Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Woman-hating man attacks yoga studio, killing two women

Episode Date: November 5, 2018

The man who opened fire in a Tallahassee, Florida, yoga studio, killing two women, posted videos online suggesting his hatred for women. Nancy Grace looks at the attack and the background of the 40-year-old shooter Scott Paul Beierle. She is joined by Meredith Munyon, a Tallahassee resident who attends the yoga studio, forensics expert Joseph Scott Morgan, Atlanta juvenile judge & lawyer Ashley Willcott, forensic psychiatrist Dr. Daniel Bober, and Crime Stories reporter Robyn Walensky.  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. Do you know another parent or expecting parent? Are you wondering what can I give them as a gift? Don't give them another onesie. Don't give them a plastic toy or God forbid a toy gun that's just gonna end up in the garage. Give them something that matters and what matters the most is protecting their child.

What do you love most in the world? Your children. What will you do to protect them? Anything. I sat down with the smartest people I know in the world on matters of child safety, finding missing children, fighting back against predators. And what I learned is so important, powerful, and information so critical. I want you to have it. I want them to have it. Go to crimestopshere.com for a five-part series

with action information that you can use to change your life and protect your child. Payment starting $6.99. Give that as a gift, not another onesie. Find out how to protect your child when you're out at the mall or the store or the grocery, in the parking lot, at home. Find out about protection regarding babysitters and daycare, even online. I'd rather have that any day of the week than a plastic toy or, God forbid, a toy gun. Join Justice Nation. Go to crimestopshere.com. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

I saw several police officers parking, then they got out and they started running and I first thought it was probably an accident and I saw more undercover cops coming so I probably guess it was probably a shooting and I went down here and saw more cops come and I kind of got scared so I came inside and told people what was happening and everybody came out here and and started seeing what happened. They found out the reaction that there was a shooter. So I ran down here and told all the next door shops to lock up and

there's an active shooter. I'm scared because so close to the businesses, but down in this section of the city, there's a couple robberies that happened before so i mean it's not nothing new but still i mean it's it's scary a 40 year old white gunman opens fire in an upscale tallahassee yoga class killing a 21 year old young lady and gunning down a female doctor, wounding many others. But it was no part of a robbery string, not at all. Why? I'm Nancy Grace.

This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. The scene was something I really can't describe when the women, mostly women inside that yoga studio, realized that they were being fired upon. It was a so-called hot yoga studio. When a guy comes in and totally mortifies everyone, claiming the life of this 21-year-old girl. Still now, we don't understand why. The investigation happening right now, straight out to Robin Walensky, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, author of Beautiful Life,

the CSI behind the Casey Anthony trial. Robin, start at the beginning. What happened? Well, for some reason that we still don't know what this man's connection was to the yoga facility, what's unusual to me is that he had to know it was there. It's on the second floor of a strip mall in an area right by the FSU, Florida State University campus. So if you're just, you know, willy-nilly walking by places to shoot up, you'd have to know, A, that it was there on the second floor. You know, you look up, you see those second floor strip malls.

A lot of those kind of places always complain that they don't get a lot of foot traffic. So he would have known that there would be people there at that time. And he goes in and he just opens fire, starts shooting at people, kills two, wounds five, Nancy. You know, I'm very familiar with what you're saying. I remember the children, my twins, would play at a jamboree and it was at the top of a strip center on the second floor. And you'd have to know to go up the stairs and down the corner and around the side to actually find it. So this guy had to know how to get there. Joining me right now is a very special guest out of Tallahassee who attends the yoga studio, Meredith Munyon. Meredith, you know, you and I have been friends a long time.

I had no idea that you went to this yoga studio, and I know that you are in complete shock. When you first heard about the shooting, did you realize it was your yoga studio? No. I drove home from work around 6 p.m. Friday night, and I drive right down the street from where I work. So I drive right past it, and the amount of police officers around the scene, I just knew something happened. And my heart sank, and I just felt like this really terrible feeling. And I didn't learn until I got home that it had happened at that yoga studio. Tell me about the layout.

With me right now, special guest Meredith Munyon, in addition to juvenile judge and lawyer, the founder of childcrimewatch.com, Ashley Wilcott, Joseph Scott Morgan, forensics expert, professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University, and author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, Robin Walensky, investigative reporter. Back to you, Meredith Munyon, your yoga studio that you've been to many, many times. I know that feeling when you start driving down your street or you approach your building where you live and you see a bunch of police cars. It's just a feeling. Is that my house? Is that my apartment? What has happened? Tell me about the layout, Meredith Munyon. I remember when I first started practicing law,

I would get out of court. What I thought at the beginning was too late to go running. I later reversed that decision and I started going to an aerobics class. And there would be, it had glass windows from like the waist up. And guys would walk by from bars and restaurants and just stand there while everyone was doing aerobics. And finally, the instructor would go, just let the blinds down, you know, in the middle of the class. So I'm wondering, could someone walk by and stare into the yoga studio? I mean, not really it's it's a very old building in Tallahassee it's been there forever a home of many local businesses that have been there forever and it's on the second floor on the side of the building so from the main road Thomas Road, you can't even see the studio.

You would have to pull in their parking lot, and then it's on the second level. So you might be able to see some from the parking lot, but you'd have to go up the stairs to the side to get up there. Well, if you walk up the stairs, Meredith, if you walk up the stairs and walk beside it, can you look in it? Yes, there are windows um there's three i think separate studios that are all next to each other um one of them the hot yoga studios actually you walk in there's a front desk and then you go into a room behind that so you actually can't see inside that particular studio the one a few doors the aerial yoga, which was not where it was, that one you can actually see from the balcony.

So no, he wouldn't have been able to. Yeah, he had to know it was there. I guarantee you he had been there many, many times staring in those windows as the women worked out at hot yoga. We are learning that he was quite the woman hater the misogynist take a listen to megan wilson who was eating just downstairs at a restaurant when the shooting went down so we were downstairs at ricardo's eating and all of a sudden we heard like a pop pop pop pop pop and it just kind of sounded like we didn't sound like gunshots but it sounded

like intense something was happening up there and then yelling. And then all of a sudden, probably within 30 seconds, we saw two girls bloody in their yoga outfits that ran by. And they actually ran into Bart Betten. And then a guy ran in there and he had blood all over the side of his head and a shirt. And then the owner of Bart Betten locked the door, told everybody to get down. We were at Ricardo's and everybody's, just not knowing what was going on.

But they said it's two fatalities. The gun, I mean, it was shot, like, six or seven times. And at least, I mean, there was probably eight or maybe, like, five different ambulances that are picking people up on stretchers. So it's just scary, like, having that close to home, you know, because that person could have come in any of any place you leave the door unlocked you know so it's terrible I don't know if it was like a domestic thing or what you know because why would he have skipped all of the other businesses that were down there with open doors with people and specifically go up to bar go up to the

yoga studio, you know? And the girl that ran in said that he was pacing in and out of the yoga studio. And then when it was time for them to all go in there and she's the one girl went to shut the door. That's when he busted in when he started shooting. I think people just try to get out as fast as they could. You know, it's terrible.

I'm sorry yeah it's hard when you have a two-year-old in your hands too just to try to keep calm and figure out what we need to do but they did lock the doors okay all the businesses down on the first floor locked their doors immediately um like it was weird the sound it didn't sound like a shooting i guess you just don't know what that sounds like right it definitely sounded like something happened about sound, it didn't sound like a shooting. I guess you just don't know what that sounds like. Right. It definitely sounded like something happened above us. We just didn't know what it was. So, terrible, terrible.

Hate it for those young girls. You're hearing Megan Wilson speaking to our friends at the Tallahassee Democrat describing what went down when a guy barges into a hot yoga studio in upscale Tallahassee, opening fire, wounding many, killing a 21-year-old woman, gunning down a female doctor, all in there in the middle of a hot yoga class. But why? So far, no domestic connection has been made that the witness was suggesting, such as, you know, a divorce and estranged boyfriend and girlfriend, nothing like that. But I got to tell you something. I think everybody's being way too PC, way too politically correct. Ashley Wilcott, I mean, you and I have to get

down and dirty in court dealing with crime all day long. And've told the twins and I preach it in in safety classes when you have a bad feeling get away if some freaky dude is walking in and out and pacing into in and out of a yoga studio full of women who are really not paying attention. They're doing their class. Why should they be? Call the police. And I am in no way blaming the victims. No way blaming the yoga studio. They may not have even noticed the guy.

But so often, Ashley, we're like, well, you know, let's not judge. Judge and live for Pete's sake, Ashley. Yeah, trust your gut. I tell everybody that. Trust your gut. If somebody feels creepy, it doesn't mean you're judging them as much as it means you're protecting yourself just in case they do something like he did in this case. The second thing I've got to say in this case, Nancy,

I don't think we're going to find out that he knew anybody in the studio, but I do think he specifically targeted it. Why? Because it was all women customers, presumably. There may have been one or two men, but probably primarily women customers doing hot yoga. And based on descriptions of this man, I think that was his target. We are learning a little bit about the shooter that he definitely hates women, is a misogynist. Listen to our friend at WSB-TV, Michael Seiden.

I can't process. It's just the worst. As investigators work to figure out what motivated a gunman to open fire at a yoga studio near Florida State University, this grieving father of 21-year-old Mara Binkley says he is trying to understand why his daughter's killer would carry out this violent attack in such a peaceful place. Mara truly lived a life of really devoted to peace, love, caring for others. On Saturday evening, we spoke by phone with Jeff Binkley. He told us that he

and his wife Margaret are now in Tallahassee, where they've been surrounded by family and friends who are remembering their daughter as a young woman who dedicated her life to peace, love, and happiness. You know, it's amazing to me, Dr. Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist, we hear these stories, we read about them, we try to protect ourselves as much as we can, but the ripple effects go on and on and on. I just learned yesterday morning that the victim's mom goes to our local church in Atlanta and is completely devastated. Of course she is, Dr. Bober.

Explain to me if there's no connection, like he wasn't dating any of these women. He certainly wasn't dating her or the people that he shot. He had never been to the yoga class, didn't have a grudge against the owner, nothing. What would motivate a known misogynist, a woman hater, to go in and open fire on unarmed women? Well, think about it, Nancy. When did you ever think you would hear the phrase yoga studio shooting, right? What is yoga? It's a place of peacefulness and mindfulness where you can let it all go and feel totally safe in some strange way it's almost an act of domestic terrorism just shows whether you're in a mall whether you're in a playground or whether you're even in a yoga studio that you cannot feel safe and so i think

that he targeted just like what ashley said i think he was going to go to the place where he could create the most chaos and create the most terror and get back at all the women that he's hated his whole life. Well, you know, he's had a long history. I don't know a lot about him yet. It's all unfolding right now. But we know in 2012, he was charged with misdemeanor battery for grabbing a woman, two women's rear end at FSU, Florida State University. Now that's according to Leon County court records we've managed to obtain. We also know that not too long ago, he was arrested again on a battery charge for slapping and grabbing another woman's rear end by a swimming pool at an apartment complex where he had just lived. To Robin Walensky, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. What more do we know about this guy?

Well, he was incredibly, in Volusia County, he was a substitute teacher, Nancy, working with students. And the kids, he was working in a middle school. Deltona Middle School was one of the places where they would call him to fill in. And the kids all say that he gave off like a psychopath vibe. He was aloof. He was blank. He was quiet. He was disengaged. He was empty. He was a real weirdo. That's what creepy. Some of the girls said that he was creepy. He seemed out of it. So this is someone, when you start to look at the whole landscape of this person, of this man. He was clearly frustrated that he couldn't get a date. He's grabbing women's butts. He's getting arrested for it.

And then he's teaching in a school. I mean, how is this happening? How is he allowed to teach your kids in their middle school when he's got all of this going on in the background? Plus, one last nugget. He apparently also was an amateur musician, and he was doing songs that he wrote and then attempting to sell them. And the titles of the songs, Nancy, Homicidal Impulse, American Horror, and American Massacre. And when you start to get into the lyrics of these songs, boy, did he hate women. I don't get it. Dr. Bober, I mean, I've always known just instinctively, and I've heard other people say it, that when you're interested in a guy, look at how he treats his mother or his sisters. How does he speak of them? And that's a real indicator whether you want to get tangled up with that particular guy. Now, that's just me as a layperson, as a JD. You're the MD, Dr. Bober. What is it?

Where does misogyny start? Is it when you're born and your mom is aloof or doesn't love you enough for your liking? I mean, how does it happen? Well, that is part of it, Nancy. You know, your relationship with your mother is the first template that when you come into the world, how you relate to women. So if that attachment or that bond is disturbed, it does affect your relationships with women. But this is clearly someone who is weak, who is ineffectual, who is impotent with women. And because of that, he resented them and hated them

to the point where it boiled over into violence. To you, Joseph Scott Morgan, joining me, professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University, death investigator and author of Blood Beneath My Feet. You can get that on Amazon. Joe Scott, explain to me what cops will be looking for back at his home. Yeah, they're going to look for, well, obviously, what kind of attachments he had with weapons. Did he have a cache of weapons there? The ammunition that was utilized at the yoga studio, would there be more of it at his home?

In addition to that, they're going to look for materials, such as reading materials, anything digitally that he has on computers there that's going to give you some kind of digital track leading you back to these points of interest along the way? You had mentioned, you know, the misogyny. These are these songs that he had written. Was he being influenced by anybody in particular that kind of was a trigger mechanism to set him off to just murder these people in this tight, enclosed area. I want you to take a listen to our friend, the Tallahassee Police Chief, Michael DeLeo. We have seven total victims related to this incident. Two have been admitted to the hospital. They are both in stable condition.

Three of the victims have been treated and released. Unfortunately, two victims have passed away from their injuries. Their names are Nancy Van Vessum and Mara Finkley. They've passed away. There are wounds that were inflicted upon them this evening. In addition, we have identified the perpetrator of this event. His name is Scott Paul Beerly from Deltona, Florida. Through the investigative work that's been done with a lot of partners at the state, local, and federal level, we've been able to identify Mr. Burley and are continuing to follow up the investigative leads for him and what made him come to our community

and commit this heinous act here. Do you know another parent or expecting parent? Are you wondering what can I give them as a gift? Don't give them another onesie. Don't give them a plastic toy or God forbid a toy gun that's just going to end up in the garage. Give them something that matters and what matters the most is protecting their child. What do you love most in the world? Your children. What will you do to protect them? Anything. I sat down with the smartest people I know in the world on matters of child safety, finding missing children, fighting back against predators. And what I learned is so important, powerful, and information so critical. I want you to have it. I want them to have it. Go to crimestopshere.com for a five

part series with action information that you can use to change your life and protect your child. Payment starting $6.99. Give that as a gift, not another onesie. Find out how to protect your child when you're out at the mall or the store, the grocery, in the parking lot, at home. Find out how to protect your child when you're out at the mall or the store or the grocery, in the parking lot, at home. Find out about protection regarding babysitters and daycare, even online. I'd rather have that any day of the week than a plastic toy or, God forbid, a toy gun. Join Justice Nation. Go to crimestopshere.com. of the Bart Benton Complex. There's about 30 to 40 police out here, and as you can see, this is a contained scene at this point, hearing that people have been taken away with injuries,

although the extent of those injuries are unknown. You are hearing at the time of the shooting when they didn't even realize people had died. That's Carl Edders with the Tallahassee Democrat speaking about the hot yoga studio shooting, claiming the lives of too many others wounded, but why? Joining me right now is Meredith Munyon, who attends the yoga studio. What's it like on the inside, Meredith? And again, thank you for being with us.

What's it like inside the studio? Inside the yoga studio, it's beautiful. It's peaceful. It's my favorite Miracle Studio in town. It's hardwood floors everywhere and very simply laid out and really good energy in the studio. Meredith Munyon, let me ask you this. You said it's beautiful. Tell me about the layout.

When you walk in the front door, what do you see and what were his options? Where could he go? Well, the first studio you can walk into is like a lobby type area. There's a front desk receptionist that you check in with. You sign up for classes on your phone on an app. And then you check in and they have some items there for sale. And then there's a side with some lockers to put your stuff in. And then there's a room back there where they heat it up and you can practice yoga. It's a pretty good size space. So it can hold quite a few students. So when he first went in, what could he see? Could he see an open area near the windows?

Were there doors he could go through to lead to other studios? What I'm getting at, were the women trapped in one room? Was there any way out for them? Oh, no. There's one door in. So even the studio right next to it that they hold classes in, you have the one door, you know, that goes into the studio area where they practice. And that can be seen right from the balcony and the window. I read that one of the, the only man that was taking the class actually got up and started hitting him. And some of the women were able to get around him and escape. But there's just that one door for them to get out of. Wow. I did not realize that there was an actual hero in there.

Yeah. So Meredith Munyon, tell me about the clientele. Are they all FSU students mostly or who goes there? It's such a variety of people. I mean, myself and a few of my friends, some other people I know that are, you know, young professionals, all the way up to senior citizens, and then all the way down to college students. I mean, there is no discrimination. There's all types of people that go there. Is it largely women? I assume it's largely women. It's largely women. Okay. Yes, it is largely women, but I guess that one man was in this one class.

Meredith Munyon, how close is it to the FSU campus? Not very. It's in the midtown area of Tallahassee. So I would say to get to campus, it would probably be 15, 20 minutes. Let me ask you this, Meredith. So it's in the Midtown area. Is that where your salon, where you work, is that the Midtown area you're talking about? Yes. Yes. Gotcha. You know, it's interesting the way he did this to Ashley Wilcott, judge,

lawyer, founder of childcrimewatch.com. He was darting in and out and pacing around at the front desk, apparently. I mean, right then, if they had a bad feeling about him, I think that police should have been called. What we're learning is he basically had them all herded into one studio where they couldn't get out. Catch this, Ashley. He had prior military service, we believe. He lived in Deltona, Florida, but he had been staying at a hotel in Tallahassee. Catch this. He graduated from

Florida State. He was arrested there twice, as we know, both for harassing women. And he had this history of misogynistic and racist abuse. There's a series of videos he posted. And he would rant against women and minorities. He hated police. He hated the army. All these people he believed had done him wrong. There's American Massacre is one of his lyrics. Another is My Fraulein, and he talks about a failed relationship. And in them, Beerly is sitting there going, droning on and on in a very dim bedroom, an unmade bed, a pile of cardboard boxes in the background, and he's whining that he can't connect with women. Okay, what does that tell you? Listen, Nancy, it tells me a couple of things. First of all, the guy's got issues. But second

of all, you know, as a juvenile court judge, I say this a lot. The delinquent kids that I see have had things happen to them as a younger child. So what happened to this guy? Somebody had to have recognized he had some idiosyncrasies that were not good and could have been dangerous. Why was he never, why was there no treatment? What happened to him? How did people treat him that he turned to violence? Listen to this. Dr. Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist, in some of his, I hate to even call them lyrics, but I guess I will, the videos he posted on YouTube, sitting there in his darkened bedroom on his unmade bed. I mean, you know what?

If you're going to date somebody, please find out if they've posted anything and see what it is. He calls women sluts, whores. He talks about ripping their heads off. I mean, Dr. Boberber and this guy's a substitute teacher didn't anybody ever go check him out online before they let him teach classes for pete's sake you would think they would have nancy but uh you know i'm also a child psychiatrist in addition to being a forensic psychiatrist and i can just tell you that this is someone who clearly

had as ashley said some sort of adverse childhood experiences whether it was bullying or a mother who abandoned him or an alcoholic father because because clearly when the tracks were laid down, they were laid down wrong. And he just had a lot of issues with the world and clearly was rejected by women and just was full of hate. Well, in his postings, he also states that he admired Elliot Roger. I don't know if you remember him, the so-called virgin killer, because he had been celibate his whole life. It would post all of these videos about why isn't she with me? I've got this BMW and I've got all this money.

Why won't she date me? Why is she with all these losers? He would post video after video after video about that and ended up gunning down people. This guy has exhibited admiration for the so-called virgin killer. Also for George Sedini, a gunman who murdered three women at a gym outside of Pittsburgh. Now, if those are the people he admires, what does that tell you, Dr. Bober? And how come where he was teaching didn't know he had been banned from the FSU campus? It's not unusual for mass shooters to worship people.

We've seen this in a lot of the school shooters more recently. They commiserate with them. They find them to be heroes, to be prophets of some sort. And they want to emulate them because those are the only people they feel close to and connected to because they can't connect with people who are pro-social because they don't feel like they understand them or get them. What does it mean to you, Joseph Scott Morgan? I know he's misogynist. That does not make him insane. He basically had the women herded into one room from which they could not escape. Yeah, when you think about a yoga studio, Nancy, this environment is wide open. Once you get, you got what's referred to as one point of egress, as your

friend had mentioned just a moment ago, one point, and this is the really scary thing and terrifying thing about this area. It's like a big fishbowl and there's no points of cover. That means there's no walls to get behind. There's no furniture to get behind. There is absolutely nothing. So it is like a big fishbowl where people, you know, where these terrified patrons are in there screaming. You can imagine there's smoke, there's loud bangs going on, and they don't know where to go. And there's people that are injured. So it's a terrifying, chaotic mess. Take a listen to Tallahassee Police Chief Michael DeLeo. Emergency responders were here within minutes, about three, three and a half minutes. The first officers arrived on scene. When they arrived, the gunman was deceased on scene.

And we, at that time, we had now identified six other victims that received gunshot wounds. And then we also have a victim who was actually pistol whipped. There are indications that several people inside fought back and tried to not only save themselves, but other people, which is a testament to their courage, the people who don't just turn and run, but the strength of our community and the spirit of those people trying to help and save and protect others. The 2015 Dunwoody High School graduate wasn't just a great friend. She was also a superstar in the classroom. Her father told us that she earned an academic scholarship to FSU and was in the running for a Fulbright scholarship. She planned to graduate in May with a double major

in journalism and German, but her real passion, her father told us, giving back to her community. Our last conversation, she was so excited about the Teach for America. Jeff says his daughter may be gone, but now he's hoping her tragedy will lead to change. Have that be a vehicle for change, to stem the tide of violence that threatens to literally overwhelm our society. You're hearing our friend at WSB-TV, Michael Seiden, speaking to Mara's dad, Jeff Binkley. Overwhelming mourning and really fear

now instilled in the Tallahassee community after this yoga studio was attacked by a lone gunman, Scott Paul Beerly. And what we're learning is he identified with, quote, involuntary celibates, involuntary celibates who want a sex relationship with women but can't have one. And he goes online and he tells personal stories of rejection. OK, that's a big no-no. You don't want a guy going online talking about everybody that's rejected him. He names multiple women by name and says how they had wronged him. Quote, made one date, didn't show up. Made another date, didn't show up. Kept making excuses. I could have ripped her head off. He writes, he expresses admiration and he identifies with and empathizes

with the so-called virgin shooter, Elliot Roger, spoiled rich brat who killed six people in Ila Vista, California. It was three months before barely this hot yoga studio shooter recorded his videos. And Roger, the virgin shooter, had said he was disgusted with women. And he urged incels, as he calls them, involuntary celibates to fight back against women that reject them. He goes on and barely whines and rants about interracial dating. He talks just horribly about African Americans as well as women. We know that he had trouble in the army after something went down in Amsterdam. And in Amsterdam, according to reports, four women complained about him. And his quote on his online was, quote, I got too rowdy for their sensibilities. I can only imagine.

He moved from New York to Tallahassee back in 2011. And we know he's had one problem after the next, attacking one woman, grabbing her from behind in the FSU dining hall. Oh, wow. The charges were dismissed. Imagine that. Isn't that the way, Ashley Wilcott? You look back and you see charge after charge after charge dismissed and nobody did anything about it. That's the worst part in this case. There were two separate incidents where there were charges dismissed. And you're right, Nancy, you know as well as I do, if a prosecutor dismisses charges and then there's another event, this person is likely to continue to commit crime. In this one, it became a horrific crime. Well, listen to this. From the timeline that I can

piece together, he moved from New York to Tallahassee in 2011. He didn't make it long. In 2012, he was charged with grabbing a lady from behind on a rear end at the FSU dining hall on campus. Charges dismissed. Okay, hold on. Those charges dismissed in 2013. In 2014, he's charged with trespassing in a dining hall. He was given PTI, pret-trial intervention. You know what happens at the end of that? Your case is dismissed. Okay. Then he was charged with battery in 2016. That was dismissed. In that case, he apparently had approached a woman laying out, getting a tan

at a pool, complimented her figure, and offered to put sunscreen on her rear end okay of course she said no who wouldn't and he grabbed her anyway even though she said no now this is all in the police report so all the warning signs were there he was banned from fsu campus he had one charge after the next after the next next, dismissed. I don't know what yet. I don't know yet, but I'm going to find out what happened in New York, why he fled New York. But still, nothing was done. And he meets this gorgeous young girl, Miss Binkley, who's a senior at FSU, set to graduate, studying journalism in German. And she's dead. You know, all the warning signs were there.

Dr. Daniel Bober, but nothing was done. Yes, Nancy, you're right. I mean, this is like what we talk about when we say connecting the dots. I mean, there was like a whole trail of breadcrumbs leading up to this incident. And had someone intervened and done something about it and actually prosecuted this guy, I think the outcome would have been different. And another woman dead as well, a lady doctor, Dr. Van Vessem. She's dead as well. I mean, I don't know how that gaping hole can be filled in her family's life and in the community. Joe Scott Morgan, could you explain to me the nature of the scene and why you would pick that location? You know, I'm fascinated by this, Nancy, because it is in the sequestered area where it's not on the bottom floor.

It's up on a top level and back some. You know, not a lot of folks are going to be aware. And this is not near campus. This is well off campus. You mentioned, someone mentioned earlier about high traffic areas. You would have to specifically go there. So in my estimation, he would have, in this context, been very well aware of this, been watching this area. for all intents and purposes, is total chaos. What the police will be faced with and have been faced with in this particular case are copious amounts of blood everywhere. There will be spent shell casings because my assumption is, from the way it sounds, because they said that the weapon had jammed at one point in time, he's using semi-automatic handgun. So as he's firing this

weapon, you'll be expending brass out of one side. So these will be demonstrated all over the floor and it'll be total chaos, not to mention the fact that the EMTs have come in afterwards to try to treat people. So it creates a huge mess for the police to work backwards from. Listen to Tallahassee Police Chief Michael DeLeon. About 5.37 this evening, Tallahassee Police Department responded to 1900 block of Thomasville Road in reference to a shooting. Upon arriving on scene, officers found multiple victims suffering from gunshot wounds. Emergency responders immediately provided aid and transported five victims to

local hospitals to receive medical attention. The gunman is deceased with a possible self-inflicted gunshot wound. One victim has passed away at the hospital. The other four victims at this time are in critical condition, and we're working closely to identify them, work with them, and notify their families. At this time, all indications are this is the act of a single person. There is no immediate to our community. Obviously, we're all very saddened

and shocked by the events that occurred, but it's important that people understand that there is no immediate threat outside of what has already occurred here this evening. All the evidence points to a single actor who has remained on scene and is deceased at this time, so there is no additional threat to the public. Today, our prayers to the victims' families and all of their loved ones. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. You're listening to an iHeart Podcast.