Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Trip to Mall TURNS NIGHTMARE: 8 Dead

Episode Date: May 8, 2023

Gunfire broke out around 3:30 p.m. Saturday afternoon at a Texas mall. Witnesses describe a man dressed in black, wearing body armor,  walking through the mall property firing indiscriminately. Police say an officer who was responding to an unrelated call heard the gunfire and took action. The unnamed officer ran toward the suspect, shooting and killing the man.  Eight people were shot and seven were hospitalized.  Joining Nancy Grace today: Nicole Deborde Hochglaube - Criminal Defense Lawyer (Houston TX), Former Prosecutor; Twitter: @debordelaw Caryn Stark- Psychologist Trauma and Crime Expert; Twitter: @carynpsych   Joseph Scott Morgan - Professor of Forensics: Jacksonville State University; Author, "Blood Beneath My Feet" &  Host: "Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan",  Irv Brandt - Senior Inspector, US Marshals Service International Investigations Branch; Chief Inspector, DOJ Office of International Affairs; Author: “Solo Shot: Curse of the Blue Stone;" Twitter: @JackSoloAuthor Lisa Fine-Cavalli - Route 91 Harvest Music Festival Shooting Survivor (Oct 1, 2017); Co-Founder: Route91Strong; Twitter: @LisaFineLove Facebook.com/Route91Strong  Jen Smith - Chief Reporter for DailyMail.com; Twitter: @jen_e_smith  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A Saturday trip to the mall turns into a nightmare. Eight dead, many, many others critically wounded, hanging on to life by a thread. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation and SiriusXM 111. Take a listen to the dispatch we just obtained. I don't know where he's at. Just for your information, we're getting some calls about possible shots fired over the Nike outlets in Maryland.

It's hard to make out some of that the desperate call for help at a mall a packed mall when eight are killed many others wounded at prime shopping time everybody's home for the weekend and heading to the mall and then this mom's there with their children families together all gunned down including the children do you hear what's being said people are running at polo ralph lauren we're trying to get the shooter he's still shooting a tommy hill figure at nike outlet can you imagine that saying we've all been to the mall. We've all seen these very stores.

Gunshots ringing out. At first, people didn't want to believe what they were hearing. They wanted to believe someone had set off firecrackers. Take a listen to our friends at WFAA. My mom and I were in Johnson & Murphy shopping, and out of nowhere heard about like 10 pops go off. And I look at the customer next to me, I was like, was that gunshots? And he's like, no, it's probably just construction or something.

And then like heard 10, 15 more shots go off. And so I ran to the front of the store and we're like, no, that's shooting. And we see the guy, there's this guy dressed in all black, wearing a vest, has an assault rifle, and he's just shooting at people. Terrified shoppers take cover Saturday afternoon in the back of stores at the Allen Premium Outlets as police respond to an active shooter on the property. We got boxes to shut the door because we don't know where the shooter was. It was mayhem, panic. Abu Atkar was with his wife and one-year-old child when he heard gunshots outside of H&M.

He grabbed a woman he says was shot in the side and brought her into the store. Yo, I need some help here. That's when she said, I don't know why I got shot, what's going on? And that's when I just saw blood pouring out of her stomach. The shock that is going to live with all of these witnesses will last a lifetime. But what about the victims dead? Joining me and also our panel to make sense of what we know right now. First of all to Professor of Forensics

at Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, and star of a hit new series, Body Bags, with Joe Scott Morgan. Joe Scott, well, everything about this is deadly and evil. This guy, this shooter, why is he clothed like he's going to a masquerade party? I mean, he's dressed all in black and shows up with what kind of weapons does he show up with at the mall? He's dressed in black, Nancy, because I believe this is what's referred to as tactical gear that he is wearing from head to toe. That is gear that would specifically associate him with either the police or military. He's also wearing a tactical vest.

And the images that if I'm believing the images that I'm seeing, he's wearing a tactical vest, which has space for multiple magazines for this weapon that he is carrying you can actually see a couple of the magazines there the weapon at least again i'm prefacing this by saying i i don't know the veracity of this image that i'm seeing uh but the weapon looks like an assault weapon it looks like either a 0.223 probably probably chambered for that, or 5.56 millimeter round, which is the same round that you can buy.223 and 5.56 in our world. 5.56 is generally used by our military. It's a high-velocity round that does a lot of damage. I'm curious if you don't mind explaining when you say tactical gear all of us in law enforcement or the military understand that but what do you mean by it? For instance

the multiple pockets on his clothing. Well let's just think about think about it this way with the tactical with the vest that he's wearing it's a vest that you wear. And the magazines that contain the ammunition are posted on the front of the vest. Okay. And they're inverted. That means that they're upside down. So if you grab one by the base, you quickly pull it out. You drop the empty mag and then you insert the next mag. It has to do with speed and efficiency.

That's what this goes to. Who in the world goes to the mall, a packed mall at the highest shopping hour? The most people in tactical gear, black tactical gear and loaded down with weapons and ammo. You were just hearing from our friends at WFAA and Fox as well. But now take a listen to our friends at KTVT. When I heard those shots and then when the multiple shots happened, my heart just immediately just dropped. And I was on the phone with 911 and I was telling them we have a mass casualty incident. Spanauer says he got there before any first responders. And while a handful of people around him recorded videos of the bodies on the ground, he tried to save lives. I never imagined in 100 years I would be thrust into the position of being the first

responder on the site to take care of people. Spanauer says despite applying CPR, at least three of the victims could not be saved. The first girl I walked up to was crouched down covering her head in the bushes so I felt for a pulse pulled her head to the side and she had no face the eyewitness descriptions coming out of the mall are overwhelming uh you know to Karen Stark joining us uh renowned psychologist joining us out of Manhattan trauma and crime expert at karenstark.com. That's Karen with a C. Did you hear what the witness just said? He said a lot of people, as he was rushing to try to do CPR on the victims, many of them already dead,

other people got out their phones and started videoing the dead bodies. What is that? Well, if you think about it, Nancy, I mean, so much of our culture these days is about taking photographs and selfies. Is that what you blame it on, Karen Stark, our culture? Well, that's how they respond to a crisis is you sort of separate yourself from what's happening and you put your phone in front of you. And that's a coping mechanism, even though it's not what you would expect people to do. They really are coping by taking pictures and removing themselves.

They are vultures. You call it a coping mechanism? Yeah. They are taking video and pictures of dead victims on the ground. How are those victims' families going to feel when they see that? Joining me in All-Star panel, in addition to Joe Scott Morgan out of Jacksonville State University and Karen Stark, psychologist,

I want to go to the chief investigative reporter with DailyMail.com, Jan Smith. Jan, tell me what happened. Well, Nancy, we're still learning a lot about what happened. This happened on Saturday afternoon. Now, what we know so far is that it was around 3.30 p.m.

when the first calls came in of a mass shooting incident. Now, actually, some of the first people to be involved were police officers who were at the mall already dealing with another unspecified incident. So what we know is that this shooting began either inside or directly outside the H&M outlet. Jen Smith, I'm getting a ton of questions even as you speak. So the shooting starts at an H&M, is that correct? That's what we believe so far, yeah. Either directly inside or just outside the H&M in this mall. Okay, right there, I find that really disturbing

because the shooter picks a location that's practically all women and young girls. And that's where he starts shooting at H&M. How many times have I gone up and down those aisles with my daughter? Up and down, up and down. And as you heard that one witness state that he thought it was anything but gunshots didn't want to believe it was gunshots and can you

imagine all the little girls in there with their moms and they hear gunshots of this freak go ahead jen that's right nancy i mean really targeting the most vulnerable people which says a lot about this person right so we know that there are eight victims. We don't know who all of these victims are, only two have been identified so far, but I can tell you that their ages, Nancy, the youngest, was five years old. Pause for a big thank you to our partner making today's program possible.

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To Nicole DeBoer Hodge Globe joining us, a veteran criminal defense attorney and former prosecutor. She is at HoustonCriminalDefense.com. Nicole, I don't know if you ever feel this way. I know you can't comment on any specific case, but we've got a guy with army style, military style weapons, dressed in tactical gear, loaded up to the hilt with ammo. You just heard Joe Scott Morgan describe. I don't know why I'm actually shocked that one of the victims is five years old at the mall with mommy. I don't know why I would expect anything different from this guy, but a five year old. It's heartbreaking. And I would say, you know, as much as we do see really awful things from time to time, the moment something like that stops shocking us us it's time to hang it up and do something different it is shocking it's just absolutely horrific and the people who

just saw what happened on the scene are just going to be traumatized for a lifetime as a result and the and the victims who passed away because of this person's actions make this just an absolutely unspeakable and horrific crime. Joining me, Irv Brandt, Senior Inspector, U.S. Marshals with the International Investigations Branch Chief Inspector, DOJ, author of Solo Shot, author of Flying Solo, Top of the World on Amazon. Irv Brandt, I'm thinking about what Nicole DeBoer-Hotchglobe just said, and I suddenly remembered one, actually the first time I saw an autopsy photo. I was new at the DA's office, and it was of my first murder victim case that I tried that I represented the victim. Her name was Mary, and I've never forgotten it. And I've seen many, many other homicide victims, many other death scenes, many other law autopsies as they were happening. But that photo of her face, I can't ever forget. And'm thinking and I'm in the business in LA law enforcement

for people civilians that have never seen anything like this I mean it haunts even me much less people that are just there at the mall you know in the food court getting a auntie Ann's pretzel or whatever they're getting, it just, I don't think they'll ever forget it, much less these victims' families. And Nicole said, if you are not shocked by a five-year-old getting gunned down at a mall, then you need to get out of the business. That's exactly right, Nancy. I mean, I feel sick right now.

I actually feel sicker. I'm sorry, go ahead. The witnesses to this, the victims to this, they're going to be scarred for life. Just like you said, the first time. It's not like these people are hardened veterans that have, you know, seen it in the course of their life over and over again. They're civilians and they've never witnessed anything like this. And to witness something so traumatic, this is just a tragic incident. They're going to have nightmares and visions of this that's going to carry through them for the rest of their lives.

They'll never forget it. It's heartbreaking to think about. And you know, another thing to most of us on the panel today, we signed up for it. We know what we're in for. But not these people. They didn't sign up for this. With me is

a very special guest, Lisa Fine-Ghaffali. She is a survivor of a mass shooting at Route 91 Harvest Music Festival. Lisa, thank you for being with us. Thank you.

When you are hearing us talking about not just the dead that lost their lives of all places at a mall where you know there are children. There are ladies shopping. I remember my dad, Lisa, and it was no small thing. I could hardly keep up with him. When it would rain outside, he was a heart patient.

He would go to the Macon Mall and walk like a maniac. There are elderly there getting their steps in. People are hanging out at the food court having a Krispy Kreme or a Chick-fil-A. Then all of a sudden this. It reminds me of what you went through at the music festival where everybody is having a good time listening to music and then all of a sudden shots ring out. I want to know what images from that shooting stick in your mind and how has it

affected you? I was shocked that I'm in a world that is unrecognizable to me. I had the life before the mass shooting, I survived, and now. It is terrifying to me that there are evil people that want to kill these beautiful souls that are just living their lives. The mass shooting that I went through was a war zone. It was horror beyond horror. You are listening to people screaming as they're dying. You are watching men, women, children, families. Everybody's just there knowing we're going to die. I still can't believe that my friends and I survived. And every time, every time these mass shootings happen,

it just pulls me straight to that moment. My heart is beating out of my chest listening to every word that the panel and you are saying. It is trauma beyond trauma. I don't understand it. I hope for a better world. I feel like I can't even leave my home. I don't know about any of you, but when I go to the mall when I go anywhere I literally get home and think to myself I just survived that's what trauma does you know Lisa Fine Cavalli joining me she survived the Harvest Music Festival mass shooting what happened at the shooting what happened at the shooting? What happened at the festival? What do you recall of it?

One minute, we are having the time of our lives. It was the most beautiful three days of a Country Music Harvest Festival. The amount of positive energy and just joy, it was everywhere. It was exciting. It was fun. We were just getting ready for Jason Aldean to go and do his amazing concert the last night. Ten minutes prior, my friend took my picture behind me at Mandalay Bay. that window is broken and all hell is about to break loose and then it happened and I knew instantly something was wrong I grew up in Idaho I know about guns I had the feeling of we are all going to die and we were in VIP section we had front row to murder, to mass murder. We had people dying all around us. We thought we would never breathe again. Then you do breathe. And then you think, I lived and 58 people plus two more died later. They're dead. I'm alive. Why am I spared? Just like going to the mall. I have watched that scene over and over because I feel like an obligation as a survivor to care about these people, these families.

I want to know what happened to them. I want to feel the grief for them. It's as if each victim is somebody that I loved. Because I almost died. I would want somebody to care about my life and live a legacy to help make the world a better place. Guys, you are hearing the voice of Lisa Fine Cavalli, who somehow managed to survive the Harvest Music Festival. And when she tells us when she heard about this mall shooting, it was as if she were right back in harm's way.

Take a listen to our Cut 24. Terrified concertgoers running for their lives, others diving for cover, some laying on top of each other for safety. By some accounts, the bullets raining down for more than an hour. And they cut the music and everyone said drop and everyone dropped. And then everyone just got up and they said run. And everyone started stampeding and charging and knocking over grills, jumping over fences, getting out. We tried to run this way and the same thing happened. And then we just hid in a bush for like an hour police SWAT teams tracked the shooter to the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay Hotel that from our friends at NBC guys that was the Mandalay shooting

at the Harvest Music Festival and now it's happened again at a Texas mall and you know to Joseph Scott Morgan professor forensics at Jacksonville State University, Joe Scott, it's almost as if this guy picked the time when the most people would be at the mall. He did, I believe at least. And there's one image that has been captured online relative to this, Nancy, and that's as hard as it is to describe. This image of these four souls that are all dead, and they're laying in one centralized area. It's not everybody, it's not every victim, but there is a collection of these victims. And Nancy, when you look at that, it is a perfect storm because there is only one way to get out. Just imagine kind of a horseshoe shape,

and you're in the backside of the horseshoe at the top, and there's only one way out, and that is to run back toward the shooter. And so they're corralled in that area and you actually have the bodies of these little ones that are lying there among the adults as well. So yeah, when you say that he picked this time out, I would agree with you to that point because the reality is it's in the middle of the day essentially

you've got a lot of shopping going on if anybody were of a mind to do this sort of thing you would have the access to the most targets and of course targets are actually a dehumanizing way of saying victims these are human beings that this happened to and it is an absolute horror show. You know, Joe Scott, the way you're describing the type of ammo this freak brings into the mall just made my stomach hurt. It's like he's going to some type of play acting like a theater where he is the star and he dresses up in his outfit and his costume and he gets all of his ammo and then he goes to the mall which is where so many people go on a Saturday afternoon. It's packed with women and children and there he unleashes pure hell. You know that's one thing that i really stress in the book don't be a victim is to wherever you go you look for an for the exit wherever you are you find the exit and i rehearse

and rehearse with the children where's the exit where's the exit where's the exit they think i'm crazy and you know karen start we were talking earlier about how these victims at first they were coming up with any idea any theory about what they were hearing as opposed to gunshots and I have the exact opposite whenever I hear anything I'm like is that a gunshot that's a gunshot it's just a mindset and to be so cruelly wrenched into the reality of what's happening and then everybody just starts running and i understand um uh from jen smith that many people were lying on top of other people trying to protect them that's what happened karen stark well there were parents that were on top of children trying to protect them and

and this guy was talking about a mother you you know, when he turned her over, there was a child underneath and then the child wanted to know about his mother. It's just horrific, Nancy. And the point here picked that time of day and the weekend because he wanted to get as many people as he could and as much attention as possible. That is so often the motivation. These are angry, angry people motivated by hate. And they're going to make sure that they are in a place where everyone can know what they did. Following up on what Karen Stark just told us, a psychologist joining us out of Manhattan, take a listen to our friends at KTVT. Spanauer says he found a child that survived while covered by his protective mother who died.

And so when I rolled the mother over, he came out and I asked him, are you okay? And he said, you know, my mom is hurt. My mom's hurt. So rather than traumatize him anymore, I put him around you okay and he said you know my mom is hurt my mom's hurt so rather than traumatize him anymore I put him around the corner set him down he was covered from head to toe like somebody had poured blood on him. It's that awful image that Spanauer and others who witnessed the horror will be haunted by for the rest of their lives. Who is this guy? What happened to Jen Smith? Joining us, Chief Investigative Reporter with DailyMail.com.

Take a listen to this. The first gunfire came in around 3.30 Saturday afternoon. That's when witnesses say a man dressed in black, wearing body armor, looking similar to a police officer, began walking through the mall property here, firing indiscriminatelyately sending thousands of people running for cover about 30 minutes outside dallas is the allen premium outlets it's a sprawling shopping center that has 124 apparel stores there are also six chain restaurants in the outlet mall starbucks is one of them simon property group owns the center the large real estate investment trust has more than 200 shopping mall properties worldwide back to jen smith joining us from dailymail.com what can you tell me about how he

entered this mall how nobody noticed him until really when he first started firing the military grade weapon well like you were just discussing nancy and everybody else this guy really wanted to he did want to make himself the center of attention. But the way that he was dressed, this tactical gear, some of the survivors said that they thought he was a police officer or security guard in this mall. That's the way he was presenting himself. So we're not entirely sure how he got to the mall. It sounds like he just walked right on up to it with this weapon we don't know a huge amount about this guy we are still learning what we do know is that he had some insignia on his tactical gear that suggests he was part of kind of extremist neo-nazi groups as i say that

information is still coming out but by all accounts so far he just walked up to this store and unleashed terror when you say an insignia that suggested he was with a neo-nazi group what do you mean by that a swastika or what no it wasn't quite a swastika it was um an acronym for a right-wing group. The letters are RWDS. We believe that that might stand for Right-Wing Defense Squad, something to that extent. And when investigators began researching this guy's online presence, social media revealed that he had expressed interest in neo-Nazism

and other extreme, extreme white supremacy groups. And in the Nazi culture, the human life means nothing. Nothing. So here we've got this guy, a neo-Nazi, and that's determined after finding a death squad patch believed to have been on his chest, observed by witnesses. Firing an AR-15 100 times, killing at least eight, including children. Take a listen to Chief Brian Harvey with Alan P.D. and our friends at NBC. At 336 this afternoon, one of our officers was on an unrelated call at the outlet mall. He heard gunshots, went to the gunshots. He also then called for ambulances. We have a multi-agency response helping us work the scene. In the

moments before police arrived, we are told that hundreds did whatever they could inside this property to survive. So we ran to the back, barricaded it with some concrete bricks, and then right then on the security camera, thank God we went in the back at that time, we saw him walk right by, masked up, fake police outfit on. Did you hear that, Jen Smith? He was perceived as having on a police outfit, the one person that people would run to, and he's actually the killer. And then a hero emerges, a cop, already at the mall on an unrelated matter. Maybe it's a shoplifting, Maybe it was a fender bender. He was there at the mall and he runs, did you hear this, runs to the bullets. Not away to safety, but runs to the sound of gunfire. Who is that guy, Jen Smith?

Well, we don't yet know his name, but we know he is a police officer like you say runs towards the danger um we will i'm sure find out more about this man but i think it's safe to say that had he not been there this the body count would have been a lot higher oh gosh yes take a listen our friends at msnbc he was described as wearing body armor he has been looking very tactical in nature very similar to in fact a police officer and that is how he was described by mother abby perez who brought her two daughters here in what was supposed to be a pre-summer vacation shopping trip that ended up with her keeping her two daughters locked in a bathroom guys dressed like a police officer in tactical gear, what do we know about this guy? Take a listen.

New information tonight on yesterday's Texas mall shooting. Law enforcement officials have now identified the suspect who killed eight people and wounded seven more. Police say he is 33-year-old Mauricio Garcia. Investigators say he was heavily armed with an AR-15 style rifle, a handgun, and multiple rounds of ammunition. Eight people were killed before a police officer who was responding to a different call shot and killed the suspect. Neighbors say that they saw the FBI agent show up about a few hours ago. They tell us the suspected shooter is in his 30s and has lived here for as long as anyone can recall. They tell

us he drives a gray Charger and was always parked in front of the home, except for the last few months they did notice that maybe he was not around and might have moved out. Neighbors say they don't recall any police activity here or problems. You're hearing our friends at CBS. What more do we know about the shooter? Take a listen to our friends at WFAA. Neighbors say the suspect always wore some kind of security guard uniform. Although no one saw him with a weapon, they say he was very quiet, would often walk up and down the street wearing some kind of hoodie and also just not really talking to anybody. They said he had very unusual behavior. They will likely spend many days going through that evidence trying to

determine what happened. I've talked to multiple sources and they are not quite sure at this point what the motive was even after speaking with the family. Neighbors say that this suspect was very quiet, kept to himself, but they believe that he was very, had very unusual behavior and sometimes dressed in gothic wear and kind of stayed to himself crime stories with nancy grace Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Jen Smith joining us, Chief Investigative Reporter with DailyMail.com. He dressed up in security guard garb and would go up. The neighbors would see him out on the street.

Was he a security guard? Was he previous military? And, I mean, it sounds like, you know how children like to dress up like cops? Who is this guy, Jen? Yeah, I mean, it really is. The picture is emerging. When we know, we've heard the neighbors say that they thought he was a security guard. That's because of how he was dressing, like you mentioned.

We've not been able to verify that this guy actually was a security guard. You mentioned the military experience. Now, we've just learned that he was in the military. We believe he was in the army, but he was removed from the army in 2008. And that was over a mental health concern, Nancy. So clearly there were some red flags about this guy for a long time, enough to get him kicked out of the armed forces. We're still trying to verify exactly what went on there. But aside from that, we don't know a huge amount about this guy. The neighbors say they hadn't seen him for several months around the house. We think he might have been living in a budget inn motel, at least in the weeks before this incident.

That's potentially where he was planning this atrocious attack. But really, this picture is only beginning to emerge of this horrific mass murderer. You know, it's really interesting to Irv Brandt, Senior Inspector, U.S. Marshal Service, DOJ, International Affairs, and author. You have hunted down people all over the world with the U.S. Marshal Service. This guy has a car parked outside his family home. I don't know if you've seen the photos of his neighborhood, but the neighborhood is tree-lined with beautiful lawns and lovely brick homes. I don't know if he was hiding out in some budget hotel or not, but I know what I'm seeing. And my point is, Irv, isn't it,

let me say, a deadly curiosity how people like this guy can blend in with everybody else and you don't understand what's lurking in their brains yes nancy um over the years i tried to profile people there'd be a certain type to a certain crime, and I found I couldn't do it. It was people I would look at the pictures or when I did the interviews or when I made the arrest, it took me by complete surprise. It was someone that you would walk by in Target or someone you would walk by in the grocery store, someone that you might have a conversation with at a coffee shop while you're standing in line. Just like you said, you looked at the tree-lined neighborhood,

and it's hard to envision that this type of person lived here, but they do, and it can happen anywhere. And it could be anybody standing next to you and that's what's so terrifying about this wearing a patch that says rwd s right wing death squads and and he is he's showing it to the world nicole devord-Hotchglobe, a high-profile lawyer joining us. This is her jurisdiction of Texas. It's one thing to have neo-Nazi beliefs that you keep to yourself. But he was proudly wearing that patch emblazoned on his cop-slash-military tactical uniform.

He was proud of it. Yeah, no, it's definitely disturbing. And it's certainly in hindsight, a red flag. And, you know, I think a lot of us probably don't go walking around thinking about what those initials might stand for. But it's probably in the future, something good to make note of. You see people wearing that kind of hate insignia, that maybe that's somebody that we need to keep a pretty

close eye on. This is somebody who is wanting the world to know how hateful they are. You know, it's interesting when she says that, you know, to Lisa Fine Cavalli, survivor of the horrible, horrible Mandalay shooting outside the Harvest Music Country Festival same thing in Parkland shooting same thing at Mandalay a guy that was suspicious a guy that raised red flags but there seemingly was not enough for authorities to act on. I mean, in Parkland shooting, the perp actually went online and talked about how he wanted to shoot up the school. But yet, it still happened. So, how does it make you, a survivor of this type of mass shooting, feel when you know there are red flags but no one acts on them

it makes me angry and it makes me terrified that we don't have a system that can catch evil evil people that intend to kill innocent lives. It makes no sense whatsoever. We are not protected. And I always wonder, you know, it happened to me. So I have a completely different feeling about the world. I wonder when it happens to the people that make the decisions, our leaders. I hope it never does. But when it happens to your family, you look at everything different. Guys, I want you to hear our friends at Fox 4 Dallas.

Hundreds were left to watch investigators swarm the scene from across Chelsea Boulevard waiting for loved ones to come pick them up. We heard what we thought was like fireworks and then people running. Sandra McKinley and her 13-year-old son Ryan were huddled inside American Eagle. I think a lot of us were hoping that maybe everything wasn't really happening, you know? And our friends at WFAA. So when I get out of the store, the ghost city, like I don't see nobody. I keep walking, everybody, like all doors were locked up, every shop kept people inside. Except me, I keep walking.

So when I see the scene, like people's bodies and everything. You saw bodies? Yeah. Tell me what you saw. People injured, really bad, some dead bodies. How many bodies do you think you saw? Probably like seven. It was really bad, man. Actually, a security guard too. I think they keep, the shooters keep all the way around. Like probably five, ten stores. You know, they keep shooting because the glass broken and everything. Like I said, security guard too.

He was dead too. That's right. The neo-Nazi killing machine is dead. Jen Smith, DailyMail.com. Did the hero cop gun down the shooter? He did, yeah. Immediately upon locating this guy, he trained his weapon on him. We actually believe that he killed him with a single gunshot wound to the head. That's what some of the people who saw the shooter's body afterwards

reported, that he was shot in the forehead. So thankfully, this guy who happened to be there, he didn't hesitate. He ran towards the danger and he took the shooter out immediately. We know that after that, some of the people who were injured were taken in police cars to the hospital because their injuries were so severe, Nancy, some of the people who were injured were taken in police cars to the hospital because their injuries were so severe, Nancy, that there was no time to wait for ambulances to arrive. So thank God that this police officer was there and that he took things into his own hands when he

saw that there was a danger. Thank God for this hero cop and for the police officers that go toward the danger, not running away from the danger, saving the lives of so many by loading them up in their squad cars and rushing them to hospitals, not even waiting for ambulances. We wait as the facts unfold. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast. Goodbye, friend.