Danny Jones Podcast - #291 - Smithsonian Cover-Up: The Lost GIANTS of Ancient America | Jim Vieira

Episode Date: March 20, 2025

Watch every episodes ad-free & uncensored on Patreon: https://patreon.com/dannyjones Jim Vieira is a stonemason, writer and star of History Channel's "Search for the Lost Giants." SPONSORS https://rhonutrition.com/discount/danny - Use code DANNY for 20% off. https://truewerk.com/danny - Get 15% off your first order. https://bubblycleaning.com/dannyjones - Get your first 3 hours of cleaning for only $19. https://whiterabbitenergy.com/?ref=DJP - Use code DJP for 20% off. GUEST LINKS https://www.megalithomania.co.uk https://www.facebook.com/giantsonrecord FOLLOW DANNY JONES https://www.instagram.com/dannyjones https://twitter.com/jonesdanny OUTLINE 00:00 - Ayahuasca cure for seizures 10:11 - Archeological giant humanoid skeletons 19:56 - Hancock vs Dibble debate 30:41 - Excavated giant human skeletons 46:10 - Lost connection to mysticism 53:12 - Plato, Atlantis & Ogygia 01:13:22 - Trump JRE podcast 01:24:46 - Fish gods & ancient Sumer 01:35:14 - Dead Sea Scrolls & Egypt 01:53:49 - Future archeologists 02:04:18 - Psychedelic experiments Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You were just telling me you had a, what were you saying about your TBI? How did you get a traumatic brain injury? Playing football. Oh, really? I got, it was funny. We were playing East Bridgewater. I grew up in Hull, South of Boston. They pulled us a little closer.

Yep. And I was running back in a linebacker. And I took a hit during the play. And I scored on like an 80 touchdown. But like, I remember running and like the cerebral spinal fluid came out of my nose. Oh, yeah, and I was like just, just really wonky. And everybody's jumped, you know, I scored the touchdown. I go back to my coach and I explain what was happening.

But this is like, you know, the 70s or something like the freaking dark ages. So I get sent back in, obviously with the swollen brain, skull fracture and TBI, and ended up manifesting as a seizures disorder. I would get waves of petty mall, grandma seizures that required medication and, hospitalizations and massive depression for weeks on end and the moral of story is I then went in to the meet with the shamans in Ecuador and do a series of ayahuasca ceremonies for many weeks and I came back and healed the seizure disorder I never took medication again I got off to Delanton the deprecote the Neurontin and I've never had I haven't had oras or seizures in like 15 years oras are

is a kind of like pre, it's like almost a precognition of a seizure. You know when it's coming. So it's this weird twilight zone. And with the seizures, especially the petty malls, I would get waves of them in the sleeping waking state and they would cause massive depression for weeks on end. I mean, I couldn't freaking move. I was paralyzed and it was insidious and intractable.

And all this is verified by my former neurologist, Dr. Alice and Ryan in Northampton, Mass. So I am indebted to the spirits of ayahuasca, let's say. Holy cow, man. So after you did the ayahuasca, you never got any seizures or oras. No. How old were you? Probably like 17 years ago, something like that.

Yeah, yeah, what was I? No, the seizures didn't manifest until a little later. I got the injury early on, and then I started to get like neurological dysregulation and things like that. but the real seizures, I think, started manifesting in my 20s. How long after the injury did the seizure start coming on? Seven, eight years? Seven or eight years, really.

Yeah. And then after the seizures happened, you did the ayahuasca. How many years later? It's all a blur. Yeah. In my 30s, I believe. Yeah. Yeah, in my 30s.

What do you think it was about the ayahuasca that was able to completely get rid of the seizures and all that stuff? It's a good, you know, it's anti-parasitic. It has all. these efficacious applications for the human body. I could tell you a metaphysical theory, you know, that one thing was I faced all these neuroses and self-doubt and this internal conflict and trauma within myself like everybody suffers with. So I really straightened out a lot of the things that drove my,

behaviors in life that were unhealthy. Addictions, seeking externally, I was able to sit with myself. There's a part of the brain called the claustrum, right? The ego center that literally gets put to sleep and anesthetized when you do plant medicine ceremonies, when you do psychedelics. John Hopkins figured that out in like 2020. So I like to say the ego gets put to sleep, the tyrannical operating software of the separate self, the mystics would say.

It gets put to sleep. and you can see with Cleavision. And it's like you get like this life review. You can see everything. You can see how you behave unlevelingly and why you can see the drives and the unworthiness and you can do something about it. You can make these changes in your life.

But the day-to-day tyranny of the ego doesn't allow you to see that. It's in the way of, say, your divine nature, for instance. So I believe that I removed a lot of that turmoil and judgment and all these. because all the judgments we have for others in the world are really judgments and unworthiness we feel about ourselves projected

to get a hit so you feel better and self-righteous like a freaking bad drug addict. The reality is it's like that undoing of the trauma within that manifests in a better way. So moral of the story, I think there's a physiological aspect to ayahuasca and I think there's a metaphysical one as well. It allows you to self-reflect,

make changes in your life. And yeah, that's my experience. It lasts a while, right? A few hours. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And I was doing San Pedro Cactus as well, which is Meskolin is the main ingredient there.

There was like 15, 17 hour grueling. You know, people say like, oh, you're just getting high or whatever. It's just like you face all your dark fears. It's terrifying. Often these ceremonies. And don't go into it lightly, I would say. you know yeah and the shamans know this and that they you're tore guy through this experience

quite frankly so they know what you're facing and it's it's harrowing you know but have your smoke straight up DMT um what's the buffo I have that's the like the uh 5MD what the hell is it 5 MEO DMT correct that I have that that that lasts like five to 10 minutes right that that last quickly, ayahuasca, psilocybin, those are multi-hour experiences. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and it's a similar thing. They all have the same mechanism or function of putting the ego to sleep and allowing you to see what clay vision. I wonder, is that you've done both?

Is it a similar sort of experience when you're on ayahuasca, just longer lasting? Yes, yes. It's a little more intense. DMT really blows the top off your ego. Oh, yeah. It really does blow the top off. I felt my soul leave my body. Bingo.

And it's tough to translate into this waking state that we appear to exist. And so people like, you know, what are those dudes talking about? But it's wild, as you know. And I did a ceremony in anticipation of coming here with the shamanista this weekend. And we could talk about that later if you want or whenever. It's the same mechanism. It's the same thing that it keeps happening. It's like, wow, you're tapping into another reality.

And I've done this, like, I'm a non-dualous, so I study like the Upanishads, the Astavakra Gita, Ramana Maharshi, Lao Tzu, Jesus, Buddha, like all these mystics that say the same strange and specific thing and radical thing about the nature of reality. So for months, I just keep rereading the Astavakra Gita, which is considered, it's an ancient Sanskrit text that's considered like the most mind-bending metaphysical text in history. And I kept rereading it, and I got thrust into that state of the one of timelessness. And I'm like, so it's not just like, all this substance is altering your brain chemistry.

There are ways through fasting and meditation and other modalities. As the mystics would say, it's like Sahaja, your natural state. The ego state, the external searcher, the disaffected hungry ghost is not your real state. So it's removing the blocks to your awareness is enlightenment.

It's not accessing or gaining something in the external world, right? So it's a different dynamic. I have to remove the false beliefs to rediscover what I already am, which is a blissful state. Yes. Which is tough for people to believe.

I get that because it's like, you live 10 minutes in this world. It doesn't appeal like that. You know what I mean? Right, right. Man, what a f*** gruesome injury. Your spinal fluid was coming out of your nose. Yeah.

Jesus. And then what are they, like when you first went in, like, I didn't know for years later. Was he in the hospital for a long time after that? No. It was like back in there, you rub some dirt on it. You know, the coaches, they didn't understand what happened. You were right back in the game. Right back in the game, right with the fucking swollen brain.

And I just bought a hyperbaric chamber, actually. I'm going to start doing it to, like, access some of the frozen brain, you know, because it can't swell. And to do how, what, what is the hyperbaric chamber going to do for your brain? It, like, frees up. it oxygenates the brain. And they say that when the injury occurs, like you almost get cognitively frozen at a particular time when it happens.

Excuse me, but, you know, the moral of the story is that it led me down this path. My movie character had to go down this path, you know. And I'm grateful for it as twisted and painful as it's been. And I have a lot of empathy for people with depression because I had this crippling, I couldn't move for weeks. It was like painted my world black and gray. It was like.

Yeah, no, it's brain injuries are known for being, they're known for being endocrine disruptors. So they can really affect your hormone regulation and like your testosterone levels. That's why a lot of, a lot of football players or fighters or boxers or whatever that have had those extreme head injuries, they have to do hormone therapy after that. Yeah.

Well, thanks for being open to that, you know, it's hopefully I know a lot of people who suffer somewhat things. That explains the depression too, like low hormone, low testosterone levels and stuff like that, that can affect your whole body, including your mood and your depressive states and all that. So how did you get into all the stuff you're doing now? You wrote two books about giants and like the stone,

like Stonehenge and and this ancient history. How did you get into this world? I'm a stone mason by trade. So my brother and I run a dry mason's business in Weston Mass. Are you a Freemason? No, no. Okay. Yeah, people ask that.

No, it's like I study Freemasonry and Rosicrucianism. Okay. I think they're interesting. I, you know, we build our projects, utilitarian projects. We quarried stone. We redo old walls. We've been at it for like 25, 30 years. And one of the things we're avid hikers, and so we're out in the woods, and we keep seeing these

constructions that were thought to be colonial that are more seemingly Native American, anthropomorphic forms, carnes, turtles, serpents. And I'm like, whoa, this seems to be like this subtle Native American landscape of stone hidden in New England. And I wasn't the first one to, I found out, I wasn't the first one to draw that conclusion. and other researchers have wrote about it. So what I did was because I'm kind of a rain man record keeper type of guy, I went to the UMass Library and started reading the town and county histories to see if there were any occurrences of colonists showing up and documenting pre-existing Native American walls in stone chambers and other structures.

And in fact, there are in the historical record. So the colonists found Native American stonework in New England. Like other, you know, it's not a great, you know, like incredible because there were stone forts in Tennessee in the Midwest. We know about all the kivas and stuff. But the thought, the archaeological idea is that Native Americans didn't build with stonework in England. So by virtue of reading through all these town and county histories, I started to find the most bizarre giant skeleton accounts. Often by anatomists, scientists at the time, Smithsonian Bureau agents, like buried, obscurely in these voluminous documents in a time of inefficient communication and i was told quickly

these were all hoaxes and like they have a they reference a lot of the same anatomic anomalies double rows of teeth massive jaw bones that fit over the face femurs that are 28 and 32 inches long which are clearly indicating eight nine foot tall individuals uh artifacts found within context in little known burial techniques described as well because one of the arguments that is like these are Massadon bones or animal bones, but no, these are burial mound finds that have contextual context that matches with a lot of Native American burials, but they're absolutely enormous, like the giants in the middle and there's other burials like spokes of a whale. So I'm like, this doesn't read as a hoax. This doesn't make any logical sense, right? So I went down

that road. I started to write, I hooked up with Hugh Newman and my co-author and buddy. And the gods lined up that I ended up with the show on history. A producer who's a friend of mine in Western Mass said, hey, my buddy told me to check out this presentation you gave or something, a book I wrote or whatever. No, no, I'm sorry, it was a presentation I gave. And he became more interested in the subject because, like, my brother and I, you know, blue-collar dudes,

I think people look at us and like, you know, I'm not blowing smoke up anybody's ass. I really don't have an agenda. I just find it fascinating, right? Right. And so it's like even the history channel execs that when we got the first show it, it's like, I've never seen two guys seemingly so credible talk about such outrageous things. You know, so I, you know, people who know us, you know, will form a decathletes and coaches and, you know, our lives revolve around usually like being nice to people and helping kids and like leading lives that aren't about bullshit in Gryfton, you know? Right, right.

That's cool. So we ended up getting, we made a sizzle reel, it went to the network conference, a bunch of networks say, yeah, we want this, you know, we want this show. History said, we'll run it straight to a series without a pilot. And we'll like, we'll do it, yeah, which was cool. So we did our first season of Search for Lost Giants. And I'll just, you know, give some background. Ever feel like your energy isn't what it used to be? struggling with brain fog, slower recovery, or just feeling worn down, even when you're doing

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Plus get 20% off with my code Danny at rownutrition.com slash discount slash Danny. Again, that's code D-A-N-N-N-Y for 20% off at R-H-O-Nutrition.com slash discount slash Danny. It's linked below. Now back to the show. There's this idea like the Smithsonian. They got, you know, giant skeletons in the basement and all that. And there's this massive archaeological cover-up.

And I'm a fraud. You know, I work with archaeologists and geologists and scientists. Have them on a show. I'm friends with many academics. And the idea that there's some global conspiracy to cover up evidence. is even if it was desired, it'd be impossible if you know what I'm saying, right? So we have this, this idea

that there's a massive conspiracy to cover this, you know, giant bones. Yes. And I would say, the only point I'm making is littered within the Smithsonian's own ethnology reports, their scientists have described the unearthing of massive bones over and over again.

And so it's embedded in their records. In an episode two of our show, I'll backtrack. And the Smithsonian claims that the largest skeleton that's ever been in their possession is a six-foot-three Sue Native American skeleton with acromegaly. That's like pituitary gigantism.

It's a disease condition. Right, right, right. So they're claiming that, right. We're in Staleville, Missouri in episode two, and we find the cave at Puckett's Cave where they found an eight and a half foot skeleton. And we go through, we know, we talk to everyone, and we find where it was unearthed.

And we go through the microfilm and we find an eight and a half foot skeleton laying on the doctor's office next to six foot and a half less eaten. We found a photograph of it. And then 15 days later, it's requested to be shipped to the Smithsonian. And I'm saying that the skeleton is there,

wired together by University of Missouri archaeologists and shipped to the Smithsonian. So like, how does that shrink? into something that's less than six foot three. And the Smithsonian's own records have a count after a count that we, Hugh and I read in our book of similar skeletons that are claimed by their scientists to be over seven foot, over eight foot. So I don't have a time machine.

You can only make educated guesses about the past. But to say that this is a ridiculous premise and I'm like, you know, some grifter or a weirdo or, you know, the way that the pseudo-skeptics, often look at the alternative community of researches is that it's like they're my ideological enemy like in politics. I'm not going to yield an inch to them. I'm not just going to dismiss what they have to say. I'm going to denigrate them. I'm going to call them racist. I'm going to do whatever I can to throw red meat to my base because I'm stimulated because I'm some heroic gatekeeper. And on this end, on the alternative end, I would say,

I could run with this narrative that, oh, I'm some maverick fighting the evils of archaeology, and I'm a great guy in like being this bullshit echo chamber of true believers as well. But that's not reality either. You know, like science is apolitical. Science is objective. I need to see and analyze a 10-foot skeleton to solve the case.

I can't just spin bullshit. Right. I mean, so the moral of the story is, you know, scientists are like cops they deal with the they should deal with a lot of shit they deal with crazy people right and they got to keep their cool to get the respect

they deserve you know what I'm saying like you go through all that hard work I got my PhD I am an expert in this field you know like Graham Hancock for instance yeah I may not agree with you but this is what I need to see for your theory to be accurate

I have to see a 12,000 year old date from some temple site in Egypt at the Assyrian on or whatever. I need to see this evidence. All the other stuff, all the claims of racism, that makes people almost believe in conspiracies. You know what I mean? Right.

That you objectively state what is needed. And then if you show me this, I'm all his, you know? Right. Yeah, what did you make of that podcast with him and Flint Dibble? I was pretty impressed with Flint at first. I thought that, I mean, Flint definitely did his homework and, and crossed his tease and dotted his eyes with a lot of stuff. But then in hindsight, it seems like he was pretty slick in some moments.

Yeah, I'll say this. When you put yourself out there, there's a lot of assholes out there. Yeah. And it's like, you know, the calling for his job or the personally attacking him, you know. And it's like, I understand. It happens on both sides. Like, handker, you know, cock gets called a racist, right? Right.

Dude's in a biracial marriage. Right. He's, all he's talking about is indigenous rights. Right. Right. He's like an empathic humanist. Yeah.

Flint knew exactly what he was. He, he tried to, he tried to skate through that very, very smoothly on the podcast, but he no doubtedly tried to connect him to Nazis. Yeah.

In that article. And it's a good point to make or to highlight is that, you know, the idea that, you know, you engage in these, alternative ideas and somehow it's laced with racism.

Excuse me. Now there's partial truth there. There are like white supremacists who believe like Nazi supermen built the mounds of America and stuff like that. And there was this mound builder myth that Native Americans weren't sophisticated enough to like build the geometric forms and everything they did. So there is, you know, legitimate beefs there. But, you know, they're saying that, oh, Hancock quoted Ignatius Donnellin his first book

and Donnelly said some racist shit, you know what I mean? Which he did. Did he really? Yeah, yeah, he had some. But all the scientists of the time, you wouldn't believe how freaking racist mainstream science was for the longest time, up into the 30s and the 40s. Right.

Just, you know, repulsive. I'd repeat them, but they're like beyond repulsive. But I don't take that and paint that, you know, modern-day scientists and academics with that brush. It's like they've clearly gone in another direction. So it sounds like a sound object. argument like, oh, these, they're all racist by Hancock looking for a law civilization and saying maybe before the Inca, there was another race or beings that showed up. And the claim is from

kind of the male-dominated white left-wing cult of academia, sorry, that sounds like, you know, harsh, but it's true that you're trying to take away the accomplishments of these people. Right. But the reality is the Inca, the Amira, they told the Spanish that, the gods and the varic coaches built these structures. There's clearly two forms of stonework in Peru. And it's not like, oh, you're stiff, you can't do this. It's like the native people are actually telling us there were two different eras, right? But then you go to Malta and the Maltese, what are they, like, Sicilian farmers who came over in 5,800 BC, but they have legends of giants and gods at Gigantia. The Greeks are the same way. These old megalithic walls are built

by the Cyclops. You go over to Ireland and the Twyalth of Day Danine, these mythical beings with high technology who came from lost continents or islands in the Atlantic are attributed with the making of New Grange. So I'm not getting in a fistfight with Sully at a bar in Southie because I said, no, the Irish ancestors didn't do it. But it's a charged racist thing with these other cultures that aren't white, right? Like, and I'll go, but so, so, so, There you go. That's the scope of it. And I'm saying like, I'm all so stupid. It's also dumb. I just had a genomics professor on here a couple days ago. And he was explaining how out of all like the plant, all the plants and other organisms that exist on this earth, we are the most homogenous one,

meaning that like out of all, he studied all the human genomes. And our genomes are so similar. It's insane. There's so few variants. from the blackest person in Africa to the whitest person in Finland. He said that all of the common ancestors of humans today came from like 10,000 humans. There was a bottleneck in humanity like tens of thousands of years ago. And he's saying that like we are so closely related. It's unbelievable. It's the binary system.

It's left and right. You know, we should have like a five-party system. You know? But it's like I'm in an echo chamber. the algorithms are weaponizing my preferences. So I go and I'm addicted to outrage. Everybody is, right? It's like instead of like, if you're a good person,

go work at the homeless shelter, don't pretend you're online being good. You're a freaking like a Coke addict looking for another hit. And that's fine. And I speak, you know, I was in that zone myself for a while and it made me want to take like 100 showers. And I don't want to belabor this racist thing. I just want to like put it out there because like honestly,

a lot of pseudo-sceptics feed information. to like the guardian and they do these hit pieces right without asking Hancock's opinion of the matter right right and that's not cool no it's like that's that's it's like i don't i also don't like what flint did when he was on my podcast where he said that people who purchased these on the antiquities markets are like doing a disservice to history or like they should belong in museums they shouldn't belong he said that people who purchased the these ancient egyptian artifacts on on the antiquities market are contributing to like a black market or like contributing to cartels and this kind of stuff. And I don't buy that. That seems like a cop out. That seems like,

I don't know what that is, but that doesn't seem, that doesn't seem like it's coming from a, from a, from a good place. One of my greatest teachers said, agenda makes you stupid. And I'm not saying I'm not dissing Flint Dibble. I'm sure he was a nice guy and we probably get a lot. No, he was. I liked him. Me and him got a long great. Yeah, I was going to say, we probably shoot the breath for like three hours and laugh our ass off. It's just, I understand where he's coming from. Like, there's a lot of assholes out there. There's a lot of pseudoscience out there. There's a lot of bullshit. There's no pair of view in the alternative realm, right? So there's a lot of bullshit artists and grifters. And there's a lot of well-intentioned people who get it wrong, too,

because it is not, their books, their presentations are not put up for pair of view. They don't get critically analyzed. I could sit here and tell you, and they get these like softball like interviews with true believers and podcasts so it's like if i could spin you one side of a story and make myself appear to be the big hair who has all the answers but if you objectively debate with someone so you know dibbles up against some real assholes who like denigrate him or they call for his job and that's why i've like oh man it's vicious it's vicious the people that are against him online it is like it is the most extreme cult i've ever seen And bingo.

And, you know, the left wing is its own virtue signaling, D-E-I, S-G cult. Of course. And like if I say, transgender, a man who transitions to a woman, like I said, a former coach, should not be allowed to participate in women's sports. That's, like, obvious. But I think, like, Congressman Seth Moulton just said that out of Massachusetts, and Tufts is going to stop doing business with them or something. Yeah, that's crazy. That shit is like, so. A few years ago, you'd get kicked off social media for doing that for dead naming somebody.

Exactly. And it's if Trump's victory is a repudiation of all that, you know, and I like to think of myself as moderate. And I really feel like people just got to understand the weapon, the algorithms are weaponizing the preferences and they're getting you addicted to outrage. Yeah. I mean, being a coach helped me like, I get conservative parents. I got liberal parents. They both want the best for the kids. It's like, I don't give you shit what you vote for. Right. Like, it's a different dynamic. But will you indulge me for a second? and to read a quote and hopefully put the racist thing to vet. Of course. This is what Vine Deloria said. He was a Lakota Sue Elder. Voted by Time Magazine is one of the greatest religious thinkers of the 20th century.

He's an author. He wrote red, earth, white lies. He was critical of kind of white mainstream archaeology and anthropology. And he actually organized a conference in 1999 in Washington State where he had all these elders share their. indigenous wisdom about giants, which is very interesting as well. So people say, oh, this is a fairy tale, you know, giants or whatever. It's like, how can virtually every culture on earth and almost every Native America tribe

had these traditions of giants? And that's something to be touched. When was he from again? What time? What time period? Oh, 80s. I think he passed away in 2000. Recent.

Oh, yeah. Vine Deloria. The Indian explanation is always cast aside, let me see, as a super. Precution precluding Indians from having acceptable status as human beings and reducing them in the eyes of the educated people to a pre-human level of ignorance The stereotypical image of American Indians as childlike superstitious creatures permeates American society because Americans have been taught that scientists are always right That they have no personal biases and that they do not lie Which is and a lot of indigenous scholars think the same way. It's like you're dictating to us what we should

should believe because these ideas that the natives have are about floods they're about giants they're about lost civilizations and they are they are a part of the belief system of the ideological enemy of science which is religion and mythology right so it's like i'm not going to yield an inch so i'm going to make claims of racism where i kind of subtly and raciously do not listen to the traditions of indigenous people so i just throw that out there it's like Like, time to pull that, you know, if I got like a S-S tattoo on my neck and I'm saying Nazi Superman to build this and that, you know, you could shit on me. But I'd like to put that to rest because I love working with professionals. I've organized archaeological digs.

I sit and I talk to like anthropologists for hours on end. I've presented at university campuses and the kids, you know, and I'm like a goodwill ambassador from lunatic fringe. You know, I talk about fish gods and Atlantis. And I find these subjects interesting, you know? And I just like, I want a, like in science you have, I'm sorry, in medicine, allopathic medicine, alternative medicine, now you have complementary medicine. And I would like to see the same in archaeology and anthropology, hopefully. Right.

The first time I learned about you was from a gentleman by the name of Praveen Mohan. Oh, yeah. He was in here. And he was pointing out some of the newspaper articles from like the New York Times. from I have, I want to say it was like the 40s and 50s, maybe. And they were showing actual excavations of these giant skeletons that were found in these mounds and like South America and somewhere even in. I think one was in Texas maybe.

And he was pointing out that like you were the like foremost guy around here that's researching this kind of stuff. This episode of the podcast is brought to you by True Work, a clothing company hell bent on bringing you the most technical, high-performance workwear on the face of the earth. The true work story begins in the Colorado Mountains where a trade worker knew there had to be a better solution than the wet, heavy gear that was weighing him down. And true work was born. I love my true work pants because they're a durable work pant that is so comfortable and stretchy that you can go golfing in them as well. Every true work product is engineered for

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15% off your first order at TrueWork.com slash Danny. That's 15% off at T-R-U-E-W-E-R-K dot com slash Danny. It's linked below. Now back to the show. Yeah, first of all I like him. He's a really solid dude. And he's into the traditions like in India. Well, same thing. I've all the Vedas, the Ashtavakr Gita, Rebu Gita, all the metaphysical and historical texts of the Hindus in its wild. Yeah. So, you know, what I found is like in 1939

at the Moorhis mound in Texas, they found a massive skull. And there's a picture of it. And William Duffin was the archaeologist, who was like a WPA works project in 39. And I went to talk to him, and he passed away at like 106 a couple of years ago. Yeah, right? But anyways, the skull rests at the Texas Archaeological Research Lab, and it's enormous.

And then in 1933, George Fisher, head geologist of Pennsylvania, on Earth's a 7-5 skeleton. Donald Cadzo joins him on the dig. He is Oxford trained archaeologist. He writes this article about finding a 7-5 skeleton. And then about three months later, he's cruising in a van with the 7-4-5-inch skeleton, and talking about it, going to Harrisburg, because the Smithsonian requested that it goes there, right? So that's where I go with this.

It's not just like this drunk farmer from 1720. It is like respected professionals, including in the 50s and 60s, Don Dragoo, head of the anthropology department at the Carnegie at the Cresat Mount in West Virginia. They were destroying it for an oil and gas project. So we excavated and he found a 7 foot two skeleton with massive bone structure,

huge jaw, they call it the adena jaw, and web and snow at the Dover Mound in Kentucky, funded by the University of Kentucky on earth another seven foot skeleton with massive bone structure. The adena people elongated their skulls. There's all this mystery here, right? So you might say, ah, seven foot, seven foot two, shacks that big or whatever. But there are so many of these accounts with massive bone structure, with jaw bones that fit over the face, of a much higher percentage. than today's population

if you read through all the ancient documents. So I mean, I'm sorry. So there was a lot more shacks walking around. There's a lot more shacks, but through like NFL linebackers, they weren't like skinny dudes either. And every explorer you can name

and counted giant native chiefs, Tuscaloosan, Alabama, DeSoto, you know, him and his father. And the archaeological narrative is, you know, the Indians are like five foot seven, five foot eight, and the Spanish, the English, they were 5253, which is true. The general population was, but their leaders, the tall ones, the chiefs, they were on their knees.

They towered over all our tallest men. You know, you read the accounts and these explorers who were training the out of observation, and they are talking about absolutely enormous tribal chiefs all the way down to Patagonia. Magellan, Drake, DeSoto, they all encountered and recorded this happening. So it's just another, you know, just like polydactylism, extra fingers and extra toes. It's another aspect of the mystery that's ubiquitous. It's found around the world by cultures who had little and no contact. And that's what catches my attention.

What is the, what's the biggest skeleton excavation that you've seen, a human skeleton, that you've actually, like, looked at? Oh, good question. Well, seven foot six at the Muddum Museum in Philadelphia. And where did that one come from? It came from Kentucky, but part of getting it is that they sent it to the muddum museum with the understanding that they couldn't say where it came from. So I know it's very strange, but there's a 7-foot-6 skeleton that's believed possibly to be one of these mound builder giants.

But I will say we have that photograph of like an 8-and-a-half-foot skeleton that was found and shipped to the Smithsonian in 1933 that we found during our show in the microfilm. And we got it in a book. So it's this picture of Les Eaton, who's over six foot tall, next to an eight and a half foot tall skeleton. So to the argument I made, the Smithsonian is claiming that the largest skeleton they ever received was six for three.

And I'm not saying, you know, modern day scientists, they probably don't even know these stories. But at the time, there was a particularly zealous, racist, pre-Nazi eugenist named Dr. Herlichke that ran the anthropology department with an eye and fist. Wow. Oh, yeah, yeah. How do you spell his name?

Herlitschka. Herlitschka? H-R-D-L-I-C-K, Dr. Hurd-L-L-C-K. So you can find something about this, dude. He sounds wild. He was a Czech anthropologist. He was, a lot of the early scientists, there he is right there. Actually, we're into this idea of giants.

They were open to it. Their scientists wrote about, you know, a 36-inch circumference skull formed by Thomas M. Perrin in Illinois, like massive bones in their ethnology reports. But he was the guy in 1933 who wrote and talked about Giants to No More. This is wishful thinking. This is delusions of amateurs and things like that,

ignoring the fact that his own scientists had uncovered and reported these things. So it's a really interesting dynamic. And I'm going to say something that's repulsive, but he also said some, and believed some of them more, racist things you can imagine he wrote and edited the Journal of American Anthropology in 1933 we write about it in our book he said the greatest threat to the American

population is blending the inferior blood of the one-tenth of the Negro population into the superior white blood of the rest of the you know of the white race and he had all kinds of like like that and that's what scientists believed back then and this is you know you have Native American civilizations with these giant chiefs the tall ones with these legendary legends of cannibalistic warlike giants that are clearly in their traditions, you have magnificent geometric forms that predict eclipses, you have this vast and incredible Native American civilization, but they would denigrate it and they were marginalized as a ploy to steal their land.

And the scientists of the time went along with that, too. It's like, we're not going to embrace any of this mythological childlike ideas of the Native Americans we're going to marginalize them and and that's what happened so scientists today do not operate like that but you got to be honest about the shit that happened when in this crucible when modern theories were reformed and one of the missteps of science is that they pushed away oral traditions in native indigenous wisdom so we don't listen to the anchor when they tell us something that lines up with a mythological idea we don't listen to the natives that have been there for tens of thousands of years when they tell us that giants were historical reality,

that doesn't mean they were, but to dismiss them out of hand in portray indigenous people as superstitious and childlike, you can feel that too. When you're told about a native tradition, you know, you get this vibe like, I have respect for their culture, but I don't believe the shit. You know what I mean? That's kind of like what we're taught by science. So sorry, that's a long-winded way of saying, be open to indigenous traditional narratives. It's funny. There's a weird sort of legend around this area of Florida. We're on what's called Indian Rocks Beach right now. The beach that's literally a quarter mile that way is called Indian Rocks Beach. And it's called Indian Rocks Beach because allegedly there's all these Indian burial mounds that are around this area. And there's for some reason over the last couple hundred years out of the hundreds and hundreds and thousands and thousands of hurricanes that have come up through the yucatan and gone up the gulf of mexico there's only been maybe two that i've hit anywhere close to us and they've gone probably at least a hundred

miles north or south there's never been a direct hit within like 50 miles of this beach in like a thousand years and the legend is because there's these indian burial grounds protecting indian Rock's Beach. And just last year, not even, not even a year ago, maybe six months ago, there was a report that was in the news where this lady was like redoing her, like building a house and they like knocked down this huge Indian burial mound and excavated all these bones. And in the last freaking three months, there's been like three hurricanes that have hit us direct. And there's one coming right for us right now too. That's supposed to hit next week. Oh, I didn't know that. That blows. Jesus Christ. We've been.

It's been like the worst, this has been the worst three months of hurricanes that we've ever had in this part of Florida. We wrote about the, it's called the Soars of Thunder effects. Anthony Robbins was a mystic in an author who wrote about giants and- Tony Robbins? No, no, no. Anthony Roberts. Oh, Robert. Yes.

Okay. You know, Tony Robbins has gigantism too. Yeah. It's like, he's got the pituitary thing. Yes. where he's like got the he had like a I think it was a maybe a benign form of but he's got like the gigantism traits or whatever and he had that when he was young where he got like really big he's got the big jaw and the brow and he's like he's super tall yeah yeah it could be like

acromegaly or something like that so he wrote this uh anthony roberts i believe robins oh anyways uh wrote about the soars of thunder effect when they opened the burial mounds around the British Isles, you would get like these incredible storms come up. And his thought is like these ancient geomancers, they built along lay lines. They used their divination skills to build and enchant the landscape. That's a John Michelle thing, who was a mentor to Hugh Newman. He wrote about how you use certain stones, certain geometry, water, and energy lines to transform and enchant the landscape to bring peace and prosperity to the population. It's like this

ancient druidic thought system, which is interesting. But every time you would open these burial mounds of the ancients, you would get wild storms and they're all documented and we get pictures of them like old woodcuts of the explorers would go on the weekends and look for pots and they're digging. And then the second frame is this wild storm comes up. And the same thing is it's like, you know, natives were into weather shamanism and the mystical world, and that's another thing that's dismissed, you know, this idea that there's another reality that we had to face with. And I've spent a lot of time with indigenous wisdom keepers, with shamans, with tradition holders.

And they tell me very specific and very strange stories about the nature of reality, about the invisible realms and stuff like that. And it's my personal experience, but I gotta say that that is exactly what they're saying. So you could dismiss them if you want, or you could say maybe there was something to the story, you know, just like your burial mound story. It's like at least be open to it, I would say. Like what's your intuition? What's your experience tell you?

Right. Like who is that freaking gatekeeper in your mind? Who is the tyrant that is like smuggly knows better? The ego, right? Insidious, tyrannical. It feeds you self-loathing and doubt and conflict and judgment instead of forgiveness and empathy, you know? Right. Like the subtle voice beneath the surface is your real state, your natural state.

And the over-identification with the movie character, like this is the only existence I have. I got to freaking fight and scratch and I got to get things externally that clouds your judgment that covers you and the worst impulses. And the ego is the conspiracy. You know, there are conspiracies in the world. but the ego is like a bad software program that makes you believe that your only experience is this right here. And that somehow it's like, you know,

once they throw you in the ground, you're done. Instead of your, the screen of existence, the ocean of existence and not the wave, your real estate is eternal, unchanging, blissful. And God's at home and where the idiots who decided to take a walk. The allegory of the prodigal son. That's what the mystics tell us.

Right. I think technology has been one of the big reasons that we've sort of lost this connection, this sort of spiritual connection that like we had, you know, like the Native Americans would have back in the day or like the experience that you get when you're on drugs or on psychedelics like DMT or Iowaska or whatever. Because there's people that talk about how like when they first go to the Amazon or whatever and they walk out into the jungle barefooted, like all of a sudden all these deep senses sort of arise like deep from deep within them that have been buried because of the. this technological advanced society we live in in North America where we're surrounded by screens. You can call a car to pick you up on. There's an app on your phone to deliver food to your house. Like, like, it's insane how much like electronic shit and technology and and just the evolution of technology that we've surrounded ourselves with, I think is

sort of destroying that connection to whatever sort of, whatever sort of, whatever sort of, ethereal layer of consciousness that exists out there that some of the ancients would talk about. Bingo, you nailed it. Even Rudolph Steiner, the mystic, called it Aramon. He called it this dark, cold technological force that would overtake humanity, but it would be chosen by humanity. And I studied with John Gardner. He was super old when I studied with him, like in the 80s. And he actually knew Steiner.

Steiner was like a mystic, like Edgar Casey. and he talked about this coal technology would be accepted and wanted. So at the time, we're like, what is this technology that's coming around? My friends who studied Steiner, and we joke, it's like, oh, you're putting on the helmet, or they're going to have a TV that you have to leave on 24 hours a day in your house. We didn't know it would be the iPhone. It would be this insidious, dark, cold technology that brought about the worst impulses in humans. Yeah.

It agitates you, it gets you addicted to outrage. and just be honest, you know what I mean? We've all been, you know... Our dopamine slot machines. Bingo, right? And I don't want to talk up my game, but, you know, part of my spiritual journey and my plant medicine ceremony is to look at all my embarrassing behavior,

all my shortcomings, all my judgments, all my desperation around, you know, as my soulmate, you know, this heartache that we often feel. So I sat and I burned out that for years. I've sat in silence for a long, you know, going Aaron Rudge, or whatever. I live in a 10 foot by 12 foot cabin, 10 foot by 12 foot. I have virtually no possessions. I drive in a beat up old truck. I've been single for years. And I've come to a place of

never being lonely, completely thrilled to be at peace in a meditative state or to hang out with friends and stuff. And my life is oriented around like serving anybody I can, not like because I'm a fake good guy because I feel like the world blows me to tears. You know what I mean? I dig ancient mysteries. I like metaphysics. You know, I'm mixing a little Celtics or whatever. But like the world of distraction and conflict blows his shit out of me.

Right. And when you like reside and surrender into your real state, it's so enthralling, you're like, I can't believe I am that. You know what I mean? Right. So it's magnetizing us all,

but we're swimming against the fucking river. We really are. We really are, right? Strong river. And it's like, and Niagara Falls is not far. Bingo. And the moral of the stories,

you already are perfect. you're like and we think of that in the context of a weird movie character who's temporary. I'm talking about your real state behind the scenes and you can experience it in your temporary movie character. Excuse me, but it's like surrendering into that state versus swinging against the river because we falsely believe this is all we are. So you got right. I need some more money or I need a new girlfriend or I need, you know what I'm saying?

Right. Because I feel like shit about myself because I falsely believe. what I am not and especially a character that the time is you know you're on the clock in a body you know what I mean I got to get and now I just sit in silence I don't freaking want anything and I'm not saying that makes me right but I like to think it positions me well to objectively take on these controversial mysteries do shows do all this other stuff I do because I could feel like the overstimulation happen you know you film in the scenes of people watching you, like the camera's always falling around. You know, and my brother and I are pretty grounded and level-headed, but I could feel that like the cokehead part of me getting wound up, you know, it's like, oh, some Milf sending me a message, you know what I mean? It's just like, sorry, but it can be overstimulating.

And I'm like, fuck that, you know, it's not like, it's not that I'm so good, it's that it reads disingenuous and it makes me feel like shit. Yes. And I'll tell a story here, if you'll indulge me for a sec. I did a ceremony when I came with the shamanista and I asked

which guide me because I'm going to talk to this dude that I have these comic entanglements with and has this you know the you see Main Street media is fucking dying right I mean

like CNN's letting everybody off and we learned that better than ever in this last election exactly so these formats are the new news they're like

just growing in popularity, which is great. And I applaud you on creating this way to communicate. But I'm in a ceremony. Like I asked the spirits, you know, guide me and show me. And what I got was this, like, I was thrust into the field of the one that Rumi talks about. Beyond concepts of good and bad, there was a field I will meet you there. You know, that like, thank God, I don't have to do anything to become what I already am. Right. Just like that, that, that. breath of fresh air and Rumi was enlightened, Hafiz was enlightened, Ramana Maharshi, Jesus, Buddha, they have liberated themselves and wrote about what it's like to be in the state of the one. So I'm in the realm of the one and I'm giving a life review and I see my entire, the scope of my life.

And it's like every time I was arrogant, judgmental, critical, argumentative, it wasn't even like it was a real thing. it was just false and untrue. It was just like this lame energy that went nowhere. Right. And every time I was empathic and compassionate and helpful, I could just see this incredible, like, this is what you really are. This is the energy that's waking you up.

And this is how you should behave, not out of good or bad. It's because it's your real state. You know how like judgment feels like shit? Yeah. And holding the door and smiling for somebody just feels good, right? Absolutely. So it's not some new age.

It's like a reality. This is what you are. And it revealed it to me. And then you showed up. And I could see that we had different lifetimes together. I know that's a strange concept, but most of the world believes in reincarnation. All the masters teach it. And you are like an alchemist, like you and Rogan, that sets the stage for events like this can happen.

Like your objective, you're open-minded, yourself, reflective. and you don't take yourself too seriously. You're just like, let's create this platform. It's like Plato's Academy. Honestly, that's what Plato did. He would just open up the realm of ideas. So I applaud you for that, but it was wild. It was fucking wild.

And I know it's just like, I can't like, I don't know if a bunch of iron workers are going to know what I'm talking about. It's my experience. It just is what it is. You know what I mean? And I thought it was just a real cool happening, you know? Yeah, man, that is super cool. That is very cool.

So you, from when I talked to Hugh, he was telling, he was kind of explaining to me that you are, are really big into the investigation of the background of the Atlanta story as well. And from what I understand, Ignatius Donnelly was one of the first people to actually write a book about Atlantis. Right. I forget the name of his, his book. But I had Flint come on to talk about Atlantis. And all the shit that Flint talked about me and me and him disagreed on a lot of stuff. We disagreed on the vases, the Egypt stuff. But one of the things that I think that made a lot of sense that Flint said that I just can't get out of my mind is his, the way he explained Atlantis and the backstory of Atlantis. It's hard to find a housekeeper you can trust to take care of every nook and cranny of your house, especially when you're not home.

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You can schedule as early as this week. It's all backed by a guarantee. And their forever clean membership saves you $30 an hour on all future bookings. Take home cleaning off your plate this spring by using bubbly cleaning. Head to bubblycleaning.com slash Danny Jones to get your first three hours of cleaning for only $19. Again, that's bubblycleaning.com slash Danny Jones to get your first three hours for only $19. It's linked below. Now back to the show. And Flint just happens to be, for what it's worth, his area of study, geographic location, Greece, and the time 12,000 to 15,000 years ago in that area of Athens, it lines up perfectly with the story of Atlantis and the people who are writing about Atlantis and Plato and all that stuff. So the way he explained it to me, and I also had another friend of mine who is a classical philologist who has dedicated the last 30 years of his life to reading the ancient Greek literature.

He read just endless amounts of philosophy, history, comedy, and pharmaceutical texts and medical texts in antiquity. and his ideas on Atlantis as well as Flint's ideas on Atlantis seemed to line up. Particularly specifically in the fact that Plato seemed to be a philosopher who was known for coming up with hypothetical philosophical hypothetical ideas on like how to build the ideal SimCe. city or coming up with war games, which was the idea of the Tamias and Criteus, where they were coming up with a war game between Athens and this hypothetical, um, advanced city of his of Atlantis. And what would happen in that hypothetical war is similar to his hypothetical idea of Plato's cave, right? Like we don't, one of the main points that Flint brought up is Plato's cave, the allegory of the cave was a, uh, a philadelphia. philosophical idea and an analogy he was trying to explain for humans to understand. And that's the reason that we're not looking for Plato's cave. Another thing is the, you know, Plato was also really big.

Like he wanted to censor Homer. He didn't want, he didn't want the kids that were growing up being educated to know anything about Homer because he thought that was not good for society. He wanted to come up with this noble lie for society to basically create this sort of Santa Claus for people to, so people could behave well and act right, not commit crimes. Like he wanted this ideal, this ideal society. And he wanted to create this sort of like a noble lie where he thought, I mean, to his credit, he thought that like, you know, the philosopher king should run society. Below them should be the knights and all this stuff. So, you know, he was known for coming up with these crazy hypothetical abstract ideas and these thought experiments, right? And he wasn't known for being a historian.

So and then, so if you combine that with what we know of Plato with the historical timeline of what we know about Atlantis, which is an oral tradition, the, the first. first time it was ever talked about was like a thousand years before Solon, right? And then it was an oral tradition for like a thousand years. And then I might be fucking this up. I'm going to do my best. But then Solon told Pliny the elder about it. And then there was like another couple hundred years and then Pliny the elder told his grandson Pliny the younger who was 10 years old and then there was like another hundred years and then there was like an Egyptian priest who read some sort of texts maybe this was before all of it the the temple priests of sayus yeah the temple priest right transmitted the story to so on to solon to solon right right but then there

was never any actual evidence of that text. He wasn't actually consulting the text when he told Solon, right? So this was prior to all these transmissions going down this chain over thousands of years. And then 50 years after Pliny the elder's grandson Pliny the younger told Socrates, then another 50 years goes by and then Plato writes about it. No, those are all good points. Flint is right. right that Athens, 9,000 BC was bedrock. There's no evidence that it was advanced culture. Right.

So it's like that feeds into like, is this a noble lionaut? You know, is this an allegory? Right. And he did like, he did operate like that. And, you know, these ideas that, excuse me, just because Plato said it doesn't make it factual, it could be like, this might be, worthy and further investigation. That's what I would say. The idea intrigues me, let's see.

I would say that there are other sources that talk about, you know, like the Twatha Day Danin show up from four island continents, I mean islands, four Atlantic islands, and they show up in ancient Ireland and these supernatural beings. And you have these stories of lost worlds and gods and the Aduad and the Aenead and Egypt. And at the temple of Edfu, you have the building text, right? I saw you talking about the building text, right? So I reached out to Mano Saves Sadaay, who was translating them from German to English. Now, Dieter Kerrath is a doctor who since 1986 has been translating the building text of Ed Fu into German, right? And, you know, the old French translations leave a lot to be desired. So Manu is friends with Dr. Dieterkerth

and interfaces with them, has him over for dinner, and he's taken these incredible texts, and he's translating him now into English. So I just spoke at the KCE conference with Manu, and I'm friends with him. And I asked him about this dynamic of like, is this Hancock's version of the Ed Food text, kind of a patchwork of wishful thinking?

And he said, no, he got it right, stunningly, because they're very difficult to translate. Ptolemaic hieroglyphs are very, very difficult in context, is very difficult to understand. But he said, you can believe it or not, but these writings about the primeval land and the land of the gods in the first time, they are claiming that there was this lost island of the gods

that was destroyed in the flood. In the Edfu text. And when were the Edvoo text? Edfu texts written. It was a Ptolemaic temple. So 200 BC, I hope I got that date right. So after Plato wrote about it. But no, no, the three.

traditions go way way back they're the oral traditions carried and written down and like the pyramid text of Eunice are super ancient but they're even from more ancient traditions and i will say homer talked about aegidia that's his atlantis a gigia ohigia oh gigia in the middle of the atlantic yes aggidgia the aggigian flood plato talked about in laws book three and he says it was 10,000 years before the invention of writing and music so the data is like 10,600 bc that Plato points to for the time of the Eygian flood. And Plutarch, and there's another geographer who's escaping my attention now, said that Igidia lay five days west of England in the middle of the Atlantic.

That they pinpointed this, this, a Gidgian paradise in the middle of the Atlantic. Oh, there we go. Ogigian flood is a flood in ancient Greek mythology that occurred during the region of O'Gigius, a mythical king of Attica and Boeotia? Boatia. Boatia. Fact-checked in real time. Yeah, look at that.

Community notes. Interesting. It says survivors moved to Egypt, which was called O'Gigia. Can you scroll down a little bit more so we can see like a timeline maybe or like dates? Ogidious. What happened to Ogidia? Click on the Wikipedia. Plato gives it a date of like 10,600 BC.

I believe. In laws three. It's for Homer, it's this mythola or this, this age of the gods, this ancient time. One thing I find interesting is like we have a coal case, right? Science, anthropology, archaeology, there are different kind of science. It's not like biomedicine or physics or math. We can keep repeating the same. Exactly.

Right? Yes. So it's a more ephemeral, difficult science. And that's not to disparage professionals because it's really high. hard. So you get to find a new site. You got a carbon test. You get to have things in context. There's a lot to it. Yes. Excuse me. So I, being the weirdo that I am, and I'm willing to go anywhere for a good story. And I bring in the clairvoyance, the psychics, Edgar Casey, Rudolph Steiner, Madam Blavatsky, the Rosicrucians, the Freemasons. And what's stunning is

every one of those groups or mystics said that Atlantis was a historical reality. There was a cataclysm that destroyed it. Humans were originally androgynous, a byproduct of genetic engineering. What does that word mean? Androgynous. Sexless beings, you know, kind of like my love life. It's like it's either possessing two sets of sexual organs or none. You know, it's really, it's weird.

even uh plato says you know aristophanes displays the myth of the ancient androgen and Zeus cuts us down the middle we were first androgynous Plato talks about it Plato talks about Atlantis as a historical reality Plato talks about the immortality of the soul so all these skeptic I'm skeptics uh psychics are claiming the same strange and specific thing you could say maybe they just took information from each other but it's like the rosicrucians and freemids. They're kind of like tight to the vest with their info, you know? You read through their documents, you talk to people who are Rosa Crucians and Freemasons, and they're like, they believe all their esoteric wisdom flows back through Egypt to Atlantis. So that's just interesting.

So I'm open to these ideas to get back to Agigia. Madam Bolvatsky said that Homer was correct. He was the first one. The barred of Ulysses understood that Aguigia was Atlantis, you know? You know, so there's other, you could say, I don't believe in Atlantis. The Aztecs call it As to Land. You know, all these indigenous people have beliefs about a lost continent, Lamaria in the Pacific, Atlantis.

I could get into play tectonics and that it might be somewhat of a flawed theory, but I don't want to because it's a long. I'm just saying, be open to the idea. Right. And as a professional, it's like, you know, this is what I need. You know, we got to go over the mid-Atlantic range. We got to find this and this is the evidence I need. And, you know, I'll reference, you know, I'm not here fighting a proxy war for Graham Hancock.

I like Graham a lot. Yeah. And he's the one who got me into like Ayahuasca, so I'm indebted to him. And he's just pushing boundaries. He's a maverick. And he's looking for, you know, Atlantis and this lost race. And that's cool. Because a lot of the mystics of old, like Plato, you ever wonder why his work is like almost so flawless?

Albert North Whitehead says, Western thought is a series of footnotes to Plato. You know, Plato was a genius, Pythagoras. Yeah, and Aristotle. Aristotle, the scientists of old were a blend of spiritual, how do I say it, they were spiritual scientists. Yeah. They engaged.

They were all doing drugs, man. They were all doing, like, ethnogens. They were engaging in rituals. Mm-hmm. They were liberating themselves from the false self, from the judgments and the ego self. So thus they were well prepared and objective to take on both sides of the street,

the invisible realms and the visible realms. And, you know, so it's like they did that. So the scientist of today would be, it would be helpful. Like I say, skeptics are more afraid of ayahuasca than the are Atlantis. You know, I'm being a wise guy. And I don't even want to diss anyone.

I'm just saying like, you know, you might want to mix in a little plant medicine ceremony or some metaphysical, usually like when you have trauma or somebody your love dies or some crazy things, you get a portal into the other realm, you know? So some people get it that way. It's like it shouldn't have to happen that way to see through the veil of this matrix, you know?

So once again, I would like a blending of spirituality and science. That would be cool in my estimation, and we'll see where it goes. I think the Trump election, and I'm a moderate, it's a repudiation of some of these ideas of uh grievance archaeology of of dictating through a virtue signaling cult like lens of what the past is like and how people should behave it's like all my lefty friends are like they feel like they get a walk on eggshells all the time oh do i get my

pronouns right do i get the right flag in my you know profile and all that shit it's like people want to be left the fuck alone you know what i mean like native americans voted in the largest democratic way for Trump. Yeah. Right? It's like, I'm a cracker. I'm, you know, I'm wighty telling you and dictating what racism looks like and how to protect you.

Right. It's like, I don't, some of the most pragmatic people I know are native people, you know. Yes. Yes. You know, some of that, I feel like some of that really only exists on social media, on places like Twitter and a little bit of YouTube and stuff like that. You know, my friend Julian Dory has this great theory. he's a born and raised in New Jersey kid.

And he's got this theory he calls the Wawa theory. He's like, if you go online and you look at someone like the far right or far, far left most bloodthirsty corners of the internet and see how riled up everyone is, he goes, if you want to real litmus test of reality, go to a Wawa. He's like, if I go to, if I see if I go to a Wawa, he goes, I see the guy with the, I see the girl with the green hair holding the door for the old guy with the Vietnam hat. Reality is that. It's not really what you see on social media. And it's almost like the people who spend the most time on social. If you spend too much time on these fucking screens, that sort of becomes your reality. Bingo.

Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's remarkable. People don't interact like that in real life. No, no. When you go to Wawa, you don't act like that to people. No, no. It's funny because, you know, I'm whatever. Like I said, I'm the try to be the goodwill ambassador for lunatic.

fringe, but it's like, here's the giant dude. You know, this cat's out of his fucking mind, you know? But it's like, I'm working with profession. I've never got diss to my face, you know what I mean? It's like, uh, and I like a good debate. I don't want softballs. I'm going to figure out the truth for real. I absolutely feel that in it's a manufacturer.

You know, you can get into like the CIA and, you know, go listen to Bobby Kennedy Jr. And, you know, they iced his father. They iced John. And my house was like a shrine to the Kennedys when we grew up, right? My parents grew up in East Boston. My mother was Irish Catholic. MLK, John and Bobby Kennedy all over the freaking house. And it was like the promise was that the Democrats were going to deliver a world without war, a world of sanity, a world of respect for everyone.

Right. And then the left started falsely believing that's coming back if we get the right candidate. If we get back in power and it never fucking happened. Biden passes a lot just defense bill in human history. the left loves World War III now. We're fighting this fucked up proxy war in Ukraine. And it is like we're putting trillions of dollars in the U.S. and because it's the reserve currency,

that's what's causing inflation, not supply chain bottlenecks. And he's just like, you know, they had England and the United States pulled Ukraine away from the peace, negotiating. Yes, 100%. Right? Yep. And then the Guardian before it was a left-wing Iraq,

was writing about that and cozying up to neo-Nazis and what you know the u.s is hanker for world war three and now it's just like oh the freedom fighters are taking on you know because uh Putin has some conservative views about like LGBT you know people and stuff like that and so he's become this demon you know and i've never heard him he says like I'm all for people believe in what they want and doing what they want you know I'm not going to get into that debate the moral of the story is like you have this insidious control system that divides people. That's why they're easy to control. Like you said, you hold the door for someone,

you give you shit about someone. And I felt it myself with the whole COVID thing. I got vaxed. I got boosted because I thought I was being a good citizen. And then I'm taking a step back and I'm looking how people are treated like Aaron Rogers. Yeah. Is it Yolkovic?

Who is the tennis player or Nadal or whatever? Oh, I don't remember the tennis guy. And they're totally getting demonized, right? Like they're complicit and. mass murder and I'm like, so anyways, it happens on the right too. I don't want to get long to wait. I don't want to get too long-winded, but I just want to say that you're absolutely right. Get the fuck off unless you listen to your podcast.

Get off the internet. Right. Get off. If you stop feeling like shit and you're addicted to outrage, it's a red flag, you know? Right. Well, I think the podcast shit is a good antidote to the internet extreme shit because you can just put your headphones in and listen to something uninterrupted for three hours. That's what I thought was so cool about that.

Trump podcast because this is a guy who has this he is probably the most absolutely the most famous human being on earth and he's been hyper famous for decades right and he's got this incredible brand this real estate this real estate and entertainment sort of brand right larger than my personality but he exists in these overly produced television shows commercials uh and If you look at the news, like it's all kind of opinion, commentary, short clips and, you know, summaries of shit. But there's, what has not existed until now is a long form, three-hour, uncut stream of consciousness from that guy. And I thought that was like the most profound thing that happened with that podcast.

It is like you actually have to see right through this guy and see what he's really about. Is he full of shit? Is he just a pull-string puppet who just repeats the same shit over and over again? Or can he hold a real conversation? Does he actually have real beliefs? What is he, how does he think? One thing is that the Maverick thinkers

in the Democratic Party have been pushed out. RFK Jr., Tulsi Gabbard. They're not sociopaths, you know, their marketing conspiracy, you know, the trafficking conspiracy and all the shit. Right, right. Like I was, my left friends, I was like, I like RFK Jr., man.

He talks about... I love that guy. This is how the CIA was formed. This is how they operate. And like, I don't want to end up dead in a dumpster. But, you know, this cat is right on. And he's the first president talking about this crazy epidemic of cancer and autism and diabetes and obesity in the country. Like, that is the number one problem.

That's like the biggest killer out of anything. And he's the first president to actually talk about that shit in his campaign. That's insane. And Elon Musk comes out of the gate. It's like the Walmas were coming after you, you know. Yeah. And he's saying like, you know, Pfizer, Big Pharma, Bobby Kennedy Jr. saying, keep your receipts, you know, like that's not fascist.

But, but, you know, Trump, like all of us, he's flawed. He's, I admire, like, I'm like a recovering Catholic, you know, so I got all these fucked up hangups, you know. And it's like, I can only imagine being so embarrassed in the public eye, you know, all the trials and all the, like, God, you know, having your, your. past indiscretions brought up and stuff like that. The point is that he's not pure evil and he's not sent by God to save the world either. You know, be objective about it. And like 97% of DC voted for Harris, right? Is that a lead us out of touch or what? You know what I'm saying? Like, and that doesn't, you know, I don't want to dismiss her, but they were just looking, you know, the neocons got completely behind her. Dick Cheney, you're like the war machine.

universally voted for a kid you know she's out you know I'm not gonna do well whatever she's she's not like savvy she doesn't understand economic policy she's kind of a figurehead so they this insidious plan can keep unrolling we sell weapons around the world you know we're um leading to a path of destruction so trump's a hand grenade we'll see what happens but i would just say you know being in the middle and more objective is a much saner place to be yeah because it's honest it's like i got my issues I'm riddled with flaws. If I spend all my time deemnizing someone, that's a fucking red flag.

Yeah. No, I mean, at the very least, like if you want to call these guys, these people, like, if you want to call Trump like a sociopath or a liar, like I'm sure he's lied before. I'm sure he's got some narcissistic, possibly even, I don't know if he's a,

I wouldn't go to as far as to call him a sociopath, but I mean, absolutely you have to be a narcissist to some degree to be the president of the United States. But like, at the very least, if he is lying, I mean, she's been caught, I mean, her and Wals, like, literally have, like, lied their ass off objectively. Like, it's been discovered, like, it's been exposed all those lies that they told during their campaign.

But, like, if Trump's lying about all the shit that he's saying, at the very least, he's pretending to want to end the wars. He's pretending to support Bitcoin. And he's pretending to try to, like, push this health care initiative with Bobby Kennedy. So, like, I'm going to take that over her any second day of the week. Early on, he was one of the only critics of the Iraq war. You had all the Democrats lining up, all the Republicans. Yeah. He's saying he wants to release the JFK files, first of all.

He wants to release Ross Ulbricht. So we'll see if he does this stuff. He says he's going to do it like first thing when he gets into office. Yes. And I just got to say Iraq war, Afghanistan war, once we start, you know, all this moral superiority we feel as a country, man, our government acts in real bad faith, you know, mass murder. You know what I mean? We traffic weapons around the plane. We're not the fucking good guys, you know what I mean?

And enough of that. You know what I mean? Yeah. And we'll see what Trump goes. You know, he could go off the deep end. He could like really highlight, at least just to talk about it. Like we spend with $36 trillion in the hole. You know what that means economically?

Right? The Fed raises interest rates. They hold it too long. Everything's cracking beneath the scene. We get the commercial real estate going on. We get the euphoria from the Trump election right now. Right. The 10 years can moving up, you know, there's a lot.

The bond market is the world's investment market. It's not the stock market. The bond market is huge. The Japanese and the Chinese are dumping them because of toxic debt with $36 trillion in the hole once again. So the 10 year, it's going to become more costly, right? We pay a trillion dollars a year in interest payments on our fucked up debt. We're like a co-keged kid who blew all the inheritance of our parents. and now we're like in all this like good economic data is fueled by spending by its it's debt fueled

prosperity that has to end and it gets worse because now we're going to pay exponentially for the interest on the debt that's a long-winded way of saying we have an insidious system and stop fighting left and right in sea and demand at least a temporary world of peace as a springboard to awaken and get the fuck out of the matrix you don't I'm saying like just demand peace you know what I mean I don't give a shit who the candidate is talk about wars talk about what's going on you know shitting on Netanyahu is not the same as you know it gets inflated with anti-semitism I got Jewish friends and they think he's a piece of shit you know what I mean? Of course right lots of them me too and he's a sociopath and he operates like

we when I go to Iraq or I go to Egypt and you know I hope I'm not held accountable for the misdeeds of the U.S. government you know what I mean just like you know Jewish people probably feel this like disgust at how their government is operating just like U.S. citizens abroad feel the same way. It's like, this doesn't represent me, man. Right. So anyways, I don't want to go down that rabbit hole too much. I just want to express that. You know what I mean? Be kind to each other and demand a better world, not based on judgment and addiction to being right, but like empathy, you know? Yeah. Yeah. We'll see. We'll see if like, you know, because the media is clearly owned by the left wing establishment and the party essentially, the regime.

So, and it's clearly that they got to figure out, you know, they don't know what the fuck they were doing, especially with this election. They got really arrogant. They don't understand how this landscape works. They obviously were not able to like read the room as to like what was going on. And with her like literally trying to dictate how she was going to do the Trump podcast, like you have to come to me and it's only going to be one hour because I'm too busy. Meanwhile, the following week, she literally cancels a rally and her plane does a U-turn in mid-air so she

can go do SNL. So like, you'll cancel a rally for SNL, but you're too busy to do Joe Rogan and going to make him come to you. Like, that's whoever was in charge of that, like, maybe they're going to try to like, they're going to try to figure out what the fuck they did and try to, figure out a new strategy here because Trump is clearly trying to, it looks like what he's trying to do is bring more unity. I mean, he just came out saying that he was going to like pay off her debts or something like that recently. Yeah. And like for the sake of unity and to bring the country together. So we'll see if he can try to like turn this thing around and be more of like a JFK 2.0. Yeah. The autopsy of the Democratic strategy isn't going too well. It's not, there's not a lot of self-reflecting.

It's like, oh, we should have got, Biden should have dropped out earlier, not like, what is your message? You know, I could be a brilliant campaign strategist, but nobody would listen to me. Right. You know, they force up Bernie Sanders. I don't want to agree with his economic policies, but at least he's better than a lot they put out there. They push away RFK Jr. Like, it's like, we're going to work for people. We're going to work for, you know, you focus on economic needs.

You're going to have Republicans in my cabinet. You know, we're going to like work together in a bipartisan. and way for real. None of that. It's like the cult members, the cult members who remain in the DNC are doubling down. You know what I mean?

Like Trump, you know, he's a racist. He's going to like to deport everyone. He's going to do all that's evil. You know, so I hope what you're saying is right. But what we really need is a multi-party system that doesn't have political machinery and funding behind it. And term limits. And term limits.

And Trump's been talking about that. So, yeah. Well, we'll see where it goes. This is just for people who like, you know, when I'm like a lefty my whole life because, like I said, I had this. So was I. Yeah, this glorious dream of Bobby and John coming back. Right, right. And liberating us from the octopus, you know.

It didn't happen. Yeah. No, I was same way. Raised like super, super left wing by my mom who has a master's degree in fine arts, lived her whole entire life in the university system. still that blue no matter who and you know like having conversations with her nowadays is like I know it's rough it's rough thankfully my parents are in the other realm God bless but we never talk politics you know the the Democrats today are now they're like the ones that support the Iraq war

it's crazy uh that's true and the intolerance that came out of life that I never dealt with you know I never saw that because and it's not to shit on anyone because there's a of intolerance on the right there's like a religious cult thing, of evangelical thing on the right, that's a little over the top. And there's more of an atheistic cult thing on the left, you know? And it is what it is. It's more like, you know,

evaluate what's going on, this binary dynamic and how it doesn't work. Yeah. And, yeah. I did want it. Can we shift gears and talk about fish gods? Let's shift gears talking about fish gods. Before we do that,

I got to take a leak real quick. Take a quick pause. Fish gods. All right. Are we going, Steve? We're still going. All right, let's talk about some fish gods. Which is great, man.

It's like that it's so seemingly absurd. I love it. Wasn't varicotious fish god? Let me start, if you would indulge me, by a quoting Carl Sagan. Okay. First of all, I'll say that all around the world, the wisdom keepers, the culture heroes of virtually every culture. they were androgynous amphibious

brother and sister husband and wife self-fertilizing genetic engineers who taught the arts of civilization repaired the heavens after a cataclysm and have many other traits in common which is like right off the bat and these are cultures that had a little no contact

and I'll talk about your boy Vericoach in a minute Yeah. So let me put on my old man glasses here. And this is Colisegan, right? Okay. So, Owanis is the fish dude who shows up and teaches the arts of civilization that Barrosis talks about, right?

He has this strange bag. You see it in the Samarian iconography, right? He's described by Barrosis in 280 BC in Babylonica. We have his, which is no longer with us, but Eusebius is Caesarea. and Alexander Polyhistor wrote about the work of Barosis in their works. So that's a long-winded way of saying. He talks about how, you know, in the early times, this fish being comes out of the river and teaches the arts of civilization to the ancient

Samarian people. And he's literally got like a fish's tail and a human aspect to it too. And that's what you see in that iconography. So we're being told that, that Olinus is one of these beings. And in fact, the seven Samarian kings of the Kings list that goes back 250,000 years, they all had an advisor who was a fish god, who was an androgynous amphibious fish god. And O'Anus was the first one for the first Samarian king. And they lived these massive lifespans. Wow.

So anyways, this is what a boy, Carl Sagan, who I wish was around today. He'd call it so much shi Ann if he was around today. Oh yeah. Stories like the Awanis legend deserve more critical studies that have been performed here to four. Such hypotheses are entirely reasonable and worthy

of careful analysis. So, you know, people can shit on them if they want, on me if they want, but I'm going off of what Sagan said about analyzing and trying to figure out the truth of fishy friends. Samarian civilization is depicted by the descendants of the Samarians themselves,

to be of non-human origin. A succession of strange creatures appears over the course of several generations. Their only apparent purpose is to instruct mankind. Each knows of the mission and accomplishment of his predecessors. That's the Apcalo,

the seven generations of fish beings. So the story starts in Mali Africa with the Dogon people. Professor Robert Temple wrote the serious mystery in the 70s. He's one of the most brilliant academics I've ever encountered. Robert Temple. Robert Temple. Professor Robert

Temple. He wrote the history of China with Newman and the guy's freaking brilliant. So, he wrote about the Dogan understood supposedly about the binary nature of Serious, like

white dwarf, black dwarf stuff. So a lot of people got bogged down and they're like, then the Christian missionaries might have hooked him up with some idea about Serius, for instance, like that that's how they knew that so this I don't want to get bogged down in the controversy what he really highlighted was that the nomo the eight are androgynous amphibious self-fertilizing wisdom bringers who taught the arts and civilization to the dogon people so self

fertilizing means you like literally procrate out of yourself right that sounds bizarre right self fertilization so let's go and then remember what Sagan had to say we go over to samaria Now, give me a sec to talk about Sitchin, right? Zacharias Sitchin wrote about the Anunaki gods. They're extraterrestrials. Nibero comes around every 3,600 years. I don't want to shit on him because he's not here to defend himself. But he created this science fiction kind of version where he had some things right.

The Samarians are the Anunaki, as far as the documents and the cuneiform tablets are concerned, created humans. They are genetic engineers. But Nibera was like a mistranslation of Nippur in the library of Nineveh. So he created this compelling but not necessarily factual or, you know, you can't fact check what he had to say. Right. Right. So the skeptics glom on to that and like, this is all a fairy tale.

It's like, no, go back to the original translators and finders like HV. Hillprecht worked for the University of Pennsylvania in the 1800s, late 1800s. He was an seriologist. He unearthed the Library of Ninevehva. he found tens of thousands of cuneiform tablets This is Euphoria Calvin Klein The new elixir collection

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Watch the Stanley Cup playoffs on TNT, TBS, True TV, and HBO Max. And in his book, The Expeditions of the University of Pennsylvania in Babylon, him and his colleague Hugo Radhdo, who got his Ph.D. from Columbia in the 1870s, they wrote about the androgynous nature of all Sumerian gods. they are self-fertilizing androgynous beings that beget out of themselves. So he's highlighting the fact that all the Samarian gods are self-fertilizing androgens, which is fucking wild, right? It's like that level of specificity.

Now let's go over to Egypt. And on the temple, at the Horace Temple, the Edfu texts, which we had talked about, right? I got no social life. So it's two in the morning. and I'm reading the old French translations of the Ed Food Text. I'm reading Eve Raymond, right, the highly regarded Egyptologist. She writes about the Audeauad, the eight. Now remember the eight of the NOMO?

Yes. In Dogon? Yep. The Ogdoad and the Eniad are brother and sister, husband and wife, self-fertilizing androgens who teach the arts of civilization, their wisdom bringers, and three different passages. on the Ed Fu text talk about the self-fertilizing nature of the gods, of the androgynous gods. They beget out of themselves.

They are born without the mother. You know, it's like clear that they are self-fertilizing androgens on the temple walls of Edfu, right? So you have this theme that is carried to China. Who creates humans? Fushi and Nuwa. And Robert Temple writes about it. He wrote the history of China with, I forget, colleagues name Joseph Newman I think so anyways temple says that the Chinese people

firmly believe that a fish-tailed androgynous humanish hybrid brother and sister team twins created the Chinese civilization they taught marriage it seems like a genetic experiment we're gonna teach you animal husbandry the arts of civilization marriage we're gonna control the population so on all the tunes you have the brother and sister with the entwined tails of fushinua all of the ancient chinese tombs you can go to wikipedia they firmly believe that that um these androgynous amphibious self-fertilizing beings were the culture heroes and then we go to peru for instance varicocha emerges from lake tidi caca he uh is covered in fish scales at the bennett monolith

his wife and sister and twin mamacocha had is is also amphibious and androgynous and there were temples all around like tidi caca before the uh that were documented before the spanish destroyed them of her as like half human half fish tail right so it's it's this story's carried over to peru with it and he creates humans when all these beings are genetic engineers he creates the giants destroys them in a flood like Yahweh in the Bible, who's androgynous, and you have the same story play out across the ocean. So I'll just go, I'll give a couple more. Sedna, Sedna and Inuit lore in Greenland of all places, is androgynous and amphibious. And you go find this freaking stuff on Wikipedia. It's not like I'm cherry picking the data. And Sedna,

Isis, and Kaibel, one of the oldest goddess in Asia Minor, Artim Pasa, and so many others were served by cross-dressing gay and transgender priests, like showing that, you know, that androgynous gender fluidity, if you will, this reverence for the androgeny. And the oldest temples on Earth display the double-headed idol of the androgen. Jericho Ayan Ghazal, they just found one at Karahan Tepe. Erid Ziphar is an Egyptian archaeologist in 2007, she wrote, the first Adam, Ian Gazzal, and the two-headed statues that were found at Iain Gazzal in like 8,000 BC.

The moral of the story, she's saying that ancient people firmly believed that the first humans were and that the gods and the engineerses were androgynous and they had displayed in the iconography of the oldest cities on Earth. And then I told her, you know, they just found a double-headed androgynous idol at Karaheimtepe. They did? They did. Can you find this?

A picture of this, Steve? Hugh Newman, it's, it's, it's, uh, probably has it in his, uh, oh yeah, Hugh probably talked about this when he came in. So it's a long winded way of saying, wow. Isn't that a bunch of levels of specificity, um, between cultures that had a little, no contact, describing the culture heroes that taught them the arts of civilization in that similar way? You know, that catches my attention. I don't have a freaking time machine. Who knows?

Sagan's saying, check it out. Have you ever heard of John Marco Allegro? Yes, the Dead Sea Scroll translator. Yeah. Yeah, he translated the Dead Sea Scrolls. And it seems like there might be a connection, but he basically came up with this crazy theory that, well, he was reading and translating those Dead Sea Scrolls,

first of all, like dedicated his life to that. And essentially the connection he made was with, like, he thought that with the way Jesus was born, this immaculate conception, right? He connected that to mushrooms. They come from rain hits the earth and they just appear. There's no fertilization that has to occur, right? They appear from mycelium, right?

So it's kind of like the same way, like an immaculate conception. So he theorized by connecting these Sumerian texts with the Hebrew texts that Jesus Christ was a psychedelic mushroom. But one of the gaping holes in his reasoning there is he was connecting Sumerian roots of words to Hebrew. And there is linguistically zero connection if you talk to classicists between those two languages. So for what it's worth, that's an interesting connection. Oh, there's a double-headed idol right there. So I tell Erud Zephyr that they, I said, you should do a victory lap because a paper is brilliant. He's like, I would propose the idea that the first humans revered by these cultures were androgynous.

You know, Aristophanes displays the myth of the ancient androgen cultures around the world. Oh, I was going to say, Marsha Silverblatt, professor from Duke University, writes specifically that there is no doubt that Vericoach is androgynous. All these, like, in academic, we'll tell you. you, these people believed that these were real beings who were androgynous. You could say, I don't believe it. It's a mythology. But the traits that I discussed are an academic. We'll tell you, yes, this is exactly what was being said there.

And the iconography is remarkably similar at all these places as well. As if, you know, this is like Hancock. I don't want to speak for him, right? But he's like, even in the show, he's talking about Awanus. He's talking about variculture, right? He's beating around this bush of like, androgynous fish gods showing up and being the wisdom bringers it's such a strange concept so he's like oh Jesus Christ I'm so far on the limb anyways I don't know his mind but maybe he's like I'll just keep it as like

some lost wandering beings who teach civilization because if I if I get into the fish gods why watch out but he's the one who kind of point to me in their direction along with Sagan you know so to your point about Allegro I've read all this stuff and I think it was off base in some but like Mermaid literally means Virgin of the Sea, right? Thoth, he born without a mother. The pyramid texts in Egypt, utterance 534, Neith, who is endrogynous, oh, I'm sorry, Nephthys, her born without a vulva. You know, basically, it's not a real world, what is it,

housewives of Egypt, dis. It's like claiming that she is endrogenous. She is a self-fertilizer. all these beings are described as having, they don't procreate in the same way as we do, excuse me. So anyways, see, it's like, oh, you believe in the mermaid, you're a fucking idiot, you know what I mean? Like, that's how a skeptic would take this whole thing.

But I said, my boy, Sagan is saying it's worthy of further investigation. And you would look around these traditions, and I'm not a hyper-diffusionist. I don't think there was contact between all these cultures. How could they envision and, come up with so similar like brother and sister husband and wife let me if you would indulge me for a second the idea of the cripple god right androgynous zeus androgynous hera throw androgynous hephistus the the iron worker of the gods off monolympus because he is so deformed

he is limp right so the doctors have looked into it like was Hephaestus did he have arsenic poisoning they'll look it for like a worldly way to describe it so then we go over to Japan and the two brother and sister gods throw Abisu I mean I mean they cast Abisu out because he's crippled and he's a fish god and then you go to Egypt and you have Patah and you have Osiris who always has his legs wrapped and mummified he cannot walk Plutarch tells us that he gave birth in a self-fertilizing way to his next next incarnation who has horace whose literal name means like fish god of our earth or something like

that right i know you know i don't want to like go up rain man here but when you the scope of this there are so many kind of hidden in plain sight aspects of this mystery i think it demands further investigation these are the gods who are the genetic engineers who created humans because people like i'm down with uapes you know i feel uh georgio says Like, the idea is aliens didn't build the pyramids. Who are the gods? You know? That's what he talks about.

But it's like, how do I portray you in the most kind of hurtful and disrespectful manner? You're a fucking moron. You think the alien creatures built the pyramids, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Instead of, no, who are the gods? Salim Hassan considered the greatest Egyptologist, Egyptian archaeologists. I should say in history, wrote in 1949 in the Sphinx that the Egyptian people themselves firmly believe that there was a succession of great gods that ruled for tens of thousands of years, right?

So Salim Hassan says that. Menetho, who we use the dynastic classification system, starting with menace in around 3,100 BC, economics use that and agree that he's got it right. but the time of the gods and the time of the followers of Horace which is 13,900 and 11,000 years I consider mythological so when I go to Egypt

I hang out with my boy Yusuf I won Oh yeah, yeah, I've heard of him Yeah, Ben Ben and hangs out with him when he goes over there He's a super solid dude He's a know, you know, you gotta spread a lot of backshe's around You gotta know people when you travel in Egypt His dad apparently worked with Edgar Casey, right?

His dad was the great wisdom keeper Hakeem Awan, right? So what does he have to say? What do the ancient traditions of Egypt have to say that there was a time of the gods that was older, that was like 10,000 years older and older, right? Not in the main, you know,

so we have, this is a great racist argument thing. There are people, there were Edgar Casey people who think the pyramids were built in 10,000 BC. Yusuf goes around and he shows... How is that racist to say the pyramids were built in 10,000 BC? Because somehow you're saying that the Egyptians couldn't have pulled it off themselves. But they were same, they were Egyptians still, just older Egyptians.

Yes, I know. This is where it gets. They were still African people. But, you know, the Egyptians is incredible things, you know, like that we know of. Like in Ptalaamac times, we know about Karnak, on and on and on. All as I'm saying, or anybody who would take an alternative approach is that the tradition state that the Sphinx, the Great Pyramid Complex, and probably the Assyrian, right near Abidose from an earlier time.

I think Youssef would say that too. So that goes to this like, and they found all these voids in the Great Pyramid, right? Yes. Oh, yeah. Robert Schock and Thomas Dobecki found a void

under the power of the sphinx. So it's like, I don't know if the freaking pyramid's 25, it's inconclusive in my estimation, but maybe it's 10,000 years old, who the fuck knows, right. Let's get in there and see. Let's do explorations

because if there's something that is datable within the Great Pyramid, it would be contemporaneous with the date, either 2,500 BC or 10,000 BC. And like Robert Schock would say, the weathering pattern on the sphinx is showing a much earlier antiquity, but that's just one piece of information.

You cannot extrapolate and say that proves that Egyptian civilization is 10,000 years old. You need artifacts, carbon dating, in context. So I'm like, you know, I'm always pitching shows at different networks, and I'm like, I dig the idea of excavating under the power of the sphinx.

I like the search for the Lost Hall of Records idea. Who knows? I don't have a fucking time machine. Don't you think people would dig that? You know what I mean? Like, let's find out once and for all. And then we could like banish this realm of pseudo-archology that it's claimed. That like there's no basis in this because a lot of the Atlantis myth is tied into survivors

showing up in Egypt, these gods, these bizarre androgens. that has a lot to do with this the dating and the atlantis myth so let's see let's let's let's do it you know yeah no um ben was telling me talking to me about uh yusuf and how his dad was like a really big part of this casey movement or i don't know i don't know when edgar casey lived i don't know if they it was possible for his dad and casey didn't know each other but he was a part of this big edgar casey sort of um organization right and they were he was explaining to me that there's like a lot more underneath the sphinx than we know and a lot that hasn't been excavated or maybe has

but as being held secret by like Zahi Huas. I was supposed to speak with Zahi and Mark Lerner at the Casey conference like three years ago but it was so I didn't get to meet him to talk to him. The whole thing is fascinating. I'll give a little background on Casey. I just spoke at the, I just spoke there again at the ARE and I love the Casey people.

They're not like glassy-eyed zombies. They're like really cool. They were empathic. They were all about hailing. Like anyways, Casey was born in 1877, at Hopkinsville, Kentucky. And he basically would go into like this trans like state,

trans like state and give health readings for people. Right, right, right, right. Crazy stuff. Crazy stuff, right? He apparently, like, someone told him to, something told him to sleep on a book or something. So he literally took it literally,

put the book under his pillow, apparently slept on top of a book or with a book under his head and then woke up and knew all the information in the book. That was actually. I think it was his father was telling him to do his study so we slept on the book and then he just

every page he would open the page and know it. John Van Aachen is like runs the Casey Center there and he's got all the kinds of stories and I just did a bio on Edgar Casey for ancient aliens last season I actually came out really good

so the moralist story is that Casey would give these health readings he would claim to tap in not him but just like to tap into the Akashic Records of all existence but then he started talking about past lifetimes

Atlantis, ancient Egypt, and in his waking life, he was kind of like a conservative Christian, and all he did was like read the Bible and stuff. So he was really kind of bummed out. But then he just went with it, and all this, you know, all these readings came out. 14,000 readings, 25 million words. It's all documented at the Casey Foundation. Right. So Casey had the, Casey said Atlantis existed in the Middle Atlantic, founded in 210,000 BC,

talks about three cataclyisms in 50, 20, 20,000. in the final younger dryest one 12,000 BC. So he has this timeline of Atlantis. And I just find it interesting because Casey got things wrong about future predictions for sure that he made and he got things right that he should never have known about. So he's the perfect for me case study. I'm not dogmatic, but I'm intrigued.

Jonas Salk said, intuition points to where the thinking mind should look next, right? And some about the Casey material rings true to me, and we'll see, like the idea of Egypt being older or stuff like that. So, Hakeem R. I can imagine, was connected to the Casey universe. But in a karmic sense, when you think in these terms, I think of like these beings keep orbiting each other in different lifetimes, right? So you have Zawi Huas, Mark Lerner. They were both supported by the Casey Foundation, Hawassi, went to UPenn.

Learner's education was paid at Chicago, I believe, an archaeological degree. And Lerner wrote a book, his parents were Casey people, about kind of proving the Casey material through the lens of archaeology and mysticism. But then he went against that,

and he became a mainstream Egyptologist. But they still have this connection. So they were on the other, they played for the other team, but they're deeply connected to the Casey Foundation. Right. And then you have Shock,

Robert Shock, You have Hancock, Bavall, you know, all these people that are kind of floating in this Atlantis milieu. You know what I mean? I'll throw myself in there, you know what I mean? Just a little humble brag that I'm connected somehow to the Casey material and the people. Yeah. And I just think it's cool in this kind of karmic orbiting of different beings trying to unravel the story. It's just, it tickles my fancy.

My favorite theory is Chris Dunn's power plant theory about the pyramids. I don't know if familiar with him. He wrote the famous book, He's a power plant that he followed it up recently with his new book, The Tesla Connection. And he has this theory that basically the Great Pyramid was this electron, a solid state electron harvester. And that, I mean, he's the only guy who's like a legitimate engineer who has back engineered the Great Pyramid. Like he's in his best, he's looked through every single cavity and shaft inside the Great Pyramid. And he like built a replica and reverse engineered a way for it to somehow create free energy.

And he has this theory, his new, his variation to the theory. So he's evolved his original theory. And his new theory essentially is that the great pyramids, the great pyramid and the three other, the two other pyramids, they sit on the Giza Plateau, which is a seismically active area there. So there's like a lot of seismic activity there. And there has been through history. And he hypothesizes that there was a hydraulic hammer device in the subterranean chamber that

would hammer the earth and induce earthquakes, which would essentially bring up electrons through the igneous rock of beneath the earth up through the pyramid, which is built with igneous rock with the limestone and all the granite. And that how that those all those electrons would somehow come through the king, the queen's chamber and there were shafts that were peripherally outside of the pyramid that they would pour. What was it? It was a some sort of act. acid. Yeah, yeah. Sulfuric acid.

Maybe sulfuric acid. I could be fucking that up. But they poured it in those, in those shafts. Those, well, they were like, there were pits outside of the pyramid. And those pits fed the shafts that went into the Queens chamber, right? Because he believes that they're connected. They went after they sent that rover up those shafts and figured out there was that gate and brink's door there. Then they busted through the door because the door had these little two electrodes that were coming through, which is why the fuck would, why would there be little too?

copper electrodes coming out of that door, that way up in the middle of that shaft in that pyramid that was supposedly a tomb. And he thinks that the, um, it fed liquid that acid into those shafts and those electrodes were there to like keep the right amount of liquid in those shafts. And that would create this liquid or this, uh, this hydrogen that would come up through the queen's chain or the, the grand gallery will create some sort of resonant frequency and create some sort of combustive. in the King's Chamber, and the two shafts that came out of the King's Chamber were like mazes,

right, that somehow created some sort of a field of free energy that he believes powered that civilization that was there during that time. Yeah, I'm friends with Chris. He did a huge, Hugh does an Origins conference in London. And I got to tell you, he's funny men like behind the scenes. Oh, he's hilarious. He's hilarious. I love Chris.

Yeah, what a great sense of humor that dude has. Michael Creamo too, forbidden history or I think that's a book he wrote. He's another because people don't know the personalities of some of these guys. I love Chris. I think, yeah, it might have been a multi-purpose use, right? I think we all believe it wasn't a tomb, you know? There's no adornment, there's no hieroglyphics. You get into the Howard Vice 1834, seemingly forged cartouche and stuff like that.

He's looking for funding. He's using dynamite. He's a piece of shit, you know? Right. So, and it's fine, you know what I mean? See, I know Zawi gets a lot of shit, but he pushes back because there's, they've robbed antiquities from Egypt. They portrayed the Egyptian people in really bad ways over time, you know, science has.

So I dig where he's coming from. I would just say, I think, I think the archaeologists would agree with this. I think world government should lay out about $20 billion a year and do archaeological digs around the world, especially at this point in history, you figure out our past, because there may be clues within the past about ways to understand our true nature and understand what's going on, you know, in time and space, all those big questions. But my point is, let's excavate under the parlor of the sphinx. Let's get into the Great Pyramid as much as possible. Let's excavate all around the Giza Plateau. If you're interesting in this, my boy Trevor Grassie and William Brown,

spoke at the Casey conference, William bought a piece of land near the pyramid, and they do have like a three series video set on YouTube beneath Gaza, no, the underworld of Gaza, for anybody who's into the story. Of Giza? Of Giza, yeah. So they're looking for the Lost Hall of Records, you know?

They're not dogmatic, they're just following, you know, the traditions and stuff like that. So the moral story is like a lot of people don't believe the pyramid was a tomb, so let's find out. Right. You know? And it seems like there's a lot of young Egyptologists that are coming up in Egypt

that are taking Chris Dunn's stuff seriously and like looking more into it. So it's like sort of like a new guard who's looking at that. And like we should look into this stuff that we don't understand. Like what's the like we're never going to get anywhere if we just keep accepting the narrative.

Totally. And it's part of that cult like belief system. It's like this is a belief of my ideological enemy. I'm not going to give anything to this. It's even like, you know, I'm a stone mason with engineering experience and you'll look at like Gobeckley-Tep. and Cara Han Tepe, these, Hugh probably talked about a 12,000-year-old sites.

It's not impossible technology, but it's like incredible work that requires, like, feeding this huge population and skilled masons and all kinds of organization through a civilization or a society of hunter-gatherers. You know, that's where Hancock gets like, was there a transfer of technology or at the same time? You know, because it springs up everywhere, and the massive scale of it, Turkey now is just like incomprehensible how much of it is but the skeptics because they don't want to yield they don't want to give anything to Hancock it's just like yeah you know there's some rudimentary stonework uh instead of an embracing how fucked up it is and how like paradigm shifting it is you know

so so i would like more honest objective evaluation like let's take Hancock he starts off in the 90s of the late 80s he has his hypothesis there's a cataclysm And there's a lost civilization that's destroyed that goes around the world and teaches the arts to civilization. And lo and behold, we find the evidence for his cataclysm supported by an international team scientist called the Younger Dryest Impact Hypothesis. And if it wasn't considered a mythological and religious idea, it would have been accepted like 20 years ago. If you look at the evidence, it's pretty incontrovertible in my estimation. And then we find a super civilization in Turkey that's 12,000 years old. That was one of the main things, arguments against Robert Sharman.

I am saying the weathering indicates like a 10,000-year-old date for the Great Pyraman, I mean, the Sphinx. He sits with Mark Lerner and he gets scorn poured upon him. There is no contemporaneous, advanced culture or civilization or temple sites around the world that meet a 10,000-year-old date. And then it happens, right? And I don't think the apologies came rolling in. And the same thing with Hancock. It's like, you have an, well, I don't agree with you there. but you predicted or you or what came to support your theory has been evidence for a catacly

and civilization being vastly older right you start there now for me to buy which is selling I need to see more than just a thought from Plato that may and may not be true I need to see this evidence and that evidence but then you start on them and calling a racist or all this unhinged stuff then then you're losing the audience right then you're like that's not cool you know what I mean? Right. And instead of like a scientist, once again, got to be like a cop.

You deal with a lot of weirdos. You take a lot of shit. But you get the respect of objectivity. Science is apolitical. We need these dates. This is what we need to see. Now, I'd just say that, you know, because, you know, in the shortcomings of the alternative space,

there's no pair of view. You got an audience who wants to believe that you can fool and grift off of. There's a lot of, of flaws there's no there's you know not a critical analysis of everybody's theories oftentimes but there are strengths too there's intuition there are a lot of people who are oriented towards metaphysics because a lot of people get into ancient mysteries because they are interested in spirituality metaphysics like Megan fox for instance she liked my show so she had me on her show which is

kind of Megan Fox the actress yeah Megan she did a really yeah a legend of the loss a couple of years ago she She did a one season show. And the last episode was about the Clovis Barry and Giants and stuff like that. So we were talking and we became friendly. Really? Yeah, yeah, she's really cool. She's into Edgar Casey. She's into metaphysics.

Wow. So we communicated back and forth. The first thing she said to me is like, I don't want to incarnate again. I don't want to tell stories out of school, but these are like glowing reviews of her as a person. So I don't think she'll mind. So she said, I don't want to encounter any. anymore. She said, I'm into the Casey material. I'm into ancient mysteries, but the rest of the world

bores me to tears. You know what I mean? And I said, I agree. It's like, what's our real nature? She asked about ayahuasca. I said, you don't want to incarnate again. Go read disappearance in the universe by Gary Renard. He's a non-dualist teacher. And it's

about the false and temporary nature of the Matrix and our true nature and stuff like that. And it's hardcore and it's radical because that is what non-dualism is it's like you are not a body you are a field of awareness outside of time and space with no concrete specificity like the false and temporary matrix i know it's mind-bending yeah but every mystic throughout human history says the same thing so i said read the book megan she reads

it i mean she sucked it up in no time disappearance the universe by garra and she gets back to me and she's like i'm in the gym the other day i'm looking in the mirror and i'm flipping the fuck out and my image is disappearing. And she's like, I understand intellectually everything that's being said, but look, I'm a mother of three kids. I'm in my early 30s. I got a, what is it in the matrix when you go back in? You take the blue pill or the red pill. She's like, I'm not ready for this. And I say, I dig that. And I'm not going to like push it. I'm just going to say, the seed has been planted and you'll probably come back around to this. Because it's like when you hear the truth, it's like a Zen koan. Right. What's the sound of one hand clapping?

that's not a question to be answered it is a question to dissolve the questioner the false egoic self so her appearances of is disappearing right and that she's having the zen co-on effect like you ever see jim carrie talk in a dissociative way about his movie character like jim he's like he's starting to move towards enlightenment so he's talking about jim carry the separate being as if it's a movie character right and i've studied my brother and i study with like an enlightened spiritual teacher for 20 years. And you're like, what is that? Liberated from fear in this blissful state.

You're like, how the fuck do I get there? You know? And the point is that he encourages almost a dissociative orientation around your movie character. Don't take yourself too seriously. You have karma to play out. Your true nature is benevolent anyway. So, you know, if you're really in alignment,

you'll do nothing but good deeds anyways. It's only the twisted whispers of the ego that, that get, you know, means you down the wrong path. So Jim Carrey talks about this like dissociative, in a dissociative way about his movie character. It's really interesting. And people like,

oh, he's a fucking victim of MK Ultra or whatever. It's like, no, he's starting to move towards enlightenment. And that's what happens. Like, and these are the lifetimes where you deal with all this, you deal with all this trauma, you reflect, you forgive. And then next time you have to show up in the Matrix, your parents are like mystics or whatever.

You've undone so much. And then you flip the switch like Ickhardtoli, right? Like he came into this life. You're like, power now I can't fucking focus, you know, but he came into this life ready to be switched on or switched off, I should say. And that's what the mystics say, that you undo, you keep coming back to the Matrix until you break the cycle reincarnation, but you undo all that is false about you.

And that's the book Megan read. It's just like you undo the- What's the name of that book? The Disappearance of the Universe by Gary Renard. But it's not like the course in miracles is this kind of new, channeled, non-dullistic teaching, which is interesting, but the Edvita Vandata, the Ribu Gita, the Ashtavakra Gita, all these texts wrote history, the teachings of Lao Tsu, Ramana Maharshi. Even Jesus in the Nagamati scrolls, the apocryphon of John, he comes to John, and he speaks

about the inexpressible one, the field of existence, in completely non-dualistic ways. Go read it. He's like Eastern mystic, you know, not the Jesus of kind of the evangelical movement. He's been transformed. The Gospel of Thomas, who Elaine Pagels talked about, the shortest passages, be passerby. Leave everybody alone. Do not try to change anything. Bless, forgive, turn the cheek.

You are making it real by conflict and judgment. you were experiencing a false and temporary and you can make whatever you want about the sojourn, it's time and space. Right? People have different ideas. God made man so man could become God. You know, these theories of like,

oh God wouldn't know what was like to like turn his ankle and see a sunset, whatever. You know what I mean? Like, and it's not like a white dude in the throne. The God is the field, the field that you are. That's what the mystics say. The point is, I think it's worthwhile pointing to

our eternal nature and then make of it what you want because we could talk intellectually about this all day long but all these teachings and ceremonies are geared towards the experience the literal visceral experience of what you already are so when you break through and you you're in the zone of the one you're in the field all doubt is cast away you don't even want to describe it you don't even want to think it's a it's a realm without thought in time It's fucking crazy. And it's awe-inspiring and enthralling. So I could talk shit all day,

but it's like, what can you do in your life to get you back to your real nature? And the mystics, which they forgive, don't do it out of phony goodness. You're already perfect. So I don't want anything out. I don't want anything transactional out of you.

Right. I don't want to fucking manipulate you to get an extra hit. I don't want to look for my soulmate on Tinder. You know what I mean? I want to treat people for what they are, which is divine and forgive. And what I don't, I'm being a fraud in a piece of shit, you know, and a hypocrite.

And you don't condemn yourself, though. You're like, you kind of laugh at your movie character. Totally. So I know I went on a long rant there. Yeah. You know, that's where I'm coming from. I think that's a kind of a cool way. That seems to be the consensus with people who experiment with psychedelics.

There's a guy who I had on the show about a year ago named Andrew Gallimore. I don't know if you were heard of him. Yeah, he's doing this study called DMTX out of Tokyo where he's putting people on extended state DMT trips and they're essentially trying to like map the DMT realm right and figure out like what's going on and try to build some sort of consensus or some coherence of what people are experiencing when they're on these things like ayahuasca and DMT and what's going on because there's a lot of very similar things like it's not just like everyone's having their own unique experience a lot of people are seeing them reporting the same exact sort of things like entities

and patterns and colors um and you know he is a neuro neurobiologist and what he seems to believe is that there's this there's more of a reality there and what our brain is is essentially like a filter

and our brain is here to exist evolutionarily to filter out everything there so that we can only sense what we need to to survive and to evolve and to reproduce and what happens

happens when you're ingesting these substances and integrating with them is you're you're activating more of your brain so you can experience more of what's already there like reality if we were to have our entire brain engaged and and somehow be turned on it would be something that's so overwhelming for us we might just dissolve maybe we can only handle like a couple hours or 10 minutes of this but it seems like there's definitely something there. And when you hear people talk about like they're experienced with these drugs and tapping into this other realm or whatever it is,

they seem to talk about these kind of things. Absolutely. I've experienced that. A mystic would also say, you're not going to experience all your lifetimes at once because it would be overload. You'd have a nervous breakdown, but you can't, you know, why are there some psychics?

There's some bad artists and grift is out there, but there's some psychics whose game is pretty tight who have a good track record, right? So it's like, what are they doing to happen in the past and the future? It's because, you know, Einstein would say it's a false construct in a false world for whatever purpose.

It could be the experience, you know, one of the shamans that I've studied with and did ceremonies with, at least there's a beauty in forgetting. It's like when you realize, you know, you're in this blissful state of eternity and, like, it's incomprehensible, but it's almost kind of a cool game to forget

because when you remember what you really are, it's like so are inspiring, it's beyond comprehension. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I thought I was this hopeless piece of shit, but on this glorious divine being that has to do nothing to be what I already am, right?

Right. So I don't know about the nature of that. I'll just say that on a worldly level, it's worth looking into psychedelics. Are they letting us go into other dimensions? Are they showing us our true nature? You have Johns Hopkins just built like a $17 million research facility. End stage cancer patients are losing the fear of death.

Right? It's like this is the shit that we need in our society. We don't want to demonize it. That's why I like Hancock again. He's always like pointing to psychedelics. And it's hard, man. Have you done Iwasco? Never done Iwasco.

Just DMD. It's like stop the ride I want to get off. It's really rough. Yeah, no, it seems terrifying. Terrifying. You got, like, I imagine, like, I always thought, well, like, from the descriptions I've heard of it, it sounds like you're literally going to hell and facing demons. Pretty much. The demons your own.

Well, you know, there's third parties in the room, too. That's another strange thing. Like, the spirit, like, if you do ketamine infusions, which are very helpful for, like, intractable depression. Sure. There isn't a third party, and there isn't a spirit being there. But ayahuasca, they call it, like, grandmother. It's like this supercomputer intelligence knows exactly. you need and we'll kick you in the balls,

you know what I mean? I think it's like it or she or whatever is seeing that there's a limited window to get to you, right? Because most people run from these things. And it's like this is what you need to see. You wanna heal, you gotta face this darkness. You gotta face the ugliness in your subconscious that hasn't been healed that's been calcified with trauma

and false beliefs and self-hatred. And it's a deep dive, but then the liberate, then you're like, It's unicorns and rainbows out the other end. Oftentimes you're like, oh my God, I feel liberated. I feel a weight. I feel like my souls come back to me, you know, which is cool. But it takes some sack to get in there and do it.

You know what I mean? And it takes like, it's not a weekend seminar that's going to heal your problems. It's the little changes you take every day, every day, like you catch yourself. Oh, fuck man, I'm back on Twitter, I'm back on Facebook. I feel like I'm worried. I'm filled with fear. I'm filled with survival. concerns. I'm filled with emptiness and heartbreak and depression. And that's fine, man. Everybody,

because we're in an unnatural state in this configuration as a temporary movie character that dies eventually and gets sick and all this crazy. We are plagued with psychological difficulties. So have empathy for people. And this is another thing. You know, people think they're like good online and they're helping and they're educating and they're fixing. And just like the vision I had, It's just like, you just blow and smoke up each other's ass. Nothing good is happening. If you really want to be helpful, well, how Sue says it. Look at all that is dark and unhealed within yourself.

Ramada Maharshi, the greatest social activist in human history, does nothing compared to the seeker who forgives, who evaluates their own weaknesses and liberates themselves through forgiveness. And I found that go work at the fucking homeless shelter. You know what I mean? Literally, there's got to be a family and neighbor. that would be thrilled if you showed up with a freaking bag of groceries every week. And this isn't a diss, but see where you're a fucking cokehead,

looking for another hit on social media versus true empathy. Like, look somebody in the eye and do something kind for them. And that's not a judgment, because I've been in the fucking Cokehead zone, you know? Yeah. So, and then when I act out of empathy,

you know, a couple buddies in mine, we call the Hilltown Helpers, we live in the Hilltowns. And we're always, like, shoveling off old ladies' roofs and shit like that. You know what I mean? Like really, you know,

some old lady hasn't seen anyone in a while and you sit down and you talk to it and you're kind to her and you do, and she's like, oh, let me pee! And it's like, no, no, that's not what this is about, you know? And it's those acts of empathy that really have an impact, you know? Oh, for sure.

When you look back at your life review, you're going to be fucking pissed if you didn't do more and not more in a fake way, more in like a loving, empathic way. And that's true. You can say that's, this dude is like, like, you know, hawking some new age philosophy, but I'm telling you, man, it's, you can

even feel it. You don't even have to believe it, you know, when you, when you're truly kind, right, you know? Yeah, man. Yeah, I think you're spot on with that. What other kind of stuff are you looking into that are that you're working on? Like, are you writing any new books? Are you working on any new shows? We got a pitch. Oh, yeah, I want to give a tip of the hat. If you dig this fish god story, Paul Anthony Wallace is a friend of mine, and he wrote the Eden series. Paul, he's Australian, he's awesome dude.

He's a former archdeacon in the Anglican church for 32 years. That's one level below bishop. He left the church, and he's writing about how in these ancient documents and ancestral narratives, there are these bizarre androgynous and, you know, genetic engineers that I talk about that are in the Old Testament. it, Yahweh has a consort called Ashera. They're androgens, right? The first Adam in the Bible is androgynous.

And then Eve is made, you know, through genetic engineering. That's that parable there. Anyways, he tells us this wonderful story throughout human history. He's half Guineas. I think he's like half Welsh or English. And he's connected to all the African ancestral tales that tell the same story that I've been sharing about Veracotia and. Fushi, it's utterly fascinating. And he's a really solid dude on top of that. I mean,

I'm sure you'll have Mon at some point, but the Eden series is highly acclaimed. It's like this new version of the ancient astronaut theory almost. Oh, wow. But he's brilliant. I can't talk his game up. So anyways, we're kind of collaborating and we get a pitch into one of the networks right now as a search for the loss records investigation of the ancient gods that I've talked about hair type of show you know go to ed foo and look at the lost hall records and i'm also writing a book about polydactylism in the ancient world extra digits right six fingers six toes yeah it's associated with the supernatural the divine and giants the giant of gath has six fingers and six toes in australia you have rock art everywhere of giant feet with six toes i was just touring with hugh and malta we go to the

Hypergium in Malta considered one at the underground temple once thought to be one of the oldest temples on earth before they found gobekli-tepe they they through construction building in like 1906 or something they broke through to it you go to room 20 there's an enormous handprint with six fingers there you go out to the american southwest there are a giant hands and feet with extra digits you go to north carolina there's judicolor rock with the Cherokee talk about the legend of judicolor and there's a seven-fingered handprint. The greatest hero of the Ulster cycle in Ireland in the Tane, the English Iliad has seven fingers and seven toes in the Oxford translation.

Just throw it a couple more. You go to Botswana. Matt Singh emerges from the underworld with humans and animals, and there's a giant six-toed footprint there or engraving there. And then you go to Karabati, and on the island there are giant almost beyond belief

six toad footprints that the old men told anthropologist IG Turbert in 1949 about they are attributed to the giants so the world is lit it with giant hands and giant feet associated with these giants that the indigenous

people tell us about so that's another like I know it's yeah here you go like see the giant foot in newspaper rock On the left is Chaco Canyon. On the right is newspaper rock in Utah. Look at that, you know. And there's this legend about, I talk.

Is that picture of that person's feet real with like seven toes? Yes. It's called polydactyl. Yeah. No, I met a woman who said that she was born with an extra finger the other day. She was from like Haiti or something. It's a rare genetic condition. Some people are born with extra digits.

It's pretty common in some like the Caribbean Islands. Exactly. And, but it's associated with giants. It's associated with the supernatural. The sorcerers, exorcists and temple priests of Samaria were obsessed with polydactylism. The Summa Ibsu is a series of 2,800 tetralogical almonds, and they talk obsessively about what it means to have six fingers born on one hand, six on the other. The giant of gath, once again has six fingers and six toes.

and there was no genetic condition that associates polydactylism with gigantism. So it's like, yeah, so it's like, I get that if some phrechazoid has a bunch of extra digits in ancient culture might say, oh, this dude's a god or whatever.

Yeah. But it's everywhere associated with literal giant rock art of hands and feet. It's wild. And cultures that had no connection. You go out to Baja, California, El Carmen Cave, Google that.

Look at that. Giant footprint of Pinguine. I'll say this, Professor Paul Toussaint in Australia, I think the University of Kimberly, a couple of years ago, there was this story that it went around the world that like, world's oldest ancient narrative found in Australia, this Aboriginal super ancient narrative. It was the Pleiades, it was the serpent, but it was also giant feet with six digits, right? So Professor Toussan actually wrote a paper about how he found. found these examples of giant hands and feet with extra digits like in all these cultures around the world. And if you look at it, if you go to Mara, Mara Wonga, Mara Wonga, Professor Tasan, T-A-C-O-N, giant footprints, six toes.

If you Google that, you'll get, what is the conventional explanation for these footprints? Like that one right there on that rock, that guy standing next to the pingon one i could be that um you know it's like well that's 200 million years ago and granite so i don't think a giant stepped in it it could be the indigenous people carved it yeah but then it that raises its own kind of um mystery because um yeah if you could throw up mara wanga australia six-toed footprints i know that's a lot and we'll see if we get a picture of that the moral story is the androgyrogyny that I spoke of and the

polydactylism are displayed in the iconography of the oldest cities on earth Ian gazelle Jericho and they just found a 16-fingered statue at Karahantepe me Andrew Collins and Hugh Newman did an episode for ancient islands about it where say what you want but these people revered this this trait right so a Sey birch is another place that was just unearthed that's super ancient in Turkey and the dudes holding up his hand he has six fingers and the professor who did the excavation Karul from Istanbul University he said the giant um what do you say the statues of the humanoids always have extra digits or a strange number of digits never five

so the thing I'm talking about is being unearthed in real time at the oldest sites on the planet Androgyny polydactylism make of it what you want. I'm just like the story is going, has a thread through the oldest iconography in human history. And it continues like Malta, all these places. Yeah, you have six digits. Yeah, once again, I don't know, Marijuana. Is it rejecting that? Do you think these giants were responsible for some of like the megalithic structures around the world?

See, that's the tradition. So like Pizarro and other Spanish explorers, right? They show up at Soxie Waman in Peru. They show up at Lake Tidicaca and all the ruins there. And the Spanish are like, oh, these are built by demons. They don't know what to make of it. They ask the anchor. They ask Pizarro.

And they specifically said they were built by the Hawaris, the giants, after an age of darkness and cataclysm essentially. So that's what we're told because if I say, you know, I don't know if you could build that, you know, like with the tools of the time. That's not a diss against the I'mire or the Inca people. Then I'm right out of the gate like I'm some racists, you know. But then again, you know, go to Malta. It's the same story.

Right. They're like freaking Sicilian farmers. But the point is that the indigenous people have all these missing legends about giants and Stonehenge is the same way. And, oh, the Neolithic Britons, they're going to be pissed at me if I said, Giants built Stonehen, you know, it's just like, I don't want to go round and around with that. But the point is, these traditions are the things that's interesting, not my theorizing, right? So what the fuck does it mean?

You know, I don't know. Is it pure fantasy? These people who we attribute having the wherewithal to do these amazing things are telling us these kind of wild stories. So you can't have it both ways. It's like, or at least be open to the idea that there's more. going on yeah man absolutely that what is that one on the bottom with all the holes in the ground you see the one with the circular the circular carvings in the ground that's poble benito that's a that's a kiva in uh colorado and that's where the footprints going up the wall

are yeah the six six digit is this is in colorado that's in colorado wow so go to polenke and there's hands and feet all over the iconography there go to peruio go to, you know, so many places are, and it's not just because we know it's a rigid condition. It's just not associated with like some. Gigantism. Gigantism. It's literally associated with the supernatural,

the divine, the malevolent, and giants. And, you know, to any scale, you know, and hey, I've never analyzed a 10-foot skeleton. I, you know, I know why skeptics are skeptical about the idea of giants. I just like, how can all these traditions exist? How can there be giant hands and feet associated? Not just, they don't stand alone,

they're associated with giants. And the legends are. Right. Excuse me, the Cherokee, Judicolor in North Carolina, Mott Singh and Botswana, on and on and on. The Australian Aborigines, they have the same stories of malevolent, extra-digited giants

like the Native American tribes do in the Southwest. Right. It's like, I'm not like cherry picking and trying to make an argument. I'm just saying, how can it be that there is no story there? I don't know. Right. I don't have a time machine, but it's pretty interesting. I'm just curious, like, what, I wonder what the academic consensus is on that.

And, like, how do they try to explain it? I actually, my book is, like, heavily dependent on academic sources. Like, 90% of it is academic excavation reports, academic analysis. Dr. Richard Barnett wrote a paper. in 1986 about polydactylism, he says the academic world has given this subject zero attention. And he was right. He's the first one to piece together like, hold, there's this polydactalism everywhere in the ancient world, right? So there were a lot of academics who took on like Patricia Crown wrote in 2016 about how in Colorado at Chaco Canyon, the natives revered polydactalism

extra digits so there's like an um an article about that other warable and other academics wrote about polanke and mesoamerican reverence for polydactylism they call it divine polydactyl so you have different academics in isolated areas talking about it and i understand the skepticism but i would like to know just like we had professor todd dissettel evolutionary biologist on a for a show and I love Todd he's great and I asked him like how can you know what's the anthropological explanation for a skull elongation all around the world between cultures that had no contact it's the most bizarre and specific thing to do are they emulating something you know what's going on and you know he didn't have he's just like I don't know how to explain it

essentially and I agree it's just like these love levels of specificity by cultures that had no kind like when you have a kid would you elongate little baby timmy skull it is like so bizarre and so crazy goes back at least 10,000 years to China right but you have it like chalk tall a bunch of Native American tribes did it's fucking crazy you know what I mean so it's that's the kind of stuff where if it is dismissed as like garbage or or lunacy by the academics or the pseudo-sceptics people push back and they feel like these ideas aren't getting a fair shake. Right.

And then they start to believe in conspiracies and then announce some fucking TikTok rabbit hole. Right. Where the professionals should say, there's a real mystery there. I'm not going to jump to conclusions. This is what I need to see to prove the case. But that is very interesting. Common sense would tell you the level of specificity and the ubiquitous nature of these things is telling you that it's worthy of further investigation.

Yeah. So I'm trying to bridge that gap. You know, it's just like take your foot off the break a little. I mean, put your foot on the break a little. Chill out and address this as it's an interesting puzzle to solve, not a belief system of your ideological enemy, you know what I mean? Which is completely different. Totally, man.

Well, Jim, thank you for doing this, man. This has been a fascinating conversation. Super fun. Talk to you about this stuff. I love learning about this crap. You and you are really, I think you guys are really on to something with what you guys are doing and teaming up on this work. It's fascinating shit.

That's great, man. It's just being open to these. seemingly bizarre ideas is really cool. I think that's why your platform is so popular, and it's just like people dig it. And I appreciate, like, especially being, you know, to, like, give permission to men to, like, talk about difficulties, talk about depression,

talk about empathy, you know, shit like that, right? It's really important to embody a contradiction, you know, be the best of what a man is. It's not like a tough guy getting drunk at a bar and beating the shit out of someone. It's about, like, empathy and concern. And I really, that's the best part of it, that you're, we're in the same zone there.

And I really, I dig that, I appreciate it. Thank you, man. And where can people find more of your work, get in touch with you? I'm in the Witness Protection Program with fucking ancient mysteries. I'm such a loser. I got like the tech skills of an Amish preacher.

I gotta pick up my game. I'm on like Facebook. It's a picture of me and my brother at Roanoke when we're filming the Lost Colony of Roanoke. So I'm like doing this and my brother get hammers in his hand. And I get a couple dead accounts because I get freaking locked out of them.

But I'll say at Hugh site, megalithomania.org. There's a Jim Vieira section of videos. I think that's the best place. Okay. And Hugh's always like if I'm doing tours with Hugh or we're gonna do a show or something, he'll post there too.

So I talk about all this shit. Edgar Casey, fish gods, metaphysical secrets of the ancients. There's all videos there if people dig any of this stuff. Oh, you can reach out to Facebook and, you know, say hi or anything like that. Okay.

But, you know, one day I'll, like, get a tech assistant or whatever. But, no, it's fine, because I just like putting content out there. Absolutely, yeah. I don't want to push away prosperity, but I don't really want to try to overly monetize any of this. I just think it's cool and it's interesting. And I like that I can interface with both sides of the aisle, if you will. Because I got some tight friends who are like skeptics, and they were always shitting on me and shitting on Atlantis

and busting my balls, but I love them, you know what I mean? And it's not like, it's not confrontational. So thanks for everything, man. Yeah, man. I appreciate your time. Again, we've got to get you on a flight. Oh, yeah, that's true. We'll wrap it up.

All right, goodbye, world.