Culture & Christianity: The Allen Jackson Podcast - What They Won't Tell You About Abortion [Featuring Victoria Robinson]

Episode Date: July 26, 2024

“When I was driving to that abortion clinic, I had my hand on my stomach, saying, ‘Forgive me for what I'm about to do to you, because this is the best choice for you, and for your sisters, and for me. You don't want to be brought into this mess of my life.’ But it's easy to be manipulated, Pastor, when we are in the most vulnerable times of our lives. And that's what the abortion industry banks on: manipulating women and coercing them into believing what I believed,” Victoria Robinson told Pastor Allen during this podcast. Victoria Robinson is the Founder and CEO of Reassemble, an organization that strives to help women, men, and couples recover from the trauma of abortion and find healing through the redemptive power of Jesus Christ. Robinson shares her testimony and speaks boldly about the lies men and women have been told by the abortion industry. Potential Democratic Presidential Nominee, Kamala Harris, believes that murdering an unborn child is a “right” every American woman should have. The Church has been strangely silent on the issue of abortion while sixty million children have been lost. Discover the ugly truths of the abortion industry, and how you can make an impact. More Information: Reassemble: https://www.reassemblelife.com/__ It's up to us to bring God’s truth back into our culture. It may feel like an impossible assignment, but there’s much we can do. Join Pastor Allen Jackson as he discusses today’s issues from a biblical perspective. Find thought-provoking insight from Pastor Allen and his guests, equipping you to lead with your faith in your home, your school, your community, and wherever God takes you. Listen on Spotify: https://bit.ly/3Wl42oRListen on Apple Podcasts: https://bit.ly/3YldHyi

I believe I have my own theory. I think that some of these politicians are paid under the table, and they have nice big boats and big houses from the multi-billion-dollar abortion industry. And let's, you know, pedophilia, all of the things that we don't have time to talk about, that all are lumped together because many of my clients have been sex trafficked and forced into abortions. But they still go through the same trauma because those were their children. Well, very good. I want to welcome you to culture and Christianity.

I have a very special guest today. Victoria Robinson is going to help us. You know, this whole notion that our faith has to be lived out in the context of our culture is the essential idea, not just of this podcast, but of ministry. And so, Victoria, we are very glad to have you with us today. Thank you for joining us. Oh, thanks for having me. You're a Middle Tennessee person.

I am. So I understand your accent. That's helpful for me. I was born in Hickory, North Carolina. You were? I was, and then we moved away from there and moved around a lot. So I didn't pick up that accent, but apparently I have some kind of accent because I hear that a lot. No, it's not very heavy.

No. No, I go home to Hickory sometimes and see friends and they'll say, Vicki, you don't talk like us. It's because I moved away. Very good. Well, you have written a couple of books, and we'll jump right in because they're really the kind of the topic that we want to unpack today. The first one was they lied to us. Do you want to tell us what the theme of that is?

I will leak it, but I'll let you jump right in there, okay? Okay. They lied to us as a book that I wrote about 15 years ago that has stories from women who chose abortion, why they chose, why they felt obligated to choose, why they felt there was no other option. My own story is in there as well. And think chicken soup for the soul,

kind of different stories of women, and I wanted them to each share so that a woman that's considering abortion could read one of their stories and possibly relate to them. and that book is in its fifth print now. I think that book has saved tens of thousands of children that I won't know about until I get to heaven. That's awesome. What a heritage.

So the essence of this is abortion really is the topic that you've been willing to carry the flag for. Correct. And spend time and energy trying to awaken people really to the horror of that and what it represents. You know, the bag drop around that is since Roe v. Wade and the Supreme Court found a right that's not in our Constitution, and we have lost tens of millions of children. It's become a scourge on our nation, but over such a lengthy period of time now, it's been baked into the mindset of our nation, tragically even into the Christian community. Correct. And so we're having to come back with some humility. and really look at this from a biblical perspective and not just a convenience issue

or what we have cultural permission for. Thankfully, the Supreme Court has changed their mind, so we're no longer arguing that it's just the law of the land. You know, we used to hide behind that as if it were legal, it meant it was godly. We did. And you're correct when you say the church as well. Oh, absolutely. The church has as much blood on their hands as our government.

Yeah, and I've spent my professional life in the church. So when I talk about the church, I at least have an informed opinion. I may not be the only authority. And when you say that, abortion has been almost as prevalent statistically within the Christian community as it has been within the secular culture. Correct. Yeah, I've lived it. I've seen it in my work that I do with abortion recovery for those people who have chosen abortion that are dealing with the trauma. And many of them were sitting in churches pregnant with abortion appointments.

they were too afraid to tell their parents, or they were fearful of the shame they were going to feel in the church because sex outside of marriage was the greatest sin, and if you're pregnant and you're not married, you're going to hell. So these young women that come through my retreats that I now do for women and men who have abortion trauma, they sit there and tell me, my father was a pastor, and he drove me to a different state so that no one would know.

And now her father's dealing with the ramifications of that choice. I had a pastor in my men's retreat recently who had two abortions in his past from college. And he said he had to get out of the ministry because he felt like a fraud because he'd never even confessed his abortion. So there are so many people wounded that are in the church. And that's why, pastor, I tell pastors like yourself, if we're not speaking about the abortion issue, if we're not speaking against the sin of abortion, you have people in your church that are sitting there pregnant considering an abortion. thinking it must be okay because my pastor's never addressed it. Or those men and women who've already chosen abortion are internalizing that to mean

that is the one sin. Jesus won't forgive because my pastor won't even talk about it. And so they live in that shame and in that guilt. And what I love to remind them of is that Christ died on the cross, not just for their unborn children that were aborted, but also for them. Amen. Well, I really want to walk through all of that while we have this. time together. When I say all of that, I mean the reality of it being ungodly, but also the reality of the shame, the after effects of that, because they are real. And it isn't adequate just to condemn

a behavior. We have to point people towards the redemptive power of the cross without being sloppy in our expressions of grace. Because if you willingly do things that you know are wicked, there's consequences that are coming, and I don't believe those are mitigated. So we can't misuse that. But before that, this is more personal to you. Abortion is a part of your journey. So it's not just a theoretical study that you've picked up. You know, can you tell us a bit more about your own journey?

Because I know this is something, Revelation says, we overcome Satan by the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony. And I don't think there's anything more profound than our own God stories. I agree with you. And I have mine. I have several. I was a single mother with two little girls that were nine months old and three because my husband decided he didn't want to be married anymore.

So he left when they were babies. And I went from working part-time to working now full-time, two jobs to take care of them because there was no support coming from him emotionally, financially. So I had to do what I had to do. At my second job, I met someone who said all the right things to me. and I was already this broken girl whose husband had abandoned her, went from North Carolina to California and got as far away from us as he could. So it was easy for me to believe that he loved me and that he wanted to marry me one day.

So I started a relationship with him, and nine months later I was pregnant. I was very shocked, and I was ashamed. I wasn't married, and I was already struggling with the two babies I had. So my boyfriend at the time convinced me abortion was, the best option for us. We could have children later, but not now. And then the woman Helena at the abortion clinic in Charlotte, North Carolina, told me the same thing. She said you'd be a really selfish mother to your little girls if you tried to have another child to feed when you can barely feed them. So I believed all of the lies, which is why I named the book they lied to us.

And I drove myself to an abortion clinic on a Saturday morning after paying the babysitter and leaving my babies there and lied and said I was going to. shopping. And the woman I was who walked into that abortion clinic was not the same one that walked out. I said to the woman, Helena, are you sure this is the right thing? I've got two children. I know the outcome of a pregnancy, and I was weeping. And she said, you're so early in this pregnancy. There's nothing there but a blob of tissue. And you can have more children later. You're so young. Remember what I told you'd be really selfish to do this to your little girls? And do you think our government would allow it to be legal if it could harm you in any way. So when you leave here,

never think of it again. And it's the only thing I thought about for decade until I got help. And it still is it some days. You know, I tell people that go through abortion recovery just because Jesus heals us, you were talking about consequences, pastor, you know, if a girl that has premarital sex is pregnant and she goes to the altar and says, Lord, forgive me for my sin, he forgives her, but she's still pregnant. There are consequences to everything we do, including choosing abortion. That never goes away, but we can walk in freedom and redemption, which is what I found 10 years post-abortion. I went to a recovery retreat for women like me, and it changed my life. And I told the ladies that were facilitating, please show me and teach me what you just did for me so I can offer this

same help to other women. Every woman needs to know Jesus loves her. and he can forgive even abortion. Absolutely. And that was 28 years ago. That's awesome. But you said a couple of things that I think are worth just a moment. You had delivered two babies. You had two beautiful little girls.

I did. And you still presented for an abortion. I think the average, I think without thinking, we imagine that most people having an abortion don't understand pregnancy. So when they say it's not a life, well, if you've carried children to term, you understand that's a living person there. Correct.

And yet statistically, a very high percentage of people having abortions have delivered, I mean, have carried children to term. Yes, they have. And I'll tell you, when I was driving to that abortion clinic, I had my hand on my stomach saying to this blob of tissue, forgive me for what I'm about to do to you, because this is the best choice for you and for your sisters and for me. You don't want to be brought into this mess of my life.

but it's easy to be manipulated, Pastor, when we are in the most vulnerable time of our lives. And that's what the abortion industry banks on, manipulating women and coercing them into believing. What I believed, I truly believed when that woman looked at me and said, you're only six weeks pregnant. There's nothing there, which were lies. If I had had an ultrasound, I would have seen my baby's heartbeat. But I believed her because I needed to believe her. I was in a desperate situation. I was struggling. So I wasn't ever, not a bad mother, although I believed that for a long time afterwards. I always thought I was a good mother until I actually did that. It's interesting that the enemy will tell us, you know, no one's going to know.

This is the best choice for you. Think about your little girls at home who need you. You can't bring another baby to feed when you can't take care of them. You know this is the best choice. And she said it's just a blob of tissue. And as soon as I got on that elevator after, I allowed them to kill my baby. The voices were different. It was what a horrible woman you are.

What a horrible mother. No one's going to trust you to be around their children. You killed your own baby. So that's how the enemy works. He convinces us of one thing. And then others are right there to chime in and manipulate. And we believe sometimes what we need to believe until someone tells us different. And that's what's beautiful about abortion recovery.

So people can understand he loves you. You made a bad decision, but he can use your life and take what the enemy meant for evil and turn it into good because that's what he's done for me. Well, that's the beauty of the redemptive work of Jesus. No matter what our story, whether it's immorality or murder or whatever, the blood of Jesus is sufficient. And we don't have to live with shame and guilt. We can be free. Yeah. Thank God.

And that's as an important message for the church to deliver as it is to deliver that abortion is wrong or sexual immorality. is wrong. I just walked through in recent weeks the death of my mother. And I know from personal experience lately that when your heart stops beating, they recognize it as the end of life.

Well, if we recognize your heart not beating as the end of life, it seems to me only fair that we recognize when your heart is beating, it's the beginning of life. Yeah. You would think, but they've twisted it all around in this multi-billion-dollar business called abortion. They have twisted everything around to convince people that it isn't a life.

And even as you just said, and I was the mother who'd already had two children, when I looked back after I left that day, I thought, how, Vic, how could you have believed that? You have two babies at home. How did you believe that? Because I needed to believe it, because of the fear that I was walking in, of how am I going to do this? So it was easy to believe the lies rather than the truth that there were other options. I just wasn't presented with those other options. Well, I'd like to tell you that I think you're uniquely blackhearted and far more coarse and callous, but I don't believe that. I think all of us have an amazing ability to justify our ungodliness. You know, as you tell your story, a part that I heard really clearly was the father

of that child encouraging you to have the abortion. And, you know, and for the men listening to this, folks. This is not just a women's issue. We practice immorality. We are, I don't think you should imagine yourself a Christ follower. If you practice immorality, you're unrepentant. I don't care where you sit on Sunday morning or how many verses you can quote. We've got to have a sense of repentance and humility. And we have taken too many cues from our culture. If we took cultural cues that abortion's okay. We've taken much broader cultural cues that the biblical perspective on human sexuality is out of date and therefore we have a great deal more license. We don't. God has not revisited the topic. You know, I want to tell you some about the men. I'm glad you brought

them up. After I had the abortion, we broke up within nine months. So, you know, nine out of ten times when an abortion occurs, couples don't make it. So girls are having abortions to keep their husbands, keep their boyfriends. It's too traumatic of an experience. So being around each other, it's a reminder of what you did. I never looked at him the same. He was supposed to protect me. I knew that internally.

And he never looked at me the same because I think he had to have asked himself, I can't believe she actually did it. So our relationship crumbled. It was 10 years later before I went through abortion recovery. And after I had gone through it, I was writing my first book, They Lied to Us, and I called him.

We knew a lot of the same people in the same circles, but we never had run into each other all these years. And I called him to tell him about the book because I didn't want him to feel that I outed him, that I changed the story. No one would know it was him unless they knew we were together at the time. When I called him, I said, hey, it's me. He started crying.

He could not even speak. And I was shocked. And when he composed himself, he said, Vic, I've been waiting for this call for over a decade. to beg you forgiveness for what I made you do. It's haunted me all these years, and I've been in therapy for eight years dealing with it. I should have protected you and our baby,

and I failed you both. Can you ever forgive me? Please forgive me. And in that moment, two things happened, Pastor. The first thing was I thought, I haven't fully forgotten caring and forgiveness towards this man. And I said, yes, I forgive you. And in that moment, I just felt like my healing came full circle,

because that's part of it of healing is forgiving. And the second thing I felt Holy Spirit speak to my heart so clearly was don't forget these fathers. It is not just women who are hurting and affected by abortion. These babies have fathers who are hurting. And from that moment on, I have always, wherever I've spoke at a church, at a conference, a podcast, wherever it is, I always speak about the men

because they have been emasculated to the point in this country, when it comes to the issue of abortion and other issues to stand in the corner, keep your mouth shut because it's not your body your choice, but it's not her body either. So what I challenge men to do is step up and be the men God created you to be. One man said to me who's 60 years old,

my greatest regret in life, Victoria, is that I didn't fight for my unborn child. The only child I ever had, I allowed my wife, they're divorced now, but I allowed my wife when we were in college to kill our baby. He said, she told him, I'm not going to give up law school for this baby. And I kept my mouth shut because I believed I wasn't, I had no right to say anything.

Now I've never known all these years if I could have saved that child's life because I didn't speak up. Men must speak up. They must do the right thing. And so I was able to forgive him. He was able to receive forgiveness. It changed his life. It changed my life. And that's why the second book, They Lie to Us Too, is all the story.

stories from men. I spoke at a men's conference one, and they'd once, and they'd never had a woman come to speak, and they invited me to speak, and I shared in detail a lot about my story with my ex-boyfriend, the father, and the men stood in line for two and a half hours waiting to talk to me, and many of them said, you're the first person I've ever told. Now I know why I can't connect with my children. Now I know why I'm a workaholic. Now I know why I've went to alcohol. Now I know why I can't commit to a woman. All of these things because they were dealing with the shame and the trauma of their children dying and they did nothing.

Men were not created to not protect their women. God created women to nurture and give life. So when a woman realizes what she's done, it's devastating to her. Our job is to nurture is to bring life into the world. But a man's job is to protect his women, his teeth. his children. So when he comes to that same realization, he is just as devastated. So we cannot ever forget the men, the millions and millions of men who are sitting in churches week after week. And I just did a men's retreat here in Leepers Fork, and it was full. And when I was asked to do a men's retreat,

I said, why would I do a men's retreat? I'm a single woman. I have no business spending a weekend with a bunch of men. And two different pastors said, of course you wouldn't spend the stay there overnight. you leave and go off campus, but you need to lead these sessions, Victoria, because you represent the women they hurt. And these men need to hear from a woman that she forgives them and that she wants to help them walk through.

So I have men that work with me at these men's retreats. Well, the last one that I did on the first night, pastor, on the way there, I said to the Lord, what have I done? Why did I agree to do this? These men aren't going to say anything.

They're not even going to talk. Men don't speak. What am I going to do? do all weekend. I'm going to have to talk to these guys all weekend. From Thursday night when we began the retreat, and we end on Sunday, they never shut up. They just started pouring out their hearts and just I sat back and just wept thinking that I almost said no to this because I thought this is ridiculous. And those men told me on Sunday, I'm going home a different husband and a different father because I have finally dealt with this sin from my past. So it's a beautiful thing. And I just

want pastors and people to understand in the churches that one out of four people sitting there has had an abortion in their past. And they want to be involved in ministries, but they feel like they're not equipped because they've never even told their secret. Yeah, secrets kill us. Yeah. I loved you. I liked your comment a lot about how forgiveness came to you, not in one fell swoop. But as you continue to say yes to the Lord and the Holy Spirit is so gentle and so faithful to continue to show us those places where we have to continue to forgive. And we find we have this, I find this not just around this topic, but in spiritual formation in general, we want to so desperately say we're mature. So we want to say, well, I've achieved that or

accomplished that or I've finished that. And in my life, forgiving and all of those things is an ongoing process. You know, the events may be in the distant past. Correct. But I still bump into nuances of those memories that bring real emotions to me, and I need to forgive or release or repent. And it's not a one-time event. It's not.

And so I think that's such an important point for those people listening. If you'll cooperate with the Spirit of God, he continues to bring greater freedom to you. Because when you're carrying things you shouldn't carry, you don't have the capacity to carry what God needs you to. Exactly. Yes. And it's freedom. I mean, I'm sure you've heard that unforgiveness is like drinking poison, expecting the other person to die. I tell people all the time, you're only hurting yourself. If you don't forgive, you might, I got to forgive. Yes, yes. You have to forgive him too and her too and all of them. Yes, he did. It wasn't a suggestion. It was a command. And so yes, if you want to walk in true freedom, it may be a daily occurrence, like you said. I have,

I still have to forgive our government for allowing the slaughter of over 80 million babies in this country since Roe v. Wade. I never thought I'd see Roe overturned in my lifetime. Never. And I've been doing this for 28 years. So I had to get on my knees and say, sorry, Lord, oh, ye of little faith. But praise God for it. And I had pastors, pastor, not like you, who said to me, simmer down, Vic. Come on, Victoria, you keep posting about this. We get it. You're excited. that Roe was overturned, but you've got to realize there are people that are terrified. I'm like, are you joking? Who, what Bible are you reading that you're not going to celebrate what God just did?

This is a miracle that we are seeing in our lifetime, and you're telling me to simmer down. I'm never going to shut up about the fact that Roe was overturned. I'm never going to stop praising God for that, because that is a miracle just like Trump moving his head. That's a good analogy. But I think this whole notion that the church, The line they use is we shouldn't be political or we're being political. You should hush. Yes.

And there's tremendous hypocrisy in that. You know, if you were willing to say out loud that George Floyd's death was inappropriate, you weren't being political, you were being chic. Correct. If you said Mr. Trump was immoral and he frequented prostitutes, you weren't being political, you were being biblical. Correct. But if you say abortion is evil and should not be supported by the federal government

and sponsored by our tax dollars, you're being political and you should shut up. Yes, exactly. I'm over it. I know. If you don't have a better argument than you're being political, you don't have an argument.

The sanctity of human life is not a political discussion. It's a worldview issue. It is. And it's a human rights issue. I mean, it infuriates me, honestly. I feel like God's called me to antagonize some religious people.

I was speaking at a church. I was speaking at a church in North Carolina that one of the biggest churches in that area in February. and this is a pastor like you are who speaks the truth without apology. He's an incredible guy. And he invited me to come speak.

And I spoke at all three services. And in line were people from his church waiting to speak with me or to get a book or, unbeknownst to him. He just thought, oh, they just want to say hi to you because you brought a great message. They were telling me they'd had abortions in their past. Men, women, couples. So after the third service on Sunday, he came to me and he had teachers. years in his eyes and said, I had no idea. He said, I had no idea. He tells me this, that we had this many people in our church who've had abortions in their past. I said, oh, pastor, they're in

every church in this country. You're just brave enough to bring someone like me in to talk about it. They are sitting, dying, waiting for their pastors to tell them, abortion is wrong, but Jesus loves you and forgives you if you've already chosen. And this keeps girls out of the abortion clinic that are coming from the church. And it keeps those sitting there afraid to get up running to the altar saying, can he really forgive that? Yes. So let's pray for you. And we're going to show you what Jesus is going to do because I promise you if you give him a shot, he'll show up. So there are those pastors like yourself that are making a difference. But I'm going to say it because it's the truth. Unfortunately, you guys are a minority.

Well, and there are people like yourself, women like yourself, that are willing to stand up and tell the truth. You know, it seems unimaginable to me that women don't defend their children. I know. You know, it's a little more available, I guess, in my thinking, that men are so selfish and self-absorbed and so ungodly that they don't accept responsibility. Correct. And as heinous as that is, and as loudly as I'm willing to bark about that. I think the women's voices on this issue, because for decades now, women's rights has been so front and center, and the opportunities, and with rights come responsibilities. And so it's refreshing to hear your story.

But a couple of things I want to touch before we run out of time. One is abortion is targeted towards some subsets of our culture disproportionately. And that's tragic and unfortunate. And, you know, Margaret Sanger, who started Planned Parenthood, did it with a very dark objective, even darker than abortion. She did, and all you have to do is go look it up. That's why I don't understand. People have access to the Internet. All you have to do is go look up some of her interviews, and she talks about that very same thing.

And that's why I don't understand how Christians, not just others, but Christians as well support Planned Parenthood or abortion. And then they want to talk about the race issue in the next breath. They speak out of ignorance. And I say that with all due respect. They're not stupid people. They're ignorant. We have to believe they're ignorant. Otherwise, it's too dark.

It's unacceptable either way. But there are those that know. and they still, you know, our current vice president knows, and she's still pushing the abortion issue. There are a lot of people who still know the truth, and they're still pushing it. Yeah, I want to pick that up, because as we're having this conversation,

President Biden has said he's not running for re-election. And at the moment, the most likely replacement, it seems, at the top of the ticket, is Vice President Harris. and I heard multiple reports, including her own, that she thinks being pro-abortion with no limits is the ticket that will get her to the White House. That is so deeply offensive, it's difficult to say. It is.

That the privilege of murdering our children up to the point of delivery will have broad enough support that it's a winning political strategy. You know, my friend Charlie Daniels before he went to heaven, He said all a politician wants a vote. And politicians, I know there's exceptions, but tend to form their worldviews based on what will garner the most votes. It's unacceptable to me that Vice President Harris at the moment,

that would be the lead plank in her platform. It will be. And what's going to really open the eyes of this country, especially Christians, I would hope, is how many votes she's going to get because of it. I've been doing this a long time. And I remember when I first got saved in 1993 and I read the scripture that the road is narrow

and few will find it. And I thought it was a typo. I was like, Lord, this can't be true. Look at the church. It's full. Now all these years later, decades later as a Christian, being involved in the pro-life issues like I have for 28 years, I get it.

I think some prisons are going to empty when Jesus comes back and some of the churches are going to be full. I have seen it and I have had pastors look me in the eye and say, Victoria, I love what you do. I've heard you speak. I love how you bring a word and a message. But if I bring you to my church, you're going to offend my pro-choice church members,

and we can't do that. How are they going to hear about Jesus every week if they leave the church? And I look at them and go, really, why do you have pro-choice people sitting in your pews week after week after week? I get it when they first come. but what are you doing to convert them to pro-life? What are you doing talking? Are you talking even about the sin of abortion?

And they're not. And they'll, well, you don't understand Mr. So-and-so. He's a big wig in the church. And I said, well, did he pay for the carpet? Tell him to pick it up and take it with him when he leaves. You're going to answer to somebody a lot bigger than me, buddy. And you better start preaching against sin. And it's not just abortion.

They don't want to preach against any sin because they won't be popular. And we wonder why the country's in this condition. Pastor, there's a church on every corner in this country. And we're still having a candidate who's going to get a lot of votes because she believes in killing children up to birth. And we thought Joe Biden was bad, Mr. Catholic, but he is. She's worse. Yeah, I think the challenge we face is, I use the term generic Christian.

If you don't declare yourself to be Buddhist or Muslim or agnostic, and you're born into a family that sometimes visit the church. You're by definition, you're a cultural Christian. It's generic Christianity. But you've never really reconciled the lordship of Jesus. Because once you establish Jesus is Lord, it's no longer my life and my preference and my schedule. That's right. I have to accept the values and the parameters that come from the king in the kingdom that I have been ushered into.

Yes. And so I don't get to decide what I think is moral and immoral. I don't get to choose. I have to submit to the king or I have to process that with him. And tragically, we've lost that message in the church. Yes. You know, we've had kind of a gospel of salvation where if you'll say this little prayer and get dipped in a pool,

then you can live however you want to live. Yeah. And once in a while, you kind of look up and go, I'm kind of sorry, as if God is just, we can mock him. I know. It's heartbreaking. And I don't mean to bash the churches. I'm trying to challenge the churches.

Some of them I would like to bash. Some of these pastors like to smack them in the face if I could. And I'm not a violent person, but they infuriate me because I look at them and think you've got a congregation of people that you think you're going to offend. They need it desperately to hear the truth. This country wants to hear the truth. And Christians that are calling themselves Christians, how are we doing them a service? by letting them believe a lie. So when people ask me, well, what about this, though, Victoria?

What about this, Victoria? And they're claiming to be Christians. I just look at them. And my favorite thing that I say now is, well, what does the Bible say? It doesn't matter what I say. What does the Bible say? Show me in the Bible where it says that's okay. And then, you know, I might come to your side.

And we can all find obtuse passages that we don't have easy answers for. Correct. That's true. But there's so much that I do understand. that I can live out. Yes. Let's just stop arguing about the things we don't understand and go practice the ones that we do.

Yeah, and how about just common sense? Now you're getting radical. I mean, come on. Yeah, I think it is radical. It's insane. I turned 60 years old last week. I have four daughters and 12 grandchildren. And when people ask me now,

Roe was overturned, why you're still out there running your mouth and whatever, I'm like, because when I look at those grandchildren, from 15 years old down to three months, I want them to say one day, Armimi fought the good fight, and Armimi taught us right from wrong.

And even when she was coming under attack and getting death threats, she still said, I'm willing to die on this hill. And Christians better be willing to die on this hill because there could come a day they're going to have to. Well, and the tragedy of this is the overturning of Roe really has not turned down significantly the number of abortions. Well, because of the abortion pill.

Girls are getting the abortion pill. They're getting abortion by mail. In the state of Tennessee, we don't have abortion, but they're getting them by mail. They're illegally having pills mail to them. I just had a client who delivered her 12 and a half week old in her toilet in Clarksville, Tennessee. And they told her there was nothing there. All she would see were clumps of tissue. And she held her little boy in her hands.

And then they said, flush it down the toilet. And before she flushed him down the toilet, she said, made me take a picture. And she took a picture of him. And this was two years ago. And she said to me at my retreat, I've had this in my phone, Victoria, and I look at it every day. I said, you need to get that off your phone. You've got to walk in forgiveness. The enemy will use that to keep you sucked in into that depression. So she said, but what should I do? Why did I take this picture? And I told her, maybe the Lord's going to use his life to help somebody and show the truth about abortion. So she sent it to me and emailed the pictures to me and I sent it to someone who we didn't

interview with last week. And I never looked at it because I didn't even want to look at it. Because I see enough. And when I saw the picture as I was emailing it, that little boy is looking right at you. That's the truth and the reality of abortion. And that's what these girls are dealing with in their own homes, pastor. We're going to have a mental health issue like we have never seen before in the next couple to five years because these girls are being lied to and they're seeing their intact children when they said it won't be anything but like a heavy period. The abortion industry is a wicked multi-billion dollar industry that needs to be shut down.

It's a for-profit industry. 100%. It has nothing to do with women's rights. Just like so much of the transgender thing with our teenagers and young people. It's all about money. It's a profit. That's the bottom line. Planned parenthood is pivoted into that as well.

They have. They don't want to miss the opportunity to cause great harm for profit. Yes, that's true. So they're still destroying children. It's an insatiable appetite, these people, and some politicians to kill children. And I believe I have my own theory. I think that some of these politicians are paid under the table, and they have nice big boats and big houses from the multi-billion-dollar abortion industry.

and let's, you know, pedophilia, all of the things that we don't have time to talk about, that all are lumped together because many of my clients have been sex trafficked and forced into abortions, but they still go through the same trauma because those were their children when they come to me asking for help. And I don't see, I can't even keep up, pastor, I can't keep up. So the Lord's been using me now to train others to do what I do because I said, Lord, I'm one person. I can't, how do I duplicate myself here? So pregnancy centers like the one here, Portico, they brought me in and I trained them to do weekend model retreats for women. I do them now for men and even couples, couples who aborted their children together that beat the odds and stayed married are now coming to my retreats at my couple's retreats.

And the Lord's not just changing them and healing them individually from the choice. He's healing their marriages. He's in the business of reconciliation and redemption. and I believe we have an army of people, pastor, millions of people that when they find healing from just this sin of abortion alone, it's the backdoor approach to ending abortion. Because you said earlier, you'd love to hear more women speaking out. There aren't a lot of me speaking out because of the shame. But when they go through healing, their identity is no longer in that abortion.

Their identity is in Christ. So that's when they're able to share. You know, I think we've got to wrap this up. We're going to run out of time. Maybe you'll come back. I'd love to anytime. Okay. We're neighbors.

Yeah, we are. But you know, the line that has been used to cover so much of this is our body, our choice, or my body, my choice. And I mean, that's been echoed so many times until we got to COVID. And all of a sudden, it's my body, but it was no longer my choice. You don't want to get me started. You had to be vaccinated or you'd lose your job. You had to wear a mask or you'd lose your job. You had to do all these other things.

the blatant hypocrisy of that. So I don't want to hear about my choice and it's my body and it's sacred. They don't believe that when it suits their purposes. So we can have the courage to stand up and say no. That's ungodly. I don't want to be a part of it. Yeah, lies. There's so much more about this that we can talk about.

My guest is Victoria Robinson. She has a couple of books. They're great resources. They lied to us and they lied to us two. I suppose we can find those any place we find our books. Yes. Amazon bought my publishing company, so that's the best place to get them unless I'm at your church or event. I'll bring them with me. Well, I thank you for your courage and your boldness and your determination. Thank you. Thanks for having me. We have a little phrase around here that we will not stop. And on this topic, we will not

stop. Thank you. Hey, thanks for joining me today. Before you go, please like the podcast and leave a comment, more people can hear about this topic too. If you haven't yet, be sure to subscribe to Alan Jackson Ministries YouTube channel and follow the Culture and Christianity podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Together, let's learn how to lead with our faith and change our culture. I'll see you next time.