Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Plumber discovers human flesh of teen girl in bathroom pipes

Episode Date: November 11, 2020

Plumbers are called to a rental home to unclog drains. As they snake the pipes, the material pulled out is unnerving enough that the police are called. When police knock on a tenant's door, he confesses it's a body. Adam Strong is now on trial for murder.Joining Nancy Grace today: Ashley Willcott - Judge and trial attorney, Anchor on Court TV, www.ashleywillcott.com  Psych - Caryn Stark - NYC Psychologist, www.carynstark.com  Joe Scott Morgan - Professor of Forensics Jacksonville State University, Author, "Blood Beneath My Feet" featured on "Poisonous Liaisons" on True Crime Network Nicole Partin - Crime Online Investigative Reporter Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. A man calls a plumber, and for the rest of the world, that's no big deal, except maybe a really big bill. But in our world, when sinks, commodes get clogged up, we immediately think dead body. So, welcome to our world. Jeremiah Wildeboer, a plumber called to the apartment, described Strong's basement in disarray. Wildeboer was to snake the drains after complaints from upstairs tenants. The plumber, who started his work in Strong's basement apartment,

said the accused was, quote, annoyingly hovering over him and his colleague. Making little progress, the plumbers then decided to try and remove the blockage from the upstairs bathroom. Wildeboer said that's when the pair found the blockage. He said, quote, We were more in denial. I hunt, so I started recognizing the buildup coming out.

Strong watched as they recovered the contents. Wildeboer said Strong commented, quote, that's so gross. What is that? And kept asking how it got there. Wildeboer testified the substance was so concerning, he texted his boss, who told the men not to say anything and pack up their tools. The plumbers then notified police. Don to say anything and pack up their tools. The plumbers then notified police. Don't say anything. Pack up your tools and leave.

That is what the plumber was told, and that is what the plumber did. You were just hearing our friend Brittany Rosen with Global News. Can you imagine the plumber getting a call, just thinks he's doing an ordinary snake job, cleaning out a drain. And for anybody that's lived in New York, you learn how to snake a commode because you don't know when a plumber's ever going to get there. And then they will charge you an arm and a leg once they do get there. Nobody likes cleaning out the commode. Nobody likes plunging it. Nobody likes snaking it. But what this plumber found was altogether a different nightmare. Again, I'm Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Let me introduce to you an all-star panel to weigh in on a very, very disturbing case

with me, Ashley Wilcott, judge, trial lawyer, anchor, court TV, wife and mom at AshleyWilcott.com. Karen Stark, renowned New York psychologist, longtime friend of our program. You can find her at Karen Stark. That's Karen with a C, karenstark.com. She's joining us today from Manhattan. Professor of Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, and star of a brand new show, Poisonous Liaisons on the True Crime Network,

Joseph Scott Morgan. Also with me, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, Dave Mack. So, Dave Mack, when Jeremiah Wildeboer goes to the scene, is it an apartment complex or what is the structure? Nancy, it's a house that has two apartments in it, one on the main level of the house and then another apartment in the basement. Gotcha. I was thinking duplex, but this is stacked on top of each other. Gotcha.

So it's not like an apartment complex where they typically will have a maintenance person or a plumber on the scene. So, guys, this plumber, Jeremiah Wildeboer, shows up just a snake a drain, and you hear him talk about what they are pulling up. Okay, hold on just a moment. Maybe we should hear it from the horse's mouth. Take a listen to part of the 911 call from that poor plumber. Communications. Hi there, how are you? Good, you? Good, thanks. I'm just a plumber and I'm on site for a job. We're snaking a drain and we've been pulling back, we probably pulled back about 10 pounds, 15 pounds of like, it looks like flesh type of stuff, meat. Plumbers hired to unclog the drains by main floor tenants were so concerned they called police. We started to sink and we've been working on it for like three, four hours now, right? Oh, okay. And we can't get it clear,

but we keep pulling back chunks of, you know, whatever the hell it is. You're hearing our friend Catherine McDonald at Global News and the 911 call from that plumber. You know, Karen Starr, New York psychologist joining us from Manhattan right now. He sounded pretty calm. I guess he didn't really know what he was snaking up out of that drain. I think also he might have been hesitant to say that, you know, how hideous and offensive it was. And he might be a little bit, Nancy, in shock. I mean, you're pulling up horrific stuff that it seems like he was used to seeing, but he couldn't put it in that context. So he sounds to me like he's not sure what's happening.

You know what? You just said something really important. Ashley Wilcott with me, judge, trial lawyer, anchor, court TV. I've seen very often with witnesses, they see or they hear something, but it's so out of context. They don't really know what they're seeing. And I think what Karen Stark just said may have hit it on the head. You know it, but you're not letting yourself know it because it's so out of context. Absolutely. Can you imagine? So I just heard them say 10 to 15 pounds of meat. What? Out of a toilet? Like that doesn't make sense. Who would flush down meat they were trying to eat for dinner in that amount? What is it? It

doesn't make sense. And so frequently, and I got to be honest, those are the best kinds of witnesses for me, from my perspective, trying cases is because it is so out of the ordinary. They tend to remember every detail because they can remember how it smells or how it looks because it's not something they typically see. Guys, you just heard part of the 911 call from the plumber who goes to the scene. And everybody has had to plunge a commode, snake a drain. It just comes with age. But you don't expect to, Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor of Forensics, Jacksonville

State University, you don't expect to pull up 15 pounds of meat. So my question to you is, what would it look like? Because, you know, we were just talking to Ashley Wilcott, when you cook something, let's just say you're cooking ground beef or you're cooking turkey or chicken or fish, I just don't see how it would look anything like that. No, it's not necessarily going to look that way. And let me put this in context, Nancy, for folks at home, you know, because this is the way the plumber is viewing it. All right. He's not thinking that this is something, you know, he's having to view the

abnormal in context of the normal to his world. Imagine if you will, he said 15 pounds. Imagine if you will, if you had maybe five, five pot roasts. Okay. That's what we're talking about, essentially small pot roasts. And these things are being cut down and trimmed down in order to fit down into the toilet to flush it. That gives, that gives our viewers some kind of frame of reference here. And when you take this stuff out after it it's been in there for a while, and it's been compressed and compiled and kind of stratified in there with everything else that's going down this toilet line, it's foul. This meat will be decomposed. It'll have kind of a black to deep brown texture to it. And what's really interesting is not just the tissue itself.

There's going to be different types of tissue, Nancy, because you're going to have what appears to be maybe like muscle. And you might also have what appears to be hair or skin. You know what? I need to remind myself whenever I ask Joseph Scott Morgan a question, I am going to get TMI. But you know what? That's exactly what's needed in cases like that, because most people, this is something so extraordinary and out of the norm for them. It's hard to wrap your mind around it. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we're talking about a mild-mannered plumber that goes on a call to Snake and Drain and finds anything but a hair clog.

Let's take a listen again to our cut 18. Listen to the plumber. Communications. Hi there, how are you? Good, you? Good, thanks. I'm a plumber and I'm on site for a job. We're snaking a drain and we've been pulling back, we probably pulled back about 10 pounds, 15 pounds of like, it looks like flesh type of stuff, meat. Plumbers hired to unclog the drains by main floor tenants were so concerned they called police.

And we started to sink and we've been working at it for like three, four hours now, right? And we can't get it clear, but we keep pulling back chunks of, you know, whatever the hell it is. To Joseph Scott Morgan, you had stated earlier that the substance the plumber was pulling out looked macerated. And I assume that comes from the same Latin root as masticate to eat or chew. Explain what you meant by that. Yeah, to tear, to rip. You know, we think about when somebody, or you see an animal, for instance, that rips apart a piece of meat that they're eating,

you see one of these wildlife videos or something, it's not going to be very even, much of it, because for one, it's going to be decomposing in there, So that's going to change the appearance. But here's the big hook. There might also be clean edges. And let me tell you what that means, Nancy. When we're looking for clean edges. Do you have to? Yeah, I do. I absolutely have to because our listeners, they deserve to hear this. Go ahead. When you examine this tissue, what you're going to be looking for from a forensic perspective is to see if this was butchered. And if it was butchered, that means that sharp edged weapons were used. We want to know if it had been chopped, sliced, if there was a circular saw used. What tore this tissue apart? In what manner was it torn apart? Was it just an ax or was it somebody that took their time that knew what they were doing? Because that's going to tell you a lot about the person that put this stuff there.

So let me understand this, Dave Mack. A tenant calls a plumber. The plumber arrives. He finds flesh and meat. He said he was a hunter, so he had a pretty good idea of what he was finding. He calls 911. Cops arrive. Who else lives in the home? Adam Strong lives in the downstairs apartment. There's another couple that lives upstairs, but the police are knocking on the door downstairs. That's where the plumber arrived and started downstairs working in that area.

And it was described as a big, big mess that Adam Strong had in that downstairs apartment. But that is where police went. And we also heard in the original reporting from Brittany Rosen at Global News that Adam Strong was, quote, hovering over the plumbers as they're trying to snake the drain. Take a listen to our friend Catherine McDonald. Park was first on scene and says after seeing the shopping bag full of what was either human or animal flesh and after speaking to other officers on scene, decided to knock on the door of the basement tenant. Strong answered the door and asked him, what have you been flushing down the toilet that you shouldn't be? Park said Strong seemed defeated and dropped his head before saying, OK, you got me. The gig's up. It's a body. To Karen Stark, I think I need to shrink because here's the guy, the cop just

comes to the door and says, have you been flushing anything down the commode? You shouldn't. And his response to a dead body in the commode chopped into bits is, okay, you got me. The gig is up. It's a body. It's almost like it's a game the gig is up well for him that's exactly right Nancy it is like a game because it's not it doesn't mean anything he has no empathy he really can't feel anything about what he's done so I mean if you this is a very inconsistent guy you can't even stick to his story and he's saying the gig is up. He could be playing tag. Okay, you caught me.

I'm sure I told on anybody. Oh, that's a really good comparison. That is exactly correct, Karen Stark. So, Ashley Wolcott, you're on the bench. You're in court all the time. Court TV anchor. I guess to some people, what they're doing is almost like a game. But for the rest of us, it's a deadly murder and butchering of a human body.

You know what, though? Listen, as a judge, here's the evidence I need to hear, though, Nancy. The gig is up. The body. OK. Of what? Of an animal? Of a cat that was a pet cat that died? Of a dog? Of a person who was already dead, which means there could be some dismembering, or rather someone that was killed, which means murder. So I got to tell you, that is not a confession. We don't know enough details yet. What is it in that toilet. Well, you know what? You and I can tangle up like two wet cats in a barrel because when somebody says the gig is up, it's a body. I take that to mean a human body because anybody else would just say, oh, it was my fill in the blank, my cat, my dog, my pet raccoon. But when you say it's a body in our world, that means a human body. But you and I can lock horns on that later because I want you to hear how this whole thing started. I think we've established it's a body.

Okay. Those are his words. Now, maybe it'll turn out that Ashley Wilcott is right and it's a kitty cat or a ferret or a rat or a gerbil, but there's 15 pounds of meat that we know of. Let's start with the disappearance of a gorgeous young teen girl. Take a listen to Shannon Dion speaking to Stan Behal with the Toronto Sun. Teenagers started to roll around, and that's when Roy started to get a little bit more free time on her hands.

And I went back to work around that time. I was working for a restoration company through uh her her grandparents family and um that's when i started losing a little bit of grip with um you know my girl because her dad and i had separated already and um i was working 12 hour days 10 hour days and And Rory was left unfortunately to make a lot of decisions on her own at 14 years old, 13, 14, eh. And she was always a mature kid. So that was already a bonus

cause she was already a very well-spoken young lady. She knew what she wanted and nothing would stand in the way of her getting it. But that was our mother-daughter escape. We were getting the ugliest bus we could find, and we were going to make it home and spend one year together before she would go off to college. A mother-daughter dream, converting a bus to a rolling home and spending a year together before the daughter goes off to college.

Man, would I love to do that with the twins. Renovate an old bus, as they said, the ugliest bus they could find, and spend the next year, just the two of them, hitting the open road. This young girl, Rory Hachet, this teen girl with the world in front of her, planning this wonderful trip with her mom. You know, when you hear that, and with the backdrop of what the plumber says, is excruciating. Joe Scott, you've been on literally thousands of death scenes. It's hard to digest or take in that what was flushed down that commode could very well be this young girl.

Yeah, it is. And that's one of the reasons you know i i'm always and even in my memoir you know i talk about this the impact that it has on you as as a death investigator but even more so as a parent nancy oh always you're always having to see things in the abnormal in the context context of the normal, you know, just, just think about this just for a second and see that, that plumber is going into this environment and he's pulling this out. The mother. Now you kind of collate that with what this news that's come in.

And you think about that mama, what kind of pain is she in now? You know, when you begin to think about this, and it is an absolute horror show. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we're talking about a plumber pulling up what turns out to be human flesh, clogging an apartment's commode and sink. Now we learn that this sweet teen girl, about to set off on a year's adventure with her mom before going to college, goes missing.

Their trip was not meant to be. Take a listen to Catherine McDonald. Rory's torso was found in September 2017 in the Oshawa Harbor. Three months later, police were led to this home on McMillan Drive in Oshawa by a plumber who found flesh in the drains. When officers went to Strong's basement apartment to inquire, he told them he had the rest of the body in a drains. When officers went to Strong's basement apartment to inquire, he told them he had the rest of the body in a freezer. Strong tells Detective Paul Minton that it was just bad luck that the flesh was found in the pipes. Quote, I got greedy, that's all. He also admitted to

dismembering Rory's body on Christmas, saying that that's when the neighbors were away. And talking about the discovery of the torso in the harbor, he says, I was tripped out. Strong tells the officer, in the days that followed, I actually went fishing there off the pier. The officer tells him, the torso was floating. Strong responds, it didn't pop up, did it? It was floating. Wow. Saying he felt badly for the grandfather and grandson who discovered it. Wait a minute. Not only was I just hit with the fact that this little girl, Rory Hachet, a teen girl's torso, was found in the Oshawa Harbor.

I hear Adam Strong stating that it was, quote, bad luck. The flesh was found in the pipes. That he, quote, got greedy. That he dismembered the teen girl's body on Christmas Day because the neighbors would be gone, and he felt bad for the grandfather and grandson that saw the body pop up. He also was interested as to why it popped up. I guess, what, did he have it weighted down originally? Take a listen to Pam Seattle with the City News. When investigators searched the premises, they uncovered what they allege were parts of Haché's body stuffed in garbage bags

and stored in a freezer in Strong's basement apartment. I've thought of every scenario in my head in the last couple years because I had to because I was going crazy not knowing what was done to my daughter and how this happened and why, know um so today shed a lot of light on the the the nitty-gritty the worst part and um you know we're going to get through this together we're learning more and more about what happened to this young girl Rory Hachet a teen girl so part part of her body is flushed down the commode, and part of it is stuffed in garbage bags and stored in freezers. Why? I need a shrink, too. Karen Stark, why, after murdering the girl and dismembering her body,

would you store the body in your own home? Well, Nancy, it's a reminder of the fact that he killed this person and so he gets excited by knowing that he has a piece of her there and you never know do you mean sexually excited Karen yes I do and working out with it you're the shrink not me but I mean how can you get sexually excited over body parts in your freezer? Well, it reminds him of the killing. That's number one. So he can go back and relive it and feel that same excitement, which I have no doubt he felt while it was happening.

And then there's necrophilia, and that's the truth, Nancy. There are people that really engage sexually with their bodies. So he can preserve it and have it if he needs it or wants it. Her mother actually sounds numb as she is describing getting through the, quote, nitty gritty. Take a listen to Detective Darren Short with the Durham Regional Police. Based on the evidence we've examined to this point, we have located the remains of Rory and her DNA in the residence, and now the DNA of this unknown female in the residence at this point. The other remaining missing female at the time was identified as Candace Fitzpatrick from the Oshawa area. Family had reported to the DRPS in 2010 concerns of her not having

been seen and she was 18 years old at the time. As a result of that information we approached the biological parents of Candice and obtained DNA samples. We strongly believe that the DNA located is that of Candace Fitzpatrick. We are, however, taking steps to 100% confirm that and eliminate the possibility of anyone else being a donor to that unknown DNA profile. So as they are investigating the flesh in the commode drain, they discover another set of DNA, something, I don't understand really exactly how to put it to Joseph Scott Morgan. When you are looking at body parts and flesh, how would you be able to determine that some of that belongs to somebody else?

What, through DNA testing, you just happen to test a different portion of remains? Yeah, and you would have to sample that out. Look, Nancy, if you're encountering, let's say, remains that have potentially been dismembered in an environment, you want to proceed very, very carefully because this is a mark of somebody that is involved in serial events. So you don't know how many bodies that you're dealing with here. You know, you have to understand that going forward. So you're going to sample each piece there. And I can only imagine, can you imagine being in that lab and you say, Hey guys, guess what? I don't just have, you don't just have one person. You got two people here. And then they have to kind of

delineate between or draw the line between who is who, you know, who does this match up with? Who does this pair up with? And it is a shock because then you're thinking, oh my God, how far out does this thing go? Are we talking just two people here or could there be more? And that's my big question as an investigator. Could there potentially be even more people? So now the family of a missing girl, Candace Fitzpatrick, also a teen girl that goes missing, is on edge, hoping against hope she's still alive. But now they have reason to believe this could be her body. Listen to our friend Austin Delaney.

For 11 hours, a very skilled Durham police detective and Adam Strong do a dance in a tiny interrogation room. The police detective wants information about two murders. Adam Strong wants whatever he can get. Adam Strong waits nervously for 36 minutes in the police interview room before the door opens. Adam, how you doing? Good, you? Yeah, had better days. I understand I'm in a lot of trouble.

He had been in jail since December 29, 2017. Originally charged with causing an indignity to a body after remains of a pregnant 18-year-old Rory Hachet were found in his home. Is there any way I can get a cigarette? In jail for a year, he takes the opportunity to get treats. What are you going to anchor him for? Wendy's triple. Yeah, that's doable. No pickles. Ice tea, no ice. Two, their value, spicy chicken wraps and a grilled chicken Caesar salad. Let me understand something. So while this guy is behind bars about the chunks of human flesh found in the drains where he lives. He doesn't think

to mention there's a second dead girl whose remains are in his home, either stuffed in garbage bags or in the freezer. But he remembers the Wendy's drive-thru menu. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we are talking about the disappearance and deaths of two gorgeous young teen girls, Rory Hachet and Candace Fitzpatrick. While he is behind bars being questioned after the first chunks of flesh are being found, he thinks about what he wants in exchange for information. He wants things off the value meal. He wants no pickles.

He wants a chicken wrap. He wants no pickles. He wants a chicken wrap. He wants iced tea. He has the menu down, Ashley Wilcott, but he forgets to mention the second body's remains in his home. This man is so despicable. And let me just suggest this. So you and I are used to in this world that we live in and the work world we're in, it's not surprising. You have people like this who do egregious things who aren't going to be rational and calm and, oh, by the way, let me tell you about this other DNA or this other death or this other person. That's not how they think. I mean, listen, he is non-pulse. He's ordering everything he wants clearly he is not a a rational person who's going to say oh by the way there's another body he's one of the most dangerous criminals we can

encounter what's so amazing to me is that he's bargaining behind bars for a wendy's what was it he wanted dave mack he wants a wendy's ranch he wants a wendy's. He wants a Wendy's triple with no pickles. He wants a grilled chicken Caesar salad. And he's a big guy, so he knows this menu. This is a regular haunt for him. These two teen girls missing, and as Joe Scott Morgan described in the lab, they find out the remains are not one but two girls. Listen to Austin Delaney, CTV News.

The affable detective Paul Mitten wants details about Haché's murder, whose torso was found in the Oshawa Harbour. I don't know how appropriate this is, but I'd like you to pass on to her mother and her father my condolences. And answers as to why the DNA of missing 19-year-old Candace Fitzpatrick was also found in his Oshawa basement apartment. But Strong is not giving away anything for free. I would like to, and I feel this to my lawyer, and he's not interested in it, and I don't understand why, of spilling the beans and being as comfortable as I can in jail.

Not like $100,000 like picked in, but like an allowance. I don't know. I don't know. Like internet access. Like I don't have anybody who's going to buy me TV. It doesn't work like that, the seasoned police interrogator tells the accused killer, who admits only to dismembering Haché. To Dave Mack, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, is he actually trying to bargain for a comfy jail where he has internet access?

Did he say something about he wants an allowance in exchange for testimony? Yep, and he mentioned other criminals who had negotiated deals behind bars. I think this, Nancy, goes back to when the police officer arrived at his door to start with, and he just hangs his head and says the gig is up. He knew there was an end game, and he had a plan of what he was going to give out and what he was going to hold back in negotiations to make his prison time more enjoyable, if it can be. Well, you know what, Dave Mack, I think you're right.

I got my first clue as to that when he was ordering the Wendy's Double No Pickles with the iced tea, the chicken wraps, two of them, they're value meals, he says, and a Caesar salad. Take a listen to Catherine McDonald, Global News. The first few hours of an 11-hour video were shown capturing an interview between a police polygraph expert and Adam Strong. At first, the 48-year-old seems relaxed, almost upbeat. But two hours in, he eventually admits that he dismembered Rory Hachet.

Do you see how upset I am? No. You're pretty calm. Under circumstances, I'm a little concerned how calm you are. This is video viewed at the trial of Adam Strong showing his first interrogation. It was taken after Strong was arrested in December 2017 for the murder of 18-year-old Rory Hachet. We cannot show you video containing the second interrogation taped in November 2018 and played in court Monday. It was recorded after Strong was charged with the murder of 19-year-old Candace Fitzpatrick and it has yet to be filed as an

exhibit. But we can tell you Strong admits to dismembering Rory after the officer tells Strong that it's believed Rory was pregnant when she was murdered. Strong argues Rory was not pregnant. I could bet my life there's no way getting around that I chopped her up. So what is it about his frame of mind, Ashley Wilcott? And it's dangerous to go into the mind of a killer because sometimes it sticks with you and you can't shake it off. But he admits he chopped her up, but he refuses to recognize this teen girl, Roy Hachet, was pregnant when he murdered and butchered her. Isn't it wild? Now, I'm not the psychologist, thank goodness for Karen Stark. But from what I've seen as a judge, typically what it means

is there is some type of experience that they had earlier in life that they simply cannot accept that, that that's not something they can handle, but they can handle chopping up an 18-year-old. And remember, it doesn't have to make sense to us, right? So whatever is in his mind doesn't take away from the fact that he committed this heinous crime and that, yes, she was pregnant. He just can't believe it because something's wrong with him. Dave Mack, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. Dave, how did the girls go missing? Where were they last seen? How did he get his mitts on them?

You know, Nancy, at this point, we don't exactly know, but we do know that in the case of Rory, she was actually seen in the small downtown area for the last time prior to going missing. But we haven't gotten the information from the police. They're not actually, I don't know whether they don't know exactly what happened yet or if they just aren't releasing that information. But we do know that Rory was last seen downtown. And this is while her mom was working 12-hour shifts to support her just before they head off for a year-long adventure in a refurbished bus

before Rory was to set out for college. That was not meant to be. Let's hear it straight from the horse's mouth. Here is Adam Strong by Brittany resin. As mi numerous images, strong s had quote done a horrible also asked strong numerou

sexual relations with the investigators had found hi examining hasha's pelvis, which was found in Strong's basement freezer. Strong appeared shocked. He said, quote, I took her apart, right? So could it have spilled? Later on in the tape, he went on to describe dismembering the body, saying, quote, it felt

natural the way I cut around the socket and everything released. It felt natural the way I cut around the socket and everything released. It felt natural the way I cut around the socket and everything released. He's also denying raping the young girls, even though his semen is found on Hachet's pelvis. He says, I took her apart, didn't I? Couldn't it have spilled? What does that mean, cut around the socket everything released joseph scott morgan what he's saying is that he didn't if folks at home will just take their hands and put them on

on their thighs and your long bone in there the femur okay just imagine like a tree branch if you tried to cut across a tree branch it's very very, very difficult, but where, where our bones, those long bones, like our femurs connect at the pelvis, if you can go in there, there's not a lot of so much cutting across the grain that's involved as there is dislodging it from the socket in the pelvis. So you have to cut around the tissue, that sort of thing. And literally you just dismantle or dismember the body that way. And, and, you know, this gives me an indication that he has some kind of familiarity with this, Nancy. And back to my earlier premise, he's not new to this. That's what's terrifying about this.

You're right. I wonder if there are more victims. We know about these two. He strongly denies having sex with their bodies, although semen was found. He also denies other victims. But I agree with you. You don't just suddenly murder and dismember. This is not his first time on the stage in his mind.

So, Dave Mack, what's the status of the case against this maniac? You know, I don't want to say maniac because he's clearly sane. This evildoer, Adam Strong. Still at trial, Nancy, and this is not going to go away anytime soon. We just don't know. This is not the end of the game. This is just the first of what could be many trials to come. We wait as justice unfolds. In the meantime, our prayers for the families of these two young girls. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off.

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