Daisie Dates - EP25| Are we throwing the ICK in the bin?

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hello, welcome back to the Daisy Dates podcast. I'm Daisy and I chat all things dating, love, celebrating love, navigating relationships and everything that comes in between that. Today I'm joined with Lauren Josephine, a long-time dater turned dating and relationships author, which is iconic. Hello, thank you for joining me. Thank you, Daisy, for having me. I'm so excited when you reach out to me. I love your content and I'm so excited to talk all things dating with you. Absolutely. I mean, I love your content. Every time I read, I read some of these like reels that you post and the carousels, I'm like, ah, that's me or it still is me or it was me and

Starting point is 00:00:51 I need to work on it. It's great. I've usually been starting with a this or that, but I'm just going to do some quick fire questions to change it up a little bit. So just three quick questions, kind of the first thing that the first kind of point that comes to your mind. And the first one is how many dates have you been on throughout your 20s and 30s? Oh, over 200. I don't have an exact number, but it was a lot. I love it. And what was the funniest part of dating for you? The funnest part? Yeah, I think it was like when I was able to filter better, I started meeting some really great men and just like having fun experiences with them, like picnic dates, like we went camping together. And even though it didn't work out, it was nice to see that dating

Starting point is 00:01:38 could just be like fun and pleasant. And what did you find was the worst part for you generally? present. And what did you find was the worst part for you generally? The worst part was definitely dealing with things like ghosting, breadcrumbing, rejection. I definitely struggled a lot with dating and the emotional aspect of it. So it was probably more difficult than it was fun, to be honest, but lots of learning. Okay, well, I think we're going to get into the rejection part a little bit later with some tips on how you can deal with that, because that has to be one of the worst parts and taking it personally is just the worst. But first, after all of that dating that you did yourself and the highs and the lows, what made you want to then kind of write about it about the modern dating struggles? Yeah, so as I mentioned, I just struggled so much

Starting point is 00:02:27 with it. And for most of my dating career, I felt really alone in that struggle because I would see people around me seemingly using the apps and going on dates and not really getting as frustrated and down as I got. And then at the end of 2021, I had sort of like a final straw that broke the camel's back experience with this guy who love bombed me and then pulled away. And I was 32. And I just remember like feeling at a rock bottom. And I was like, you know what? I am going to quit the dating apps and I'm going to pursue my passion.

Starting point is 00:03:03 I'm going to write about dating. So that was kind of the turning point for me. How has it, how has it been so far, you know, having this book now, people able to buy it from you? How does that feel? Oh my God, it feels so amazing. I mean, writing a book, I knew it was one of my life goals, like kind of starting in my early twenties, but I had no idea what I would write a whole book about. So just watching it like become a reality has been so special, mostly because the people that reach out to me and say like, wow, thank you for validating my experience. Like I can relate to so much in your book and it feels so good to know I'm not alone. Like those types of messages and feedback that I get just like fill my heart and

Starting point is 00:03:45 soul so deeply yeah it's a weird one because dating is like quite a lonely thing really if you don't have a group of friends whether like that's a group of girls or whatever that are dating alongside you with you can feel really lonely and I think it always feels like when you're dating everyone else in a relationship or getting married and babies and then the I find that the circle of life pivots and now the people that I know that are in relationships other people have broken up with people and they've come out of their relationships and it's everyone's just at different stages all of the time and I think it is really important to remember that that everyone is going through the same thing and I think when you're dating you just constantly think it's you yeah it's just such a horrible feeling you've touched on so many things with your reels and

Starting point is 00:04:31 your carousels like I mentioned that definitely describe me now one that stood out was quite a recent one that you did actually and this was when you kind of spoke about digging into your kind of deeper avoidant feelings, getting that kind of ick feeling with people. And I really want to talk about this because this is quite a common thing that comes up on my TikTok and people asking questions like, how, you know, how do you know when it's right to walk away from an ick? How do you know if it is an ick? And we throw that term around a lot. We throw ick around. I'm not, I think lots of people have different definitions, but can you just talk this out with us, this kind of avoidant ick feelings

Starting point is 00:05:11 that you felt and how you overcame that? Yeah, absolutely. I think it is such a more common experience than I even realized. Like when I was writing the post, I think what can happen is when you are dating on the dating apps and you're kind of so used to the flakiness and the ghosting and sort of that feeling of having to like chase people and never having enough reciprocation that when you meet someone who is secure and into you and there's not like a lot of confusion, it almost flips you the opposite way where you start to wonder and get the ick about it. And you're kind of saying like, oh, like, why are they so into me? And it's such a strange phenomenon. And I noticed that when I met my partner, who's very healthy, secure into me, that I started to just like almost self-sabotage and look for ways that he was flawed

Starting point is 00:06:07 or, you know, and I wasn't doing it on purpose. It was a totally subconscious thing. And the icks were so stupid. It was like, yeah, there's this one that I bring up that I laugh about where he offered to pick me up from the airport and he wanted to come get me on foot to be a gentleman. And I was like, why would you, why would you do that? Like, me on foot to be a gentleman. And I was like, why would you, why would you do that? Like, come pick me up in the car. And I remember like on the ride home, just feeling that ick feeling. And it was so real at the time. And now looking back, I'm like, that was absolutely ridiculous. Like, why am I feeling icked out that he was trying to be nice and it was just different than what I wanted. So I learned to really kind of dig into those ics and question them and kind of think, am I really feeling not into this person? Or would I get these ics with

Starting point is 00:06:55 anyone who was just kind and into me and that I didn't have to chase? And it was, of course, the latter over time that I learned. How did you learn that? Like, how did you have that self-awareness yourself to kind of pinpoint that? Yeah, great question. So I had a very long situationship in my 20s where similarly, the guy was very into me and I just couldn't understand it. Like at the time I got the ick and I pushed him away and kind of sabotaged that relationship. And once he was already kind of gone and it was ruined, I realized like, wow, actually that person loved me and he really saw

Starting point is 00:07:40 me for who I was deeply. And like, isn't that the thing I've always wanted to be seen and heard for my authentic self. And so I think that kind of regret feeling of just seeing how I actively sabotage this connection, that could have been really nice. I learned for the future that when I had those avoidant or ick feelings come up again, that maybe don't act on them right away, like maybe question them. And I will say that, you know, sometimes they are valid. Like sometimes you get an ick or avoid it and it's a real thing because the person is not good for you or whatever. They mismatch your values. They have a deal breaker. But if you're dating someone and there's really nothing wrong and you're feeling that ick or avoidant, that's when I would say to dig in a little bit, journal about it. Yeah, it's so strange. And I, you know what,

Starting point is 00:08:31 I think some days I still experience it, not so much the ick part, because we've been together maybe eight months now, a very healthy, secure partner. But I do experience the self-sabotaging that I do. But I'm really aware of it, but I still, I do it subconsciously. Then I'm like, I know why I'm doing this. Why am I doing this? Um, and at the beginning when it was what I thought were ick feelings, I remember just kind of riding the wave and managing that like ick brain that's so ridiculous. And once I got over that, I enjoyed this really slow, healthy burn of the relationship. And it, it's so crazy to think that you know like you the littlest thing like the way he washed up I was like oh so annoying and it was it was

Starting point is 00:09:13 ridiculous I was like this guy is like bringing me flowers and he's being amazing to my family and he's here sitting in A&E like two months in and I'm like picking him apart like it was so wild um do you know why we do it yeah I think that subconsciously it's like a deep fear of intimacy I think that kind of anxious and avoidant feelings are like two sides of the same coin which is really this fear that someone is going to reject you for your authentic self. But it's hard to sort of parse that out because as we've both mentioned, it's very subconscious. And that's what's frustrating is like on the outside, you're thinking, you're not thinking, oh, I hope that he doesn't see the real me. Like it's, it's totally not a, you know,

Starting point is 00:10:01 an obvious thing. So yeah, it's really fascinating. And one sort of tip or whatever that I found really helpful for me in my latest relationship was actually naming when I was feeling avoidant. I didn't necessarily tell him that I was like feeling the ick because that's not really necessary. But I told him like, hey, I am feeling some avoidant feelings right now. That's why you might sense that my energy is a little bit different. It's not about you. I'm working through it. And that sort of like helped both of us. It helped calm him down because he was like,

Starting point is 00:10:35 why the hell is she so distant today? But it also helped dispel the shame for me and kept me from feeling like I was hiding the secret which then in turn makes you more avoidant right so it sort of was like nipping it in the bud and then like you said I was able to like ride the wave and then it became a slow burn a beautiful slow burn that is so mature of you I still think at this moment I still find it hard to be like um you know that was me I do do that and I'll be like sorry that was me I was just being a certain way but it takes me a little while to still do that yeah it's it's tough lots of like not glamorous practice I'm sure I didn't do it right but you know you learn as you go yeah absolutely and you're you're you love talking about like dating throughout 30s and

Starting point is 00:11:27 there is a massive stigma I think especially for women that once you get over 30 dating becomes so much harder you know I have women message me all the time that's like oh I've just and I'm 40 I might not be your audience for the podcast and I'm like of course of course you are 40 is so young and you you could have 50 more years with someone amazing next time you meet them like it it doesn't end after a divorce at 40 50 60 whatever but this stigma with it really it really gets to me because I have a circle of amazing friends at 31 32 33 and you know I had a friend last year you know 34 with two children and had been through a bad breakup and she was like why would anyone want me and two children

Starting point is 00:12:11 when you can get a single person at 34 that maybe doesn't have children and I was like that that isn't the right outlook and now she's met someone incredible and yeah it always happens eventually but you can't see it at the time. And I don't know why there's such a stigma. How did you deal with it when you were dating? Yeah, I fully feel that stigma. And I felt a lot of fear around turning 30. Like I think around 27 was when I started panicking because there's so much messaging in society about like, like you said, women, especially kind of hitting a wall or, you know, they're, they lose attractiveness over time or no one's going to want them once they get past 30. And like, first of all, it's

Starting point is 00:12:58 just so untrue having turned 30 and then continued to date and actually having more success, I was like, wow, all of that was just totally BS. And I didn't need to listen to it. But I think that's mostly what it is, is like society's obsession with youth. And I just like, don't think we need to subscribe to it. And and that's one thing that I try to emphasize a lot in my content is that I think that meeting someone in your 30s or beyond is actually a great time to meet someone because you know yourself so much better. You have better boundaries. You're really clear on what you want in terms of values, deal breakers, lifestyle, all of that. And so I always say that I would not have chosen the right partner for myself in my 20s. Like even at 28, nope, I wouldn't have. And it really, you know, when I was

Starting point is 00:13:52 32, finally, I did. But it just goes to show that like, I really think that you can find love at any age. And I don't think it's true that like suddenly you become undesirable. I mean, I definitely had guys younger than me and older than me who are interested. My partner is actually four years younger. And so kind of that myth about like guys are only going to want women in their 20s, like not true. And if they do, like I don't want that type of guy, you know. Yeah, it's such a weird thing. I don't know where it comes from it's like in the magazines we read um but it but it is really unsettling and it is a real big conversation

Starting point is 00:14:32 that comes up I know it comes up in in my group of friends and I don't know if it I I'm 29 now so I don't know if it would get harder um as as you get older but I just think there think there's different things in life that make it harder. Like if you do have children, you might then find it harder. But then also if you're younger, you might, you know, not be as self-aware and finding it harder when you're like triggering people or people are triggering you. So do you think it gets harder or do you think kind of it is it's relative? I think it really is relative. I mean, I would say that maybe the reality is you can get more matches in your 20s because you have like there's just a lot of single people in their 20s. But getting more matches doesn't equate to like quality matches or doesn't equate to getting into a healthy relationship. So I think that it doesn't necessarily get harder. A lot of it is mindset. And I don't mean to do toxic positivity or anything like that. But I think that, like you mentioned earlier, really just keeping that mindset of, I don't

Starting point is 00:15:34 know when it's going to happen, but I know it will happen. That was really, really important for me as I started hitting that early 30s panic. for me, like as I started hitting that early 30s panic. And of course, like, I would be remiss to not mention the biological factor if you do want kids. So of course, that does play in, but it's really outside of your control when you will meet someone and trying to like white knuckle it and just control the timeline just makes you more stressed, frustrated and anxious. So I had personally had to do a lot, a lot, a lot of mindset work on just trusting that it would happen, trusting the timing of my life. And of course it worked out. But like you said, in the moment when I was 29 or 30 and I'd been single forever, like I would just get so so frustrated I would just like cry in my room and

Starting point is 00:16:26 scream at like the universe of like why am I still single but it really does all make sense in hindsight now that I look at everything you know yeah and I actually said someone recently like everyone knew my struggles dating I've been open about it on TikTok and podcast and then I met a very healthy secure partner like last July and it's going really well but I was like people are congratulating me that are congratulations or you look so happy and I'm like I I was always happy like even like I was always happy really and I don't think I needed a congratulations and I get why people are saying it but I'm like it's funny because you've done the horrible single time then you meet the nice partner time and it's like my life hasn't changed like I just feel really cared for and safe and looked after in different ways but my my life is is still the same I'm still doing all the

Starting point is 00:17:19 things that I did when I was single and yeah it's a funny concept that you, you, you're like, why am I single? Why am I still single? When will I meet them? But actually nothing changes. The person adds to your life, but your life is, is the same. I think, I don't know what I was thinking. I think I thought that my life would just like magically transform and everything would fit like a puzzle and it doesn't, you know, there's still all the other stresses that come with work and normal life and everything else. So it's quite a weird thing, really, that we like long for it so badly. Yeah, no, I'm glad you brought that up. Because I remember a while ago, I heard about this concept of happiness set point and how each person kind of has like a natural happiness set point that they

Starting point is 00:18:00 reach and you can do work to like, raise it higher. But to your point, like getting into a relationship might sort of like spike your happiness in the short term when you're like, wow, I'm so, you know, secure and cared for. But over time, you sort of return back to like your normal state of mind and the things that you were dealing with when you were single are still there. You know, like my anxiety still crops up every now and then, even though I have a partner, it's just about different things rather than being single. So I think that's one thing is not feeling like your life is wasted when you're single and like all the work that you're doing, like to improve your mindset, like that is so important. And you're going to carry that with you into your relationship. And so I think it's so key to not

Starting point is 00:18:44 view your single time as just like biding your time until you meet a partner. It's like, no, you have to fill your life and, you know, create a life that you love. And then when your partner comes in, it's going to be even better. Yeah, absolutely. And just now you mentioned how you did a lot of mindset work. What did that actually involve? Like, any practical tips? Yeah, so I think for me, I mean, a big part of it was sort of working through a lot of the old beliefs that I had from my past, again, like a lot of really subconscious stuff, but I kind of viewed it as clearing out the cobwebs of just, you know, digging into why I felt such low self-worth,

Starting point is 00:19:26 why I was so scared of ending up alone, like just really working through those, both like in therapy and kind of somatic type of work. Also just a lot of journaling and journaling is a way that I processed emotion. It was super helpful for me. It might not be for everyone, but journaling and meditation were like super key for me to just understand what was going on inside. And then after that, I think really just building that kind of trust relationship with, I built a relationship with my higher self, I called it, whereas like that part of me that knew that everything was going to be okay, it was like this calming, wise voice that felt just like the truth. And so I really built that relationship over time, you know, I would sit there and I would meditate, I would like connect

Starting point is 00:20:17 with her and just like hear her guidance and then journal about it. And it was just really helpful to feel like I could lean on myself. And I was building this hope and this trust in the process. And I feel like that foundation was really important for me to not like totally lose it and like throw my phone off a cliff with dating. Did you ever write like manifest or write qualities down that you wanted in a partner? I did. Yeah. So I did get pretty into manifesting for a while, I think in my late 20s. And it was it was helpful. It was interesting, because I think manifesting kind of goes into that, like digging into your core

Starting point is 00:20:56 beliefs and choosing new beliefs. So it is a little bit woo woo, like sometimes manifesting teachings. I'm like, okay, like, it is toxic positive positivity sometimes. But I did write down a partner partner list. And I was pretty detailed in it. I had like 30 or 40 things like really detailed stuff. And I kind of forgot about it. You know, I wrote it down. And then when I met my partner partner I went back to that list and I was like oh my god I literally got everything that I wanted it was really cool yeah I actually just got goosebumps um that that's why I think I'd always advise people to write it down because I I did the same I wish mine was more detailed now it wasn't as detailed but when I I mean I was asking for the bare minimum I was actually really sad when I I wrote it I think in 2021 after quite a horrible breakup and I read it recently because I said to

Starting point is 00:21:52 him I think you're going to be everything on this list and I want to show you like the proof um and I like hunted everywhere to find it and I felt so sorry for my past self because I was asking for the bare minimum do you know what I mean like someone that like supports their words with their actions and it was the consistency and it was really bare minimum and I was like wow gosh I had like tried to really look I was lowering those standards because I just felt like I wasn't getting anything. It was quite sad to look back on. Like, I feel sorry for that past self of like, oh, when you just feel hopeless. Which kind of comes to the next question, actually,

Starting point is 00:22:34 because your Instagram name is looking for something serious. So how do you know, how do you let someone know that you're looking for something serious without doing all the things that we think might freak them out or you know feel uncomfortable for us to actually tell someone that because I remember playing dating so cool like I was cool like I might see you again and now I'm like I don't know why I never took it a bit more like you know told them my intentions a little bit more honestly yeah I mean I mean, I totally relate. Like I played it cool a lot in my twenties of like, I want to be the cool girl that like, I don't care. I can do

Starting point is 00:23:11 casual. And like, I'm not, I was never that person. So I think the later, the older I got, the more I was just forthright with what I wanted. I mean, I put it on my dating profiles, like a lot of the profiles now let you say like what you're looking for. So I put it on there, I would only filter for people who are also looking for a relationship. I would definitely bring it up like relatively early in conversation if there was any sort of lack of clarity around it. And I learned that it was definitely not scaring people. It wasn't scaring the right people off, right. And that was so important. And I learned that it was definitely not scaring people. It wasn't scaring the right people off. Right. And that was so important. And there were a few times when I brought it up and the person would say, oh, I'm recently divorced or, you know, I'm not really

Starting point is 00:23:57 looking for anything serious. And I'm like, oh, my God, I'm so glad that I asked and didn't get months in with you and then wonder why you weren't committing to me so I learned that it's just better to be upfront about it and you will then attract the right people who want something serious as well and you will cut loose the ones that don't and like save both of you time on that note though actually the person that I was dating went on a few dates with before the partner I'm now with um this person I have spoken about in a podcast episode because he was like my my pivotal moment of change like I cannot let this happen to me again like I'm not going through this again um but he set out all of these things that he wanted,

Starting point is 00:24:47 but I then learned it was love bombing. God, love bombing. Yeah, I know. So how do you know, like, if someone's sitting there and they're like, yeah, I want that too, or yeah, I would like, do you want children? Yes, I want children. How do you know if someone's kind of love bombing you over showing you their intentions? Yeah, How do you know if someone's kind of love bombing you over showing

Starting point is 00:25:05 you their intentions? Yeah, such a good question. And like, oh God, I think that to be honest, in the beginning, the very beginning, like the first month, it can be hard to tell the difference between love bombing and genuine interest because the whole point of love bombing is to manipulate you. And unfortunately, some people are just really good at that. So I think I learned to look out for signs of love bombing. And I feel like people usually tell on themselves. And the way that I learned to differentiate was that love bombing feels so intense compared to the amount of time that they know you. So with that situation that I had when I quit the apps and decided to write a book, I remember like within a week, he was telling me that I was his dream woman, that he deleted the apps for me, that he just kept like laying it on so thick.

Starting point is 00:25:58 And looking back, it was kind of obvious what he was doing. And then paired with a lot of sort of inconsistencies or things that didn't add up, I definitely noticed that was another thing where he would be so into me, but then kept canceling our dates and just like had all these really strange things happening to him where he just like, couldn't make time for me. And it was so confusing to have this like, just like couldn't make time for me. And it was so confusing to have this like intense profession of interest over words. And then, you know, even when we would have dates, they would be amazing, but then it would go like so much time between dates. He'd go dark for like multiple days in a row. And so I think just looking at that inconsistency and also just taking your time,

Starting point is 00:26:43 you know, not falling for someone within two weeks like I did, but really seeing like, how do they show up month after month after month. And with my current partner, I noticed like he was definitely into me from day one, but his interest was, it felt like a linear progression for how long we knew each other. You know, like the first date he was like, I would like to see you again I really enjoyed our time together second date same thing like it wasn't these like crazy professions of love you know yeah 100% that consistency when it happens in a healthy way is so attractive that was like the first thing that kind of drew me to my nail partner I think because every time I left him I knew when I was seeing him again in the week he'd like check up and be like are you still okay for

Starting point is 00:27:30 this or would you like would you prefer a meal over this or and it just felt really consistent and I actually say now if he I do wonder if he wasn't so consistent I probably was so at a point where I was like oh I'm never gonna like anyone that I think I could have just let let it go because I was it was I was so busy at the time I had so much work on I was like up and down the UK and so I think him being consistent meant he was also quite persistent in a healthy way and that's kind of what really made it a nice kind of dating process, I think. Yeah, no, I like that you brought that up. And that I think that that sort of consistent, but in a healthy way is so important, because I noticed kind of similar to what you said, like,

Starting point is 00:28:18 my first date with my partner was it was good, but it wasn't the way that I felt after the love bombing type of people were after the first date, I was like, oh my God, I met my person. We're going to get married. And I learned that that is actually not a good feeling. It's usually like anxiety and manicness. And that is a bad sign. And so similar to you, I appreciated how my partner just kind of kept showing up, kept asking me out on the next date.

Starting point is 00:28:44 And so it was like my interest was able to build over time. And that's how I learned to trust him. And it's just interesting how the people that you think you're going to marry after one day are like not the ones you end up with at all. That's so interesting, because I remember being really confused about this when with my current partner um so I remember like with the love bomb where I spoke about we spent like three weekends together and I remember sitting with my mum and sister on Mother's Day and being like oh my god I I would have his babies tomorrow like this is this is it this is it and everyone was like what what like Daisy actually fell for someone like this is crazy and I was like it's it's him this is it he's

Starting point is 00:29:30 amazing and then when I obviously realized what happened there and it was crazy I was like wow and then I did go through this like we hadn't been dating long enough for me to go through like a really horrible breakup but it was long enough for me to be like oh my god it was a roller coaster and I felt like it just stopped and I was like what happened there and then I picked up all these pieces and I was like I can't go through that again so when I met my nail partner and I didn't feel this oh my god I want to marry you or I want to rip your clothes off like I fancy him a lot but it wasn't this like it wasn't this infatuation obsession and it took me a really long time to understand if that was a good thing or not. Because I was like, oh, why am I not obsessed?

Starting point is 00:30:11 Like, but now I've learned and it's taken me a long time to be able to even like process like I love you feelings. And even saying out loud is so hard for me. But I've realized that that was so much healthier. Yeah. But that isn't what we learn. like that isn't what we're told so I was going to ask you this question so I might as well on this subject like is it about the slow burn or is it about this instant feeling yeah I mean I guess I'm biased because my relationship was a slow burn, but I definitely think that that is way more sustainable. And I think it also allows you to like stay grounded and keep your discernment

Starting point is 00:30:54 and your wisdom versus when there's that like manic obsession, like you are not your most wise self. Like you are out in the ethersers just feeling crazy. And that's just not a grounded place to like make relationship decisions from. So I am a huge fan of the slow burn. And I know like you and I and so many other healthy relationships that started off slow and the person or, you know, they liked each other after the first few dates but it wasn't this crazy feeling and I've come to think that that is like the majority path to a good relationship and of course some people have like the crazy chemistry and the sparks or whatever and it works out like that that is also a valid path but I don't think that that is at all a precursor or a necessity to

Starting point is 00:31:46 finding a healthy relationship yeah that's good point so I remember asking people that I know in healthy relationships and I'm like are you meant to feel that love at first sight thing and they've been together for like eight years now that they're like yeah I think we felt it instantly but really that's just hindsight like I would look back now and be like, yeah, yeah, we got on straight away. Like we went on a holiday quite quickly. But yeah, so I think there's there's that as well. And how did you meet your partner? Oh, my gosh, it is such a funny story. So I had, like I mentioned, I had that frustrating dating experience. I quit the dating apps. And I was just sort of like doing my thing for the next few months. And I had these old dating app matches like pop back up in my life and message me and

Starting point is 00:32:34 say just some weird things like oversharing. So I went to Reddit, which is one of my favorite places to discuss dating. There's a subreddit called Dating Over 30. And I posted a thread in there just about like people oversharing and why it happens. And my now partner was one of the people that commented on it. He just said something about like healthy boundaries. And I didn't I was like, Oh, cool. I didn't really think much more about it. And in his words, he felt a compelling urge to DM me over Reddit. And he just like really liked what I had to say, I guess.

Starting point is 00:33:10 And so he DM'd me. It was really polite. Like he wasn't asking me out. He was just kind of like, hey, loved what you had to say. Like, good luck in your dating life. And I was like, who is this guy? And so we started chatting a little bit and I found out that he lived 10 minutes from me, which is insane, because Reddit is global. So after a little bit of messaging, he decided to ask me out for coffee. And this is all before knowing what each other looked like.

Starting point is 00:33:38 So it was like very old school. Yeah. And he sent me a selfie after he asked me out. He's like, promise I'm not like some weirdo. And he was cute. And so I was like, okay, we'll go out to coffee. And we did. And that was that. Wow. That is amazing. Yeah. Wow. That must have felt like a little bit of fate after like struggling with dating for quite a while. It really did. And it like just further cemented in that whole thing about, you know, you can't really plan for it sometimes. Like timing is a thing. And it was so interesting when I was talking to him that he told me that he had, he had gotten out of a relationship about nine months prior, um, is kind of a difficult breakup. So he'd taken quite a bit of time single and he officially started dating like a few weeks before he met me. So all that time that I was like

Starting point is 00:34:31 screaming at the sky, wondering where my person was, well, he wasn't available yet. And so it was just, it felt so magical to be like, wow, like the moment he became available, like there he was presented on a platter to me. Gosh, that's amazing got goosebumps again and it's so like that though and I'm not sure how I feel about the saying everything happens for a reason because I think there's certain things in life that just shouldn't happen you know illnesses and things like that but in in terms of what happened to you like wow that really did happen for a reason that that's that was just perfect timing that's just such a nice story what do you think it was about it that made it different so we we obviously spoke about the the avoidant maybe ick kind of feelings earlier how did you know to separate that from like it's an ick to actually know this is a nice healthy partner what was it that made it different

Starting point is 00:35:21 yeah I think it I just could tell from the first time that we met that we shared a lot of similar values like he was really close with his family and I could tell that he was just like the type of guy who wanted a relationship and he was just so kind and thoughtful and I could tell that early on because he like offered to do things for my friends like so early on in the relationship, like he helped one of my friends move like three months into us dating. And so I just kind of realized that like, wow, this is a really good human with a really good heart. And not only does he treat me really well, like he treats everyone around him well. And that was just sort of the solidifying factor for me

Starting point is 00:36:05 as I was just like, this is the type of man that I want to end up with because I know that it's not going to be like only treating me good when in the honeymoon phase. Like I could just tell that he was a man of solid character. Yeah, that's lovely. You obviously met, well, I guess it was online really. And then your obviously first meeting was like real life. But because you met on Reddit, do you kind of support dating apps?

Starting point is 00:36:32 Are you, is that something that you think is good for people? How do you feel around them? Yeah. I mean, I feel like my opinion on dating apps has like shifted all over the place, over the past 10 years. But ultimately, what I've landed on is that they are just another tool to meet people. And I do think that they require like a lot of resilience and, you know, patience. And so I think that each person should feel the agency to have whatever relationship they want with the dating apps. Some people can use them and it's not really a problem for them. Like I have a lot of friends that just use them and they're, they don't really take things personally. They're kind of like,

Starting point is 00:37:14 yeah, whatever. It's just meeting people. Like I mentioned, I had gone through so many ups and downs with the apps that I ultimately said, you know what, for me, these aren't working because of my history, my emotions, whatever. And so I quit them. But I that's definitely not a choice that I recommend that everyone make. Like, I think that they are a perfectly valid way to meet people. And people are meeting partners on the apps all the time. So I think if you can approach them with a healthy mindset, like by all means. And you did a reel on like scarcity mindset with the dating apps. Can you just explain that a little bit more? Yeah. So I think it's, it's so ironic that the dating apps give us access to so many more people that than we had pre dating app. Like when you're out in the world before the

Starting point is 00:38:03 dating apps, like you might meet a few people a year that you're interested, potentially interested in dating. And now with the apps, like you have access to thousands of people all the time. And it seems like on the outside that that would mean that you have higher chances of meeting someone that you're compatible with, but somehow it doesn't work out that way. And I think that that can really exacerbate the scarcity mindset because you're thinking like, how do I have all this access and I still can't find a match? Like it must be me. There's no one out there for me. Like I'm asking for too much, you know, all those things that you tell yourself. important to actively work to combat that mindset. And, you know, even if you're not meeting people that you're fully interested in all the time, I found it really important to kind of look for the good things in each people, each person that you met, you know, you go on a date, and maybe someone is really caring and thoughtful, even though you're not attracted to them. But you said, Wow, that how nice that I met a guy that was really thoughtful and planned our date and followed up.

Starting point is 00:39:09 And that type of thing became really important for me to not feel like bitter and jaded, and to really kind of build that hope. And I think another thing was, there's a lot of comparison going on when you are using the apps and the people around you are in relationships. And I think another thing was there's a lot of comparison going on when you are using the apps and the people around you are in relationships. And I think it kind of can scare you into thinking like, oh, all the good ones are getting taken. Like they found someone, therefore I'm not going to find someone. But I think it really helps to flip that script and say, you know what? They found someone and that is proof that I can also find someone.

Starting point is 00:39:44 I think that is is really key to building that abundance mindset oh well I think that was like the perfect way to end the episode because that was some really good advice there but first where can people get your book yeah so my book um it's called looking for something serious and they can get it on amazon barnes and noble etc um and it's the same name as my instagram looking for something serious so I Looking for Something Serious. And they can get it on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, etc. And it's the same name as my Instagram, Looking for Something Serious. So I have kind of everything linked up there. And I hope people buy it, enjoy it, and feel validated in their experiences.

Starting point is 00:40:18 Because no one is alone in struggling with modern dating. And I just think that we should all band together and support each other. Absolutely. Please go and follow Lauren's content. It's some of my favorite on Instagram, genuinely, because it's just so crystal clear and relatable. So looking for something serious on Instagram, you can follow Daisy Dates podcast on Instagram

Starting point is 00:40:42 and myself, Daisy Bell as well. And this podcast, wherever you're listening, it is also available on all the other platforms as well. I'll see you next time.

Daisie Dates - EP25| Are we throwing the ICK in the bin?

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