Dan Wootton Outspoken - KEIR STARMER'S "BIG SECRET" THAT EVERYONE IN WESTMINSTER KNOWS ABOUT BUT MSM COVERING UP

Episode Date: September 30, 2024

The corrupt and captured MSM won’t report on Slippery Keir Starmer’s secrets, so what exactly is the Prime Minister hiding and why do Westminster journalists know all about it but the public don��t? The media is now actively shielding the Labour leader and covering up details of his private life, when they tried to bring Boris Johnson down for far less. In the Digest, Dan will reveal everything he can legally, including how Lord Ashcroft tried to break the story. The his Superstar Panel – former Tory minister Dame Andrea Jenkyns and Reform UK’s Alex Wilson – weigh in. PLUS: Nigel Farage launched a brutal attack on the two Tory frontrunners Robert Jenrick and Kemi Badenoch AND: Labour fangirl Carol Vorderman quits Wales over an extortionate Labour policy To watch the exclusive Uncancelled After Show for 30-minutes extra content EVERY weekday, sign up at: https://outspoken.live/premium Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

No spin, no bias, no censorship. I'm Dan Wootton. This is Outspoken Live episode number 62. And please do click to subscribe to this brand new independent news source. Turn on the notification bell so you'll be alerted to all our brand new live shows, uncancelled interviews and special royal episodes. Big news too, Outspoken now available as a podcast. So you can listen to the show every weekday on the go wherever you are you can subscribe on spotify apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast i'll put the links by the way in the show notes below this video today the corrupt and captured msm won't report on slippery care starmer's secrets so what exactly is the pm hiding and why do the

westminster journalists all know about it, but the public don't? Because we shouldn't have little clubs of journalists who know stuff and politicians that know stuff, but we're in the know and you're not. So I'm happy to put it out there that it is an open secret at Westminster that there is something about Keir Starmer's past that is not in the public domain and it may or may not have a bearing on all this Lord's Alley stuff. It may be totally tangential, irrelevant, may not even be true. But if I were him and there is a secret, I would just get it out there now. Okay, so here's what I know. The media is now actively shielding

the Labour leader and covering up details of his private life when they tried to bring down Boris Johnson for far less. So in my digest next, I will reveal everything I can legally, including how Lord Ashcroft tried to break this story. Then my superstar panel, former Tory minister Dame Andrea Jenkins and Reform UK's Alex Wilson weigh in. Then my superstar panel, former Tory Minister Dame Andrea Jenkins and Reform UK's Alex Wilson weigh in. Also coming up today, Nigel Farage has launched a brutal attack on the two Tory frontrunners Robert Jenrick and Kemi Badenoch. Kemi, by the way, who is lashing out at the MSM. I don't regret things that I didn't say, but thank you for asking.

I've said maternity pay is important. Are you all right? It was all going off there. And Labour fangirl Carol Vorderman quits Wales over an extortionate Labour policy. I'll tell you what's happened. Then in the Uncancelled After Show today, Samantha Markle and Donald Trump's close friend and attorney Peter Tickton here for an exclusive interview from Florida about their ongoing court case against Meghan, the Duchess of Sussex. You can register to watch on our own website right now at www.outspoken

diet live. That is our safe space, free of censorship and your support at just five pounds a month. Not only gives you 30 minutes of extra content every single weekday, it allows me to continue making this independent daily news show to take on the MSM. But now, let's go. Now, it doesn't matter who Starmer is or was sleeping with, or whether he has fathered any children outside his marriage. Arguably, no. On a personal level, I don't actually give a damn. But the chronic hypocrisy that has entered every aspect of his governance post-election and the double standards from a two-tier media, well, they certainly do matter. Why should we accept that the MSM will cover a Tory Prime Minister with completely different standards to a Labour one?

They hounded, they hounded Boris Johnson over every tiny detail of his personal life. And once he became PM, every aspect of his relationship with Carrie Johnson or previous affairs or number of children, it was all considered fair game. The same approach has never been taken towards Keir Starmer, with the media agreeing to shroud his personal life in a cone of silence despite the Westminster elites having been whispering about a series of salacious rumours for many years. Now, it's hardly a surprise when you look at these pictures of Starmer. With the Westminster press pack, these people are his friends and friends protect each other. But on Friday morning, the excellent political journalist Isabel Oakeshott

went on talk with Mike Graham and was more honest about the situation than any other political hack has been thus far. So I think there is something bigger going on here and it's annoying because I don't know what it is and I know that the lobby of political journalists at Westminster feel the same. All of us instinctively feel that there is some big fact here that we're not being made... I'm going to ask the question because nobody else will. Is it some kind of sex thing, do you think? So there have long been rumours about Keir Starmer's private life

and they certainly aren't to do with any kind of doubts over his sexuality, if I can put it delicately. They are to do with his past and what the shape of his family really looks like. And it wouldn't be fair to go any further than that. But this is an open secret at Westminster that those question marks have been around for a long time. And papers have been extraordinarily restrained in not publishing any of that speculation. And even whether they've got, you know, maybe there are publications that have more information than I'm aware of,

they've been restrained. Why? Because there's been a strong feeling that it's not in the public interest. And the bar for that these days for the press is really quite high. It's a whole different world to where we were in the john major years you know all those sleaze scandals were really just to do with cabinet ministers having affairs having mistresses that wash anymore in modern day britain people actually don't care you know if one of our cabinet ministers has got a relationship with someone else who cares well except well except if it has some bearing on legislation if it has some bearing on the conduct of of of policy uh or laws that are

being made i mean that's when it starts to become a problem so you have to have a strong public interest defense to publish this stuff and i think to date um the media has felt that there hasn't been a strong public interest defense and fairness to whatever may or may not be going on in his past or in his private life he has never posed with his family or children and acted like they're the perfect family and that he's the perfect dad and all of that perfect husband etc etc he hasn't done that so there isn't I hasn't up until now been any kind of hypocrisy public interest event I just wonder whether um that is now shifting I say I don't kind of throw mud out there because I don't know much detail but I think it's fair to our viewers because we

shouldn't have little clubs of journalists who stuff and politicians that know stuff but we're in the know and you're not so i'm happy to put it out there that it is an open secret at westminster that there is something about keir starmer's past that is not in the public domain and it may or may not have a bearing on all this Lord Ali stuff. It may be totally tangential, irrelevant, may not even be true. But if I were him and there is a secret, I would just get it out there now. Now, this evening, I can reveal that Lord Ashcroft did try to break the story about the shape of Starmer's family, the true shape of Starmer's family, for one of his books, but was legally unable to. And if I am being sympathetic, many journalists

and outlets may be too scared to report stories about Starmer's personal life, because the only person who did so, the brilliant Tim Shipman of the Sunday Times, one of the few Westminster journalists that I actually respect, was successfully sued by the then Shadow Cabinet Office Minister, Baroness Chapman, over a tweet that she claimed falsely suggested that she had a, quote, secret adulterous relationship with Starmer. So on May the 8th, 2021, Shipman had said that loyalty to Baroness Chapman appeared to be quote the most important commodity as far as Labour High Command is concerned this evening. He later tweeted that Chapman had been banned from the Starmer's family home on quote the orders of Lady Victoria.

But less than a fortnight later he wrote on the platform which is now known as X, some people may have inferred that I was suggesting a relationship between the two that is not purely professional. That was not its intention or context. Any such inference is untrue. I apologize for the distress caused. No disrespect was intended to anyone and particularly not to Ms. Chapman, to whom I have written and will pay compensation. But it still went to the High Court, where Baroness Chapman's solicitor, Kevin Benavia, said the inference from Shipman was that Baroness Chapman had been conducting a secret adulterous relationship with Sir Kama and allegations that he said is completely untrue. Shipman is believed to have paid substantial damages and legal costs for those two tweets.

So while Starmer did not take any legal action himself, the implication there was clear. Make allegations about the Labour leader's personal life at your peril. And this had all gone quiet. It had all gone quiet around Lady Victoria until she became the disappearing wife during the election campaign, again leading to speculation about the marriage. Now Starmer's team explained his wife was helping their son study for his GCSEs, the same excuse used in the past week as to why the family moved out of their home to Ali's luxury penthouse.

However, as soon as the rumors reached a critical mass, there was a surprising reversal, and Lady V was all of a sudden everywhere, dressed up to the nines in designer outfits that we now know were funded by Lord Ali's millions via donations. Since that public re-emergence, which you'll remember happened in this loved-up Instagram post at the Taylor Swift concert at Wembley, just another perk by by the way, that virtually every Labour cabinet minister appears to have taken up, she's now become a regular public entity. So I am told that a decision was made that Lady Victoria must go public to try and stop the growing speculation about Keir's marriage and the shape of his family that was also sparked by the removal of his wedding ring. The brilliant Guido Fawkes blog, which has shamed the MSM

by revealing scoop after scoop about Starmer's sleaze since he became PM, had hinted at trouble too. So here's its editor, Paul Staines, speaking about this on the Bombshells podcast. During the election campaign, you were hinting a bit about, well, Guido was hinting a bit about Keir Starmer's personal life, but... We never got the story to fly. Well, no, more that no one else... Yeah, everyone was talking about it.

Yeah, well, yeah, but no one else was talking about this apart from Guido. Is that because journalists and editors want to stay on the side of the incoming government like those type of stories you could never prove yeah I've got a photographer outside at nighttime and in the morning shall we say so it's very like I got him very very hard to stand up yeah you know um and just because everyone knows or everyone says doesn't mean it's tough so we tried it from all different angles and people enjoy as lord leveson said to me a mosaic of information yeah could put it together and you know i think i think basically a lot of people knew what the mail and the telegraph were getting at when they were saying, where's Vicky? You know?

Yeah. And all that kind of stuff. Where's the ring? Truth is, where's the ring? He's still not got it back on. Maybe he's just putting a bit of weight. You know, it happens. Maybe he's following Prince William.

He also doesn't wear a ring is that true I don't wear a ring probably it's the traditional thing to do well it's I don't wear a watch so I think I think that story isn't over yet that story isn't over yet the story about the shape of Starmer's family isn't over yet. The story about the shape of Starmer's family isn't over yet. The story about what's really going on in his marriage really isn't over yet. And certainly, all of the headlines about Lord Ali brings this into the public domain, and I think it's clearly in the public interest to know what's really going on. Now, Starmer has since attempted to guilt trip mainstream journalists away from coverage of the donor scandal, even though the PM and his key lieutenants had promised an administration

free of sleaze and cronyism. And boy, oh boy, his client journalists are there to support him. Who's probably the worst? I reckon Lewis Goodall of the No News Agents podcast. So when he was covering the Boris scandals at the BBC, this is what he wrote. This isn't a story about furnishings or wallpaper. It's a story about the law and the standards we expect in our democracy about openness, transparency, and so on. Now note the marked difference to his coverage of Starmer's scandal, where he posted on X, amid the mostly trivia FreebieGate stories, the real story of the Labour conference was largely missed to the clearest signs, yet the government is going to shift fiscal and political approach and start talking about borrowing to invest. So it's actually been left to one of the only

honourable MPs on the left in the UK, Canterbury's Rosie Duffield, to express the horror the nation feels about Starmer's dishonesty while quitting as a Labour MP on Saturday night. I think because interview after interview, Kirstarmer has had the opportunity to apologise, to disclose everything all at once and to just say, I hold my hands up, I made a mistake, I got it wrong, I can see how bad it looks. But instead, he's doubled down. He seems to be affronted when asked about it by journalists who are doing their job. This is a scandalous way to behave. None of us need free things. the lowest paid mps i've said this before like me are 91 000 pounds that is so much money compared to the average british person who also has to provide clothes

for themselves and their children and if they want to go out they want to buy tickets to a concert they save up or they make that that a present for. The fact that those things are gifted to a prime minister who, as leader for the opposition, when he took most of these things, was earning about £140,000, it's disgusting. He has yet to apologise. He just seems cross when people dare to question him. And that is not only a really weird human attitude,

it's also terrible politics. But it's now not just Starmer taking the piss. So too is the mainstream media, which is now actively shielding Starmer and covering up details of his private life when they tried to bring Boris down for far less. Because let me tell you, I've seen a lot of speculation online, but my understanding is that there is no injunction or super injunction that would stop any newspaper or journalist publishing the details of what they know. So where are you? Paul Brand? James O'Brien? Carol Vorderman? More proof, if ever we needed it, that two-tier Britain is served by a two-tier media.

And now, let me bring in today's superstar panel. And to discuss this further, I am delighted to welcome back my friend, the former Tory Education Minister, Dame Andrea Jenkins, and making his outspoken debut, the Reform UK London Assembly member Alex Wilson. So Dame Andrea Jenkins, my view on this is that the MSM is engaging in a cover up which exposes them as complete hypocrites because they cannot say that your friend Boris Johnson's personal life was of the public interest and deserved front page headlines and constant coverage in order to try and drive him out of Downing Street.

But Keir Starmer's private life isn't in the public interest, even though we know that he's taking donations for his family, for his wife's clothing, etc, etc. It is double standards, Dan, and I'm talking from personal experience. Back in 2015, I was a new BMP of just six months, a backbencher, and I got into a relationship with another backbencher. I ended up front page news of The Sun, of The Daily Mail, all the national media that was camped outside my mum's house. I lived with mum at the time. And I was a backbencher. Why was that a public interest? And we got hounded. People even contacted ex-boyfriends from a decade ago, the media did. They contacted my elderly uncle who was old. They contacted ex-boyfriends' parents from a decade ago so why was i of public interest dan but not

the prime minister indeed and what what are you hearing about this andrew because i know you've just been at the conservative party conference yeah this is the talk isn't it lots of people are asking questions about it there um i mean i didn't hear so much at the conference i was only there for a day but i've heard stuff from sort of friends who i know um in the mainstream media etc um and other politicians who have have said that it's a well-known secret exactly what isabel said um that it's allegedly relationship wise um and so yeah i mean to me i don't want to be sued as somebody who's got no money and trying to get a job done but i think the mainstream media who clearly um has has got lawyers and that behind them why go after a backbencher like me back in 2015 who was you know nobody let's face it

why and camp outside my house um why go after boris and just hound him for for years um yet they um allegedly stay silent over mr starmer our our Prime Minister. Because you're very good friends, I know, with Harry as well as Boris Johnson, Andrea, and those stories took a real toll on them, didn't they? It's awful. It's awful. They got so personal, even about arguments that they supposedly had. And, I mean, I personally don't care what somebody does in their personal life, as long as it doesn't involve children or animals, Dan, as long as it's legal. But the fact is, it's hypocrisy.

And you cannot have double standards in the media reporting. You cannot have hypocrisy and double standards from our prime minister as well, like we've been seeing over allegedly sleaze of the Tory party. Yet what are they like? You know, they're the worst offenders. So you cannot throw a stone, they're the worst offenders. So you cannot throw a stone if you're not clean yourself. Alex Wilson, great to have you on the show for the first time, Reform UK London Assembly member.

Are you hearing anything about all of these rumours to do with Starmer and the shape of his family and the state of his marriage? Well, Dan, I have to thank you for bringing me as closely up to speed as anyone can. See, the intro that you've just given to this piece has mentioned several things, but it's still as clear as mud, really. And, yeah, honestly, I don't know where to begin. I think when we have a new government that's come in

and promising to be clear of sleaze and cronyism and all those things, to then very, very quickly return to what seems like politics as normal. It's why a lot of people are getting utterly disengaged in politics. And you saw the turnout election was lower than it has been for some considerable time, because people just think that their politicians on all sides sides, are not relatable, are not honest, are not straightforward. Why engage in a process when it certainly gives the appearance of them all being the same? What we need to do is offer some real choice and re-engagement and get people fired up again. And I think to do that, talk about sleaze and corruption

and cronyism and all these things, it really doesn't help that. But to try and get back onto real issues and talking about how politics can and should make a real difference to people's lives and the issues that matter, that's what government should be focusing on. But in the meantime, the longer this goes on, the worse it gets. Well, indeed, Alex, because the problem is, you know, your boss, Nigel Farage, is another one, absolutely hounded by the mainstream media, constantly, consistently.

And that's unfair too, if they're covering up for Starmer. Because let's be honest, every tiny thing Nigel does, whether he's going somewhere, where he's earning money from, I mean, it's considered front page news all the time. Absolutely. So we have two tier care, we have two tier media and we have two tier led by donkeys. Where are they in all this? If it was Nigel, they'd be all over it. And it's ridiculous. The things that Nigel gets criticized for are you

know going out earning a living um paying a lot of tax on his earnings you know making a big contribution to to the national and international discussions on all sorts of issues that should be celebrated but uh not not not hidden like this no indeed do you have any sympathy for Starmer though I'll put this to both of you. Andrea, let me ask you first. He's obviously very concerned about protecting his children, right, who are at a vulnerable age. Do you have any sympathy for him on that level?

No, I have sympathy for anybody who's got children. And, I mean, as you know, Dan, I've got little Clifford, who you know as well, and you do your best to protect them. And when the speculation will keep snowballing and something will come out in the end. So isn't it better to nip things in the bud now? Alex, what about you? Any sympathy for Starmer over this? Given what went on may have happened many, many years ago. Yeah, I think it's fair to have sympathy with his family and his children and so on. But ultimately, all of us that are involved in politics we choose to put

ourselves in the public eye um and if we do that knowing that there are things about us and about our past that uh that may or may not be um you know helpful to to be come out well that's a choice that we make um and it's it's never the uh the actual offense or the or theence or the difficulty that gets you. It's always the cover-up that gets you. So I think if there is something, then I think it would be in his best interest to be clear and honest and open about it. In the meantime, Dan, Isabel, keep pushing

and maybe we'll get the answers that we're looking for. Dan, can I come in? I've just been looking on Angela Rayner's tweets while I was on here. That's why I was looking down. And this is how much they hounded, she in particular hounded Boris. In 2019, she was quoting about Boris Johnson, that Adam Bienkoff had done a tweet having a go about Boris. And Rayner said, I've met guys like him before. He thinks there's a cut above the rest. Adam Bienkoff had done a tweet having a go about Boris.

And Rainer said, I've met guys like him before. He thinks he's a cut above the rest, says all the I love yous and gets a girl pregnant. Oh my goodness. That's the thing. They went down and dirty. And now that their leader's got a dirty secret, they all of a sudden want to pretend that it's nobody's business well why was Boris's love child's anyone's business exactly so she was getting personal about Boris's life and and having a child and and that's wrong you know if they have got a secret to hide whatever it is as said, don't cast these stones down.

Well, I mean, I find it astonishing, Andrea, a bit like you talk about your own personal experience. There are a whole load of lies put out about me last year, as you know, and it was complete nonsense, complete witch hunt, completely untrue and there's been more mainstream media focus on that andrea than there has been on starmer's secret which is just completely astonishing but they're in they're in it for him aren't they because if you also look at the revelations regarding lord ali i mean where has the mainstream media been on that? It's Guido Fawkes that is revealing that this guy is a massive supporter or was a massive supporter of Assad in Syria. It's Guido Fawkes that is revealing the fact that Number 10 told complete lies about the fact that Starmer had only filmed in Lord Ali's penthouse once. It was multiple times. And the worst thing is, look,

this is the picture that's astonishing to me, Andrea. Look, he cheated the public by putting his family pictures behind his shoulder to make it look as if he was recording from his own house when he was telling all of us to stay home. Absolutely. And it's hypocrisy and it's deceit dan and somebody like that should not be in government personally i think you know if you nobody's perfect but but people always get

found out by the lies dan so this is just a matter of time now i think well see for me alex all of these stories are actually about hypocrisy that That is what it is all about. Labour acted completely hysterically for five years. And they brought Andrea's government down, let's just be completely frank about it, over a cake. A piece of cake, which Boris Johnson has actually now said in his autobiography, he didn't even eat. He didn't even taste a piece of cake. And fundamentally, that is what destroyed the last conservative government because the moment that Boris was deposed at the behest of the left-wing mainstream media,

it was all over. It was all done. So if you are going to maintain those sorts of standards for the opposition, you sure as hell better be whiter than white yourself. And we've actually seen, Alex, I think, the worst of champagne socialists, which is that they talk a good talk, but actually they are constantly on the tape. Absolutely.

It's the very kind of definition of champagne socialism. Champagne, for me, socialism for everyone else. And that's simply not acceptable but um you're right it's the hypocrisy and uh and it's great that that you and guido are doing the work that you do in asking these questions if the mainstream media are not prepared to do it then someone has to and uh you know good luck and keep keep doing it but but um lockdown, I think, is quite sickening. Obviously, over lockdown, it was lockdown that drove me out of the Conservative Party because I thought it was utterly wrong, particularly second lockdown. Good on you.

For people who were supporting lockdown, whether on the then government or on the now government, who at the time were arguing for deeper, harder, faster, longer, to be potentially having breached the rules themselves while telling us all to buckle up and lock ourselves away for months on end. Absolutely outrageous. But this isn't the first time that Keir and Angela Rayner have lied over their conduct, specifically in regards to lockdown. Do you remember Beargate when they were hounding Boris Johnson? But in fact,

they were eating Indian takeaways and partying and downing bottles of beer when they were meant to be in lockdown. So even when it comes to COVID restrictions, there was a complete double standard in terms of the media and the police's treatment of the Labour Party compared to the Conservative Party, Andrea. Yeah, and on that point, actually, I think I was on your world show Dan discussing this do you remember how we well I think you uncovered how a was it a police and crime commission or somebody high up in that particular police force that was investigating it got a pay rise during that time yes so yeah I mean I remember I remember Angela Rayner said she wasn't even there.

No, absolutely. And this is what you and I cannot stand hypocrisy. And everybody should be treated the same under the rule of law. You should be treated the same as anybody else and be innocent until proven guilty. You know, look what happened to you, Dan. And it's wrong. It's wrong that people on the left can get away with things. And it's been going on too long now. And I do think that the mainstream media actually owe it to the general public to restore trust in them as well to start reporting on these things.

Well, to me, it's gone. To me, the trust in the mainstream media is gone i mean look at that guy look at that guy every single day james o'brien tries to justify this despicable conduct so does carol vorderman who we're going to be speaking about later in the show so i believe the trust in the mainstream media has gone and that is why it is going to be independent journalists i mean isabel oak shop Oakeshott, for example, she has now launched a sub-stack. I've written about this on my sub-stack today.

Guido Fawkes is an independent platform. That's who you can trust. You cannot trust the British Fashion Corporation or Wokai TV or Sly News or Channel 4 News to tell you the truth about what is really going on in this administration. But look, Andrea, I know you're just back from the Conservative Party conference

and Nigel Farage, Alex, your leader, has weighed in finally for the first time on the leadership race. And it is very clear that Nigel sees this as a two horse race between under fire Kemi Badenoch and the rising star Robert Jenrick. So this is what Nigel Farage had to say. Conservative Party conference begins in earnest. Until now, I have refrained from intervening in the upcoming leadership election, but the time has come. Kemi Badenoch has spent weeks positioning herself as tough on immigration. But in 2018, she campaigned in Parliament to increase legal migration and was the biggest champion for students bringing independence. I don't believe a word that she says on anything. Then on Robert Jenrick, he said, formerly a man that believed in nothing, he now pictures himself

as the great hardliner. This is almost certainly done for political gain and not out of conviction. He will divide the party. I doubt that Jenrick will last long if he wins. The Conservative Party is split down the middle and the brand is completely broken. So how appropriate that we've got someone from Reform, someone from the Conservatives here. Andrea, let me start with you because I know you're friends with Nigel. How do you feel about his complete takedown of both Kemi Badenoch and Robert Jenrick? He may be a friend, but he's still opposition, isn't he?

And I'm opposition to him at the moment. So I think that's to be expected. I think clearly they don't want any of these. They want a really weak Conservative leader because that's beneficial to them, isn't it?

But talking about the actual leadership candidates, I disagree with his comments conservative leader because that's beneficial to them isn't it um but talking about the actual leadership candidates um i mean i disagree with his comments on um on robert i mean i was his pps um dan and i i know him personally very well he was at my 50th birthday him and his wife and um i think what people are forgetting this collective responsibility when you're in government and you're a minister and you have to sign up for that um and of course he did quit he did quit eventually i'm saying so for many years he signed up to collective responsibility but he's actually if you look on the public with um robert is the only one who has defied the the government with the

conservative whip and the public whip states is defied the the whip 14 times but the other candidates according to that online hasn't so he has got a conviction yes he had to um abide by um collective responsibility which i did when i was a minister and i i was a government whip um but he chose his moment like i choose my chose my moment to rebel and i think is vindicated himself afterwards i mean he's is um i think on this show i've called him a born again christian they're born again thatcher right but um he's born again conservative baby yeah in all honesty dan um he i know his views from working with him for many years i mean gosh he did fundraisers back in um 2015 in my constituency for me came to my business clubs to speak to businesses i've known him quite a long time and and he he is a conviction politician

otherwise why would he have resigned? And I think you know me well enough, Dan, that I cannot back somebody who is fake. No, and that's a relief. It hurt me too much. I wouldn't stay in the party. It's a relief for me to hear you say that because I like what Jenrick is saying. So, Alex, just before I get you to respond, I want to show you Jenrick's latest campaign video where it sounds like he's a member of Reform UK. Alex, listen to this. Wahby Mohammed, a man born in Somalia who aided the plot to blow up the London underground. Akindoyan Akinshipe, born in Nigeria who raped a 13 year old girl. Murad Mustafawi, an Algerian who recruited for

ISIS in Edinburgh. A Ugandan who we only know as ZM who beat a man to death in the back of an ambulance in London. What do these men have in common? They're just a few of the people the European Court of Human Rights has stopped us from deporting. The court is also why illegal migration is out of control. It's created an arsenal of rights for illegal migrants that are used to gum up our courts and prevent their removal. Our special forces are killing rather than capturing terrorists because our lawyers tell us that if they're caught,

the European Court will set them free. So Alex, look, I put it to you, and by the way, I say this, I'm very honest about this, I voted for Reform UK at the last election, I'm a big supporter of what Nigel is doing at the moment. But isn't Robert Jenrick your worst nightmare? Nigel's worst nightmare, because he's actually trying to outflank Reform UK from the right. Thanks, Dan. And thank you for your support in the election. It's very much appreciated. So what a different video that is, or a different pitch from Robert Jennerick compared to, you know, he rolled back the clock to the 10 years ago when he was elected in the New York by-election, you know, facing a very strong challenge from UKIP, and he pitched himself very much as a more sort of centrist candidate and won that by-election

on the back of winning support of Labour voters to keep out UKIP. I was a Tory member for 21 years, and I was a very active Tory member, and I've been a councillor, and I've been a candidate, and I've done all sorts of things. And I'm the kind of person that really all the candidates for the Tory leadership ought to be trying to win back. But none of them excite me, none of them inspire me, and none of them will get me to come back. And that includes Robert. I just don't believe what he's saying. I think all of the four candidates were complicit in the activities and the record of the last government, whether that be lockdown, whether that be committing to net zero without any meaningful debate,

whether it's the highest tax burden since the war, or whether it's effectively open borders. Now, the Labour government that we have in place now is going to be worse. It's quite surprising how quickly it's become worse, but that's not to excuse the previous government and all of those who served in it for their element of responsibility in these issues that we're facing. So that includes Robert. And it's why I think we've seen a poll only in the last couple of days from Ipsos, a very well regarded pollster,

showing that compared to all four of the candidates, then the one figure on the right of British politics that stands head and shoulders above all of them, when measured as what it takes to be a good prime minister, it's Nigel. It's not Robert. It's not James. I knew you were going to say that. I knew you were going to say that. Look, it's been a bit of a car crash of a conference for Kemi Bailionok. The problem is she is not prepared to commit to any policies. So she's speaking in generalities and it got her tied up on the issue specifically of maternity leave so this was the interview that sparked all the trouble on times radio we need to make sure that we are creating an environment where people can work and people can have more freedom to make their individual decisions here nor there for people who can't afford to have a baby we need to have

more personal responsibility wasn't any maternity pay and people were having more babies. We need to make sure. Well that's because women often had to not work, they had to stay at home. So is that the solution? That's not, you're putting words in my mouth. The point I'm making Kate is that we have got to a point where government isn't working anymore and it's tinkering everywhere. Me giving you an exact amount of what maternity pay should be when circumstances are different everywhere is not where we're starting from. It's not where I'm starting from in this campaign. I'm talking about principles. What is it that we believe as conservatives, rather than throwing out lots of different policy ideas out there? We've got to a point where government has become about technocratic micro policy management. That's not what's going to get this country.

And the MSM, we're after her at conference today. Watch this. I don't regret things that I didn't say, but thank you for asking. I've said maternity pay is important. Are you all right? OK, let's be careful with other people. I said maternity pay is important. If we want to fix maternity pay, we need to start with making sure Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn. Iawn if you're taking 30 second clips, it's very easy to misinterpret.

But one of the things that I'm not going to let happen is allow other people to say things that I haven't said. Andrea Jenkins, isn't this the problem? Robert Jane Rick has been very clear about his policy positions. Kemi is not. No. I mean, we may as well call her Kemi Starmer instead of Kia Starmer because she's playing by the rule book that Kia did in not saying anything and not committing to anything. And look what we've ended up with.

So I don't risk it on Kemi personally. But you've never been a fan of her, have you, Andrea? Sorry? You've never been a fan of her, have you? No, just because she's so arrogant, the way she treats people. And, you know, Sir Bill Cash, he was a real stalwart of Brexit. You know, she schooled him like a child on the European Scrutiny Committee. And you don't speak to people like that.

It's about, even with the speaker, you know, I'm about traditions, actually. And you don't speak to people like that. She's very arrogant, and I don't like that um so I mean regarding the maternity thing I don't know if you saw my tweet yesterday did you Dan um yes I did but you go ahead explain well I just again I don't like hypocrisy I don't know why she waded into this um subject because I remember I think she'd only got in the reshuffle and she only got elected in 2017. She'd only been made a minister a week. It's about a week, two weeks max. And I recall that she had six months off maternity leave after becoming a minister after one or two weeks. And I'm not saying that's wrong, but another minister have to cover. So, yeah, taxpayers pay for that, of course.

So to me, if that's good enough for a minister, it's good enough for the general public to take six months off. So that's what I really didn't like. But can I just come back on before you go to Alex? Yes, of course. Alex's point earlier. Please. Alex, you're beginning to sound like the Lib Dems. It's so easy to hark from the sidelines.

Actually saying about, first of all, lockdown. I mean, look, my sister nearly died from a COVID jab. But when you was in government and you've been bombarded with information from the so-called scientists, it's like rabbit in the headlights. You know, the government try to act on the information that they've been given. Look, Boris has said since, I think his initial instinct about herd immunity was right.

But when they've been bombarded, so it's very easy to harp on the sidelines. And also saying about the biggest tax bed, and I agree as a Conservative, but look at the money that's spent um trying to help with the energy crisis um we saw what lockdown cost and so unfortunately we've got this massive debt and i would like to see more um list trust policies um you know rather than policy but it's very easy for you to say that, Alex. So, Alex, you're just acting like the Lib Dems. The reform are just acting like the Lib Dems. You can say whatever you want

because you haven't been in government. That's Andrea's point. Well, I've never been called a Lib Dem before. I'm not sure if that's a compliment or not. It's not. It's definitely not. OK, I'm fairly sure it's not. Well, in terms of electoral strategy, it might be, you know, winning 72 seats on a smaller share of the vote than we did,

but we could go down a whole different rabbit hole talking about electoral systems and reform. But, no, yes, the tax and the debt is largely to deal with, or a very large part is to deal with payment for lockdown and furlough and dealing with the energy situation. But, again, both of those are problems that are in no small way are of the government or the old government's making in net zero that's the biggest contributor to um to energy prices and the fact that we in this country now only today you know closing down our last ever coal power station

and on the same day as closing the blast furnace at port talbot it's absolutely tragic and devastating it's economic, social, industrial... But your government laid the way for this. Is your government in 2019? Theresa May, love her or not, as the case may be, she enshrined the net zero target in law with very minimal debate. And it was the Conservatives that did that. But I think the issue is, look,

this has been a big global movement um this whole net zero and there's been very few of us who's been brave to speak up about it in all honesty and i think that you know there's also international pressures as well on governments to to conform to this and it's only now actually that i think that what we're what we've seen in in other european countries rolling back and and actually the negative impact of these net zero targets and how unachievable they are that that people are seeing it um with a a realist perspective now so hindsight's an easy thing but i think we're in a different situation than we was five, seven years ago with information. OK, I hope we are. But for me, it wasn't hindsight. I could see this coming.

I left the Conservative Party conscious decision and because of those two issues. And I'm very glad to have been proven right. OK, just want to quickly bring in the third candidate who some people think is a bit of a dark horse and could end up in the final two and it's James Cleverley who made this 30 second pitch to conference today. I want to make sure this party is back in government at the next possible opportunity. Every single one of the people standing would make a fantastic leader of the party. I would make the best leader of them. I have had the most experience dealing with the media. I'm the only one that's dealt not with one but two great officers

of state. I'm the only one that's been the chairman of the party. I'm the only one that's won a general election. If you want to mess about, pick anyone. If you want to win, pick me. Andrea, do you think it's possible that he could actually force out Kemi and this could end up being generic versus Cleverley in the race? I think given the conference, actually, I think she could force out Kemi. Now, the thing is about James, I mean, I like James. He very funny guy is witty and is a nice guy, but I've been in the DFE with him department for education and he doesn't challenge the civil servants.

I never saw him challenge civil servants. It was more of a loving cause it's probably too nice actually. So I don't think the time, um, for his leadership is now. Um, that's a, I mean, Alex, he would be a dream, wouldn't he, for Reform UK?

Nigel Farage, nice guy, but he's a centrist. Yeah, I think that's a fair comment. And again, pointing to his record in government, as Home Secretary, presided over near- record net migration of nearly 700,000. So it's I think all of them, all of them have got their weaknesses and very few of them have got very, very, very many strengths. So there's been a couple of funny moments. For the migration issues, because you've got massive issues. In fact, I think why Jenry resigned, having been in that department, seeing the yes, minister, civil servants trying to block every opportunity. I mean, you know, pretty personally, like I do, Dan, the way she got made out to be a bully for just doing her job and actually

standing up to the civil servants is not as easy as this. We need the whole institutions ripping apart to rebuild. We need an American way of system where we bring in our own civil servants to get legislation through. There's so many blocks blocks alex it's not as simple as that so i would like to know how would reform deal with all this because rome cannot be built in a day and we saw what happened to boris um and pretty when they've challenged um challenge them absolutely 100 agree the home office not fit for purpose hasn't been for years and that's why one of the um the things that we would do is establish a completely separate department of immigration uh that would have that and immigration and border security that

would be its remit that would be its job but civil servants be working in it they'd be moved from one department like when we founded the brexit department you've got to get the um you know that knowledge from somewhere who understands the system. So are you just moving them into a new department, Alex? I think you want to recruit externally and bring people in who have proven... Well, see, what I think we need is we need political appointments. That is what's required. Like in America, that's what I said. Yeah, we need an American style system. Now, look, I wanted to bring some joy to the conferences,

which have been pretty dark and pretty grim. And I think it's actually in humour at the moment that sometimes political realities come out because we know the MSM is covering up so much. So first, Andrew Lawrence as a drunk LBC presenter. I wonder who he's talking about. Good morning. Well, as good as it can be in a country of gammons and bigots. I wonder who he's talking about. Now, bigots, Tory party conference hurts your ears, doesn't it? All the worst people, the stinkiest, ugliest, nastiest people congregating in the same place. And which city is hosting the Conservative Party conference? Birmingham. Could there be any greater smear on Birmingham's good reputation

than their willingness to host a Tory party conference? Well, I hope it was worth it, Birmingham, because let me tell you, I won't be visiting you any time soon. Why are the Tories even bothering to have a conference after the utter humiliation of the general election result? Why would they want to show their faces in public after being utterly rejected by voters? How are there even any Tories left? Why haven't they shuffled off to live alone in the woods, filled with a deep and inescapable sense of personal shame? Why are they even still

alive? The way they systematically destroyed this country over 14 years of total misgovernment, some of them deserve the death penalty. I'll tell you how embarrassing the Tory party conference is. Not even Boris has turned up. He's too busy promoting his new book where he throws all his friends under a bus. And then Katie Hopkins as Rachel Reeves at Labour conference. Name is Chancellor Rachel Reeves. Ceramic bob head, hair by Lego, dress by Lord Ali fresh from kissed armour shitter and heating provided by the tax player.

My speechwriter says this speech is about being together. He says to smile, say our and we and collective endeavour. Together, collective endeavour, our we. You may know I am the first female ever to be in politics and to be Chancellor ever, ever in 800 years. Obviously Maggie Thatcher was up against it 50 years ago when she was actually Prime Minister, but we don't talk about her anymore and we've taken her picture off the walls of Number 10 Downing Street. I am the first woman ever to be in politics. I mean, Andrew, it's true, isn't it?

The cheek of Rachel Reeves constantly going on about being a woman. When you guys had Margaret Thatcher in the late 70s, and Labour has never even come close to having a female leader. Although maybe we'll see. I agree. Maybe we'll see if this Starmer stuff will expose. Now look, big Carol Vorderman news. She's quit Wales.

This is apparently because of a Labour tax policy. And I'm going to get the reaction of Alex Wilson and Andrea Jenkins in just one minute to this story and tell you all about it. So don't go anywhere. But first, it's the best time of year. Football is back. We're talking Premier League in the UK and tell you all about it so don't go anywhere but first it's the best time of year football is back we're talking premier league in the uk and in the us nfl sundays and college football saturdays with that the glorious kind of fantasy football lineups is back too so it's where your own manager comes alive setting the perfect fantasy roster scream net your tv

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after deciding to quit Wales because Labour, yes, that's right, Labour, the party that she thought was going to be so brilliant for everyone, has decided to increase council tax threefold on her luxury home in Pembrokeshire. Andrea Jenkins, isn't this absolute proof that the champagne socialists are all talk but actually when it comes for them they're out I mean one thing I think should be pleased about that

they're not actually taxing selfies, low cut scantily clad selfies or I should be bankrupt Dad There's another one, this was inside the house apparently but again yes of course um i mean let's see how how her and also the likes of um of gary liniker um remain silent after the next

budget because i think there's going to be lots of hammering of those who's got wealth in the budget and the middle classes as well i mean the thing that's fascinating alex is she said this was her fantasy home she said that she'd never want to leave she bought it for 350 000 pounds she's now made a 100 000 pound profit on it and surely if miss vorderman really is what she claims to be She wouldn't mind paying triple the council tax under Labour. Yeah, and perhaps she's selling it early to avoid any threat of being stung for capital gains tax with what may happen in the budget. I think the real message here is Labour will always want to put up taxes

and we're about to find that out in a big way in a few weeks' time. It is interesting to see, though, isn't it, Andrea, the way that these hard left MSM figures are trying to justify the unjustifiable. It's not just Carol Vorderman, although she is one of the worst, it's James O'Brien, Gary Lineker, as Alex mentions, it's Paul Brand, it's Ben Kentish. They are proving so quickly that they were never about holding your government to account. They just wanted labour and power at any cost. And now they are becoming fanboys and activists not journalists

but i think haven't they always been that these people yeah and um you know there's there's no true um really there's with people like that i don't know how they um keep in a role to be honest with you because we know that mainstream media is heavily regulated, meant to show both sides of the story, both sides of politics. But it doesn't seem to happen on their shows, does it, Dan? No, indeed. But you remember Vorderman, Andrea, used to be all over all of your people. She was having those snow snowball fights with uh david cameron she was uh charming boris johnson at number 10 downing street she was at the races with matt hankoff

she was our mathematics star wasn't she yeah so i actually think it's a grift on her part it's a it's it's you know something that actually has been done for purely strategic reasons. And now she just doesn't like the reality of Labour and government, because let's be honest, socialism is hell for all of us. Rich or poor. I think you've hit the nail on the head there, Dan, to be honest. Yeah, indeed. Indeed. Well, a fabulous superstar panel today.

Thank you so much to Dame Andrea Jenkins, former Conservative Education Minister and Reform UK's London Assembly member, Alex Wilson, making his outspoken debut. Now, coming up next in the Uncancelled After Show, Samantha Markle and Donald Trump's close friend and attorney, Peter Tickton, here for an exclusive interview about their ongoing court case against Meghan, the Duchess of Sussex. You know, it's very important to me that we have a safe space not patrolled by big tech, where censorship and control runs deep. So that's why I've launched www.outspoken.live. It is our membership section where you get half an hour of extra content every single day. So what

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Outspoken is now available daily as a podcast. You can listen to us on the move wherever you are. I'd be really grateful if you would subscribe at Spotify or Apple Podcasts. I've put the links to both of those in the show notes below this episode. And please, if you're listening on the podcast, rate and review because that means that other people get access to this podcast. So thank you very much for that too. Now we are back every weekday at 5 p.m. UK time, midday Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hit subscribe right now on YouTube and Rumble. Most importantly, I promise to keep fighting for you and we'll see you on the after show in just one moment with Samantha Markle.