Dan Wootton Outspoken - NIGEL FARAGE RESPONDS TO ELON MUSK $100 MILLION OFFER TO MAKE HIM UK'S NEXT PRIME MINISTER

Episode Date: December 2, 2024

Could Elon Musk and Nigel Farage be the men to finally smash Britain’s two party system, with reports the Tesla and X billionaire is considering a 100 million dollar donation to Reform UK? Responding live today on Outspoken: Reform UK’s Ann Widdecombe, the former Tory Minister who is now campaigning for Farage’s insurgent party. She’ll cover all the big news of the day with Dan. PLUS: Is there now a civil war in Reform UK following Ben Habib’s dramatic departure last week? AND: The MSM’s hysterical reaction to Gregg Wallace so-called scandal as conservative commentators slam the corporation for caring more about the Masterchef star’s bawdy jokes than grooming gangs. Dan will show you Kay Burley’s response to Wallace’s claim that the story is being whipped up by middle class women of a certain age. THEN: In the Uncancelled Aftershow, Brittany of the Royal News Network joins Dan with all the big royal news of the day, including the meaning behind Catherine, the Princess of Wales, emotional Christmas letter following her cancer battle. Sign up to watch the exclusive Aftershow at www.outspoken.live. Today’s Sponsors: SURFSHARK - Go to https://surfshark.com/outspoken for an extra four months of Surfshark at an unbeatable price VERSO - https://buy.ver.so/outspoken - Use code OUTSPOKEN to save 15% on your first order. MANSCAPED - https://manscaped.com – get 20% off + free shipping with the code Outspoken. ---------- Dan Wootton Outspoken is fan funded through monthly and one-time donations: https://www.outspoken.live ---------- Join Dan's Substack community: https://www.danwoottonoutspoken.com ---------- Find the full audio show wherever you get your podcasts: Apple — https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/dan-wootton-outspoken/id1762436723 Spotify — https://open.spotify.com/show/19Ltoneek2MSPL10CpSA1J?si=8f6d84e2db56448c ---------- Follow Dan on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@outspokendan?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc Follow Dan on Twitter: https://x.com/danwootton Follow Dan on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/danwootton/ Follow Dan on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danwootton/?hl=en #DanWootton #DanWoottonOutspoken #news #outspoken Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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No sugar added? Neutral. Refreshingly simple. so there's no censorship i'm dan wiltonooten. This is Outspoken Live, episode number 108. Please click and subscribe to our brand new independent news source. Turn on the notification bell so you'll be alerted to our brand new live shows, uncancelled interviews and special royal episodes. Breaking right now, could Elon Musk and Nigel Farage be the man to finally smash Britain's two-party system, with reports the Tesla and ex-millionaire is considering a $100 million donation to Reform UK? Responding live today on Outspoken, Reform UK's Anne Widdicombe, my old mate, the Tory, former Tory minister, who is now campaigning for Farage's insurgent party.

We'll cover off all the big news of the day, including Farage's one-on-one with Starmer, and whether there is now a civil war in reform following Ben Habib's dramatic departure last week. Also coming up on the show, the MSM's hysterical reaction to the so-called Greg Wallace scandal as conservative commentators slam the corporation for caring more about the MasterChef star's bawdy jokes than grooming gangs. I'll show you Kay Burley's response to Wallace's claims that the story has been whipped up by middle-class women of a certain age. You can imagine how that one went down. Then in the uncancelled after show, Brittany of the Royal News Network joins me with all the big royal news of the day,

including the meaning behind Catherine, the Princess of Wales, emotional Christmas letter following her cancer battle. And the uncancelled after show now broadcast exclusively daily and on demand on Substack. You can Google it or get to it right now by visiting www.outspoken.live. If you subscribe to a monthly paid membership, you get access to the after show Monday to Friday, all my exclusive reporting and columns, our live chats on the Substack app, and you join a really thriving community. It is a safe space, free of censorship, and we have the Cyber Monday sales still running, which means you get 30% off. So you can join from as little as £3 a month plus VAT if you're in the UK.

Most importantly, though, I want you to be part of it so it is completely fine to subscribe for free. This is a family, we are a network and I want you to be part of it. But now, let's go. It increasingly seems, doesn't it, like the world is Nigel Farage's and we just live in it. It's hard to believe that just a few short months ago, the Reform UK leader had left folk like me despondent and desolate over his decision not to run for Parliament to focus on his media work and campaigning for Donald Trump in the US. Fishi Rishi Sunak's ludicrous decision to call an early election seemed to have done the trick of neutralising the threat of Reform UK. But Nigel's last-minute U-turn after being told he could easily win the Clacton seat could end up changing British political history. Hear me out.

News in the Sunday Times this weekend that Elon Musk is considering a $100 million donation to Reform UK as part of his desire to smash Britain's two-party system. And that comes even as Slippery Star seems to realise that Farage cannot be ignored. Indeed, did you see this on Friday? It was astonishing. Just after the passing of the historic, for all the wrong reasons, vote to sanction state suicide, the Prime Minister make a beeline for Trump's British BFF. Watch. to be a fly on the wall here's how Farage described the meeting earlier today. Hashed up the stairs to talk to you in the House of Commons chamber all on camera. First of all, what did he say to you? And second of all, would you actually take any job within this government as an envoy, as someone who could provide liaison with Donald Trump, your good friend? Well, he came across the chamber and we had a good laugh about a couple of things.

Well, tell us what? I can't imagine you having much in common with Keir Starmer. Well, he did tell a joke at my expense at PMQs the other day and I did sort of reciprocate. Nigel also spoke about the possibility of that 100 million

coming to reform from Musk via his company X. Would you take the money if it was offered? We'd take legal money if it was offered to us. Of course we would, yeah. You know, when you think that the big party machines raise tens of millions every year and we are a little bit like David with a small stone in a sling,

of course we need money as a party. Of course we do. But whether there's any truth in this story, I have honestly got no idea. OK. But other senior figures in the party were far more forthcoming. Chairman Zia Youssef posted on X, the man who helped make Trump president again knows that reform will be the next party of government. Reform UK's novice MP, James McMurdoch, he wrote, if the rumour is true and Elon Musk donates $100 million to Nigel Farage, it could go down as one of the most clinical and decisive moves in history. For some context, by the way, the Conservatives received £38 million

in donations last year and Labour £22 million. So Elon's $100 million would put Reform UK in the same ballpark. Alex Phillips, friend of us here at Outspoken, major Reform UK backer and Farage ally, explained on her sub-stack that much like a football team, for a political party when you have staff and resources, output exponentially improves and climbing up the league becomes a probability. And even as Reform UK does append to have descended into a form of civil war following the departure of former deputy Ben Habib and negativity from many conservative commentators about Farage's soft approach to mass deportation and Islam integration, Alex insisted this. She wrote, it's also true that you cannot have multiple small parties

pulling in different directions to topple the big beasts. You need one well-resourced entity that has its finger on the pulse to offer a red-blooded alternative. Sorry Reclaim and UKIP of today, that is not you. So can Reform UK dream of winning the next general election? Oh, the establishment finds that reassuringly far-fetched. After all, the less they get it, the greater the political divide that becomes stepping stones to power. The answer is yes. And I can now see a path to doing so that no longer feels outrageously fanciful. And there is polling to back up what Alex is saying, actually. I mean, look at this from Wales, where Reform UK is in touching distance of becoming the main party in the Senate.

Extraordinary. That even prompted the Independent's political editor, David Maddox, to suggest, should the Conservatives stand down candidates for Reform UK to break Labour's grip on Wales? Sounds mad. But as 2026 gets closer and if polls like this become the norm, this could become a genuine conversation. And I think it should. I think it should become a genuine conversation because even though the MSM remains in their echo chamber thinking it's business as usual or attempting to destroy Greg Wallace for some dirty jokes, the vast majority of Britons realise there is something very wrong

with our country. Like this picture I posted yesterday from a member of the outspoken family who was horrified to see cops patrolling Dorking Christmas Fair openly with automatic rifles. Since when was this normal? And are we just going to accept that as our new reality in Britain? Or what about the pro-Hamas protesters clashing with police yet again in the nation's capital with absolutely zero interest from the MSM? I repeat, since when was this normal? And are we just going to accept this as our new reality in Britain?

You just know, if those folk clashing with the cops had been anti-establishment protesters, Reform UK voters or Tommy Robinson supporters, they would have been paraded across news bulletins and probably locked up by now. Very much understand, there are some people, some good people actually, not sold on Reform UK's approach. And when Reform UK makes missteps, as a critical friend, believe me, I will point them out. Like dismissing patriotic Uniting the Kingdom marchers as that lot, or brutally sacking an intellectual giant like Ben Habib. But the right has to unite behind a revolutionary force with resources and a superstar behind it. And I found myself asking at the weekend, actually, would Margaret Thatcher have defected

to Reform UK if she were alive today? And with the decline of her beloved Conservative Party and imminent downfall of the UK, I think it becomes more likely by the day that that answer would be yes. But now, the Uncancelled interview. And how wonderful to be reunited with the great Anne Widdicombe, who I haven't spoken to in some time, but has just launched an incredible new sub stack. I am subscribed. This is the place where you're going to hear all of her insight, not just into Reform UK, but the news as well. And Anne, I miss you because obviously we used to speak every week on my GB News show. So it is great to have you on Outspoken for the first time. And congratulations on the launch of the Substack. You know, I'm convinced it's the future, Anne.

Yes, thanks very much. And thanks also for giving it the pups that you've been giving it. It's going extremely well. I mentioned it on GB News and lo and behold, within 10 minutes, you know, subs have quadrupled. So I'm mentioning it as often as I can on as many outlets. Yes, and Jacob Rees-Mogg, he's a sub-stacker now. It is actually an incredible platform, Anne, because it's not partisan in any way, but it believes in free speech, which is really, really critical. So look... And the great thing about a sub-stack,

as opposed to my Express column, is that, of course, I can make it as long as I like. Yes. I'm not confined to a certain number of words, so I can really go into things in a way that I couldn't in an ordinary newspaper. No, indeed. I've loved reading it so far. And it is great to have as many big names as possible on there, actually. But look, Anne, what do you reckon?

Am I crazy? Is it possible that if Margaret Thatcher were alive today, she would have considered defecting just like you from the Conservatives to Reform UK? Well, I think the first thing to say is that if Margaret Thatcher were alive today, the Conservative Party would not be in the state that it's in. Good point. It's in that appalling state because of the successive four leaders. And if Mrs Thatcher were around, you know, I don't think I'd be with reform. I'd still be with the Conservatives.

But she isn't around, and the Conservatives have completely lost track of what they're supposed to be about. They no longer stand for freedom of speech. They no longer stand for low taxes. They no longer stand for strict control of the borders. They pay lip service to all of those things. But in power, they did for some of nothing towards them. Yeah, I know. I know. It's, I mean, do you sometimes feel a sort of grief for the Conservative

Party, Anne? Because, look, for, you know, it took me a lot to vote reform at the last election, because here you are thinking this is the world's most successful political party. It's a movement that has done so much good for the world. It is the party of Winston Churchill and Margaret Thatcher. But it's gone, isn't it? Yes, I've got through the grief barrier. I mean, I left the Conservatives after 55 years. I left them in 2019 and went to join what was then the Brexit Party, which subsequently morphed into reform. And I didn't even join reform immediately.

I absolutely did not go back to the Conservatives. And I've got through that feeling of how on earth did this happen? Why have they got like this? What can be done about it? I've accepted that every hundred years or so there is a sea change in British politics. The Labour Party came out of nowhere after all and it can be done and I think it will be done next time. And I simply ask myself very straightforward question, Dan. I look at the parties, which one has the agenda that I

believe is right for Britain? And there's only one answer to that. It's Britain. Okay, so let's talk about Elon Musk. How do you feel about him, Anne? Is it right for a billionaire to be potentially getting involved in British politics in that way? Oh, billionaires have been getting involved in politics for a very long time. Frankly, I can't think of a better use for his money than to give it to reform and to see us frame the right agenda for Britain. I think it's a wonderful idea. I wish I had 100 million. Sadly, I don't. And tell me what difference 100 million makes to a fledgling operation like Reform UK.

It would make a massive difference. I mean, you know, we operate pretty well on a shoestring. We've got subscription income, obviously. We've got donations, not of that order of magnitude, if or to. We've got some very generous donors. But we have to try and compete with political parties that have got enormous headquarters, enormous staff, enormous resources. And we're just now setting up a fully democratised party, which we haven't had in the past.

We're setting up local branches. And all of that is a huge investment in organisation, but also in expenditure. So it would make an enormous difference. I go so far as to say that sort of money would make the difference between being a minor party and pretty quickly becoming a major one. And Elon Musk is getting seriously involved, Dan. This is not something that is just an every now and then thing for him. It started really after the election of Starmer, where he was pretty disgusted to see the two-tier

policing and folk going to jail for a post on X or all of that sort of thing, because of course, he's very free speech orientated. But he's become much more party political in recent weeks, especially since his meeting with Farage at Mar-a-Lago. I mean, it even culminated in him publicly declaring that at the next election, the establishment parties would be, in his words, crushed. So Labour, the Conservatives, the Lib Dems. And after the defection of Dame Andrea Jenkins last week, he predicted that Reform UK will be the government at the next election. Firstly, do you agree? Secondly, what do you think of him making these types of predictions? Well, first of all, I think it's entirely possible, entirely possible that we'll be the

government after the next election. Everybody thought this time around with the election that was actually only a few months ago, everybody thought that we wouldn't get any MPs, that even Nigel wouldn't win his seat, that we really were a bit of a lost cause. People now understand that if you do vote reform, you get a reform MP. We've got five from Zilch. So I think people have a different attitude towards us now. They know that we can succeed. A lot of them want us to succeed, and I think it's for us to carry on putting calm but very sensible policies at the forefront of our approach.

I know from responses to my sub-staff, I know that people are very, very concerned about freedom and nobody else is taking that seriously at all. Now, let me say one thing, however, Dan, and I am going to say this. I do not believe in rioting. I do not believe in creating disorder. I do not believe in geeing people up against the police. And if people were involved in that sort of activity, or if they were being incited towards that sort of activity, I have no problem with the law clamping down, just as it had to do, maybe too young to remember this, but with football hooliganism, when it went absolutely mad and became violent and we were doing it abroad as well. You know, Brits had a terrible reputation abroad and the courts came cracking down with really stiff sentences and it stopped.

Or if it didn't stop, it diminished to a point where it was manageable. So I do believe in stiff sentences when things get out of hand. And I'm going to say that. I know that won't make me popular in all quarters. Can I just challenge you on one aspect of it, Anne? Because, look, I'm a law and order guy too. But can you not see that the way folk have been treated after the so-called riots following the Southport massacre

is completely different to the way that the pro-called riots following the Southport massacre is completely different to the way that the pro-Hamas demonstrators are treated every single week in London. I mean, Anne, we've had this young 23-year-old girl, Cameron Bell, who was on my show last week, be jailed. And this is one of the cases, by the way, that Elon Musk pointed to. And he described the UK as a tyrannical police state as a result of her imprisonment. She got nine months behind bars. And all she had done was live stream on her TikTok what she was seeing that night in Tamworth. So it really does feel like Anne, like there is one set of rules for the white working class so-called rioters following Southport and one rule for the pro-Hamas

demonstrators. Well, I think there are several separate issues here. The first issue is so-called riots. They weren't so-called riots. They were riots now. They were actual riots. They were trying to light fires. They were destroying property. They were taking on the police. It was a riot. And if anybody else had done it, we would say riot, and we wouldn't have any problem with that at all. And I am not going to call it a riot. And as I said at a reform conference recently, you know, attempts to link us with riots were mischievous and were mis hold riots. And as I said at a reform conference recently, attempts to link us with riots were mischievous and were misplaced. And I'm the justice spokesman, and as far as I'm concerned, that is wrong. There is a separate issue about equal policing, if you like. And

while I am in favour of cracking down on something, because we haven't cracked down on those riots, they would be repeated everywhere, just like before Hooliganism was. They would be repeated. And we probably would have serious injury at some point. So while I'm all in favour of cracking down on riots and on anything that suddenly breaks out like that. I'm also in favour of dealing with demonstrators who are breaking the law and either making life difficult for the police or stirring up direct racial hatred, which a lot of those Hamas demonstrations have done. So I do believe in equal policing, but I also believe it's right when you've got a phenomenon

like that outbreak of rioting, which wasn't in one place, it was in several, that's why it was so dangerous, that it, I think, becomes cracking down like a ton of bricks. No apology. Nigel Farage, your leader, has said that he believes the Southport massacre cover-up will go down as one of the biggest cover-ups of our lifetimes. Do you know what he's referring to?

And do you understand, Anne, that there is now a distrust in a lot of the authorities, including law enforcement, who did misleadism Act for the possession of an al-Qaeda manual and the production of ricin as a biochemical weapon. And that information was withheld. Now, I believe there's a lot more. Nigel Farage believes there's a lot more. But do you feel like there's a cover up? Cover up is a very emotive word. I do think that there has been information

which has been withheld for whatever reason and that information should be in the public domain. But as you say, be very, very careful of the sub judice rules. And I am not going to speculate at this point. And I strongly advise other reformers not to speculate at this point. Say what we like after. But you can say, though, that James O'Brien describing the Farage riots was utterly inexcusable and irresponsible, given all Nigel had done was raise questions that turned out to be completely accurate. We didn't know the full picture. I mean, that is absolutely right. But media commentators, I'm afraid, on both sides of the political fence,

are given to exaggerated statements. O'Brien's was certainly that. And a couple of other big issues in terms of immigration, which are clearly infuriating the public. I mean, look at this post from Darren Grimes. Two small boats were picked up in the Channel with dozens of migrants on board, taking the number of crossings since Labour were elected in July

to more than 20,000. Starmer didn't stop the boats. Storm Burt temporarily did. God help us. And then knowing that the Conservative Party are taking a lot of the blame for this current situation, Robert Jenrick, who is your stablemate, the justice spokesperson now for the Conservative Party, posted, today is a day of shame for the Conservative Party. Our

handling of immigration let the country down badly. The public are right to be furious. Repairing the damage won't be easy. We will only begin to rebuild trust once we build, once we own up to our failures and fundamentally change. Do you think the Conservatives can be trusted ever again on immigration, Anne? No, absolutely not. They did have 14 years. It doesn't mean they only had a few months. They had 14 years. And again, they paid lip service to control of the borders,

but they didn't actually implement anything. And as for Starmer, I mean, in the last general election, he actually offered no policy at all. He said he was going to ditch Rwanda, which was the one and only deterrent, ineffective deterrent possibly, but it was the one and only deterrent that we had. He was going to ditch that, but he had nothing to put in its place

other than really rather vague statements about smashing the gangs. Well, you might as well talk about smashing the mafia, smashing drug gangs. It is not that easy a thing to do. And we have had 20,000 unlawful migrants, unlawful since Labour came to power. And they've only been there since the summer. I know. I know.

And there is no plan, is there, Anne? There's no plan. The only plan on earth is reform's plan. There is no other plan to stop the votes. And Ken Brick is making, again, all the right noises. OK, what's his policy? Let us hear the policy. He would have been a better leader, though, wouldn't he, Anne,

for the Conservatives? He was much more of a threat to your party than Kemi Badenoch, who is effectively a business-as-usual choice. If I had been a Conservative, which thank heaven I wasn't, but if I had been a Conservative, I'd have voted for Jenrick. I made that very clear at the time. And because he did it, he stopped the policies. I mean, Kemi is a policy freezer.

And she's going to have to do better than that. She is indeed. Lots of talk, though, Anne Widdicombe, about the personalities within Reform UK. And you're right there at the centre. So I want to take you through this developing story that I know you disagree with being described as a civil war, but that is how it has been termed after the former deputy leader, good friend of yours, fellow Brexit Party MEP, Ben Habib, quit in quite dramatic circumstances, overshadowing the defection of Dame Andrea Jenkins to join reform from the Conservatives. So let's have a look at the key moments, I guess, from this incident over the past few days, and I'll get you to react to each one. And I think there have been a few more defections from the Tory party to reform,

and all of these are trumpeted. But it's our people that should be trumpeted it's the movement that we created that should be trumpeted not the people joining from the Tory party who are part of a party that delivered the country into the peril in which we now find ourselves so I can't understand this obsession with recruiting Tories sure there are some good Tories that are worth recruiting. Suella Braverman, for example. But why would you want to open the party up wholesale to defections from the Conservative Party? Does he have a point, Annie? He doesn't want more folk like you.

Well, let me say, I almost tackled and said, what about me, Ben? Ben and I are very good friends, let me, exactly. I almost heckled and said, what about me, Ben? Ben and I are very good friends, let me say that. Let me also say that I have a huge admiration for Ben Perdy, and I do. But first of all, one man does not make a civil war. Oliver Cromwell couldn't have done it on his own. He needed an army. And, you know, one person is disenchanted with what is going on. All I can say is the other

political parties would love it if only one person, I think they had a problem. So I don't think you can call it a civil war. I think that's nonsense. When Ben says that we shouldn't, he didn't quite say we shouldn't welcome conservative defectors, but he thought we were becoming obsessed with them. I don't think we are I mean we're very happy to have Labour defectors we're very happy to have Lib Dem defectors if such a thing is even conceivable you know we're very happy

to have people from anywhere for the simple reason that we're a new party people who come to us are bound to come from a previous party unless they've had no interest in politics at all they're bound to come from a previous party, unless they've had no interest in politics at all. They're bound to have come from somewhere. And therefore, I really can't see the issue here. I'm sorry, Ben.

I admire you tremendously. Don't get the issue. OK, what about Nigel's response to this? Because I'm a friend of Ben. I'm a friend of Nigel's. This has put a lot of people in an awkward position, but Nigel didn't treat Ben with any respect. And this is the specific moment on GB News

when he was talking to Michelle Jubry, where that became very clear. Let's have a look. What would you say, I have to ask you as well, you've got Andrew Jenkins in. One of the things that many GB News viewers have been in touch about is Ben Habib. What's happened there for anyone that's not followed that twist and turn?

Yeah. Well, that was the real champagne moment of the day. I mean, it was a good day, but Ben Habib announcing he's not with us really was the absolute icing on the cake. Look, after the election, Ben didn't get elected, other people did, and he and David Bull had been the deputy leaders under Richard Tice. And I said, Ben, David, I'm really sorry, but I want to make Richard Tice the deputy

because he's in the House of Commons. He will literally deputise for me when he's there and I'm travelling around the country. And David Bull accepted that and is very much a part of the organisation. And poor old Ben felt bitter about it. And he's attacked me more in public than the Labour Party have. He's gone very bitter, very twisted. It's very sad. The fact that he's walked away, frankly, is a huge relief. Well, there you go. Anne?

I think it was, to put it bluntly, an ill-advised statement, but he was speaking from his heart what he felt. The disagreement between them has gone on for a long time, which is something that those outside the organisation won't know. I think both sides should reflect a little and maybe say that things could have been done differently, and I think they could have been. Ben was perfectly exact, and I know this at the time, of the fact that it made sense for Richard Thijs to be deputy leader. But it was the way that things were done. And I'm not going to go into detail. We've got this unfortunate clash between two very big people, very different people.

And I think that is unfortunate. But, you know, Ben has now gone. He's no longer in reform. And therefore reform isn't answered itself. Yeah, I guess one concern that some people have about Reform UK, and these are people, Anne, who want Reform UK to succeed, is that they worry if Nigel can be a team player. What's been your experience of working with him in Reform UK?

And do you think it's possible for him to lead more than a personality cult? Because for Reform UK to become the government of this country, it needs to be more than one man, right, in a Westminster system. Right. First of all, it is more than one man. Secondly, I have seen Naibu operating both in the Brexit party and the European Parliament and in reform. And yes, he is a team player. He's got his own very distinctive style.

There can't be any argument about that. He is sometimes perhaps a bit blunter than one would expect, but he is a team player. And when I saw what he did with the Brexit party in Europe, I was very impressed because he was dealing with completely disparate set of people. He had on the one hand defecting Tories, he also had defecting Labour people, he had people who felt very, very strongly about Brexit, and he managed somehow to wield that team into a cohesive whole so that we always voted with unanimity. Now, you know, other parties don't manage that. And it wasn't managed by accident. It was managed because of Nigel's skill. So yes, he is a team player. And yes, he can wield a cohesive group. And I think that's what he's doing. and that's why I say one man doesn't take a civil

Can you imagine Nigel as PM? Yes, I think I can it will be a very unusual style I don't think there's any doubt about that it won't be the usual it won't be the usual I think he will I think he can stuff. I think he can be PM. I think he should be PM.

I think it might come as a bit of a shock to people who think everything should be done the Westminster way, which itself now needs taking by the strut of the neck and shaking. Honestly, I'm here for it, Anne. I'm well and truly here for it. See, again, people have mixed opinions on this moment, which I want to show you now, but I loved it.

Nigel Farage, on this day where it seemed like everything was a little bit pressurised because the Dame Andrea announcement was overshadowed by Habib. And then Sly News became obsessed with James Murdoch and the fact that this guy, who was a surprise MP, had a conviction from, I think it's 20 years earlier. And it was a really horrible incident in his life that he has admitted was a really terrible incident. He pushed his girlfriend and it went through the judicial system and he has now spoken about it and moved on. But Sly News on this day decided to make that the number one topic

of conversation with Nigel and he ended up storming out of the interview. I'll get your reaction after, but let's have a watch, Anne. It involves being honest though are you not concerned that he lied about what he did did he he wasn't vetted he wasn't vetted james mcmerdoch was one of those many candidates who wasn't vetted at all with the party look i didn't know any of this when i took back over his leader so you said you're going to play put in place the most vigorous vetting system in place now. Do you think James Murdoch would not go through this new vetting system?

You can have your fun at Sky News. We've got 100,000 members. I've got a million followers on TikTok. Dame Andrea Jenkins has just joined us. She's our candidate for Greater Lincolnshire. You've had your fun. I'm off for lunch. Thank you. See, I love that. I'm there for lunch. Thank you. See, I love that. I'm there for that. Oh, good, you agree. You agree, Anne. You like that. Totally. Totally. I mean, I think you do need to speak

to these interviewers sometimes. I once, a long time ago, asked John Humphreys, with whom, by the way, I get on extremely well, but I did once ask him on air if he was paid by the interruption. And I think sometimes you do need to take them off. And Nigel did that absolutely splendidly. And he cut short her thumb.

That's a ghastly photograph, by the way. I don't know why you have to keep showing it. And he cut short her thumb. And I just want to get you to respond to some criticism that has been made of Reform UK by Connor Tomlinson. Now, this has sparked a bit of an online firestorm. So let me take you through what he had to say. And so Connor wrote, who wants any insurgent political movement with half a chance of fixing Britain to succeed. But in its present state, it has its priorities wrong. It exchanges credible allies like Ben Habib while hoping to appease hostile media and attracting Tory MPs with inexpungible records of ruining this country. Richard Tice denounced the crowds at the Unite the Kingdom rallies on GB News,

saying we have nothing to do with Tommy Robinson and all that lot. He also points out that he disagrees with Farage, insisting if we politically alienate the whole of Islam, we will lose. What's your response to Connor? My response to that is that I think nigel has been uh very reasonable uh and also very truthful we have the toughest immigration policies of any of the parties uh we are aiming for a one-in-one-out immigration policy uh we've said that we're going to cut the grounds for visas considerably, with the sole exception of those who are genuinely qualified in medicine and social care, nursing.

Apart from that, we should truncate visas, and we're also keen to skill our own workforce so that we don't need to import skills from other countries. We've come out with a very firm plan for stopping the boats, for stopping housing immigrants in hotels and instead housing them in secure reception centres so that we can deal with them. And we have very, very tough policies. We also understand that there are difficulties. And one of the difficulties, and I know this because I used to be Home Office Minister, one of the difficulties is in deportations. Now, first of all, you've got to find them because we don't practice detention. Secondly, you've got to get to their country to accept that they are a national and take them back. And there are all sorts of practical

issues. And I think Nigel is right to say, look, stop the immigration, instead of just letting the immigration go on and then trying to deport those that we no longer want. And it's a totally sensible thing. The first thing you do if you've got a flood is you turn off the tap. You don't let the tap run while you try to deal with whatever problems you may have. So I think he's got it absolutely right and he's responsible and he's telling the truth. We don't want to alienate all Islam, do we? Because not all Islam is bad. We're just telling the truth and we're being sensible. And if what

people want is just ranting instead of measured policy, they're not going to get it from us. But do you understand that a lot of people are concerned about demography specifically? Yes.

I do understand that. And are are concerned about demography specifically? Yes, I do understand that. And are you concerned about it? Yes. Of course I am. I mean, I'm very concerned about... I've said many, many times, I think the most damaging, or one of the most damaging things for Britain has been to embrace what is called multiculturalism. It's not possible.

If people come here, then they must, and I'm not suggesting that they change their religion or anything like that, but they must accept that our culture is the prevalent one, not theirs. You can't have different cultures all over the place in different parts of the kingdom with sharia law and all the rest of you can't have that uh and and so yeah i'm very concerned about that what i'm not going to do is say you know that i'm an enemy of all islam because i'm not i'm really not no and i think if nigel had phrased it that way people would probably have been a lot more relaxed. There is some degree, isn't there, Anne, of Nigel is cleverly waiting to see the Overton window shift, see how things change under Donald Trump. And we may be talking about a very different set of policies come 2029. I mean, I'm sure that's absolutely true. And I'm sure that Trump is going to have a massive impact on globally.

It's going to have a massive impact. And he's well disposed towards Nigel. And I think if Starmer's got any sense, he'll make some use of that. Yes. Well, maybe he is, given they cosied up in the House of Commons the other day. But look, Anne, stand by. Don't go anywhere. Because I want to get your reaction to the mainstream media deciding that Greg Wallace and these bawdy and possibly inappropriate jokes that he made on MasterChef, deciding that that is the most important story in the country at the moment. So don't go anywhere.

Back with Anne Whittakin shortly. But first, you know how often, you know how often I talk about the need for free speech to be protected. Well, I've been increasingly thinking of the need for personal protection online from snoopers, bad actors and hackers. And I'm delighted to tell you I have now found the fail safe solution. But what's more, this VPN or virtual private network, to use the full term, is also a life changer when it comes to providing you entertainment and information from anywhere in the world, wherever you are. Let me introduce you to Surfshark, an incredible and easy way that encrypts all your internet traffic, meaning your online activity stays

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the legacy news networks have gone into virtual rolling coverage after his claim that the allegations about his behavior were being made by middle-class women of a certain age. Kay Burley, a middle-class woman of a certain age, she's been livid. Morning, everybody. A former BBC executive has told this programme the MasterChef Christmas special is likely to be cancelled after a string of allegations were made against one of its presenters, Greg Wallace.

And we've heard both major parties this morning express concern over the allegations. Yesterday, Wallace provoked a furious reaction after describing contestants on his show who accused him of making inappropriate sexual comments as middle-class women of a certain age now in the newspaper i can see the complaints coming from a handful of middle class women of a certain age just from celebrity masterchef this isn't right i love the way it says middle class. Thoughts, morning, ladies. And livid Kay Burley even decided to put the question to a government minister. We saw over the weekend, I thought it was quite surprising, you know, the individual should want to engage with the case

and do that properly, and I'm not sure that was really helpful. I'm not going to let you dodge it so easily, Mr Norris. What do you think of middle-class women of a certain age? I've got nothing but respect for them you know I think they make Britain I think they're part of Britain in all of our industries and lives I think any sort of sweeping generalization about like that about people's generally a bad idea. Would you pick a fight with them? No I generally don't pick fights with people I like working with people. Especially middle-class people of a certain age.

Well, again, I wouldn't draw a line particularly with them or someone else, to be honest. No, he's too terrified to say a thing, especially to Kay. Things got even more stupefying this afternoon when number 10 decided to weigh in. Hello, good afternoon. We start with breaking news and the Prime Minister's official spokesman has criticised comments made by the TV presenter Greg Wallace over the weekend as completely inappropriate and misogynistic. Now, given the BBC harboured paedophiles for decades and failed to blow the whistle on grooming gangs, luckily I'm not the only one finding the destruction of

Greg Wallace just a little bit too much. Sane Lefty, Paul Embry, that's what I'm going to call him from now on, Sane Lefty, he's brilliant, posted on X, if Greg Wallace is guilty of that which he stands accused, he is plainly an unpleasant person. But for the life of me, I cannot understand why this story has been leading the BBC news broadcasts all day. Can we keep a sense of proportion, please? Joanna Williams, responding to a Daily Telegraph feature, posted, is Greg Wallace the most obnoxious man in Britain? Seriously? More obnoxious than rapists, paedophiles, domestic abusers? Real lack of moral compass here. And the brilliant Brendan O'Neill of Spiked Online put it best, writing, I'm not going to swear though, effort. Someone has to say it. There has been more liberal media fury over Greg Wallace telling Kirsty Work a dirty joke

than there ever was over the years-long violation of white working-class girls by grooming gangs. I find it ridiculous and sinister. Now, Nigel Farage was the only public figure I saw today to have any sense of perspective. Watch. Says middle-class women of a certain age. Hi. Basically not being able to take a laugh, not enjoying banter. What's the big deal? Other people saying, look, boorish behaviour. BBC should have stepped in sooner. Where do you stand? I don't really know, to be honest with you. I mean, clearly, boorish behaviour seems undeniable. He perhaps had a way of talking and behaving that we would call outdated, to say the very least. But his pushback strikes me as being somewhat catastrophic.

And the hysteria, as it always does, prompted what I describe as a hostage video apology. I've been there, Greg. Let's watch. I want to apologise for any offence that I caused with my post yesterday and any upset I may have caused to a lot of people. I wasn't in a good headspace when I posted it. I've been under a huge amount of stress, a lot of emotion. I felt very alone under siege yesterday when I posted it. It's obvious to me I need to take some time out now while this investigation is underway. I hope you understand and I do hope that you will accept this apology. Anne Whittaker, I'm not surprised Greg Wallace feels that way.

This is an onslaught. Where do you stand on this? Well, can I point out a slight contradiction in your approach, Dan? Which is that you say, you know, is this really headline news? Is this really all the BBC should be reporting all day? And then you run a major segment. What a hypocrite I am. What a hypocrite I am. Although I would say, Anne, I am covering and analysing the media take on this,

which I think has been ludicrous and over the top. Yeah, I mean, I agree with you. It's completely out of proportion of proportion uh and i don't think there's any doubt about that but the way i deal with things that i think have got out of proportion is i ignore them for example for more than 12 months i kept my express column very good column by the way everyone said i kept my express column a harry and megan friso i said i have heard enough i am not interested in commenting on this silly fact. You know, I am not going to comment on them.

You won't find them mentioned in this column. And I stuck to that for 12 months. My agent, by the way, said to me, oh, he said, you have to manage that for more than six weeks. They're so newsworthy. I ignored him. Although, Anne, I will say, when I went through my own cancellation, I was incredibly grateful that you used your Express column to speak up for me and say, this is mass hysteria. And in that case, it was mass hysteria, I think, to get me cancelled from GB News.

That was obviously when Lawrence Fox had told an inappropriate joke on screen and I'd giggled along rather than maybe tell him off, even though we were after the watershed. And I guess because of my personal perspective on having gone through something like that, Anne, I know what it's like when the whole woke mob turns on you. And to me, it feels like Greg Wallace has become the number one target in the country. I mean, this has genuinely been leading the BBC news bulletins over the war in Syria or foreign news, which the BBC is meant to specialise in. Well, I mean, indeed, you think what Putin's doing would be slightly more interesting.

But no, I think what we have today is, and I thought this in your case, we have a very, very modern version of the witch hunt. Yes. And social media has taken the place of the Inquisition. Now, the only difference between the Holy Inquisition and what is going on on social media today is there's no physical future. But everything else is exactly the same. You find people with the wrong views. That might have done for the East German stars. But why on earth are we doing it in Britain? You find people with the wrong views and then you persecute until they lose their jobs, until their marriages break up sometimes. Whatever it might be, you just keep on at that person and you are using a power which is no different, absolutely no different from the power of the witch hunters and what they depend upon of course is

a compliant public actually joining in and the witch hunters couldn't have found all those witches they were denounced they were denounced by busybodies and that's exactly what is going on on social media today and it is appalling and that is one of the reasons why I'm so, so devoted to reform, is that we do genuinely believe in freedom of speech and we will not have a cancellation. And it will be the people who cancel who pay penalties, not the people who are being persecuted for what is often very little. And sometimes it may be serious. That's different. It is often very little. Sometimes it may be serious, that's different. But he's often very little. Well, I did see Elon Musk the other day posted cancel culture has just been cancelled. And I'm delighted that that may be how he feels in the US.

But it's certainly not how I feel in the UK, because I think this is the example of someone who is just going to be driven into the ground. And it's like, what do they want? What more do they want from this guy? Do they literally want him dead? And Anne, you have been in a lot of these showbiz type scenarios. Obviously, after you left politics, you became a reality star in your own right, a star of Strictly Come Dancing and have featured in loads of the big TV shows. Did you see this sort of thing? Is it true that there's lots of sexualised humour? Because I can't imagine you putting up with that, Anne. Well, I wouldn't, no.

I mean, I would protest very violently, but not to the executives. I'd protest to the person and say, don't do that, please. You know, I know i don't find that funny you want to do that you do that with people who find it funny don't do it in my presence because i don't um and that is how i would have tackled it didn't arise i mean anton was the perfect gentleman it really didn't arise on on scripted um but of course i went through a cancellation uh in 2019 i was doing a theatre tour and I went through a cancellation because my views on some aspects of the homosexual agenda were completely distorted and misreported. And in fact I said to a lot of people who sent me communications on my website etc. I said, sorry are you reacting to the interview or to the media

reporting and several of them did come back and then apologize having watched the interview. But I also found some gems. There were theatres who said no we're not cancelling, you can threaten all you like, we're not giving in to keyboard warriors, we're going ahead with this. The Lowther Pavilion, for example, up in Blackpool was tremendous. And I actually was quite heartened that there are pockets of resistance to this nonsense. And what we've got to do is to make that resistance more general.

Well, indeed. And that's why I'm in the independent media space now. Wasn't where I expected to end up so quickly, Anne. But believe me, it's beautiful here. I'm not regulated by the off communists. I don't have billionaire owners pulling my strings. And in fact, I can speak directly by my audience, being funded directly by my audience, like you are now with the launch of your Substack. But can I just ask Anne specifically on Mr Wallace,

did you find his comments offensive that this witch hunt seems to be driven by middle-class women of a certain age? I don't think that offensive, but I found them profoundly stupid. And I thought, you know, why on earth did he say that? He must have known that it was going to add fuel to the flames. It wasn't going to calm things down. I don't think he does, no. You know, why did he say it? Idiot. Idiot. He shouldn't have said it.

But, you know, it having been said, I think there are much worse things around. Yeah, no, I think there are. Look, I just worry that, I mean, I've even heard people now saying that John Turow should be cancelled. Now, John Turow is Greg Wallace's sidekick on Masterchef. And the claim is that, well, if Greg Wallace was doing all of this terrible stuff, then John Turow must have known about it. And so he should be cancelled too. And this is the problem. When you give in to these forces, where do you stop? I actually once went and did a little MasterChef practice with John and Greg, and I found them both to be perfectly nice people. Greg was not inappropriate in any way, certainly not with me, for obvious reasons, but not with anyone.

However, what I would say, Anne, is that he has the type of sensibility that the BBC doesn't like. They're not into what I would describe as working class in your face humour. Now, Nigel maybe puts it in the right way in terms of saying it's socially unacceptable now, but should it be? Do we really want to get to the point where we are starting to manage people's jokes? Because isn't the world going to be pretty dull? And if everyone's too scared to ever make a joke in a work setting? No, I think to be fair, conventions do change, and things which might have been perfectly acceptable a few centuries ago certainly aren't now. I mean, a few centuries ago, you would have referred to the working class as the canard, or as dogs, or something horrible like that. Well, you wouldn't say, just because you once did it, you can do it now. So I think

Nigel's perfectly right. There is a distinction between the past and the present uh and uh you know there are things you don't say now um or if you're going to say them you say them in the full expectation of a funeral um and uh as i say i i don't know why greg said what he said but where i do agree with you is yes i think now we take offense far too readily at silly little things that really are not offensive at all. And not only does that damage free speech, but it does damage humor. And, you know, people are now self-censoring. They don't prep jokes in pubs anymore. They watch very carefully what they say. How many times a day do you hear people say to you oh but you can't say that now yes you can you can on this show you can on the show i mean look i do on any show well yes and

look let's be honest about this it did get me cancelled from the mainstream media someone else's humor so this does happen and gb news was meant to be the anti-cancel culture channel. So it does happen if there is media hysteria. But I am proud, actually, when I look back. At the time, I maybe thought, oh, I made a bit of a stupid decision there. But actually, I never viewed my role as being the policeman of someone else's language. And even today, I don't believe that what Lawrence Fox said crossed any particular boundary. It certainly wasn't misogynistic. It was a bad joke, but we can make those bad jokes sometimes. And actually, it's what Ricky Gervais says, isn't it? Sometimes it's okay to offend and sometimes it's okay to be offended.

And when I look at some of these people like Asma Mir and Emma Kennedy, who are saying that they were so terribly, mortally offended by Greg Wallace, I think, come on, you're highly successful women. But what did they say to Greg Wallace at the time? That's the point. What did they say from the time?

As I say, if somebody really offended me, and really did offend me, I would say something. And I would say, just don't do that again, please. And it's no good, ages afterwards, somehow, then parading hurt and offence, when you should deal with it at the time. And the one thing that I do think has grown up now is that people will resurrect things that happened years ago. And, you know, but they didn't at the time. They didn't at the time. Offence archaeology. Indeed. Indeed. Because let me tell you, Anne, let me tell you, the types of conversations that were

going on in the newspaper newsrooms that I used to work in 20 years ago would be considered completely unacceptable today. Now, do we do offence archaeology on people's conversations? Because that is the reality of what's happening to Greg Wallace. A lot of these incidents took place up to 20 years ago. But look, Anne, thank you very much for pointing out that I'm being a massive hypocrite by talking about it today. It is so great to have you back, Anne. Absolutely love your sub stack. Let me tell you, I've recommended it on my own sub stack so you can find it there and immediately link through. And Anne has two columns running a week, one for all subscribers and then one for paid subscribers, where she goes much more in depth into a reform UK policy issue. And Anne,

I hope you come back to Outspoken soon now that we're Substack buddies. I will. Thank you. Thank you, Anne. So lovely to chat. But don't go anywhere because we have the uncancelled after show coming up on the aforementioned platform of Substack. And today, Brittany of the Royal News Network is joining me with all of the big royal news of the day, including the meaning behind Catherine, the Princess of Wales, emotional Christmas letter following her cancer battle. There she is. She's in London. Welcome, Brittany. I hope you're not too jet lagged. You know, it's very important to me that we have a safe space, not patrolled by big tech,

where censorship and control runs deep. So that's why I have Outspoken.live. It is our membership section on Substack where you get half an hour of extra content every single day. So what we do at this stage is we come off YouTube and rumble. We move to Substack to continue the conversation in the uncancelled after show. All you have to do is sign up at www.outspoken.live. Big news, we have a Cyber Monday sale running. This is going to end very shortly because it's a roll on from our biggest ever Black Friday sale, 30% off, which means if you sign up for a year, you can get access to Outspoken from just £3 a month plus VAT if you're in the UK. Do subscribe either way though. There is a free membership and I absolutely want you to be part of this community. I get how tough times are at the moment. If you can support me, do. But if you can't, please sign up. It's totally free and spread the word. I'm back tomorrow,

5pm UK time, midday Eastern, 9am Pacific. Hit subscribe if you're watching on YouTube or Rumble. I promise to keep fighting for you, but I hope to see you on Substack for the after show in just a few moments. Thank you. We'll be right back.