Crime Weekly - S3 Ep267: Jason Burgeson & Amy Shute: Golf Course Double Homicide (Part 2)

Episode Date: January 17, 2025

Providence, Rhode Island, is the capital and the largest city in the state, known for its rich history, vibrant arts scene, and unique mix of old-world charm and modern urban development. As one of the oldest cities in the United States, founded in 1636, Providence was a refuge for those seeking religious freedom, which has laid the foundation for the city’s commitment to diversity and tolerance. The city is also home to some of the most prestigious universities in the United States, including Brown University, an Ivy League school, and the Rhode Island School of Design. With so many college students, you would expect Providence to also have a thriving nightlife, which can be found downtown where a variety of bars, clubs, and live music venues wait to welcome students who want to socialize and let loose in the evenings and on weekends. For such a large and busy city, you would also expect that Providence has its share of crime, and while the city does have some issues with violent crime, property crimes such as burglary and motor vehicle theft are far more common. But what happens when a basic carjacking turns violent for seemingly no reason whatsoever? In June of 2000, 20-year-old Jason Burgeson and 21-year-old Amy Shute found themselves in the crosshairs of five nefarious men who were prowling the streets of Providence, looking to get into trouble. Jason and Amy were spotted by a Providence police officer around 2:15 AM on June 9th; the couple was chatting in the parking lot of Tommy’s Bar and Grille in downtown Providence. Less than 12 hours later, their bodies were found slumped against hay bales at the Button Hole Golf course, located on the border of Providence and Johnstown, Rhode Island. They had been murdered in cold blood, and it was up to the investigators to figure out what had happened to them and why. Try our coffee!! - www.CriminalCoffeeCo.com Become a Patreon member -- > https://www.patreon.com/CrimeWeekly Shop for your Crime Weekly gear here --> https://crimeweeklypodcast.com/shop Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/c/CrimeWeeklyPodcast Website: CrimeWeeklyPodcast.com Instagram: @CrimeWeeklyPod Twitter: @CrimeWeeklyPod Facebook: @CrimeWeeklyPod ADS: 1. RocketMoney.com/CrimeWeekly - Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and more today! 2. OneSkin.co - Use code CRIMEWEEKLY for 15% off your purchase! 3. HelixSleep.com/CrimeWeekly - Get 25% off sitewide and more! 4. Skims.com/CrimeWeekly - Shop SKIMS best intimates! Select our podcast after you order to let them know we sent you! #skimspartner 5. SimpliSafe.com/CrimeWeekly - Get 50% off a new system with a Professional Monitoring Plan!

Hello, everybody. Welcome back to Crime Weekly. I'm Stephanie Harlow. And I'm Derek Levasseur. So today we are diving into part two of the Jason Bergeson and Amy shoot case, and we're going to be wrapping this case up tonight. So we will be starting wrapping this case up tonight. So, uh, we will be starting a new case next week, but where, where do you feel we're at with this case so far? I mean, we covered that the night of, well, we didn't get into the, you know, the, the nitty gritty of what happened to Jason and Amy yet. No, we were going to get into the worst of, there was a couple of things. So after we, uh, after we covered the episode and you were down in Providence last week and got to meet some of my cop buddies, I don't know how many of them you met, but one of them actually came up to me and I'm surprised I remembered this because I had a couple of celebratory drinks. But one of them said Lau is actually, it's pronounced Luff. So that's one thing.

L-O-U-G-H. Yeah, I guess he pronounces it Luff. And without getting into too many specifics, there wasn't, he didn't have too much on it. He said he's no longer a police officer. He said he didn't finish out his career. He didn't, he said that from what he had heard because this was a Providence cop that came up to me. He was a go-getter. He used to do his thing,

but there were some complications. There were some things that he did not finish his career. Do you think because of what happened to Jason and Amy? No? No, no, it wasn't that. It wasn't that. I did ask him. I said, was it that? And he said, no, it was something that happened maybe a year or two later. And it wasn't even one specific thing. He just said a couple of things went wrong. But I, but I, I remember asking him, uh, you know, is this, uh, is this something that could have been kind of tied back to that where maybe he was affected by he goes? Absolutely, you know, there's no doubt it could have it's something where that could have shoulda woulda right and if he had just

Pulled up to them, you know nose to nose which i've done before you have someone going down the wrong way You light them up and you go nose to nose with them that in and of itself might have might have scared The the drivers and they might have said oh shit They might have abandoned the car ran they could have got out and ran or or got into a shootout or whatever but it would have they might have thought oh we're caught when in reality it was just for the going the wrong way but you never never gonna know now so we're gonna talk about that also as i had mentioned on last episode we were right where it happened and and you're gonna see some photos tonight i'll try to refer back to it where it was late shout out to to Shannon. She was in the truck with me. And I was like, oh, we were going to a pizza spot. And I'm like, I have to go by now. And the ironic thing about it is photos are probably going to go up right now if I know Shannon. But the arcade is still there. And then Tommy's place, which is closed down, is still there. It's still there as well. The sign's there. And then the wall that we were trying to describe, it's right there for you.

Can't miss it. I took pictures of the wall, pictures of Arcade, picture of Tommy's Place. I sent them to you at like 2.30 in the morning. And so we'll have those for you tonight. But now you have a better idea of the area. I think it's a beautiful area. But unfortunately, some bad things can happen. I very much enjoyed, and obviously I did it not alone, but I very much enjoyed walking around Providence, even though it was bitterly cold.

Really cold. Oh my gosh. And you're in upstate New York, so for you to say that, it's cold. I mean, it was warmer in Providence. It was five degrees warmer, but it was still, especially that Thursday when I got in, probably the coldest day I've experienced in a very long time. It was chilly. It was chilly that night. And yeah, it's a great place.

It's a little different than it was back then when this happened. Of course. It's heavily patrolled. I don't know how many police officers you saw driving around there on every corner, it seems like. I mean, I went all over the place. I saw streets that we had talked about. I went by the water so I could kind of get an idea of where the bridge bridge was just, you know. So me and Shannon, shout out Sam as well.

We went over the bridge as we were driving. We went and took photos and then we actually drove the route that the five would have driven or walked. And then we went over the point street bridge to my favorite pizza restaurant. Shout out Fellini's best pizza in Rhode Island. In my opinion, India point was right over there. You can see it also. Yeah. Shannon was like, wow, like I can see it now. And it was interesting. I stayed at a hotel in Westminster. Yeah. You were right there. Right by Waybosset. Yeah. It was crazy. Yeah. So beautiful place, tragic story. We're going to get into it. The response was great on it. Thank you, everyone. I felt like it was kind of an old school Crime Weekly episode where it's an important case. Some people had said, you know, you know,

this one's already solved, but there's, there's still a purpose to it because this could happen to anyone. Amy and Jason did nothing wrong. So the purpose of covering a case like this is to educate, right? It's for us all to look at the factors of the case, dissect it and figure out what we could have done differently if we were there. It's not the victim blame or anything like that. It's taking this tragedy and using it in a positive way so that we can learn from it, just like the history books.

We didn't do everything right, as we all know. This is how you don't repeat history. Now that you know Amy and Jason's story, maybe you'll think about, hey, what would I have done if I was in that situation? So God forbid it ever happens to you you are now better prepared that's the point i mean i know after i covered this case and researched it when i was in providence even though i wasn't alone i was still on my guard i still you know made sure to keep an eye on my surroundings i still made sure to avoid certain areas you know like obviously sure to keep an eye on my surroundings. I still made sure to avoid certain areas, you know, like obviously it doesn't matter. Yeah. It's everywhere,

not just Providence everywhere. So there is a purpose to it. Yeah. We're going to cover the big Karen reads and the, the Lacey Peterson's, but I would argue those cases are, are, are as, as solved, as solved as I was trying to be, you know, I mean, unless you're Scott Peterson and then it just not solved. Right. And even Karen Reid, solved or not solved, we're never going to know for certain. It's one of those things where people are kind of buried into what they believe. So I feel like this case deserves just as much attention. And in fact, and we'll get into it more.

But there was not a lot of attention on this case, by the way. There has been. I mean, you got a book on it. And yeah, there's a book. But as far as like, you know, I went newspapers.com. Obviously, I look for media coverage and things. Even in the local papers, there just wasn't a ton of coverage,

not the detail I usually like to get into. No, the most recent thing, and I don't know which one it was, but one of the guys involved in this, he tried to get out. Raymond Anderson. He was trying to get out. He said he served enough

time, but we'll get into the story. You can hear what happened and then you can decide if any of them should get out. I'm actually interested to hear what you have to say on this one, but I have a feeling you're probably going to agree with us, but we'll see. We'll see. Well, let's get, let's get into it then. Let's do it. That's a nice little segue there. Let's do it. All right. So the Buttonhole Golf Course. Have you been there, by the way? I have not.

I don't even know if that's still there. They might have changed it. It is. Is it? Yeah. Where is it? In Cranston? Oh, no, Johnston.

Johnston. Yeah, it's right on the border. Nope, haven't been there. So part of the golf course is in Providence and part of it is in Johnston. Is it still called Buttonhole or is it called Triggs? I think it's still called Buttonhole because I went on their website. Anyway, it seems like the Buttonhole golf course, it's sort of inception. It's very cool. It seems like they focus a lot on the local youth, kind of like teaching them golf as a healthy outlet so they don't turn to

drugs or a life of crime, which is ironic because the five young men involved in this case probably could have used a healthy outlet. We understand that every single perpetrator in this case was very young. I think 18, 19, 20, 21 at the oldest. Young, young. Old enough to know right from wrong. But, you know, old enough to know right from wrong, that's for sure. But, you know, old enough to know right from wrong, exactly. So the Buttonhole Golf Course has a very interesting backstory, just like the state it's located in. From its earliest days as the site of the Industrial Revolution, Rhode Island has a long and storied history of the growth of many manufacturing industries that developed in populated areas around the many sources of

water in the state. Now, one of these sources of water is a river. I'm not even going to try to pronounce, Derek, please say it for me. Woon-sa-quah-tuck-it? Woon-sa-quah-tuck-it? Woon-sa-quah-tuck-it? Yeah, we'll go with that because I've honestly never pronounced it. I've seen it on a map before as I'm driving over in that area, but Woonisquatucket. Woonisquatucket. Woonisquatucket. Sounds good to me. Woonisquatucket, yeah.

Let's go with that. So one of the sources of this water in the Rhode Island area is the Woonisquatucket River that flows through Providence and Johnston. Did I say Johnston right this time? Johnston's right, yeah. Yeah. Johnston, Rhode Island area is the Woonisquatucket River that flows through Providence and Johnston. Did I say Johnston right this time? Yeah, Johnston's right, yeah. Yeah. Johnston, Rhode Island. Among the businesses and factories that thrived along this urban corridor was a shoe factory

where buttons were used as shoe fasteners. Now, back in those days, no one knew that they should be concerned about the environment. And so they just dumped everything in the river. And the river and the buttons from the shoe factory were no exception and they would be swept down the river until they were caught along the bank in a natural swimming hole. And local children who would often swim in this river before it was probably incredibly polluted named this magical place Buttonhole. Now over 100 years later, that nickname stuck and many who grew up in the city remember swimming

and playing at Buttonhole long before it became a blighted area that was rescued by a small group of visionaries and turned into an urban green space home to the Buttonhole Golf Course today, a public golf enthusiast Ed Morrow began transforming 26 acres in Providence and Johnston into a golfer's dream, creating a nine-hole par-three course, a 25-bay lighted driving range, two practice putting greens, wetlands along the river to serve as an educational classroom, and a clubhouse with a pro shop and indoor instruction area. The grand opening was slated to happen in the summer of 2000. So when our case took place, a lot of the golf course was done, but there was a portion of the golf course in Johnston that was still under construction and in its final phases, which is why William Coburn was there early on the morning of Friday, June 9th, 2000. Coburn was operating a bulldozer

at around 645 that Friday morning when he spotted what he described as a pile next to a stretch of fencing and hay bales that had been set up next to the river to prevent construction debris from getting into the river. He made a mental note of it, but really didn't think too much of it, and he went about his work. But several hours later, around 1230 p.m., two other men working at the golf course also spotted the pile that William Coburn had seen earlier that morning. Andrew McLaughlin, the green superintendent, and Michael Almond, the assistant groundskeeper, they were out on an electric golf cart, they were checking out the progress of the construction, and they stopped

near the fence and the hay bales to clear away what they thought was a pile of garbage. Even as they got closer and the pile began to take on a more human form, the men didn't immediately think they were about to encounter two dead bodies. And we always see this, right? People see dead bodies and they immediately think mannequin. This happened here too. They thought mannequin. And then they thought, oh, maybe it's an unhomed person who drank too much and fell asleep over here. Their brains could not process what they were actually looking at until they saw the blood. A 911 call was placed from the Buttonhole Golf Course at 12.45 p.m. and law enforcement were on the scene by 1.15 p.m., including Johnston Police Detective Raymond Pingatori, who would later say, quote, I got my first look at the victims then, and it was a sight I'll never forget. It was revolting on every level, but what was

particularly repelling to me were their ages. These were just kids. They were both in a semi-sitting position, slumped on their left sides against a tract of hay bales. In this section of the golf course, construction was just getting underway, and there was nothing but ash and brown dirt, almost as far as the eye could see. The bodies, however, were resting on a narrow swatch of green grass that bordered a forested plot of trees and shrubs with the Woonsetucket River just beyond that. The male victim, his legs folded in front of him, was practically on top of the second victim, which appeared to be female. His dark blue jacket was prominent, the left side saturated with blood, the staining more apparent on the upper part of his left pant leg, the slacks a lighter gray color. A pool of blood had collected near the bodies, running a short distance through the grass down the slight incline in which they were reposed. His head was resting on top of hers,

and he appeared to be blindfolded, indicative of an execution-style murder. However, it was clear to me that this was a simple black headband that had dropped down below his forehead following the impact of the gun blast. Resting on top of the male's left sneaker, in a tangle of shoelaces, just below the cuff of his pant leg, was a live round of ammunition. It almost seemed as if it had been placed there intentionally, perhaps a calling card left by the killer. The second victim was pinned beneath him, her back pressed against the hay, her yellow sweater contrasting sharply with his dark blue jacket. Her right hand was resting on his right knee, his right arm draped across her bent right knee, which was nestled between his right hip and arm, as if they were hugging in a final embrace. She was wearing a white headband, though her face and much of her petite frame was obscured by his

bulk, end quote. Pingatori said that within a short time of processing the scene, the theory that this could have been a murder-suicide was eliminated because there was no vehicle left behind and no weapon found in the vicinity. There was also no sign of sexual assault or a struggle of any kind, although a ripped and empty condom wrapper was found about 30 feet away from Jason and Amy. Pingatori went on to say, quote, in fact, it appeared to me that they were very scared at the time they were killed, huddled close together, and did not put up a fight, probably trying to convince the murderers

to let them live, end quote. A latex glove was also found about 60 feet from their bodies, and Amy's wallet, along with Jason's Sony Discman, were also located at the scene. The wallet was found when police followed fresh tire tracks leading away from the scene of the crime. The tracks went up a slope. The slope led out of the golf course, and near those tire tracks, about 90 feet west of where Jason and Amy's bodies were located, the wallet was located. Now, both Jason and Amy had been killed by gunshots to the top of their heads. Jason had been shot twice and Amy once. In Jason's pocket, detectives found a Massachusetts driver's license that identified him. They also found a gold-colored money clip holding $78 as well as a check for $65 made out to Jason Bergeson and signed by Amy Shute. Now the money clip with the money in it

and the check from Amy to Jason, those were actually located in Jason's shoe, which I wonder like on the drive, did he remove them from his pocket and put them in his shoe so they wouldn't be taken? Might've thought the worst outcome here was they're gonna get robbed. Maybe that's why they agreed to go.

Maybe an indication of why they even agreed in the first place. Now, listen, I mean, these types of crime scenes, I didn't have a ton of them. But it's a feeling that I, you really can't describe. It's like this, you go through these different stages in a matter of seconds where initially you're like, oh, that's nothing. Huh, that looks like something. Is that what I think it is? Oh my God. It is. Wow. I can't believe I'm standing right next to this. That can't be real. And then I know for me, I remember the first dead body I ever saw, which was, it wasn't like a murder, but it was just someone who died of old age and you have to stand

by until the medical examiners arrive. And the rookie is always the person who has to stay with the dead body. And you're there for sometimes hours. And I was in this small room. I was 20 years old and it's literally just like a bedroom. And I'm sitting there in the dark with just like one little bed light on and this body just staring at me. You couldn't sit outside the door? So this was a halfway house. So I was in the room controlling the scene. And so I was sitting in the room with this person for hours. It felt like hours. And they were just looking at me.

And I remember thinking like, this is the first time I've ever seen a dead body in real life outside of a casket, right? Like in its like natural state and being it sounds so childish but i was like wow it looks just like the movies that's all i could think of and and you would think as you see them yeah you do become a little bit more desensitized to it but you never i can tell you right now you never get used to it because every one is different and uh especially when it's someone younger and and it is a homicide, you can almost

see like what they were experiencing in those last moments. And it's stuck on their face. And it's something that sticks with you forever. I have never walked up on an execution style death like this and with two younger adults. We've had infant deaths, but nothing like this. And definitely seen a lot of photos, seen a lot of videos covering other cases, but I'm fortunate enough to never experience this in person. And it's gotta be tough, man. It's gotta be tough because you still have a job to do. And so you're feeling for them. I don't know if Ray had kids or not, but- He did, yes. Yeah. So he had kids and he's looking at them. I don't know how old they were, but he's looking at this. He's seeing it for what it is, but he

also has to keep his, his head in the right mind because he's got to, he's got to document everything, not only with his paper and pen, but also with his eyes and ears, because something he picks up in that moment could be the difference between solving this case and not. And I want to, you know, we've kind of foreshadowed a little bit, but this is not an automatic solve. This is a case that takes some work. The answer to the problem, the answer to the question as far as who did this, it's not right there for him. He's got to play detective. He's got to do his job. So this is a very critical part of this case. Oh, huge. And I mean, what he's seeing is, and you can kind of see the process that he's going through where he's walking up to it. And obviously there's that initial shock, but now he's got to figure out what does this look

like? Could be a murder suicide. No, it's not because he's got to process that first. Right. Yeah. And then you have to start processing the actual evidence once you have a better grasp of your surroundings and what's happening. And obviously, that's what he was doing. That's what the CSI team is going to do. And then the medical examiner's office is going to come, right? Once they've taken pictures and picked up whatever evidence and bagged it and done the appropriate things, the medical examiner's office is going to come to remove the bodies. And at that point, Jason and Amy, who were locked in some sort of embrace, they were separated and Amy's full body could finally be seen.

According to Detective Pingatori, Amy was partially in a fetal position with her right leg extended back and away from the rest of her body and her nose almost touching her right knee. On the ground very close to the tip of Amy's fingers, crime scene techs saw what looked like a diamond engagement ring, which they believed she'd been clutching in her fist in an attempt to hide it from her attackers. Now, where is this engagement ring from? We don't know. Was it something that maybe her ex, Jeff, had given her at one point and it was very

important to her so she wanted to keep it away from these people who she knew wanted her money and her personal belongings? We're not sure. No, I mean, maybe it was something. I think we would know about it, but maybe it was something Jason gave her. I doubt it. It was kind of their relationship was super fresh. Super fresh, yeah. It could have been a family heirloom.

It could have been a lot of things. So, yeah, you're seeing those moments. You're seeing how it was for them before their life was taken from them. And it's tough because their bodies do tell a story. It really does. It also can tell you maybe what they believe the motive was. And you talked about the checks. Now you've talked about the ring.

It appears that they were trying to hide those items. So there's probably, maybe there was even conversation. We'll never know this by the way. There could have been conversations in the car to keep them calm where it was said, Hey, listen, we just want your stuff. We just want the truck. We're going to drop you off. Don't do anything stupid and you'll be on your way. So they're probably thinking, okay, they're going to let us out somewhere in the middle of nowhere. So let's just hide these things. So they just take the truck and they go. At least that's what they thought was going to happen. I also feel like it's very easy for bad people to convince good people that they're not going to do bad things to them because we operate, we operate also, we operate from a place,

especially these, these two, they were young, naive, you know, they hadn't really seen what the world held at that point. And good people, they operate from a place of like, well, I wouldn't do this. I don't understand how somebody could just commit an act of senseless violence. So I understand that they want to rob me, but I can't imagine that they would hurt me because I wouldn't do that to somebody. And so that's the way they kind of operate. That's how their brain works, especially until they get out in the world and get hurt a few times and kind of see that there's some people that are just bad and there's no good inside of them. They're just bad. Yeah. And you have to wonder, did the offenders know that this was what they were going to do all along? Was it an evolution where they had gone back and forth? We're going to get into it because there are some theories out there

and some comments that were made that may give us some insight, but who knows? Well, let's take our first break. We'll be right back. All right, so when Amy's body was removed, police found a spent.40 caliber shell casing between the fencing and the hay bales that had been behind Jason and Amy. And Detective Pingatori said that based on how horrific the scene was, he figured that whoever was responsible for it was long gone by then, hundreds of miles away. But he was wrong about that. So Harry Burdick's girlfriend, Christina Hartley, had been looking for him all morning since he hadn't returned home the night before.

She finally found him a bit after noon outside a convenience store on Broadway in Pawtucket. Christina laid into her boyfriend when she found him, and he then spilled the entire story to her. Well, not the whole story. He told her a version of the story, which included Gregory Floyd killing two people the night before. And Harry claimed he just heard this from Floyd. He didn't tell Christina that he'd been present when it all went down. He didn't tell her that he was responsible for basically choosing the targets because he wanted their vehicle. Now, later that day, Harry also called his father, who lived in Warwick, and asked him if he'd seen any coverage about the two murders on the news, but he had not. When law enforcement began investigating the murders, they contacted the family members of Jason and Amy,

and they were given information that the previous night the couple had been driving around in Jason's 1991 white Ford Explorer. So that night at around 7 p.m., a bolo was issued for Jason's vehicle. Now, at that time, the Ford Explorer was still being driven around Providence by Gregory Floyd. And he had been seen by several people around Waybosset Street that day. One witness had seen Floyd dancing next to the Explorer as he blasted loud hip-hop music out of the Explorer. And this happened outside of Mama Metro's cafe on Waybosset. Now, at 8.43 p.m. that night, Providence patrolman Stephen Gencarla was driving through the area between Classical and Central High Schools along Cranston Street when he spotted the white Ford Explorer driving in the opposite direction. Acting quickly, he pulled his cruiser in front of the Explorer, blocking it. He then got out of his car with his weapon

drawn and ran in a low crouch to the driver's side of the vehicle before standing up and pointing his weapon at a very surprised Gregory Floyd, who was in the driver's seat. Now, I'm actually going to read a passage directly from the book, Murder Without Motive, because the way Steve and Giancarlo handled this very stressful and scary situation is kind of badass. And he was young. He'd only been on the force a few years. He was like maybe I think 27 or 28. And he very much thought on his feet and he moved as if he had backup who would help him. And he didn't at that moment. That's what I'm going to say. I mean, he, he acted and you never know how you're going to react until you're put in a situation like that. And I can tell you that's not always the case. There have been officers I've worked with where

they see a dangerous situation unfolding in front of them and they're getting on that microphone and they're going to stay at a distance until the cavalry arrives. Yeah. Yeah. Not this guy. And it could have been his life. You got it wrong. Exactly. I don't even blame them for that. I don't know. No, because that's why I'm not a police officer. I'm not brave. Now I'm staying at a distance. Yeah, I'm not brave. No, I mean, listen, sometimes in a situation like that, seconds can be the difference between getting your guy and not.

So he did what he had to do, and it worked out. So good for him. But he could have died from it. I mean, he could have went a completely different way. So the passenger in the book says, quote, Jen Carella saw a second passenger, Elaine Jennings. And then he let out a war cry that further froze both occupants of the vehicle as he pulled the door open, reached inside, and turned off the ignition.

In the same motion, he grabbed the black male driver by his shirt collar and pulled him out of the Explorer. End quote. I just think that's so badass. He lets out a battle cry, wrenches the door open, pulls the keys out of the ignition, grabs Gregory Floyd's ass out. And it's like this happened lickety, right? And the way the book describes it is like Gregory Floyd and his passenger, who is his, we're going to talk about her, but he has got a woman in the passenger seat. And they're just shocked.

They're stunned because they're just driving along. And all of a sudden, they're like being bombarded. And it kind of feels good because it's like, that's what you do to people. But you actually hurt them. You actually take their vehicles. You actually scare them. They're actually innocent. Karma.

And now you're the one being like bum rushed and run up on. All right. So Gregory Floyd was placed in the back of Jen Corrales' police cruiser and other officers who had responded to the situation placed Floyd's passenger, Elaine Jennings, in a separate vehicle to keep them, you know, separated so they couldn't get their story straight. What you're supposed to do. I guess the people in Karen Reed's case forgot to do that. The police officers there, they don't separate people. But here, they do. So Elaine Jennings was actually one of Gregory Floyd's many situationships.

And he had called her earlier that night to ask her for money, which is how they ended up in that area of Waybosset Street again that evening because Elaine didn't have any money, but she knew someone in Providence who she could get some money from. Elaine was only 14 years old at the time, okay? 14 years old. And she'd been in an on-again, off-again relationship with 19-year-old Gregory Floyd for a year. So already electric chair, honestly.

I don't care what else you did. Electric chair. And at that time they'd met, they were both scared shitless of Stephen Giancarella. And also when they had met previously the year before, both Elaine and Gregory were homeless, but then Gregory ended up getting close with his friend, Kenneth Day. And although I don't think he lived there full time, he'd kind of disappear for days, he and Kenneth Day had an apartment in Providence that they lived in together, and they were considered roommates at that time. Detective Ray Picatori arrived to the scene shortly before 9 p.m.,

and by that time, it had been confirmed that the white Ford Explorer Gregory Floyd had been driving around in all day did in fact belong to murder victim Jason Bergeson. The SUV was towed to the Johnston Police Department where it would be processed while Floyd and his young girlfriend Elaine Jennings were placed in holding cells at the Johnston Police Station. When Pingatori had Floyd in an interview room, he said the thing that surprised him the most was how polite and respectful Floyd was. Quote, he was the perfect gentleman. Everything was yes, sir, no, sir. He spoke very softly as well. And many times we had to ask him to speak louder

so we could hear him, end quote. Pingatori also noted that Floyd didn't seem stressed. He wasn't worried. He was at ease. And he had pretty solid poker face. He claimed he had no idea why he was there or what he did wrong. Can you think about the audacity of this whole situation where you talk about what happened? We just broke down the crime scene. These guys are responsible for it. And one, they're driving around in the victim's vehicle, dancing outside of it. Well, just him, just Gregory Floyd.

Just Gregory Floyd. And nobody thought it would be a good idea to dump this vehicle. Just Gregory Floyd fired those shots, too. I'm going to give that away now because this dude pisses me off, all right? So he's outside dancing around the truck, and then he's coming in here cool, calm, collected. The audacity, it's just the balls on these guys. Do you really think you're that smart?

I mean, at minimum, you would think you would dump the car. I know. But no. I know. Here no. I know. Here's what I think. And I think that Detective Pignatore and other people who met Gregory Floyd sort of share this opinion. Dude's a psychopath.

Yeah, he's got something wrong with him for sure. Something's wrong with him. There's a screw loose up there for sure. Yeah, he's not right in the head. He has no empathy. He doesn't think things out. Like he's not thinking about, oh, what if I keep this car? They're going to find me, right? It's not a thought in his head. There is a mentality, especially in the inner city sometimes where, and I grew up in the inner

city, so I'm allowed to say it, where it's like, hey, if you can't afford it, then you take what you can't get on your own. And once you take it, it's yours. Hey, if you can't afford it, then you take what you can't get on your own. And once you take it, it's yours. And there, there is that mentality around. I remember as a kid, not when you left two dead bodies behind, not to make it about me, I've lost a couple teeth because someone, and I think I've told you the story before, but I lost a couple of teeth because someone said, Hey, I want what this, this ring I had. And I said no. And they decided to kick me in the face after pushing me on the ground. So it didn't work out Now, Derek's going to give you the advice that if somebody wants a ring you have on, give them the ring. Yeah, it was expensive. And I'm still having to keep going back and fix it.

I don't care, Derek. Just give them the ring. Guess what, though? They didn't get the ring. They got my tooth, though. They could have gotten your life as well. They got my tooth, but them the ring. Guess what though? They didn't get the ring. They got my tooth though. They could have gotten your life as well. They got my tooth, but not the ring. But yeah, I mean, it's like a culture thing. Take my eyes, not the shirt. It's like, you know, listen, if I can't, if I can't, if you have what I want, I'm just going to take it, period.

And I, obviously that's exactly how these guys were, right? That's how they operate. We don't have money for gas. Let's go rob somebody. We don't have a car to get home. Let's go take someone's car. Yeah, that's how they operate. We don't have money for gas. Let's go rob somebody. We don't have a car to get home. Let's go take someone's car. Yeah, let's go catch a lick. That's what he called it.

Let's go catch a lick. That's bad enough. The entitlement of that is bad enough. But to think you're entitled to now take these people's lives and drive around in their vehicle as if there are no consequences waiting to bite you. That's another thing entirely. That shows, what is it called when they say psychopaths kind of don't understand like the implications of their actions? They think that they're sort of like untouchable from it,

that nothing bad's gonna happen. They act without thinking. They're not thinking things through. They're impulsive. And that's really what we're gonna find that Gregory Floyd, he encompasses all of this. Now, initially, he told the police that he had bought the Explorer for $300

from a Hispanic girl named Teresa Gomez in downtown Providence. Obviously, no one believed the story because, dude, where'd you get $300 from? She doesn't even exist, more than likely. She doesn't even exist. Floyd was unable to give any details about Teresa Gomez, including her phone number, her address, nothing. That's how dumb these guys are. What did I always say to you? Criminals were smart. We wouldn't catch

them. Well, I mean, at that point he's like, I'm caught. I'm just going to deny, deny, deny. That's the thing they do. He's like, I'm going to deny this. I'm not going to admit to it. So I'll just make stuff up. So not long after Gregory Floyd is first sitting in an interrogation room, Harry Burdick and his girlfriend, Christina Hartley, were avidly watching the 10 o'clock news when the story about what had happened to Jason and Amy broke.

Now back at the police station, Pingatori was starting to lose patience with Gregory Floyd, who was sticking to his story and sticking to his, I am a calm, cool guy sort of demeanor. Pingatori said, quote, Floyd's respectful demeanor was what finally set me off, aggravating me to the point where I got out of my chair and I yelled, knock the fucking shit off, or I'm going to drill you through the fucking wall, end quote. I thought he was playing me. I wanted him to drop the act, but it was not an act. I didn't know anything about Floyd at this time.

In some respects, he was a walking contradiction. Floyd displayed no discernible reaction to my outburst. He remained passive and just stared blankly at me. End quote. Psychopath. He's a psychopath. Yeah, well, it's a chess match at this point. And I have been in this situation before where if you didn't know better, you would say,

maybe he is telling the truth, but obviously with time and experience. You get frustrated with yourself, right? You're like, you feel like you're being gaslit because they're so sure that they're so sure of their story. And you're like, wait, am I, am I the crazy one? Am I wrong? Oh, it also gets you frustrated because they'll say something like this person, like you said, it was Teresa, right?

Teresa Gomez. Teresa Gomez. They'll say that name. And it's not like you said it was Teresa, right? Teresa Gomez. Teresa Gomez. They'll say that name. And it's not like you go, okay, I'll check into that. What you'll do is you'll send one of your partners or a patrolman out. Okay, what'd she look like? Which you'll try to, and you can't find anything on this person. Yeah, you pull Teresa Gomez, you realize there's 75 of them in like a 20 block radius.

He gave them the most common kind of name. And as you're sitting there with them and he's going, nope, I don't know where she was. I don't know where I picked her up. I don't know how I found her. You're realizing they're obviously they're playing you and it does frustrate you. And, you know, a lot of people won't like what he said in that moment. It's not necessarily how you conduct an interrogation, but at least he's being transparent. I'm assuming you took that quote from the book.

So he's being transparent. Because Detective Pingatori co-wrote this book. Yeah. Is it, is it professional? I get where you're coming from or anyone says it isn't, but does it happen? Yeah. Sometimes you play good cop. Sometimes you play bad cop. And sometimes it's not even the threat that you're going to do this to them out of, and they, and they respond out of fear, but based on their code, they don't like to be challenged by another person. So that in and of itself may have them get aggressive and say, oh yeah, you're going to knock me the fuck out, go for it. You know, and then they'll, they may slip up and say something out of anger that implicates them. So there is a tactic behind it. It is a chess match. I don't think he was actually going to do that, but maybe he was like,

hey, listen, I played the nice guy approach that didn't work. It's time to change up strategy. I'm sure he also felt like this dude's like acting so calm and being so respectful, like intentionally to get under my skin. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and for the people out there, I say that that's, that's your job is to remain composed. I think even when he said these things, I'd like to think that he was still in control. He knew exactly what he was doing. He was trying to elicit a response that he hadn't been able to get so far up to that point. I mean, also listen, it was just hours before this that he saw Jason and Amy hugging each other as they died on that golf course. Yeah. It can definitely make you lose your cool, but fortunately he didn't act on those threats.

No, he didn't. Kind of wish he had. See, you can say that. I can't say it. You can say whatever you want. No, no. I don't know. You can.

I give you permission. Thank you for the permission. All right, let's take a quick break. We'll be right back. Okay, we're back. So remember, Harry Burdick, he's at home with his girlfriend Christina. They're watching the news. He sees that Jason and Amy's deaths are now being reported.

And so he gets up right away and he calls the police. And he remained anonymous at first. So he calls the police and he claimed he had information about the murders at the Buttonhole Golf Course the night before. He said that someone named Greg had told him that he'd killed a guy and a girl, but he didn't know any specifics besides what this Greg person had told him. So after some time on the phone with Sergeant John Sinote, Burdick did give his name and he agreed to meet with law enforcement in the parking lot of a Kmart. While police officers hopped in their cars to meet with Burdick, Detective Pingatori informed Gregory Floyd, hey, you know what? A witness just called in. You loser. A witness called in. And not only did he give me your name, but he knows what you did. And do you know the name Harry Burdick? You know, because Pingatori wants Floyd to know. I'm not messing with you. This is not a tactic. Yeah. This is not a tactic. I actually have somebody. I got your fucker. He threw, he threw Burdick under the bus, man. Well, listen, he knows Burdick's

lying too. So at that point he's like, listen, I'm going to turn you guys against each other. Let's see who's going to say, and, and this is, this is what you always hope for as a detective. I talk about it all the time when we're covering cases, you're normally not going to have the person who's holding the gun or pulling the trigger come forward. If they're doing that type of thing, they don't have a conscience. But what you're hoping for is that there's more than one person involved. And even though the second person may not have had as much of an involvement in the case, they're still on the hook for just as severe of a penalty. So if you can find that person who has just as much to lose, but not as much as an involvement where they could potentially

get a deal, that's the guy you're looking for because he's going to sing like a canary. Is that the saying, right? He's going to, right. That's the person you want because they didn't pull the gun. They were just there. They're going to, they're going to tell you everything you want to know because they don't want to go down for murder one. Exactly. So don't sit here thinking Harry Burdick is having a guilt. No,

he's not a good guy. And he's not like, Oh, I really need that. No, he knows. Don't forget episode one. Yeah.

That's what we're, what you're saying there. Cause he was right in the car with him. That dude's a douchebag. Okay. Yeah. He's the one that was like, Oh,

let's go. And then, and then as they're even driving to the golf course, well, according to Floyd, okay, as they're driving to the golf course, Harry's trying to get tough, right? With Jason and Amy in the backseat. Just give me your money.

We're gonna kill you. We're gonna do this. And Floyd, always the calm one, the respectful gentleman. He's the one who talked calmly to Amy and Jason. He's the one who got them to not lose their minds and just be like, hey, it's going to be all right. Don't worry.

Floyd did that because he's a psychopath. Harry Burdick is a different kind of psychopath, a less controlled psychopath who some might say is the less dangerous sort of psychopath because somebody like Gregory Floyd is going to be able to put on a mask. I have a calm composure. I'm not a violent guy. You're going to be fine. Don't worry. Whereas Harry Burdick's like, yeah, Harry Burdick's the typical, like he thinks he's

a gangster. He thinks he's a tough guy. Like, oh, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do that. You know? And Floyd's like, hey, calm down, man. We're not going to hurt these two. So he's the one that lulled them into a false sense of security. He's also the one who drove around the Ford Explorer. Yeah. I mean, and a side note here, a lot of these accounts that you're hearing from, clearly they're not from Jason and Amy. So you have to remember they're coming from the offenders. And although Harry's coming forward and we'll never know the full truth, but there's a real possibility he said what he said as a means of self-preservation. We don't know. The only reason he did it.

How much involvement he actually had, who actually, because not anyone's going to agree to this. You know, hey, I did this or I did that. So you got to keep that in mind. Harry's coming forward because he's trying to get ahead of the narrative because he's thinking that Gregory Floyd

is in there diming him out. That's the only reason he came forward. Yeah, well, he doesn't know that Gregory Floyd's even arrested yet, by the way. Oh, when they saw the news article, it hadn't renounced. It didn't say no. Gregory Floyd got brought in. Oh, he doesn't know that Gregory Floyd's even arrested yet, by the way. Oh, when they saw the news article that it hadn't renounced. It didn't say no. Gregory Floyd got brought in. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah. Gregory Floyd got brought in around nine. The news came out at 10.

But did they say that someone was in custody? No. However, Harry Burdick knows very well that this Gregory Floyd dude might be a psychopath. But once again, like you said, not a smart criminal, a stupid kid. He knew that he took the Explorer because he dropped Harry off at home in the Explorer the night before. So he figured it's going to come back to him anyways. He's figuring this dude's going to get caught. He's not going to let go of this vehicle.

Even probably Floyd was like, I'm going to drive this to the wheels fall off kind of thing. And Harry Burdick's over here like, damn. And Harry said he was afraid because when Gregory Floyd dropped him off, he was like, listen, I'm not going to tell anybody, like just don't hurt me. And then Floyd had threatened him like, oh, are you going to tell somebody, man? Maybe I got to leave another body here kind of thing, you know? And Harry was like, no, I'm not going to tell anybody. But he does know in the back of his head, this guy's going to get caught. He's a loose cannon. He's not smart. He's not going to be, he's not going to be low profile by any means.

So I'm going to sort of get out ahead of this. I don't think that there was a, a cell. I wasn't doing the right thing. Yeah. I don't think there's a cell of goodness in that Harry Burdick. We agree there. So detective Ping and Tori's like, we got someone on the phone. They claimed that you, they know what you did.

You confessed. This is his name. You better start talking because if he talks first, it's not going to be good for you, right? Yep. So Gregory Floyd finally did start talking. He said he had been there at the time of Jason and Amy's murders, but he had not fired a shot. He also named names including Raymond Anderson, Kenneth Day, Samuel Sanchez, who he claimed was the one that actually pulled the trigger. Now, Floyd said that the four of them,

along with Burdick, had been driving around in Sanchez's car when they saw Jason and Amy outside the arcade building, at which point Sammy and someone else had ordered the victims into their Ford Explorer at gunpoint before driving away while he and the others followed behind in Sanchez's car. Now, we know they're going to get that surveillance footage from the alley, the surveillance footage showing Gregory Floyd and Harry Burdick creeping through the alley with their backwards hats and their leather jackets on their way to go and accost Jason and Amy. So the police are going to figure that out once they start getting into this investigation and they start pulling surveillance.

No, you were not in the other car. You were in the Explorer, right? And also we have eyewitnesses who saw Gregory Floyd in the Ford Explorer the night that Jason and Amy were taken. So obviously, including a police officer, right? So obviously, they're going to figure out that that's not true and that he's lying. Now, Gregory Floyd said, I had no idea what we were doing or where we were going until we arrived.

And then there was a disagreement between the five of them about whether or not they should have raised Amy's shoot. Floyd said, quote, I disagreed with this and seemed to be the only one who did. So there was an argument and Sammy wanted to shoot me. While we were arguing, Sammy all of a sudden aims at Jason and shoots him and then Amy in the top of the head. And then he states, that's how you do it. Sammy then gave me the gun. He said, make sure he's dead. Amy was laid over and Jason was slumped forward. And I knew they were very much dead. I was scared. And Sammy kept saying, do it or else. I told him they already dead,

but I shot Jason after Sammy did, end quote. So now Gregory Floyd saying, hey, I didn't actually shoot them, but I did hold the gun. And actually, I did fire a shot, but they were already dead when I fired the shot. So I can't get murder because they were dead already. But he's placing himself at the scene of the crime, and he's placing himself with the murder weapon in his hands. And he's even admitting to taking a shot. Yeah, and that's great for an investigator because, like you just said, you establish them at the scene. He's put himself there. He's locked into that statement. So you start there,

and then you begin to peel back the layers. You know the first version's not the true version, but that's a very good starting point. I don't think any of these versions are the true version. No, but they could still stick to, I wasn't there, I didn't do it. So to have them fast forward the process and, and do all that work for you, that's great. I bet Floyd wished he killed Burdick at that point. Yeah. And let's not skate over what you just said there either, you know, where these guys are debating in front of the victims, whether or not to her. And then with the gun in their hand, just standing in front of the victims, whether or not to her, and then with the gun in their hand, just standing in front of them deciding, hey, do we just kill him? Do we just do that instead?

And I'm assuming that Jason and Amy are probably sitting there begging for their lives. I mean, they're not sitting there quiet like, well, we'll just let them decide. It was probably a horrific scene to be present for. I'm sure there was a lot of emotion being displayed there. And, and yet these guys who just have no emotion are sitting there talking about them. Like they're basically just objects. Like they're already dead. Yeah. They're already, Hey, listen, what do we want to do with them? What else do we need from them? Nothing. Okay. Let's dispose of them. It just shows you what we're talking about here, because at the end, we're probably asked the question is five of them. They all didn't pull the trigger. Should talking about here because at the end, we're probably asked the question, there's five of them.

They all didn't pull the trigger. Should they all be held to the same expectation, to the same severity? Spoiler alert. Yeah. But you come to your, I think that was what I said at episode one, at the start of it, when you start thinking about culpability and how the spectrum of that, and whether you're the guy driving the car or the one shooting the gun, what's the accountability there? So I really want to emphasize what was happening in those final moments because any one of them could have stepped in and said, hey guys,

we don't need to kill him. Let's just get out of here. Hey, you guys aren't going to say anything, right? We're going to take the car. We're good. If you say something, we're going to find you. We're going to come after you. So don't say nothing. Nobody stopped it. Nobody stopped it. I mean, they all claim they tried to. Yeah. Bullshit. Yeah. Bullshit. That's right. Because honestly, I feel like if any of them had tried to stop it, they may have ended up dead as well. Possible. You know, at that point with Gregory Floyd in possession of the gun, dude's a loose cannon. Yeah. Possible. If you're not on board with it, you could be a snitch. You're the weak link you got to go to. And you're right. That absolutely could have happened because if they're willing to kill those two people, they're willing to kill you as well.

Yeah. You already got two bodies with these guys. What's the third to throw on? And maybe it'll just confuse things for law enforcement. It might make it a better kind of detraction or distraction of who's this guy with them and how did he end up here? I mean, that would have been hard to put together, honestly. But what you just said there too, before we give anybody a pass, even if they were in fear that if they stepped up, that they could have been killed, that wouldn't have stopped them from coming forward or calling police that night when they were away. They didn't. They were hoping to get away with it. And if Gregory Floyd wasn't driving around in the Explorer, they never would have spoke up. He'd just been innocently hanging out at the bus station when Gregory Floyd approached him and asked if he knew where they could get a car.

And Burdick claimed he told him he didn't. I have no idea where you can get a car. And then the two parted ways. But later that night, he saw Floyd again driving a Ford Explorer, and Floyd asked Burdick if he wanted to ride home. As they drove home, Burdick asked Floyd where had he gotten the car from. And he said that Floyd showed him a gun and told him about the murders. Floyd had threatened Harry, saying he would kill him if Harry told anyone. But Harry didn't believe the murders had actually happened until he saw the news, and then he immediately

called the police. As Harry Burdick talked to the police, who knew they weren't getting the full truth, his story began to evolve. Now he claimed that Floyd had driven him to the buttonhole golf course where Burdick had seen the bodies of Jason Bergeson and Amy Shute, which obviously didn't make any sense with his previous assertion that he hadn't believed Gregory Floyd had actually committed the murders since he was now claiming he'd seen the bodies. So I think that's all you need to see to believe it. At 4 a.m., police executed a search warrant at the residence where Gregory Floyd had been staying and also where Kenneth Day lived. And there, they recovered a.40 caliber semi-automatic handgun, a clip with two live rounds in it, a gun holster, and another round of live ammunition. And surprise, surprise, this is the gun that killed Jason and Amy

in the possession of Kenneth Day. It was actually in Day's room. And he couldn't explain that because, you know, Gregory Floyd had used it to kill Jason and Amy. We're going to get there, but he was the one. And Kenneth Day was like, I don't know how it got in my room. I did take Floyd's jacket when we got home and maybe it fell out of the pocket. I don't know, but it's not my gun. I didn't touch it.

I didn't shoot anyone, et cetera, et cetera. So at that point, Gregory Floyd's roommate, Kenneth Day, was arrested and he was taken to the police station where he gave a statement after waiving his Miranda rights. So all the pieces are starting to fall into place now, right? And these guys have no loyalty, right? Again, they're all in it for themselves and at the time they're tough guys because they're dealing with two people who are unarmed and they have a gun and they feel like they are the gods there they're going to decide who lives and who dies and now that they're in custody and they may they may lose their freedom suddenly they're no longer boys they don't care about each other and they're willing to rat each other out as quick as they can and this is always a great thing for detectives when this happens, because sometimes you will have a group of individuals who are in a gang together or are family members, and it's much more difficult. There is a loyalty there that's hard to break and they will potentially go to prison for a crime they didn't commit to protect someone they love.

These guys barely knew each other. And as you had mentioned in episode one, there was a point, I believe it was Harry Burdick. I could be getting some of the names tossed around, but they were contemplating leaving him behind. Yeah, it was Harry because he was obnoxious and he pretended to be a tough guy. And they were like, yeah, this guy got in the car before they could pull away. He just dove through the open window. There's no loyalty there.

They were a convenience for each other and they probably felt more empowered because cowards like this, they don't do the one-on-one fights. They need a group. They have to, they have to outnumber their victims, their prey. Yeah. They're like a pack, a pack of hyenas. That's right. They got to outnumber them because they have no balls. So here they are locked in a, you know, a room with guys who also have guns and suddenly they're kittens. So it's nice to see and it's good to see how they are all folding on each other because if they had to shut up, maybe the case isn't as strong. But ultimately, the police gave them the shovels and they're now burying themselves. Yep, absolutely.

Let's take a quick break. We'll be right back. All right. So Kenneth Day told the police that he, Gregory Floyd, Raymond Anderson, and Harry Burdick had been driving around in Sammy Sanchez's car with the intentions of robbing someone, an activity that Kenneth said he didn't want to take part in. But since he was in the car, he just didn't feel like he had any choice, which is bullshit. But okay. Day said that after they'd gotten Jason and Amy and their vehicle, the Ford Explorer, they all then drove to the golf course, right? The cars following each other. Day said that there had been no conversation about anybody. He claims that that did not happen at all. He said Floyd, Gregory Floyd wanted to kill both Jason

and Amy. And remember, this is technically if anybody has loyalty to anybody, if anybody's actually friends here, it would be Gregory Floyd and Kenneth Day because they were roommates, because they were always hanging out together. I mean, it's not it's not like a, you know, a blood brother bond. But if there's any sense of loyalty or friendship, it would be here. Right. And now he's nothing. no, no loyalty. Not surprised. So he said it was Floyd, Gregory Floyd, who had shot Jason Bergeson. Day claims he saw this happen. So Kenneth Day says Floyd fired one shot, one shot at Jason. And then Kenneth Day said he ran. He didn't want to see it. He ran. And he only heard the shot that killed Amy.

So he didn't know who had fired it, which I actually believe this. I believe he ran away and then came back because he was probably like, shit, how am I going to get out of here? And I got to go back home where this guy lives with me. And if I run away, like there's going to probably be hell to pay. And I'm going to have some explaining to do so he came back i believe it because why wouldn't you just say if you already said gregory floyd shot jason why wouldn't you say he shot both of them if you saw it happen you know it's possible

and there's sometimes with even the criminals will accidentally tell the truth you know so you know we'll never know for certain does it make him look more innocent i mean he came back it makes him look like he wasn't, he didn't know that was going to happen. So he ran away and then came back. Who knows? Because he needed a ride or something. I don't know.

But I mean, I genuinely don't think that any of them knew it was going to happen. You think he just turned around and said, oh, this is how you do it. I don't think that at least the guys in the car following the Explorer knew what they were going there for. Do you know what I mean? But once they're there and Floyd's got a gun and he's pulling it out and he's talking about it, yeah, they're obviously going to have a

conversation about what's happening. But I don't, the way it sounds and the way it sounds like from all of these guys when they tell it is that it kind of was like, are we going to do this? Are we not going to do this? Are we going to do this? Are we not going to do this? Are we going to do this? Are we not going to do it? And then all of a sudden Gregory Floyd was like, bang, bang, we're doing it. Yeah. Yeah. What do you, so that's possible. What do you think about his account? Because you do say you believe him on the run. Do you believe there was no discussion of her? Someone just randomly brought that up. It was Gregory Floyd who brought that up, correct? Harry Burdick also. Okay. So two, two accounts saying the same thing.

Most of them say it besides Kenneth Day. So no, I don't believe him. Yep, so he was trying to, for some reason that bothered him. He didn't want to admit that he was part of that conversation. Yeah, I don't believe him. I believe that there was a conversation about it.

I absolutely believe there was a conversation. I think, again, you're going over the research. You probably know the case more fresher than me now, but I believe there were indications too that there could have, I won't, I won't, I won't bury it. But we already talked about the fact that there was an empty condom wrapper found. That's what I was referring to. I can't remember if you mentioned that or not. It was within like 20 feet of the bodies.

So there was definitely some talk. We're going to come back to that condom. Okay. We will. Okay. Okay. I'll wait then. All right.

So on June 10th, Raymond Anderson and Samuel Sanchez were taken into custody and Sanchez's Chevy Nova was impounded so that it could be processed. So let's quickly talk about what they found during the search of Jason's Ford Explorer and Sanchez's Chevy Nova. The Explorer was apparently very dirty, not from like dirt, but they said there was smears all over the exterior of it, like handprints and fingerprints. I believe they described it in a way where they were like, it looks like multiple people were outside of this car, like pushing it. I don't know why that would be, but it was very dirty.

Now inside, latent prints were found as well. And they found a black and white pocketbook that belonged to Amy Shute and it contained her most recent paycheck. Now, the reason I say there's handprints on the outside and the inside, obviously, we know whose handprints these are. All five of these freaking people left their handprints all over the place. Yeah, they weren't wearing gloves or anything like that. They got those latex gloves from Saki's Pizza. Remember, Harry Burdick stole them. So that Harry

Burdick's going to be like, oh, I didn't know it was going to happen. Dude, you knew something was going to happen that you had to get latex gloves, oh, I didn't know it was going to happen. Dude, you knew something was going to happen that you had to get latex gloves for. They probably didn't think it was going to be a murder, but they thought they were going to rob someone. But I don't think they thought there was going to be a murder, but I think that they were fine if there was. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, how do we know they weren't even connected to others? They were never able to actually connect them through evidence.

You know, like it was more of just, was this the first time something like this has ever happened? I mean, obviously not. People are mugged and killed all the time. So they could have been connected. That's what I'm saying. These guys in particular. Yeah. None of them will ever admit to that, but we know that they're connected to other. Of course not. There's a lot of unsolved cases in Rhode Island. Yeah. You know, we have them all over the place. We had one, it's not unsolved anymore, but it was a taxi driver in Central Falls. And yeah, there's probably other cases similar to this that maybe this crew or maybe a part of this crew-

Yeah, like Gregory Floyd. Has done something like this before. I completely agree. Actually, I would find it hard to believe that they hadn't given how easily- The way he pulled the trigger without even thinking about it. Right. If they're telling the truth, does that sound like the first time he's done something like that? When he's saying that's how you do it? I don't, well, apparently Sammy Sanchez, I think it was Gregory Floyd who said Sammy Sanchez pulled out the gun and shot them. That

was his first and said that, but he could be projecting, right? He could be projecting and that's what he did. Just a different person. Just getting the names mixed up. Right. He just forgot that it was in his hand, but he was probably pretty convincing with that statement because he was telling something that he was pulling from memory because he did it. So could he have done this before? Could he have shot someone before in the past? Of course, definitely possible. Inside Sammy's Chevy Nova, they found

some casino coins, an arcade coin, some photographs, and a still wrapped condom whose lot number matched the empty condom package found on the golf course. So what does that mean? Well, it came from the same package, right? It's the same brand. It came from the same package. They did not find any evidence of sexual assault on Amy Schutt. But having apparently the condom wrapper was empty. So the condom was taken out. It kind of seems like they were preparing to do it. And then she was shot. Correct. Yeah, there's definitely a conversation going on, checking if they have what they would need to possibly do so. For all we know, they were genuinely still debating whether or not to do it, and that's when Gregory said, F this, we're not waiting any longer, and just jumped the gun, literally,

and shot them. Yeah, I think that's what's happened. I mean, they're not going to ever tell you that. No. There's no way to prove it. But based on the evidence between the condom and the scene that you have and taking them out to this specific location, highly likely that was what was being debated right before she was shot. I was even thinking they were talking about what they're going to do to her.

And then someone was like, hey, does anyone have a condom? And Sammy Sanchez is like, yeah, I think I do. And then he pulls it out, but it's an empty wrapper because he already used it. And he's like, ah, shit. And he threw the wrapper on the floor. He's like, I don't have a condom. And maybe that was kind of the thing because they don't want to leave behind DNA and stuff. I don't know.

I don't know. Yeah. And for all we know, that's when maybe Jason said something. Who knows? And that's why he was shot first. It's very possible that they were like, hey, you know what? Let's get rid of the guy. We don't need him for anything we only need her damn sad when you think about it like that right it's really disturbing yeah he's no use to us get rid of him now she's

even weaker yeah it's very it's very disturbing yeah um we're never gonna know like you said we're gonna know but if this is i want to one more time, if this is the story we're getting. How bad could it be? How bad was it really? Because we're not getting the full version. So if this is what they're willing to admit to, what actually was said? What actually transpired? I don't even want to know. I really don't. I, I, I, yeah. Or Jason and Amy's family, we're better off not knowing any more than we are. This is already too much. I know, dude, it's bad. I really had a hard time with this one. I will say, cause.

Of course, imagine being their parents. It's one thing, you know, murders. This was torture. Yeah. What they went through. It was psychological torture. It was, and I mean, to think of how happy they were you know before like whole life ahead of them they were yeah they were making plans for the next day you know Amy's pulling Jason's friends aside and

being like listen I know he's not my normal type but damn there's something about this boy I really like and he's just like glowing smiling from ear to ear just to be in her presence like this was probably one of the happiest nights they'd ever had. And to have it end like this. Like that. Yeah. Yeah. And it goes back to what I said in episode one, and I stand by it and I can promise every

single person listening or watching this, this situation's horrific. The fact that they lost their lives, that's terrible. But when we talk about deciding to go with the offender or not, this is what I'm referring to because I can't promise you that you're going to get out of there alive. I can't. You can run away. You can do what you got to do. There's still a chance they're going to get you. But I can promise you that if you at least do what I recommended, it's not going to end this way. You're not going to be sitting there begging for your life. You may go out, but you're going to go out fighting. And I'd much rather go out like that than go out like this because I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy. And so it's something

where if you, these, these offenders, they wanted control and to get, to get that control, they had to take them to a secluded area so they could think about it and plot and do what they wanted to do. In the moment in the city, when there's plenty of people around, police cruisers driving around, you still have some leverage. Don't let that go. So in that moment, as hard as it may be to do it, you just got to go for it. And I was actually talking about this with that same police officer that told me about love. And we talked about it and how, even in that moment, another thing that you may do, and it may sound like, oh yeah, sure. You would do that, but you could also go for the guy. You could go for the gun, call their bluff. Are they actually gonna, are they actually gonna pull

the trigger? Is it even loaded? Is it even a real gun? That's a gamble. I'm not recommending that. And especially if you don't have training, but if I'm that close to them and I don't know what the proximity was, but if I'm that close to them and they're pointing that gun at me, I might like my odds with going for the gun and trying to grip it in a way where I know he can't pull the round. Cause I I'm familiar with firearms. I might be able to get it away from him, especially if I'm bashing his head in with my elbow, but that's a different story at minimum You run away and you and you let Whatever you believe in decide if how it's going to work out, but they're going to be more

likely to flee Than follow because they know if anybody sees them now, they're just they're even more involved They may just take the car and go at that point, but can't go with them guys you can't it's not statistically speaking it's not going to end well and if you take anything from this just remember amy and jason i don't think it ever ends well yeah never very rarely if they want to take you to a second location it's because that's it they don't know control they don't know what to do with you and the default is always going to be tie up this loose end and if there's if you now know who they are and you know more about them and you maybe heard names or what, now you can't go. They didn't have masks on so they could identify them.

Now you can't go. But it's like they took the $18 that they had in that parking lot. So Jason and Amy said, obviously that wasn't true, but Jason and Amy said, this is all we have. They had that money. They could have taken their car and left them in the parking lot. And then what? Oh, you get in trouble because you stole $18 in a car. It's not murder, but they had to escalate. And I don't know why. I don't know why. Idiots, morons, cowards. What other words can I use to describe them? I have words, but not appropriate for YouTube. I mean, just scumbags, not worth being on the planet, you name it.

All of the above. Absolute human pieces of garbage. Yep. So we're never going to know exactly what Jason Bergeson and Amy Shute went through that night. The people who were there could never settle on a story, but we know it was terrible and terrifying. The police believe that the account given by Raymond Anderson is probably the closest to the truth. I think that's debatable.

That's just my opinion. Anderson said that they'd grabbed Jason, Amy, and the Ford Explorer. They'd driven around for a bit before ending up at the golf course. Once there, Gregory Floyd told them all they had to do something with Jason and Amy, and Harry Burdick said he didn't want to have anything to do with it. He started to walk away. But then apparently he came back to watch. Anderson said that he told Jason to get out of the car and sit down on the ground. And then Amy started talking to him, trying to appeal to Anderson's humanity, which she didn't know wasn't there. Yep. You guys got to read the book because it goes into more detail. She was

really trying to befriend him. She asked him, is there anything that you can do for us? Is there any way you could help us and get us out of here? And so they made Amy get out of the car as well and sit down with Jason, at which point Jason and Amy wrapped their arms around each other. And Gregory Floyd pointed the gun at Jason and screamed at his victims to shut up. Basically, stop begging for your lives. Stop it. It pissed him off.

Anderson said that he and Kenneth Day started to walk away. Sammy Sanchez was still in the car, and then Gregory Floyd just started randomly shooting. Anderson said, quote, he shot the guy one time in the top of the head, and it went in and came out, and I guess it exploded because of the hollow tipped bullets and it hit the girl and the girl slowly went down. He wasn't sure if she was dead. So he shot her again, shot some more times. I think he shot two more and that was it. Then we left and that was it, end quote.

So if you're listening to Anderson's version of events, maybe they plan to kill Jason, Amy. But when they shot Jason, because Jason and Amy were so close together, it was a through and through. Yes. And when law enforcement is talking about the most accurate account, they're probably referring to the shooting itself because the ballistics more than likely lined up with that. When they start to go back and they figure out trajectory of that first round and the entry and exit points of when it entered Jason and where it exited Jason and then where it

entered Amy, it probably lines up if they replicated them holding each other. So that's why they're probably saying, okay, you know what? Sammy was as accurate as anyone was about the shooting itself. So maybe there's some truth to what some of the other things he's saying. That's probably where they're coming from. Ballistically, some of the other things that were said by the other participants maybe didn't line up. Yeah. I mean, I don't think that any of them were telling the total truth because they're going to leave out whatever part they played. Right. And then the other guy is like, oh, no, this guy actually did this and this guy actually did this. And they're like, no, I didn't do it. That guy did that. It's stupid.

It's stupid. I don't care what they say, to be honest with you. I know what they did. I know they were all there. And as far as I'm concerned, you're all culpable. Right. Well, that's all this is right now is just tying them all into it. The more they speak, the more they bury themselves. Well, according to more than one of the accused, Sammy Sanchez wasn't innocent either. He had urged Floyd to pull the trigger saying, quote, what's taking so long? End quote, which I mean, not hard to believe. So Kenneth Day would later say that he believed Floyd had shot Amy and Jason because they didn't have any money. They had $18 and it pissed Floyd off, which doesn't make any sense. But overall, the five culprits had only been able to take that $18

from the innocent couple. They hadn't checked Jason's shoe or they would have found more. No, it's terrible. We can only say it so many times. It's a terrible situation. We'll never know the truth. These guys are all cowards. I feel very uneasy about it.

I've never watched the TV show I Survived before. Have you? No. Okay. No. I watched one episode. It was the most traumatic experience ever. I cover true crime. It's what I do every day, all day. And these I Survived stories made me feel like I was just taking a bath in cortisol. I couldn't breathe the whole time. So this is how I feel when you're going over the very minute details of what happened to these people. It's very tense. It's very stressful.

It's like the human in you is trying to repel away from it at all costs. It's very hard. Hard stories to hear, but I survived and the reason we're covering, this case is solved, right? And yet we're covering it for a purpose. It's to do exactly what you described, right? It traumatized you. It stuck with you. You're going to remember it. And when

you find yourself in an environment that is similar to whatever this story involved, you're going to think twice. And something may go off subconsciously where you're like, wow, maybe I got to get out of here. And it could be because of something you read or heard or watched. Oh, trust me. That's how I feel all the time. So all the time, but you know, some people we go out there and we want to believe the best in people and hearing these stories. And I'm sure a lot of you guys are sitting there right now and you're extremely upset by what you're hearing, but that's a good thing because that means it'll stay with you and you'll think about them for the rest of your life. And you may never know it, but because of what you

heard and how it impacted you, it may result in a decision you make that you don't even know saved you from something. And that's, that's what's important. Yeah. Let's take our last break and give me a break and we'll be right back. We'll be right back. So in the early morning hours of June 10th, Providence patrolman Marcus Hoffman went to the- I love how you say patrolman, by the way. Patrolman. Patrolman, there you go.

But that's plural. Patrolman. Patrolman is plural, dude. Patrolman. Patrolman. Patrolman. Patrolman. I've never been like, hey, get this patrolman over on that corner.

Get away from me, patrolman. Now we just say officer. Well, Providence officer, Marcus Hoffman, he went into the Johnston police station because he believed he had some information about the suspects, specifically Gregory Floyd. He said that the previous morning between 3 and 4 a.m., he'd been on duty. He was on duty driving north on Pine Street when he spotted someone he knew, Gregory Floyd. And how did he know Gregory Floyd? Because Gregory Floyd's a criminal.

And patrolman Marcus Hoffman is a police officer. So he sees Gregory Floyd driving this white Ford Explorer with two to three passengers inside. And Hoffman observed that the Explorer was being closely followed by another vehicle that was brown colored. Hoffman said this stood out as strange to him because he was familiar with Floyd through interactions with him. And he knew that Floyd did not have access to a vehicle like this. Marcus said that Floyd turned down Pine Street passing him. He then waved and said, hi, what's up Marcus? Before continuing to drive. Yo, Gregory Floyd's a psychopath because not only did he wave at the first police officer when they were first like leaving the arcade building area,

now he's rolling down the window talking to this police officer. And Jason and Amy are in the back seat probably like, and he probably told them, he's like, you make a sound, I will shoot you right now. Yeah. And at that point, they're just driving by. As much as I said, don't get in the car. you're in the car like that. Now you can't run

away. So, yeah, there's not much you can do. You're helpless at that point. So he's talking to this police officer. And the reason he's doing it is because he wants this police officer to think like, oh, if this guy was up to anything, why would he be talking to me? He's a psychopath, man. He's completely cool as a cucumber. He's stealing a car. He's got a gun on him that's not his and not legally registered. And he's got two people in the back that he kidnapped. And he's like, hey, what's up, Marcus? What's going on, my dude? I believe it. I believe it. What the hell? So then Gregory Floyd keeps driving. Patrolman Marcus Hoffman, he keeps driving.

And then later, Hoffman was shown pictures of Jason's Ford Explorer as well as Sammy Sanchez's Nova, and he confirmed that these were the two vehicles he spotted that night. So now we have not one, but two police officers who saw Gregory Floyd driving Jason Bergeson's vehicle with Jason and Amy inside of it as he left Providence and headed toward the place where he would murder Jason and Amy. No one did anything, even though both of them thought it was odd. And one of them knew Floyd was a bad dude and wouldn't be driving a nice car, but he was probably like, well, you know, why would he wave at me and talk to me if he was doing something wrong, you know, and moves on with his day.

And that's, I get it. I get it. And a lot of these individuals that get involved in, you know, minor crimes, you do become familiar with them and they do start. Nobody ever called me Officer Levasseur. Anybody who knows me when I was a patrolman, they know that it was just, it was Officer Derrick. It was Officer Derrick. So they become familiar. I wonder what they called you behind your back. Clorox, because I was pasty. They used to call me Jump Street. That was my name. And then inside the police department, they called me Hollywood. Do you think they ever called you Officer Dickhead? Oh, for sure.

For sure. We were killing it out there. We were doing a great job. They definitely didn't. I was, they weren't a fan of mine. They weren't a fan of mine. That's for sure. That's your job. Not supposed to be.

But we had a lot of good relations too. I, I received a lot of information from the bad guys, right? Because when they did something wrong, I would do my job. I would still treat them with respect so that when something major happened, someone was shot or something like that. I could go to them on the side and say, Hey, what happened over here? Hey, listen, you didn't hear it from me, but you know, this, this, and this, and this. That's the whole reason I got into detectives so early was because of those relationships. So it doesn't pay to be an asshole when you're a police officer because the streets will close up when something bad happens. And if you don't have a rapport with them, they won't communicate with you.

So it is important to have these relationships. I don't take anything from what Marcus did here. He's doing his job. The only thing I would say is at that point, in hindsight, maybe could have, you know, ran Gregory to see if he had a license. Yeah. Or ran the plates on the Ford Explorer and saw it wasn't registered to him. Yeah. Hey, let me see that. I don't think he had a car like that. Let me run that real quick, just to make sure that Gregory's on the up and up. Now, an argument could be made.

Is that probable cause enough to run it? Do you need probable cause to run a license plate? Supposed to. Yeah. Supposed to have something. Please, dude. Oh, cops be running license plates as much as they be eating donuts. It's a slippery slope.

And I will tell you, we will get engagement on this in the comments. And I'm open for the discussion. I do believe that the plates, especially in Rhode Island, they're on the front and back, are there. They're easily readable.

And that allows us to make sure that everyone has their registration insurance. But then you do run into issues where certain officers are profiling drivers and only running certain plates. That's why we have NCIC. That's why you can see what plates people are running. And then when you run the plates, the registered owners, you can tell who they're constantly running. I'll give you an example. When I was in IA for a very short time, we were able to go back and see that a specific officer was running all these plates, right? Running all these plates two, three in the morning, being very active, right? But then when we started checking

the research results from these plates, guess what they all came back to? Young women. They were all in their twenties, early thirties. And then we started to find out more because this all came up because a woman accused him of pulling her over and giving her a number. Oh, that makes a number. Oh, that makes sense now. Okay. So, so then we go back and we look at his logs.

I'm like, cause women are great drivers. So why would he be profiling them in that way? You know, you could see that there's a pattern and all the plates he's running are either young women or middle-aged adults who are the parents of those young women. Right.

So we were able to figure that out really quick. And we, we handled that as you would expect. Wait, how, how, how would you, is he gone? Is he in the Woonsetucket river? Yes. He's no, he's no longer a police officer, but, um, but this is something that back to this story, uh, this is a different topic. It's not really what we're talking about, but weigh in down in the comments, give your opinion on it. Do you think law enforcement should be able to run plates? Cause they're publicly accessible, but weigh in down in the comments, give your opinion on it. Do you think law enforcement should be able to run plates because they're publicly accessible? Or do you think that it should be something where you have to commit an infraction before doing so?

There's plate readers on the streets now. Yeah, they have plate readers. And some people have pushed back on that and saying that's unconstitutional. You do usually have to articulate why you're running someone's plate. The judges will look, especially in traffic court. okay, you ran the plate. It came back unregistered. Why did you run the plate in the first place? Oh, well, they kind of went over the center lane or they had something obstructing their license plate or they had a broken taillight. Something to explain why you ran the plate. And if you don't have that, many judges will throw that case out.

Weird. Weird. But okay. I mean, even if it comes back unregistered. Well, you need to have at least that minimum, and this is maybe something that you guys care about, at minimum reasonable suspicion. You have to believe that a crime has been committed, is being committed, or will be committed. You can articulate that. You can get away with it. But if you're just like, ah, the car drove past me, I ran the plate. Dude, fair enough. So let me tell you then about what Gregory Floyd was known for by law enforcement in

the area. And then- Great job coming back to the story, by the way. You got us back on tracks. And then you tell me if you don't think Hoffman had probable cause to maybe run the plates of a vehicle he saw Gregory Floyd driving when he knew very well Gregory Floyd didn't have that car. Let's do it.

All right. Thank you for bringing us back on track. That was very good. Seamless. That was awesome. Now it seemed that Gregory Floyd had been on the radar of law enforcement for a while and he managed to slip through the cracks of the system every time. At the age of 19, Floyd had a known history of motor vehicle theft. Did you hear what I said? There you go. Known history of, hey, here's Greg Floyd,

the known motor vehicle thief driving a car that I've never seen him in and that I know very well isn't his. That's suspicion. So that right there, how you write that in a narrative super quick, I observed a male known to me as Gregory Ford driving a vehicle that I had never seen him

driving before. This individual has a record of motor vehicle theft. So at that time, I ran the plate to confirm that the registered owner of that vehicle was in fact Gregory Floyd. That simple. There you go. And I think most judges would allow that. Yeah. He was actually on probation for it, right? For multiple offenses. But that would be the way to articulate that and have it go through. On November 20th, 1998, Floyd mugged a tourist near the Biltmore Hotel, took $200 in cash, credit cards, and a key fob that he then used to locate their Lexus, which he also stole.

After that, he drove to his job. He worked part-time at Saki's Pizza, and he bragged about it. And he was arrested later that day, and police found an unloaded air gun and some marijuana in the glove compartment of the stolen vehicle. On June 20, 1998, he had stolen a Nissan, and he was arrested after he crashed it on Log Road in Smithfield. For this, Floyd was given a five-year suspended sentence and five years of probation. On September 24th, 1999, Gregory Floyd was charged in Providence with possession of stolen property under $500, and that same year, he was arrested by the state police in Warwick for driving a car with plates stolen from the Urban League of Rhode Island. In two years, Gregory Floyd missed five court

appearances, and each time a warrant was issued, he'd be arrested, but then each time he'd be released because his crimes were not violent. He did serve 30 days in jail for failure to show up to district court, but he'd been released just days before he took the lives of Jason Bergeson and Amy Shute. Now, Harry Burdick also had a history that included some domestic violence charges against girlfriends and heroin use. He had been involved in more than one armed robbery, his first at the age of 17. And at the time of Jason and Amy's murders, he was on probation for a 1996 larceny conviction, also pleading guilty to disorderly conduct and a domestic violence offense. One of his ex-girlfriends actually wrote a letter to a judge saying, listen, I'm terrified of this guy. He has horrible anger issues. And a psychiatrist

would find that Burdick showed traits of antisocial personality disorder with poor impulse control. He had been ordered to undergo domestic abuse counseling, but in the winter before Amy and Jason's murders, he just stopped going and nobody made him go and nobody did anything. Burdick was also on probation, which he violated, leading to a recommendation that he serve 15 days in jail, but he didn't show up to court three times, and there was a warrant out for his arrest. Samuel Sanchez also connected to multiple armed robberies. He carried out at least six robberies of convenience stores and markets in the period of one week.

Sanchez had convictions for robbery, conspiracy, and felony assault, and he was on probation as well. Raymond Anderson had some drug charges, nothing serious actually. Kenneth Day had no criminal history in Rhode Island as he had just moved back there from North Carolina two months prior. But in that state, North Carolina, he had criminal drug charges pending against him. And in 1995, he'd been convicted of assaulting a woman, at which time he was sentenced to house arrest. Now, part of Day's house arrest included him wearing an ankle monitor for 30 days, but he regularly did not comply with these terms.

So basically, all of these guys, except for Anderson, it appears, who I feel like Raymond Anderson had the least to do with this, but it still doesn't matter to me. It literally doesn't matter to me. It literally doesn't matter to me at all. On December 18th, 2000, a federal grand jury indicted all five men for conspiracy to commit carjacking and carjacking with death as a result, among other charges. The families of Jason and Amy had pushed to have this case heard federally so that the death penalty would be on the table as a potential sentence. Raymond Anderson and Harry Burdick then quickly made deals with the government to plead guilty in order to avoid the death penalty. These deals included giving their full cooperation

in testifying against their cohorts who had all pleaded not guilty. I don't know how you could even like plead not guilty with a straight face in this situation, to be honest with you. The following June, an inmate at the Donald W. Wyatt Detention Center in Central Falls, Rhode Island. Shout out Central Falls, baby. Well, he wrote a letter to Assistant United States Attorney Jared Sullivan, claiming he'd been privy to statements made by fellow inmates, Harry Burdick and Raymond Anderson. The inmate said that while Burdick seemed to feel

somewhat bad about what had happened, Anderson showed no remorse. And in fact, he even gloated about how he'd been lying to law enforcement. He said he had been lying his ass off to law enforcement and he was expected to receive the lightest sentence of them all. Apparently, Anderson had claimed there had been a conversation about whether or not to Amy shoot. And he had made both Amy and Jason get out of the car, get on their knees and beg for their lives. Now, is this jailhouse bragging or is it true? I believe it's true a hundred percent. And that's because of what I've said to you on these episodes before. There's a code, man. You don't women, you don't touch children. If you do, and other prisoners who are there for a long time,

find out about it. Um, you're probably going to have some similar crimes happen to you. I don't know, man. There's a lot of people in prison. I'm telling you, I promise you there's been some stories. I mean, I'm not saying every single person who goes in there for those crimes is held accountable on a street level, but it, it's not something you usually boast about. I'll just say that. To answer your question, if somebody's in there for more than likely, you're going to say, I didn't do it.

They're definitely not going around saying, yeah, we were debating whether or not to her because there are a lot of men in that prison that have mothers and sisters that are in there for different daughters. Yeah. And they do not like hearing that. Yeah.

Maybe, maybe. And there's also some who have done the same thing multiple times to women and probably don't care i don't i don't know what that point means but yeah i mean yeah but there's there's guys who are in there who are like hey i'll kill some a dude for disrespecting me but don't you dare put your hand on a woman now there's still a violent criminal that you wouldn't want in your home yeah but they have this weird moral code i don't know you know what i mean i'm not saying i'm i'm not saying they're

heroes it's a weird moral code that they create't know. You know what I mean? I'm not saying they're heroes. It's a weird moral code that they create in their heads to make them think that there's something off limits. Something is sacred. Oh, no women, no children. Yeah, really. You know, that type of thing. What Anderson apparently allegedly claimed, because this is hearsay, right, from this inmate. He said he made both Amy and Jason get out of the car.

He made them get on their knees and beg for their lives. And he allegedly said, quote, if it wasn't for Harry, we would have that bitch like I wanted, end quote. Now, it also kind of makes me feel like maybe this jailhouse informant had a little bit more of a closer relationship with Harry because he's like, Harry did seem to feel remorseful, but not Anderson. And then he's having Anderson say, like, if it wasn wasn't for Harry, like Harry's the one shining night. He's the shining example of manhood in this group of, you know, absolute pieces of shit. And he's like, no, we are absolutely not doing that. Like, I don't know. I don't know if anybody was really like so against it.

Who knows the motive, but it does speak to the validity of what he's saying, because at this point, I'm assuming not all of this information has been made public. So this jailhouse informant is conveying guilt knowledge, things that can be backed up through ballistics. So it's something you got to listen to, especially when you're building a case. Well, this jailhouse informant claimed that Harry and Raymond, I guess they were all in like separate cells, but you could talk to each other, right? You can. Wyatt detention is like when you're usually waiting for a crime. It's a lot more, it's not maximum security.

I've had multiple prisoners escape from Wyatt where I'm out there as a patrolman and we're trying to find them along the train tracks because then it becomes our problem. It's more like a jail than a prison. It's a prison. Trust me, it is a prison. I've been inside there, but it's a lot of financial crimes and a lot of people that are still waiting to go to trial. So there's not as much, there's not as much crime occurring in there

because they want to be on their best behavior before their trial. So I still wouldn't want to be there, but it's not, like I said, maximum security where you're dealing with guys who are in for life. Well, apparently Harry and Raymond from their separate jail cells would talk about the crime and the situation often.

And Raymond seemed to blame Harry for them all getting caught, which, I mean, technically is true. Technically is true. It's absolutely true. I guess Floyd could have continued denying that he knew anything about that Explorer and they eventually would have put it together. But I don't know. Well, ballistics and then, you know, whatever, DNA, handprints, all this, maybe done something. Yeah. Yeah. So in July, Samuel Sanchez swiftly changed his not guilty plea to guilty. And then the death penalty was taken off the table for him as well,

even though they didn't even make him agree to cooperate against his co-defendants. The following month, Gregory Floyd's lawyers told the prosecution that he would be willing to plead guilty as well if he could avoid the death penalty. This is the man who killed Jason and Amy. Remember that. He's the one who did it. So obviously the families of Amy and Jason, they've been patient throughout all of this, the deals, the pleas, the bullshit. But when the Rhode Island state's attorney recommended accepting Floyd's plea, they spoke out. And I don't blame them. Jason's mother, Nadine, said, quote, my son pleaded for his life and he got a bullet. My son's dead.

Amy Shute is dead. This is just insane. I'm not happy with it at all. The whole justice system doesn't make any sense to me. End quote. Same. Same, Nadine. Makes no damn sense.

Jason's big sister, Kelly, also expressed her disgust saying, quote, Gregory Floyd is a coward. Why? When he's faced with the same fate as Jason and Amy, should we even listen to what he has to say? He should be willing to face the same fate. End quote. I agree. I agree. Nothing needs to be added there. Nope. Well said. On September 26th, the United States Attorney General did accept Floyd's offer. I have no idea why. I really don't. I really don't. And I think it's just because, honestly, they really didn't want to mess with the death penalty. The whole trying this case federally so that the death penalty could be on the table, that was obviously incredibly controversial in the state of Rhode Island where there is no death penalty. So I think that the government, the powers that be, were getting a lot of heat, right? They were

like, politically, this don't look good. All right. And so they were like, well, we'll just make deals with them, right? All of these guys are going to get life in prison anyways. Yep. They're young kids. Let's stick them in jail and leave them there. Let them rot. I don't feel that way. I think Gregory Floyd should have got the death penalty. Well, I don't want to take away from what's important here. I mean, you don't know. They were all involved. So for me, in this case, when it's not clear. Gregory Floyd admitted to shooting them. Admitted to shooting them. But if you're giving him the death penalty, if the other guys were there condoning it and egging him on, which we don't know if they were or not, they should also be getting, it's my thing is they're getting life

in prison. Honestly, I don't care if all of these freaking, well, that's my point. That's my point. That's my point. There's a difference between egging him on and pulling the trigger. Yeah. Pulling the trigger deserves the death penalty. I'm not going to, I'm not going to die on this hill with you.

I don't completely disagree for me when, when it involves young people, and Amy would be in that category, but children specifically, that's where you really get me. That's where I'm like, I'm with you. We're on the same team. It's a case by case. I've always felt that way about the death penalty. It has to be overwhelmingly convincing. And to your point, he admitted to it. So now it's just a matter of, does the crime fit it? And you feel one way, someone may feel another. I don't know. I don't know. The fact they didn't go through trial with it, he just admitted to it. Maybe that's where the leniency comes in. It gives that family the answers they're looking for. He knows he's going away for the rest of his life. The person who did this is held responsible without having to go through this lengthy trial. I'm sure that's part of the decision-making process as well. Yeah. Probably like save some money too, because they know- It saves a lot of money, which shouldn't be part of it. But there is a world where he doesn't

admit to anything and the family, even if he's found guilty, doesn't truly know. Did he actually do it? Did he actually do it? You know, did he actually do it? What happened? He admitted. He admitted to it once he got it. He's giving them that. Did he do it for them? Of course not.

No. He did it for himself. But even so, you still don't know if he's telling the truth. Like, you know he did it, but you don't know if what he's saying, how he did it, why he did it, etc. Exactly. You don't. But it's better than a lot of families get. I mean, listen, they wanted him to get the death penalty.

And I think that when the family is that strongly feeling that way about it, their opinions and their feelings, they lost something. I know. How do you make them whole now? You can't. You can't. And the death penalty won't make them whole either, though. You should take their opinion. It won't.

You can't. But you should take their feelings and their opinions. And if they feel that an eye for an eye is going to rectify this and fix some of their brokenness in even the smallest way, you've got to take it into account. Now it shouldn't be your main reason for giving someone the death penalty, but you have to take it into account. I'm sorry. They may have. They just didn't agree. They didn't agree. They took the optics of it into account more if you want to know how I feel about it. That's fair. All right. So Gregory Floyd admitted to killing two people for absolutely no reason,

and he took his sentence of life in prison without the possibility of parole. And this left just Kenneth Day to go on trial for the murders of Jason Bergeson and Amy Shoup. Kenneth Day would face a jury of his peers. They were shown graphic pictures of the crime scene, which he could not look at in the courtroom. Gregory Floyd, who had previously called Day his brother, now testified against him, and his testimony did not provide anyone with the closure they'd hoped for. When asked why Amy and Jason had been forced into the Explorer after they had surrendered

their $18 to him in the parking lot, Floyd said he had no idea. None of it had been planned. When asked why he had formed the intent to kill Jason and Amy, Floyd responded, quote, I can't say that I really did. It just happened, end quote. When asked if it was an accident, Floyd replied that it was not. So he's like, I don't know. It just happened.

And they're like, well, was it an not. So he's like, I don't know, it just happened. And they're like, well, was it an accident? And he's like, no. Okay. And Floyd admitted to pulling the trigger three times. So obviously we know you can't accidentally pull the trigger and aim it at somebody three times. The prosecution asked what the reason for the murders had been. Was Floyd trying to look good in front of his friends? And Floyd replied that he guessed you could say it was something like that.

Kenneth Day's attorney asked Floyd what he had felt when he pulled the trigger. Had he felt proud? He replied back, quote, what's there to be proud of? End quote. When asked if he was happy or if he felt any emotion at all, Floyd replied, quote, I can't say for sure. End quote. And later he would say, no, I felt nothing.

I felt nothing about this. I didn't feel bad. I didn't feel happy. I felt nothing. It just is about this. I didn't feel bad. I didn't feel happy. I felt nothing. It just is what it is. It's what I did. However, with Kenneth Day on trial in a federal court, the judge ruled that the federal requirements for carjacking with a death resulting had not been satisfied.

And the case was then sent to state court where Day was facing several charges, conspiracy to commit robbery, conspiracy to commit carjacking, conspiracy to commit murder, first-degree robbery, carjacking of a motor vehicle resulting in death, and first-degree murder. Obviously, he and his lawyers argued that he had not played a major role in the crime, and he pleaded not guilty. But during this trial, he was found guilty on all charges and sentenced to four consecutive life prison terms plus 30 years. Now, Kenneth Day appealed, obviously. He claimed double jeopardy.

He and his lawyers felt that conspiracy to commit robbery and conspiracy to commit carjacking were essentially the same. And it was like double jeopardy, kind of. And in 2007, the Rhode Island Supreme Court agreed. And they issued a judgment that partially overturned the convictions, and he was acquitted of the conspiracy to commit carjacking charge. The families of Jason and Aby by this point were not fazed, since all four life imprisonment without parole sentences would stand. And Nadine Bergeson said, quote, What it amounts to is that he's still in there for the same time. They can appeal whatever they want, when they want. They're in there just sitting in jail,

and they can appeal this, appeal that, end quote. In upholding the life sentences of Kenneth Day, the court stated, quote, it is our opinion that the manner in which the subject crimes of carjacking and murder were committed, cruel, heartless, inhuman, malicious, savage, and vicious being just a few of the applicable adjectives alone justifies the imposition of the sentence upon the defendant. There is nothing in the record indicating that the defendant has to this day shown any real remorse for what he has done. And we note that he apologized to the victim's families only after extensive prodding by the trial justice during the pre-sentencing hearing, end quote. So basically, Kenneth Day appealed and he got one of these overturned,

but he's still going to be in prison for life. They all will be. Actually, Gregory Floyd died. I forget why. I think it was cancer or something, but he died after being in prison. Yeah, exactly. That gets you sometimes. Sometimes it works out. And I do think just from a macro level, and some of you may not agree with me on this, but if we ever want to create a system where we deter people from conducting themselves in this manner, being present, but maybe not pulling the trigger and thinking because they didn't pull the trigger, they're absolved from any wrongdoing. This is how you do it. If you're there and you don't actively try to stop what's occurring or at least come forward immediately after to let law enforcement know what happened as a witness and not as a participant.

You're a part of the problem, not the solution. That's it. And so you got these criminals will talk to each other and say, hey, you see so-and-so he got life in prison for just being there. Don't think that doesn't cross their minds, right? They could be standing in the, in the group and Joe Schmo could say, I'm going to kill him. And they might say, don't you dare? Because if you do now, you got me as well. If you do that, I'm going to kill you. So does it work all the time? I'm not saying it's a foolproof plan, but it may be something that's in the back of their minds when they hear about their boy in prison for life, when they were just sitting by and watching and they didn't come

forward and be an active participant in solving the case that now they're in prison as well. So in that way, listen, if you're there and you're part of it and you don't actively stop it or contribute to the solving of that case, you could also end up in prison for the rest of your life. Let that be a lesson to every scumbag out there who, first of all, gets involved in this type of activity, knowing that this could happen. It could be a carjacking where the driver decides not to be a victim, and that carjacker could shoot the victim while you're driving the other car, and now all of a sudden you're going down for murder one as well. And I do not have any sympathy for you or your buddy. I don't,

because if you didn't put yourself in that situation, you wouldn't be there. And do technically Harry Burdick did come forward and help solve it. Right. Because without his testimony, who knows how long Gregory Floyd would have just been like, nah, I don't know. It wasn't there. Don't know. I have no idea. And he's still got life in prison. So screw you, dude. I don't even care that you helped because it was selfish. It was selfish. Yeah. No, this case, it really struck me as a police officer when we covered it at BCI school. And part of the reason we covered it was not only because from an investigative perspective,

they did a great job. They really did. The interviews were great. Ray did a great job. In fact, David DeTora, he works for the state now, but he was a crime scene investigator for Johnson Police at the time. He was the guy who responded out to the golf course. He found the condom. He found the latex glove. I think he found, I had wrote some notes on it too. He found one of the live ammunition rounds. He was the one processing the scene. So he brought us in to cover this case for a couple reasons.

One, to show the investigative practices that need to take place in order to solve a crime, but also to remind us when we're out there maybe working a routine patrol shift that that car you see going the wrong way may just seem like a minor traffic infraction, but it may be much worse. And your job is not to decide what's important, what's not. It's to do your job and enforce the law. And whatever comes from that comes from that. So it really was a wake-up call for a lot of us who have been on a little bit of time. And you can get complacent over the years. So to hear this story

and realize there were multiple forks in the road where one decision going the opposite way could have resulted in Amy and Jason still being with us. And listen, I don't want anybody to think I'm being like super hard on these cops for no reason. I understand being human. I understand making mistakes. But I think about Jason and Amy in the backseat of that Explorer seeing not one but two cops pass and their captor their captor waving at these cops and them just seeing this like moment of you know we might be saved and having that hope crushed a minute later i think about that that's what i think about like i'm not mad at these these police officers i'm not like you suck you should never sleep again how can you look at yourself in the

mirror i understand mistakes but at the same time, I think about Amy and Jason and how those police officers in a moment presented a sliver of hope for them and that hope was crushed. How many times that night do you think their hope was crushed? That's what I think about. Yeah, it's demoralizing. It's demoralizing. And it's something where we can only learn from it, which is why I think Amy and Jason's case is something that David DeTore makes it a point to, you know, to remind officers that are working cases in to her as well. And you can see the photos of these guys. I mean, they are young, but they're hardened criminals. I mean, they're monsters. And there's one photo in particular, and I don't even know which one of them it is. I think I can see it right here. If you're looking at the photo, it's all five of them left to right. It looks like all the way to the left, you got Gregory Floyd in this jumpsuit, this Tyvek suit.

Then it's Harry Burdick next to him with the t-shirt on and the blue jean shorts. Then you have Sammy Sanchez. He's the shorter one. Then you have the taller one in the gray hooded sweatshirt is Raymond Anderson. And then the last one, the one who went to trial and did all this thing. Have you seen this photo yet, Stephanie? Is it the one where they're standing up? There's two, but is the one i'm gonna send it to you They're sort of standing up in court. Their hands are behind their backs They're standing up in like an arraignment area at the police station. Yes. I can see two of them

Yeah, there's two of them. I'm gonna send you one right now And it may be the one you've seen there's two different ones The one there's where they're standing next to gregory floyd the other one standing next to Day. The one I'm looking at, it looks like I believe they're standing next to Kenneth Day. He's got a black t-shirt on. Is he looking at the camera? Yep. Do you see that face? Yep.

Does that seem like a face of remorse? No. And they said that during his trial, he was very like cocky, arrogant, like making faces, showing no remorse, being like whatever, like laughing, being sarcastic. Exactly. Exactly. Look at that face everyone who's watching on youtube does that look like a guy who feels bad about what happened

not at all not at all so that's where we leave this one i'm again the takeaway and i've said it a few times and i don't mind saying it again nothing we can do to change what happened amy and jason but we can create a better environment a better awareness of our own situations and try to prevent this from happening to you or someone you care about. You know, we had developed a description for Crime Weekly many years ago. We haven't updated it since. And it basically says we're covering cases that are in the headlines, but also more obscure cases so that you don't become the topic of our next case. And we mean that. There is an educational element to this where we're covering these cases,

you're getting an inside look from someone who's done it, you're getting great storytelling, but also you're learning something that is a tool. It's a story that you now have that you can refer to, remember what happened, and regurgitate some of the things that transpired here when you're thinking about how to react to a situation. So there's something to take from it.

Don't just move on to the next one. Really think about it. Yes, we want to remember Amy and Jason, but we also want to remember what happened and the decisions that were made so that if you find yourself, hopefully never, in a similar environment, a similar situation, you may react differently and you're not the victim of a case like this. That's really my hope for everyone out there. Before we go as a close, I want to tell a quick story to show how violent crimes like these don't just affect the victims, don't just affect the offenders, don't even just affect the victims' families, but affect everybody who is close to them.

It's a ripple out effect that ruins lives. So remember Jeff, who was in love with Amy, right? This dude was devastated when he heard what happened. He went to the trials. He sat there. He held a stuffed bunny that I assume was hers or that she'd given him, sobbed. He never got over it. And a few years later, he died of a drug overdose. And he was never a drug user before. So people believe that what happened with Amy, how she was stolen from him and in that horrible way, it broke him irreparably. And he turned to drugs as a means of deadening, distracting, not feeling. And he overdosed. They believe that happened. They don't know if he did it intentionally or not, but yes. Didn't survive. This was a bright young man and had never used drugs before. It was a

very straight laced guy. This was a good person who had so much love in his heart, even for a girl, enough for her where he was like, yeah, you go out and you see what else is out there. And I will be waiting here for you when you come back because I love you that much. And I believe in what we have between us that much. We were supposed to talk that night. And they were supposed to talk that night. Yeah. I mean, all these cases have a ripple effect. These monsters that commit these crimes, it's not only the immediate impact on the actual victims, but it's also the family members and friends who no longer get to see their loved

one and have to constantly think. We're going to finish this episode. And yeah, I remember this case, which is why I brought it up to you. But I'm not thinking about it every day. And these stories that we're telling here tonight about what actually happened, think about the family members that have to remember Amy and Jason and they knew them personally. And to think that that person that they cared about so much experience that it makes you want to put your fist through a wall. It really does. I mean, sometimes it's hard for me to walk out of recording my videos or crime weekly and like connect back to my life. Of course. It's very disassociative.

It's very like you get in your head and you just feel it. And then you almost feel guilty. You see your own family alive and healthy and you're like, oh my God, why don't Jason and Amy's parents deserve to be able to walk out and see their children who they love? And I get to do that. It's very difficult. It is. It's very hard. It's very, it's very difficult, but. It is. It's very hard.

And all we can do is send our thoughts and prayers out to the friends and family of Jason and Amy and everybody else who's experienced something like this and continue to cover their stories, continue to make sure that people know what happened to them, and also use this information to prevent it from happening to you or someone you care about.

We appreciate you guys being here as always. It's always tough to cover these cases, but we appreciate the support. We appreciate the engagement for people to come here and get into these conversations with us. The engagement last week was incredible, and I think it's going to continue. So we will be back next week with a new case. Until then, like that hat says over here, stay safe out there. We'll see you soon. Bye.