Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - SAVANNAH GUTHRIE MOM MISSING: DAY 12

Episode Date: February 12, 2026

It's day 12 in the search for Nancy Guthrie.  Investigators are asking Guthrie's neighbors to send footage from home security cameras of vehicles, traffic, people or anything unusual in the days before Guthrie's disappearance.  A tent was erected in front of Guthrie's home as forensic equipment is seen being carried in.   TMZ received a new email from the person offering to give up information on the kidnapper.  The writer seems to complain about not being taken seriously,  saying the 1 bitcoin asked for was needed as protection from retaliation.  Joining Nancy Grace today:  Eric Faddis - Partner at Varner Faddis Elite Legal, Former Felony Prosecutor and Current Criminal Defense and Civil Litigation Attorney; Instagram: @e_fad @varnerfaddis; TikTok: @varnerfaddis Dr. Shari Schwartz - Forensic Psychologist (specializing in capital mitigation and victim advocacy), Author: "Criminal Behavior" and "Where Law and Psychology Intersect: Issues in Legal Psychology;" X: @TrialDoc Brian Fitzgibbons - Director of Operations for USPA Nationwide Security (leads a team of investigators specializing in locating missing persons), Marine and Iraq Wat Veteran; Instagram: @uspa_nationwide_security Scott Eicher - A Founding Member of the FBI’s Cellular Analysis Survey Team (C.A.S.T); Historical Cellular Analysis Expert; Former FBI Agent of 22 Years; Former Police Officer and Homicide Detective with Norfolk Virginia Police Dept. (having served 12 years); Currently with Precision Cellular Analysis handling Criminal, Defense and Civil Casess. Dave Mack  -  Investigative Reporter, 'Crime Stories' See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie missing. Day 12. I'm Nancy Grace. This is crime stories. I want to thank you for being with us.

We are at an hour of desperation. And we need your help. What happened? Was this really a kidnapping? Totally terrifying situation. You don't know what, what is? What is real? What is fake at this point? This criminal did mess up somewhere and they will be caught.

As we go to air, we have learned that a tent, a forensics evidentiary tent, has been put up outside Nancy Guthrie's home. Let's take a look at this. This was first reported by Matt Thin, FNC, a tent going up outside the front door of Nancy Guthrie. Guthrie's home. The first comment was someone opining that a body had been found. I don't think that is the case. Although I understand why the viewer said that. Again, that's from Matt Finn, FNC. Joining me, an all-star panel to make sense of what we are learning right now straight out to Brian Fitzgibbons, you and I have been on plenty of crime scenes. why a tent at this juncture outside Nancy Guthrie's front porch?

Yeah, what's unique about this crime scene is you've got not only your standard national media attention, or not, I shouldn't say standard, you've got an incredible amount of national media attention, YouTubers, members of the public out there. This is very likely done to protect whatever those agents are doing in there. So the equipment they're bringing in isn't being analyzed, the people aren't being photographed as they're working, and that speculation isn't being generated from whatever's happening. But who cares about speculation, Brian?

Whatever is speculated doesn't matter to the FBI. Typically, a tent like that is put up when evidence is being recovered. Sensitive evidence. Agree or disagree? or Fitzgibbens, when the evidence, as I said, was so sensitive, you don't want it, how can I say, polluted or destroyed in any way? I would agree, and I would say that this is done more for concealment and moreover for the suspect to be aware of exactly where they're looking.

So, you know, this is protecting the integrity of what they're doing. What about us, Scott Eicher? So there's some good equipment that we can use set into that little four-year area and it'll laser measure that whole area. So it'll give us like a model of how tall the arches, all the bricks where they are at. So it would be a very detailed picture using lasers to get that documented. Also, I mean, have we ever seen anybody in there looking for hairs? I mean, this guy stood there for a while, working with the door, bringing in shrubbery. Did he shed some hairs?

Did he shed some DNA? They might be just, you know, meticulously looking for anything that's still in that front porch area. Iker, could you explain the laser equipment you are describing that would take specific measurements? Yes, it's a device you set in the middle of a room, and it takes laser measurements. all around to give you exactly the model of that room. We've used it in numerous different cases, even in the theater shooting in Aurora, Colorado. You were motioning with your hands when you said,

you put the device in the middle of a room, and it takes measurements all around, and you were making a spiral gesticulation. What does that mean? Well, the laser has to go all the kind of, rotates around in measuring all the different parts of the room so you give you a full measurement of how far this wide it is how deep it is how tall it is we need measurements on that arch also right one of those things is going to help us give a height to this gentleman that's

walking to the door right because we now can say oh when he stood up he reached this brick in this archway so he's that tall. So there's a lot of information we can get from these type videos. So why would they need the tent to do that, to block off the arch to get the interior dimensions of the room of the porch? Yes, that's correct. And prevent from that laser going further. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. How does the laser work? It takes those measurements, bouncing it off the wall, making the measurements of how far that each room is. is and how wide it is, how tall it is. Does it need darkness?

It doesn't have to have darkness, but I think that maybe that tent would, you wouldn't want the laser to shoot out to the street, right? We're just trying to get the dimensions of that room. Nancy, the tent was taken down after a couple of hours. However, we got a good hint as to what was taking place that we couldn't actually see. When one of the investigators was leaving the scene, he was carrying a forensic height board. This is a tool used to determine the height of a suspect when you don't actually have the suspect in front of you. You just have marking areas around where that person had been.

So the forensic height board giving us a clue as to what was taking place while they had the tent up earlier today. And again, Nancy, it has been taken down. Wow. Okay. Now, we've heard from Iker, Scott Eichor. We've heard from Brian Fitzgibbons. Eric Fattis, you were mentioning earlier about how the scene was released too soon and various people could go up and take photos of Nancy's blood. I'm going to circle this back to the tent. That's a problem if there ever is a trial regarding chain of custody.

Oh, that's exactly right. I mean, in order to enter evidence at a trial, there has to be a sound chain of custody. there has to be proof that what you're giving to the jury is authentic, that it hasn't been contaminated, that it hasn't been tampered with. And that is always a significant issue when there are seen containment problems like in this case. And if they're doing this now, why now and not 12 days ago? This would seem to be something that crime scene specialists would do on the first or possibly second day. Fattis, you're absolutely correct. And that would be a great question for Nanos, the sheriff, because 12 days ago, the FBI had not been invited in.

Right? They were not given jurisdiction. So all of these things were just thrown out the window. Nothing happened. No video, no measurements of the area. We didn't need measurements of the area because we didn't have the video of the guy. and it just builds and builds and builds. So you're right about that.

Dr. Sherry Schwartz, what about the fact that you heard Fitzgibbon say he thinks the tent is largely for secretiveness to keep what's happening a secret? I wonder also how it affects the family when they see evidence being carted out, when they realize what's going on. He also mentioned he and Iker both

that you don't want to tip the perp off about every single thing that's happening. And all of those are excellent points, but the family is the first group of people that I thought of when we found out that a tent was going up because we associate that with finding remains of a person.

And so I can only imagine for them already being in this emotional limbo that they're in and having to wait and see just like the rest of us in many ways and how hard this must be for them. Oh, gosh, yes. When you see a tent like that going up around your mom's home, it's got to, just like the first comment was, oh, I pray to God in heaven, they're not bringing out a body. Because we're used to seeing that go up in the middle of nowhere where you found a body. We've seen it over and over and over.

Another development. Dave Mack, joining us, Crime Stories, investigative reporter. I want you to take a look at some video that we found of this guy in the area in the early morning hours. And this is from a neighbor's security cam. Let's see the video, please. Dave Mack, what do we know about this? Well, Nancy, we know very little, but look, you can see the man's head clearly. you can see what he's doing.

It appears that he's dealing with trash. And he's got another backpack there. Why isn't he putting it in the trash can? Well, he's reaching over. It seems to me somebody's handing him something, or he's reaching over far enough to get another bag. And now here we go past the dumpster. He's walking back towards wherever he's.

And this was taken a couple of miles away from the Guthrie home at about the same time. So, Nancy, I don't know what's going on. Let's see it again, please. I don't know what's going on North Tucson, you know, in the middle of the night. But it seems odd that we would have multiple people walking around. Wait a minute. That's a backpack.

At first I thought it was a trash bag. It looks more like a second backpack. It is, actually. You see the strap hanging down there. Now, I didn't notice that either. You can hear the sound of cans in that bag, though. You hear something. And it has been submitted to the FBI.

This video was turned over to them right away before it was posted for all of us to see. But again, you know, we're getting a good look. I want to see where he goes. Yeah, trying to see. Keep going, Dave, Matt. Oh, it is a second backpack. Yep. And he's not getting in the vehicle.

No. And now the thing is, Nancy. What is he doing? Wait, watch this, Dave. He hangs it over the side. He reaches over. something's happening on the other side of that wall. There's somebody else over there, I think.

Because he's getting something from somebody or something. I mean, why not if he's, he's not reaching far enough over to getting something from the ground. You see, he's only reaching, what, three feet down is all he can get to. Is he trying to get in behind that gate, trying to reach around to find the latch and get in? And he's not going to the car. So who is he?

and why is he there? And about what time of the day or night did this take place, Dave, Mac? We're at 153 a.m. And this was caught on a ring camera, the ring app. And that's why we're getting just that one angle. But again, you're talking at 153 in the morning,

February 1st. So this is taking place at the same time. It takes six minutes difference between the 147, on Nancy Guthrie's front porch. And here we go, not far from her house, a guy walking around with backpacks at the same time within minutes. Again, this just seems beyond strange. You've got a guy with two backpacks. He's handing it over the fence. He's grabbing something else. You saw him. He's got backpacking his left arm. He's reaching with his right arm. And now he comes

back up. He's holding the left back up and reaching with his right. He's resting that left bag on that brick wall there. It looks to me that Jackie's right. It looks like he's trying to get in that gate. Guys, this is posted on Ring Neighbor app. It's an app. A lot of people have them in neighborhoods and everybody on the neighborhood can look at it. Ring Neighbor app. We're not saying this guy is the perp. The reason it caught our attention is, and it's posted by I, Amy Lee, on X. And it's from the ring neighbor app. And the reason, Dave, that you and I are so interested in it is it's around 2 a.m. in the morning of the same night, Nancy Guthrie is kidnapped, starting around 147 a.m. 2 a.m. There is a spike in her heart monitor, her pacemaker spikes. And in 20 minutes or so, she's gone. this is just a few miles from Nancy's home. Again, we're not saying that this is the perp.

I'm saying this was posted on the neighbor, the ring neighbor app. A few miles from Nancy's home, the night she disappears within minutes of her disappearance. Who is this guy? What is he doing? Does that gate lead to a back alley? Does it lead to a back road to Nancy Guthrie's house? This has been sent to the FBI. And tonight, we are calling on all neighbors, everyone. Look at your ring apps.

Look at your door cams. This is how the case is going to be cracked wide open. By someone seeing something, a girlfriend, a wife, a friend, noticing something unusual. It's going old school right now in the search for Nancy Guthrie. Also, in addition to that tent going up and the discovery of that video on the Ring Neighbor app, Savannah has just released a heartbreaking, a poignant video. Let's watch.

She accompanies this with music, and there you see, Nancy Guthrie. with her little girls in her youth. That's Savannah and her sister Annie. There's a still including Brother Cameron. This is outside, we believe, the very porch where she was led out of the home leaving behind blood drops. I believe I know why Savannah released It's number one, her heart is breaking, breaking.

And she's going through all of these videos and photos of her mom praying desperately. Her mom is still alive and we brought home soon. Fitzgibbons, I think there's another reason she released it. Yeah, I mean, this is an incredibly emotional and humanizing video. You know, this is going to go like wildfire across the country. This is going to keep folks, as you were talking about earlier in this show, keep people inspired to persevere in this case. What about it, Iker?

I agree. And you're also sending a message to the potential kidnappers that this person has family, has kids, is a loved one. You want to humanize this person, not being just a victim that you don't care about. Now you're showing she's a mother and has a family. Hopefully that will preserve her and make sure that she stays alive. Dr. Sherry Schwartz, this is a desperate hour. I believe Savannah is sending this, speaking directly to the kidnapper. I agree, Nancy.

She is definitely trying to appeal to whatever scintilla of empathy that the kidnapper may have. But if not them, then somebody close to them who recognizes them, who knows it's them. This may appeal to them and they might go to the police hopefully and tell what they know. You know, you said something really important just then, Dr. Sherry Schwartz. To Eric Fattis, Dr. Sherry pointed out not just to them, but someone that knows them, maybe a mom that knows their son, their husband, their son-in-law, has Nancy Guthrie. And only a mom would really understand this video. The bond between a child and their mother, the last thing you want to do.

is separate a mother from their child, Eric. I think that's how the case may crack someone, a girlfriend, a wife, a mom, knowing their son, their husband, their ex, has Nancy. Someone knows something here, that this was not done in a way where only the kidnapper is aware of this. I am relatively certain that someone around them, a friend, a family member, an acquaintance, a coworker, somebody knows something. And these videos help to sort of galvanize the community and also speak to the emotional resonance within those people, hopefully, such that they would come forward and tell

what they know. Late in the evening, Eastern Time, we learn the discovery of a glove. That's the first thing we learn. It looks amazingly similar to the gloves worn by the perp on Nancy. Guthrie's front porch. Look at this guy. See those? That. Then we learn not just one glove, but two gloves found. Found by the side of the road. Now, you may think debris, people throw everything out of the cars. Everything ends up on the side of the road. But what is significant about the location of these gloves? Let's

than a mile and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home, the crime scene. Yesterday, we saw, and let's see the footage of it, please, we saw L.A. law enforcement, there's the FBI out literally beating the bushes in multiple locations, all on road sides. We saw them in Campbell. We saw them in Estrada. out combing the area beside roadways and then, wow, what a coincidence. That's my friends at Fox News, by the way. What a coincidence.

They're looking in multiple locations by the roadway and they find the gloves by the roadway. This as the question arises, cast Cellular Analysis Survey Team. with the FBI. They were the ones, I'm telling you, we haven't heard it from Kash Patel, we haven't heard it yet, but mark my words, they were the ones that unearthed

that porch video. It had to be them. And I'll explain with you, along with a founding member from the cast team joining us, how they did it. But my question tonight is, is their audience?

My little ring door cam has audio. I bet this did too. And what about the other cameras in the home and around the home? Is there more to come? Are they working feverishly at this moment to get more evidence and lead us to the identity of the kidnapper and God willing? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Straight out to Dave, David.

Mike, Crime Stories, investigative reporter. Go, Dave. You know, Nancy, yesterday we were talking about this incredible search that's going on and how many agents are in the field. We're talking hundreds were out searching yesterday. And a mile and a half, I mean, a mile and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home, on the side of the road, they find a black glove. You saw the video from the porch and it looks like the pictures were. we're seeing of the glove. And Nancy, it's shocking that they told us where they were looking and they found it. So they're operating on tips that we're not aware of. They've been given information or have unearthed their own information to know where to look. And specifically, I mean, you're talking about finding a needle in a stack of needles here. They find a glove just off

the road a mile and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home. I want to talk about the possibilities. It just takes one, just one, one hair, one little speck of touch DNA. Think about Brian Coburger, no motive, no confession, didn't find the weapon, no connection between him and the victims, but we got DNA. We got dna, deoxyriboniclate acid, a tiny amount of DNA. on the snap, the little button snap, on the hilt of a knife, a knife hilt, just that much. And no, Coburger did not have a record. So you couldn't compare it to DNA already in the system. Another hurdle.

Genetic genealgy. Experts went all the way up his family tree. They staked out his home. They got his dad's DNA. and that information gave them enough to get a search warrant to use to compare his DNA. And it was, I wrote it down last night, one in 5.37 octillion match to Brian Coburger. It just takes one. Let's talk about the gloves.

Now, first we heard there was one glove. Now we are hearing there are two gloves. Dave, Mack, which one is it? Two gloves found, but not together in separate areas. The one glove was found right off the road. That's the one we've been told about, about a mile and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home. A second glove found away from where the first glove was found. They're not indicating exactly where that one was found, but we've been told two gloves. Joining me, Brian Fitzgibbens. He is the Director of Operations, USPA, nationwide security. He leads a team of investigators that go around the world finding missing people. Fitzgibbons, don't you know that the perp was hot, not necessarily hot temperature-wise, is in the evening. It may very well have been cool outdoors. But from all of those clothes, and it looks like he was wearing layers of clothes, and I got a theory on that,

the stress of breaking in her home and getting an 84-year-old woman out. He's got on layers of clothes, including a ski mask or a balaclava, gloves the works. He gets in the car. He's got her in the car. And he is sweating bullets, Fitzgibbans. And can't you just see him rolling down the window, stripping off a glove? throwing it, stripping off a glove, throwing it. Hence the separation of where they're located, keeping one hand on the steering wheel. Just play it out. Unless, of course, someone was driving

with him. Go ahead. Hypothesize with me. For sure. And this is a common theme in a number of violent crimes like this that perpetrators will discard items of clothing, pieces of equipment that they used, weapons along the roadways, around the, near the crime scene, or a small distance away. We actually had a murder case here locally that was solved when detectives found a polo shirt five miles from the murder scene that was discarded out the window by the suspect himself, you know, they had DNA and blood from the victim on it. And this was five miles down the road, just on the side of the road found by a dog walker. So, you know, this is very common that they would want to dump those items,

especially as he's driving in those moments after committing this crime. He's, as he's moving along the roadways, that's some of the most vulnerable time for him because he's wondering, has police been called, are they searching for his vehicle in those moments right after the crime? You know, last night we were having quite the discussion regarding what could be, if these are the right gloves, what can be attained from the gloves? There's a lot. Number one, does anybody remember the name Totman, Casey Anthony?

If you will recall in the prosecution of Casey Anthony in the murder of her daughter, Kelly Anthony, she was acquitted. We learned, well, many people learned for the first time. I learned it way back when in the Atlanta child murders, that plastic, such as plastic trash bags and plastic gloves, each have a particular molecular makeup, a molecular signature, that that company uses to create their product, unlike any other company. Trash bags and plastic gloves can be traced to a batch and a lot down to where they were sent and where they were sold.

You ever heard of anything like that? Joining me, Scott Eicher, forensics expert, founding member of the FBI's cellular analysis survey team. Not only that, 22 years, former police officer in the homicide unit with the Norfolk, Virginia, PD, Scott, thank you for being with us. What do you make of that? The fact that they, FBI, not local law enforcement, they don't have the facilities, they don't have the wherewithal to do that, nor should they really. It can be done. And it's not that hard.

I totally agree with that. We've, it kind of brings me back to the Atlanta bombings because I was working that with the FBI, with Eric Rudolph back then. And the bomb components were all individual. And we were able to kind of go back and into each component we could figure out where was that made? Where was, where was that sold? So those are the tracks that the FBI's can be doing with these gloves. What's the composition? obviously the DNA and hair in the gloves themselves and then trying to figure out where they were purchased, how long ago were they purchased, try to give video from where these items were purchased. It is a big deal to find these gloves and hopefully they are related to

the Scuthorry's kidnapping or missing. You just gave me a great thought. Thank you. You know how tight it is when you rip off latex or plastic gloves, that has to take away. That has to rip off some hair on a guy's hand, some DNA. It's not just

you putting them on, which is probably enough to get touched DNA. Because when you look at the gloves he's wearing, they look tight. I wonder if he was wearing gloves under the gloves, which would not be helpful at all, but still the ripping them off

aspect from the wrist could very well, Scott Eicher, rip off hair or definitely touch DNA. I totally agree with that. And have you ever tried to put two sets of gloves on in the same hand? I've done that before, but it's very hard because they all are sticky. So I doubt he's wearing two sets of gloves, but it sure does look like the gloves that were found that are black in color match the video that we see of him coming up to that front door. This could be the break in the case.

I'm so excited and I'm hoping they could get some information off of this. You know, you said something else, Scott Eicher, and I'm going to follow up with you about what else could be obtained, such as fingerprints. But Dr. Sherry Schwartz is joining us, and I want to ask you a question about perseverance. Dr. Sherry Schwartz is a forensic psychologist at panther litigation.com. She is the author of Criminal Behaviourkewarm.

behavior and where law and psychology intersect. Perfect. Night before last, Dr. Sherry, we were also buoyed so happy that while Nancy was still missing, we had something. There had been a detainee pulled over and was being questioned. The hostage team was a few blocks away waiting to go in and try to save Nancy. We all checked the news throughout the night and woke up in the morning to find out it was a catch and release. He was not involved. We were back to square one. I felt so defeated. I felt like somebody kicked me in the stomach. And then I was overwhelmed with guilt. How dare I feel defeated when Savannah and her family woke up to the same news. It's like day after day, they're living in a nightmare. They're living in a nightmare. They're away from their home. Savannah lives with her family, her children and husband in New York.

She's out there. She's away from home. Her mother is missing. She could have been killed. It's a race against the clock. Evildoers, trolls are coming out of the woodwork trying to get money and torture them. It's a nightmare for her. So how dare we feel like we got a gut punch? how what can you tell us to help us keep going sherry because you know dr sherry schwartz you never know the FBI certainly does not need us but what if one thing that you say or fitzgibbon says or iker or mac or eric fattis one thing leads to one thing leads to one thing leads to one thing leads to a solution give us some encouragement for Pete's sake. Well, the best encouragement that I have is that in a case like this, of course, we want resolution.

We want to know where Nancy Guthrie is and bring her home safely. But the good news is, and we can look on the positive side, that if this isn't the person and this person has no idea and isn't a suspect anymore, then they keep looking. And that means there's still opportunity, right? Because if it is the person and whatever the outcome is, if it doesn't bring Ms. Guthrie home safely, then it's over and we're all grieving. But in this particular case,

it just means that the investigation continues and everybody needs to stay vigilant. Because like you said, Nancy, you just never know. You never know who might hear something, who might see something. Putting this video out there of this suspect is, this intruder is excellent because somebody might see this video and recognize this person from the way they walk, the way their body looks. So it's really about staying vigilant, staying engaged, and helping to bring Nancy Guthrie home.

Joining me, high-profile defense attorney Eric Fattis, the founder of the law offices of Eric Fattis, former felony prosecutor. You can find him at Eric Fattislaw.com. Eric, thank you for being with us. how do you do it when you're in the middle of a trial and you get a big blow, the judge rules against you, you think the jury is going to rule against you, your client is horrible, how do you keep going? Because I'm very curious because yesterday morning, when I got up 530,

looked at the news again and saw it was real, the guy was not involved back to square one I had to drag myself. If I didn't have to get breakfast ready for the twins and my mom, I think I would have just, I guess, go back to bed, I don't know. I had to drag myself out. That was a blow. And then I immediately felt horrible that I felt defeated.

When Savannah is out there just bone tired, exhausted, trying to put one foot in front of the other, how do you do it? when you get a setback, and I know you do. Sure. I mean, what a rollercoaster of emotions for this family, certainly for Nancy Guthrie. You know, when that happens, you've got to try to remain resilient. I think having a good support system around you is helpful.

Having sort of faith in the integrity of the system and the objective of the system to seek justice. You know, it appears that law enforcement is continuing to follow up on leads, being diligent and thorough, although there have been some missteps. And you have to hope that there are genuine efforts and people who truly care about the outcome of this case and about seeking justice and sort of draw upon that energy, draw upon what they're bringing to the table and sort of collaboratively try to reach the best outcome available under the circumstance. I want to go back over Dave Mack. Well, Eric Fattis, you're right, by the way. Dave Mack, I want to go back to the discovery of the gloves.

again, it was no coincidence that we see law enforcement side by side all up and down, the highways, looking by the road, not just the roads in Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood, but all around. Estrada, they were in Campbell, they were in Trada, Tucson, they were in various areas. and I knew they were all looking by road sides. I knew that meant something, but I didn't know what it meant. And then, of course, there is no coincidence in criminal law, Dave Mack. Gloves are found on a roadside, and that leads me to think possibly someone had called in a tip of having seen something thrown out of a vehicle.

Where all were they searching? And Dave, weren't they searching behind Sister Annie Guthrie? and again at Nancy Guthrie's home? I think, you know, Nancy, it's important to point out that when we think about a search with law enforcement, you know, we tend to think of, you know, maybe 15 or 20. We're talking hundreds here. This was a massive undertaking of law enforcement, FBI, local deputies. We're talking real searching in these areas just off the side of the road.

Now, just a mile, mile and a half away from Nancy Guthrie's house. You know, Nancy, just off the road in this area, it's rugged terrain. We're talking arroyos that go four or five feet deep, a lot of brush and rocks and packed eye. I mean, there's a lot going on, even that close to the road. So to have this many law enforcement personnel out seeking, they had to have information that put them on this road because look at the results. But going back to Annie Guthrie, you know, this was something that is not getting talked about a

But law enforcement went to her neighborhood, Nancy, to Andy Guthrie's neighborhood, and went door to door there. They looked in the brush. They looked in in little backhouses, you know, where you store lawnmowers and things like that. They searched for something or someone all throughout that neighborhood, door to door. Now, they did the same thing at Nancy Guthrie's too. They didn't just fan out into the brush. They had her house and went out from there. They were looking, like I said,

they found the first glove they found was a mile and a half from the home, not very far. And we're talking directly across from where Nancy's house is facing. Look at her front door and go straight out that way into the brush. That's where this was found.

The other glove was found nearby, not far away, as you mentioned. Like if you're taking one off and throwing it, taking the other off and throwing it, that's about the area where these gloves were found. So again, going back to this, we're not talking a couple dozen law enforcement officials spending the day walking. We're talking hundreds in a very structured search of a very specific area and finding what they're looking for a mile and a half from the scene of the crime. I think they had more than just a tip.

I think we just don't know what they have yet. Carlo Palazuelos, the individual that bore a general, resemblance to the guy on the front porch is actually a delivery person who delivers not just to Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood, but likely to Nancy Guthrie's home. He was detained and questioned. This is him speaking. He has nothing to do with Guthrie's disappearance, and this statement dashed our hopes that Nancy was this close to being found. They helped me and get my will. They didn't bring me my rights until two hours later. Okay? You know what I'm gonna? My wrist is off, swollen? From the backup? Did you have any idea that this was about? No. Do you know who Nancy Guthrie? No. When they finally told you this was how to do with some kidnapping, like what were you thinking?

What the fuck I'm doing here? I didn't do anything. To be honest, like, I'm innocent. And you don't even know who the lady is? Do you know who Savannah Gunther is? No. No. I don't. I don't. I don't. I don't. I don't. I don't. I don't watch the TV show. The front porch video emerged. What can we learn from this video? How did this person get in? How did they exit? I'm wondering if there had to be two people.

I think this is going to be the tip of the iceberg. We're going to see more. We're going to have a better idea as to what happened. We'll be back to the glove in a moment regarding the possibility of getting DNA from the gloves and or fingerprints. But I want you to look at a conundiose. a conundrum that we observed after a careful inspection of the photos of the guy on the porch, as we call him. In one clip, in one frame grab, he is wearing a backpack. And another, he's not.

Let's see those. Now, this tells me a lot. This tells me that very likely somewhere there was a car. We don't see the backpack laying around. Where is it? And where did he come from? Okay, Dave Matt, Crime Stories investigative reporter,

way in. Nancy, that's been the big question. One thing I've noticed as you see this guy walking up towards the walkway, right? He's kind of got this odd gate kind of loping as he comes into frame. And then once he knows he's in camera frame distance, he stops, ducks his head,

and starts with a different kind of a shuffle. And I think, see, we see him coming from somewhere and you see him loping. And that's why I said, this guy's been here before. He knows what's going on and knows where the camera is at their angle. Because he comes at an angle and immediately drops his head. So was his vehicle parked down the street? Was it parked, you know, a street over?

You know, it's interesting that we've had some sightings of vehicles in the neighborhood maybe there was a rehearsal parking in a certain area and walking. I mean, we just don't know because we're not getting that info from law enforcement at this point, but he had to come from somewhere. He wasn't walking around at 1.45 in the morning just out for a stroll to, you know, get to this location. He had to be nearby. And then, Nancy, they still have to get, I think they're talking to people too.

We only have one on video, but I don't see how you're going to get an 84-year-old. fairly immobile woman out on your own. This guy doesn't look like he could handle her by himself and maintain control. Her cane is left in the house. You have to her out of the home by either walking with her or carrying her, and that's going to take two people.

So where is the vehicle? Was the other person waiting in the vehicle until this guy was able to disable the cameras? We don't know, but he had to be somewhere. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace That eagle-eye Jackie here on the set. Notice, let's see that double photo again, please. Not only is he missing a backpack, where's the gun?

Okay, Eicher, former FBI, what about it? Here at my radio producer, Jackie, had to school the FBI. FBI cellular analysis survey team founding member. What about that founding member? She's exactly right. I did notice that in the photos comparison when you showed him up. I'm like, where's the gun and where's the backpack? So where is this later on after he's gotten into the house?

Put him up. Iker. Yes, ma'am. You noticed it, but you just wanted to keep a special secret and not say anything about it. Whatever. You noticed it. Okay. Analyze.

secrets. Believe it. So what do you make of it? The backpack's not there and the gun's not there. Right. So is this a later time frame in that? Did he's already been in the house? Now he's moving things around, maybe walking her to a car or something like that and doesn't

need the gun and the backpack. He's not walking her anywhere. He's on his way walking back in. Look at the picture. Where's the gun? Where's the backpack? Let's analyze it. Put it.

What else could it be? Yeah, where did he put it somewhere, right? Did he leave it in the house while he's moving things around? Or did he take it to the car? Now he's coming back. Leave up the picture. Hey, Iker, look at the photo on the left and look at the photo on the right. When I was first looking at them at the photo on the right, I thought, wait, is that the backpack over there to the right under that palmetto plant?

It's not. That is the pot, a pot for a plant. Because if you look at the picture on the left, you see two of them. The picture on the left really shows me the background a lot better. If there was a vehicle, I'm sure he parked it away from the home. But wait a minute, that really doesn't make sense if he's leading her to the vehicle. He would park as close as possible, right? Agreed, agreed, unless he brings the car around.

If there's more than one person, we've got a lot of different scenarios going on here. Another thing, photo on the left, keep the photo on the left. when he drove away if he went in that direction, that cam may have caught it. Of course, then he took the cam down. Which leads me to another question, Iker, if he removed the cam, would it have kept recording? Is that possible?

It's possible if it has its own power source. I have nest cameras and they don't have their own power source. They don't have a battery in them. They have to be plugged in. And as we saw from them removing that camera on the roof, there was a solar panel that gave the power it needed. Other cameras are hardwired. All mine are hardwired.

So they have to have a power source. It's usually just the camera and not any batteries in it. So once you take it away, I think it's not going to record anything anymore. Okay. If it has batteries and you take it away, would it keep recording? Yes, it would for a small amount of time because it's going to lose its Wi-Fi connection once it gets away from the house. Okay, here's another question to you regarding the camera, Scott Eicher. Guys, just so you know, Eicher is with precision cellular analysis handling criminal defense, civil cases, and more at PCAExperts.com.

And remember, founding member of the FBI Cellular Analysis Survey team, they are the ones responsible for getting this video. And let me just put it out there right now. Eric Fattis joining me, veteran trial lawyer, Eric, at the beginning, the sheriff, who, by the way, buried the lead here, stated late last night that more detainments are likely to occur. quickly. He said that. Nanos. He also, however, said that at the beginning, oh, shucks. She doesn't have, she doesn't have a

subscription. No video. We sent it off to blah, blah, blah, blah, and they couldn't pull anything up. Well, blah, blah, blah, blah did a crap job because the cellular analysis survey team with the FBI got it after they mined the vast, vast millions and millions of data points from Google. That's a nest cam. Look at the top right, fattest of the photos. They all say Nest. Nancy Guthrie had the Nest equipment in her home. Google owns Nest. It's all Google. So they either got a court order or a subpoena or a subpoena ducus teacum

or plain old search warrant, is my guess. Or Google may have given permission. That said, they weighed through millions of data points and out of all that, a sea, a sea of information. They find Nancy Guthrie's porch cam

and manage to get this. My point is, at the beginning, Fattis, Nano says, darny darn darn, darn, no video. What about it? Can I trust what he's saying now that more detainments are about to happen? Sure, Nancy, I thought it was peculiar that the video took so long to be obtained and get public. Usually in these investigations, they have it within the same day.

You can go to Google, like you said, with a search warrant, production of records request, and they have to respond to that. In addition, there was some scene containment issues, and the sheriff has been criticized for that. And so there have been some missteps, as I mentioned in this investigation, and I'm not sure the public has full faith in law enforcement conducting the investigation and reaching an ultimate outcome and finding a suspect here. We also heard from Cash Patel stating, as late as last night, there are persons of interest. So Iker, I took us down the garden path there, but regarding the camera, Scott, My door cam, it's a ring, gives me audio.

I can hear what the person is saying. I can hear everything. I can hear the dog barking. Can you hear everything. Is there audio that we have yet to hear? It's a good possibility. I have several cameras at my house, but only two of them provide sound. So it really depends on which camera that was you at that front door on it that had sound ability.

I'm not sure we would have heard very much of him walking up to that house, but you never know what was possibility there. And I did confirm that KAST was the ones that kind of worked with Google and obtained this video. And it did take a while because Google had to do a lot of searching and have the right parameters to get this stuff. So Kass was definitely integral part in that aspect. As in the stopping of the gentleman a couple days ago or last night, that was later released, there's 100% possibility that that's cast looking at the tower dump information and seeing that that individual's phone come into the area, stay for a little bit and leave. And that's exactly what they're looking for in those tower dumps, is phones that

are not stationary like neighbor's phones or Nancy's phones. They're looking for phones that came in and left around that time that they believed she disappeared. So there's going to be a lot more of those little detainments just trying to figure out who was allowed to be there or had a reason to be there and then hopefully narrow down to our suspect. I pulled up with them. They were following me. Yeah. They were following me, Morana. This peep as in the San Cruz County and Miranda was down here, it's like, come on, two and two. And so then when they came up on you, what did they say? Like, what did they say? Nothing. Nothing. Nothing. They just told me stop moving. Like, what's your name? Carlos, and that's it, he put me in the car.

You've got to wait like two hours. I waited like two hours until the detectives here and everything. As Savannah herself stated, the hour of desperation, with every minute that passes, the hour becomes even more despairing. If you know or think you know anything about Nancy Guthrie's disappearance, please call 1-800-2-25-3-24. Toll-free. 5324. Or if you wish to remain anonymous, dial 520-882-7463. Repeat. 520 882-7463.

We remember an American hero, Lieutenant Shirley Lannning. Canadian County Sheriff's, Oklahoma, killed in the line of duty after 30 years, serving and protecting, leaving behind her great. grieving husband, American hero, Lieutenant Shirley Lanny. Nancy Grace signing off. Goodbye, friend.