Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Rich Kid Mows Down 4 Pepperdine Sorority Sisters, Hires Karen Read Lawyer

Episode Date: August 13, 2025

The driver in a violent crash that killed four Pepperdine college students has entered a plea in court and hired a celebrity attorney. Fraser Bohm, the man accused of crashing a speeding car into four Pepperdine University sorority sisters who were walking along Pacific Coast Highway, pleaded not guilty in the deaths of all four sorority sisters.  Alan Jackson, recently making headlines for the acquittal in the very high-profile case of Karen Read, also represented actor Kevin Spacey in a sexual assault case and was a former member of the Los Angeles County District Attorney’s Office team that successfully prosecuted music producer Phil Spector for the murder of actress and model Lana Clarkson. Bohm appeared in a Los Angeles County courtroom on Wednesday to hear his charges, alongside his new attorney, who was most recently the legal representative in one of the highest-profile murder cases in recent memory. Bohm, of Malibu, has hired Alan Jackson, who just recently secured a not-guilty verdict in the Massachusetts murder trial of Karen Read, according to Court TV. Joining Nancy Grace today: Bridget Thompson - Roommate and Best Friend with Pepperdine Crash Victims Coco Crandall - Roommate and Best Friend with Pepperdine Crash Victims Brian Claypool -Trial Attorney, Owner and Managing Partner at the Claypool Law Firm, and Author of "Break the Code of Silence: Raising My Voice to Protect Our Kids;" Instagram: @brian.claypool, Facebook: @BrianClaypoolMedia Caryn Stark -  Forensic Psychologist, Renowned TV and Radio Trauma Expert and Consultant; Instagram: carynpsych, FB: Caryn Stark Private Practice Joseph Tremblay - Senior Forensic Engineer and Accident reconstructionist, Veritech Consulting Engineering Dr. Kendall Crowns - Chief Medical Examiner Tarrant County (Ft Worth), NEW Podcast "Mayhem in the Morgue" (launching AUGUST 20), and Lecturer: Burnett School of Medicine at TCU (Texas Christian University) Dave Mack - 'Crime Stories' Investigative Reporter See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A rich brat mows down, moes down, four beautiful Pepperdine sorority sisters. In the last hours, we learned he hires the Karen Reed defense lawyer. I'm Nancy Grace. This is crime stories. I want to thank you for being with us. Four beautiful young college sorority girls in their early 20s with bright futures set out for a fun night in Malibu.

But in a shocking turn of events, that evening soon became a nightmare. Joining us tonight, in addition to an all-star panel, are two dear friends of the victims. But first, listen to this. The four females were pronounced dead. The Alpha Phi Sisters arrived to Sigma Kai's party, and are waiting outside when a red BMW speeding down the PCH going at least 100 miles per hour suddenly swears from the road and slams into parked cars. Party goers scream as the parked cars are shoved into Neve, Peyton, Asha, and Deslin. While bystanders call 911 and attend to two

others injured in the crash, the BMW's driver gets out, stumbling away from the mangled cars. So don't bother telling me he was too out of it or injured to know what he was doing. Under the law, is called flight. I'm sure veteran trial lawyer Brian Claypool will argue with me about that. What you heard earlier is from our friends at Malibu Times. Four beautiful co-eds in the prime of their lives. Standing there, minding their own business, are mowed down at speeds of 104 MPH in a residential area. Now will a rich brat manage to escape justice? having just hired a controversial defense attorney that helped Karen Reed get an acquittal. Again, with me an all-star panel, but first I want to go to two very special guests.

Bridget Thompson, roommate and bestie with the Pepperdine crash victims, and Cocoa Crandall, also roommate and best friend of the crash victims. You know, to Cocoa Crandall, I don't call it an accident because when you put your foot to the pedal and exceed 104 MPH, that's no accident. This is a crash. Tell me what you know, Coco, about the night of the deadly crash that stole your friends from you. Yeah, I remember getting a call that night saying, you know, don't. freak out. There's been an accident and we think it was Ash's car. So I immediately drove down there. I was like, they have no family, all their families out of state. You know, they need someone

and Bridget met me and Bridget met at the scene or as close to the scene as we could get. But we just sat on the curb all night not really knowing what was going on. But then, you know, news broke and once we hadn't heard from them for a couple hours because we were always in contact with our friends. We knew that something was wrong. I'm just imagining you, Cocoa, Crandall, sitting there on the curve. I've got to tell you, I've been to so many crime scenes and seen family and loved ones and best friends like you,

literally sitting on a curb because there's nowhere to go. There's nowhere to sit. And you just sit there, kind of suspended in time and space, just waiting, it's like everything comes to a standstill. Everything seems to stop. And you're just waiting, waiting to hear something, to know something, to find out something. Bridget Thompson also with us, roommate and bestie of the crash victims. Bridget, what do you recall about that night? Yeah. For me, I actually was supposed to be with them that night. I had cheer practice that night, and it ended running a little late.

So I texted them and let them know that I'll just meet them there. And as I was on my way, I got a call as well, and it was kind of along the same lines as Coco. And just thought there was an accident and the girls aren't answering. I tried calling all of them, but none of them answered. And like Coco said, I went over to the scene and tried to do whatever I could. But at that point, it was just such a helpless feeling. Bridget, when you got to the scene, what did you observe? Well, we couldn't get past, like, the police officer that was blocking us off.

So really, it was just a bunch of stopped cars and a police officer standing there. And then in the distance, we saw a bunch of sirens, ambulances, but nothing other than that. Did anyone or could anyone tell you what had happened? Not directly. There was things coming out in the news because there was quite a bit of news coverage on it. And that's kind of how we found out our information. We heard there was four dead, six involved. So we were praying that hopefully we only lost two of our friends with that math.

But unfortunately, that just wasn't the case. Bridget, did you try and question the police or try and ask anyone any questions? We definitely did, but we knew that there wasn't really information that they could give us. What did you do? Who did you try to speak to? What time of the night was this? The crash occurred at 8.30 p.m. we were trying to speak to just the police officer standing, you know, blocking off the scene.

And then we were calling hospitals all night trying to see if we could locate them anywhere. Because at this point, we didn't know that they had died at the scene. And a hospital just wasn't necessary. Cocoa Crandall also joining us in addition to Bridget Thompson. Coco, were you there sitting on the curb waiting for answers? as well. Yeah. Yeah. So Bridget and I happened to get there around the same time and we both were pleading to the officer to let us through to give us any insight on what was going on and we're like we know those are our friends in the scene. We can track them. We see they're not quite at the party. And yeah,

like Bridget said, they couldn't really give us any answers. So we just sat there for hours, you know, calling hospitals and asking if they had our friends. tracking them and probably, I mean, like Bridget said, I don't know if I even fully remember a time, but I think it was around 1 p.m. or 1 a.m. And then we went back to Pepperdine's campus up until, you know, 6 a.m. the next morning when more information was released. Who told the girls' parents? Originally, the school was the one to break it to them, but the parents, I mean, you know, mothers know when something's wrong. And so a lot of the parents were also calling me and just saying, hey, you know, what's going on?

Where's my, you know, where my daughter is, whatever. But it took a while for the coroner to confirm what had happened. So this will kind of officially, you know, tell the parents right away because they had to wait for the officials to confirm it. Bridget, when did you first see or speak with the girl's parents? I was in touch with some of them over the phone the next day. So early in the morning on October 18th, I, someone came up to my room and said, Neve's parents are downstairs, they want to talk to you. And I just broke down because that was like a realization to me.

Oh, my stars. I cannot even imagine going down and trying to speak to the parents. And the parents were there in the apartment, the place that you guys shared? No, I didn't go back to that immediately. Never went back to that apartment. I briefly said bye, but they had us in a hotel room on campus. When you first saw the parents, what happened? it was hard they were obviously a mess beside themselves um they were unclear of what had happened um

exactly so i tried to give them all the information that i knew but it was a situation that i wouldn't wish on anyone it was really really heartbreaking coco what do you recall yeah um i i i like bridget said remember the parents coming up they came so fast And I remember when Ash's parents came because they had flew from the East Coast in, there was just so much sadness and grief and heaviness all around. And I just remember walking outside the hotel and meeting her in the parking lot. And we just held each other and cried. And I remember seeing her brothers. and there was just a lot of tears shed and eventually we got to kind of all sit in a room together with, you know, all the parents and Bridget and I and some of our close friends as well.

And we tried to just, you know, tell their parents all amazing memories that we've had with them at school and how wonderful they are and just share, you know, more about our, how Malibati. it was a happy place for them. It's just reminding me so much of when my fiancé was murdered. When you're trying to, in those first hours and days after, it doesn't seem real, your head knows it's real, but the rest of you doesn't know it's real. And you're like remembering events together, things you did together. I don't know if that's some sort of comfort or solace. your mind as you try to absorb what has happened. Bridget, you stated you did not go back to the

apartment. Why? Oh, I just couldn't. I mean, when I left there, I could still picture them right now. They were all sitting on the couch. We were laughing, giggling. I told them I would see them after cheer practice. And we had so many amazing memories in that apartment. We I mean, we spent every second together so I couldn't imagine going back without them. It was and when I did just because I felt like I needed that for my closure

when I walked in our apartment it was clear that they were meant to come back. It was clear they had their pajamas set out on their bed, their lights still on. They were they were meant to come back I just it was truly

heartbreaking the night you're at the crash scene girls did you see the defendant no we did not crime stories with Nancy Grace

joining me now crime stories investigative reporter dave mac who is the defendant his name is fraser bone he is a 23 year old rich kid growing up in privilege in malibu in an 8.7 million dollar seaside mansion um he was driving his his 18th birthday president of BMW. And he is a former athlete, was a pitcher in high school, and pretty privileged young man, Nancy. Why do you say that? I'm looking at a picture of him and apparently a shirtless selfie. Can we circle back to that, please? And he's got rings on every finger. He's dripping in silver jewelry. What did you say about a $7 million what?

An $8.7 million seaside mansion with a view of the Pacific Ocean. A beautiful view of the Pacific Ocean, actually. And by the way, also a $700,000 vacation place out near Palm Springs. In this particular incident, we lost four young people with a complete life ahead of them. for really no reason other than complete and reckless disregard for the life of others. So Neum Roaston, Paton's Store, Desolene Williams, and Asha Ware were seniors at Pepperdine, and they were mining their own business, just being in the neighborhood where their school is, and they lost their life unnecessarily.

Between two and a half to four and a half seconds prior to the collision, the defendant's vehicle was at a speed of 104 miles and out. KTLA 5. Loved by all who knew them, the four young women were more than best friends. They were sisters bonded through Pepperdine's Alpha Feed. While they were planning a glamorous night out, one young Malibu man would change the course of their night. exactly what happened the night that these girls were mowed down dead by a BMW traveling

at rates of that we know of 104 MPH they're standing on the side of the road they are not in the road waiting to enter a college party now they're dead four gorgeous young, innocent, beautiful girls. They're gone. Neme, Payton, Asha, Desert, gone. Tonight, we're analyzing why. You know what I'm saying? Gone? Let me say it correctly. Why they're dead. They're dead. And don't you know their parents are wondering the same thing? you just met two of their best friends that they lived with. It could have been them too. It didn't matter who was standing there.

It didn't matter how young or innocent or vivacious or how scrubbed in sunshine they were. It didn't matter to the defendant who was driving his brand new BMW given to him by mommy and daddy at least 100. M.P.H. On October 17th, at around 8.30 p.m., Mr. Bonn was allegedly speeding at speeds of 104 miles an hour on a 45-mile-an-hour zone on PCH when he lost control of his VNW. He allegedly crashed into a park car before crashing into four pedestrians standing together. on the side of the roadway. All of the young women die at the scene. To top it all off, it's a fixed object. Out of everywhere, you could drive your car.

You plow into a fixed object and then into four young girls. And listen to this. Party host, Sigma Kai brothers tackle the male driver to the ground and hold him there until police arrive. I just saw some people taking him out of the some people taking him out of the car and holding him down on the curb and everything else.

And he was just yelling and screaming. From our friends at KTLA-5, joining me veteran trial lawyer, defense attorney Brian Claypool, managing partner Claypool Law Firm, author of Break the Code of Silence, raising my voice to protect our kids. Brian Claypool, he tried to get away. That's called flight under the law. So don't tell me he was out of his mind. or he was depressed or he hit his, he tried to get away, Brian.

That's damning under the law. The guys had to tackle him and drag him back. Look, this is a heartbreaking tragedy. I mean, we all have kids. But we can't measure how a young man is going to react to a traumatic situation. It's not like he hopped in a buddy's car and was driving to the, to the Mexican border. Why are you making that up?

Why are you making that up? It's not like he hopped into buddy's car. Maybe he would have, but he didn't have a buddy's car there. So he did all he could do. And he took the pat and Turner, pat the street and turn the corner. He tried to run. Isn't it true, Claypool? That, that is evidence of guilt.

Flight is evidence of guilt. When you try to get away from the crime scene as fast as you can. Right. No, you're right. And that's why Alan Jackson has a tough case ahead, too. It's not, just because he won the Karen Reed trial, remember in that case there, you couldn't even establish the, the manner of death in that case. Brian Claypool, this is not about Karen Reed, okay? I'm talking about these four young girls and this guy trying to get away from the scene.

That's what I'm talking about. So let me try to get the car back in the middle of the road. Could you address him trying to leave the scene? And I haven't even gotten to the crash yet. Yeah, Nancy, look, you're right. Flight is evidence of guilt. It doesn't matter how rich this kid is. Every defendant in a criminal case is entitled to do it to a defense, whether we like that or not.

So what he's likely going to argue in defense of Baum is the following. Was there a potential malfunction in his car? They're going to expect, examine the car. How did he go from 94 to 104? I'm sorry. I just coughed up my hot tea. A malfunction in the car? like lead foot, like his foot on the pedal?

What possible malfunction? You know what? I'm glad you said that because I happen to have an accident reconstructionist with me, a renowned one, which I'm going to follow up with what you're saying. But I like that. Go ahead. Spend me some more gold rumple stilts. Can accident malfunction?

Go ahead. I can't write fast enough. Yeah. Well, the other argument that his previous lawyer made was he was involved in a road road rage incident, so that's going to be investigated by Alan Jackson. And if there was a road rage incident, let me make sure I understand what you're talking about. You're talking about the mystery vehicle, the mystery vehicle that was chasing him that nobody's been able to find on any of the road cam, that car? Yeah, that's the car, right. And that's what they'll look

into. They're going to have to look really hard, really hard. I'm may take a little, let me just say, creative editing to find that mystery card. He's claiming something along the lines of he cut somebody off because he was texting, and the guy got mad of him. And so he, boom, ran away as fast as he could. So he wouldn't be injured and then crashed and killed the four girls. That's one of his arguments. Real quick, one other argument, I don't know what that has to do with anything. Well, look, one of his other arguments, my job is to tell you what a defense lawyer is going to argue. Okay, hold on. Dave Mack joining me, I want to follow up on everything Claypool is saying.

Because, while I don't buy any of it, it could be a defense that they try to raise a trial. And the best thing the prosecution can do is be ready for that defense and be prepared to shoot it down when it rears its ugly head. Dave Mack, tell me about the mystery road rage incident. There's a man named Victor Calandra. He's a resident of Malibu for over 35 years. He's driving his 2016 GMC-25 pickup truck in close proximity to Fraser Baum. And he says that Baum was speeding and driving in and out of traffic. And they actually caught up to one another right at Sunset Boulevard toward Topanga.

and that's when Calandra said he's trying to get Balm's attention at the light to tell him to slow down. And Boehm never acknowledges him. And when the light turns green, Baum accelerate with extreme, I think is the term with extreme acceleration up the road. Calandra couldn't, was not, he was right there with the light with him, but did not keep up with him as Bone takes off. And it seconds later when the accident happens. And it is Calandra, who actually was young. yelling at BOMP at the crash scene. And that's who they're claiming was actually road rage when, in fact, he was telling him to

slow down. You know, there's going to be footage of that. Dave Mack, what stretch of the road was the alleged road rage incident where now we're learning from the other driver he was trying to motion to Bome to slow the hay down? But what stretch of the road was this? Well, we're dealing with, you know, stretch of the PCH that is called Dead Man's Curb, which is actually a long stretch there. But it's an area of the PCH that is just beyond Sunset Boulevard toward Topanga. And the erratic vehicle, in this case, being driven by bone, was at the Los Flores Canyon Stoplight.

That's where they caught up. So it's a very short area where they actually caught up at the light where Pallandria. You just made me so happy, Mac, which typically does not happen in a case like this, but you just made me so happy. Because to Joseph Tremblay joining me, Senior Forensic Engineer Accident Reconstruction with Veritech Consulting Engineering. Tremblay, that was music to my ears because I heard PCH, Pacific Coast Highway, and we all know it is dripping in traffic cams. I heard Dead Man's Curve, which as I recall, has signs

posted the curvy nature, like beware on Dead Man's Curve. And also, the speed limit there is greatly, greatly reduced because of the curves. Also, I heard

Dave Matt from Crime Stories state the intersection at Los Flores Canyon stoplight. I bet you that have a traffic cam as well. I mean, I'm hoping they do because this could corroborate the witnesses story. It could corroborate the defendant, but I don't think it is. What does all this mean to you, Tremblay? When I look into a case like this, I start with the evidence of the scene itself. And in this particular area, it's a very windy part of the road.

And those wines in the road require certain steering inputs, which would require a tent of driving, essentially. And I want to reiterate the fact that in this particular area, there are cautionary signs indicating that a turn is ahead, but the speed limit in that area is 45 miles per hour. And I'll do the math for you. He was going 59 over the speed limit. That's more than double the speed limit. Hold on, Tremblay. I did a little research last night, and we found out that in some of those spots, it's actually 35. There's also some 45s, but in spots where he was, it's actually 35 MPH.

Yeah, that's an incredible excess of speed. I'd like to also point out that the dynamics of this impact, suggests that he contacted three other cars. Those cars have significant damage. There's actually photographs of those vehicles that he contacted. And to be honest with you, those cars probably diminished the impact severity that he produced against these four lovely young women.

So Joseph Chimbley and regular people talk, what you're saying is the cars he crashed into to start with were a barrier, a buffer to the victims, and they would have suffered even more had he not crashed into those cars to start with 104 MPH? That's correct. This is just such a severe impact. The four females were pronounced dead by a senior. The Alpha Fee sisters arrived to Sigma Kai's party and are waiting outside when a red BMW speeding down the PCH going at least 100 miles per hour suddenly swears from the road and slams into parked cars. Partygoers scream as the parked cars are shoved into Neve, Peyton, Asha, and Deslin. While bystanders call 911 and attend to two others injured in the crash, the BMW's driver gets out, stumbling away from the mangled cars. From Malibu Times. In a chilling turn of events, 22-year-old Frazier Bohm tore through the infamous stretch of Pacific Coast Highway known as Dead Man's Curve, doing over 100 miles per hour and a 45-mile.

per hour zone. He was behind the wheel of his luxurious BMW allegedly fleeing from a road rage altercation when his recklessness would create a nightmare no one could have imagined. A BMW brand new to him just gifted to him by his parents. Joining me now, in addition to Karen Stark, renowned forensic psychologist, Dr. Kendall Crowns, joining us, Chief Medical Examiner Tarrant County, that's Fort Worth, store of a brand new hit. podcast, Mayhem in the Morg. He is esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU and has performed literally thousands, thousands of autopsies, accidents, natural causes, suicides, and

homicides, including vehicular homicides. Dr. Kendall Crowns, thank you for being with us. The girls standing there, minding their own business waiting to go into, I believe. leave Bridget and Coco, it was a Sigma Chi party? Was that where they were headed? Yes, it was a mixer. It was like an event for our sorority. It wasn't a party. Okay. What's the difference? There was no drinking involved. Okay. I neither had to be a difference because when you put the Sigma Chi's and the Alpha Fees together in one place, it sounds like a party to me. So why Cocoa, Crandall,

were they waiting outside to go in? So they weren't, from our understanding, they weren't necessarily waiting. They actually had parked their car. If you're familiar with PCH, you only can park on the street. So they parked their car, got out of their car, and we're walking to the house to go to the mixer. And in the process of walking, that's when they were hit. Got it. Got it. So they're walking into a mixer. Wow. Okay. Dr. Kendall Crowns, I just wanted to make sure I understood what they were doing. You know, another reason I wanted to know, Dr. Crowns, because because so often, somehow the victims turn out to be the bad guys in the media. And with the defense, no offense, Brian Claypool.

I know you do everything you can to help your client. But Dr. Kendall Crowns, they were A, not drinking. They were B on the side of the street walking into the Sigma Chi House for a non-alcoholic mixer. I just want to be very clear, all dressed up in their party outfits, having all gotten ready together back at their place they all shared with our guests. I mean, Dr. Kendall Crowns, you know what time it is, right? I'm looking at colleges right now for the twins. And hearing something like this just pushes me over the edge. Dr. Kendall Crowns, what happened to these girls when they were hit by a couple of tons of metal at 104 miles per hour?

So what happens when a car is going at a very high rate of speed and it hits a pedestrian. Initially, the bumper comes into contact about your knee level and folds your knee in, causing your thigh to strike the upper portion of the front of the car. And that pitches the body onto the hood. The head hits the hood or the windshield. And at that high rate of speed, the body will flip up over the car and then fly through the air and land on the ground. Now, one of the other things when you're having someone drive at that high rate of speed is you'll get traumatic amputations where the legs will be severed from the point of impact and then just kind of spread out all over the roadway. You also might see, depending on their height, amputations at the hip area, bodies cut in half, and even potentially from the speed with the head hitting the windshield decapitation.

There'll be massive internal injuries, fractures, all the extremities, ribs, pelvis, and then the organs themselves will be ruptured or lacerated as well. It's actually high-speed velocity pedestrians accidents are very gruesome events. Dr. Kindle-Kraounds, how many cases like this have you worked? So pedestrians truck by vehicles are fairly common. We see them at least probably once a week. but high-speed pedestrians struck by vehicles are very rare because most of the time pedestrians aren't on the highway and most people aren't driving their cars at 104 miles per hour

when they hit a pedestrian. I'm glad you mentioned that last comment. I'm going to circle back to you, Dr. Kendall Crowns, for more of an in-depth analysis of what the victims may have lived through. But Brian Claypool, joining us veteran trial lawyer, managing partner Claypool Law Firm, joining us out of California. Did you hear what he said?

Very rarely are victims walking on a highway where high speed crashes normally happened. This was not a highway. And they were walking along the edge of a pedestrian street where the MPH was 35. Yeah, hey, Nancy, I get that. But I think what Alan Jackson is going to do in this case is he's going to go after the county of Los Angeles and or the city of Malibu. I think it's likely the county for failing to adequately maintain that road. What do I mean by that? Your entire show, you've mentioned probably four or five times, Dead Man's Curve. It was also called Hell's Corner. The county's on notice that this is a

dangerous curve. Why wasn't there better lighting? That's what he's going to argue. And he's going to argue also a, was there a guardrail here? I don't think there was. And if there wasn't, there should have been. And that might have minimized the impact. And this tragedy might have been avert. Well, at least you're going down swinging. You're going to try and blame bad lighting and no guardrail and push it all off on the county. Okay, that sounds more like a civil lawsuit claim where you're trying to distribute the monetary damages, I'm talking about a criminal trial for vehicular homicide. I'm sure, Claypool, that you are familiar with the abandoned and malignant heart theory under the law, which rises too. I would like this to be prosecuted

as murder, not vehicular homicide, because of the abandoned and malignant heart theory. Malice murder. Murder one can be proven in many different ways. One is, of course, when you say, I'm going to kill you, Claypool, I've had it. And I take a gun, hold it up, and shoot you dead. Okay. That is clear, extrinsic, and implicit evidence of intent to murder. There is another theory called abandoned and malignant heart.

What does that mean? Here's an example. You drive 104 miles an hour through. let's just say a street festival that's been blocked off where people are selling food and homemade items and crafts. And there are 200 people there on a Sunday afternoon drinking a lemonade and eating kebabs and suddenly here you come, Claypool, 104 MPH, plowing through the street festival and you kill people. That shows an abandoned heart. In other words, you have a heart, which is abandoned of empathy for other people.

And you do something so insanely reckless, it equals murder. That would be my argument to this jury. And you're trying to blame bad lighting? I respect that. Well, look, I respectfully disagree on that my argument applies to a civil case. You know as well as I do you've got to prove causation, even in the murder case here. And what Jackson is going to argue is there can be concurrent, concurrent. causation. And here's another point. In order to prove murder in this situation, in California,

to prove causation, what's called implied malice. Not that he intended to drive over these young women. You've got to prove that he acted in such conscious disregard for the lives of others that he knew that it was likely that these young women would die. And what Jackson is going to argue is that that wasn't in his frame of mind. That he didn't intend on doing that. Didn't intend to trying to somebody. Again, you just made me so happy because you said

he didn't intend it. But isn't the black and white letter of the law which will be read to the jury in jury instructions just after closing arguments that the law presumes the defendant

intends the natural consequences of his act. Isn't that true? Yeah, I'm not sure if that's a jury instruction in California. You could try to make that argument as a prosecutor. Well, let me refresh your recollection. It is. The law presumes that you intend the natural consequence of your act. Look, if this case goes to trial, Bohm is going to have to testify

to try to refute. Wait, let's assume you're correct, Nancy, then he's going to have to testify to tell a jury what was going on in his mind at the time of this incident. And that's really what Jackson is going to have to do. I don't care what's in his mind. Why do I care what he's thinking? You should care because the first question Jackson is going to ask him. Did you intend on driving off the side of the road to kill these young ladies? That is relevant in this trial to refute your abandoned heart theory. It is, Nancy. Abandoned heart means you act with such gross negligence with a malignant heart that you kill others. What you're, thinking does not go as twice called negligence. You're not thinking, hey, I want to kill four

girls all dressed up in their party dresses to go to the Sigma Chi mixer. You don't have to think that. If I go into the Mall of America with an oozy and start firing, I don't have to know who my victims are. I don't have to mean to kill them. That is an abandoned and malignant heart and that is murder. But I just looked it up just to make sure I was right. And guess what? I am. The law presumes that you intend the natural consequences of your act. And it's called, in your jurisdiction, non-target offense liability. You don't, it just like I said, if I take a piece of thin china, so fine you can see through it, and I throw it to the ground. Wow, what did I intend to do? Break it. When you drive 104 MPH in a residential 8,000,

area where people are by the road, the natural consequence of your act is a crash. Let me ask Cocoa Crandall and Bridget Thompson. First to you, Bridget, have you ever been in that area before? Have you ever seen the Sigma Chi House? Yes, absolutely. And is it a residential area? What's around it? Are there homes? Yes, it's 100% a residential area. It's lined on both sides with homes. Are there other fraternity homes, sorority homes on that street? There is one, but it's not like a Greek row or anything, but there's definitely residential homes. So they're private residences?

Yes. So good luck with that, Brian Claypool, that there needed to be a guard rail to prevent this horrific, deadly crash. You're going to blame a guardrail or bad lighting? oh, I can't wait. Well, one other thing I would do if I'm Jackson is, again, I disagree as to the state of mind a bomb. I think you have to ask him, why did he go from 93 miles an hour to 104 miles an hour? That gets to your defense.

I mean, if he has some rational explanation as to why the car accelerated 10 miles an hour in a short amount of time, he might be able to get over this abandoned car series. He's an a-hole. Did they teach you that at Harvard Law School? An a-hole? The defendant knew his actions were dangerous to human life and deliberately acted with conscious disregard for human life, committing four counts of implied malice murder in this case. I can't say this enough. We have to realize that when we're driving a card, we have the potential of killing others. When we're driving at 100 plus miles an hour

on a 45 mile per hour zone, the only reasonable conclusion that kid arrive out of that behavior is harming others. I told her that the greatest threat to her young, vibrant life. and the future goals was a motor vehicle accident which is still the leading cause of death

in her age group at that time I asked her that since I've lost the argument you were just seeing Deslin's dad Desmond Williams speaking and that's my friends at Pepperdine University to YouTube trying to make sense

of a nonsensical tragedy. He's one of eight parents devastated. Tonight, while we're on air, they're at home sitting in their dims and around their supper tables, looking at an empty spot. Maybe they're sitting in the girl's bedroom. Maybe they're driving by their apartment,

thinking about what, was. I want to go to two very special guests. But first to Karen Stark joining us. Forensic psychologist, renowned TV, radio trauma expert. You can find her at Karenstark.com. She has dealt with so many survivors trying to make sense of a new normal. Karen, please, what is your advice to these two girls? joining us today? I think that they need to do exactly what they're doing, Nancy. They have to keep talking about this. I'm so glad they're on the show. I'm very sorry that this happened, but the more they get involved, the more they talk about what this person did, the disputing,

all of the neglect, the better they're going to feel. It will never, ever go away, unfortunately. Don't we know that? I think everyone knows that that hole in the heart never closes. But over time, it will get better. Just keep spreading the message that this is terrible and should never have happened. And remember your friends. Girls, when I first moved to New York to start off at Court TV, Karen and I would watch trials together in a dark studio and we would talk about what the victims had gone through.

remember that Karen all those years 11 years in those dark studios and she's right it it won't go away it changes you don't cry every single day but probably right now that's still your situation and Karen please jump in whenever you have a suggestion Bridget and Coco tell me about what life was like living with these beautiful girls. First to you, Bridget. Yeah, life was nothing short of perfect. When I met them, my life literally changed. They were the most amazing people I have ever met and I think I will ever meet. They made every day a better one. They knew how to pick me up When I was down, they were always a shoulder to cry on. It was just the best to live with them, to wake up to their good mornings every morning to go to bed, hearing their good nights.

I just miss it a lot. You know, it struck me, Bridget, that when either you or Coco went back to the apartment, I believe it was you, their PJs were still lying out on the bed where they had placed. them to hop into when they got home? Yeah, they were. Coco, tell me about a typical day that you would have waking up with these beautiful girls. Yeah, it was, I mean, it literally felt like a dream every morning getting to wake up with them. They are, like Bridget said, they are the bestest of friends, and I don't think we'll ever find friends like that again. They're truly, I don't even think most people are lucky enough to have friends like we did in their whole lifetime.

But we would wake up and we always had a playlist that we would play mornings. And we would wake up, open the curtains, let the sunshine in, just sit in our PJs, make breakfast, play music. We lived obviously in a great area. So we'd walk to the beach. a lot of time either on walks along Zuma Beach or at Point Doom. So it's a lot of time in the water, just swimming around. And then I feel like we always would go get dinner at our favorite Italian place in Malibu. And I mean, it's such a simple day, but any day with them, whether we were doing nothing or anything and everything was.

just such a dream and I know I can speak for Bridget and I like we would give anything just to have one more day with them do you ever dream about them yeah absolutely I mean so after the accident because I lived with Deslin and Bridget live with the rest um Bridget and I moved in together afterwards into a different apartment um and would be like we both had dreams and it felt so real that both of us were like we don't want to ever wake up because we just want to keep dreaming and some of them felt so real some of them were dreams about them coming back and telling us like hey we're okay we're in we're in a spot and you know it happened so fast and like I want you guys to know we're okay and so Bridget and I would just wake up and sometimes just like

cry together from our dreams because they felt so real but then we'd wake up and It's just hard to, you know, keep going in life without them. You know, I feel like we were just in a really big denial stage for a really, really long time. But Dr. Kendall Crowns, it wasn't that way. It wasn't just all so fast. They laid there and died. You talked about severed limbs. You talked about horrific impact at 104 MPH.

They didn't just die, just like that. Well, that is very true, Nancy. It really all depends on where they got hit and what was initially damaged. Now, of course, the initial impact that could sever limbs could cause a person to go flying over the car but not hit anything else. So their head would be intact and they would be laying there with the traumatically amputated limb bleeding out on the roadway. It really all just depends on what organ system got hit and at what point was their head and. or their neck engaged or how quickly they may have died. And it can be one of those situations in which just the lower extremities were severed or crushed or whatever or their pelvis was crushed and they just lay there slowly bleeding out and nobody could help them because of the amount of damage that was done. Joseph Trimbley, Senior Forensic Engineer Accident Reconstructionist at Veritech Consulting, how do you go into this scene, knowing what you know, having heard Bridget and Coco and Karen and Dr. Crowns,

how do you go in and perform a hard, cold evaluation that will hold up in, court to explain to a jury what happened? What do you do? Well, I have to look at the facts. I have to look at the evidence. And I think it's fair to say in this situation at that excessive speed, this was no longer a car accident at that rate of speed. And the collision that occurred would cause severe damage. I mean, he's probably lucky himself that he didn't have any injuries from this. This is so severe. And, you know, one of the nice things we have in this situation is so much evidence and so much data, in particular the data from the vehicle itself, which will corroborate his speed. It'll corroborate his pre-impact navigation and whether or not he attempted any sort

of maneuver to avoid this collision. So there's a lot of evidence that's going to be presented at trial, and I think it's going to be very elucidating for this particular crash. Trimbley, what do you mean you're going to get a lot of evidence from the car itself? I got a lot of evidence in the Alex Murdoch case from his nav, his navigation system, which was awesome. You can't really argue with the nav system in your own car. What evidence are you talking about? Well, that's a great question, and there is a lot of evidence from a navigation unit individually,

but in addition to that, modern cars are constantly recording data. Every car out there, it's a federal mandate that they record data. And that particular data is tied to the airbag system. In the event of an airbag deployment, the car decides whether or not to deploy the airbags based on things like vehicle speed, steering inputs, braking inputs, things like that. data is stored on the car. That can be retrieved. In this particular crash, that data was retrieved by the responding officers. And that is most likely the way that they determined the impact speed and then also the way that they determined the pre-impact acceleration that was done by Mr.

Baum and his apparently completely absent attempt to avoid this crash. Trimbley, I know that the arriving officer saw skid marks and smoke. What does that mean? That may actually suggest a small maneuver or breaking attempt to potentially mitigate the crash. I'd have to look into that even more. If it was a skid mark, that would suggest potentially maybe a steering input or a braking input to decelerate slightly before impact. However, that also kind of depends on how the crash unfolded itself. The data will provide a very solid basis for all of that.

And the nice thing about that data is that, you know, it's been admitted in many different court cases. It's very solid. It's hard to argue that data. I'm sure Mr. Jackson will probably make a very honest attempt to kind of reduce the credibility of that data, but it's just very solid. It's been used a lot, and it's a very valuable piece of evidence here. To Bridget Thompson joining us, roommate and Bestie with the crash victims, do you ever dream about them? Yes, I have had many dreams with them, and

it is an amazing feeling to feel like you get to be with them one more time, but it's hard to wake up and no, it's just not the truth. In the dreams, what's happening? What are they saying? Sometimes they'll reassure us that they're okay. Sometimes they'll be like, it's okay. I'm okay now. And I'll try to convince them to stay.

And they'll be like, I have to go back. I have to go back. It's a really crazy feeling. Karen Stark, what do these mean? What do these mean? What's happening in the girls' psyches? It's a case of them trying to preserve the friendship with the girls. And this is actually wonderful.

Because a lot of people, when they lose someone, they want to dream about them. You have a chance to revisit, even to say goodbye, which I'm going to suggest to both of you, that you tell yourself you want to do that when you have the dream again. to say goodbye to them and the whole idea of being with them again. It's all beautiful and very, very fortunate. I'm glad they're having those dreams. I know that when you wake up, it may be upsetting. But take it like a message, you know, that your friends have come and they're visiting with you.

Pepperdine University seniors, Neve Ralston, Peyton Stewart, Asha Weir, and Deslin Williams. Four Alpha Phi sisters get ready for a Sigma Chi party at their apartment. The girls are incredibly close after moving in together sophomore year. The women connected freshman year and became inseparable. The Pepperdine victims are a star athlete, future vet, TikTok intern, and an aspiring writer. Neve, a 20-year-old business student, was an excellent gymnast, cheerleader, and Polvolter, who competed in the CIAH championship. Deslin was on a pre-veterinary track with deep empathy for animals.

Peyton spent her sophomore year at Pepperdine's London campus, landing her dream internship with TikTok before returning to campus for senior year. Asha was studying, writing, and passionate about the dynamic landscapes of the fashion and music industries. If you have any information, if you were a witness, if you know anything that happened before, during, or after the fatal crash, please dial toll-free. 800-222-8477. 800-22-2-2-2-2-tips, T-I-P-S, 800-22-2-8-4-77.

We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace, signing off. Goodbye, friend.