crime Stories contributing reporter. What happened? What do we know about her disappearance, Drew? She's been missing since Friday. It was the hours right before Hurricane Harvey hit. She's from Baytown, Texas. That's just east of Houston. And her uncle, that's her closest relative. Her parents died when she was 11. So her uncle runs the family real estate agency. And her uncle, that's her closest relative. Her parents died when she was 11. So

her uncle runs the family real estate agency. And he says that she left a message to just, you know, routine message to say that she had a couple of appointments and that's the last he ever heard from her. He went and talked to her ex-husband later in the day. She's been staying at his home because her home has been under renovation. So Crystal's been staying with the ex-husband. And her uncle said he talked to the ex-husband, and he said that Crystal sent him a text. This is the ex-husband. Sent him a text that said she was coming to pick up their two young children to take to Dallas. So even before heavy rains have devastated Houston because of Harvey, this family already suffering from a nightmare that they can't wake up from.

Monday marked day four without hearing from Crystal McDowell. Now, this happened just before Harvey goes down. To Dr. William Maroney, in light of Harvey and Texas, how is this going to affect finding Crystal, this Texas realtor, or if she's dead, finding her body? In the collection of evidence, this is devastating. This could literally wipe out any crime scene. If there was a crime scene, if there was a primary crime scene, a secondary crime scene, it's going to be lost. In the secondary effects of finding her, if the body's found, it's going to depend on moisture and temperature,

whether or not the body decays according to an understood protocol so that they would be able to set a time of approximate death. But collecting evidence, this is a game changer. This is a deal breaker. You're not kidding. This is what we know about her. She's 38 years old. She looks like she's got long blonde hair. She was a former flight attendant for Express Jet. She was already bringing in tens of thousands of dollars in revenue every month for the real estate company. Everybody loved her. She never missed an appointment. But catch this.

She had appointments the day she went missing and never showed up. In my mind, Dr. Maroney, that's where you start with your timeline. Agree or disagree? I totally agree. She always is prompt in returning messages, whether they're from a client or a family member. Always, always. That's why the family knew something was very wrong. Now, from my understanding, straight back out to Drew Nelson reporting on the case,

cops searched her home but found nothing of any significance. They also got to her computer, and it looked like some files had been destroyed, which piqued my interest, but it looks like that may have happened because of a factory reset. So, you know, that's nothing nefarious at all. The woman, Crystal McDowell, always active on social media. She has not posted on her personal page or her professional page since the same day she missed those appointments, Drew. Now, when you say factory reset on her computer, what that means is somebody went in there and wiped it out intentionally. Oh, my goodness.

Okay, see, I didn't know that. Factory reset. I thought that meant something completely different. Drew, school me. What does that mean, factory reset? That's taking your computer your smartphone your tablet takes it back to zero like it's a brand new except the police can go in there and find what's been wiped out that's it's as though it's been kind of wiped over um with paint

but then you can just kind of wipe the paint away and see what was there. So now- Okay, I did not know, Drew Nelson, that that is what factory reset meant. Dr. Maroney, especially in the real estate business, I doubt very seriously she reset her phone and her computer because those are all of her contacts. Somebody's trying to cover something up. Some recent contact, some phone number, some emails being wiped out on purpose. This is forensic evidence that this needs to be recreated.

Crystal McDowell is described as 5'4", weighs about 120 pounds, with long blonde hair that comes about down to her elbows. Now, authorities are not sharing information regarding what the files may have contained that they are trying to salvage right now. But I think it's very foreboding that the day she, you know how realtors live and breathe, they rise or fall on those appointments. She missed two of them, which she had never done before. You know, back to Drew Nelson, a reporter on the story.

Drew, what do we know about her personal life? Does she have children? She has two children with her ex-husband, and they are still staying with her ex-husband right now. Wait a minute, Ex-husband. That's right. Now, he has not been named as a suspect. He has not been named as a person of interest at all.

I'm just asking on my own. What do we know about him? Now, the uncle has been talking. And he says that after the last he heard from Crystal, later in the day, he called and spoke to the ex-husband and the ex-husband said that Crystal sent him a text to say that she was on their way to pick up their two young children to take to Dallas. And now her uncle is saying that Crystal never said anything about making plans to evacuate to Dallas for the storm. Wait a minute. Wait a minute.

Was this when they knew Harvey was coming but before Harvey had hit? This was just a few hours before the storm hit. I find it very hard to believe, Dr. Maroney, that she would evacuate and leave her children behind after the ex-husband is saying she was planning to take them with her. I don't believe that, Dr. Maroney. That's impossible. Mother's instinct and intuition would never allow that to happen.

Families don't do that in emergencies. So what now, Dr. Maroney? What should they be doing now to try to find Crystal McDowell? Guys, please help us find this Texas mom. She goes missing just before Harvey hits. Tip line for Chambers County PD, 409-267-2500. Give us some advice, doctor. We need forensic IT specialists, people that have been trained by the FBI

or the Texas Bureau of Investigations or Georgia Bureau of Investigations or maybe military to reconstruct some of the resets. Dr. William Maroney joining us, a medical examiner out of Madison Heights. A lot of focus has been placed on Harvey, which I understand, but Crystal's family is more focused on her activity on the Thursday and the Friday before she goes missing. They are desperate for anyone that may have seen or spoken with Crystal McDowell. Crystal Surratt McDowell, mother, Texas realtor, missing. Tip line, Chambers County PD, Police Department, 409-267-2500. Drew, Drew Nelson, what more can you tell me? The family has contacted the FBI.

They've contacted Baytown police. They've contacted the sheriff's office. They're all busy with the flood, with Hurricane Harvey. The FBI, their office is flooded in right now. So the family is frustrated beyond belief. Their cousin has been saying that the police are just too busy to look for Crystal, too busy to look for her black Mercedes Benz. And they've had several reports of abandoned cars, abandoned Mercedes Benz that the police can't check out because they're just too busy saving people. Here's the other thing. And again, the husband, the ex, has not been named at all. What about this theory? Drew Nelson, she had an opening and a closing that day.

Have the people that she was supposed to meet been checked out? Because I recall distinctly, oh, I'll never forget this case. This realtor, a mom, had one showing. She was on her way home. She was on the phone with her husband and they were deciding who's going to pick up something for dinner. She was working late. Nobody had time to cook. Boy, I've been there. And they make plans about whatever they were going to pick up. She had one showing left. It was starting to get dark. She went to the showing. She was never seen alive again. She was murdered by some guy there at the empty home. That's what happened. So what about that? Those people been checked out, Drew Nelson,

the opening and the closing that day. That takes us back to what's on her computer. Police would have to recover her schedule to find out the people who were on those two appointments, check out those names, check out those people and find them. Now, we don't know if police have had a chance to talk to them yet, but this goes back to the fact that they're so busy with the hurricane. This has just been put on the back burner because they're so busy with saving people's lives, pulling people off of cars, off of their roofs, that they're just not able to give this the attention that it needs, Nancy. Well, this is another thing we know.

The children, the two children, are at the ex's home, and she hasn't contacted them. Yeah, this is also what I know. According to her cousin, Melissa Cherry, she says Crystal had canceled a walkthrough earlier that morning. Does that mean Crystal called and made the cancellation or she didn't show up? The cousin goes on to say this is not a storm thing. Crystal had appointments the day before and that day. We haven't heard from her since that morning. She was driving, as you said, a black Mercedes, but because of the flooding, the family has not been able to get out and look for

it. Another thing that I know, she hasn't tried to contact her children. That's bad. Okay. Also, we know the cousin says she's gotten numerous calls about abandoned Mercedes. And some calls from people claiming to have Crystal and trying to extort money. This has got to be pure hell. The uncle keeps talking about the helpless feeling he has. Nobody can do anything about it. So where does it stand right now? The tag number H happy B brother, B brother, 63 51 black Mercedes H happy B brother, B brother, 63 51. Where does it stand now, Drew? The last that her uncle heard anything about her

was when he talked to her ex-husband, the man who still has their children. Crystal has been staying with her ex-husband because her house has been under renovation. The ex-husband says the last thing that he heard from her was that she was on the way to pick up their two young children to take to Dallas. But the uncle, he questions whether she ever sent those messages. Now, I'm quoting him here. He says, we aren't sure she sent those messages to him. Well, you'd have to have a forensic expert to determine that. Tip line, everybody, 409-267-2500. Amidst all the pain and misery and suffering happening in our Texas right now, let's don't forget Crystal McDowell.

Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.