Dan Wootton Outspoken - UK GOVT CENSORS YOUTUBE AS TRIGGERNOMETRY FIGHTS BACK + TOMMY ROBINSON & JORDAN PETERSON SPEAK OUT

Episode Date: July 16, 2026

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The Hulu original series Furious is coming to Disney Plus, starring Emmy Rossum. Furious follows FBI agent Alice Black on the hunt for a mysterious and calculating serial killer. Both walk their own paths toward justice, and as their lives start to intertwine, the line between right and wrong begins to blur. Don't miss the three-episode premiere of the Hulu original series Furious on July 27th, only on Hulu on Disney Plus. Spent no bias, no censorship. I'm Dan Wooden. This is a special edition of outspoken episode number 540. I'm breaking today. The biggest British independent media shows on YouTube are at growing threat of state censorship.

As the authoritarian UK government under the soon-to-be Prime Minister, Rat King of the North Andy Burnham, decides to double down on dystopian plans to suppress unfiltered and daring conversations that risk weakening the mainstream narrative. The UK government is trying to essentially gain control of all of YouTube via the algorithm in order to make sure the information you can receive is heavily curated. Only consume what they say you need to consume because they know best for you. Don't worry about all the other independent creators or companies or journalists, just ours. We're going to bury them so you'd have to really go out of your way and the fucking sticks and mud to find anything that isn't approved.

The authoritarian UK government is coming for YouTube, aggressively seeking to regulate its content and turn it into just another tool of propaganda against the British people. This plot means shows like the massively successful digital native trigonometry will soon be hidden from your feeds in favour of the British Passion Corporation, Wokai TV and Sly News,

as the Labour government admits it doesn't want you hearing conversations like this. I believe this country is in danger. And all those laws are going to curtail and prohibit your speech and your ability to even have discussions on any of these issues. When the public realize the state of our nation, the safety of their children, the absolute destruction of our culture, our identity, and our future, when they realize they're going to look who's to blame, and they're going to look to the politicians, and they're going to look

to the journalists, they're going to look at who light, and they're going to look at who told the truth. Joining me for the entire show to discuss the end of free speech in the disunited kingdom is the co-host of Trigonometry, Francis Foster, who has also just become an author of the brand new book, Uneducated, My Life as a Teacher, and Why You Should Never Become One. So we're going to hear all about that too. Also coming up on the show today, Douglas Murray has revealed why Slippery Stama was over just weeks into his premiership, and it all goes back to his failure on the Southport massacre. And we'll reveal Trigonometry's most explosive ever moments

as we look back on the eight years of the podcast and its massive contribution to independent media. Then in the Royal Uncanceled After Show on Substat, we're joined by Paula Frolikuncensored to reveal why even Elton John has now ditched Prince Harry. You can sign up to watch at www. outspoken.live after the main show. No greatest British or union jackass today because of the special edition of the show.

Tomorrow, though, as normal, we will be revealing the worst Britain in the world this week? Will Adam Bolton take the win for his disgusting slurs about Anne Whittaker? Well, you can vote right now and make the decision in the Post's tab on YouTube. But now, let's go. Legacy media is dying and the establishment knows it. They know Brits are flocking to independent media. get their news from voices that won't censor the truth and that aren't afraid of having difficult conversations essential to try and stop the downfall of the disunited kingdom. But the MSM and the

Westminster elite simply cannot handle the success of brilliant independent shows, from trigonometry to Mike Graham, because they shine a light on the horrors of Britain's dark underbelly that for so long have stayed covered up. It is in this climate, that this week's re-emergence of Canadian psychologist and philosopher Jordan B. Peterson on Elon Musk's important free speech platform X was, in my view, so significant. As Tommy Robinson remains a toxic figure in our political establishment, and even for so-called right-wing parties like Reform UK, the most significant voice for many conservatives internationally broke his silence,

and of course it is a silence that none of us have liked to see because of his ongoing health battles to endorse the work of the Unite the Kingdom activist. He wrote, My wife Tammy played an instrumental role in encouraging my and thou podcasts with Tommy Robinson.

She was recently in the UK and spoke with him again. Without Robinson, the rape gang scandal would simply have disappeared. Now remember, Peterson has actually had Tommy on his massive podcast, twice. So let's just be honest about it. Tommy, no matter what politicians say, plays an outsized

role in the desire of the deep state to shut down the independent media. No independent media, no Tommy. And that's because mainstream organizations of the so-called center right, everything from the Daily Telegraph to GPN News to talk TV, continue to integrate the man day after day. But that propaganda is no longer really working because millions now hear directly from him. not just through his own Urban Scoop media organisation, but the wider independent space too. And you know one of the most important shows in that space is Trigonometry, the digital native podcast hosted by comedians turned intellectual heavyweights, Constantine Kissen and Francis Foster.

They reversed their position and invited Tommy on their show. And that was a huge moment because TriggerPod isn't just a mega success here in the UK, but across the Atlantic too, where many Americans are looking on in hot. at what is happening to our country, and the Islamist take over and take it as a necessary warning to them. That trigonometry conversation was headlined, Britain is on the brink, an honest conversation with Tommy Robinson, and it has now been viewed by millions across the globe, as Tommy educated many for the first time on the true risks of Islam. Let's have a look at this book. Now, I don't know how many people know this.

but the Quran is not in chronological order. I didn't know this. So one thing Muhammad says one day is next to something he says 20 years later. So for you to try and, any of us to try and make sense, it's like what the Christians used to do. They wanted everyone illiterate so they could control the population, yeah? The Quran is like an encrypted war man that you can't make sense of, yeah? And it's important that you can make sense of it because abrogation in Islam means whatever Muhammad says late in his life supersedes to what he says earlier. So if there's two contradictory verses, if he says, love the Jews and then later he says killed the Jews, then which one did he say later? This one matters. This prohibits this one.

So they give me the Quran and then I thought, right, let me make a few points here. Let me make, do not be friends with Christians or Jews and I challenge anyone to do this. Pick up a Quran and go through and make reference to the verses that tell you not to be friends with Christians or Jews. And I started writing these verses and I had pages of them. And I was like, it was like a jigsawl just fell into place. Everything I've seen grown up, the Muslim playground, the Muslim dinner talk. The friends who side with them. Well, they're taught from a little age. Supremacy, they're taught not to be friends with us.

They can't be friends with us. 70% of this book talks about us. How they need to treat us? So as I'm reading it, I started making sense of it. And that was my, and I didn't stop after that, if I'm honest. During that blockbuster conversation that we all know you would never see in the MSM, Tommy stated facts about the police that for years were dismissed. The police were letting them act the way they wanted.

Now, we now, they become a prescribed terrorist organisation by 2010 after one year of the English Defence League chasing them around the country. Then the government stepped in the Home Secretary and said, we've got to ban them. Well, you know, you should have banned them 20 years ago. You banned them because there was street problems. They only listened to that. So at the time, I understand.

So we went... Do you know, something, I interrupted you there because what you just said, I think 10 years ago, people would have been like, The police only react when there's three problems. But I can't argue with that now. When I look around at what's happening now, I can't argue with it. Because they cover up and ignore stuff until people are really angry.

And then they act on it. I mean, that's just people can say that's whatever. That's just a fact. If you look at our country now, if you look at the protest outside micro and hotels and all of the stuff, they have been ignoring all this shit until people actually started getting angry. That's just a fact. Well, look at what I believe was the assassination of Anne Whitakim, my friend and longtime colleague just last week.

The police got it wrong until we speculated. Tommy was also ahead of his time when it came down to exposing this government plan to censor and suppress free speech targeting shows like this and like trigonometry. And I'm a deep thinker, yeah? Yeah. I believe this country is in danger. I believe my children are in danger. And I believe the enjoyment and freedoms we've all had

are going to be eroded and taken, and the kids won't have them. And this is far bigger than me or my kids. This is about a generation of our kids. And I believe that. And I've believed it since growing up. So when this was starting... What do you mean by freedoms, by the way?

I mean that the ability to speak, because they just curtail and suppress, and it suits the government as well. well. So they create the problem a lot of time, which they're doing. And I think maybe I've played my part in that role where they want us all clashing with each other. Because as we're clashing with each other, we're not looking at them. And they want everyone separated into gay, straight, black, white, BLM, this group, that group. You're all war with each other. And whilst you're war with each other, they're implementing so many laws that you're not

not even listen about. And all those laws are going to curtail and prohibit your speech and your ability to even have discussions on any of these issues. And one of the reasons the establishment are desperate to make sure that you don't listen to Tommy, is because they are scared they will be exposed for decades of lies manipulating the British public about the reality of what is going on in the UK. I think that most people are sitting where we're sitting, as in something big is happening here. When I say the country's prime for revolution, it is. The mood of this nation, I've just, you know, down the end of here, there's a petrol station with the Greggs.

I had two people come up to me in that Greggs, who are talking about September 13. The level of feeling this country is, and the emotion and and fear that the public are having, when I see people, I remember I've gone through this for 15 years, I've gone from being spat out to being punched, to being hugged, to be an embrace, to have my hand shaken. And that process is now where the country's at, where they're gonna look, when the public realize,

the state of our nation, the safety of their children, the absolute destruction of our culture, our identity and our future, when they realise they're going to look at who's to blame, and they're going to look to the politicians, and they're going to look to the journalists. They're going to look at who lied, and they're going to look at who told the truth.

But unfortunately, I think things are going to get far worse before they get better. The Rack King of the North, Andy Burnham, campaigning in Makerfield with Hugh Grant, Mr Suppression himself, Mr. Hacked off himself. And that's why Tommy warned about the next Prime Minister here on outspoken. I don't know how much you know about Andy Burnham, Dan.

I investigated after the attacks in Manchester, the Ariana Grande attacks. I looked heavily into Manchester. And I found Andy Burnham continually sharing a platform with Mend. I found him and his friends took money from MENT. Mende are a extremist jihadist group. he works alongside them, not just works alongside them, his council were holding joint seminars across the area with this group. So Andy Burnham is in bed with Islamic jihad as any of them are. He doesn't care. So I don't see, but the worst thing is Andy Burnham's more of a palatable face.

You saw that in the recent election. I also, I think in the recent election that there should have been a conservative effort between restore and reform and everyone else to try and stop Andy Burnham. Because Andy Burnham is going to be a much better leader for Labour than Kirstarmors. But it's not just Tommy Robinson and trigonometry. This government censorship plan would take away your access

to all of these shows. Apparently not very happy that everyone seems to be stabbing him in the back. Well, what did you think would happen when he became the world's most unpopular Prime Minister and the world's most useless leader of any political party that has ever been? Get your breast cut off between seven and a half

and 12 and a half thousand pounds and for the vaginaplasty between 30 and 35,000 and for vulvaplasty it's about 20 grand that's how much it costs the NHS why why do immigrants have a right to be in the country well he's going home just right good contribution just mate immigrant I'm a cigarette bitch well he's going home Put it that way. And look, I don't usually like talking to you. I hope you realize that about this inside baseball stuff. Because actually, we should just be able to get on and do our job and report the truth

without any fear of arrest or censorship or demonetization. But increasingly, independent podcasters in the UK are having to contemplate a situation where we will actually have to broadcast to the UK from overseas, a bit like pirate radio, if you're old enough to remember, to avoid these draconian regulations. Indeed, independent geopolitics YouTube megastar Maya Tusi has publicly revealed his plans to broadcast out of Britain to stop his channel falling apart as a result of the deep state threat, something we first revealed here on outspoken. A lot of restrictions on free speech, on free press.

And with everything else being going on, we made a decision, as I've been hinting before, to expand in the US, to be safer, to be able to operate, and to be able to grow and be better than what we even are now. Now, thankfully, after many, many false starts, the Google-owned platform YouTube does seem to finally understand that the UK deep state threat to take control of its algorithm using the law to shut down free speech provides an existential threat to its business model too. It recently wrote to independent broadcasters like me. YouTube is yours because you built it. View by view, subscriber by subscriber, on the merit of your ideas and your connection with your audience.

However, proposed new rules could fundamentally change how your content is discovered, recommended and viewed in the UK. The UK government is running a public consultation called Watch This Space, a new strategic direction for UK media. The proposals include mandatory changes to how content is discovered. on YouTube. This could direct audiences away from your channel. As a UK creator, this directly impacts your future. Digital content discovery works best when driven by user choice, not legal requirements. This is a vital window for you to share your perspective before the consultation closes on the 31st of August 26. The proposed new rules include a mandatory prominence regime. This could require digital platforms like YouTube to prioritize and give a privileged position to traditional broadcasters like the BBC,

ITV and Channel 4, in user interfaces and recommendation fees potentially pushing your content out of site. Mandating prominence to traditional institutions will impact all other independent digital creators, production companies and media companies, including through your content downranked, pushing this group forward means pushing everyone else downward. Mandatory prioritization of broadcasters would affect how your content reaches your audience, regardless of what your audience actually wants to see, reducing user exposure to diverse content and independent creators, mandating prominence for established media networks would push the UK's diverse mix of independent journalists, educators and digital first businesses down the line.

Threat to reach and channel growth because your ability to organically grow your community is much harder if you are not discovered. Here's where it gets even more chilling. the consultation repeatedly emphasizes trust in the context of legacy broadcasters implies that digital first voices are less credible, damaging the foundational trust that sustains the creator economy. And I'm sorry, just look over the past few years, and I don't need to tell you, because you're already here, watching me or watching Trigonometry. I don't need to tell you that over the course of, for example, the COVID scam, it was digital independent creators that got this right. So thank goodness there are some political leaders speaking out, Reform UK boss Nigel Farage, writing,

look at this appalling state censorship. Labor now want to seize control of YouTube's algorithm. They want YouTube to artificially boost the BBC and Channel 4's content and suffocate independent journalists and producers. The BBC has been biased to pro-mass immigration, open borders and net zero views these past few decades. It's part of the reason we're in a mess. The BBC's own internal reports admit and document some of this bias. People have moved to X and YouTube in part as a response to it, and now Labor wants to control what they see there. Reform will scrap this heavy-handed lunacy. But trust me, this is only going to get worse under Burnham, because his future cabinet minister, the ex-UK Deputy Prime Minister, I call her Angela Red Rainer the Tax Evader, this week,

fully admitted on LBC that this government intends to just shut down negative coverage by claiming it as misinformation. One of the challenges that we face is that I think the government was being accused of shutting down free speech, but I don't think it's free speech, actually. I think when people are being given misinformation and untruths, it has caused challenges. If you remember the first summer that we came into government, there was a lot of misinformation that was out on social media, and it caused a lot of unrest.

And actually what we do need to do, And I think our deputy Prime Minister Lucey at the weekend was making the case for it as well is that we really do need to crack down on some of this rubbish that is being spouted out, which is wrong. And it causes real big problems for us. So I agree with you on that, that, you know, you shouldn't be allowed to just get away with saying whatever you want. Oh, so it was the misinformation that caused unrest was an ang.

Oh, that's odd. I thought it was the Islamist Axel Ruda-Gabana going to a Taylor Swift dance class in stabbing three young English girls. Sorry, must have got that wrong. Now, Francis Foster. Francis, so good to have you. I'm honestly so angry about this. And obviously we've got a lot to talk about, including your new book and trigonometry. But when you hear Angela Rainer there, and look, we've seen it all week. We've seen it even after Anne Whitakim's murder, Lucy Powell and and Diane Abbott suggesting that shutting down and censoring social media would somehow have stopped the political assassination of Whitty.

Like, why is this censorship the number one priority for this government, do you believe? Dan, I think it's because we have an inability, certainly amongst the political classes, to actually have a conversation which is difficult and uncomfortable. and where we go to the very heart of the matter. So a perfect example of this is Sir David Amos. Sir David Amos was brutally murdered by an Islamist. And then the very next day, what did we do? We had a conversation about online hate.

That was the conversation that we were having and whether we needed censorship for social media. Instead of actually having a conversation about Islamism, radical Islam. and unfortunately, we do not want to have those conversations. So what we actually do instead is have conversations about censoring on social media. And this is really important to say it as well, Dan, because the channels that you've all shown, many of whom are friends and all the rest of it, and we would agree that they're all on the right side of the political spectrum,

but this doesn't only affect them. This affects people on the left of the political. spectrum, the Navarra medias of this world. So if the people who are watching and listening... All of them. All of them. All of them. All of them. So if there's people who are watching or listening to this who are engaging with this issue, are thinking, well, it's only people on the right who are worried about it. Please, please be aware that the weapons that are used against your perceived enemies

will soon be used against your allies if and when they displease the government, which they surely will. because there are people at Navarra like Aaron Bastani who I actually think is a good faith actor and is very strong on things like freedom of speech they will come after them as well we are all at risk here

which is why it's so important I think whilst I know that they will suppress right wing channels but I think and it's really important to look at this as a bipartisan issue it's not left it's not right this is every single person in the UK who is going to be affected by this,

particularly if you like to get your news or political commentary from independent sources. So Francis, where do you come at this from a trigonometry position? Because Maya 2C, whose channel 2C TV has exploded in recent months, it's really started to focus on geopolitics now. So he is saying, well, actually, it just doesn't make sense for us to be based in the UK anymore. It doesn't make sense for us to broadcast from the UK anymore. For you, Trigonometry does have a massive footprint in the US. You've obviously traveled extensively there, recorded extensively there.

Is it tempting to think you could go there, be based out of there, and actually avoid some of these draconian censorship moves? Look, let's be honest, there is always a temptation to, you know, move abroad, particularly when the UK is in the way, is in the state that it's in. I am someone who was born in this country. My mother is from Venezuela, so I saw a country slowly slide into authoritarianism, communism. I saw what happens when totalitarian regimes take power. But I will say this. I have always considered myself English. I'm very proud to be from England. I think this country has a wonderful

history, which we unfortunately delegate. We have a culture that is so rich that it has literally changed the world. If you look at things like the, for instance, the three-piece suit, that is a British invention. An important one. An important one. Yeah. And which has now become essentially the costume of business. You look at the English language.

It's completely changed the globe. The English language is the international language. But I do not want to abandon this country in its hour of need. I really don't. And I think we are in a really dark place. But I also feel that until things become absolutely untenable, we are you going to remain here until things become untenable. And then once things get so bad,

then obviously you have to have a conversation. But no, I believe we have to fight. Yeah, that's how I feel. What about this government regulation specifically, Francis? I mean, I've spoken to a lot of independent creators who have said to me, Dan, this is what I'm submitting. I think you should do the same. And this is so sad, but I'm reluctant to do so because I actually feel like, and I probably will do it because it's the right thing to do democratically.

But I actually feel like the government is so determined to shut down people like me. Lucy Powell and Angela Rainer are so desperate to shut down critics like me. By making it clear what an impact this would have on a business like mine, I actually feel like if anything, it will supercharge them. It will make them want to do it more. Do you get what I mean? No, I don't necessarily think people will view it. And trigonometry in the same way, because obviously, trigonometry is not a podcast in my view anyway, that that is a podcast of the right.

I mean, you pride yourself on having guests across the political spectrum, but I don't know if that's how Labour would view it. So the interview that we are releasing literally yesterday is with former Tony Blair advisor and left-wing podcast that Alistair Campbell. Indeed, not a man of the right. No, a man of the right. How did it go? It went really well.

We had a good faith debate about populism, about the rise of populism, is populism good? And it was really, really invigorating. It was fun. He was a good sport. I have to say that. And what it did was it modeled good faith disagreement, which unfortunately in our society is in very short supply. But so I really, really dislike what this government are doing. Because what they're actually saying is these arguments that are being put forward from these outlets, we are going to suppress.

And instead of making the content from government outlets better, instead of making them more trustworthy, instead of making them more compelling, no, we're not going to do that. What we're going to do is we're going to put a thumb on the scales and make sure that our competitors can no longer be seen. This is authoritarian. It truly is. This is anti-free markets. It truly is. This is anti-capitalist.

And I mean, I think the thing that's so shocking, Francis, too, is you think about the resource that an organisation like the BBC or the British Bashing Corporation has, thanks to us, thanks to taxpayers, compared to an organisation like trigonometry, and yet there is zero chance, certainly at the moment, that the BBC across its whole suite of YouTube channels. I think they're launching something like 50 YouTube channels will do any of the numbers of trigonometry.

But I think what the mainstream media and legacy media fail to understand, it's not about resources, and it's not about budget, it's not about having a posh studio or like snazzy graphics or anything like that, is it? It's about trust and about truthful conversations. And certainly when it came to trigonometry, you have built that trust up over many, many years. I mean, you were broadcasting like I was, for example, over COVID. So you can immediately judge there. Well, who was actually prepared to challenge the narrative?

Well, of course. And look, the reason that the BBC is where it is is because they've betrayed the trust of its viewership. It's not an accident. It's not, you know, nobody's there scratching their heads going, well, why is it for much fewer people, watch the BBC than they're used to? It's simply because they have betrayed the trust of the public. And this gives me no joy whatsoever to say this. If you had asked me in the 1990s when I was a teenager and I was 18, 19 years old, if I liked, the BBC, I would have said yes. I love the BBC. I love the documentaries. I love the comedy. I love the

dramas. I love the news. But they've betrayed their own legacy. And it gives me no joy to say this. I'm not one of these people. I don't particularly consider myself to be on the right number one. Whatever, you know, if other people do, then that's fair enough and up to them. They're allowed to do that. But I'm not one of these people who takes any joy in watching the down. of a once great broadcaster. I think it's nothing else than a pure unmitigated tragedy, Dan. And this is another nail in the coffin. How can you possibly defend this?

It's indefensible. And they are going to defend it because, unfortunately, they look at the numbers and they see that the only way for them to compete with the phenomenon like trigonometry is with state support, which is actually so chilly in so many ways. And look, I agree with you. Like, Trigonometry should actually be held up as a show

that people sort of in the British establishment or centreground want to support because I totally agree with you that it's not a right wing show, even though you are so often lumped into that category. So the fact that Trigonometry will be suppressed, Navarra Media will be suppressed shows that actually they don't really care about fair content. It's not about that. It's about keeping their friends, like the BBC, like ITV, in power, and I think it's truly chilling. Breaking today, Douglas Murray has spoken out on the real reason that slippery Stama is finished. And I think this is fascinating because it's something I have said for a long time, but no one in the mainstream media has linked his existential decline to just weeks after he entered

number 10 Downing Street and turned against patriots after the Southport massacre. I was broadcasting live actually on the day. Do you remember this? When Stama turned up at the scene of the stabbing of those three young girls by Axel Ruda-Gabana and Islamist terrorists, even though they still won't say it, at a Taylor Swift dance class in a sleepy English suburb. And I could sense the palpable anger in that crowd. And rather than Stama actually going to speak to those people or understanding, oh my goodness, the English people have had enough. He went back to Downing Street, quaffed a whole load of champagne. I'm not joking. He was at a party, quaffed a whole load of champagne and hatched a plan to lock people protesting up. Hatched a plan

to lock people up who were commenting on social media about the tragedy. For example, Lucy Connolly, who ended up spending over a year behind bars. So I think it's one of those things that sort of the Kremlinologists at Westminster don't understand. They talk about lots of political intrigue and the winter fuel allowance, that type of thing. And I'm not saying that didn't impact Stama. But I genuinely believe the moment that the British public realized this man is not on our side was after the Southport massacre. Doug Dess Murray, I think he is such an important voice. Now a major columnist for the free press, Barry Vicer's free press in the UK. And it was on that. platform that he made this argument. Listen.

So unlike Blair, Stama came in with no particular popularity and with no particular program. I mean, he studiously in the election campaign avoided saying anything much that he was going to do. And then he succeeded in not doing very much. I don't think history will really remember him. There's a few. thing, I mean he continued British support for Ukraine. That's sort of been a happy place in a way, strangely to say, for British Prime Minister since the war began. It gives them a feeling of grandstanding on the world stage.

But other than that, you know, he's tinkered with some social media laws and so on. If he's remembered at all, it'll probably be for badly misjudging the public mood from the moment of the Southport stabbing's onwards, which was really only a few weeks after he entered office, and deciding that instead of dealing with any problems that existed in the country, he should clamp down on and prosecute and suppress the opinions of people who didn't like the bad things that were happening.

Francis Foster co-host of Trigonometry, do you agree with Douglas Murray's assertion that that was almost Southport? massacre and the reaction to it and the desire to crack down on free speech, the desire to lock up patriots from that moment on his premiership. Well, I guess you could say it was almost the beginning of the end, Francis. Do you agree with that argument? Do I agree with that argument? I think it's, I agree with one facet of it, but I think it runs deeper. I think then after 14 years of a conservative government,

which, in the words of Kemi Badernock, talked right, governed left, when people said time and time again, democratically, we want immigration lowered, when they voted for Brexit, and Brexit was, let's be honest, it was, they tried to throttle it,

they tried to thwart it, they tried to stop it. People are very, very, very angry. And by the way, this comes from someone who voted Remain. But when the results of the referendum came in, I was like, well, people voted against the European Union. I have to accept it. And we move on because that's democracy. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people in my camp, as it were, who didn't agree with that.

And what they try to do is they try to derail a democratic vote. This has been building for a long, long, long time. And then you had the terrorist atrocities like 2017, the Manchester bombings at the Ariana Grande concert. And people feel, and I completely understand why they feel this way, that the elites, as it were, the politicians, don't care about them, they don't represent them, that every time they vote for a political party and demand change,

the change will not be enacted. And as a result of that, we have ended up where we are. And I do agree that the Southport killings, horrific, absolutely horrific, played its part. It's a tragedy. We can all agree on that. But I also think that every prime minister would be doomed

particularly one who is fronting a Labour government because they are incapable and unwilling to actually tackle the issues which so desperately need tackling. 100%. And then you get to, well actually, before we get to Burnham, let's just talk about what type of Guy Stama is. Because I think one of the other big problems is that he was so holier than thou in opposition

that people expected him to run a clean administration, that we were getting a different type of politician. And I think alongside his bid to crack down on patriots and lock people up and all of that, and absolutely I think there's a huge amount of anger as a result of the constant invasion of our country, I do also think people were disgusted that he never practiced what he preached, Francis.

And we saw that sort of revolting type of privilege right from day one with do you remember Lord Ali spending all of the money on his clothes and all of that type of thing. And there was, I thought, quite an astonishing story, which again, the mainstream media didn't pick up over the past few days. But for me, it sort of was another thing that represented the way that Stama never actually acted in good faith, given the way that he criticised Boris Johnson, especially in government. And it was a very bizarre story, for instance, but I think you might know what I mean. So it was actually Noah Hoffman in The Spectator who revealed it. And she wrote,

The Tories have accused Sir Kirstama of using the government car service to transport his kitten between Downing Street and Chequers. It comes after Paymaster General, Nick Thomas Simons, confirmed that residents of Downing Street, including those in previous administrations, have frequently and publicly taken pets between residences. Tory chairman Kevin Holland Rake slammed the arson. outgoing Prime Minister for using the ministerial fleet to run a cat delivery service to checkers

and accused him of taking the puss. Okay, good line there, Francis. But isn't it fascinating that Stama's argument is not, oh, this is the right thing to do, this is how we should be spending public money, it's simply to say, oh, well, that's what they all did, so we're going to do the same. And it's like, no, people expected better of you. That was the whole reason people actually voted for you. I mean, I think you're right. It was largely because that turned off the conservative party so badly. But he absolutely presented himself as a figure who was going to be a paragon of virtue in number 10 Downing Street. And instead, what we've seen, I would argue, is the same old cronyism, the same old ability to try and line his own pockets. And I actually think it's disgusting

that a government fleet of cars is varying Kirstama's pussy from one resident to another. Well, there's a sentence. Anyway, so here's the thing with Stama. And this is, I don't think people talk about enough. We can talk about the scandals, fair. And every government has them. I think the real reason why people despise Starmad Dan is because he's weak. And people will forgive a leader for many things,

but they will not forgive them for being weak. If you think of all the great leaders this country has had, whether it's left or right, doesn't matter, you would never accuse a single one of them of being weak. Arguably, the last great prime minister this country has had is Tony Blair. Now, you can disagree with a great deal of what Tony Blair did, but what you cannot challenge him on is, when it comes to his leadership is strength.

Same with Margaret Thatcher. It's all of these leaders. You know who they were. You know that they had a vision. You know the choices that they were making were leading to a particular place. That's the place that they wanted Britain to be. Blair had it.

Thatcher had it. a lot of our great prime ministers had that vision. Starma doesn't have a vision. He U-turns, it seemed to me, every three weeks. There was another U-turn, after another U-turn after another U-turn. And look, let's inject a little bit of nuance into it. We're all human beings. We all make bad choices.

But if you do perpetual U-turn after perpetual U-turn, after perpetual U-turn, what it actually looks like is you don't know what you're doing. You are weak, you are supine, and people cannot trust a leader who comports themselves in that manner. It really is that simple. And I think that's the real reason why people hate Stama. It's because you can't respect a weak man. Yeah, and he was so weak on so many levels. Francis, do you sometimes find it quite extraordinary, though, how hated he was?

I mean, I'm just going to use another example, right? Gido Forks headlined it Care Mageddon. And it was quite an astonishing fact. They say cares are now an endangered species. And it was because, Francis, no new cares were born at all last year. They reported a tragedy for the outgoing PM as another year passes with no new cares. The final insult, new baby name figures for 2025 have been released by the Office for National Statistics Today. Care, 2025, zero.

Kemi, there's four, up one. Rishi, 28, up 10, Boris 19, up three. Liz, 18, down seven. Elizabeth, 624, down 82. Nigel 5, no change. Andy 21, down 5. So no change to the Nigels, the Andes are down 2. but quite astonishing is it?

Because it was, Francis, you'll remember it was quite a trendy name for a while, care. And this dude has just killed it off altogether, the name Care. Yeah, he is our most unpopular prime minister ever, which I do find somewhat surprising. I mean, look, like I said before, this is all cumulative, Dan. This is residual anger. This is residual anger at mass immigration.

This is residual anger at the fact that our economy hasn't grown since 2008 in real time. It's residual anger at the gradual decline of our nation. And it's residual anger at the fact that people feel that they're no longer being listened to by government. And here wasn't a good prime minister. Let's just put that diplomatically. but there was that backlash and that vitriol and that hatred. And this is really interesting to know. Cast your mind back to 2023 and 2024.

What did Keir Starmer actually say? What were his policies? What were his vision for Britain? I don't think a single person, maybe somebody on his campaign team would be able to tell us, but I don't think if you went down the street and talked to 100,000, people, they would be able to tell you.

Because the overriding message of his campaign, Dan, was, well, I'm not the Tories. Well, absolutely. But isn't that the exact same problem, though, that we're getting into now with Andy Mernard? I mean, this was the Daily Mail last week who described him as a Messiah without a mandate. They branded the coronation as a shameless stitch up. And I do wonder if this is going to come back to bite Burnham on the bum. because there has been no contest, there has been a coronation, and I follow this stuff every day. You follow this stuff every day. Could you say what Burnham's big vision is? What he intends to do

the country, how things are going to change? I think he's literally dropped a few soundbites here and there, but we have no idea about what he intends to do. My suspicion, and it's based on the people around him, is that he is actually going to push down a hard-left socialist path. nothing has announced. And I think this guy who is much more affable than Stama, let's be honest about it, like he's a good interviewee, he's good on social media, like he's got all of that down. My prediction is he's still going to end up almost as hated as Stama. Well, look, the fact that Andy Burnham is going to be maybe Prime Minister, Labour leader, even though he doesn't have a mandate for it.

Let's actually look at Burnham. The reality is Burnham is in an impossible place trying to do an impossible job. You look at the Labour Party and you look at all the different sections of the Labour Party. You've got the old school lefties. You've got the progressive liberals, the hyper-progressive liberals, the woke, if you will, in the Labour Party. You have got the sort of left of centre, kind of interchangeable with the liberal Democrats. You've then got people in the Labour Party, like, who are actually putting forward that, you know, they want to introduce blasphemy laws.

To hear Ali is an example of that. He got up in Parliament, I think it was in November 2025 and advocating for blasphemy laws. And then you've got everything else in between. And you're looking at this broad coalition of people and you go, these are a group of people. It is literally impossible to hold together. What does an old-school left-wing firebrand, for one of a better term, what are they have in common with a woke liberal progressive? The answer is nothing.

And then you've got to hear Ali, who's a strict Muslim. what does he have in common with a woke liberal progressive who thinks that gender is a social construct? Then you've got the centre left who are, you know, pretty much David Cameron in disguise. You cannot construct a set of policies that will please all of those people. And the moment you start to then start to go, right, we're going to implement certain policies, That's the moment they're all going to be at each other's throats because that's another problem with the left is the capacity that they have for infighting

and for just going at each other over the slightest provocation. And the other challenge as well that Labor faces is the Green Party, where they're hemorrhaging lots and lots of the hyper-liberal progressives and young people and with this vote at the age of 16, the Greens are going to be clearing up.

And that is a very, very real worry for Labour. And then as well, losing the Red Wall over to reform and to restore as well, a small minority, a very small minority going to restore. For now. For now. I think it might get bigger. It was interesting actually. I saw a poll this week, Francis, in the Manchester mayoral election, restore at 9%.

Nine percent. I mean, it's not, all I'm saying is it's not to be scoffed at, is it? You know, not to be scoffed at. Now, Trigonometry is one of Britain's biggest and most successful and most consequential shows in the independent media. it has been running over eight years now and as a result of its success has encouraged this country and other folk across the world in the west to have difficult conversations some of which have triggered. See what I did there. Cultural shifts. One person who knows this more than anyone else is of Francis Foster who joins us now to go through some of Trigonometry's most explosive and impactful moments as he releases his new book, Uneducated. My Life as a Tehranerner. I'm an educated. My life as a teacher and why you should never become one.

Now, over six years ago, is Trigonometry had a guest on the show called Posey Parker. We know her today as Kelly J. Keen, but things were very different six years ago. It was during a time when daring to suggest that trans women were indeed men was considered extreme. And you can tell by the line of questioning by Francis' co-host, Constantine Kiss, and when he asked her about the element of compromise on her position, watch.

They're just men. That's it. There's no compromise, pose. There's no middle ground where we can say, okay, fine. They're not women, let's say. What they are is trans women. And we create a separate category so that those people can get the comfort that they need. They can have their own pronouns used.

But for the purposes of, let's say, sport and other fields, they're not treated exactly as women in that sense. But broadly speaking, we give them the comfort that they've done. They need to feel good about themselves. So in order to compromise, I will have to change my language to something that I know isn't true. But no, I'm not saying you have to say they're a woman. I'm saying you have to say they're trans woman, for example. It's a new category, let's say. No.

Why? I just don't. I think it's really bloody offensive to think that you can just stick on some clothes and demand that I change the way I'm. think because I don't think that I trans women is a nonsense term. Woman doesn't apply to those. But you don't think there's a difference between me and me having cut off my penis and replaced her with an artificial vagina and artificial breasts.

Is that not a different person, a different type of person? I think you're probably a troubled human if you do that, but I don't think that makes you a different category of human. So look where we are six years later, Francis. How does it feel watching that now and how the dial has moved? over the years because that episode was hugely popular at the time, wasn't it? And do you think it's, I guess, help contribute to the war on trans, which is now effectively over? Well, look, there's a little bit of context here. So that was recorded, I think, in 2019, very early 2019. At that time,

I was doing stand-up in the evenings. I was doing trigonometry. And I was also a primary school teacher. So I... That was a very different time in your life, Francis. My God. Yeah. And so excuse my language, Dan. I was shitting myself. Because are you like, I'm going to be sacked?

I don't legitimately thought that. I was seeing they going, well, I'm going to have to somehow replace my teaching career. I was in the most left wing of all professions. And people go to me, you look tent. I'm like, yeah, of course I look tense, mate. I thought on the moment I went into work the next day after it got released, so I was going to get given the boot.

Of course I look tense. Well, it's interesting because you didn't just have, I mean, this is what I like about Tricking Donutscheon. You'll have both sides on, right, of a particular debate. But what is interesting, I think, shows a stark change of position, is that actually India Willoughby, who now will just make a... shudder. But seven years ago, was actually trying to insert herself into right-wing circle,

suggesting she believed the complete opposite of what she does now. It's so fascinating to watch. Well, my view, controversially as far as trans people are concerned, is that I don't think you can actually get away from the fact that if you've been through a male puberty, the chances are, not guaranteed, but the chances are that you are going to be taller, bigger, have a long a greater stride, all of these elements that will come into play if you're playing a sport. And I would divide it into two areas of the sport. I think obviously in terms of keeping fit and having fun and recreational, then I don't think there's a problem.

If everyone's happy to accommodate people into that environment, then great. But I think there is a distinction when it's professional sport. You might think this is terrible. I don't like using... I mean, I would call India Willoughby a He being honest. Do you think that he was being honest with you during that interview? Like, what's changed?

It's so interesting, isn't it? Do you know, one thing I always try and do, Dan, is I never try and intuit motive, because the reality is, you never know what's going through someone's head. You never know what... someone's thinking or feeling. And I'll give you an example from my own life.

Constantine and I, we set up trigonometry in 2018. At that time, my views on economics, politics, culture, and society have moved. They've completely changed. And there are a lot of people in my former industry of stand-up who will say, and if you ask him, they will go, Francis is on the left. He's just a grifter who does this for money. And the only reason that he's changed or he's saying these things is quite simply because

he's just interested in money, he's interested in success, he's interested in fame, and that is it. As opposed to what has genuinely happened, which is I started a show with Constantine and we have had conversations and as a result of the, those conversations over many, many weeks, months and years, my mind has now changed. So I know what you're saying. I just try never to do that simply because it got done to me a lot.

So we shouldn't beat people up if they have been on a journey, a political journey, to use that old X-Factor term. And I think, look, Francis, to an extent we all have, right, because I think there have been certain, I described them as radicalization moments over the past decade. And I actually don't mean radicalization in a way that the left would jump onto it, right? But I think for some people it was Brexit. Like that's when it happened for me because it was seeing the deep state do everything possible

to overturn the biggest democratic vote in British history. But for other people, it was COVID. for some people it was the vaccines, but for some people it was the trans issue. Do you know what I mean? There's been a lot of these seminal moments. And once you're woken up, and once you're maybe engaged in watching trigonometry

or watching outspoken, that type of thing, then you don't look at things in the same way again. And I think that's why the mainstream media plays a really interesting part of this. And there was actually another one of these seminal moments on trigonometry. I'm very interested to hear your view on it now because it all sort of blew up. with Fraser Nelson on this episode about whether Rishi Sunak is English. And I think it sparked a much more important

conversation, which we had been having in the independent space, as you know, but had never, like, bled into the mainstream. And this episode of trigonometry changed it. And it's effectively, right, what does it mean in 2026 to be English or British? But here's part of the conversation. And do we regard Rishi Sunak as English, for example? I've always said this is a very unpopular thing, that I'm not English, I will never be English. I don't think Rishishish Sunak is English. We're both British, but we're not English. You weren't born here, you are an immigrant. Well, my son was born here. I don't think my son is English.

Right. He's born to a Russian immigrant. Again, that's definition. I would say that Rishisunek is as English as Tyser and wife, friends, right? He is absolutely English. He was born and bred here. and I wouldn't say that the colour of his skin makes him any... He's a brown Hindu. How is he English? Because he's born and bred here. So by being born here, you become English, in your opinion. Yeah.

Now, how did you feel about that, Francis? Because trigonometry, I think, has been much more accepted than a lot of the other independent media shows, right? In Westminster, like, you have a studio where you film certain interviews in Westminster. You have a lot of big mainstream politicians on your show. But in that... moment, you were sort of like dumped into the category of like, you know, racist extreme, terrible far right content because I think Constantine in that case

just stated a fact, but that's not how it was viewed in the mainstream media. So how did you feel about that conversation? The way I feel about that conversation is the way I feel about a lot of conversations, Dan, is that we, there are so many conversations that we simply feel that we cannot have. We cannot have. We cannot have a conversation about,

for instance, this was a number of years ago, going back to trans, what is a woman? That was the apex of the nonsense and the ridiculous. And it was controversial to say what a woman it is.

That was the peak of insanity and the peak of lunacy. And it was so interesting for me, watching the fallout from what happened. Because as somebody who is from a product of a first generation immigrant and my father is English, well, half English, Irish, these are always concepts that I've always thought about. And I always had conversations with friends. I'm from South London. A lot of my friends were

ethnic minorities. A lot of them came from mixed heritage backgrounds. And we used to talk about. this like do you see yourself as english do you see yourself as british what's a difference between a british person and an english person why do you why do you support if you are half english as one of my mates is one it half english half italian why is it you don't support the england team but you support the italian team even though you were born and brought up in this country is it because you feel more italian than you feel english these are conversations that we used to feel able to have and now because of this fear that every single one of us has where we just think that if we say the wrong thing or if we say something, not even that it's wrong, but we just express it in a way that is clumsy

or not even in a way that is clumsy that can be taken out of context and then put on the internet and it go viral, our lives will be destroyed. Yeah. It has just silenced everything. And the thing with the show is we want to have those conversations. We want to have all of these conversations. And do you know what? We may be right.

The guests may be wrong or the guests may be right or we might be wrong. It could be a little bit of both. But what we do is we have the conversation and we leave it up to the audience member to make us. Yeah, and I mean, that was such a good example of that. But things have certainly changed, right, Francis, back from 2019. I mean, it's incredible to think. 2019, you're working as a teacher part-time, you're doing your comedy gigs at night. During, like, the most controversial war in recent times,

trigonometry secures a sit-down with the Israeli leader Benjamin Netanyahu and all hell breaks loose. Here is some of that interview. Prime Minister, you've just used the words the Western leaders buckled. And I'm assuming what you're referring to is Kirstehrman's statement on the 25th of July where he said that the UK would recognize

a Palestinian state. What is your response to that? And do you think that was just going to essentially encourage Hamas to continue? their assistance? Yeah, of course it does. I mean, look, they commit the greatest savagery against Jews since the Holocaust, and the Prime Minister of Britain says,

will reward you with a de facto state, which is what? Which is committed openly to repeating the October 7th massacre over and over and over again. Quite an extraordinary moment, Francis, I thought, for trigonometry. But you must have known it was going to be controversial, I guess. did you expect the firestorm it created? Because I guess lots of people, I mean, I guess, look, you get involved in that conflict. You're going to get it from both sides. But a lot of people were saying, well, why were you not asking him this?

Were you tough enough on him? How do you feel looking back now? I'll be honest you, Dan. We're both incredibly proud of that interview. I think it was the perfect balance between allowing a guest to talk and inserting the appropriate level of challenge. This is something that you will know for yourself. You ain't going to please everyone.

If you'd gone and you'd just been, you know, with BB and just pointing the finger and gesticulating, not allowing him to speak and doing a traditional mainstream interview, then people would have quite rightly said, would you didn't allow him to speak? But then you do allow him to speak, and everybody's like, well, why did you allow him to speak?

And you're like, well, I think you've got to, when you're in this game, you've got to switch off what people are saying. And you've got to look back at your work and be hypercritical with yourself and think to yourself, did we do the best possible job at that point? And I think we did. I'm genuinely proud of that interview. I think it's fair. I think it's balanced.

I think there's the appropriate level of challenge, like I said, but also he gets to outline his case. And as always with trigonometry, you are the audience, you are the adult, you get to make up your own mind. It's up to you. I'm not going to tell you what to think.

I am going, and constant as well, we bring people on, we explore their ideas, when we disagree, we insert the appropriate level of challenge, We don't do it hominin. We don't do shrawmanning. We take it on. In good faith. ...any differently to how you treat all of your guests.

That's the critical thing for me. Obviously, the Trump thing gets a lot of people going to Francis. And one interview that went viral around the world caused a lot of controversy among the right was when Sam Harris went on, I guess you'd say, what, a stark anti-Trump rant, I guess. Jesse didn't care if Hunter Biden. had corpses of children in his basement, and that's subverting democracy to ensure Trump wouldn't become president

would be warranted. It was a really extraordinary interview. Take a look. Hunter Biden, at that point, Hunter Biden literally could have had the corpses of children in his basement. I would not have cared, right? It's like there's nothing.

First of all, it's Hunter Biden, right? It's not Joe Biden. But even if Joe Biden, like, even whatever scope of Joe Biden's corruption is, like if we could just go down that rabbit hole endlessly and understand that he's getting kickbacks from Hunter and Biden's deals in Ukraine or wherever else, right, or China, it is infinitesimal compared to the corruption we know Trump is involved in. It's like it's like a firefly to the sun, right? I mean, like there's just it doesn't even, it doesn't even stack up against Trump University, right?

Trump University as a story is worse than anything that could be in Hunter Biden's laptop, in my view, right? Now, that's not, that doesn't answer the people who say it's still completely unfair to not have looked at the laptop in a timely way and to have shut down the, you know, the New York Post's Twitter account. Like that, that's a just a conspiracy. To deny the presidency to Donald Trump. Absolutely it was.

Absolutely. Right. But I think it was warranted. Now that blew up, didn't it, Francis? And was that difficult because you're actually quite friendly with Sam, aren't you? I'm a huge Sam Harris fan. I actually have his app and I listen and I meditate to Sam's voice every morning. I in fact did it this morning in bed.

So yeah, that was, it was, look, that was, I'll be honest, that was tough for me because I disagree with what Sam said. but I really hated what happened to him and the fallout afterwards. I don't like to see people going through that. I don't like to see mass pylons happening. I don't like to see people screaming for people to be cancelled on either side of the political spectrum. Part of the reason why we started this show is that we hated this and we wanted to create a space where it would combat this kind of.

of, you know, outrage and the social media machine and all the rest of it. And whenever people came up to me on the streets and were like, oh, you know, Sam Harris, I'm like, no, I didn't enjoy that. I didn't like seeing the after effects of that interview. I didn't like seeing what happened to it. It almost went too viral. Yeah. Because we don't want our interviews to go viral, don't you? But I know what you mean you don't want your guests to feel like there's going to be a massive backlash for coming on. But that is always, I guess, the risk of the internet with things are taken out of context. But look, I have to end on a laugh, though, in terms of our highlights, because there was a very funny moment with Theo von, you know, huge star of the

American independent media, roasted trigonometry. Hello. Oh, no way, bro. No fucking way, dog. That's not real, huh? No, what is... Look, we do a formal intro, all right? Let's just get it over here, all right?

That's how we normally start our interviews, let's get it over with. Right, hello and welcome to Trigonometry. I'm Francis Foster. Oh, come on, dog. You gotta do better than that. I agree with you. Thank you. Sorry, man. I'm not trying to tell you what to do. You know what you're doing. But you got to try harder, bro. All right. Start again. All right.

Hello and welcome to Trigonometry. I'm Francis Foster. I'm Constantine Kissett. And this is a show for you if you want honest conversations with fascinating people. Our brilliant guest today is already taking the piss out of us. It's the amazing American comedian Theo Von. Welcome to Trigonometry. You guys have, we call it autism.

That's so good. So funny. But Francis, there is a thing, isn't there? like, do you almost sometimes think the Americans love you guys more because of what they regard as that English charm? I think it's always why like Pierce Morgan, for example, and I know he's a guest, he's a previous trigonometry guest, but I think it's why he sometimes gets away with so much so much more in America than he does in the UK. Yeah, look, I think the one of the things that I love about America is a genuine love and fondness that they have for us, Brits. And whenever I I've been to America, they've always been super open, super lovely, very welcoming people.

And it's just, you know, and I think they love our kind of, because we are socially awkward. We're a little bit weird. We're a little bit strange. We're a bit emotionally repressed. We can't say what we think and feel. And then so we sit there and they're obviously they're loud and they tend to be brash and outgoing. And it's this clash of cultures. And I think that's that. By the way, we talked about. Sam Harris, that is the most viral clip ever. I think that clip is in the billions. Because I got clipped and shared across all platforms. I have been in places where people come up to me and just go, you guys have, we call it, autism. Just apropos of nothing. It was a truly viral moment. And it was brilliant.

And to me, that's the strength of the show. You know, we can interview a Benjamin Netanyahu. We can, you know, interview Tommy. We can interview Alistair Campbell. And we can also have a laugh with Theo Vaughn and make a great comedy pod. It's a multifaceted element of the show that makes it what it is. Francis, Jimmy Carr, on the front of your book, Uneducated, right? Francis is doing for teaching what this.

This is going to hurt did for medicine. Brutal, honest and laugh out loud, funny. The subheading of your book, My Life is a Teacher and Why You Should Never Become One? Isn't the issue, Francis, that we need amazing people like you in the classrooms instead of these terrible, wotopian hard leftists who are taking over our children's minds? I think the problem is that.

is look, the teaching education system is broken. And when you have broken systems, it leads to broken outcomes. And ultimately, it leads to broken people. So the problem is, is that you can go in as a teacher with the best of intentions and wanting to change kids' lives. And you might be able to do it for a certain period of time. Unfortunately, after a while, you get ground up and you get spat out. And this book is about a teacher's journey. And for those of you who think it's going to be miserable. It's not. Like Jimmy said, it's laugh out loud, funny. It's hilarious. You're going to have a blast reading it. But you're also going to learn about what it is to be a teacher, the education system. And why is it that we're so, forgive me, but our school and our kids and

our education system are so completely and utterly screwed. It's a blast. It's a really, really good book. And if you don't like me and want to see me absolutely humiliated, give it a read because there's loads of stories. Take us, take us back to one of those moments because you say there was a moment when you were standing up in front of the classroom. And obviously, you're a comedian. So at night, I would argue you're actually doing something that for most people would be considered much more difficult, right? Stand up in front of really difficult crowds. But you actually seem to suggest that it's harder for you to be standing up in front of a classroom because you knew that the class in question were not actually laughing with you that they were laughing at you.

So paint me a picture. What happened? What lesson was that how did you lose the room in that way? So I was teaching a drama lesson and I walked in to this drama and the kids had already let themselves was into the classroom. It was a mess. A drama studio is basically a black box. There's just there's no table, there's chairs, but they're all scattered around. And I said, and I was very new and I was very inexperienced, and I was in my mid to late 20s, and these kids were a teenager, so they were barely 10 years younger than me. And I tried to, you know, be the alpha male, put the chest out, and say the words, right, kids, I want to circle. I wanted them to get into a circle.

Yeah. And there was a general hubbub and they ignored me. And I went, I want a circle. Again, they ignored me. And then I went, I just want a circle. And one kid turned around, looked at me in the eyes while I was holding a can of cherry Coke and said the words, Mr. Foster, you're a drama teacher. Imagine one.

And at that point, I looked down and I noticed. my flies were undone and I'm like you're out. Was that the moment? No. That was early on in my career. What was the moment when you were like I'm done?

I think it's when during a P.E. lesson one of my kids took a shit in the sink and then having to explain that. Yeah. Yeah. Because we separated the boys and girls and then the female

teacher was with the girls as they were changing. I was with the boys. And then one of the kids who went to the toilet must have just absolutely defecated into the sink. And you're just like, I'm out. I'm out. And then the deputy head came in and we sort of had like a fecal equivalent of Hercule Poirot where she came in and quizzed everybody in the class. And who knew it? It was. it was I just couldn't see it's so interesting to be because I grew up in a household of teachers so both my parents were teachers um I actually went to the school where both my teachers were parents at the time my dad was deputy head he ended up going on to to become a headmaster and

so everyone always assumed that I would become a teacher that it was almost like something I was you know destined to be because I have to say my parents were like those dream teachers. Do you know what I mean? Like truly altruistic. Love the job. Absolutely believe in what they're doing. It's a vocation.

It's not a career. All of that. And I saw what they had to put up with ice. I mean, my dad has hilarious stories about like kids coming in with like a wooden stick to beat him up one time. And he then ended up becoming like great friends with that guy further down the line. It's a really, really difficult job is the point that I made. And so from quite a young age, I was like, why on earth would I ever be a teacher? Of course not.

Like, I've seen how difficult this is for my parents. I've seen that it's not a job where you're showered with lots of sort of life's luxuries. No, I'm absolutely never going to be a teacher because it was seeing my parents up to close, given what an absolutely brilliant job they did do. But I do wonder how we can attract better people into. teaching, Francis, because is it about money? Like, does, does the pay have to be higher? Like, because I know everyone always looks at teachers and says, oh, you get all of those really long holidays and you work great hours. But actually, if a teacher is doing their job properly,

trust me, that's not the hours. Because the good teachers, you know, are down at the pool, coaching the water polo class, you know, doing the choir after school or a at lunchtime. Do you see what I mean? The great teachers actually do work really hard. They plan their lessons during school holidays, for example. Yeah. Look, if you were going to be a teacher and you're going to do it properly, it is an all-encompassing job. It is six days a week, maybe even seven, and you're going to get in at seven o'clock in the morning, you're going to leave it seven at night, and you're going to go home, and you've still got marking and planning to do and all the rest of it. We do need to pay teachers more, number one. But also, that's, you're going to

That's not the main issue, Dan. The main issue is we treat teachers abysmally in this country. When you look at the behavior in the classrooms, it is quite frankly a disgrace. The way that teachers are treated by parents, but mainly by children, it's unforgivable. And the reality is those kids and their behavior is driving teachers. out of the classroom in their droves. The average teaching careers last just slightly under five years. And there's a reason for that. Pay has got to be a part of it. Of course it is because the pay is woeful. But it's not the main part. It's the conditions. It's going into a classroom every day and not knowing if you're going to be allowed to teach. Yeah, which is so sad. It is so sad. And unfortunately, it's one of those areas in life, I guess, where wokeery has actually encouraged teachers to be treated worse,

which is ironic, given so many teachers are woke. But actually, the breakdown in discipline in large part is because of the woke takeover. Okay, so I'm educated, my life as a teacher and why you should never become one by Francis Vosser. Is it out now? And Francis, come on.

This has like TV drama written all over. Are there some secret talks going on, Francis? Are you like, is this going to be your big hit? I'm hoping. We're pitching it at the moment. I've got a, I've got an agent in LA who's doing the round. So we'll see. We'll see what happens. But yeah, that's a dream. I'd love to pitch it and for it to get turned into a TV show. But you're not leaving trigonometry regardless. No, no, never, never. Excellent. We're married now, myself and Constantine. Excellent stuff. Okay, so uneducated my life as a teacher in why you should never become one available now at all good bookshops or via Amazon. of course or the online bookshops and do make sure you subscribe to trigonometry. And I've also seen that trigonometry is a big, big success on substact now too. And I've been really pushing substact, for instance, I don't know if you have because

with all of this algorithmic takeover by the UK government, I think substack is a good way for people to avoid that because it means we can email directly. And it doesn't operate on the same algorithm system. So I've been delighted to see trigonometry absolutely soaring in the same. substack charts. So that's another place. But of course, do subscribe on YouTube as well.

Francis Foster. One second. I've also got a new channel called the Francis Foster Show, which does half an hour deep dives into culture, society and politics. The video that we're going to release

this is Thursday on tomorrow will be all about YouTube censorship. Oh, brilliant. But we've done one on communism. And it's starting to take off. A lot of the videos are now getting over 100,000 views. People are sharing it.

People are loving it. It's politics with a small piece, society and culture, but it's satire and it's really funny. Yes, I am subscribed. I am absolutely subscribed. The Francis Foster Show on YouTube as well as Trigonometry and of course the brilliant book. You've got a lot going on, Francis. So I so appreciate at the time you've taken to be with us today here on Outspoken.

Thank you so much. Thank you so much, Dan. Cheers, mate. Appreciate it. Thank you, Francis. Hope to see you soon. And of course, thank you for your company. today. We are not running a Greatest British and Union Jackass today, but we will be back

revealing the worst Britain in the world this week on tomorrow's show. You can vote right now in the posts tab, the community tab on YouTube. And don't worry, we are back as normal with all of the news tomorrow 5pm UK time, midday eastern 9.m. We are heading over to sub-sac now, though as normal for the Royal Uncanceled After Show, Paula Frolic, uncensored, is going to join us there. She's great, so I'm very excited about that. Please do hit subscribe right now on YouTube. As I mentioned, please also subscribe on Substap because it does help avoid all of this algorithmic censorship coming from the UK government. The address again, www.w.outspoken.live, have a wonderful rest of the day.

And most importantly, I promise to keep fighting for you.