Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Sex, lies & video: Murderous Colorado dad Chris Watts & his mistress

Episode Date: December 3, 2018

The police interrogation recordings of the Colorado dad who murdered his pregnant wife and two young daughters -- while courting a mistress -- are now public, along with the detectives interview of the girlfriend. Nancy Grace takes a long look at the lies of Chris Watts in this extended Crime Stories episode. She is join by deception & body language expert Susan Constantine, private investigator Vincent Hill -- author of "Playbook to a Murder," Atlanta juvenile judge & lawyer Ashley Willcott, and CrimeOnline.com reporter Ellen Killoran. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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forward slash Nancy find the truth guys stay with us for a two-hour special on the recently discovered video and audio regarding the death of Shanann Bella Bella, and Celeste, and killer dad Chris Watts. I really want to help you guys. I do. I feel like this whole thing is just going to be crazy regardless of whether I give you my phone or not. I mean, that's kind of how I look at it. Like it's happening. It's going to happen. Well, the texts reiterate what you've been saying all along, so it's happening it's gonna happen well the touch is great but you've been saying all along so it's not like well they do that's the other

thing too I mean that's kind of a good backup yeah I think you hit the nail right on the head there's reasons why we want everything it validates things that we know I'm not gonna come out tell you you that if you tell me something to date, we'll validate it with your text messages, whether it's the ones we have now or the ones you're going to give us. Certainly. I'm not looking at anything else except for the conversations between you and Chris Watts and the phone data between you and Chris Watts' phone

for times and dates for those phone calls. And then the content of the text messages that that are there and we can we'll write that specifically down here understand that don't want anybody to get some of those tags like they have nothing to do with this case and they're just like between you and Chris yes they're just they're just so just tell me what you're they're just kind of raunchy okay well everybody adult we're not gonna somewhere I don't need I don't want the ones papers to get that that's all I want the only ones that we would be looking for again is

the same kind of questions we're getting to here is things about his children things about his wife there's the of, did he ever, you know, has he ever said something to you that might indicate maybe not then, but now that there was something like this in his mind, or, you know, what we're looking for. I don't need to come out and tell you that. You are hearing the alleged mistress of killer dad, Chris Watts. And even in light of the fact that his wife, his pregnant wife, and two little girls were found dead, the mom, Shanann Watts, buried in a shallow grave, the two little girls found in vats of oil.

As a matter of fact, there are reports the two little girls had to be airlifted in separate planes because their bodies were deemed, quote, combustible. And they couldn't both be on one plane. I'm trying to confirm that. She's still whining about how she doesn't want to hand over her cell phone to investigators because there are, quote, raunchy texts. I mean, please. I've even told my 11-year-old twins, unless you want it on page six

of the New York Post, do not put it in writing, and really, don't even say it. If it's something you're ashamed of or something you don't repeat, just don't say it for Pete's sake, and she is impeding a homicide investigation because she doesn't want the world to see her raunchy text like I care about her raunchy text? Well, in the end, she did not impede the investigation. She handed over the phone. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Now we are learning disturbing video surveillance from Chris Watts, the killer dad,

next to her neighbor, shows him sweating profusely as he packed his vehicle. We now believe packing his wife and two little girls' bodies in that car. And chilling moments reveal a carefree, calm, cool, collected Chris Watts picking up a breakfast roll just after dumping his daughter's body in a shallow grave and oil tanks. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us this morning. I still don't understand why the state did not seek the death penalty in this case.

Joining me right now, Ashley Wilcott, juvenile judge juvenile judge lawyer founder of child crime watch on facebook and ashleywilcott.com and with me private eye Vincent Hill author of playbook to a murder on amazon and creator of a podcast fall of a titan Susan Constantine renowned deception and body language expert but now to crimeonline.com investigative reporter Ellen Killoran. Ellen, is it true what we are learning about the Next Door Neighbor's surveillance video? And let me back it up. Is it true the prosecutors flew, went to go meet with the victim, Shanann Watts' parents, and basically convinced them not to seek the death penalty, saying, oh, you know, it'll take years and years to implement,

and you don't know if he'll really get it, and even if he's sentenced to death, it may not ever happen. What do you know, Ellen? Yes, it's true that investigators and members of the defense team did meet with the parents of Shannon Watts and they did have discussions about whether they could forego the death penalty on this. And I do think that one of the factors was let's not have a trial. Let's accept the guilty plea and the terms of that plea agreement

so that the family doesn't have to go through a trial and there's a chance that if it does go to trial, he won't get the death penalty anyway. This way, at least we know he'll be behind bars for the rest of his life. To Ashley Wilcott, judge lawyer Ashley Wilcott calm Ashley it's not just Shanann Watts it's the two juveniles in this case the little children Bella and Celeste I mean I'm not getting into a discussion of death penalty yes no it's good it's bad but if they're if you're going to have

the death penalty I would think this would be the case to do it. What do you think, Ashley Wilcott? No, I completely agree. I'm really torn in this case. I understand from the victim's perspective and the family's perspective, listen, it's a big deal to have to wait to go through a trial to not know what the verdict's going to be, to not know whether or not jury's going to decide death penalty.

But of all cases where it's probably warranted. But that's true in every case you go to trial with. But I do think it's significant that in this particular case, the family said, okay, it may be better to go ahead and take it off the table and let's go ahead and resolve it now and not have to go to trial. But listen, when I think of these victims and not only the two, the three-year-old, a four-year-old, the wife, and the wife was pregnant, Nancy, let's not forget that.

It is absolutely the kind of case that I believe the death penalty should be considered. Well, we also know that Shanann Watts put up quite the struggle. Her autopsy reports have been released, along with that of the two little girls, Bella and Celeste. All three victims died of asphyxiation. Shanann was brutally strangled with scratch marks all over her neck. Also, we learned that she had patterned abrasions on her neck and the left side of her face and on her body so she was beaten she tried to live she was beaten in the face killing her and unborn baby boy nico the two girls were smothered, according to the autopsy report.

But let's backtrack. In a moment, I'm going to go to deception and body language experts Susan Constantine and Vincent Hill on the video of the next-door neighbor that shows him sweating profusely. Then coming to the neighbors, having never really had full-blown conversations with them and telling them over and over and over three times as a matter of fact what he was packing up in his car that day that's odd i i don't know why i would go tell my neighbor hey you know in your surveillance video where you see me putting those trunks in the car that those are our bags to go on vacation that's a whole nother can of worms let's take a look at let's

take a listen to nicole kessinger the girlfriend the mistress that finally comes forward two days after shania's disappearance after she read newspaper articles listen on tuesday which would have been the 14th of august um you had read some newspaper articles on the 13th and the 14th of August. You had read some newspaper articles on the 13th and the 14th regarding this case. You had also had a conversation with Chris at some point during the day on Monday. And on Tuesday, because of what you found, specifically what you said was, and I don't want to put words in your mouth, but you found out that his life was spent. And I, yes. And you did not know that prior.

No. And you found that out via the newspaper articles, and that caused you concern? Well, I just realized that he was lying to me, and I was like, well, if you can lie to me about this, what else are you lying to me about? And it made me realize that maybe his wife was in danger at that point, and it was day two, too, and she still wasn't home.

What did that cause you to do with your phone, though? Oh, what, when I deleted those? I was just kind of grossed out by him, to be honest with you. I was just like, I don't know what's going on right now, but you just lied to me, and I don't want to see this come over my phone anymore. So I removed it. So you just, you already said, but you removed text messages. I deleted all of his stuff because he lied to me. I mean, that's what it was. It was,

it was the hurt that made me delete it. And then it was the lie that made me start questioning everything else he'd been telling me for the last few days. And that's when you decided to come forward. Yes. Okay. Window treatments is one of those terms for something necessary but boring. Your blinds. You don't even think about them unless you move or they break. Well, when they're right, everything in your home looks better. But when they're wrong, everything in your home looks tacky. But let's be honest.

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when you use promo code Nancy. Repeat, 20% off everything at blinds.com if you use the promo code Nancy. That's blinds.com promo code Nancy for 20% off everything. Faux wood blinds, cellular shades, roller shades, everything. Blinds.com promo code Nancy. Rules and restrictions do apply. There's times like I was trying to help him find an apartment, like just for him, not for me, for him and his kids um to get set up and like there's times where i'm like well where's your wife moving to like how close is she gonna be to you you should be within like 30 minutes of your kids so they're close and like you want to go to

their school and close to your gym and like what's your price range like i was helping him get all of this stuff set up and it was like in a very decent manner. And I don't know if all of that is in text. Some of it's probably on the phone. Like at this point, I've talked to him so much that I don't even know which parts are like verbalized and which parts are texted at this point. But we can figure it out. Okay. You are hearing the voice of Nicole Kessinger, killer dad Chris Watts' mistress during this time.

Joining me right now, in addition to Susan Constantine, Vincent Hill, Ashley Wilcott, also with me is Ellen Killoran, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. You say there are inconsistencies, and isn't it true she has some very unusual computer searches as well? Well, that's exactly right, Nancy. And the computer searches are what I see as some inconsistencies. As you hear in her discussions with the investigators, she talks about her relationship with Chris as one where he was more serious about her than she was about him. She says repeatedly, she encouraged him to try and save his marriage.

She said he has such a beautiful family. Why not hold on to this, this beautiful home? She says repeatedly that she encouraged him to stay married and work on his marriage. But once there was a data review of her phone, it looks like maybe there is some inconsistencies. She had spent two hours online doing a Google search for wedding dresses. Wait, is this the same woman that searched for anal sex preparation? That is correct. Yeah. You know, it's funny how you gloss over the hard parts and you make me say them.

Okay. In addition to the frothy wedding dress, I'm the one that has to blurt out the anal sex searches. Thanks, Ellen. What else did we find on her searches? She definitely, she did a search related to terms, marrying your mistress. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, she definitely, um, she, she did a search related to term bearing your mistress. Um, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait, what, what did you say? She did it.

She did a Google search term search of terms related to the phrase, marrying your mistress. Is it true? She did a search on how much she can make if she wrote a book like Amber Frye. I don't think it was specifically how much can I make if I write a book, but she absolutely was interested, and she did Google searches on Amber Frye and her book deal and whether people hated her. Okay.

Let me remind everybody who is Amber Frye. Amber Frye I now consider to be a friend, a colleague. Amber Frye was the mistress of Scott Peterson Amber Frye did not know Scott Peterson was married to a pregnant woman Amber Frye then cooperated completely with police and actually caught Scott Peterson in damning cell phone conversations wiretapping him and as a matter of fact there was a fear that peterson would come kill her but she stuck it out and she was a star witness at the trial it turned

everything around in the scott peterson prosecution in the murder of his pregnant wife lacey and their unborn child connor so you know here you hear nicole k going, wow, I don't want you to find out, to release my raunchy text. Amber Fry put it out there and completely cooperated with police. She volunteered to cooperate with police and was a star witness. She then later wrote a book, and I hope she made a lot of money off that book. God bless her. To Susan Constantine, deception body language expert, you know, I've got to give it to Nicole Kessinger. Without her cooperation, this case may not have cracked the way that it did. But according to Ellen Kaloran,

there's a lot of inconsistencies. Yeah, there are a lot of inconsistencies. And the thing is, is that it needs, they need to go back and be able to verify the information that she's given them. But for overall, you know, when I'm listening to her, Nancy, there's a lot of truth in what she's saying. So the issue with hard to come over is her lack of emotion. You know, her emotion aspect is just completely off. She's very cavalier. Her tone of her voice can is really off-putting and so she really sets herself up for people to really scrutinize her because her personality is shining through about how she, you know, how she sees the entire situation and she how detached that she is the part that bothers me the most is that she's trying to pretend

like hey I'm coming in I'm the Savior work things out with your wife but yet she's kind of like pushing him away but then kind of motioning to come closer so she's she's very manipulative so I would for the investigators, they really need to tie this up and then look for congruences or incongruencies of what she's saying and what she does. That's going to be the key. We also know to cop turn private, I author a playbook to a murder creator of podcast Fall of a Titan, Vincent Hill. Vincent, we also know that just before her murder, Shanann Watts was actually online trying to find cheap, affordable weekend getaways to patch up her marriage with Chris Watts.

Well, hold on, Vincent. I've got to get a woman's viewpoint. Ashley Wilcott, I mean, I feel so bad for her. She's pregnant. She's got the two girls. She started this new job. She's traveling all the time, you know, and if he's looking up online How to find a weekend getaway that she could afford

For this piece of crap Chris Watts the husband who's we know having the affair with Nicole Kessinger Apparently having another affair with another woman and they're like in all this kinky sex Play-role role play acting. And here she is online trying to put together their marriage and plan a sexy weekend getaway. She was shanghaied by this criminal. And what amazes me, you don't know, Nancy, I've heard of so many women who are in this situation. She was the breadwinner.

She was busting it. She was caring forwinner. She was busting it. She was caring for her children. She was taking care of the house. And yet she was still focused on him. The other thing I want to say to all ladies listening, trust your gut, because I can tell you right now, I suspect the reason she did that is because she might've had a gut feeling that things were amiss in the marriage. It does not mean she deserved anything that happened to her, but it does mean trust your gut. And instead of saying, Hey, let's get a sexy getaway for this to try to fix it or repair it, look at the marriage and see what that person's really doing in the marriage. We should take a listen to this. At one point, he told me that they sat down and they talked about it. And he told her that he wanted to either fix things

or like to try to fix things and if she didn't want to fix them then they needed to like move forward with the separation and like actually file for a divorce at this point was was the impression that i got from this and was what he told me and so um he said that she was like pretty receptive to just not trying he was like she seemed like she just wants me to go he's like when she has her mind made up she has her mind made up and that's what she wants and he's like she doesn't want to try anymore and he's like and neither do i really and he was like it's done and he's like um and then the next day, I don't even know what days these were. Sometime when he was out there, he told me, we're putting the house up for sale as soon as we get back.

And I was like, whoa, that was quick. And he was like, it's her, she's ready to go. And I was like, okay. It's the dramatic moment cops confront Chris Watt's mistress after he murdered his pregnant wife and two daughters to start a new life with her. Why would you wipe out your family to be with me? The just released video shows 30 year old Nicole Kessinger being interrogated.

Did you ever say anything to him about her? Never, never. Anything about his kids being a problem? Anything about his wife being a problem? Never. Anything about his wife being a problem? Never. Never. This shocked me just as much as I think it shocked the rest of the world. She breaks down, sobbing over the gruesome fate of the children,

four-year-old Bella and three-year-old Celeste. Ugh. He's so disgusting. I'm so ashamed of him. Why? Why? Why? Why?

How? I don't even understand how you could, like, bring yourself to do that to somebody who's, like, that big. You were hearing girlfriend Nicole Kessinger, and you were hearing our friend at Inside Edition, Jim Moray, Susan Constantine, deception and body language expert. What do you make of that where Nicole Kessinger, the mistress, breaks down in tears? Well, it came on very sudden. So that's the one thing that I look for. And also how quickly she recovers after it. So that's what I'm looking at is that it's not unusual for someone just to break down. But when you listen to her voice, there is there. I'm listening for these kind of

breaks or pauses in the voice, but I'm not really hearing that. I'm not saying that she does not feel that way. I think that she does. But what bothers me the most is how quickly the onset of that emotion was and then how quick it ended. That bothers me because there should be remnants of it throughout. Once she's finished making that statement, you should still hear her voice still cracking up afterwards. So even though she's emotionally upset, she quickly gets over it awfully fast.

That's suspicious to me. To Ellen Kaloran, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, you mentioned inconsistencies what other inconsistencies have you discovered because i think not only was she genuinely upset about the best about the deaths of bella and celeste but also was distancing herself because if she had known anything about this murder plot she would have been roped into doing jail time right now. Yes. One thing that I want to make clear is that even though there are some inconsistencies in her story, it's also very clear that Chris Watts lied to her. She did not know Shanon Watts was pregnant. And he told her that Shanon was ready to leave the marriage when that is 100% not true. We see that. However, there's one other instance of the interrogation when

Nicole tells police that she never told any of her friends or anyone about her relationship with Chris because it was very early on and he was still working through a separation. But that ended up not being the case. She did have a text message exchange with a girlfriend about her relationship with Chris, and she called investigators the next day and told them that. investigative reporter in the last hours radar online.com has managed to get a hold of and watch that neighbor surveillance video from just 24 hours before his arrest goes down Alexis Tereshak thank you for being with us please tell me how you guys managed to get a hold of the neighbor surveillance video and what does it show so we had to file a FOIA request with the county Weld County in Colorado they have you know you just ran through that okay

FOIA Freedom of Information Act FOIA which means if it's a public record or some other types of records sometimes. You can file this, especially the press, or really anyone, an individual can file them, advocacy groups that claim they're advocacy groups anyway, are constantly filing FOIA requests. I used to have to file them with the Federal Trade Commission. But long story short, then a judge reviews your request, and if it's appropriate, you get the document. So you guys at RadarOnline.com filed the FOIA request.

Okay, then what happened? So then the Weld County District Attorney is releasing these things. They're releasing them to us, and the videos are shocking. I don't know if you have. I've watched you for years covering things. These are some really intense crime videos. This is exactly what the police used to help talk to Chris and to have him finally confess. Are you on a first-name basis with him?

What, have y'all gone out and had high tea at the plaza? Chris, are you talking about killer dad Chris Watts? I am. Oh, okay. I didn't know you two were tight, but go ahead. What, are you and Chris and Nicole hanging out at the Sonic or something? What? Yeah, I am maybe one of the only women that he did not.

Yeah. She's on his wife list. I'm with you on that. So you file the FOIA request. You get the neighbor surveillance video. What does it show so what it shows is chris is watching what what happens and you know and so it's from the neighbor's front door and you can see the watts house so you don't actually see her come home what you see is chris backing up his truck and he backs it into the driveway

and then you see him move in and out and in and out and in and out and what you can't tell is what he specifically has but what we learned is what he has is he has his wife's body he has his daughter celeste's body and he has his daughter bella's body and he's putting all of the bodies into the truck and then he drives away with the truck he doesn't even look concerned he's not looking around to make sure nobody's looking at him he's not hurrying he's not dropping things he's not hysterical he is so calm and methodical just as if he was loading his lunchbox in the car and then after that we find out dry cleaning did we find out Alexis Therese Chuck radar online.com that after that he goes out and has a breakfast roll just chill axis I wish I had time to go get a breakfast roll but this is after he's just loaded his wife and two little girls' body into the vehicle

and buries his wife in a shallow grave, dumps his two little girls in vats of oil where he works at Anadarko. Alexis, I also learned, and I'm trying to confirm this, that the two little girls' bodies had to be transported in two separate airplanes because they were deemed, they were so full of oil and had soaked up so much oil, they were actually combustible. Do you know that? I have heard that that is the case, and I have heard it.

And I don't know if your readers are prepared. My readers were so shocked to know, and I don't know if you know this, when those little girls were brought out of that tank, they'd been in there for three days, they had skin slippage, which meant that so they grabbed the little girl's arm to pull her out of the oil tank, and her hand, her skin came off her hand. And this little girl's body was nothing after her father shoved her through an eight-inch hole. One of them had scratches on her behind, and there was a tuft of blonde hair that was stuck

in the entrance of this oil tank when her dad shoved her in there. Alexis, I did not know that, and I hardly even know how to respond to that. You're saying the oil tanker container opening was eight inches in circumference? Yep, that's it, eight inches. So he had to shove their bodies in an opening that was eight inches wide? And the police even said to him they said you know at the smallest part of these girls they were maybe nine inches and he said yeah they fit in there they said did you have to shove them in there he said no not at all but he was lying as he lied the entire time because his daughter's body had scraped all down the side on her on her bottom because when he shoved her in there she scraped against

the side of it oh man you know alexis i remember like it was yesterday when you had your baby boy and you were with me talked all the time when i was pregnant and about to give birth to the twins i cannot even imagine i just it just really has thrown me off. I didn't know that fact. You just told me. In fact, it's completely thrown me off. What was I asking you before you told me that? Oh, I was asking about the two separate flights for the girls because they had, their bodies had, you know, soaked up so much oil I'm still waiting to confirm that my daddy is a hero he helps me grow up strong he helps me um snuggle He reads me books. He ties my shoes. If you're a hero, blue and blue, my daddy, daddy, I love you.

Aw, I love you. You are hearing the daughters, Bella and Celeste, beautiful little girls whose bodies were recovered out of oil tankers after dad Chris Watts murdered them following the strangulation death of his wife Shanann. In the last hours, we are learning so much more. And what I don't understand is why this guy was allowed to take a plea instead of going for the death penalty. Now, that was a family decision, but I guarantee you guys, we all know how it works. The family is guided by the prosecution.

So whatever the prosecution thought, they thought it was a safe way to not seek the death penalty in this case. Joining me right now, CrimeOnline.com, Ellen Kaloran Vincent Hill PI author of playbook to a murder and creator of fall of a Titan podcast Susan Constantine world renowned deception and body language expert and just joining us with the breaking news Alexis Teres Chuck with radar online.com now a lot of what we are hearing is from a podcast well portions of what we are hearing is from a podcast.

Well, portions of what we are hearing is from a podcast and yet to be confirmed. The taking two flights with two separate bodies and the way the children were put into that oil tanker and the size of the opening of the tanker being just eight inches, we have not yet confirmed and are trying to confirm that. But Alexis Tereschuk, RadarOnline.com, you have confirmed so much, including not just the girlfriend we've been listening to, Nicole Kessinger, but also some other woman who played these kinky sex games with killer dad Chris Watts. We have confirmed there was a second mistress, a woman named Amanda, and her name was secret all during. Okay, hold on just

one moment. I hate to interrupt you, but let me go to my partner in crime. Joining me out in LA, Alan Duke. Alan, what's wrong with men? Just a question. Vincent, don't worry. Don't hide because I'm coming to you next. I mean, it's just as my son has created another word, cringy. He's got this gorgeous wife, this beautiful home, two daughters, a son on the way. He's got Nicole Kessinger looking for apartments for him and searching wedding dresses and weird sex acts online now there's another woman what you know women do this too so it's not just men yeah right look they're not here look they are not here i know what that's about don't blame the male species it's all right fine whatever blame the devil okay thanks for that insight. Back to you.

Alexis to Russ, Chuck, let me get down to the facts. So there's, how did he even have time to work, have a wife, the children, the home, the cutting the grass, the blah, blah, blah, and two women on the side. It's like he's ordering side dishes for the table. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll have the sweet potato fries on the side for the table. I mean, he's just got, how did did he do it he managed his time very well his wife travels wait wait wait he's an expert at time management thank you alexis i haven't been able to laugh in some for at least the last hour thank you for that he's an expert at time management quote alexis

teresha radarline.com. I'm sure they're so proud of you right now. Go ahead, Alexis. Well, you know, his wife took their children, both of their parents live in North Carolina. So she went for six weeks in the summer with her girls when they were out of school to stay with his parents and her parents for a vacation.

And that is when he went wild. He was like a bachelor even his friends had joked with him and this was this was all in the police report police report that the county has released the friends sent him a text and said how was your life as a bachelor and he lied to his friends he said oh you know I'm just working out I'm not doing anything else he wasn't working out working out there working out I can make a lot of crude jokes right now but i'm not i'm not gonna do it hold on ek ellen colorin won't see and she's got some news

uh crimeonline.com investigative reporter what do you know ellen well i just wanted to note that we can confirm that the opening to the tanks that chris swaps stepped his daughters into was only eight inches wide. Even after he had told investigators where he had disposed of their bodies, they just almost didn't believe him. They kept asking him over and over again, are you sure? Are you sure? How did that work? Because these openings were so, so tiny. And I agree with Alexis. He is lying if he says that he was able to do that easily Alexis what can you tell me about him going over to the neighbors after they've spotted this video first of all where the neighbors across the street or catty-cornered to him and didn't he go over and start explaining what all he had loaded into his car he did he went Chris was the most heat prolific chatterbox during

this whole three days when his life is missing so yeah so he goes next door to his neighbors and he he tells them because he sees the video and and he realizes I suppose in his mind I need to justify this way but he says he sees the video did you just say he sees the video? Why did he see the video? They show it to him because he's pretending to look for Shanann, and he's pretending that she left the house, and he wants to know what. He wanted to see what happened. Where was she? Who came and got her? She leave with the girls, and instead, it doesn't show that at all. All it shows is him in the truck so according to you and and uh Radar online.com killer dad Chris Watts watches the neighbor surveillance video just hours before his arrest he was sweating and panicked and tried to explain his actions according to Alexis teres

Chuck Susan Constantine with me deception of body language expert susan constantine i would think it was the oddest thing in the world i know my neighbors i know them but i've never had them come to the door and start explaining to me what i'll and do it not once twice but three times what they were loading into their car. Why? Well, they thought something was suspicious because you know your neighbors and their normal behavior, right? So we know what they normally do on a daily basis. And when you see something out of sync, out of norm, you're going to question what that was. So if they saw him sweating, showing a lot of anxiety, going back and forth, back and forth is showing that there's something an activity that is that happening at that moment that was

different from his norm and they were questioning it because it was off his baseline clear the reason he kept saying he was loading this that the other is because he do eventually police were going to talk to the neighbors so they would come out and say well yeah he told me he was loading a box or a blanket or whatever. That's exactly why he did that, Nancy, to go ahead and set that mindset in his neighbors to tell police exactly what he told them. I think jumping into a new relationship is a little quick. It's like I was in a relationship earlier this year, and I think this is also a little quick and i'm like so why don't we take our time and i'm like if you guys end up doing a week on a week off with your kids

i'm like the week you have your kids be with your children and the week that you don't i'm like i don't even want to see you every day i'm like i think we should spend like a few days of that together i'm like because i like my space and i think you need your space i think you need your space to like develop your identity again and, like, get it back. Because I think he's just been, like, so wrapped up in this whole thing that he's got in his own life and his life that he, I mean, he doesn't remember probably what it's like to, like, be single or have time where it's, like, just him. And so I was just like, you know, like, embrace that. It's a beautiful thing. And I really try to, like, take it smart with all that.

And it was the same thing with his kids. I was just like, you know, like, and I, and we talk about things every once in a while where I, you know, I'd be like, Hey, if I ever meet, you know, cause like I have a lot of house plants, that's a good example. So I have a lot of house plants. And I told, I told him, I was like, one day, if I ever meet your kids, I was like, I'm going to show these girls how to like paint pottery and plants, plants. It was like, I think they would love to see something grow that they build. I think it would be really, really cute. And like little stuff like that.

But it wasn't very frequent. It wasn't, hey, we should get married. And hey, we should have babies. And hey, I want to live with you. And hey, I need to meet your children now. And let's cut the mom out. It was never like that. There was never any conversation about, you know, we can't do this with her around. We can't do this with the kids. It was never like that. There was never any conversation about,

you know, we can't do this with her around. We can't do this with the kids around. He never said that. You never said that. Yeah, maybe they didn't talk about the marriage and the moving in because there was a problem. His wife, Shanann, the pregnant wife.

I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us with part two of a special look at killer dad Chris Watts. Man. Joining me right now, Ellen Kaloran, CrimeOnline.com. Vincent Hill, private investigator, author, playbook to a murder. Susan Constantine, deception and body language expert. And joining me right now, Alexis Tereschuk, RadarOnline.com investigative

reporter who's just broken two new aspects of these murders. You know, I'm listening to the girlfriend, Nicole Kessinger. Were these statements, Alexis Tereschuk, before or after the bodies were found? Before. Okay, so she didn't yet know that the wife and the children were dead okay that that that's a little that alleviates some of this because i was wondering how could she talk about all that when the bodies had just been recovered you know another aspect to this is police were listening to her but they were probably also looking at her as a potential person of interest potential she did not have anything to do with these murders let's just be clear about that so the wife and the children at this point are missing and she's just talking as fast as she

can she conveniently left out the search for wedding dresses do people quote hate amber fry dresses? Do people, quote, hate Amber Frye, who was Scott Peterson's mistress when Lacey, his pregnant wife, was murdered? How to prepare for anal sex? Oh, let's see. There's just so many to choose from. I don't really know what to pick first. Alexis Tereschuk, I doubt pretty seriously she knew his plan to murder his wife and children or that he had another mistress. You guys have broken a lot in the last hours at RadarOnline.com. So bring us up to date, Alexis Terese Chuck. So I don't think she did know that he had another mistress. There's a woman named Amanda and she, we secretly interviewed her before her name became public. And she told us that she met Chris on a dating app. They had a really dirty one-night stand.

She said that he was into, he wanted to do a rape fantasy, that he choked her out while they had sex. Wait, wait, wait. In the rape fantasy, was he the victim or was she the victim? She was the victim. So he was the one that was raping her in their sex fantasy. That was consensual, she said. All that rage, all that hate towards women. I just, okay, go ahead.

And she said that she really, she had a really good time with it. She thought he was really attractive and it was a really sexy one night stand. So yeah, so he started cheating on his wife, his pregnant wife, basically the same minute she got pregnant. And then he moved on to not just cheating on her, but having a full blown relationship and a woman who thought they were going to get married. This is somebody who he FaceTimed with this mistress. He, so he killed his wife and children. Why are you acting so indignant that the mistress thought they were going to get married? The mistress knew he was already married.

I guess when she thought he was a marrying type, that he would just bounce back from one and marry her again. And so the night that the women went missing, the first night, I'm sorry, the daughters and his wife, he sat on his bed, his unmade bed, in his bedroom, on his phone, his iPhone, and FaceTimed with her so she could see. He was in the bed where his wife had most likely died and that he was just chatting with her. She said he was staring at her very intently. He wasn't crying about his children missing or his wife missing, just carrying on like a flirty conversation with her,

knowing that he had killed his wife and his daughters in that merry house within the last 24 hours. Wow. You know, it's interesting that people worry about the, you, Alexis, let me be clear, worry about how the mistress was hurt. You know, to Haywood, the mistress was hurt. You know, to hay with the mistress, she knew full well he was married with children. Although, although I don't think she knew the wife was pregnant. Vincent Hill, private investigator, author of Playbook to Murder,

so often the defense will be, and I remember Mark Geragos, who never agree with him, but he is a good defense lawyer, would always say say an adulterer does not a murderer make. And that's true. Just because you're having an affair does not mean you're going to commit murder. But in domestic homicides, very often you will find when the wife is murdered by the husband,

there has been an affair. So the converse to me is true. Very often in domestic homicides, you will find the killer is an adulterer. True. Adulterer doesn't mean a killer necessarily, but the reverse may very well be true. Vincent Hill, they had to know they were going to dig up at least one mistress, Vincent. Yeah, absolutely. And thank God, you know, if you're an adulterer, it doesn't make you a killer because I'd be dead right now. I'm on my second marriage. But I think what's very disturbing here, Nancy.

You do notice that none of the women on the panel are laughing, but go ahead. Go ahead and laugh to yourself. Go ahead. Because I tell you what, after all I've been through trying to have these children and raise these children, I would have, oh my goodness, I don't even know what I would do if I found out my husband was cheating. You know? Not a good thing. that's a whole nother can of worms but go ahead what's really disturbing nancy is i think with this other mistress that he met on tinder or whatever dating website it was the fact that he wanted to play out this rape fantasy and strangle her i think he was kind of setting the tone of what he was going

to do with his wife. And I wouldn't be surprised if more women came forward at a later time, whether it's from 10 years ago and say, yeah, he'd like to choke or strangle or something like that. So I think all the signs were there this whole time. And luckily for this other mistress, I think she got out kind of lucky, to be honest with you. Well, you know what? You're right. You're right. And again, although we're giving her a hard time, she is in no way implicated in his murderous plan.

As a matter of fact, listen to girlfriend Nicole Kessinger. It wasn't fair to his family for him to have an affair. It wasn't fair to me to have him lie to me and make me think that everything is the plan. And still to this day, I don't even know what's a lie and what's not. I don't even know if they were like filing for divorce. I don't know if they were putting the

house up. I don't even know. I don't even know anymore what is real and what is not. But what I do know is it's just like, you know, that wasn't fair to me either because if i'd have known not even all the truth but like obviously some of it i wouldn't have even engaged in any of this in the first place and it just i mean and that's the part for me just like on my personal level outside of everything that is happening that is gonna affect me long term. It's like, you know, I'm going to wake up every day and know that, like, this mom and her unborn child and these two little girls are not around anymore. And it breaks my heart.

It is so... Oh, my God. And then I have to think about, like, the consequences of his actions and how they affect everybody else. Like, all of these, her family's impacted. My name is about to be, like, slandered for probably a while. I don't know how long it's going to take to heal, but I would not be surprised if it's going to be hard to go out in public sometimes for a couple of years. And that really hurts me.

I'm just like, this is a horrible, horrible thing. Like, how dare you, you know? And people aren't gonna understand that you know they're gonna say oh you know you're the woman that had an affair with this man who took out his whole family and I take a step back and it's just like I didn ugh. It's, he's so disgusting. I'm so ashamed of him and everything. And I just, oh, those little girls. They're so little.

They're so little. And that's the part for me, just like on my personal level outside of everything that is happening that is gonna affect me long term it's like you know i'm gonna wake up every day and know that like this mom and her unborn child and these two little girls are not around anymore and it breaks my heart it is so oh my god in any and then i have to think about like the consequences of his actions and how they affect everybody else like all of these her family's impacted my name is about to be like

slandered for probably a while i don't know how long it's going to take to heal, but I would not be surprised if it's going to be hard to go out in public sometimes for a couple of years. And that really hurts me. I'm just like, this is a horrible, horrible thing. Like, how dare you? You know, and people aren't going to understand that.

You know, they're going to say, oh, you know, you're the woman that had an affair with this man who took out his whole family. Hold on just a moment. Alexis Tereschuk, RadarOnline.com. You told me that this statement from the mistress, Nicole Kessinger, was before they knew Shanann and the two children were dead.

She clearly knows that they're dead. She just said he took out his wife and two little girls. Everyone is missing, and this is what she went in. She just said he took out his wife and two little girls. Everyone is missing. And this is what she, she went in, she volunteered. She called the police herself when the girls went missing after the first night where I said they feast time that she saw that the house that bed had no sheets on it. And he was acting really strange. She called the police, but they never surfaced again. Everybody knew that they were all missing. And so she finally realized. Okay, so you're saying that this is after they go missing, they're believed dead at his hands.

He's a suspect, but the bodies haven't been found yet. Correct. Okay, to Susan Constantine, deception body language expert. Susan, the crying and the whatever, I couldn't even make out what she was. It's kind of like a squeak at the end. The reality is she did not commit the murders. That was not her plan. She was not involved in it at all.

But it seems a little disingenuous to be talking about how her name is going to be slandered. When you sign up to date a married man what do you think is going to happen when people find out they're not going to like it yeah that's the one thing that stuck out to me too nancy was that she was kind of bringing attention more to herself like how this is going to affect me in the future how people are going to see her in the future and she may have to be you know inside for a couple of years because of this whole thing that she's this man has taken out the his family so you know the attention is on the wrong person why is the attention on her and not about the kids I just find that to be really odd but

it's a very selfish person but the act in itself everything about her was very self-serving and selfish anyway being involved with a married man. He wasn't divorced yet. I mean, Vincent Hill, when will people ever learn? This is not just about men, although I'm having a good time, you know, jibing at you and Alan. Vincent Hill, come on, you leave a track, a trail a mile wide when you have lovers and then your spouse ends up dead. I mean, even without girlfriends or boyfriends or lovers or mistresses, they always look at the spouse first, the girlfriend, the boyfriend first, the lover first. But then when mistresses start cropping up, not one, but two, including one that you play out volatile and angry sex role playing

with that, that, that doesn't look good when your wife is missing. Why, why Vincent? Yeah. I don't know why people just can't get it right, Nancy, to your point, because, you know, anytime you're investigating the death of a spouse, the other spouse is the first person police look at. And then you add in, you know, violent sex playouts and another mistress with text messages about anal sex and everything else. Then, of course, that's where investigators are going to look.

And you had the other mistress say, oh, I went there and the sheets were off the bed, so I knew something was wrong. I mean, this guy wasn't the brightest bulb in in the light shed per se to do what he did and to take the mistress to his house after they went missing that is just stupid well what about his deception and whether Shanann knew had the instinct that he was cheating because I feel like he got it over on everybody in escaping the death penalty. I think he deceived the prosecutors, the court, everybody in this case. What about it to Ellen Kalor in CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter? Well, it is really just amazing how often this and to how many people Chris Watts lied,

even after investigators told him point blank, you failed this polygraph test. We know you're lying. He still continued to lie and deny that he had anything to do with why his family was missing. He was able to convince his girlfriend that his marriage was on its way to a divorce and that his wife was on board with that, which we know now is not true. But he was not able to convince Shanon that he wasn't being unfaithful. She knew, towards the very end of her life, she knew in her gut that something wasn't right. She had seen a credit card receipt from that Saturday night that he claimed to be at a Colorado Rockies game. He wasn't. He was out at a dinner with his girlfriend, and she got an alert of the charge of that credit card, and it was way too much for one person.

So she knew, and he even admitted later that he knew that she knew, and he still continued to deny and deny and deny any affair. Nancy, the spouse always knows. Go ahead. I'm sorry, Nancy. One thing, when I was doing PI cases and people would say, I think my spouse is cheating on me, the spouse always knows. There's something that changes in their behavior, their spending pattern, the way they talk to you. So yeah, no doubt Ms. Watts knew exactly what her husband Chris was doing. Now we learned that Chris Watts, the killer dad, actually googled, quote, when to say I love you when starting a new relationship. This was weeks before he murdered his wife and children.

During his affair, he Googles when to say I love you for the first time in a new relationship. On that same day, he Googled, what do you feel when someone tells you they love you? And how does it feel when someone says, I love you? This is all while he's married with a wife pregnant with their first son, already have two little girls. For almost a whole summer before she was killed, Shanann was in North Carolina on and off

visiting her parents. and she was still working at her job. That is when we believe much of the affair began. Their marriage began to crumble and Shanann was desperately trying to salvage their marriage. So what does that say to you, Alexis Tereschuk, that before her husband killed, murdered her, she was pleading with him to stop, quote, living the bachelor life. She knew he was, quote, living the bachelor life. What is that? Well, because she was gone with their children, staying at his parents' house and her parents' house. He was acting like a single guy. He was going out to baseball games with friends and he had no responsibility. He didn't have children to take care of in the morning or in the middle of the night or drive them to the swimming

pool or to the beach or anything. He was just doing exactly what he wanted to do with no responsibilities. And she was devastated by this. She was in a panic. She kept sending him self-help books, things to prepare their relationship, begging him, telling him she missed their closeness and how much she loved him and how she wanted to work things out with him. Meanwhile, he was just having sex with this other lady and then likely plotting to kill her and get her and the girls out of the way. And the whole time texting her, Alexis texting her that Shanann, that he loved her and he was sorry and they would work everything out. But he had another pot on the fire. Listen to the girlfriend, Nicole Kessinger.

Your relationship with Chris was, can you describe your relationship? I mean, when he was with me, I considered it to be fairly healthy. It was open communication, and it was what I thought was honest, and it was very calm. It was respectful. We got along really well. He gave me my space when I needed it. I gave him his.

And any time, like, he want to take care of it like anytime that his kids could be in like his life for hours or days or whatever whenever they were home I made sure that I wasn't a presence in his life so that he could be the best dad that he needed to be and I mean I thought what we had it was very comfortable for me I enjoyed, I thought what we had, it was very comfortable for me. I enjoyed it. I think he did very much as well. You guys, six, eight weeks, two months, whatever it was, you guys had an intimate relationship during that time?

Yes. Okay. So you're pretty serious. Did he ever tell you that he loved you? Yes, he did. Did you ever tell him the same? A couple times. I'm still in shock that this whole thing happened.

That's why I gave him the benefit of the doubt for the first day, because I was just like, no way. I didn't even think about that. I mean, murder was not on the top of my mind when somebody doesn't come home for an evening, especially if they just like had some sort of like heated conversation it's like okay you guys are separating have heated conversation you leave for a night like i didn't even think this guy killed his wife i mean that that like

murders on something on the top of my mind when i call one of my friends for three or four hours and she doesn't answer the phone like that doesn't even process to me is like a real thing that is a possibility at that point and so that's why I gave it a day and then the second day I was talking to him he was just like a hot mess I could tell and then with the way he was talking to me and then that's kind of when I cut him off and I stopped talking to him. Joining me, Ellen Kalor in CrimeOnline.com, investigative reporter, Vincent Hill, private investigator and author, Susan Constantine, deception body language expert.

And joining me right now, Alexis Tereschuk, journalist with RadarOnline.com. Alexis, so much is breaking right now. And this is after the family was essentially talked out of seeking the death penalty. What more are you learning? You know, about the death penalty, I feel like, you know, Chris kept saying from the beginning that Shanann had killed his daughter. And he found her on top of the little girl and strangling her. And that's when he threw her off and killed her because the girl was dead. But you know, the police asked him, they said, well, did you try to revive your daughter?

No. They said, did you do any CPR? He said, no, even though he'd had CPR training very recently through work. And so he was such an expert. His parents, I suppose any parent loves their child, really believed that the wife killed these girls and that he was just taking a covering up for her and really was taking a bullet for her instead. And that's why that perhaps they didn't see the death penalty because they were afraid that a jury would believe that too, because that was going to be his defense, that he only killed his wife, that he wouldn't kill those girls. Alexis, Alexis, get a hold of yourself. What are you talking about? Afraid the jury would believe it too? What?

Uh-uh. No, no, no jury in their right mind would believe something like that. But are you telling me that's why they waffled and they taught the family into not seeking the death penalty? Yes, and that because his parents so adamantly believed it. And even after he pleaded guilty,

he said, I killed them all. His parents said, this wasn't true. He was coerced into doing it about the girls because he didn't kill the girls. He only killed his wife and not the girls. Why now? Why are you guys coming out now to speak with us? Because we didn't know about the plea deal.

This is Ronnie and Cindy Watts, the parents of Christopher Watts, the man who pleaded guilty to killing his pregnant wife, Shanann, and his two children, Bella and Celeste. We were not allowed to talk to him about it. They're frustrated because they say his attorneys wouldn't let them ask him anything about the case before the plea. I asked Chris, if you did not do this, do not confess to something you didn't do. And she shut me down. She completely shut me down. And just like everyone else, his parents have a lot of questions after he confessed to killing

Shanann, claiming he saw her strangle one of the kids. He said, I'm sorry. I lost, I went into a rage and I killed her. And he said, I am so sorry. He says, I've ruined your life. I've ruined my life. Well, he told me, he said, Dad, I could not put the girls with her. After what she did, he said, I could not put them with her. And so instead of putting the girls with her, he decided to put them into an oil tank. I still don't understand. I don't understand a sociopath he's not a psychopath a question his parents have is

what was the trigger to cause all this to happen something i asked when i interviewed him when she was reported missing did you guys get into an argument before it wasn't it wasn't like an argument we had an emotional conversation but i'll leave it at that. She was leaving him or he was leaving her? He was leaving her. He just said he wasn't in love with her anymore, he said. Because both Shanann's family and Chris's family are in pain, his parents just want the truth about what happened. If this actually happened like they're saying that it did, that he killed them, then what was the trigger? There you are hearing from Denver 7, Chris Watts' family defending him, claiming that Shanann Watts' wife actually murdered

their children. To Susan Constantine, deception and body language expert, weigh in on that scenario. Yeah, I'm listening to what she's saying. You know, it reminds me of Cindy Anthony, you know, when she went to bat for her own daughter. And they are delusional. They just cannot believe that their own child is capable of being a sociopath or a psychopath. Well, guess what? He is, and he was, and he always will be. And you didn't see the signs because you chose not to see it. You looked at him through a blind eye. Following up on his story, take a listen to Chris Watts

in video that we have obtained off his confession telling his dad how he heard a, quote, commotion upstairs and goes up there to find his pregnant wife, Shanann, smothering one of the daughters. She freaked out over the separation. Thank goodness. She laid back down, but that's not what comes to her. one of the daughters. I can see it. I can see it. I can see it. Want to choke on that? All right. There she's going.

Hair blue. Both of them. Yes. She choked both of them. I freaked out when she hit me. All right. I freaked out the machine. I don't know what to say. I don't know what to say. I called the cops and got in.

So they were saying you could barely fit an arm through that. How big is it? It's, I mean, it's like, I mean you can use the Toby Gage tanks. So you think it's about like, just like a pot or a, what's that thing on the ground or street? Like a manhole? Like a little cover, like a traffic? No. Okay. Was it hard to get them in there?

Did you have to push or anything or? Not really. Okay. Are you sure? You're sure? Yeah. Yes. Okay.

Like we're going to have to throw in these tanks. It's going to be kind of a mess. Okay. So I just want to make sure that you're being? Yeah, yes. Okay, and like we're gonna have to bring these tanks, it's gonna be kind of a mess. So I just wanna make sure that you're being truthful about that. And is it because, is Shanann here because she couldn't, like could you not lift her all the way up there, or you couldn't?

Would she have been too big to fit in that hole? Did you know that already? Just from working the whole field field and then I knew that. Okay. And the girls aren't going to be with her in this? Down here, no. Do you really think this just blew from wherever that was? Chris Watts, a video that we have obtained off his confession. And then you hear Chris Watts continuing to give investigators information regarding the so-called burial of his family. Listen. I told you that we've done some work overnight. I told you that we've got a lot of leads.

That wasn't a lie. We know a lot more than you think we do. And here's where we're confused. You're this great guy. I'm not just telling you that, okay? I'm telling you that because everyone tells us that. Okay? We can't find anyone to say anything bad about you.

Chris is a great guy. He's a good father. He's a good man. We're confused as to why you're not taking care of your beautiful children. I'm not taking care of them right now? Right now. Where are they? I don't know where they're at.

I do not know where they're at. If I could have my babies back home right now, I would. I want them back. I want everybody back. And it's God's honest truth. That may be the only thing killer dad Chris Watts was telling the truth about. He did want his wife and children back, so he wouldn't go to jail for life or worse look down the wrong end of the barrel at the death penalty you are hearing chris watts will with investigators

describing still claiming his wife and children he had no idea where they were the whole time to alexis teres chuck he knew he had killed all three and forced the girls bodies into tankers whose opening were just eight inches wide and we heard him a few moments ago describing that putting his daughters down these pipes essentially without shedding a tear Alexis what can you tell me about him looking at real estate? And Alexis, I'm reading some of her texts and all of these texts and videos are in the state's file. She says, I can handle not having your help with the girls. That's exhausting, but I miss the smell of you. You touch me when I'm cooking me uh holding you snuggling with you eating with you

watching tv with you I miss staring at you I miss everything about you I can't wait to hold you to kiss you to smell you to laugh with you to celebrate eight years with you if you're done and you don't love me you don't want to work this out not happy anymore only staying because of kids i need you to tell me would you stay with me if we didn't have kids and she goes on alexis i just don't get it you don't fall out of love in five weeks how can you sleep our marriage is crumbling in front of us and you can sleep all of this is happening just before her murder now Now, Chris Watts then seeks out a realtor. Explain, Alexis Tereschuk. They had major financial troubles.

But while both of them were working, they were really strapped for cash. Their daughter's school, their private school, cost $25,000 a year. It was really expensive for them. So they decided actually together to maybe sell the house. So Shanann actually reached out to the real estate agent first. She said, we would like to put the house in. She did it through her Facebook page. And then Chris killed her.

So she was no longer around. Then Chris reached out to the real estate agent. And the real estate agent thought that was so weird because she had helped them buy the house a few years earlier. She had never, ever once dealt with Chris. So he's killed his wife. He's killed his babies. And he goes ahead and calls the real estate lady and says, yeah, we definitely still want to sell this house. And she sounded the alarm.

That's before the bodies were found and they were, quote, just missing. Hours after he had killed them when nobody even knew that they were missing. When he had already dumped their bodies out in this, you bay of old oil well and out in the middle of nowhere and then he contacts the real estate lady and says yeah go ahead we definitely want to do this and so she kept texting chris and shenan because she said she'd never dealt with chris before and she didn't hear anything from her and she thought that was so strange and then he replied too and said oh yeah yeah go ahead sell the house it's just living in a completely parallel universe so he could go ahead and sell this house and it'd be fine even though he killed his wife and daughters in it

hours earlier um you know susan constantine you're the deception and body language expert i'm looking at video of him right now a convenience store right after he murders his wife he's just calm and cool and we're getting this from the colorado weld county district attorney's office and he stops to get breakfast and goes in there i'm looking at the surveillance video at a colorado convenience store it's 8 a.m in the morning and he's just chatting up the female cashier. He's wearing his orange T-shirt with sunglasses perched on top of his baseball cap. He takes his change.

He puts it in his wallet before walking away from the counter. He's just totally chill, calm, cool, collected. You'd never know. He just dumped the bodies of his little girl four-year-old bella and three-year-old celeste in an oil tank and buried his pregnant wife in a shallow grave out in a crude oil field i mean and you hear just after that he's on the phone with the realtor trying to sell the house susan yeah you know i know, I think Scott Peterson did the same thing. He put his house up for sale right afterwards. So, you know, that chill in the air that he has, you know, you often hear about other murderers that have done the same thing. They may

have killed somebody and they turn around, they go to Dunkin Donuts or, you know, to Wendy's to go stop and get a hamburger. They've released it. So they actually feel free. So they release themselves from all that anxiety they had. The person is dead and they feel good about it. So they have no remorse. Remember, Nancy, this is a sociopath. He's a psychopath. He has no emotion and he doesn't have any concern about other people. So it's pretty easy for him not to have any remorse because he has none. He has no soul. It's almost like he's a teenager.

To Ellen Killoran, CrimeOnline.com reporter, it's like a teenage boy just running or a kid in a candy shop just playing out every sex fantasy with every woman that will have anything to do with him, chasing every skirt he sees.

You've got the one mistress looking up wedding dresses online uh but i'm still confused about her her computer search for amber fry because amber fry was the mistress in the scott peterson murder case i'm thinking about that she is not a suspect she's not a person of interest she cooperated with police this woman nicole kessinger but what about ellen colonna and also what can you tell me about the photo of a doll creepily covered up with a sheet as if the doll is dead that chris watts texted um yes as you said nancy he's running around like a teenager like he has no responsibilities like he's living in this fantasy world and he's only dating this mistress who he fell in love with

and apparently wanted to start a new life with for less than two months the affair was only about six weeks it most of it happened while his family was away in north car. But he's completely ignoring them. You know, Shanon is texting him all the time. And he's ignoring, you see in the discovery documents that were released that showed the text messages, he's ignoring his wife who's patiently trying to talk to him about their family and her pregnancy and issues she's having with the in-laws. He's ignoring her text messages but he's talking to the mistress it's as what it's as though a switch went off and suddenly his family didn't matter anymore um so getting back to the interrogation um i do think that it's we should

note that chris watts continued to lie after he knew he failed the polygraph test. The interrogators, they suggested the story to him about Shanon maybe having hurt the girls before he talked to his dad. So you can look at that. So he latches on to that. Yeah. You can look at it a number of different ways but you'll know that that's in the chronology of it right it was after they make that suggestion that he talks to his dad and he tells his dad exactly what they suggested to him and i do not think they believe that was

the truth ever but after he talks to his dad his dad does believe it's the truth he does believe it's the truth. He does believe his son. And speaking of the girls, Bella and Celeste, take a listen to this. true. He reads me books. He ties my shoes. If you're a hero, blue and blue, my daddy, daddy, I love you. Chris Watts, Rot in Hell. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend.