Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Wacko judge lets brutal rapist out to murder rape victim.

Episode Date: August 14, 2020

Karla Dominguez reports a sexaul assault to police naming Ibrahim E. Bouaichi as her attacker. Bouaichi was charged with six felony counts, and turns himself in to the Alexandria jail. He was ordered held without bond. Bouaichi maintained his innocence, and because of covid, his lawyers asked to allow Bouaichi to post bond. After getting out of jail, Bouaichi murders his alleged victim. Joining Nancy Grace today: Ken Belkin - NY criminal defense attorney, www.belkinlaw.com ‭ Dr Debbie Joffe-Ellis - Psychologist, Adjunct Professor at Columbia University, www.debbiejoffeellis.com Karen Smith - Los Angeles, Ca Forensics Expert, Lecturer at the University of Florida, Host of "Shattered Souls" podcast.  Joe Scott Morgan - Professor of Forensics Jacksonville State University, Author,"Blood Beneath My Feet" Sierra Gillespie - Crime Online Investigative Reporter Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. How does a gorgeous young girl who was a victim of a sex assault, a rape, get the courage to go forward with that, make a complaint, and then end up murdered. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation and Sirius XM 111.

I'm talking about Carla Dominguez Gonzalez. Why is she dead? How did that happen? Since when do you get the death penalty because you're brave? First of all, take a listen to this. In October, 31-year-old Carla Dominguez Gonzalez called police to report she had been sexually assaulted by Ibrahim Bouyachi. Investigators charged Bouyachi with six felonies, rape, sodomy, strangulation, abduction, burglary, and malicious wounding. The 33-year-old turned himself in, and he was held without bond.

At a preliminary hearing before Alexandria General District Court Chief Judge Donald M. Haddock in December, Carla Dominguez-Gonzalez testified that the incident in her apartment on October 10th was violent and not consensual. Judge Haddock found probable cause to send the case to a grand jury and denied a request to allow Buiachi to post bond. The grand jury indicted Buiachi on five charges, rape, sodomy, strangulation, abduction, and burglary. So this guy, this rapist, is given no bond. The judge was wise. There was a preliminary hearing. Now, in many jurisdictions, a case either goes to a grand jury, which is 20 to 40 people.

They're taken off the voter registration list, usually. And they meet one to two times a week in most jurisdictions. They listen to bare-bones evidence, just one witness very often, and they decide, is there enough evidence for an indictment, a formal charge? Then there's a formal charge or a no bill. In other words, they don't charge. The indictments then are funneled through to judges in various courts in the courthouse. And my jurisdiction was done by number. So favorites were never played. One day I could get 10 theft by shopliftings. And the next week I could get

five murders. It was all done by computer. There's another way. A judge hears a preliminary hearing. Here's the evidence. Witnesses are brought forward, usually just enough to make out the case. And then the judge decides, is there enough evidence to bind the case over to misdemeanor or felony court? And that's what happened here. Ibram Boyachi was bound over on multiple felonies, including rape and kidnapping. His victim, Carla Gonzalez, had to testify about her rape and her ordeal in open court. So why did she get the death penalty?

Again, thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation Series XM 111. With me, an all-star panel. First of all, veteran trial lawyer in multiple jurisdictions, New York criminal defense attorney, Ken Belkin at BelkinLaw.com. Dr. Debbie Jaffe-Ellis, psychologist, adjunct professor at Columbia University at DebbieJaffeEllis.com. Forensics expert, host of Shattered Souls podcast, lecturer, University of Florida, Karen Smith. Joe Scott Morgan, professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University, and author, Blood Beneath My Feet, death investigator. But first, to Sierra Gillespie, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. Sierra, first of all, take a listen to this.

The sexual assault trial of Ibrahim Bouyachi was originally scheduled to begin on March 30th, and his attorneys were preparing a defense that Ibrahim Bouyachi and Carla Dominguez Gonzalez were boyfriend-girlfriend. But the coronavirus pandemic put all court action on hold. Even though Bouyachi had been held without bail since he turned himself in on October 21st, his lawyers argued that the virus was a danger to inmates as well as their attorneys and that Buiocchi should be freed while awaiting trial. On April 9th, Circuit Court Judge Nolan Dawkins released Buiocchi on $25,000 bond with the condition that he only leave his home in Maryland to meet with lawyers or pretrial service officials.

Okay, hold on, Sierra Gillespie. I was coming to you. But let me just first go to you, Ken Belkin. Really? $25,000 bond. We all know that you only have to put up 10% of that. That's $2,500. hundred dollars. And also the defense to a violent kidnapping and rape and strangulation is their boyfriend, girlfriend. I'm sorry. I don't remember that defense in law school. Yeah. What is that? Yeah. The fact that their boyfriend and girlfriend is not a very viable

defense. Now, look, with respect to their bail, this is emblematic of a pattern we're seeing play out across the country and especially up here in New York City where I am. Judges are very susceptible to the argument that because of COVID, it's a hardship and our prisons are not equipped to deal with this sort of viral outbreak. And as such, bail conditions should be modified. Defendants should be released. The reality is in prison is probably one of the few places where you have a constitutional right to adequate medical care. You're guaranteed to get medical care in prison. You're not guaranteed to get it outside in the real world. You know,

I love the way you play. Look here, not there. All right. Start talking about COVID and the prison system and the treatment system. Why in the H-E-double-L did this judge, Nolan Dawkins, think that the rapist, I'll just put it out there, because she was physically attacked with obvious injuries she had a rape kit done she goes and testifies in court and they claim boyfriend girlfriend is the defense like that somehow makes us putting perfume on the pig like that makes it better somehow easier to take the stench off the stink? Uh-uh. No. Because what it means, Ken Belkin, is, first of all, a rape suspect says, that didn't happen. I don't know her. I've never seen her. Then it turns out, oh, here's surveillance video of you in the bar.

And there you are talking to her. Oh, her. Yeah. She was just beside me in the bar. I don't know her. Okay. So now we've defeated that claim that they never met. Then it's witnesses saw you leaving the bar.

Oh, yeah. I walked her to her car. She invited me to walk her to her car. I had nothing to do with that. Now I remember I did walk her to the car. Really? And no sex. No, no. I never touched her. I walked her to her car. I had nothing to do with that. Now I remember I did walk her to the car. Really? And no sex. No, no, I never touched her.

I walked her to the car. Well, then why is your semen on her clothes and in her body? You know what? Now that I think of it, I think she wanted me. She was after me from the get-go. Yeah, you know what? You're right. We made out in the

car. Well, what about the bruises on her neck? She liked it rough. Okay, see, that's how that works. You start with, I've never met her. I don't know what you're talking about, too. She likes it rough. So the boyfriend-girlfriend thing, that's not really working for me, Ken Belkin. Yeah, it's not really working for me. And Ikin. Yeah, it's not really working for me. And I can tell you this, if I was his defense attorney, I would be employing a much different strategy. Because that ship has sailed, and that story has changed multiple times. Well, I guarantee you, Ken Belkin, this is what the defense lawyer was thinking. There's probably DNA.

Joe Scott Morgan, professor of forensic at Jacksonville State University. When I say DNA, let's just be blunt of Forensic at Jacksonville State University, when I say DNA, let's just be blunt, alright, it's sperm in and on her body. So there's no way that he can say it wasn't me. So how overwhelming statistically can a DNA, deoxyribonucleic acid result be? How specific can it be? The odds are like in the millions up into the billions sometimes, Nancy, where we're talking about what are the chances that it could be someone else other than this person? You know, years ago, all we had to rely on prior to DNA was serology, where we would look for people that would secrete blood cells into their semen. And, you know, we're only talking about ABO groups relative to that.

This has taken this all to another level. And he knows this, I'm sure. It's specificity that this is all hanging on. That's what makes this so difficult for the defense because who else could it have been? So he has no other choice but to say, well, yeah, I was in proximity to her, but this is something else.

He has to be able to explain it well, and defense counsel has to as well, and these are very difficult odds to beat. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we're talking about now a murdered, beautiful young woman, beautiful on the inside and the outside, Carla Gonzalez. It's a good thing, trial strategy-wise, that the prosecutor did put her up at preliminary hearing for her testimony under oath and on the record. I never like to do that. I don't like preliminary hearings. Why? Because I put up enough of a case to get the

case bound over to felony court to go to a pettit or jury of 12 versus a grand jury of 40. And when I'm doing that preliminary hearing, the defense has a right to cross-examine my witnesses before the jury trial. I don't like that. But in this case, fortuitously, I'm glad her testimony was preserved. Take a listen to Police Chief Michael Brown. Ibrahim Bouigi is wanted for the July 29th murder of Ms. Carla Elizabeth Dominguez-Gonzalez. The murder occurred at approximately 6.20 in the morning in the 1400 block of South Greenmont Drive in the city of Alexandria. Attempts to locate Mr. Buiechi have been unsuccessful and we are asking for the public's help in

locating him. Buichi is described as a 33-year-old Middle Eastern male, 6'2", weighing approximately 180 pounds. Buichi is considered armed and dangerous and poses a potential threat to anyone who comes in contact with him. You're hearing the police chief, Michael Brown, reporting what happened. Buichi on the run. At this point, they have no idea where he is. Take a listen to Washington, D.C., NBC News, Drew Wilder.

Carla Dominguez Rodriguez was found shot and killed near her apartment at Town Square just off of North Beauregard Street on July 29th. Alexandria City Police think this is her killer, 33-year-old Ibram Bouachi. Attempts to locate Mr. Bouachi have been unsuccessful and we are asking for the public's help in locating him. Police Chief Michael Brown says Bouachi is a threat to anyone he comes in contact with and to consider him armed and dangerous. We spoke with a woman who lives in the complex where the shooting happened. She asked us not to show her face. I also heard that the man WE SPOKE WITH A WOMAN WHO LIVES IN THE COMPLEX WHERE THE SHOOTING HAPPENED. SHE ASKED US NOT TO SHOW HER FACE. I ALSO HEARD THAT THE MAN WAS

NOT CAPTURED. AND SO THAT'S KIND OF DISTURBING. POLICE SAY BUACI WAS LAST KNOWN TO DRIVE A STOLEN BLACK 2013 NISSAN ALTIMA SEDAN. I HAVEN'T EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT HE WOULD COME

BACK. A GOFUNDME FOR THE VICTIM SAYS ALL OF HER FAMILY LIVES IN VENEZUELA. A SPOKESPERSON FOR THE CITY SAYS GONZALES WAS WELL KNOWN FOR THEIR FAMILY. THE VICTIM WAS A LITTLE DIFFERENT. SHE WAS A LITTLE BIT OF A about you know whether or not he would come back a gofundme for the victim says all of her family

lives in venezuela a spokesperson for the city says gonzalez was well known back home for competing in beauty pageants the spokesperson says there have already been memorials for gonzalez in venezuela while detectives here search for her killer and joining me sierra Gillespie, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. Sierra Gillespie, how in the world did this judge, Nolan Dawkins, think it was a good idea to let Boakye go? Released on $2,500. I mean, the guy's already driving a stolen car. He can get money. So if he can get wheels like that, he can get money. Why was his life, and as Ken Belkin pointed out,

with the best care the state can provide behind bars on rape, kidnap, strangulation, more important than the innocent victim, the beauty queen, Carla Gonzalez. What was the judge thinking? What happened? Honestly, Nancy, hindsight is 20-20. So at this point, we know it was clearly the wrong decision. And I think a lot of people would actually argue it was the wrong decision. Even at the time, people knew that he was a threat especially if this woman this beautiful beauty queen was arguing that he had raped her it was clearly not the right decision but since then the judge has actually retired and he has not made any comments about this since because now we do know the fate

of what happened to carla dominguez gonzalez well my my my isn't that convenient to Dr. Debbie Joffe Ellis, adjunct professor Columbia, Debbie Joffe Ellis dot com. Wow. So this judge can just retire with full benefits, kick back with his feet up and not issue a comment on the dead victim. I guess being a judge doesn't make one a saint. I mean, there's the element of all, any of us, all of us can make a mistake and it can be. No, wait a minute, Dr. Debbie, hold on just a second. To me, a mistake is when I forget to get the blueberries at the grocery store or I forget to fill the car up. I was supposed to pick up a tie-dye t-shirt. Lucy left it at a little friend's house. I forgot it.

That's a mistake. When you have a prosecutor and a victim begging you, do not let this guy out. I'm afraid. And you do it anyway. That's not a mistake, Dr. Debbie. That's a calculated decision that cost this girl her life. Would you like to rephrase? Well, perhaps the word mistake in this context was a little too mild for you.

I mean, no. Yeah, well, a little too mild. Yeah. Okay. All right. I'm not denying. Even that's a little too mild. Yeah.

Look, I'm not denying that he screwed up. I'm in no way defending him. I'm in no way defending him. Because it kind of sounds like you are. In no way. But we can dwell on why did he do it. The fact is he did it. Yeah, I want to know why he did it so judges in the future don't do it again.

Yeah, well, then he would have to perhaps do some sort of cognitive test, although I don't know how much that would prove. Oh, my stars. Are you trying to say he had a mental deficiency or he had an illness? No, I'm not, Nancy. I'm trying to be somewhat humorous because we can't read his mind. I can't from here. So I don't know what was going on, whether he, we can't say he did or didn't have malicious intent. My hunch is more towards negligence. And yes, I know you think I tend to be more kind. But the bottom line is we don't know. I don't know if kind is the word.

Pardon? I think that you are seeing violent criminals through rose-colored glasses. And I'm sure there's a psychological name for that. But let me just tell you, this woman went through hell when he kidnapped, attacked, strangled her, and raped her. Then she had to have a rape kit, which is a pelvic exam. Then she has to go and testify and relive the whole ordeal again in front of people she doesn't know, including a judge. Do you know how much I hate Dr. Debbie? When people out of the blue bring up to me my fiance's murder and it happened a long time ago,

I can be having a perfectly fine day, and somebody brings that up, I feel like I got kicked in the mouth. I hate it. I don't want to relive it. I don't want to talk about it. It feels like I have to go through it all over again. And I can be sad over it for days on end. My twins don't need a sad mommy. They need a happy mommy.

So here's this girl has to get up and relive the whole thing, be re-traumatized, and that's just at the preliminary hearing, and subject herself to cross-exam by the defense lawyer. She's still got to do the whole thing again at trial. So this girl's been through H-E-double-L already. a defense lawyer, she's still got to do the whole thing again at trial. So this girl's been through H-E-double-L already. What is that when you don't want to talk about a trauma? You don't want to relive it. What's the psychological name for that? Well, it could be a few. It could be avoidance.

It could be resistance. It's understandable. It's self-protection. You know, one doesn't want to suffer. Our natural inclination as healthy humans, if we are, is to go towards feeling happy or positive emotions. So it's not a mystery that we don't want to do that. It can be, as you've described very clearly, agonizing, agonizing. But you were asking about the judge and his wrong decision. Horrible decision. Yeah. Yeah. And the fact is, I'm saying

perhaps the obvious to most of us, life isn't fair and with justice in many cases. And things happen. Tsunamis happen. Innocent people die. This beautiful woman. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we're talking about a young lady who was raped, strangled, kidnapped by Ibrahim Boichi. He was let out of jail after his arrest, and then he goes and shoots her dead. Now I've just spoken to by all accounts a renowned psychologist who's a professor adjunct professor Columbia. I mean that's nothing to sneeze at

Dr. Debbie Joffe Ellis and she in her wisdom has compared a judge's decision to let this guy walk free, to go kill his victim. She compared it to an act of nature. A tragic act of nature. A storm. You said a tsunami. I don't think a tsunami is intentionally planned by anyone, although some people claim it's God releasing his wrath. I don't believe that. I think it's a convergence of meteorological factors and you have a tsunami. This judge did it on purpose.

I mean, Ken Belkin, help me. Look, you know, the reality is, as I said before, in prison, you're guaranteed to get good health care. And in many cases, people in prison are getting better health care than people outside. That's a fact. The state has to provide it to you. You have a constitutional right when in their custody. The reality is this guy was 33. He was not, by all accounts, particularly susceptible to the worst effects of the coronavirus. And this judge saw fit to give him release conditions, bond, $25,000 bond,

and pretrial services were supposed to monitor him. I don't see that pretrial services did any monitoring. This guy went out and committed a murder of the victim and chief witness in the case against him. That's a hell of a monitoring they did on him. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. I swore to give up cursing, so I can't exactly say that. Okay, I agree with you. They did. Apologies for the language. Oh, guys, take a listen to our friend at Fox 5 DC. This is Tisha Lewis. We're steps away from the courthouse where all these decisions are being made. And we are told, though, without commenting on a a specific case a spokesperson for the city says that ultimately it is up to the judge the

judge alone and a case by case decides about these releases due to the coronavirus but it's important to note that there's no specific mandate or notification process for notating if a case or if an inmate is being released due to COVID-19 now what we can say is the city says that the only way to know for sure if someone was released due to the coronavirus pandemic would be to read the transcript of any bond hearing which again still would not have to include the premise of the release. This new information comes as two inmates across our area were released due to COVID-19 and then went on to allegedly commit murder. 33-year-old Ibrahim Baruchi reportedly raped, strangled, and abducted Carla Dominguez back in October.

She testified against him in December, and he was in jail in Alexandria being held without bond when he was released in April due to COVID-19 concerns and safety measures in the jails. He's accused of fatally shooting Dominguez on July 29th. She is dead. Her family left to mourn and me to try to figure out what the hay happened, what went wrong. Joining me in all-star panel, Sierra Gillespie, Joe Scott Morgan, Karen Smith, Dr. Debbie Jaffe Ellis, and Ken Belkin. To you, Karen Smith, forensics expert, host Shattered Souls podcast, we know that she was brutally raped and strangled. She was very persuasive on the stand. The judge believed her at the preliminary hearing.

What evidence do you believe was brought forward at the preliminary hearing to convince the judge that this should be tried in front of a felony jury? We've already talked about the semen evidence that they've obviously found. You have photographs of the bruises on her neck. You have her own testimony. Nancy, I am gritting my teeth. I am so angry right now because bottom line to put a button on it, Carla Dominguez Gonzalez should be alive right now.

And, but for the actions of this judge allowing the release of a vicious, horrible felon into the general population of this country, she is now dead. And frankly, I am really upset because as a retired cop, now the onus is put back on the cops to go find him when their resources could be better put toward preventing crime, toward boots on the ground. They're dealing with COVID.

This is ridiculous. I don't know where common sense has gone, Nancy. It has gone out the window. Well, I guarantee you this. I guarantee you this. Judge Nolan Dawkins heard the word boyfriend, girlfriend as the defense and suddenly decided, eh, that rapiness triangulation, let's not go back to Joe Scott Morgan, professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University, author, blood beneath my feet.

Joe Scott Morgan, all of this is a travesty. I'm thinking about Carla Dominguez Gonzalez. They're afraid. She may have had no idea this guy was even out. Did you hear what the earlier reporter said? That the only way to find out if somebody gets out on bond is if you read the transcript for the bond hearing. Have I ever told you this, Joe Scott? I was working at Court TV, 39th and 3rd Avenue in New York. I got off the air. I had been there since about 530 that morning. Went to my office, turned on the computer, saw an email from a viewer, opened it up, and they told me my fiancé's murderer had gotten out on parole.

I didn't know. I knew nothing about it. His family knew nothing about it. It was a big surprise. I forgot how the viewer found out. I think she must have looked up the case and found out the killer was out walking free. The fact that a victim has to get a hold of the bond hearing transcript to find out what happened. Did you hear that, Joe Scott?

Yeah, I did. It's obscene. And let me tell you something else. When she was shot, Nancy, this is not like they just happened to bump into one another in the late evening, maybe going out for a bite to eat, and they just happened to be in the same spot. This happened early in the late evening, maybe going out for a bite to eat, and they just happened to be in the same spot. This happened early in the morning. This animal was stalking her. He waited outside where she was living, and he gunned her down.

And let me tell you something else that's significant about this. After all the reading that I've done on this case, Nancy, do you realize that for the year 2020, this was the first, number one, first homicide in this jurisdiction? The first. So back to the judge, just for a second. Your Honor, what else did you have on the docket that day that was so freaking pressing that you couldn't ensure that she's going to be safe. You didn't even have the wherewithal, the forethought, and your brilliant mind to make this guy wear an ankle monitor. And another thing, he's so violent.

Nancy, we talk about the violence that was inflicted. Let's talk about this. She was raped. She was beaten. She was sodomized, Nancy. She was terrorized. And so you're going to cut this guy loose and just say, well, sugar, you just stay at home and we're going to rely upon this $25,000 bond to keep you indoors and you're not going to do anything else. And it's not just

about her. I want to know where this guy lived, because if you cut him loose and he has this indication, he wasn't convicted, but he has this this indication he wasn't convicted but he has this indication of this level of violence i mean this is animalistic nancy it's brutal you're gonna let him live let's say he lived in an apartment somewhere well how do you know there's not young children other defenseless women that are living immediately adjacent to him and you're gonna cut him loose and let him introduce him back into society without any kind of controls? Have you lost your mind? Well, apparently it was temporary insanity because I got to tell you, he's destroyed.

He ripped her to shreds. Here's one more thing, and I'll shut my mouth. I'll say it. How in the, I'll say it, how in the hell does this guy have a firearm? He is so violent. Nancy, if he's that violent, why didn't somebody go to his home, rifle through his home because he is a danger to the public and say, these are the controls. These are the stipulations, you cannot be in possession of a firearm, how does he have a pistol? How does he have the ability to possess one when he's staring down, bad choice of words, the barrel of these kind of charges? And then he's cut loose.

This guy, this judge, this judge should be held to account and also the people that are supposed to be, quote unquote, monitoring him. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we are talking about a travesty and a tragedy. A violent criminal who strangles, rapes, kidnaps, sodomizes a gorgeous young girl, a beauty queen, is then given bond. He kills her. Now, Joe Scott, while we're on it, let me give you the sour icing to top the poisonous cake. I hope you're sitting down. You may need to lay down for this.

Boachie had another run-in with the law, run-in euphemism, just before the shooting in May. Now, remember now remember i believe didn't he get bond in april didn't nolan dawkins given bond in april get ready everybody in may one month later he is arrested by greenbelt police over a hold-up alarm at a wendy's cops say buocci was acting strangely in the drive-thru, became uncooperative with police, arrested, charged with two counts of first-degree assault, two counts second-degree assault, harming a law enforcement dog, resisting arrest, driving drunk after he got out on bond in April on rape, estrangulation, and sodomy. He was then released May 11 with Alexandria officials saying, we didn't know. We would have revoked his bond if we knew. There's nothing you can tell Carla's family that's going to make them feel any better. I mean, I almost wish they didn't know about this.

Did you know that, Joe Scott? He was actually arrested at a Wendy's drive-thru? No, I didn't. And attacked a police dog in May after his release in April? No, I had no idea. I thought that my head was going to explode. It has now officially exploded. This, again, is an indication.

You know, it doesn't a disservice to simply say, well, the left hand doesn't know what the right hand's doing. You know, that's okay. If you're, if you're out working on a house or if you're out working on a car or something like that, we're talking about people's lives here. You know, that, that, that the courts, that the courts and the system would be this dismissive in this event. Because who all, I mean, you've already got an indication that he's a danger. And now you're going to talk about he gets involved, getting cakey with the police and attacking a police dog as well. You know, to what extent? And I know what we can say.

Well, he's got some kind of, this poor thing has got some kind of psychopathology going on. He just needed help. Yeah, well, you know, this girl needed help, too. And in the balance, apparently his needs outweighed hers. It's not the first time an incident like this has occurred. Take a listen to Cup 14. Our friends at KMPH, Fox 26. This is reporter Marie Ettinger. Just two and a half weeks ago,

37-year-old Eric Simmons was arrested on charges of rape, robbery, battery, assault with a deadly weapon. He also had an outstanding warrant for spousal abuse. He posted bond and got out. Now he's back in jail, arrested for eight new felony counts, spousal abuse again, plus auto theft, looting, and other charges. That's the worst part because, you know, we do this to protect the public from becoming a victim. And to know you have somebody in your grasp and you're locking them up, the next day they're out and now they're victimizing somebody new. And how do you explain that to that person that, hey, I just arrested this guy yesterday and I'm sorry, I wish I could have protected you, but my hands were tied. On April 23rd, Simmons was arrested for running from police,

driving on a suspended license and drug charges. His bail would have been 58,000 bucks, but the $0 bail rule meant he didn't owe a dime. Well, that was defendant Eric Simmons. Take a listen to our friends across the country at WSTM CNY Central News, Lauren Khalil. DA William Fitzpatrick says the incident never should have happened in the first place. Mr. Mobley is dead because of your new law. That law? Bail reform. According to Fitzpatrick, Mobley had a history of run-ins with the law. He had been charged earlier in the year with a burglary. We're investigating information that he may have been involved in some arsons. He clearly had, and no disrespect to the dead, but he clearly had some mental health issues. You put that together and any judge in the past would have said this

individual is going to be held without bail until such time as his mental health issues are addressed. Fitzpatrick says the judge did exactly what he was supposed to do in accordance with the new bail reform law. As for the Syracuse police officer involved in the deadly shooting, he's been released from the hospital and his name will be released in the next few days as prosecutors and police continue to investigate. There you have people losing their lives, a cop in the hospital because of bail reform. Judges making horrible decisions, not convinced. Take a listen to Cut 13, our friends at WRGB, CBS 6, Albany.

The state's new bail laws tangled up Troy police in a loop of catch and release. They arrested Scott Nolan three times in seven hours yesterday. Around 9 a.m., they arrested him and charged him for shoplifting. He was released with an appearance ticket. Hours later, they say he assaulted a man just before 2.30. He was arrested and released again. Then just before 4.30, they say he hit another person with a brick. Police charged him with second-degree attempted assault and third-degree criminal

possession of a weapon, which kept him in custody. They just basically become reactive instead of a proactive police department. Nicholas Laviano is the president of Troy's police union. He says the department knows Nolan well, and he says this isn't Nolan's first run-in with the department. Back in January, police charged him with criminal mischief and released him. They say they caught him committing the same crime hours later. Laviano says Nolan's criminal history is 50 pages long, and that has to be printed out every time he's arrested. He says that process uses up time and taxpayer money. It's a bit of a morale killer. They know that they're not out there doing the real police work that they want to be doing ken belkin did you hear that ken belkin's joining me new york

defense attorney belkinlaw.com a 50-page rap sheet believe it or not i've seen one that long made my stomach turn 50 pages it's not impossible this guy's walking around with a brick in his hand. I have certainly represented people with rap sheets that long in my day. And let me tell you. I hope you're not proud of it. Look, I do the best I can for these people. I like to think that the end of the dad helped their lives on some level. You know, it's not it's not a cartoonish thing where it's like, oh, I got him off. He's free to go commit crimes. I like to see my clients get help when they need it. But the fact of the matter is there are forces in this country, and you see them at work here in New York City, and they want to undo our bail laws.

And in New York right now, there is a five-page list of crimes that judges are prohibited from setting bail on right now in New York City. Now, add to that, there are bail fund organizations out there that when judges, in the limited circumstances that judges are even allowed to set bail these days, these bail funds will post the bail for these defendants. And what happens is the purpose of bail is that you don't trust this defendant's going to come back to court so you want to hold something over them rather than put them in jail. And we hold some money. And if they come back to court, make all their appearances, they get that money back. These bail funds and these reforms totally defeat the purpose. If someone else is paying the bail, when a judge can even set it, what is the incentive for someone to come back to court? You know, I want to go to Dr. Debbie Jaffe Ellis, adjunct professor, Columbia University,

renowned psychologist. Dr. Debbie, I'm just thinking about how you would feel, keep defending these people and with a guy like that coming at you with a brick. I mean, there are people, they may need help. I want them to have help, but I don't want them released and unleashed on the public. I couldn't agree with you more, Nancy. And I'm a psychologist. I'm not a lawyer. I wish there were ways that you could hold judges accountable when they can't find him. He shoots himself. I don't have to worry about him hurting anybody else, but the ailment in our justice system remains, and there will be other Croix Dominguez's innocent victims if we

don't act. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. You're listening to an iHeart Podcast.