Criminal - The Agreement

Episode Date: November 13, 2015

In 2005, Danny Egipciaco had the opportunity to participate in a robbery of a drug supplier's stash house. He was told he'd take home between $100K-200K. In the end, the robbery never happened, so why has Danny spent the last ten years at Fort Dix Correctional Institution? Say hello on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram. Sign up for our occasional newsletter, The Accomplice. Follow the show and review us on Apple Podcasts: iTunes.com/CriminalShow. We also make This is Love and Phoebe Reads a Mystery. Artwork by Julienne Alexander. Check out our online shop.  Episode transcripts are posted on our website. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for Criminal comes from Apple Podcasts. Each month, Apple Podcasts highlights one series worth your attention, and they call these series essentials. This month, they recommend Wondery's Ghost Story, a seven-part series that follows journalist Tristan Redman as he tries to get to the bottom of a ghostly presence in his childhood home. His investigation takes him on a journey involving homicide detectives, ghost hunters, and even psychic mediums, and leads him to a dark secret about his own family.

Check out Ghost Story, a series essential pick, completely ad-free on Apple Podcasts. Your own weight loss journey is personal. Everyone's diet is different. Everyone's bodies are different. And according to Noom, there is no one-size-fits-all approach. Thank you. for a healthier lifestyle. Stay focused on what's important to you with Noom's psychology and biology-based approach. Sign up for your free trial today at Noom.com. My name is Danny Egypt Siakow. I'm from Brooklyn, New York. In 2005, Danny Egypt Siakow was at work

when he got a phone call from a stranger. The man said he'd gotten Danny's number from a mutual friend and that he had something important to talk to him about. They agreed to meet up at a pizza place on New York's Lower East Side. I mean, I pulled up to a pizza rear. He jumped in the car and he just pretty much got right to it. He said, listen, I got your number from such and such and I have a proposition for you. And I was like, OK, go ahead. And he just proceeded with basically telling me what the

plan was. The guy's name was Jimmy Burgos. He was a disgruntled drug courier that was no longer satisfied with the arrangement he had with his supplier. He was attempting to get his supplier And what did he want you to do? Four years earlier, when Danny was 21, he'd been arrested for possession of cocaine and was sentenced to five years probation. So he was still under probation when Jimmy called. But Danny says he was willing to hear him out. Everything was coming into play as far as, you know, my financials at the moment, you know what I mean? And my safety and so many things were just playing in my head. I couldn't just sit there and say to him, all right, yeah, come on, let's go. We can make this happen or whatever, you know?

Did he say how much he was going to pay you? Well, he was basically saying that we were going to split whatever came half and half. And how much money would that have been? What would that look like? It was going to be more than $100,000. This call is from a federal prison. More than $100,000, that's a lot of money. Yeah, definitely.

And $100,000 is lowballing it because at the end of the day, if it's 10 keys, potentially wholesale, let's say $20,000 a key, that's over $200,000. So just the potential of the money that was there was the only thing that was even keeping me like, okay, maybe this is something that can't happen. Like, I don't know. I was open to hearing him out further.

This phone's about to hang up, though, so I guess I'll call you back. Call back as soon as you can, okay? And we lost the call. Because he's in federal prison, Danny can only use a telephone for 15 minutes at a time, with a one-hour break in between. And when you do talk to him, that automated message bursts in all a time, with a one-hour break in between. And when you do talk to him, that automated message bursts in all the time, making sure you absolutely know that the person calling you is incarcerated. He called us back an hour later and continued the story. The next day I went to work,

and while I was at work the next day, he ended up calling me again on my cell phone, kind of, you know, saying, hey, I want to meet up with you again. Were you able to talk to any of your people? And I was like, yeah, kind of, sort of, but I still need more information. And I'm working right now. He's just like, all right, well, just meet up with me tonight. And, you know, we could talk some more or whatever, you know, I mean, bring one of your guys with you or whatever, and we could talk about it further. They agreed to meet a second time. And according to Danny, he went to that second meeting just to continue talking it further. They agreed to meet a second time. And according to Danny, he went to that second meeting just to continue talking it over. So he was surprised when he showed up and Jimmy

said they needed to go rob the cocaine supplier right then. I'm just like, wow, like this is short notice, basically. Like, I don't, I'm not really prepared. I told you I needed more information. And he just continued to just tell me, look, this is an easy thing. Don't worry about it. Just come through and see the scenery. And, you know, it shouldn't be a problem. Do you have a gun with you now? There was actually a gun in the car, which was located in a compartment in the back seat. Jimmy said they needed to drive uptown and told Danny to park in the parking lot of a McDonald's on 34th Street.

But all along, I'm just saying, I'm not committing a crime by going to see what's going on. In my mind, up until the point that I kick a door down and hold a gun to somebody and, you know, take something from them, I'm not committing no crime. So when I go to meet him at the parking lot, as soon as I park my car, we were ambushed by ATF and DEA. And, you know, I've been locked up ever since, basically. Danny's car was completely surrounded by various law enforcement officers, the DEA, the ATF, NYPD, and the State Drug Enforcement Task Force. They'd been waiting for him, and he was arrested for conspiracy to commit robbery.

A conspiracy charge is attaching punishment or criminal liability to the agreement to commit a crime. Katie Tinto is a former public defender who now studies policing at New York's Cardozo School of Law. You know, obviously we punish you once you commit the crime, right? You rob something, you steal something, you attack someone. We also punish you if you attempt to do it, right? You attempt to kill someone, you attempt to do robbery.

Conspiracy is even earlier in the timeline, if you think about it in that way, is that we then punish you for agreeing and starting to plan to commit a crime. But what if you changed your mind? That's the critique of the conspiracy charge, that maybe someone is all talk and bravado. Maybe the violence that they say they'd be willing to carry out, actually the person wouldn't carry out in real life. When you attach liability earlier in the process, yes, there is some risk that you're getting people who might not have actually carried these serious crimes through. And in Danny's case, there's this whole other layer of weirdness and complexity. It was all imaginary. Not only did Danny not go through the robbery,

there's no way he ever could have. I'm Phoebe Judge. This is Criminal. First off, the entire plot is imaginary. So the drugs that are supposedly in the stash house are imaginary. The disgruntled drug courier who wants to rob his dealer is an undercover agent. And so you have these people who are brought together by this opportunity that the undercover agent presents for something that didn't actually exist before the undercover agent suggested this crime. Jimmy, acting on behalf of the task force,

had made the whole thing up. And all he had to do was get Danny to agree. It's called a reverse sting, or a stash-o-sting. That's kind of a shorthand for when the government acts as the person who sets up the sting or, for example, the seller, as opposed to if an undercover officer is buying drugs from someone. If he's the seller, that's called a reverse sting. And this is, a stash house is a form of reverse sting because they're the ones setting all the terms, right? They set

the amount, they set the factors, what you need to do. Did Jimmy ever wear a wire? Yeah. The two conversations that were had inside of the vehicle were both recorded. OK. So that's how they could kind of say, listen, you were intending to do this. Yeah. Basically, when at the time, I mean, I'm speaking to what I assumed was a criminal. So the things that I'm saying to him, the boasting or, you know, the agreement is just me yesing him in a sense of like, I'm not thinking I could, you know, literally go to jail just to sit here and tell this person, oh, yeah, sure. All right. I'll look into it. Yeah, I'll think about it, you know. In all reality, I was just trying to get the conversation over with and be able to go back to where I was at and sit with my own thoughts and really be able to, like, analyze the situation. And I guess the fact that there was a gun inside of the car made it further seem like we was prepared to pull this off had this

opportunity been real. Because of the nature of confidential informants, we don't know what Jimmy's instructions were or if he was told to target Danny specifically. We can see from court records that Jimmy had been indicted on drug charges of his own and appears to have avoided a more substantial prison sentence by agreeing to cooperate with the government. The confidential informant finds people willing to do this, right? They go out and search for people who are vulnerable to this opportunity. So that makes it a little bit more problematic than a lot of undercover policing,

where they hear about a defendant or a suspect wanting to do a crime first. Katie Tinto has seen cases in which the confidential informants end up working really hard to convince their targets to say yes. I know of one case where the person started to resist a little. The suspect seemed to be kind of getting cold feet. And then the undercover agent said, I'll change the split, meaning I'll take less of a share of the imaginary drugs and you can have more of it. So again, making it more of an enticing opportunity. All the informant needs

is agreement. Then their work is done and their target is in very big trouble. Before his trial, the prosecution offered Danny a deal, plead guilty and serve 15 years in federal prison. I'm like, I'm assigned to sign 15 years of my life away for something that I really never did. I mean, just for having a conversation with somebody and showing up to a location, and I'm going to sign away 15 years of my life. I'm like, no, I'm going to go pick my jury,

and I'm going to let the jury find me guilty. Danny's lawyer wanted him to take the deal. One of his favorite lines was, the feds could indict a ham sandwich. But Danny wanted his day in court. Support for Criminal comes from Apple Podcasts. Each month, Apple Podcasts highlights one series worth your attention, and they call these series essentials. This month, they recommend Wondery's Ghost Story, a seven-part series that follows journalist Tristan Redman as he tries to get to the bottom of a ghostly presence in his childhood home.

His investigation takes him on a journey involving homicide detectives, ghost hunters, and even psychic mediums, and leads him to a dark secret about his own family. Check out Ghost Story, a series essential pick, completely ad-free on Apple Podcasts. Thank you. Learn more at klaviyo.com slash BFCM. It was horrible. I mean, you can only imagine my struggle to keep myself together in the courtroom. Danny's mother, Alita. He kept telling me, don't worry, Mom, this isn't, nothing is really going to happen here because this was all a setup. There were no drugs involved.

So they really don't have a case on me. So he was pretty confident that someone would figure out this was a big mistake and it would just be a big mistake and he would come home. He was very, very confident that that was the case because, and that's why he decided to go to court and through the jury system and all that, because he felt very confident that someone was going to see through this and yes, that he will be released. At the trial, the prosecution explained to the jury that because Danny was on probation, he should not have had a gun. And they presented other items found in Danny's car, gloves, a ski mask, and two hats. The jury deliberated for two hours. Danny was found guilty and sentenced to 25 years in prison. You've been in prison now for...

We're calling from a federal prison. You've been in prison now for a decade? Yeah, over 10 years. He went in at age 25 and he'll come out when he's 50. When you meet new people, how do you explain what happened to Danny? When I meet new people, I don't usually talk about my son. I think that's a way of sort of protecting myself because I find that every time I mention him, everything keeps coming back. And that affects me a lot emotionally. I mean, physically, I've had to stop driving because I'm

very nervous. So I try to put it, I wouldn't say on the back burner, but just out there somewhere where it doesn't affect, you know, like my job and the things that I have to do. Reversed-in cases often carry long prison sentences because the defendant is charged for the full quantity of the imaginary drugs, and drug charges often have mandatory minimums. Add a gun or a previous conviction into the mix, and you're looking at a very long time behind bars. From the government's point of view, what are they hoping to achieve? Is the whole point here getting dangerous people off the streets, stopping the crime before it could potentially start? These people, they see in their heads, these people might not have committed the crime yet, but they're on their way to committing the crime.

And this way we can stop them before any more harm is done. Yes, that's the argument, that these are people who, frankly, did agree to commit the crime, right? They did show up on that last day. They did bring weapons. They were able to find guns, either in their possession already or through the black market. And so these are people who, because they are legally guilty of offenses, possession of a gun, conspiracy charges, they deserve to be punished. It's a different question, I think, to say, is this how we want to catch criminals? Is this how we want to punish people and imprison people?

It's a different type of policing to suggest that we should catch people who are about to commit crimes or we know are very close to committing crimes or will commit crimes versus who can we tempt to commit a crime. You got to find yourself a routine because there's nothing set. I mean, you wake up, you know, breakfast maybe at 6 o'clock in the morning, and then from there you may, I personally go to work out. I get my hour of work out in in the morning, then I come back and, you know, get to my e-mails and things of that nature. You know, you get leisure time and things of that nature. I mean, three hops and a cat is what they tell you. That's pretty much the only thing that's guaranteed here.

Three meals and a bed. Yeah, pretty much. In prison, Danny has spent a lot of his time reading legal books and trying to find ways to appeal his case. He also started a website called reversing.org where he's collected testimonials from other men in his situation. Is there anyone else there at your same facility that's been charged with the same thing? Actually, I have an individual that I'm a roommate with.

I'm in a 12-man dorm, and one of the individuals that I'm here is from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and he just recently received 15 years for the same type of crime. Do you ever think about what if you had gotten kind of a last-minute text message or phone call from your girlfriend saying, hey, I need you to come? I mean, if something had happened and you hadn't taken that drive. It is what it is, harboring ill will and sitting here and stressing myself out about what has happened is not going to get me anywhere. I continue to fight.

I continue to improve myself mentally, physically, spiritually. And I just continue to make myself a better person so that when I get out there, I'm prepared to make better decisions at the end of the day. I would imagine sitting where you are to dwell on what could have happened would actually maybe drive you crazy. I mean, yeah, I mean, a lot of things could drive me crazy. The fact that, you know, I have a niece and a nephew that lot of things could drive me crazy. The fact that, you know, I have a niece and a nephew that I've never spent any time with. The fact that I'm not there to help my mother out financially or to, you know, be there and spend time with my brothers or my family and not be able to pursue my dreams. And there's so many things that I could think about that could

sit here and, you know, agitate me and drive me crazy. But, you know, I choose not to dwell on that. His mother Alita visits him as much as possible, and they talk on the phone every single day. My thing is, God knows why this happened. Let him be the judge. Let him be the one that decides what's going to happen in Danny's case and in everybody else's case that was involved, particularly that CI that set him up. Do you have fantasies ever about the day that he gets out and what you'll do on that first day?

Constantly. Constantly I see him coming in through that door and that's what I pray God, you know, to let me live enough to see that day when he walks through this door. And there will be a party that weekend. Definitely will be a big party. We're looking forward to that. Criminal is produced by Lauren Sporer and me, engineering help from Rob Byers and Russ Henry. Julianne Alexander makes original illustrations for each episode of Criminal. You can see them at thisiscriminal.com. Criminal is recorded in the studios of North Carolina Public Radio, WUNC. We're a proud member of Radiotopia from PRX, a collective of the 13 best podcasts around, shows like Radio Diaries.

Criminal listeners might especially enjoy their episode, Serving 9 to 5, in which they give tape recorders to prison guards at the Polk Youth Institution here in North Carolina. It's a fascinating behind-the-scenes look at what it's like to spend so much of your life behind bars, because that's how you pay your bills. Go listen. Radiotopia from PRX is supported by the Knight Foundation and MailChimp, celebrating creativity, chaos, and teamwork. I'm Phoebe Chutch. This is Criminal. Radiotopia. From PRX.

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