Dan Wootton Outspoken - NIGEL FARAGE & DOUGLAS MURRAY WAR OVER TOMMY ROBINSON AS REFORM UK'S HOWARD COX QUITS

Episode Date: January 13, 2025

A Reform UK civil war breaks out over Tommy Robinson, with Nigel Farage increasingly at odds with major figures on the right like Douglas Murray. The Reform split has led to the brutal axing of the party’s London mayoral candidate Howard Cox, who joins Dan live. PLUS: Ex-Labour minister Ivor Caplin is arrested after a paedophile sting but why is the MSM suspiciously quiet? AND: Ruthless Scheming Sturgeon splits from her husband Peter Murrell, as both remain under investigation over the SNP’s so-called missing millions. I’ll tell you how the ex-Scottish First Minister announced the news and what it really means. THEN IN THE UNCANCELLED AFTERSHOW: Prince Harry and Meghan Markle become disaster tourists, as Hollywood veterans lash out at the fake royals for exploiting the LA wild fires. We’ll cross to the US to team up with the Royal News Network. Sign up to watch at www.outspoken.live. To watch the exclusive Uncancelled After Show for 30-minutes extra content EVERY weekday, sign up at: https://outspoken.live/premium LIKE & SUBSCRIBE for new videos every day:    / @danwoottonoutspoken   ---------- Today’s Sponsors: SURFSHARK - Go to https://surfshark.com/outspoken for an extra four months of Surfshark at an unbeatable price VERSO - https://buy.ver.so/outspoken - Use code OUTSPOKEN to save 15% on your first order. MANSCAPED - https://manscaped.com – get 20% off + free shipping with the code Outspoken. ---------- Dan Wootton Outspoken is fan funded through monthly and one-time donations: https://www.outspoken.live ---------- Join Dan's Substack community: https://www.danwoottonoutspoken.com ---------- Find the full audio show wherever you get your podcasts: Apple — https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast... Spotify — https://open.spotify.com/show/19Ltone... ---------- Follow Dan on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@outspokendan?... Follow Dan on Twitter: https://x.com/danwootton Follow Dan on Facebook:   / danwootton   Follow Dan on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danwootton/... #DanWootton #DanWoottonOutspoken #news #outspoken Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

No spin, no bias, no censorship. I'm Dan Wooten. This is Outspoken. We are live with episode number 138. You know what to do, but if this is your first time, click and subscribe to this new independent news source. Turn on the notification bell, then you're alerted to our live shows, uncancelled interviews and special royal episodes. And it is so good to be back with you live in 2025. The uncancelled after show returns today because as you may have been aware, as we ran our special episodes last week with Lady Colin Campbell, Angela Levin, Charlie Lawson and the body language guy, I was off with my family in New Zealand. I thought I'd show you some of my favourite pictures from my little break.

That's my niece, Ivy Dan, my best friends from school, my family, my partner, Alan, with Ivy, my cousins, Lucy and Cameron, my mum, Mary, and of course my sister, Ash, and my dad, John, my auntie, Hallie, my mum, Mary, and of course my sister Ash, and my dad John, my auntie Hallie, my uncle Alan. It was a really, really special time. Obviously, I'm never going to leave you without content, so I hope you enjoyed the episodes. But we are back to the news, and breaking right now, a Reform UK civil war breaks out over Tommy Robinson, with Nigel Farage increasingly at odds with major figures on the right, like Douglas Murray.

Tommy Robinson is a man from a working class background in Luton. There are many things to be said in favour of him and what he's done. There's many things to be said, criticising some of his tactics and some of his words and much more. But essentially, he is one of a quite large number, actually, not to be underestimated, a large number of working class people in this country who saw this happen to relatives of theirs, who had girls in their families who were drugged and raped by Muslim gangs. The reform split has led to the brutal axing of the party's London mayoral candidate,

Howard Cox, and he's going to join me live, straight after my digest, outlining what's really going on. Also coming up on the show today, ex-Labour minister Ivor Kaplan arrested after a paedophile sting. But why is the MSM so suspiciously quiet? Why has Nigel Farage opened the door for the return of ISIS bride Shamima Begum? And could you believe this? Today, ruthless, scheming Sturgeon splits from her husband, Peter Morrell, as both remain under investigation over the SNP's so-called missing millions. I'll tell you how the ex-Scottish First Minister announced the news and what it really means. Then in the uncancelled after show, Prince Harry and Meghan Markle become disaster tourists as Hollywood veterans lash out at the fake royals for exploiting the LA wildfires.

We're going to cross to the US to team up with the Royal News Network. Britney's really furious, actually. Lady Colin Campbell has lots of breaking news on this as well. Remember, the Uncancelled After Show, now broadcast exclusively daily and on demand. We're back from today on Substack. You can get to it by visiting www.outspoken.live. A monthly paid membership to the after show costs just £5 a month plus VAT. And as well as that, you'll get all my exclusive reporting and columns, access to our live chats on the Substack app and the chance to join a thriving community. Most importantly, it is a safe space completely

free of big tech censorship. However, the most important thing for me is that you just sign up, you join the community, you can do so completely for free. It is a way to stay in touch with me, www.outspoken.live. But now, let's go. How do you solve a, in inverted commas, a problem like Tommy Robinson? After Elon Musk's dramatic intervention, seemingly ending his support for Nigel Farage as Reform UK leader, the Brexit king is doubling down, purging his party of anyone who has spoken up for the political prisoner. Now, I should stress again that Tommy told me directly, face to face, when I spent three hours with him in prison last month, that he doesn't want to join reform. He simply wants Nigel's attacks to end. But Farage is having none of that, defending the decision to effectively axe Howard Cox, the brilliant Fairfuel campaigner who was reform's candidate for London mayor.

What's going on in your party? Howard Cox says he was forced out because he had some support for Tommy Robinson. Are you purging supporters of him? No, Howard Cox made a silly comment. You know, the whole country is run by immigrants. Well, that's clearly not true. Yes, he supports Tommy Robinson. Look, fine. If people want to like the guy, that's fine. But don't advocate that he should join our party. Let Robinson do what the hell he wants to do. We're a political party and never the twain shall meet. Is that a deal-breaker now? So any members of your party who say, I support Tommy Robinson, will be ejected? Well, no, you can support him. I don't think he should be in solitary confinement. I think that's wrong. I think he's been dealt with very harshly, but he is a repeated lawbreaker over many, many years. Violence,

entering America on a false passport. I mean, it's a list as long as your arm and that doesn't suit a political party. So people can say, look, we admire what he said about grooming gangs or what else, but please don't tell me he should be part of reform. That doesn't work.

I only ask because last week in Leicester, two of those individuals in the audience shouted at Lee Anderson, we want Tommy Robinson or showed some... Why aren't those guys being chucked out of your conferences? I think Lee made it perfectly clear, shut up or get out. You know, and 998 didn't say that. Now, what's fascinating is that Howard Cox's departure was actually sparked, according to Nigel, by something he said right here on Outspoken. So given his unhappiness

with Nigel about what he said, I wanted to play you Howard's comments on this show in their full context. So you can watch and judge for yourself if he said anything out of line. I certainly don't think so. Watch. The reporting of this is that Sky News have since deleted the videos that you've shown already in your opening monologue. And I have to ask the question why why would they delete videos showing muslim men running around a roundabout in their cars the way they were and stabbing tires and carrying weapons why would they delete those videos it's very sinister in my view it is incredibly sinister probably under probably under pressure from uh from the government it wouldn't surprise me that

they've had someone actually speak to them in their shell-like ears and saying, look, I don't think that's a good thing. You're encouraging issues of actually... The fact is, let's face it, we are being ruled by immigrants at the moment in time. What is happening at the moment in time? And that's what we need to do.

And I agree with Jacob Rees-Mogg, for example, that immigration must be halted completely. We must stop. And if we can do that right away now, we might actually get on top of what the problem we're seeing right across in all our major cities. Now, I think the vast majority of Brits would agree with what Howard Cox had to say then. Was it really a justification to boot him out or at least encourage his exit from Reform UK? What is clear to me is that there is now a very obvious split on the right as to how to deal with

the issues of Islam, mass immigration, Pakistani rape gangs, and yes, Tommy Robinson. And I want to show you the two sides of the Tommy Robinson debate, because when it comes to Douglas Murray, I think he's a figure who gets it right. Tommy Robinson is a man from a working class background in Luton. There are many things to be said in favour of him and what he's done. There's many things to be said, criticising some of his tactics and some of his words and much more. But essentially, he is one of a quite large number, actually not to be underestimated,

a large number of working class people in this country who saw this happen to relatives of theirs, who had girls in their families who were drugged and raped by Muslim gangs. And when they went to the police, they didn't get any help. When they went to the council, they didn't get any help. When they went to their MPs, generally they didn't get any help. If they organised a protest movement, so-called anti-fascist groups would immediately say, are far right, because of course if you're working class in our country and you don't like the mass rape of young white girls, you're of course, necessarily, must be a Nazi.

All of this was done to make it utterly impossible for anybody to discuss this, and particularly to crack down as hard as possible on anyone who was white and working class and felt voiceless. And instead of giving these people any sympathy or any hearing, most of the media, most of the political class turned away. Now, I think Douglas Murray gets it right. Someone who gets it wrong is Patrick Christie's now of GB News. This is what he had to say about Tommy Robinson. Watch. The appointment of Tommy Robinson in this loose role as advisor on grooming gangs. A,

what advice do you need on grooming gangs? B, do you want that advice coming from a man like Tommy Robinson? It's not a good look for the party whatsoever. Frankly, it's not a good look for society. And I do really think this just demonstrates actually that there is an undercurrent, not this subtle level of racism that's been levelled at UKIP in the past. I think you could argue that this is now much more overt. Then there's Tommy himself, who is no longer holding back about Nigel's attacks with this dramatic intervention from behind bars. When you're in prison, small things are big things, and this isn't even a small thing.

And they're big things because you sit and stew about them all day. And to say last week I was disappointed, or this week I've been disappointed with Nigel Farage is an understatement. But I've gone from disappointment to outraged, as he's now lied on national radio. He's made the allegation that I have a criminal conviction for violence against women. Robinson's talked about this, but he has a criminal record, a list as long as your arm, violence, violence against women. Robinson's talked about this, but he has a criminal record, a list as long as your arm,

violence, violence against women. It's an out-and-out lie. Nigel's a big voice, a serious voice. He gets taken seriously. People believe what he says. And he, time and time again now this week, he's took his opportunity to defame me, to slander me, to lie about me. And in a week where he sat, and I watched because he accused Kemi of lying about him, because Kemi said he played with a few numbers on his membership scheme. It's a bit of a different line to make him the ultimate accusation that I am violent against women.

What's frustrating for me about this is I think it could soon erupt into a full-on civil war, but it is entirely unnecessary. As you know, as loyal viewers know, I am a critical friend of Reform UK, Nigel Farage, Tommy Robinson, and Elon Musk. Not to mention, by the way, some Tories too, Liz Truss and Robert Jenrick. For us to save Britain, the right needs to be attacking the rape gang and paedophile apologists in government, not each other. And I will give so much credit to Reform UK. Look at the brilliant address Lee Anderson gave at the weekend.

Look who we've got running the country. Free gear Kia. Rachel from Accounts. You know that one, don't you? We've got that famous no-brainer, Angela Rayner. Mad Milliband, the net zero fanatic. And let's not forget our very own mastermind, David Lammy. Yeah.

It's not meant to be funny, this, isn't it? He's a proper charmer, isn't he? Like, listen, I hope nobody's filming this. But keep this one to yourselves. We've got over 6,000 villagers in the United Kingdom. And if you took the village idiot from every village, right, and put them 6,000 village idiots into Tottenham,

David Lammy would still be the village idiot. And look, that is brilliant stuff. And I totally understand why Reform UK is on the march. But here's the thing, they cannot be arrogant because there are serious challenges ahead, especially with news that Musk has now been advised by Dominic Cummings, who is, let's be honest, one of the biggest critics of Farage on the right. Watch. What's your thoughts on Reform UK and Farage's re-entry into politics? It's sort of depressing, basically, I think, because Farage is not, Farage is basically like Tory MPs at heart. His goal is just to be on the Stupid Today

programme on the BBC. He's not actually there to get anything done. So he's there to profit from people being upset with the system, but he doesn't have real answers for what to do. And he always surrounds himself with useless

characters who can't build anything. So the party itself isn't really going anywhere. It tops out at roughly 15%. There's 15% of the country pretty much like Farage and hate everybody else. And he can get that 15% this year. He got 15% in 2015. But it's never going to solve the actual problem. And what Elon Musk has done is move the Overton window.

Because no matter how hard the MSM might try, Tommy Robinson can no longer be ignored. And there's this great moment on the sly news that proved it. Nicole, thank you so much for joining us here on the program. Thank you. Free Tommy Robinson. Cue awkward silence and it is that awkward silence throughout the establishment throughout the mainstream media so let's start bursting their bubble some more now the uncancelled interview and the man at the center of the drama howard cox of the fair fuel campaign previously a reform

uk candidate at the general election and of course the man who the party chose to stand against and the london merrilt he joins me now and howard look one, I was quite shocked to find out that it was your appearance on Outspoken back in August, which actually is being used as justification by Nigel Farage as to why you left the party. And Alex Wilson, who is the Reform UK member on the London Assembly, actually posted on X in regards to this saying, Howard, I am sorry you've left us. We were a great team in the London election and you did a cracking job in Dover in just a few short weeks. However, you asked for evidence of the quote Nigel has attributed to you. Here it is. And then he posted the screenshot of you appearing on

Outspoken. Now, at the time, did you get any pushback out from people within the party in terms of what you had said to me? Hello, Dan. Good to see you back and lovely pictures. Your family are beautiful pictures. Thank you. Happy New Year. Yeah. Happy New Year, my friend. The thing is, you hit the nail on the head, is that at that time when I said it, no one said a word. Not a word. No one said a peep to me. Mind you, no one has said a peep to me since I stood for election or since I stood for London mayor. Either of the elections I stood for. No one from head office since Zia has joined and he's running the office, the headquarters, has spoken to me. It's very disrespectful, but hey, that's politics.

You've got to have a thick skin in this sort of thing. And from my point of view, they had the chance to say, Howard, you said a stupid thing. But as you quite rightly played the whole interview, I was making the point at the time that, you know, we are being ruled by immigrants and immigration based on the media, the stories, what was going around at the time,

all the protests, etc. And the fact that, you know, Keir Starmer was ignoring various things that related to the fact that these protests were going on about immigration and immigrants. And my point was that I was very proud to say that Tommy Robinson was one of the few people who tried to make a difference to show, to expose what was happening right across the country, not just in Oldham or Rotherham or all those places, that our children were being systematically raped. So to cut a long story short, I was shocked at the time. And, you know, I'm glad to be out of the party now. But let me say this quite clearly for everyone listening.

I still support Reform UK's policies. And that's where I'm a critical friend with regard to it. But I've said one thing wrong, according to the party, and therefore my face doesn't fit. And I was sent in three days before I resigned a text from a senior member of the party that said, if you don't stop basically talking about Tommy Robinson, you risk being expelled. Which you obviously didn't want. So you felt there was a very clear line, which was either shut up about Robinson, or you're going to be booted out. So you made the decision to leave. And of course, it is odd, given free speech is such a priority of Reform UK, or at least we thought it was. But now we have the chairman, Zia Youssef, seeming to imply that folk in the media like me who are critical friends, I mean, I voted for Reform UK. Come on. I love Nigel in so many ways. I've been so supportive of him. He

was a colleague of mine for nearly three years at GB News. But it feels like they are so thin-skinned that they cannot take criticism. And I'm sorry, if you want to become the party of government, then you actually need criticism. And I think what Elon Musk did was force the issue on Tommy Robinson. What is quite nuts to me, though, Howard, is that Tommy doesn't want to join the party. He doesn't want to join Reform UK. He just wants the attacks on him from Reform UK to stop. Well, you're right, Dan. My point, as I said, and I've said this on many interviews, including with you, right across from GB News, Talk TV, you name it, and all sorts of places, I've simply said this. I don't know Tommy Robinson. I've never met him.

I don't know. All I know is that that man is trying to highlight the problems, these disgusting, these heinous issues of our kids being raped right across the country. And he should be congratulated on that. He doesn't want to join. And I don't think he should join Reform UK. Far from it. I think he should set up his own party, to be honest. And I don't think he should join Reform UK. Far from it. I think he should set up his own party, to be honest. And I think he'd get quite a few people.

And that's the point. Do you remember the time that Richard Tice said, you know, we don't want that lot to be members of Reform? And that lot who were supporting Tommy, most of them were reformed UK voters. Yes, although you told me at the time, Howard, that Nigel had actually admitted to you that Richard Tice had gone too far in his description of the term. Yeah, he said he'd gone over the top. He said, and that's when Nigel was talking to me a bit. Obviously, he hasn't spoken to me since. And obviously, Richard feels a bit betrayed by me

he thinks for uh mentioning that but i was so angry uh from the point of of what uh richard came out with that lot and he's also used the phrase nut jobs as well this is totally and utterly wrong the right hand side of politics is totally disparate it's totally split and it needs someone to bring it together. And you've been saying it for a long time. And I don't understand what Nigel's playing at. I respect him. He's done incredible things with Brexit.

I've enjoyed his company for 10 years. I've known him. And one reason why Richard asked me to, you know, to stand as London mayor. Well, in fact, he actually was called by Nigel, I understand. And Nigel said, that's the best idea I never had. So, you know, I was I was definitely, you know, popular. Everyone loved me, etc. But as soon as I was surplus requirements, I only came second in the Dover and Deal election after three and a half weeks, campaigned down there with 23 percent of the vote. I was, you know, totally superfluous.

I wasn't worth talking to. And I thought that was disrespectful. disrespectful but hey i'm not going to moan about that anymore i'd like this one to get you know buried totally and people understand that i totally for reform uk i think they should get into government i'd love to see them into government unless the tories get their act together and become a thatcherite government again because that's what i am and then then, you know, if we could do that, then fine. But please stop. I mean, I've got so many people contacting me, Dan, from branches, reform branches around the country. I won't digress some of what they told me, but basically they feel intimidated. They feel though there's a dictatorship now coming from the centre, the headquarters of a reform. And that's so sad, really. Well, it is sad. It really is sad. And for me, I think it was Ezra Levent of Rebel News who summed up the choice that Nigel has to make best. And I just want to read you out what he posted on this.

It's quite long, but I really, really think it is worth sharing it in full. So Ezra Levent said, By the way, I think Nigel Farage is a great man, certainly one of the most consequential British leaders in a generation. Without him, there would be no Brexit, and his fight against debanking showed great leadership. Frankly, he should be knighted. But I think he's always looking over his shoulder, afraid of being labelled far right by the regime media.

Although he attacks the establishment daily, he still cares too much about what they think of him. There's so much peer pressure in the UK. It's so clubby. And then there's the added layer of classism. Much of the criticism of Tommy, and indeed a reason the thousands of rape victims were ignored, is snaring condescension towards the white working class. In America, Donald Trump fully embraces his outsider status, knowing he could be bigger than those who sneered at him. I think Farage hasn't quite let go of wanting to be on the inside. I see other conservative pundits in the UK who I know

are privately supportive of Tommy putting on exaggerated performances of denouncing Tommy. They're not doing that because they believe it, but because they think denouncing Tommy is a very showy manner. And it gives them a sort of insurance policy against being called far right themselves. They're joining a mob against Tommy, lest the mob turn on them. Farage didn't have to endorse Tommy. Tommy wasn't asking for that. He wasn't asking to join their party. But even just raising questions about Tommy's brutal and unprecedented treatment in prison was just too scary for Farage. It would cross a line he hasn't crossed in 30 years of public life. I don't think Farage has to be quite so careful in the era of

citizen journalism and social media. I think Elon Musk was inviting Farage to replace his peer group of snobby insiders with a different, bigger, bolder peer group. Farage declined. And I just thought Ezra summed it up perfectly. I was just nodding my head in agreement when I read that for the first time, Howard Cox. And it's very similar to what Dominic Cummings said, that Nigel still cares about going on the Today programme. F them, F the BBC. You don't need them anymore. Just like Trump doesn't need the mainstream media in the US.

He proved that. You're absolutely right. But when I joined Reform UK in 2023, when I was invited to be London mayor by Richard Tice, which took a lot of thinking and sitting down with my wife, saying, is this the right thing to do? I'm approaching 70. Is this the right thing to do?

But because of you, Les, because of Sadiq Khan, what he was doing in ruining London, I was best placed to help that. And I definitely put put reform on the map as a result of that. At that point, Nigel wasn't leader. And right up to the election of in May of the London mayor, Nigel still hadn't declared being leader. It wasn't until four weeks, you know, when when Sunat, you know, ran for the hills and said, right, let's have a general election. He decided to put his head on above the parapet. And that's the issue for me. It's all about suiting what's happening now.

I've always said I've said this many, many times to people. I don't follow an individual. I follow the policies and that's what it's about. And I go back to my point just now, being a good old Thatterite, you know, small state, low tax, protecting our borders. That's what reform we're doing. No one else was doing that because we had the uniparties. So from my point of view, that's what I joined and that's what I was promoting. I wasn't promoting Nigel. I was promoting Reform UK. Absolutely. And that is what a political movement should be. Of course, you do need a charismatic leader. And I think the Americans understand what's going on so much better at the moment. I wanted to show you this very impassioned address from Tim Pool on Timcast, where he was responding directly, not so much to Farage, but more Piers Morgan, who is slowly coming around, I think, slowly coming around when it comes to Tommy Robinson. But Tim Pool explains why the issue in the British media should not be Tommy's indiscretions from years ago.

It should be the issues that he is raising. Watch this. It comes back to this. If Piers or anybody else wants to insult Tommy, my response is, so what? I don't know. I don't care. Explain to me why the one guy that was leading rallies to call out

the systemic rape of children was getting locked up and silenced and put in jail. Why weren't you doing it? Why wasn't the UK government doing it? Why weren't the cops doing it? Why was it Tommy Robinson? Oh, he's a con artist. Well, what the freaking do? At least we had one con artist, according to you, willing to speak up and inform someone like me. So I'll say it again. I like peers. I really do. I've been on a show several times. I look forward to going on again. And maybe he just doesn't understand.

Maybe he's wrong. Maybe it's intentional. I don't know. But don't you get it? This is why I don't believe you. The things they were doing to these children, man, these transcripts that came out, they fill me with a rage I have never experienced. The horrors. Man, there's so much dirty stuff in this world. And you say Tommy's a con artist. Fine. Whatever. At least I can thank the con artist for letting me know, because I would not have known about this if it were not for him. I mean, Tim Pool gets it, doesn't he, Howard Cox? And by the way, I've been sticking up for Reform UK's MP James McMurdoch, who went to jail when he was 19 years old after an altercation with his girlfriend. Totally turned his life around.

This guy deserves a second chance. So does Tommy Robinson, actually. You also say about Donald Trump. We've all got this. He's got to be the leader of the western world um this guy's also got a bit of a criminal background hasn't he who cares what matters at the moment in time is what's happening with these grooming gangs and I don't call them grooming gangs I call them rape gangs and from that point of view well people have got to realize

that and you know that every person I talk to I've got huge numbers of people writing to me, emailing me, texting me, WhatsAppping me, saying, well done, standing up for your principles. I could easily have got into an easy seat. I understand Dover and Deal now, according to electoral calculus, reform is in the lead. And, you know, obviously, I've got a lot to do with that. But I've cooked my gooses. No way back for me. I'm not worried about that. The important thing is I want people like Tommy Robinson to get some recognition for the good work he's been doing and also the respect. I don't give a damn about his background. I don't give a damn about it one bit. No, indeed. And look, I hope that things are going to change over the next couple of years, Howard Cox, because my God, you would be such an incredible MP. You're exactly the sort of candidate that Reform UK needs. Look at what you've done with Fairfuel. Look at how you fought for motorists and actually made

change over the years. And sometimes that means that Nigel is going to have to put up with someone who might not agree with him on every issue. And that's okay. I think Trump has shown actually there are ways to bring people back into the fold. Marco Rubio is about to be his Secretary of State. Look at some of the things that Marco Rubio said about Donald Trump. So for me, I hope it isn't the end of the road for you in UK politics, but I guess time will tell. But stand by, Howard Cox, because we're going to move on now to this very, very disturbing story over the weekend.

Breaking right now, Ivor Kaplan, the former Labour veterans minister, a man who remains close to the media class in the UK and the political class, followed on X by Gordon Brown, by Rachel Reeves, by Angela Rayner, was caught at the weekend in a sting by Stop Stings UK. They broadcast it live on Facebook. The claim, the allegation, is that he was on his way to meet a child. Watch what happened. You told this child that you was going to go meet him.

That wasn't because Stephen will be at work. At one o'clock, you said that you were going to go and meet him at quarter to. If we could. I don't know. Ah, yeah, you see. I don't know. But wait, but here's the slippery thing. You said you had no intention, but now you can see that actually, oh, actually, yeah, I might have been planning to take this child to meet Stephen.

So you admit that that's what you were trying to do. But I don't know his age. You know his age actively. This child regularly... If I knew his actual age... This child... I don't know that. Then I wouldn't do anything.

This child regularly told you that they were at school and they were doing school-related activity. Now, as a result of that sting, which was broadcast live on Facebook, Ivor Kaplan, the former Labour minister under Tony Blair, was arrested. And sweets. Right, I'm just going to search you before we go in there, OK? How many layers have you got underneath this? There's sweets in there as well. Oh, that's more good.

There's sweets in the back. There's nothing. There's no pockets. And what are we doing? OK, it's fine. Now, this guy, who is still followed, is still in the inner circle of all of these Labour bigwigs, had been posting the most explicit images and content

on his ex-page for many, many months, hiding it in plain sight. Yet he was still booked by GB News just a few days before his arrest to, wait for it, attack Elon Musk. Is that, of course, what I am really, really against of what Musk has said, you know, around obviously one of our very longstanding members and also the prime minister himself. Those type of comments are not acceptable and they've not been acceptable by what he said. And clearly that is something that I think the United States will have to take up as a matter for them once there is a new president in a couple of weeks.

Howard Cox, this is an utterly extraordinary story. Of course, I will stress, as I always do, this man is innocent until proven guilty. However, Howard Cox, can you just imagine the mainstream media reaction if a former conservative minister had been caught up in this sort of sting, if a Reform UK candidate had been caught up in this sort of sting. And instead, we're getting radio silence from those usual suspects over this. You're absolutely right. And you beautifully presented as ever.

I mean, what gets me, who's known about this over the years? The CPS, the police? I understand a lot of people have known about this. I mean, how long has it been going on? When he was in government, or I think he was in the government, he became a minister, didn't he? Yes, he was a minister. He was the veterans minister.

Yeah, that's right. 2003, I do remember it now. So for eight years, he was in government. And I cannot believe that that person was with this disgusting taste in whatever you want to call it, has been allowed to actually stay in government, especially if people knew. It reminds me of all the sort of things that, you know, we go back to the stage who was in charge of the CPS at the time. I wonder who was. And the thing is, this is not a one off. Howard Cox, this is not a one-off, Howard Cox.

This is not a one-off. No. There is a long list of Labour figures who are not just accused of paedophilia, have actually been convicted. Yes, it's ridiculous, isn't it? I mean, the whole thing, I just don't know where this has come from, how it's been allowed to carry on. And someone in the higher echelons of law and legal practice must have

actually known about these things. And it's great to hear Musk come out and call him a creep. I think he was being kind. That's a kind descriptor of a man. Well, it's very much an understatement. And we know the game plan, though, don't we, Howard? We know the game plan of how Labour and this corrupt administration intends to deal with it.

So look at this headline from The Guardian based on an interview with Wes Streety, who said grooming gang rhetoric risks inciting mass violence. And Darren Grimes, my good friend, posted on X in regards to this, I cannot tell you how dangerous this is. Labour's health secretary has warned there will be a far-right massacre if we continue discussing grooming gangs. These scare tactics and warnings of racist reprisals are exactly why Labour and the authorities dismissed those poor girls. to shut us up about this issue, suggesting that we are somehow encouraging terrorists is sick, is twisted, and we're not going to be suckered by this sort of threat anymore. Sorry, Howard, I'm just so angry about it, but over to you. Don't worry, I'm in awe of the way you said it.

But this is an orchestrated cover-up. Everything that's going on from Southpaw to the grooming gangs, the rape gangs, everything is being pushed under the carpet by saying we're not going to have a national inquiry and all those things. We've already had one. You know, we've got 20 recommendations and the Tories didn't do it. They blame everyone else. But for God's sake, everyone's calling for this. Andy Burnham, Mahmood and another Labour guy is calling for it. Everyone with common sense and really caring about these things must get the truth out for these people. And if these people have these sexual proclivities and allowed to go on and they're governing our country, what are we going to what's going to be the future for our children? It scares the living daylights out of me, Dan. Me too. Me too. Now, look, another big

breaking story over the weekend is this discussion, which first came from the Trump administration and a good friend of this show, Sebastian Gorka, over whether the UK should be forced to take back its ISIS defectors, including Shamima Begum. Now, I'm sorry, I give this short shrift. There is no way, no way that I will even open my brain to thinking that Shamima Begum should return to this country. A woman who, let's just remember, justified, tried to justify the ISIS bombing of the Ariana Grande concert, tried to justify the terrorism that has been wrought across this country from ISIS, and who, regardless of how she might claim that she was just an innocent ISIS bride, actually was sewing the suicide vests for the bombers. So no way, no way do I want to have her back. But Howard Cox, I want to show you in full now this video from your former leader,

Nigel Farage, who was asked about the issue on ITV and was thoughtful about it. And look, Reform UK folks say it's completely outrageous to suggest that Nigel was opening the door to Shamima's return. What I want to do is play the full interview so it's in context and so nothing can be misunderstood. So let's watch this together, Howard, and then I'll get you to respond off the back. He suggested this week, suggested, I know he's said he's been misquoted,

but he suggested that Britain should think about bringing back some UK members of Islamic State from Syria to the UK. Is he right? I find it very difficult. Seb is a friend, as indeed half the Cabinet are. I've known him a long, long time. I've got great respect for him. I think he'd do a great job.

It's very difficult for us to think we should take back people, Shemima Begum and others, and instinctively, instinctively it's not something I want to do. Gorka argues that if we and other European countries don't take back these people and put them in prison here, they will get out of prison under the new Syrian regime, leading to a problem that in the end we may all have to fight. And it could destabilize Syria.

It could well... Well, I'm not even sure Syria's stable. So, as I say, my instinctive reaction is to say, no, we don't want these people. But if Gorka's right, if there's a real risk that thousands of these people get out of prison and start causing mayhem, maybe he's got a point. You think it's something the UK should consider bringing back Shamima Begum? I've never wanted to. I've instinctively never wanted to.

And I'm now thoughtful. I'm thoughtful. I don't classify her as an ISIS, an all-out isis killer um so she's sort of less she is a lesser part of the equation do you think the uk government should listen to this do you think they should be considering bringing back some of these isis supporters back to the uk i think what gawker has done is started a debate not one that i wanted to have and not one the british government wanted to have but now we're going to have to and he's got a point regrettably regrettably he thinks he does and remember Howard Cox uh Keir Starmer has always wanted to bring Shamima Begum back uh what did you make of Nigel's answer well it's there's a bit of hypocrisy all around there I mean he's attacking me for saying we're being

ruled by immigrants and that was taken out of context. And now his party is saying that what he said just then has been taken out of context. It's horses for courses, and it really upsets me. It goes on, no way should this girl come back. No way. She's 25 years of age. She's had, I understand she's had three

children. Where are they? Are they coming back with her? Are they dead? What's going on? They are dead. And she didn't even give a damn no about the death of her children i mean this i've really looked into this woman i i i know people who have spent a lot of time with her she is reprehensible and this whole makeover so that she looks like she's Western now. That is strategic, Howard. I agree with you. But one thing with what Nigel just said just now, to me, he just wants to do anything Nigel says or Nigel's administration says he will go along with rather than being the right man. You know, from our point of view, the UK should be standing up against.

We don't want her back or any other ISIS terrorist back that potentially could come here that were British. And from my point of view, it's got this massively wrong. And interestingly, David Lammy and Kemi Badnott actually agree, don't they? They don't want her back either, which is some good news. Yeah, it is. Zia Youssef, the Reform UK chairman, he also seemed to endorse what Nigel was saying about this watch. If anyone actually cares about truth, then they should actually look what Nigel actually said, which was that what's happened in Syria is that there's been regime change. And let's be clear about what's happened as a result of that. You have jihadists in senior government positions. If you are a British citizen and you are concerned that there are people in Syrian

prisons that are security threats to the United Kingdom, where would you rather they were sitting inside a prison in a now potentially jihadist-controlled Syria or inside a maximum security prison inside the United Kingdom. And that's what the point Nigel was making. But Emma Webb, the conservative commentator, she posted in response to those comments by Youssef, the chances of prosecuting people like Begum and keeping them permanently locked up in a maximum security prison are slim to none for various reasons. There is absolutely no reason to allow people like her onto our shores. I don't care where terrorists rot as long as it's not here.

And the thing is, Howard Cox, she would not be convicted because there isn't the evidence. So she actually would be free. She would be free. She would be back on the streets of East London, no doubt, into the mosques before we knew it. I'm free to radicalise others and that sort of thing. Look, look what I've done. I'm your hero. I can do this for you. Yeah, and I can come back. You know, if it doesn't work out, you can come back. Exactly. And that's the point. And, you know,

Emma's comments were absolutely dead right. There's no way we could. There's no evidence, is there? We just know that she left. We saw her leave this place. And from that point of view, any any actual it's all sort of, you know, I don't know what it is. It's almost rumoured stuff. But we know that she's dangerous. And, you know, Sajid Javid was right to revoke her British citizenship. It was dead right. I don't know why the Pakistanis, she's Pakistani, isn't she? Bangladeshi, I believe. Bangladeshi. And that is the point.

That is the point. She has dual citizenship. There is another potential country for her to go to, which is why no international laws were broken. And remember, this has gone through the court system. And we know the courts in the UK tend to be on the left so they've approved all of this well obviously what's the big worry which you've alluded to already is what will Keir Starmer do and you know if he's going to actually say okay I want to please Sebastian Gorka and Mike Waltz

you know the national security people there if he's going to actually you know want to get on with it he might actually say okay we'll take her back you don't have to worry about it we'll try and we we'll make sure she's she's well but it takes up 10 policemen every day to keep her in check yeah and it was his position it was his public position that shamima begum should return and it was one of the many issues that's slippery starmer as i him, did a mega reversal on. Howard Cox, standby, don't go anywhere. In just one minute, scheming Sturgeon gets even more ruthless by dumping her husband. That's as she remains under police investigation.

What is this really about? We'll analyse in just one minute. But first, everyone's focused on eating better and staying active after the holidays. Personally, I find it tough to cut out constant snacking and junk food, especially in the cold, and goodness me, it has been cold in the UK over the past couple of days. I keep up with my workouts year round, but let's face it, no amount of exercise can outdo a poor diet. Now, this struggle often stems from an imbalanced metabolism, which disrupts hunger hormones and triggers intense cravings for sugars and carbs, causing blood glucose levels to spike.

So that's why I take cell bean by Verso. It's made with ingredients that help regulate blood sugar, curb cravings, and boost metabolism. They also work to shrink existing fat cells and prevent new ones from forming. I've been taking it for over six months now and have noticed I feel less hungry throughout the day, which means I'm snacking less. And I'm not alone. Their customers are seeing amazing results. One shared, I'm in my mid-30s and I've been roughly the same weight for years. With these products, I've been able to lose weight and feel amazing physically. Another said, I've had several people comment that I've lost weight and I've really noticed a reduction of fat in my midsection since taking the product.

Plus, Verso publishes third-party testing from each batch produced to guarantee you are getting what you pay for. So click the link in the description on YouTube or Rumble or head on over to buy.ver.so forward slash outspoken and use the coupon code outspoken when you check out and you will save 15% on your first order. So I'm just going to repeat the address, buy.ver.so forward slash OUTSPOKEN and use the coupon code OUTSPOKEN. But now back to the show. Breaking right now, scheming sturgeon gets more ruthless by the day. The former and the failed Scottish First Minister has now dumped her husband, Peter Murrell. She doesn't need him anymore.

He has, of course, been charged in the SNP's so-called missing millions investigation. Sturgeon herself arrested and released, but remains under investigation. So today comes the bombshell Instagram story where she writes, personal, with a heavy heart, I am confirming that Peter and I have decided to end our marriage. To all intents and purposes, we have been separated for some time now, and I feel it is time to bring others up to speed with where we are. It goes without saying that we still care deeply for each other and always will. We will be making no form further comment. But I think maybe Leo Kersh summed this up best with his post on ex Nicola Sturgeon officially split from Peter Murrell

but the sexual chemistry between them was so palpable because come on Howard Cox we've known for some time this was a marriage of business convenience Nicola Sturgeon had serious ambitions to lead the SNP. Peter Murrell was the guy with all of the power within that organisation. And what so often happens is when someone has a fall from grace, a relationship which actually isn't anchored in love because it was anchored in power and ambition has fallen apart. You're right, but I have actually got a grudging respect for Nicola Sturgeon. I think she's a consummate politician, incredibly clever, very good. In fact, she was very supportive of my campaign, Fair Fuel UK. And down in Westminster, when they had about 50-odd MPs down there,

she instructed and worked with Alex Salmond, even though they didn't talk to each other of recent times when he set up ALBA. But they actually got all of the MPs to go out onto Parliament Square and be photographed with me and say, yes, we support the motorist. I can't imagine Lib Dems or even Labour

doing that sort of thing. So I've got a grudging respect. But the big thing is, where's the £600,000 worth of donations gone? That's still, and they haven't been charged. He was arrested, but both of them haven't been charged. Where has that £600,000 gone? Well, he has been charged.

She hasn't. She's been released, still under formal investigation. And clearly, she hopes there is a second act for her political career. She hopes that this will be a case of the husband taking the rap. Now, of course, we don't know what happened. And there are, because, you know, I'm always transparent with my audience about these things. There are really, really strict and strident contempt of court laws in Scotland,

which make talking about this case virtually impossible, which is ridiculous, by the way, because you've been investigating this thing for years get on with it but i think sturgeon does think she has a second act in her political career however uh she will stoop super low howard she will stoop super low because did you see this interview that she gave to the FT over the weekend where she decided just weeks after the death of Alex Salmond, a guy who she fully admits was her political mentor, was her best mate for years and years and years. She decided a few weeks after his death to throw the guy under the bus. So during this interview, she claimed that Mr. Salmon could be really, really rough on people and that she had to step in many times to stop him. Now,

maybe that's true. Maybe it's not. But the point is, you really caused huge stress to this guy. You tried to destroy him in court. You failed because he was completely exonerated. He is now dead. What on earth are you doing, Sturgeon? And this prompted Alex Salmon's widow, who very much does not speak out often. She's a private woman, 87 years old, to make a rare public statement saying that she is still grieving for her husband and the recent attacks on him come from people who, quote, seem determined to damage her reputation even in death. Mrs Salmon added, it is difficult for us to understand what motivates those interventions, especially when such comments are made in the knowledge that Alex cannot defend himself as he would certainly have done. Those attacking him must know that the law does not allow us, his family, to protect his reputation from being defamed now that he is gone. And I just thought Howard Cox, I mean, number one, who is she to attack someone else for their behaviour at work when she remains under police investigation?

But didn't you just think, given her weasel words after his death, that this was a particularly low and unnecessary blow? Absolutely disgusting. You know, I wasn't fully aware of that, Dan. And now I've seen that and seen the response from Mrs Salmond. I mean, I've worked on various panel shows and I've worked in politics, lobbying Alex Salmond, and he's been nothing but fun to be with, incredible person to be with. He's hugely funny to be with, and I've had nothing but good about him. And when he was having those problems in court, et cetera, like that, I was surprised.

But, you know, to see him suddenly die like that, I was genuinely choked. And I was with actually some media people who knew him quite well as well. There was a there wasn't a dry eye in the house. He's a good guy. empowered these former SNP leaders who are desperately now trying to create media careers beyond despicable given what they have caused to the great nation of Scotland given the complete destruction that they have left the country in and as ifing Sturgeon isn't bad enough, we now have Humza Useless, who was by far the worst First Minister in the history of Scotland. A racist guy, by the way, because he is very anti-white people. We all remember that famous white video. And he is now trying to turn himself, Howard, you're not going to believe this,

into some type of social media influencer, like a Scottish version of Owen Jones, believe it or not. And he's released a video to launch his career attacking Elon Musk. Let's watch this together and I'll get your response after. Good luck with that. Elon Musk needs Let's watch this together and I'll get your response. Good luck with that. Elon Musk needs to be stopped. This isn't just about one tweet or one individual. It's about a pattern that we are seeing globally. Powerful individuals with massive platforms are amplifying harmful rhetoric. They're normalizing prejudice, and all to create division through the spread of disinformation. Last summer, after he fanned the flames of racial intolerance here in the UK, I warned that Elon Musk was one of the most dangerous men on the planet. Everything, everything that he has done since then has only reinforced that view.

Not only has he used his vast billions to muscle his way into the White House, he's now attempting to subvert democracy by trying to overthrow the democratically elected Prime Minister of the UK. But what's motivating Musk? Worryingly, it's his far-right sympathies, driven by anti-Muslim hatred, that seem to be the driving force for the world's wealthiest man. He supports Tommy Robinson, a man who's called Islam a violent fascist ideology. Howard Cox, your response to Hamza Youssef, the influencer. You couldn't write that, could you? I mean, you couldn't invent that.

It's pathetic. I mean, if it wasn't for Elon Musk, we wouldn't be talking much about Tommy Robinson. We wouldn't have free speech, all those sorts of things. I do believe that he shouldn't be involved in dictating who leads parties. I'm sorry, I do agree with that. But in terms of actually influencing actually what happens here, I've got no problem with that whatsoever. And I understand Dominic Cummings doesn't mind either. And the thing is, that guy, Humzi Yousaf, is the biggest hypocrite ever, because he's talking about spreading racial

intolerance when he has done just that with his anti-white racism campaign in Scotland. And then he's talking about subverting democracy. Well, this is the bloke who did not accept two major referendum results, did not accept the once in a generation vote for Scotland to remain part of the United Kingdom and did not accept the once in a lifetime vote for the UK to leave the European Union. So he would have subverted two of the most important democratic votes in recent UK history. Yeah, absolutely right. I mean, you've hit the nail on the head. You've got these substandard politicians now coming out post their career that has gone down into the dustbin. They've come out now thinking that actually people are going to listen to them and take on board

what they're saying. It's nothing to do with them now. You stay out of it. Elon Musk has got a platform and let's face it, Donald Trump, I'm looking forward to him going in there, sorting out the fact that the expenditure and getting efficiency moving, all that sort of thing. We need an Elon Musk on our civil service in this country. But that will never happen. And that's one thing we must remember. Reform UK, which is one reason I signed up to them. They want to get rid of five pounds out of every hundred pounds spent on the state. So, you know, this guy, you know, I never really took much notice of him. And I go back to my point about, you know, Alex Salmond.

He was a rare person. He was a statesman like politician, in my opinion. Whereas people like him, you know, Yusuf, well, forget it. Just, well, I've forgotten about him already. Well, do you know what? I think I'm going to have quite a bit of fun, actually, with whom's a useless becoming a left wing influencer. I'm rubbing my hands with glee, just like I'm rubbing my hands with glee to see scheming Sturgeon having ruined Scotland try and re-enter the political domain. But Howard Cox of the Fair Fuel campaign, formerly of Reform UK, so brilliant to have you here live today on Outspoken and please come back very soon. Thank you very much.

Now, coming up in the Uncancelled After Show today, Prince Harry and Meghan Markle have become disaster tourists as Hollywood veterans lash out at the fake royals for exploiting the LA wildfires. We're going to be crossing to the US to team up with the Royal News Network. Britney has the very latest on this story momentarily. You know, it's very important to me, by the way, that we do have this safe space on Substack, which is not patrolled by big tech. That's where the after show is hosted. www.outspoken.live. It is our membership section where you get half an hour of extra content every single weekday.

So at this stage, we come off YouTube and rumble. We move to Substack. We'll continue the conversation in the uncanceled after show let me repeat the address www.outspoken.live you can sign up completely for free by the way and that is the most important way to join this thriving community and avoid big tech censorship it allows me to keep building that direct relationship with you so please please, please, I know it takes a couple of minutes. Actually, probably doesn't. Probably takes 30 seconds. www.outspoken.live is the address. We are back live tomorrow, 5 p.m. UK time, midday Eastern, 9 a.m. Pacific. Hit subscribe if you're watching on YouTube or Rumble. Most importantly, I promise to keep fighting for you.

See you on the after show in just one moment. We'll be you next time. you