Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - TEEN GIRL CHEERLEADER DEAD ON CARNIVAL CRUISE SHIP, FBI JOINS INVESTIGATION

Episode Date: November 14, 2025

Anna Kepner, 18, starts senior year at Temple Christian School excited about her future. Annapaints her parking spot to match her favorite movie, Clueless, and is ecstatic to be back on thefield, cheering for the Lions. Anna loves the water, licensed to boat and scuba certified. Sheenjoys making Tik-Tok's with her friends and brother. Anna plans on joining the military after high school, already in talks with recruiters. In fact, she’s waiting on the results of her ASVAB\ testing to determine which jobs will suit her best. Anna Kepner,  was a cheerleader and he was found dead aboard the Carnival Horizon cruise ship during a recent western Caribbean voyage that ended in Miami on Saturday, November 8, 2025. The FBI is investigating the death. Carnival has stated it is fully cooperating with the investigation. The cause of death has not been released, and an autopsy is pending. Early Saturday morning, the last day of the Horizon’s voyage, a passenger is found dead. The cruise ship returns to port, asking passengers to disembark from their rooms as quickly as possible. The FBI now investigating the death.  Funeral planned after death on Carnival cruise ship.  Anna Kepner, 18, died on a Carnival Horizon cruise ship on Nov. 7, Anna's cause of death is unknown. Anna Kepner's Celebration of Life will be held Nov. 20. Joining Nancy Grace today Spencer Aronfeld - Lawyer for Dulcie White, Trial lawyer and Founder of Aronfeld Trial Lawyers, Author of illustrated children's book "Sara Rose, Kid Lawyer," website: Aronfeld.com, Facebook: Aronfeld Law, Instagram: Aronfeld_Trial_Lawyers -Dr. Angela Arnold - Psychiatrist, AngelaArnoldMD.com, Former Assistant Professor of Psychiatry, Obstetrics and Gynecology: Emory University, Former Medical Director of The Psychiatric Ob-Gyn Clinic at Grady Memorial Hospital Robert Crispin- Private Investigator “Crispin Special Investigations”, Former Federal Task Force Officer for the United States Department of Justice, DEA and Miami Field Division. Former Homicide and Crimes against children investigator, website: CrispinInvestigations.com, Facebook: Crispin Special Investigations Inc.; Joseph Scott Morgan - Professor of Forensics: Jacksonville State University, Author, "Blood Beneath My Feet", Host: "Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan", Instagram @JoScottForensic, Susan Hendricks - Journalist, Author: “Down the Hill: My Descent into the Double Murder in Delphi", IG @susan_hendricks X @SusanHendicks  Sydney Sumner - Investigative Reporter, 'Crime StoriesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A gorgeous little teenage girl cheerleader dead on a carnival cruise ship. Tonight, the FBI joining the investigation. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us. 18-year-old Anna Kepner, a brilliant straight-A student from Titusville, Florida, embarks on what is meant to be a celebratory cruise marking the end of her high school journey. This trip is supposed to be a joyful escape, unaware of what is to come.

This little girl was a high school cheerleading star, a star in so many ways. She had all A's. She was already set to go into the military, had already spoken to recruiters, had her mind made up to serve her country. Now she's dead on a cruise ship. You know, maybe I'm the crazy one here. Straight out to Susan Hendricks joining us. You know her well investigative journalist

who shot to fame on HLN and then her close coverage of the Delphi double murder. She even wrote a book in all of her spare time down the hill, my descent into the double murder in Delphi. Susan Hendricks, this little girl should be on her way to college or into the military. How is it so many people keep dropping dead on cruise ships? Look at her.

She's a baby. Yeah, she is, and I was looking through her TikTok last night. I have a daughter around the same age, and you see just how young and full of life she was with the dances going on this cruise with her grandmother, loving to do that. I even saw on her TikTok or dancing with her grandmother full of life. her grandmother calling her Anna Banana, so much ahead of her. And really, what happened?

That's what we're trying to piece together. Susan Hendricks, we have taken the twins on a lot of cruises, okay? Like four, five. Disney cruises. That's my comparison, a Disney cruise, where everything is in a controlled environment. I guess you could, I wouldn't, but you could let your children run wild. but I just don't understand how a young teen girl ends up dead and we can't even get the right time of death.

Isn't it true, Susan Hendricks, that at first we were all told this little girl died 11-8, but now we're learning they even had the date wrong by 24 hours. She died 11-7, around 11-17. A.m. Isn't that true? Yeah, and the cruise ship docked back when it was supposed to on Saturday. So we're learning now, you're right, 1117 on Friday. We're trying to piece together exactly what happened, but it seemed like she loved cruises. She was excited to go. They were looking forward to it.

How did she end up dead? What happened to her? It feels like everyone's tight-lipped. Well, I tell you the FBI on it now, that's never a good thing. have the FBI picking through your trash and going over your movements. Joining me there on the scene is private investigator, Robert Crispin. He is joining us at the port of Miami where so many cruise ships depart, including this one. He is the owner and founder of Crispin's special investigations, but that's just part of his story. He was with the former Federal Task Force Officer U.S. Department of Justice, DEA, in that jurisdiction,

Miami Field Division, former homicide, crimes against children, and he's at crispin Investigations.com. Crispin, this is right up your alley. But I can't stress it enough in a moment I'm going to go to our friend Joe Scott Morgan on this. Robert, they can't, I mean, do they know their tail from a hole in the ground? A cruise ship investigating a potential homicide and they don't even get the time of death, even the day of death, right? Do you know how many witnesses are now lost forever because they didn't

get the TOD time of death down? 24 hours plus, Crispin, who was with her on 11-7? We don't know. What was she doing? What did she eat? What did she drink? Did she leave on a port adventure? It's all gone, Crispin. Yeah, listen, this is why the FBI is involved. And when you get 12 nautical miles off the coast, pretty much up the entire coast, it's international waterway. And the problem is these types of cases, Nancy, at sea, are an issue for the FBI. Why? Because the problem with these cruise ships are, the crime scenes that are moving constantly.

If you have evidence that was discarded out, it's in 5,000 people. that's a problem for the FBI. Joining us an All-Star panel to make sense of what we're learning tonight. Straight out to death investigator, Professor of Forensics at Jacksonville State University, the author of Blood Beneath My Fe, and you can hear him now

on a hit podcast, BodyBags with Joseph Scott Morgan. Joe Scott, thank you for being with us. It's a death investigator's nightmare. It's a floating crime scene. How did the little girl die? Who was with her? What

time did she die, not just the COD cause of death, the manner of death. And just like you heard Robert Crispin say accurately, those guests, over 5,000 of them on this particular cruise ship have scattered to the four corners of the earth. They weren't all even from the U.S. So what do you do first? Well, you try to get access to the area where she was actually living in that cabin, that I assume that she was in there with her grandmother, bits of evidence that are contained therein, all the stuff that was in her baggage. But here's one of the problems, Nancy.

Once that stuff is removed out of there, you lose all context for the rest of the investigation. Here's another problem. We don't have an established timeline. You had mentioned earlier, has she ingested anything? What kind of meals did she take on board? Who was she hanging out with on the ship?

Was there anybody that could have slipped or something at some point in time? Did she have access to alcohol when she's in international waters? So all of this works out to be just an absolute nightmare scenario. The upside here though, I think if there is any, is that when they put in, they put in to Miami. And Miami-Dade has one of the finest medical examiner offices

in the country. So they are going to be working this case from a medical legal perspective, and we're talking about toxicology, and we're also talking about a physical examiner, examination here because we want to try to rule out if we can any kind of trauma that might be there. That's one of the reasons we're waiting. We don't have a COD yet, but they're also waiting on talks and therein might lie the answers. Joe Scott, this is a morbid question, but it must

be asked. Where are dead bodies stored on a cruise ship? They actually have a location for them. Yeah, they do. Having worked in New Orleans for many years, major port, I worked several cases coming off of ships, everything from tankers to cruisers, you name it, even out on all platforms. There are locations where bodies can be stored. Sometimes they refer to as a cool room. Other times I've actually had remains that were placed into a literal deep freeze. And so it's going to vary from, structure to structure or from platform to platform with a cruise ship though they have a dedicated area most of the time and that's a big that's a big issue nancy because in the medical legal world we want to try to put the body into stasis in death so that you're not going to have or you're going to you're not going to have any kind of degrading of the remains because that's going to compromise evidence as well and how well was the body protected you know i begin to think about elements like trace evidence. It drives me nuts thinking about this because you're going to have

people that are unversed in this area. They're going to be handling her remains. And this is your primary bit of evidence here. I'm not being disrespectful to the dead, but you know and I know that that's the issue here. You have to protect this body at all costs because therein lie all of the answers. Jos Scott Morgan joining us, death investigator with literally thousands of death investigations under his belt. Joe Scott, you just said the condition of the body. Let's just think for a moment. You know how small the cabins are on these cruise ships. Think of her. She's basically in a tin can, in a closed room, in the Caribbean, hot as H-E-Double-L. You know the implications that has for a dead human body.

you lose evidence with every minute that ticks by. Yes, you do. And that's one of the major problems, particularly when you begin to think about her tissues. And just let me kind of lay this out. They're going to be three. The body in total is going to be examined. Her body will.

But there are three major areas you're looking at anatomically here with a person this age that suddenly passes away, the heart, the lungs, and the brain. And so you want to be able to preserve, so that you're not going to have any decomposition or degradation of the body to the point where it's going to compromise any kind of evidence that you can recover that rests therein. That's why it's so important to be able to keep this her remains

so that they are as intact as you possibly can until the M.E. in Miami can retrieve the remains and examine them as they should be examined. Joining us now, Spencer Erinfeld, he is the lawyer for the family of Dulcy White, another woman that dies at sea. He is known as the cruise ship lawyer. And for a reason, he takes on these seemingly impossible cases and actually wins them not on behalf of the cruise ship, on behalf of the families. Spencer, I wouldn't trust a cruise ship investigator as far as I could throw them, not that they're evil people. I mean, for Pete's sake, They don't even have the right day of death, much less time of death.

We had to get a medical examiner in the States to give me a time of death. I mean, really? If they can't even do that, did you hear Joe Scott Morgan? He's the professor of forensics describing what all has been lost because of their ineptness. Nancy, the security officers on cruise ships are really nothing more than glorified mall cops. Most of them have little to know training in law enforcement, in forensics, in investigation. This is one of the primary problems that people have on cruise ships is they expect that they're actually being guarded by a police-level security force. These are men and women, primarily from the Philippines, from Indonesia, who could have been a bartender, could have been a dishwasher, but they got a job on the security force.

Stop, stop, stop, stop, please, stop. Okay, my ears are bleeding. You've made my ears bleed. Did you say the cruise ship investigators were a bartender back on the island, and now they're the investigator on the cruise ship? The entire training they've had in being a security guard is generally the training that the cruise line gives them. They're recruited in these countries, and they apply for different positions,

if they get a job in security, then the cruise line trains them themselves. They usually have no military background. You're killing me. You just gagged me. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. I just opened a whole can of worms right there. You're hearing Spencer Erinfeld talking the cruise ship lawyer. Joe Scott, do you know how hard I had to train to go on crime scenes as a district attorney, an assistant district attorney? How hard did you have to train to be a death investigator? Now I got a bouncer from some bar from the Caribbean, and that's the cruise ship security. That's the investigator.

Yeah, and here's another piece, if you like that one, let me give you this one as well. We work in a world now in forensic science where we're talking about molecular evidence now. So to my colleague's earlier point where there's, there's no manner of death ruled at this point time. If we're talking about a homicide here, we start to get off in areas like DNA. We treat scenes many times now, Nancy, those of us that are professionals, as if we're going into surgery. You know, you see us in the Tivex suits with

the hoods on and the gloves and the booties and the mask and all that's. Well, there's a reason we do that is because the evidence many times is very, very fragile. And when you don't, when you don't have specific evidence at a scene that's going to point back to something, you know, just like Coburger, just like Coburger. No eyewitnesses, no confession, nothing, no fingerprints, no footprints, no footprints, no nothing. And if it had not been for molecular forensic evidence, a quadruple homicide would have gone unsolved. There was no motive.

There was no connection that we knew of between Coburger and his four victims. The state was just hanging in the wind. We were gone until people like you came in with molecular evidence. Think about it. The evidence was found on the snap of the hilt of a knife and got him dead in the water because of molecular evidence. There is no way that investigators on this cruise ship got molecular evidence. No, I just hope that they didn't compromise those things that are there. Sometimes it's better just to keep your hands off, but we know that the

that didn't happen because in fact they have to take care of the body that goes back to what you said earlier about placing the body in a location that is at minimum cool hopefully colder more like what we have actually in the morgue because at that point time we can cease or slow down the process of decomposition and also it secures the body how do i know where her remains were on that ship that other people didn't have access to her body you know you go to the emme's office And look, you're going to have to pass through several layers or gates of security in order to get access to a body. You're talking about a rolling city here with 5,000 occupants, just like our colleague said earlier, that are in the wind. They're gone now, Nancy.

How are you going to track them down? You know, back to Spencer, Erinfield, the cruise ship lawyer. Spencer, let me tell you a story about what happened to us on a Disney cruise through no fault of Disney. so you know they have like a tween hangout i believe it's called the edge which is edgy where like if you're 11 10 to say 14 you can go there and pretend you're 18 right and you play games believe me i scope the whole thing out they play games they watch disney movies of course and they have like coulade and pretzels and there's a guard at the door the only entry exit i check the whole thing out So, we went on another Disney cruise, and John David, Lucy wanted to come back from the Edge and come to the room.

So I was already in my pajamas, shorts and a T-shirt, and went to Edge to go get her. I bring her back with strict instructions to John David. Do not leave until I get back. He's like, sure. I go back, 45 minutes later, get Lucy all set. He's not there. He was with a little friend from our hometown, and they left together. He thought it would be okay, because I always say travel in a group.

I was running in my pajamas up and down the hallways of the Disney Cruise Line, trying to find John David. Because you know how fast somebody could have dragged him into one of their rooms, molested him and killed him? Just like that? Out of all those thousands of rooms, I went berserk. Now, granted, that was all on John David, not on Disney. In fact, we went on another Disney cruise after that, that following summer, where I would not, I had a handcuffed to me. He could not leave.

Lucy here, John David here. No matter where they went, I was there. Spencer, this is so wrong. And people wonder why I'm so angry and upset. This is not, I'm not mad at the investigator who doesn't know what he, she, are doing. I'm mad because this is the only thing. thing left that we can do for this little girl. This is it, is to solve her case, Spencer.

Well, probably Nancy, and I agree with you, the most important evidence for me would be the surveillance video. These cruise lines are wired like casinos from bow to stern with high definition CCTV covering all the common areas, covering the elevators, covering the dining rooms, the pool, the nightclub. And my question is, where's the CCTV? In my experience, and I sued Carnival thousands of times, they will either not have all the CCTV

or failed to preserve it, which is why I think the FBI boarding the ship the minute it got to Port Miami was essential for the preservation of the CCTV. They're going to get it off the ship and the FBI will take possession of it before carnival destroys it, loses it, tapes over it. I think the cameras are going to tell a lot of the story of what happened to her. Senior year at Temple Christians, Anna paints her parking spot to match her favorite movie,

Clueless, and is ecstatic to be back on the field cheering for the lions. Licensed to boat and scoves, she enjoys making TikToks with her friends and brother. Anna plans on joining the military. In fact, she's waiting on the results of her ASVAB testing to determine which jobs will suit her best. Anna's grandparents gift her a spring cruise as an 18th birthday gift. Anna enjoys the experience so much, she books a six-day trip with stops in Ocho Rios, Jamaica, the Grand Cayman's, and Cozumel, Mexico. Anna Kepner is known for her infectious spirit and love for people with dreams of serving her community through military service. That's why what happens on her trip devastates all who know her.

How long had this little girl been dead in her room, if that's where she was. actually found. Lindsay Allison, a passenger staying just down the hall from Anna's room, remembers crew responding to a medical call around 11 a.m. Friday morning. Security never left. They guarded their room very well. Though she doesn't know what happened, Allison can imagine the terror that ensues when your vacation turns into a floating prison. You're out in the middle of the ocean. You can't go anywhere. You can't get on land. You can't flee. Early Saturday, the last day of the horizon's voyage, a passenger is found dead. The crew should returns to port, asking passengers to disembark quickly.

The FBI now investigating the death. From our friends at Fox 13. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Another debacle at sea. A case that may never be solved now of this little cheerleader, eerily reminiscent of the so-called Missing groom. This is Captain Michael.

May I give your attention, please. A person may have gone overboard last night. George Smith and his bride spend the night gambling with friends they met on the Royal Caribbean's brilliance of the seas. When the ship's casino closes, the group heads to the club. But Jennifer leaves after a drunken argument with George. By the time the club closes at 3.30, the young men have to carry George back to his room at 4. Around 4.30, neighbors hear a sickening thud, which investigators believe was George's body slamming against a lifeboat canopy before falling into the ocean below.

I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that my son was murdered on that cruise ship. There's so much evidence. It's overwhelming. It's just been a complete and awful nightmare for my family. That last bit from our friends at 48 hours, I personally investigated the George Smith missing groom case. Joe Scott Morgan, you also have studied the case. I spoke with his mother, his sister at length, went through all of the evidence. There is no way. Did you know, they tried to claim he fell over the rail? When the friends, friends that he just met in the bar that night, and they were all drinking absinthe,

which, you know, I believe it's outlawed in certain jurisdictions so powerful, they left him in his room. And the rail to George Smith's balcony was chest high. And there were several rails so nobody could just fall over the side. He was thrown overboard, and the evidence is overwhelming that he was murdered. I agree with his mother that you just heard speaking. But, But it's never been solved because everyone scattered, as I said, to the four corners of the earth. Yeah, you take a look just at that image of the blood deposition alone. You know, how is that explained? And again, this is another great example of how can the scene be processed or secured?

Because I'm not thinking, I misspoke when I said processed. I would not expect security on one of these ships to process a scene. But do they even understand basic scene security, how you lock down an area? Once you get there and you understand the value and how delicate this evidence is, you know, to get back to port in order to allow those that are professionals to work the scene, to interpret the scene. So now you've got a fantastical story about this fellow going over this rail that's chest high. These rails are designed this way for a reason. It would take him being propelled in order to get over the side.

And so that's one of these things. It's a fantastic example of what a potential train wreck these deaths are at sea, Nancy. And, of course, there had been arguments the night before he had a huge argument with his fianc. Well, they just got married. This was her honeymoon. She, what Jennifer, I recall her name, was spotted on Cam, like sitting in a hallway completely drunk, just, you know, had been totally over-served. long story short, I don't think she had anything to do with his death, but I believe he was murdered potentially by people he was with at the bar that night. And when I say, by the way, Joe Scott, that the rail was chest high, that's chest high on me, not on you, okay? I'm 5.1 and a half. You're like, what, 6-2 or 6-3, so it would be different. But still, it was to a height. He didn't just fall over. He had to be, as you said, propelled. And part of the problem, Dr. Angela Arnold with us.

Psychiatrist, you can find her at angelaarnoldmd.com. Dr. Angie is the family never will know what happened. And here with this little cheerleader, we see the same thing all over

again with Anna. Terrific. Nancy, it's a form of trauma that this family will never be able to get over. That's why we have funerals and things like this, it's for people to process the death of someone. But if you never, ever know what actually happened to that person, you can never fully process their death. And so they will all be

traumatized by this in ways that we don't even realize for the rest of their lives. It's true, it's very sad. Anna is mourned by classmates and teachers at Temple Christian. Mr. Bruner writes a heartfelt note, your curiosity, your gentle spirit, and the way you cared for those around you made a lasting impression on me and on everyone who knew you. Anna's family parks her car in the parking spot for the last time. The White Kia stacked high with bouquets of Anna's favorite flowers. Susan Hendrick is joining us, investigative journalist and author. Susan, there's something that's so poignant about that photo of her car in her little parking spot.

Seniors get their own spot, and she painted hers after her favorite movie, Clueless. her car was still parked there and then everyone began putting flowers on it and it reminds me Susan you and I have both lived in the south how it's very typical you'll be driving along the interstate and you'll see like a cross covered in flowers

it's all that's left the family is so bereft all they can do is go put flowers on her car it's just it's heartbreaking to me yeah when I see that car I think of a teenager with their whole lives ahead of them. And the school decided, hey, we're going to keep that car there.

It's staying put for now. And you see all the memorials that young girls' best friends thinking she was just here. What happened? And as Dr. Arnold was talking and Joe Scott, I'm thinking, is that the place to commit the perfect crime, that floating vessel? I mean, it's blocked off. It's already back out at sea. Passengers are shuffled off. And there's no answers.

Okay, Robert Crispin is joining us at the port of Miami, the departure spot for all of these cruises we're talking about. Okay, Robert Crispin, get ready. It's not just Anna that dies at sea. Now we've got Dulcy White, a loving wife and mom, who apparently is over served, falls over the edge, and the boat doesn't even go back to look for her. Dulcy White, a loving wife to Terry, a mom of three, nursing patients in Westmoreland, New York. When Dulcy's daughter, Megan, suggests they take a girl's trip, Dulcy immediately suggests a cruise. Dulcy and Megan decide on a four-day Taylor Swift-themed cruise to Nassau and Royal Caribbean's Cocoa Key. The cruise promises themed events, friendship bracelet exchanges, and a clever t-shirt in my cruise era, or $1,500 per person.

I mean, to you, Robert Crispin, what could be more fun than that? A Taylor Swift theme cruise, where there are all the girls, the young teen girls running around exchanging those friendship bracelets and some grown men I've seen wearing the Taylor Swift graphic, whatever. So much fun, so innocent. But the allegation tonight is she was horribly over-served and fell overboard. And the ship didn't even turn around to go find her. They just let her drown. What's the likelihood we'll ever going to find her body? That's never going to happen in an open sea in the middle of nowhere.

You know, Nancy, everything starts out so exciting and everyone's happy when to get on this cruise ship. But the problem is, when somebody falls off and the cruise ship pilot does not turn the vessel around or do a Williamson turn or an Anderson turn, that didn't happen. And that allegation alone is sickening, and it makes people not want to get out of cruise ship. God forbid something happens. Dulcy and Megan depart Miami on board the allure of the seas. Dulcy decides to splurge on a drink package as well, opting for Royal Caribbean's deluxe beverage package, so she doesn't need to pay for individual drinks.

Royal Caribbean's deluxe beverage package can cost more than $100 per day, not including an 18% gratuity charged at the end of the cruise. Dulce White eagerly boards the all-in on Taylor Swift cruise with her family expecting to have a wonderful weekend filled with all her favorite songs. Little does she know this trip will soon turn into a tragedy. That's right. It's not just that gorgeous teen girl cheerleader Anna Kepner that dies at sea. Now a mom of three dead and the boat didn't even turn around to try and look for her body. Why? Joining us an All-Star panel, you know, I just want to be clear about something to Robert Crispin, former DEA, former Vice, that's where this comes in, former DOJ, who's joining us there at the Port of Miami. In the States, it's against the law to over-serve someone who is obviously inebriated. What, those rules don't apply on a cruise ship? You know, Nancy, you would think it does, but it doesn't. And sadly enough, even though they're inebriated, they're staggering, they're slurred speech, their bloodshot watery eyes, they're still getting alcohol served. Why? Because

they got the wristband on. It's the deluxe all you can drink. What happens? They get them back to their room and they end up dying or something bad. Really bad happens to these people and there's no accountability. You know, part of it though, Dr. Angie Arnold joining us, renowned psychiatrist. I think when you get on a cruise ship, I kind of did it with the twins. Of course, we're all teetotelers, sadly, we're not in the party, but you think you're safe, you're surrounded by children, adults don't get to come, like just on their own, no purrs wandering around, I don't think, anyway, and you just feel totally insulated, especially on a Disney cruise. And I'm wondering if that has anything to do with the attitude on cruise ships, you think,

oh, I can drink as much as I want, all I have to do is walk to my room. Well, Nancy, what I was thinking about was this. Once a person has had a certain amount to drink, they're really not in control of their cognition at some point. So they're being over-served and they really don't realize that they're being overserved because the alcohol is affecting their brain. So they're no longer capable of making good choices. That's why in the United States it's illegal to over-serve people. So it's really quite a shame because they can add. ask and ask for more, but Nancy, they're not aware of what they're doing. And then something tragic

like this happens. Tuesday night, Dulcy and Megan grabbing drinks along with pizza. Megan is socializing with other fans. Doesn't notice her mother inebriated after ordering drinks back to back. By 7.30, another passenger has taken note of Dulcy glassy-eyed, slurring, and struggling to maintain balance. The concerned passenger escorts Dulcy back to the room. Megan returned shortly after and is shocked by how intoxicated her mother is. She's never seen her mother in this kind of state. The mom and daughters start getting ready for bed. To save space, the pair leave their suitcases out on the balcony,

so they have to venture out to grab fresh clothes. 940, Megan notices Dulcy out on the balcony and assumes her mom is grabbing pajamas. When she next looks, she sees Dulcy sitting on the railing of the balcony, her feet dangling over the edge. Before Megan can get to her, Dulcy slips off the balcony and, Megan can't catch her as she falls into the water below. Oh, my stars. Straight out to the cruise ship lawyer, Spencer Ehrenfeld.

You're the lawyer for Dulcy White's family. I'm stunned. She was served so much she could barely walk. Everybody let it happen. Then she falls overboard, board her daughter races to catch her and couldn't make it. Is it true? the ship didn't even turn around after the daughter raised the alarm? Well, the case has just been filed, Nancy. We don't have all of the ship position logs.

We don't have the captain's log. So I have what the family has told me, which there was a delay in initiating the man overboard protocol. But once we start taking depositions and getting all of the data from the ship, I can answer that question specifically. But the allegation from the daughter who watched her mother fall to her death, is that the ship did not stop, did not contact the U.S. Coast Guard or Bohemian Coast Guard immediately and did not initiate rescue efforts timely.

But I also wanted to say this, Nancy, and I've investigated hundreds of man overboard cases. The common denominator is always alcohol, and in most cases, the over-service of alcohol. And cruise lines do have a... legal responsibility under federal maritime law to not over serve visibly intoxicated passengers. The problem is this perfect story of the all you can drink drink package encourages people to want to get their money's worth because they've already

prepaid it and the crew members are incentivized to serve and keep serving because that's how they get tips. So the cruise lines pay these folks below a minimum wage. They're not subject to federal minimum wage laws. So they're paying these guys pennies per hour. And if they can get $1, $2, $5 tips per passenger 15 times an hour, they're going to keep serving and serving and serving. And it's really a recipe for disaster.

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace to Sydney Summer joining us Crime Stories investigative reporter what about Williamson and Anderson those are two distinct maritime maneuvers that are to be employed when someone is a quote

man overboard right that obviously did not happen in this case it feels like Royal Caribbean did nothing to try and save Dulcy despite Megan's quick report of what happened to her mom. Megan says she felt hopeless and that no one did anything in any timely manner after she reported her mom fell overboard. Megan immediately reports her mother's fall overboard to crew members, but the ship

does not perform a Williamson or Anderson turn to return to the man overboard location and no rescue boats are launched. The crew doesn't even immediately report Dulcy missing, though her fall was caught on the ship's cameras. Eventually, crews from the Royal Bahamas Defense Force and the U.S. Coast Guard searched for Dulcy, employing helicopters, but Dulcy's body is not recovered. She did overdo it, just trying to maybe get her money's worth. I don't know. It saddens me that that is my last memory of her. From CBS. Dulcy White falls from the balcony after allegedly being served one too many drinks. Her body. is never recovered, leaving her family and friends in shock and warning.

Dulcy White's family files a lawsuit, claiming the cruise line over-served her alcohol and delayed an emergency response. The filing alleges Dulcy was served seven drinks in six hours and eight minutes, despite obvious signs of intoxication. The cruise line is accused of failing to comply with statutes enumerated in U.S. maritime law when they failed to launch an adequate search for Dulce. It will haunt us for the rest of our lives. I feel that the overconsumption of alcohol and the over-service of alcohol was the cause of this. That from our friends at CBS, the daughter literally haunted the rest of her life because she didn't catch her mom before she fell overboard. Was it her fault? No. But I'm sure she has survivor guilt. And these two that we've highlighted

tonight, Dulce and Anna. They aren't the only ones. Does the name Amy Bradley ring a bell? Because I will never forget it. Amy Bradley was 23 and she was on her family vacation. The water was crystal clear. Life is good. Everything

is great. Daughter's here tomorrow. They went to that. Around 5.30 in the morning, I saw Amy on the balcony. 6 o'clock woke up again. She wasn't there. He said, I've been looking for Amy. And I can't find.

We check every inch of the ship. The captain came in. He says the FBI have searched. Your daughter's not on this bay. Now years had passed. We've had so many sightings. I saw her. That from our friends at Netflix, Amy Bradley, is missing.

To be told by the captain, your daughter's not on this boat. How do you know that? How do you know she's not on the boat? I mean, Robert Crispin, you're joining us from Port of Miami. How big are these behemoths? They're massive. They're massive. And Nancy, if they told him that, then they knew something.

They looked at the cameras. They saw a fall. They knew something. But how can you tell someone that when you haven't even done an investigation if you don't see you're falling off the boat on a cruise ship? You know, the ship from which Anna Kepin went missing, was monstrous huge. There were thousands and thousands of not only cruise ship passengers. I tried to add it up. Let's see, the 14-deck Carnival Horizon, sales the Caribbean, 4,000 passengers, and

1,500 person crew. That's at least 5,500 people. And they come in and tell, The dad? Yeah, she's not on the ship. Okay, and there's more. Now, years had passed, and we've had so many sightings. I saw her. That's where I was standing. Amy's alive. Taxi driver said her daughter is on the aisle. She could have been lured on the ship. I saw her in the restroom, all Barbados.

I said, what's your name, Amy? I was in the bar, enter a sow. One girl said, my name is Amy Bradley. I need help. I thought that could be. That could be Amy. From our friends at Netflix, Amy Bradley, missing. And it's still unsolved, which goes back to Joe Scott Morgan's insistence that you have to solve the case

before everyone departs from the ship. Joe Scott, I'm not sure you're familiar with Jackie Castanellas, another similar cruise ship mishap. Well, she was in New York City, waitressing on her way to becoming a star. She went to some open call auditions, and this was one of them for this high-end cruise line. And lo and behold, they called her back. They liked what they saw on her and booked her onto the first of what turned out to be three cruises over the course of the next year and a half. That was her really her first big break doing what she loved doing, which was singing and performing.

Robert Chris has been joining us there at the Port of Miami. Robert, if they can't keep up with the... safekeeping of their own employees. She was a performer, right? She was there as part of the performances that the ship puts on to, you know, entertain the passengers. They can't keep up with a star performer. She ends up dead in her room and nobody knows what happened, much less the passengers. Let me tell you something. If you've ever been on one of these, they're floating cities. They can't keep track of everybody. They just can't. It's impossible. to you Joe Scott Morgan exactly why you were insisting that the case be investigated while everyone is still on the cruise ship before witnesses can leave like they did in the George Smith case and evidence lost I mean they're never going to find Dulcy's body ever no no they they they will not gone forever and ever amen you know we're covering a similar case as well not similar in that sense in the sense of the cruise

cruise lines. But you know, we had the Burning Man homicide from a couple of months ago. And Nancy, there were 70,000 people at that event. There's a high probability that that will never be solved. Do you know why? That was a non-permanent location where people just went into the wind from all over the world. It's identical to the cruise lines as well. You have these people that go down there for fun. They relax. They should be. You've earned it. You pay for it. You go down there. You want to taste of the good life. And then you begin to indulge in alcohol. You meet strangers, some of them. You don't know who they are, where they're from.

You don't know what their intentions are relative to you. And so it's not like working in Atlanta or New Orleans or New York or wherever, where you have a static location where you can go out and process a scene. You can go out and canvas and interview people and all these sorts of things. This is an absolute nightmare scenario for everyone involved. Spencer, Aaronfeld, cruise ship lawyer, Dulcy is your. case, what are you going to do, man? So the first thing we're going to find is the surveillance video.

We're going to interview the servers. We're going to find out what they saw, what they knew, what they observed. We're going to get the ship's position log and find out from the moment that the daughter called the bridge and informed them that her mom had gone off the side of the ship, how long Did it take the ship to notify the Coast Guard, notify the Bahamian authorities, and to initiate any type of man overboard protocols? There's technology available right now that alerts the bridge without having to have a call. It's actually mandated by federal law, but most cruise lines are not following this, and they do not have installed man overboard technology. To my knowledge, the only cruise line that is really fully compliant with that is Disney.

But all these new mega cruise ships are coming out that are floating cities. They are doing it in contradiction to U.S. Federal Maritime Law, and they do not have man overboard technology. There are so many ways now that passengers who go overboard can be found. A simple air tag can be included on their landings. so that when they go overboard, they can find them with GPS within seconds. But the cruise lines choose to put their profits ahead of passenger safety, and they don't invest in the technology that they're required to have, and they could easily have to rescue people that go off the side of ships.

Two more unsolved cruise ship fatalities. If you know or think you know anything about these cases, please contact Miami FBI. 754703,000. Repeat, 754703, 2000. Your tip may make the difference in solving these cases. We remember American hero Deputy Sheriff Lawrence Canfield, Sacramento County Sheriff's, California, killed in the line of duty after 13 years serving and protecting, leaving behind his grieving wife and two children. without a dad. American hero, deputy sheriff, Lawrence Hanfield. Nancy Grace, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an IHeart podcast.