Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - SEX PERV JEFFREY EPSTEIN DEAD! WHODUNNIT?

Episode Date: August 12, 2019

Millionaire pedophile Jeffrey Epstein found dead in his cell over the weekend. Initial word is suicide, but conspiracy theories abound. Nancy Grace looks at all the possibilities with Judge and trial attorney Ashley Wilcott, Forensics expert Joseph Scott Morgan, Psychologist Caryn Stark Psychologist, former detective Steve Lampley and Crime Online Reporter Dave Mack. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Tonight, investigators are pouring over evidence and surveillance footage to figure out the major breakdown that allowed Jeffrey Epstein's apparent suicide in his jail cell. ABC News has learned guards were supposed to check on the alleged sex trafficker every 30 minutes. Sources say that protocol was not followed in the hours before he was discovered. It really is an insane system on so many levels. Attorney Bruce Barquette represents Epstein's former cellmate who roomed with Epstein less than three weeks ago when he was found unresponsive with marks on his neck. What the guards do and what they're supposed to

do are almost always two different things. So one has to wonder how it is that this man who just tried to take his own life by hanging himself a few weeks ago was in a position to successfully hang himself. Just six days after that first incident, Epstein was taken off suicide watch. Saturday morning at 6.39, the multimillionaire was found hanging inside of his cell. Who done it? How did multimillionaire Jeffrey Epstein, charged with multiple counts of sex trafficking minors, child abuse on minors, allegations are as long as I-75. Who done it? Epstein wheeled out dead from a Supermax where there were cameras and guards

supposedly checking on him by the minute. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. That was our friend at ABC, Stephanie Ramos. You know, another irritating facet of this, in addition to Epstein never being brought to justice, is the media looking down their noses at everyone, mocking the so-called conspiracy theories as to how Epstein was killed. I call BS on that. In a basically supermax holding facility where guards are watching you 24-7, 365, I mean, this place has held people like El Chapo, Al-Qaeda, Madoff, you name it. And they let Epstein, quote, kill himself. Whoa, whoa. Wasn't he just on suicide watch? How did he just get off suicide watch? I mean, every jail I've ever been in, and that's been a lot, I'm not proud to say, doesn't let inmates, you wonder why they're

wearing flip-flops? Because they can't have shoelaces to kill themselves or each other. How was Epstein given the tools to commit suicide? This is not the end to the Epstein case that many people imagine. Joining me right now, an all-star panel to break it down and put it back together again, Ashley Wilcott, judge, trial lawyer. You can find her at ashleywilcott.com. Joseph Scott Morgan, professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon. Dr. Karen Stark, psychologist at karenstark.com, joining us out of Manhattan. Steve Lampley, former detective, author of Inside the Mind of a Serial Killer.

Joining me right now, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter Dave Mack. Why is it that I feel like something was just taken away from me? I think it's justice. Nancy, the shocking part about this is it seems like everybody that's been following this case, from the moment this guy was arrested, from when they bashed in his Manhattan mansion back in the first week of July. Everyone knew this guy was, he was walking dead, either by suicide or murder by suicide. Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold it, hold it. I don't know if I agree with that about suicide, because this guy was such an egomaniac. It was all about him.

Apparently, he gave his staff orders that he required three orgasms a day, like having his meals. Don't laugh, Jackie. I mean, can you imagine your husband jumping up and saying that? Like he was being brought his meals on silver platters, literally. He required three orgasms a day. That just doesn't fit in my mind. Now, I'm just a trial lawyer. Hold on, Dave Mack, to Karen Stark. You're the shrink, Karen Stark, at karenstark.com. Joining me out of your swanky

office in Manhattan. Karen, why does that not fit together in my mind that somebody so egotistical that he literally thought, he didn't think it he did it he could buy people just as his own playthings little girls and he did it for years he was the puppeteer pulling the strings on florida sheriffs while he was quote in jail he would get out could fly unsupervised to New York, about a short distance away from some of the victims' schools. He could leave the Florida jail for 12 hours at a time, unsupervised, and go to his, quote, office. And while there, coincidentally, why, what a coinkydink, all of the visitors' logs to show young girls going in and out of his office got, quote, lost. I mean, this is while he's in jail. I find it very difficult to believe the puppeteer suddenly got a fit of remorse and killed himself.

It's really hard to take in Nancy because he just doesn't fit the profile of somebody who would do that. I mean, he felt so much that he was above the law and used his money to actually have young girls be slaves in this day and age. And so and to have all kinds of influence with powerful people. It's it's really hard to see that somebody with that kind of an ego would just crush his own life, decide to put it out. And there's just too much about the story that's very mysterious, that doesn't make sense. So I agree with you. Not only is it outrageous that nobody has the chance now to get any kind of feeling of revenge or completion, watch him suffer. But it's very hard to believe that he did this to himself. And the last thing I need is a bunch of know-it-alls in the media telling me not to use my mind

and consider possibilities other than a suicide. Dave Meck, sorry I got you off track there, but it's also quite a coincidence. And, you know, Ashley Wilcott, as I always say, there's no coincidence in criminal law that this treasure trove of documents implicating former presidents, that would be Clinton, partying with Trump, having Prince Andrew at a party with his arm around a minor girl in a photo. All of these documents, thousands of pages of documents, were just released, and then he turns up dead. Now, I'm certainly not saying that Prince Andrew somehow rappelled into the facility and killed Epstein. I don't think that. I don't think Clinton did it. I don't think Trump did it. But I can tell you this, when you get a lot of powerful people mad at you, when they are looking at criminal charges, people will do anything to stay out of jail, Ashley Wilcott. Absolutely, Nancy.

Are you kidding me? I see it time and time again. Criminals, you know, often aren't upset about what they've done. Like this man, I do not believe has any remorse for the many, many crimes. He's a perpetrator that he's committed. He would be upset because he was caught and because he was put in jail. And remember, he is a man of many, many resources financially Financially, I think he paid off everybody he needed to to do exactly what he wanted.

Dave Mack, I want to go back to all of the documents. You know what? I'm getting ahead of myself. How did this guy, quote, commit suicide when he had been under suicide watch? And even if he wasn't, in this Supermax where El Chapo had stayed, Al-Qaeda had been housed there.

Madoff had been housed there. How could he commit suicide? How was he just coincidentally not watched at that moment? You know, Nancy, by their rules and by the description I've seen from that cell, it's an impossibility. There's no way the guy can commit suicide. From the clothing they gave him to the type of sheet that he had to cover himself with while he slept, it was described as something a little bit thicker than paper, but not strong enough to hold the weight of an individual. But there's nothing to tie onto.

This is not like Mayberry's cell where Otis can pull the bars. There are no bars in this cell. There's no light fixture. There is nothing that you can tie onto if you had something to tie up and make a noose. So you've got an impossible situation being sold to the public as a reality. His former cellmate said there was no way this could happen. Now, the guards are supposed to be poking in, looking in on him every couple of minutes. They claimed that he was no longer on suicide watch. And even under those rules, okay, even under the rules of non-suicide watch, they were supposed to be viewed, physically viewed

every 20 minutes. So even under the most lenient of rules regarding them in this particular cell, there was no way to actually commit suicide. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Epstein's apparent suicide comes one day after thousands of pages of documents in a civil case between Virginia Gouffray and Ghislaine Maxwell were unsealed. In the court documents, Gouffre, an alleged victim of Epstein, accused Maxwell, Epstein's ex-girlfriend,

of directing her to have sex with several politically connected and financially powerful men when she was a minor. Gouffre was among the most vocal of Epstein's alleged victims. You know, before you know it, I'm being lent out to politicians and to academics and to people that you, royalty. You were hearing our friend at CBS, that was Mola Alenji. Wow, powerful people, presidents, ex-presidents, government members, royalty, academics. But what about the victims in this case?

And we know there are so many of them. There are just a lot of people that are, yes, angry and livid. Michelle Licata says Epstein sexually assaulted her when she was just 16. She and other accusers are outraged he will not face a criminal trial. I really wanted justice. I really wanted him to take up for what he did and to be put in jail or prison and have to sit there and think about what it is he exactly did to so many people. Tonight, authorities are pledging to continue the investigation. Epstein's death comes less than 24 hours after 2,000 pages of new documents were

made public. You're screaming on the inside and you don't know how to let it come out. All you do is obey. Virginia Roberts-Gouffray's 2015 defamation suit was unsealed against Ghislaine Maxwell, a longtime Epstein associate. In deposition testimony, Gouffre says that Maxwell recruited her to be a teenage sex slave to Epstein. Give Jeffrey what he wants. A lot of this training came from Ghislaine herself. Maxwell has not been charged with any crimes. She has consistently denied the allegations. Tonight, accusers are calling for those who enabled Epstein to be held accountable. You're hearing our friend at ABC, that was Stephanie Ramos. In the last hours, the facts surrounding the abrupt end of the Jeffrey Epstein case, Epstein found dead in his jail cell. Questions swirling. The jail where the disgraced

millionaire Jeffrey Epstein was found dead was, quote, short, staffed. I want to circle back on all of those documents that were just released, thousands of pages of documents. What do we know about that, Dave Mack? In the 2,000 pages that were just released less than 24 hours before his death, the documents talked – they named names. It was the document people had really been watching for. The document is between one of the victims, a girl who was just 17 years old when she was recruited to give Epstein a massage that was blurred into and pushed by Maxwell, Epstein's girlfriend. That lawsuit was a couple of years ago. This paperwork, over 2,000 pages, named names by this first victim. She's been the loudest one and has named names of people and how she was recruited, how she was abused, and how she was raped time and time again by some of the most famous people

in the world of politics. And it was all released, like I said, less than 24 hours before Epstein's dead body. Well, everybody's in on this one because we now know there were claims that the Obama administration, in order to protect Clinton, made that secret deal in 2008 that allowed him to plead guilty to one tiny soliciting minor for prostitution. Okay, that's not true. The deal was actually created before Obama took office under Bush. And then it went through during Obama. Okay, and it implicates, these documents implicate Clinton.

And there are photos of Trump partying with Epstein. I mean, you can put all these guys on the side of a mountain at Rushmore for Pete's sake, but long story short, nobody thinks that any of these people had a hand in Epstein's death. But what happened? And as it turns out, the photo was manipulated, shared by thousands, falsely claiming to show Epstein with Trump and the young Ivanka, the president's daughter. So this has gone through so many crazy, wild conspiracy theory manipulations and distortions and false, false facts. It's hard to find the truth. But I know this. I don't care what some troll puts online or how they manipulate a photo to Joseph Scott Morgan, forensics expert, author of Blood Beneath My Feet. Jackie here in the studio, first thing she says, and granted, she's just a radio expert,

but how do you commit suicide by hanging and end up on the floor in a fetal position? That's certainly food for thought, Joe Scott. Yeah, it is. And you know, one of the things that's coming out of this information, they keep using the term hanging, hanging, hanging. I've seen this over and over and over again. And Nancy, I've worked a lot of jailhouse deaths, as we refer to them as. But in this particular cell, as Dave was talking about just a second ago, we have to keep in mind that all people at home, I don't know if people at home have ever visited the interior of a correctional facility. I've been in many. I hope not too, Nancy, because they're a horrible place.

But all of the surfaces in there are smooth. Even say, for instance, the spigots that the water comes out of, many times those things are flush with the wall, so you can't tie off onto them. The beds themselves have smooth surfaces. It's not like a bed frame that you might think of in your home. And, you know, that's what makes this, this is what's such a head scratcher in this environment. The environment is very, very stark, you know, when you go in there. So you think about how in the world could somebody physically do this? I was taking a look at the images of his body being rolled in when the fire department is bringing him into the emergency room. And Nancy, the only thing, the first thing I thought was, well, maybe, maybe he used his pants to hang himself with because that's actually

kind of common. You know, they wear the orange scrub pants. You can make a ligature out of this, put it around your neck and hang yourself with it. Well, Nancy, in the image, he's wearing a scrub pants. Maybe he took his shirt. Well, it looks like there's something there. I don't even see that they've cut the shirt away in order to do cardiac, you know, resuscitation on him. So I'm kind of left here thinking, well, what in the heck is going on? They did the autopsy yesterday. And I do know this, Epstein's group that, you know, kind of supports him, his attorneys and this sort of thing. They did hire Dr. Michael Botten to come in and be present at the autopsy as the office of the chief medical examiner for New York was actually doing the autopsy. So we're going to have multiple eyes on the autopsy.

They're saying that it's pending. We'll see what the toxicology says because that's what they claim they're waiting on. We'll hold it right there. How come they can't look at him and say, he hung himself? What's the holdup? Why do they keep saying, quote, apparent suicide? Why can't they come out and say suicide or no suicide? And I'm glad they've got Biden there. I'm glad they have two eyes on it. I hope

the New York Medical Examiner doesn't take any offense to that. Not that I care, Joe Scott. This is the other thing, Nancy. Think back, July 23rd, and this is what's really, really troubling for me. There was an incident in the jail where they claimed again that some kind of harm had come to his neck and they've never been really specific. I've heard the term hanging come out and then I've heard this kind of generalized term of he sustained neck trauma. One of the things they would have been looking for at the autopsy is they would have been able to what we refer to in the autopsy

suite as reflecting the neck. That means that you go down through multiple layers of tissue and they'll look and they'll see if there was actually a pre-existing injury on top of what he may have sustained over the weekend, this past weekend, to see if that is actually resolving or healing. And then they'll go forward and look at the new autopsy results. Bodden would have been there for this, as well as probably Dr. Sampson, who's the chief medical examiner, who's highly respected for the city of New York. And they're going to look at this.

But there are so many physical indicators here that they have to take a look at very carefully. These autopsies take hours, Nancy. Everything is dissected to look and see if there's hemorrhage. If anybody has done harm to him, this is goinged to look and see if there's hemorrhage. If anybody has done harm to him, this is going to be very, very thorough. And that's why they will have to go over every jot and tittle. Keep in mind, the toxicology results are just one small piece of this. They're going to look at microscopic tissues, this sort of thing. I'm going to be

very curious, and I'd love to hear what Karen thinks about this relative to what type of medications he was on, to find out if he was being given his meds, if he's in a major state of depression, all of these other factors that come into this. I want to know who the mental health people were that were taking care of him and who took him off of suicide watch. I have dedicated my life to crime victims, to giving a voice to those who can no longer speak for themselves. And that is why I work with Oxygen to create a new show, Injustice with Nancy Grace.

We investigate cases that I believe never got it right, from wrongly accused, to botched investigations, to unclear motives, to unjust sentences. I don't just cover cases. I solve them. I put my heart and soul in it, dig deep, look at the background, at the crime scene, at the families, at the witnesses. I look at every tiny detail because what matters to me is justice. Join us in our search for the truth. Injustice with Nancy Grace. Watch now on demand and every Saturday at 6, 5 central. Only on Oxygen, the true network for crime. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

Epstein was inside the special housing unit, a part of the Metropolitan Correctional Center, where he was held without bail for the last several weeks as he faced federal sex trafficking charges. Just two weeks ago, Epstein was found unconscious on the floor of his jail cell. Arrested on July 6th, Epstein pleaded not guilty to charges that he enticed, recruited, and molested dozens of young girls at his homes in New York and Florida. Epstein's federal charges came more than a decade after his legal team struck a secret deal with federal prosecutors in Florida who allowed him to plead guilty to two lesser sex charges in state court. He served just 13 months in a county jail

and was granted work release. A trial date had been set for June of 2020. We last saw Epstein in court on July 31st during a procedural hearing in the Southern District of New York. He appeared tired, deflated, and noticeably thinner. You're hearing our friends at CBS. That was Mola Lingji. Epstein dead. Whodunit. You know, I can't break it down any more simply than that. And that is what is on everyone's mind, especially the fleet of then minor sex attack victims. Straight out to Steve Lampley, former detective author of Inside the Mind of a Serial Killer. Steve, I know you have analyzed this every which way but loose.

Weigh in. Nancy, there's so many questions, so many unanswered questions. There are so many unanswered questions. There are so many possibilities. How does, like Joseph said a while ago, how do you hang yourself in a cell that's smooth? Every person I have ever arrested that was suicidal, this is at the municipal level, Nancy, this is not even at the county or the federal level.

But every single one individual that I arrested that was suicidal was brought into the jail stripped. Body cavity search, just to make sure, given a paper gown, put in a jail cell by themselves under 24-7 camera observation in a cell with a bed, stainless steel bed mounted where you can't be moved. You can't hook anything to it. A stainless steel toilet sink combination like Joseph's prime mortgages did with the spigot in the wall, you can't hang yourself, Nancy. You know, another issue is Epstein himself, according to reports, claimed someone tried to kill him before he died. What do we know about that, Dave Mack? Well, what we know is what we've already mentioned about the attack on the 23rd, 24th of July. And he claimed then.

Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. That was deemed. Well, it was reported as a suicide attempt. And that's why I went on suicide watch. It was after that. I just heard you say attack.

Go ahead. Yes, ma'am. I'm sorry. It was after that alleged suicide attempt around the 24th when he was put on suicide watch that he alluded to that he actually told his cellmate and maybe a few others were not sure, but at least his cellmate that somebody had tried to kill him. He thought somebody was trying to hurt him. Now, think about this, Nancy. He was supposed to have a cellmate the entire time, even after he came off suicide watch, that the warden made that decision, by the way. The warden himself moved him off suicide watch. And then hours before

his body was found, his roommate was moved out of the cell without any kind of justification and without any warning. Okay, I want to go through that again, because the big question right now, why wasn't Epstein more closely monitored, especially given his apparent suicide attempt just 12 days prior? And Joseph Scott Morgan, you've dealt with a lot of jailhouse deaths. What can you tell me about Suicide Watch? I was stunned to find out he was taking off watch. Well, ideally, yeah, I was too, Nancy. Ideally, with Suicide Watch, first off, at the federal level like this, they're supposed to have camera monitoring that's taking place within the cell. A tiny camera that is, say, what we refer to as like a fisheye camera that's embedded in the ceiling, that's smooth through the surface, and you can see in.

Well, first off, they're saying that there was no camera that was functioning, which is just an absolute shock to me. And since he was no longer on suicide watch, he was in a cell that was being monitored externally. So even the external camera wasn't working on this, which again is a huge red flag for me. Aren't you convinced, as I am, that they do have camera surveillance in the cells? I mean, you can't put a member of Al Qaeda in a jail cell without a camera. And ideally, you would hope that they would. But from what I am hearing right now, there is no video surveillance of the interior of his cell. And I have also heard that the camera was quote unquote, big air quotes here, not functioning outside the cell. And that is very

troubling to me. With Suicide Watch in particular, many times you're issued what's called a suicide blanket, which is very, very thick. It's not something you can, if people will just imagine trying to fashion a rope out of a sheet or a blanket, you can't do this with a suicide blanket. It provides warmth, but you can't manipulate it. It's very, very thick. Also, in suicide situations, they will put you in like a paper gown, okay, that is not, that's not sufficient, again, to make a ligature out of. And in some cases where people are severely like just raging, they'll take them and they'll put them in. It's hard to describe.

People can kind of look this up online, but it's like a gown that covers the body that is very, very rigid and hard. It almost looks quilted. You can't manipulate this thing. So aside from that, you have to have guards that are walking the post that are physically eyes on. Along with the camera, you'll actually have somebody that will pass by the door, walk in their post, and they'll look in the porthole to physically see that patient or prisoner inside of that suicide watch area. It's a specific area that's set aside for this specific reason, because there's a lot of people that are troubled that go to jail that have mental issues.

So they have to have a specific area for this. He wasn't in this area. He wasn't in this area. And what's so striking is the fact that back what happened July 3rd, how in the world, how in the world can you take this guy off a suicide watch? It just, it absolutely blows my mind in this particular case because there's so much riding on this case. So this is what we know. The warden himself took Epstein off suicide watch hours before the alleged suicide. His roommate was moved out of his jail cell. We know that there was no functioning camera in the jail cell and apparently the camera out in what we would call the hallway was, quote, not functioning. What about guards? Aren't they supposed to be monitoring what's happening in the jail cell?

What happened to them? How is it so coincidentally that everything isn't working or doesn't happen, according to SOP's standard operating procedure, at the moment Epstein, quote, commits suicide. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Shortly after Jeffrey Epstein was found dead in his jail cell, President Trump retweeted this video from a conservative commentator. For some odd reason, people that have information on the Clintons end up dead, and they usually die from suicide. Former President Bill Clinton was also once friendly with Epstein, but there is no evidence at all to support the conspiracy theory the president is fueling.

Why did the president then retweet that Clinton suggestion? I think the president just wants everything to be investigated. In a statement, a Clinton spokesman said the suggestion that the Clintons were involved is ridiculous and of course not true. You are hearing our friends at CBS News. That was Ben Tracy. Theories abounding, but everyone in their gut is saying who did it because as Jackie here in the studio points out she's right the warden yes took Epstein off suicide watch but his shrink that had been treating him advised the warden to take him off suicide watch so the warden did. And I mean, follow that line of thought through to its logical conclusion. If the shrink thinks he should be taken off suicide watch,

does that mean he most likely did not commit suicide? His frame of mind was not suicidal? Let me understand this, Dave Mack. You're telling me that the warden takes him off suicide watch. Did you say that his cellmate was moved out how many hours before the apparent suicide? Nine hours before his body was found, his cellmate was actually moved out without any kind of explanation whatsoever. And you're saying there's no functioning camera in the jail cell, and the one out in, for lack of a better word, the hallway was not working. What about manual walk-bys?

Aren't they supposed to be walking by every 30 minutes or less? Yes, and the amazing part about this, Nancy, is the excuse that they are giving about the guards walking past is that they claim there were two guards assigned to this block that were supposed to be patrolling. But, you know, their excuse has been, well, they're working a lot of overtime. One of the guards had been on for five straight days and another guy was working overtime and they just didn't do their job, apparently. Okay. These guards were to be looking in on Epstein and the other inmate cell every 30 minutes, but did not follow procedure. One guard whining it was his fifth day of overtime,

all right? The second, that he was forced to work overtime. there's no video of the moment he died because cameras do not point into the inmate's cells he had been removed from suicide watch at the time of his death it has sparked widespread anger we've all seen the photos of Epstein's body being wheeled into a hospital moments before he was pronounced dead. He was wearing his shirt and pants, so what did he hang himself with? He's wearing that orange jumpsuit and what appears to be a brace around his neck as he is pushed on a gurney into New York's Presbyterian Lower Manhattan Hospital. Hmm. In one image, paramedics look like they're trying to revive him. According to the Washington Post, Epstein had been left in his cell for hours alone

when the guards were supposed to be looking in on him every half hour at the least. No one understands why the cellmate was transferred. Nothing is really fitting together. Now, we know Michael Bodden, who was the city's chief medical examiner, has been called in to witness the autopsy. I don't understand what the holdup is, but I know this. The victims may still have a course of action. And what about Ghislaine Maxwell?

What's the story with her? Did she facilitate the attacks on young girls? Now, we know Epstein's suicide comes just 24 hours after court documents implicating very powerful players were unsealed. Is the timing of his death suspicious? What about it, Ashley Wilcott? Ashley Wilcott joining me, judge, trial lawyer. You can find her at ashleywilcott.com. I know the pseudo-intellectuals are poo-pooing any theory but suicide, but the timing doesn't lie, Ashley.

Is it suspicious? Absolutely. All of these things together are suspicious. Let me tell you, in my experience, Ma, on the bench, and you have one coincidence, like you always point out, Nancy, hmm, really a coincidence. But when you have these many things adding up to it doesn't smell right, it doesn't pass the smell test, it's absolutely suspicious. I do not believe that it was a simple suicide. Again, remember, you know, a jail is a microcosm of our society. So it's not as if it's perfectly run and all of the safeguards are in place. Instead, rather, there are humans that are there that will do whatever they need to do to survive or choose not to survive. I have no doubt that he was either a murderer, that he paid people off to do what he wanted to do.

There is so much more to this story. It is past suspicious, and it's going to go much, much deeper than any of us can anticipate. Because guess what? There are people responsible, involved, I have no doubt, and that will come to light with an investigation. Well, I can tell you this much. It ain't over yet. Take a listen to NBC's Kathy Park. While Epstein's death marks the end of the criminal case against him, today the U.S. attorney said the investigation remains ongoing. Legal experts citing longtime Epstein associates like Ghislaine Maxwell, who has not been charged,

as possible focal points given statements made in documents just made public. Those people may be investigated by the federal government and anything that they lawfully found in terms of documents at Epstein's home can be used in additional government investigations. Epstein's alleged victims can also continue with civil lawsuits against the financier's estate. I am calling today on behalf of his victims for the administrator of his estate to freeze all of his assets and not disperse them. Civil cases, perhaps a meager consolation to the many women who hope to see Epstein have his day in court. I want you to take a listen to NBC reporter Stephanie Gosk. The then underage girls say they were lured by the cash.

My mother was on drugs at the time and she couldn't provide for me and I was pretty much homeless. Former Palm Beach Police Chief Michael Ryder says many of the girls didn't know each other but had the same story. We believe that this would end up in a prosecution that would incarcerate Mr. Epstein for the remainder of his life. Federal prosecutors even had a 53 page indict indictment ready to go, according to a court filing. But Epstein, a hedge fund manager who famously palled around with Donald Trump, Bill Clinton, and Prince Andrew, never faced those serious charges.

Instead, a plea deal was struck. He pleaded guilty to two counts related to solicitation of prostitution and only served 13 months in a county jail. You're hearing our friend Stephanie Gosk at NBC. It ain't over yet. Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.