Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Two little boys DEAD after forced back into home with KILLER-DAD

Episode Date: March 17, 2020

Susan Cox-Powell goes missing. Her husband, Josh, is the prime suspect. Then he kills their two sons and himself, taking the answer of what happened to Susan to his grave. Susan's parents Chuck and Judy Cox repeatedly warned Child Protective Services that their grandsons were in danger, but no one listened. Now the family is suing to hold the agency accountable. Joining Nancy Grace to discuss: Chuck Cox - Father of Susan Cox Powell Anne Bremner -  Attorney for Chuck and Judy Cox  Evan Bariault, Attorney for Chuck and Judy Cox  Rose Winquist - Investigator - www.winquistinvestigations.com Dr Daniel Bober - Forensic Psychiatrist, follow on Instagram at drdanielbober Dr. Tim Gallagher -  Medical Examiner State of Florida  Alexis Terezchuck - Investigative Journalist Crime Online [phone] For more information on this case and the Susan Cox Powell Foundation, visit https://susanshelp.net/ Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I want justice. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Available now only on Fox Nation. When your children draw a picture of you, what do they draw? Mine drew me in black tights, tennis shoes, and a Braves t-shirt. My husband had on his work outfit. We were all holding hands. Susan Cox Powell's children, her two little boys, Charlie and Brayden, drew a picture of mommy stuffed in a car trunk. And that's

just the tip of the iceberg. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Does the name Susan Cox or Susan Cox Powell mean anything to you? Does it ring a bell, even a distant bell? Well, I will never forget the name Susan Cox, and I will never forget her face, and I will never forget her two little boys, because they're branded into my memory. What happened? Where is Susan Cox? Why did her two little boys have to die? This has been dragging on for several years now and still no answers and no one has been held accountable. Even if you don't hold anybody accountable, can we just get answers? Can we get the truth?

Today, a team is joining me that is being led by Susan's father, Chuck Cox. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation and Sirius XM 111, the Triumph Channel. Take a listen to this. Why take your two young sons camping after midnight, freezing cold temperatures? Well, we just go out and do things that are fun. But it's after midnight.

You know, shouldn't your sons be sleeping? Weren't they sleeping? People who know me know that time is hard for me to keep track of. I tend to be spontaneous. I do things in the spur of the moment. Why not call work the next morning to say, hey, I was out camping. I'm not going to be in today. To be honest, Saturday was a blur. I was convinced it was still Saturday. Just hearing his voice makes my skin crawl. It just, anger just comes up into my neck because this beautiful mother, Susan, devoted herself to her little boys, dead. I don't have official word on that, but I know that she's dead at the hands of her husband.

And their two little boys, dead. Why? You were just hearing our friend at ABC News, Abby Boudreaux, speaking to Josh Powell. Joining me, an all-star panel to try and make sense of it and maybe get some answers today. Because right now, there is a courtroom battle going on like you have never seen. Joining me, Evan Berrialt, lawyer on the case, working with Susan's dad. Ann Bremner, high-profile lawyer out of Seattle, attorney for Chuck and Judy Cox, the boys' grandparents, Susan's parents. Rose Winquist, private investigator.

You can find her at Winquist, that's W-I-N-Q-U-I-S-T, winquistinvestigations.com. She's been on the case since the get-go. Dr. Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist psychiatrist joining us out of the Florida jurisdiction. You can find him on Instagram, Dr. Daniel Bober, the medical examiner for the state of Florida, Dr. Tim Gallagher. Also joining me, investigative journalist, Crime Online, Alexis Tereschuk. Now, this is a reporter that's been around the block a couple of times, intimately familiar with the case. But joining me right now is a very special guest who I go so far as to call a friend, Chuck Cox. who was leading the fight to save their lives. But because of DFACs, CPS, whatever you want to call it,

Child Protective Services, who did nothing, even though the alarm was raised over and over and over to them, you had investigators going to CPS, begging for help, but it was repeatedly refused. And right now, a court battle is raging to Chuck Cox, Susan's father. Chuck, I've just got to ask you, this is something I've never asked you before. We've been through Susan's disappearance. We've been through Powell's crazy story that he took the boys camping at midnight in freezing temperatures. That when the boys were asked later to draw a picture of mommy, your daughter, your baby girl, they drew a picture of her in daddy's car trunk.

And I was thinking about that this morning, Chuck, because there are pictures up in our kitchen, and there are photos that the children have drawn, pictures the children have drawn of their family, and they've got their dad who's huge, tall, and always wearing a vest, even if he's got on work clothes, and me in black tights and a Braves t-shirt. And it's so perfectly done. That's how they think of us.

Your grandboys thought of mommy in a car trunk with daddy driving and them in the back seat. And they say mommy went into the mines looking for crystals. That's the last time we saw her. But what I want to ask you, Chuck, is when they got married, after Josh and Susan, your daughter, got married, when was the first time you thought, this guy is weird? I would think when I got a call from my daughter

that said they had driven from the reception over to Steve Powell's house to wash off the car. And they were there. They're supposed to be going on their honeymoon. And instead, he drives to his father's house so he can wash his car. I thought, what on earth is this guy? Okay, right there. That was after the wedding reception? So day one? Day one, right after the wedding reception. Ann Bremner, a high-profile lawyer out of Seattle who is the attorney for Chuck and Judy Cox

who have been leading the battle for the truth. They were the ones begging, begging D-Fax, Department of Family and Children's Services, in that jurisdiction to do something. Now the boys are dead. Dead. At the hands of their father. Because DFACS did nothing. Ann Bremner, tell me about the courtroom battle that is raging right now.

First, thanks for showcasing this case, Nancy, for so long supporting the Cox family. It's just, you've been fabulous. And I think- Ann, you've met my babies, John, David, and Lucy. The thought of Lucy growing up and unwittingly marrying somebody like Josh Powell and ending up in the mines looking for crystals.

I mean, it's overwhelming to me what that family has been through. Tell me about the legal battle right now, Ann. We have a case right now, Nancy, against the Department of Child Services. Praise the Lord. PTL. Finally, somebody's taking them to court. Right. And it's basically the case is that they ignored

so many red flags and we couldn't even count all of them i told the jury about that and they repeated warnings that josh would kill these kids slow down slow down slow down so people like me can even understand what what's happening in court right now we're in the defense case we put on our case and the case is going forward despite of course the now we're in the defense case we put on our case and the case is going forward despite of course the coronavirus out here in the northwest and and we've had experts come on nancy to talk about that they had a reunification bias that safety should have been safety first but that was basically something okay right there right there hold right there. Hold on, Ann. You're warp 10 right now. Dr. Daniel Bober, a forensic psychiatrist,

you just heard Ann Bremmer state that defects, CPS, was hell-bent on reunification versus safety. Explain. Well, you know what, Nancy? You see this a lot in these reunification cases where the goal is to reunify the kids with the parents and I think it's a mistake because sometimes the parents are obviously not what's in the best interest of the child and it actually puts the child in greater jeopardy

especially in this case as we're seeing Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, joining me right now, Susan Powell's father, Chuck Cox, who's been leading the battle against Department of Child Services, who he holds responsible for the deaths of his beautiful little boys, two gorgeous little boys, Braden and Charlie. I want you to take a listen to our friend Abby Boudreau at ABC News interviewing Josh Powell before he murdered the boys. Did you kill your wife?

No. Did you have anything to do with the disappearance of your wife? No. Nothing? Nothing. What is the truth? People who know me know that I'm a good dad. I work hard.

I put my sons first. I was a good husband. I took care of my family. And I see you're still wearing your wedding band. Yeah. You still love her? Yeah. Yeah. I guess you could say that I still love her.

Man, that took a long minute for him to figure out if he loved the mother of his children, the one he killed. Wow, just hearing the voice of Josh Powell right now, a courtroom battle raging to find out the truth of why DFACS, Child Protective Services, never moved to protect the boys. I want you to take a listen to Abby Boudreaux over at ABC. She's talking about how Susan Powell, now missing for two years. Take a listen. For nearly two years, authorities have been searching for missing Utah mom Susan Powell. Her husband, Josh, whose alibi, a midnight winter camping trip with his children, is the only named person of interest by police. But now, in a shocking turn, Susan's

father-in-law, Stephen Powell, has been arrested following a search of his Washington state home. Police say thousands of lewd images of women and children as young as eight were discovered Steven Powell has been arrested following a search of his Washington State home. Police say thousands of lewd images of women and children as young as eight were discovered by police on computers and DVDs inside Steven Powell's home. There are pictures of girls in showers, on toilets, taking a bath. Among that material, police say secretly recorded videos and photos of Susan Powell, allegedly taken by her own father-in-law. We also have pictures of Susan Cox Powell that she probably doesn't know were taken. Powell shares his home with his son Josh, as well as Josh and Susan's two young sons.

Since Stephen Powell's arrest, the boys have been removed from the house and are in protective custody. Powell pleaded not guilty to 14 counts of voyeurism and one count of possession of child pornography. So let me understand this to Evan Berial, the lawyer on the case, led by Chuck Cox, Susan's dad. Even though Josh Powell is the suspect, the only suspect in his wife Susan's murder, D-Fax let the boys still live with the father. And when a judge found probable cause to search the home relating to Susan's disappearance, they find child pornography.

They find laying around for the boys to see pornography. I've read your brief carefully, including photos of a woman, a young woman with a sword plunged through her vagina. They found a noose. Just so much wrong in the home. And that's where the boys have been living these two little boys Evan that's correct that's where those boys were living and throughout this dependency as the state continued to give Josh more and more none of these safety concerns diminished in fact the state found out there were more images

there was cartoon porn that they found on a computer in Utah. So it worsened. And yet here the state was continuing to try and give Josh more and more. And they were learning that Josh was lying through his teeth. People in the community, his family, others were saying, Josh is lying to you. And yet here's the state giving Josh that much more trying to reunify these kids, not following these policies and putting these kids in harm's way. And Rose Winquist with me, private investigator at winquistinvestigations.com. Rose, we hear about child porn in the home, pornography where women are being murdered, laying out, not on a disc, not on a computer, but laying out in, I guess, magazine or photographic form for the boys, the little boys to see that. was also living in the home had thousands of voyeuristic photos where he would take pictures and videos of women unsuspecting when they were changing clothes when they were in the bathroom

including photos of dead Susan Cox Powell as a matter of fact isn't it true that her underwear had been taken out of the dirty clothes hamper? And he, the father-in-law, had that. And he would lay out her underwear on the bed with a picture of her head at the top and form like a pillow body for him to, let me say euphemistically, make out with. Yes, that's absolutely right, Nancy. Thank you, by the way, for following this for 10 years, if you can imagine. From an investigative standpoint, you know, Josh Powell was the only person of interest. Now, of course, people are

using the word suspect in the disappearance and probable murder of Susan Cox Powell. He left Utah only three weeks after her disappearance to move in with his pervy father, whose creepy fixation on Susan was unparalleled as far as I'm concerned. Again, you're right. He had photographs of Susan and video of Susan that she had no idea he was taking of her. How did he do it? Like through the window or through a peephole camera? How did he do it?

You know, through the crack in the door, through any means he could figure out a way and then of course you know a search warrant was finally served on his house um in september of 2011 this was some 21 months after susan disappeared the police described this house as a house of horrors. You can imagine. There was a bag of fingernail clippings. I know. I heard that. Ann Bremner, I don't get the sandwich bag of hair and fingernail clippings. I can't imagine what that was for or to whom they belonged.

But all this culminates i want you to take a listen to a 9-1-1 call made by the social worker elizabeth griffin hall now this is after she hands the boys back over to daddy on a silver platter. Listen. There was a man and two children. I just dropped off the kid. He wouldn't let me in the door. Get a line for the fire department, okay? I'm going to get them on the line. Do not hang up. Hold on. I can hear the fire check, but they're not here yet. It's 8-1-1-9. What? We have an engine there. And people are saying there's not somebody here, but I was just there, and there is somebody here. There's two little boys in the house, and there's five and seven, and there's an adult man.

He has supervised visitation, and he blew up the house and the kids. The kids and the husband and the father were in the house? Yeah, yeah, he slammed the door in my face. So I kept knocking. I thought it was a mistake. I kept knocking and then I called 911. And that is why we're so angry. That is why we're so angry. Joining me, Susan's dad, Chuck Cox. I remember when I first saw this image, the video of the home in flames. And at first I understood that Josh Powell had blown up his home, and then I was told the boys were in there. Chuck, do you remember that moment when you got word you'd already lost your daughter years before because he killed her and was never brought to justice and was given the opportunity to have these boys?

Do you remember when you learned about the explosion, Chuck? I remember learning about it, not believing it, and then standing there at the house watching what was left of the flames, or not the flames, but the smoke that was rising, the police had added fire out, and just asking myself what more could I possibly have done? And I could not think of anything. I had warned people, and the DSHS people refused to listen to my warnings.

And I asked the police to arrest him, and they said they couldn't. They were illegal. There was always excuses. There was always issues. But I couldn't. I did everything I could do to save my grandchildren. Hi, guys. Nancy Grace here. We have all worked so hard to bring to you. Don't be a victim fighting, Fighting Back Against America's Crime Wave, a brand new book. After interviewing literally hundreds of crime victims and police,

we put our knowledge into Don't Be a Victim. You can pre-order now. Go to CrimeOnline.com, pre-order now, and know that portions of our proceeds goes to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. With me right now, the dad of Susan Cox Powell, who has searched for answers for years, and his beautiful daughter, one of the best mothers you'd ever hope to find, Susan Cox. Her disappearance has plagued him, but now misery has been heaped on him, pain like I can't even imagine the pain he has suffered when he learns the man who killed his daughter, his son-in-law, allowed to keep the boys, murders them. Mr. Cox, you said you tried to warn people. I know that the two investigators had worked so hard, they even went and begged Child Protective Services to take the boys away

because they were so afraid. Who did you warn, Chuck, and what happened? I warned everybody who would listen to me. I started with the police because they were first working on the case against Josh. Then when the boys came under the control of Child Protective Services, DSHS, I warned the caseworker. And then I talked to the guardian ad litem and provided them evidence and tried to do everything because they were, of course, in the control of the state.

So I worked to everybody that I was supposed to work with to try and get the point across that they, that Josh could kill these boys. And I wanted to get them safe and out of that house of horrors which we had accomplished but I was ignored take a listen to CBS News correspondent Ben Tracy and I want you to brace yourselves as arson investigators continued to search through what's left of the Powell home the medical examiner now says seven-year-old Charlie and five-year-old Brayden Powell suffered chop injuries to their head and necks. The sheriff says their father, Josh Powell, then started the house on fire. We found two five-gallon cans of gas. One of them was with the bodies. The other one, we believe, was spread throughout the house.

There was accelerants throughout the whole entire house. Police say before he carried out the murder-suicide, Powell donated his son's toys to charity and left instructions about his personal effects in multiple emails. He sent some emails out to family and a pastor and some other people, making sure that everybody knew that he was gone, that he was the one that did this. He had put a plan in motion and he carried it out. Powell had been under police scrutiny following the suspicious disappearance of his wife, Susan Cox Powell, from their Utah home in December 2009. Six days ago, he lost a battle with Susan's parents

for custody of his sons. To Dr. Tim Gallagher, the medical examiner for the state of Florida, how in the world could medical examiners determine that Charlie and Braden, just 75 years old, had chop marks to their necks? Well, that's a difficult question to answer. You know, it would depend on the extent of the burn injuries, but typically what we find are the victims are on the floor of the residence that is engulfed in flames.

And meanwhile, the fire is above them. So they do get thermal injuries or they do get heat burns on their body. But it's not as disfiguring as one would imagine looking at the video. I just watched the video myself. So there are many, many cases of the injuries of presenting themselves in these bodies that have been tragically burned like these two boys. But how with a burned body could you decipher chop marks to the neck? Chop marks to the neck can be deciphered quite easily by looking at the vertebra or the bones in the neck. And you can see the instrument marks on the bone of the neck, and that would lead one to believe that is a chop mark. And you could

also coordinate that injury with the injuries that you find in other parts of the body, for instance, the skull. And a chop mark to the skull leaves a very distinctive pattern. And in this instance, that pattern was preserved. And the medical examiner who did the case concluded that that was a chop mark in the head and such, again, the chop mark in the neck. Both of them coordinated with each other. We also learned that the official cause of death was carbon monoxide poison, but I find that difficult to believe if they actually sustained chop marks to the neck and skull. Alexis Teresich joining me, crack investigative journalist, crimeonline.com.

Alexis, what leads me to this point, to this lawsuit? The family has finally, they tried. Chuck and Judy Cox, they tried almost immediately after the children were killed to file a lawsuit to get DSHS to take responsibility for this. They filed a lawsuit. It was thrown out in federal court. They have finally been allowed to have it back, and the trial has started. And what they are asking for is not punished. Well, the judge has said the woman who was there, the original woman, cannot be prosecuted.

The child second services woman that allowed the children to go into the homes. They ran ahead. Although I'm wondering if Josh Powell told those children, he was so manipulative, if he told them, next time you come over, run into daddy's house first. I bet he was planning it that far in advance. But they are finally having their day in court because they have to be held responsible. Nobody can be allowed to let children be abused and murdered in this way. Detectives have testified on the stand. You know what, Ann Bremner? We're hearing Alexis Tereschuk joining us, describing what's happening in court right now,

just a war between the gods going on, where CPS, Child Protective Services, is actually, thanks to Chuck Cox, Susan's dad, the boy's grandfather, trying to hold them accountable for what they did. Now, Alexis Tereshchuk is absolutely correct. A higher court ruled that the CPS workers could not be held accountable individually. But as far as the entire CPS, you got a shot at that.

Now, take a listen to this, Ann Bremner. This is Chris Cuomo speaking when he was at ABC. Take a listen to what he learns. When Elizabeth Griffin Hall brought Brayden and Charlie Powell to see their father last Sunday, the boys were excited to go as usual. Until that afternoon, she'd only ever witnessed a father who loved his sons. But then Josh Powell opened the door and everything changed did you did the door open did you see Josh I saw

Josh I saw Josh for just one second his eyes caught mine and and it he had a look in his eyes it was just kind of sheepish and he just shrugged his shoulders at me like that and then he slammed the door and i i thought that was an accident that he didn't mean to lock me out and so i knocked and i knocked and i rang the doorbell and i started i started yelling at josh let me in then she smelled gas and rushed to call 9-1-1 we'll have somebody look for you there okay how long will it be i don't know ma'am they have to respond to emergency life threatening situations first. The first available deputy...

Well, this could be life-threatening. So you're telling the 911 dispatcher, this is an emergency, this is a big deal, they're kids, and what are you getting from the other side? I'm getting, how can you be... Who's your supervisor? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, the case of Susan Cox Powell's murder and the murders of her two little boys, Charlie and Braden, has heated up in a court of law. It is a war between the gods as Susan killer, their son-in-law, Josh Powell. The boys end up dead. Dead because of what CPS did working in tandem

with Josh Powell. Take a listen to our friends at Fox News Seattle. This is Olivia LaVoie. It's been eight years since Chuck Cox saw his grandchildren for the last time. His emotions still raw when discussing pulling up to Josh Powell's Graham home engulfed in flames and running to a firefighter. I asked him if the boys were in there and he said yes. Chuck Cox described trying to process his emotions in that moment. He said he recalls saying out loud, what more could I have done? I was thinking I tried so hard to keep them safe. I tried to do everything.

I did everything that I was asked and more so. And I told everyone I could tell of my fears and the danger. And still here I am looking at this building and powerless to save the boys. This opened up testimony that is really the heart of this case. Chuck Cox's attempts to get DSHS social workers to see the danger he felt the boys were in around Josh. Danger? You're darn right. Susan Cox is dead. And listen to the findings that were made when the search warrant was executed in the home.

They found very sophisticated child porn on 15 computers and laying around. Porn lying out in the open in the home where the boys were. Josh Powell had a gallows hangman's noose in his room with a picture of a woman with a sword in her vagina coming out of her stomach for the boys to see. Josh Powell known to run around the home wearing nothing but a diaper. Josh Powell remained a suspect in child porn and voyeurism. Yet Child Protective Services allowed these two little boys back in the home of a suspected killer to Susan's dad. Tell me what you want to happen, Chuck Cox. What do you want out of this

lawsuit? First, we want DSHS to recognize their error and to change how they're treating these cases and how they treat domestic violence issues so that no other family has to go through this you know chuck i i hate even playing or describing what happened to the boys when you hear that i i know that when somebody brings up facts about my fiance's murder, and I'm not ready for it. It's like someone has thrown cold water on me. I could be having a perfectly great day with my children, John, David, and Lucy, or David, my husband, and then somebody brings that up out of the blue, and it still to this day stops me in my tracks. What is this trial doing to you as you have to hear this evidence day in, day out?

Every time we do hear the evidence or they bring up some fact, right or wrong, or it's close enough that it brings us right back to where we were that day and to the frustration we felt and to the loss of our children and the grief that we felt. It all comes flooding back in. You know, I thought I knew it all about grief after Keith was murdered, but now that I finally, you know, just as the window was closing, I got married and had children. And the thought that one of them would be hurt, much less endure what these two boys went through, I really can hardly think about it, Chuck. To Ann Bremner, you've been working this case so long, and it really goes to show your work, Ann, should affirm that as much as there are lawyer jokes floating

around, and it's easy to take a pot shot at lawyers and judges, I get it. You've been dedicated to this case from the beginning and you've never let go. What's happening in the courtroom right now, Ann? And at the end of this case, what do you want, Ann Bremner? Well, Nancy, you've been with us all along the way. And I think just like the family putting one foot in front of the other in the hopes that there's going to be justice at last, and this jury has a chance to make history, make sure this never happens again and we have accountability. We're in the defense case right now. We're hearing from all kinds of different people including experts about why this and why that but the bottom line is is that they failed in their duties to these children. Oh they failed so horribly Ann, Ann. They did. And it's very frustrating, of course, but also heartening to be part of this and to represent Chuck and his family

in a quest for justice. It's the most important case I've ever had. And I hope there's a legacy for Charlie and Brayden, for children, not just in Washington State, but all over this country, that they won't be in harm's way when they're in the care, custody, and control of Child Protective Services. You know, Evan and Barry, this is the first time I've gotten to speak with you personally, but I got to tell you, this is one heck of a brief, and we have posted it at crimeonline.com because it's an incredible brief that you guys put together. Evan, if you win this case, what are you asking for? Well, Nancy, thank you first for the compliment. I really appreciate that.

At the end of the day, we want change. We want DSHS, we want CPS to change the way it does things. And it needs to realize that it cannot act on reunification at all costs. It says under the law that child safety is number one, and DSHS, CPS needs to put child safety number one. Those rules, those guidelines are there to protect children, to prevent events just like this. The state had guidelines in place to prevent this from happening. This never should have happened. It shouldn't happen to any child that is under the care, custody, and control of the state, and it needs to stop. We can't have any more child deaths, and this is an opportunity for a jury to tell the state,

this is not going to happen again. You need to turn it around now. Back to Chuck Cox, Susan's dad. Chuck, you are intimately familiar with many, many more case files than I have. You were there. What do you think Josh did with Susan? The specifics. My suspicion was he poisoned her, incapacitating her with something in her food.

And then from there on, I still have issues. I think he probably stuck her somewhere where she died. But I don't know. And then he he got rid of the body somehow but that's that's what i'm thinking but you know at this point whatever we do is not going to bring susan back or even charlie and brayden but what i plan to do is when the courts hopefully change what dshs does and obviously the only thing we can get is some kind of a judgment, and we plan to use any judgment to increase our efforts to help others to prevent this and to create a legal defense fund for people who are dealing with DSHS so that people will have a voice and we can protect more children. I mean, that's what we can do as a legacy to Charlie and Brayden and a service, which is Susan's legacy is service to others

to try and help others who are trapped in domestic violence and are not aware of these things, to bring this stuff to light. And that's why we really appreciate your interest in the case, and that's why we're fighting. And to Ann Bremner, Evan Berial, Rose Winquist, Dr. Daniel Bober, Dr. Tim Gallagher, Alexis Teresichuk, and all of you, whenever you are tired or you're weary and you feel like you can't take another step or keep fighting, remember what Chuck Cox is saying. We can make a difference.

We are all watching that courtroom and praying for the right outcome. Godspeed. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.