Criminal - Finding Sarah and Philip

Episode Date: February 3, 2017

In 2005, Teri Knight drove 650 miles on midwestern roads through Ohio, Indiana, Iowa and Illinois, pleading with the public to help her do what law enforcement and the FBI had not been able to: find the remains of her children Sarah and Philip Gehring. An Ohio woman named Stephanie Dietrich read about Teri Knight's search in her local paper, and decided she would try to help. Say hello on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram. Sign up for our occasional newsletter, The Accomplice. Follow the show and review us on Apple Podcasts: iTunes.com/CriminalShow. We also make This is Love and Phoebe Reads a Mystery. Artwork by Julienne Alexander. Check out our online shop.  Episode transcripts are posted on our website. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hi, I'm Terry Knight. And two years ago, my children, Sarah and Philip Gehring, I don't know if you remember the case they were murdered. They don't deserve to be buried on the side of a road. I don't deserve to have them buried on the side of the road, and we need to find them and bring them home. In 2003, Terry Knight's children, 14-year-old Sarah and 11-year-old Phillip, were murdered by their father, Manuel Goering. Terry Knight and Manuel Goering were divorced and in the middle of a custody dispute.

The two children were spending Fourth of July with their father in Concord, New Hampshire. Instead of returning the children to their mother at the end of the visitation, Manuel Goering shot them and crossed several states before burying their bodies. He was arrested one week later in California and confessed to the murders. He began to try to help investigators find the children's bodies, but he didn't appear to know exactly where he'd buried them. Law enforcement transported him in a van across the Midwest, and Gehring tried to describe visual markers, but they weren't specific, really just somewhere along the Ohio Turnpike.

The search was unsuccessful, and Manuel Goering killed himself awaiting trial. Terry Knight continued searching for the bodies of Sarah and Philip. She drove 650 miles on Midwestern roads through Ohio, Indiana, Iowa, and Illinois, pleading with the public along the way to help her. She was asking for the public's help in any way they could do it, whether they were psychic, whether they could pore over maps, whether they could drive that route. She would take any help she could get. This is Stephanie Dietrich.

Stephanie's lived in northeastern Ohio her whole life. She knows the roads and intersections. And back in 2005, she read about Terry Knight's press conference in her local paper. It was on the front page. And right then, Stephanie decided she would try to help. So I didn't know I was supposed to sign up for a search group. I just thought, you know, do what you can where you can. And that's what I did.

Stephanie Dietrich speaks very practically about the whole thing. Terry Knight asked for the public's help, and as Stephanie put it, Am I not the public? Her own kids were grown and had moved out of the house. She'd been at her job at Acme Grocery for a long time and was starting to cut back on her hours. I asked if she told Terry Knight she was going to start searching, and Stephanie said no. I didn't want to disappoint her.

I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal. Initially, the FBI didn't release a lot of information to the public about where Manuel Goering said he'd buried his children's bodies. But when years passed, and Terry Knight had taken her plea directly to the public for help, the FBI decided to release as much of that information as possible, including a crude map that Gehring had drawn of the location. Well, he gave them a list of about ten things that they would find on the property, like a pile of dried firewood,

some slabs of irregular cement, like six-foot six foot tall grass. There was a pump with a green handle. There was a chain link fence. And when you get out and start looking for this stuff, it's amazing the places that have all these same things. Stephanie thought these markers sounded like they could be in a part of the woods outside Akron she knew pretty well, off Copley Road. She'd often take her dog out there and walk around. Oh my God, this dog. What was the dog's name? Rico.

He was Boxer and Rottweiler. Big or how much? Big, 116 pounds of pure muscle. She convinced her family and friends to go out with her and Rico whenever they could to help look. And she would call the local police departments often, giving them tips on where to investigate pieces of land that she thought looked right. In fact, the FBI did send an evidence recovery team down there. And we went back that afternoon. I didn't know they'd been there.

And I was like, man, RICO didn't run through here and make all these tracks through here. And so I called them, and they were like, yeah, we were there today. It's not the right place. And I was like, but did you see this? And did you see this? And the lady was real snotty, and she said, we're telling you it's not the right place. You're welcome to check it yourself. Click. And then I was pissed. I was like, we're telling you it's not the right place. You're welcome to check it yourself. Click.

And then I was pissed. I was like, okay, I'm going to do this. So the police were giving you a hard time. Like, why are you doing this, ma'am? This is... Right. Right. I mean, they weren't telling me to get off of anybody's property.

There was never any incidents like that. But when you get a man detective, they're like, why are you doing this? Are you a prison junkie? Did you write to him in prison? What interest do you have in doing this? They just didn't understand it. A lot of people don't understand it. I just think it's the way that some people are wired.

People that understand it understand it, and people that don't never will. She started seeking out tips and information from the Internet and would print out any articles she could find. She put them in a folder and kept them in her car. And these tips, combined with her knowledge of the area, guided her search. I went out to what I thought was going to be the place and pulled in and looked around and see these no trespassing signs. And that didn't really bother me and got out with Rico and just started walking around because it was property

that was owned by a construction company. And it was just, there was nothing on it at the time. So we could just like pull straight in there. And basically, I was there so often that the man from the towing company across the street from that property pulled in in his tow truck one day and asked me if we had bought it, bought that property. How big of an area were you searching? Well, it was probably an acre, a few acres, but I only stayed in, I mean, like, maybe a two-acre area.

And when you would look, would you let Rico kind of lead you on the leash, or would you be digging around? Rico, like, when we would go for walks and stuff, not just looking for these kids, but either he's watching out for me or I'm watching out for him, but we don't ever both just, like, wander off. I can't explain it, but I could just wander anywhere I want to and know that dog had his eye on me. So I felt safe where I was at. I would follow anywhere he wanted to go to. And when you were walking around, would you carry a shovel with you? Would you be digging or would you just be looking down at the ground?

I would only, like, dig a couple shovelfuls. I mean, I have a note where I stuck it in a hole. It says, please don't fill in this hole. And then I gave them, like, the website for if you don't believe what I'm doing here, you know, check this. And I came back, and there's a dirt bike written over my note. Because you wanted to not have to retrace your steps. Right. But I didn't want to leave somebody's property with big holes in it either.

Why did you think that Rico could search? I mean, was he trained in any way to do this? No, he just always went everywhere with me. I mean, everywhere I went, Rico went. And so it just made sense that if I was going to be outside, you know. You weren't hiding the fact that you were looking. Did your mother knew? Your friends knew? Did everyone know that you were out doing this?

Yes. Did anyone ever say, what in the world are you doing? Why are you spending so much? Well, I mean, I pretty much do whatever I want to anyhow, you know, so, and it works out for me. I don't get into too much trouble, but I don't offend people and I don't, like, I'm not going to go stomping through, you know, breaking down branches or climbing your fence or snipping your, you know, or try not to leave any trace I was here, you know. They didn't make, no one made fun of you or got creeped out and said, hey, that's enough, stop it.

None of your family or friends. Well, they were a little worried, you know, I was obsessed with it, but... Were you? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Stephanie began spending more and more time searching on Copley Road. Sometimes she would take her book and a lawn chair out to a spot she was searching and just sit there for a while in between her digging,

letting Rico roam around. She started giving away her work shifts at Acme Grocery so she'd have more time to search. I can remember calling. I was supposed to be at work like at 10 a.m., and we went out there at 8 o'clock in the morning. I already had my work clothes on and stuff. I called my manager, Jeff, and I said,

Jeff, I'm coming in, but I've got to go down to FBI first, okay? And he's like, okay. By November, she'd been looking for four months, and she started to slow down. We had all been together for Thanksgiving the week before, and somebody asked me at Thanksgiving if I was still looking for those kids, and I hadn't been out in a while. And I said, no, but I've got to find them.

She'd exhausted every inch of the woods off Copley Road. She searched other places in the area, but had no luck. So she moved her search to a new location in Hudson, Ohio, off Tyrex Road. This Arctic air was moving in, and the ground was going to freeze, and I remember my mom called, and they were in the middle of a move, and she's like, can you come help me? I said, no, Mom, I've got to go find these kids. The ground is going to freeze, and we won't be able to get to it.

And will you describe how the new location kind of looked the same or different from Copley? Was it the same idea, a couple acres? They both had the six-foot, this grass that grows in Ohio. It's like it's over six feet tall. And as the fall comes on, it gets brown at the top and almost like wheat's in it or something. I don't know.

And I thought it looked pretty good. So I called Hudson Police Department, and then the next morning I wondered if they were out there. Like, man, did they go out there and check that out? And so that's why I went back up there, which was to see if they were doing it. And if they weren't going to do it, I was going to do it myself. So they weren't there.

So we pull in and park, and we go back 100 yards, and we start looking around, and just the look on his face, like, dig right here. And so I went and I stood over him where he was at, and I knew that the branches to the tree reached down toward the ground as opposed to stretching up toward the sky. The father had said that. And I looked at this big branch over Rico, and all the little branches on it were snapped off. And I thought, well, that's too high for deer to have nibbled those off. Somebody broke those off so they could work in this spot. And the father had said that there will be just exactly room for one vehicle to have backed in. And I was like, oh, Rico. Just the way he laid down.

So I get my little shovel and I dig in once and my shovel breaks. So we go back 100 yards to the car and I get another shovel. And we go back there again and I dug like two good-sized shovelfuls of dirt out, and it was like clumped together. It was all real heavy clay, and I see black plastic and duct tape, and I don't know if it goes to the left or if it goes to the right, so I move one to the left, and it's still going. There's still black plastic and duct tape, and I move one to the right, and there's still

black plastic and duct tape. And I move one to the right and there's still black plastic and duct tape. And I was like, oh Rico, we got to go get help. I didn't look for anything else. It's like, you know when you know when you know. And so we go back down 100 yards and now it's getting dark and the snow's starting to come in. And as we get to the car, here comes a Hudson police officer across the opening. And I'm like, oh, my God, an angel from heaven. And I'm trying to talk to her real fast, and I'm wiping snow off the back trunk of my car, and I've got all these papers that I've copied on, you know.

They walked back to the site, and the officer cut a hole in the bag, which further confirmed what Stephanie thought. He called for supervisors, and they didn't want me to go back there again, and I didn't find it out until later, but when the supervisors got there, they cut the plastic a little more, and they saw the little boy's boxers. After five and a half months of searching, Stephanie Dietrich had somehow managed to do what no one else had been able to

for the last two and a half years. She'd found the remains of Sarah and Philip Gehring. How did you feel on that ride home? Or when you knew that you had found them, how did you feel? I was probably just pretty at peace with it. It's the only thing in my life that I've ever started out to do and finished. I swear to God, I never finished anything. And it never occurred to me, I never got discouraged or disgusted. It never occurred to me that I wouldn't find those kids. Rico just, if I hadn't had him,

I probably, I wouldn't have gone out like that. I mean, I give Rico all the credit because he was the reason I was outside spending time with my dog. He was a little stressed out. In fact, he threw up in the car, but I always told him what a good boy he was. I have a dog now. She's just a dog. Oh, it's terrible to have a good dog first and then just have a dog.

My name is Jeff Stralzen. I'm a senior assistant attorney general and chief of the homicide unit at the New Hampshire Attorney General's Office. He was the lead prosecutor on the case. I was able to meet Stephanie out there at the spot where the children were buried. I have a picture of my office that I'm looking at right now of myself and the dog Rico and Detective Flanagan were both kneeling down at the spot where the children were found with Rico. And I remember that day extremely well. I was just, I was amazed that someone had that capability to carry through with it like she did. And then when I met her, it really made perfect sense to me

that she would be the person to help us bring Philip and Sarah home. Have you ever heard of a citizen committing this much time to finding a body? You know, I haven't. Typically, people just read stuff online and don't really do things. This is what Stephanie did is she got out there and she put her feet to the ground. She didn't just read stuff online. She actually got out there and looked at places. And I think that's pretty unique. Do you remember Terry Knight's reaction when the bodies were found? Relief. Relief because as terrible as it sounds you know people can tell you and we certainly told

her why we very much believe that philip and sarah were dead but until you know for sure there's that lagging lingering doubt in the back of your mind could they be somewhere else could he have taken them somewhere and as much as logic tells you that's not possible, you know, giving her closure was important. We were able to bring her home some personal effects from the children, you know, and I think that really finally allowed her to have some measure of closure. After word got out that the Gehring children had finally been found, the national media swooped down on Hudson, Ohio. Stephanie says news cameras were lining her street.

Rico was given an official canine collar by the FBI. And Terry Knight, the children's mother, came to Ohio to meet Stephanie. She brought a big rawhide bone for Rico and sat down on the floor to greet him. We reached out to Terry Knight, but she didn't respond. She did say at the time, Stephanie Dietrich is the amazing spirit of what we hope people are. She's now remarried with twin girls. As for Stephanie Dietrich, she still works at

Acme Grocery a couple days a week. Rico died two and a half years ago. Throughout our entire conversation, I kept trying to understand what she was thinking all that time. But she doesn't think she did anything that special. As she said, she knew the area and thought she could help. Thank you. illustrations for each episode of Criminal. You can see them at thisiscriminal.com or on Facebook and Twitter at Criminal Show. Original music in this episode comes from Blue Dot Sessions. Criminal is recorded in the studios of North Carolina Public Radio, WUNC.

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