De-Influenced with Dani + Jordan - Jordan Was Spiraling, Dani Gets Called Out & Are Blue Zones a Scam?!

Episode Date: August 20, 2026

Things got a little TOO honest this week. 😂 Jordan admits he was fully spiraling after a chaotic few weeks of traveling, sick kids and approximately zero alone time—and Dani shares the surprisingly simple thing that apparently fixed everything overnight. Marriage with four kids, people!!! Then we get into the internet's obsession with judging parents, Dani responds to getting called "out of touch" over her minivan comments, and we ask: can anyone take a joke anymore?! Plus, we're diving into the controversy around homeschooling, the wild claims that some of what we know about Blue Zones and longevity may be based on faulty data, and whether churches and pastors should mix faith, politics and media. Basically… marriage, parenting, internet drama and a few rabbit holes we probably shouldn't have gone down. Enjoy!! Thank you to our sponsors: Cotton: Cotton is the Fabric of Our Lives. The next time you're shopping, check the tag and choose cotton. Learn more at TheFabricOfOurLives.com, and follow along at @discovercotton using #ShopCotton. Resort Pass: Visit resortpass.com/dani to get $20 off your first booking of $100 or more. That's R-E-S-O-R-T-P-A-S-S.com slash D-A-N-I, for $20 off. ResortPass—the day is yours. Storyblocks: Head to Storyblocks.com/DANI to access the human-made stock media library that's essential to my workflow. For a limited time, they're offering 15% off any annual plan, and that discount is only available through my link. Again, that's storyblocks.com/dani for 15% off annual plans. Instant Hydration: For a better way to stay hydrated, go to InstantHydration.com/Deinfluenced and use my promo code DEINFLUENCED for over 40% off your first subscription order - it's Instant Hydration's best offer available. Salt and Stone: Try Salt and Stone's discovery set to find your signature scent — Go to SaltandStone.com/DANI and use code DANI at checkout for 15% off your first order. Vionics: Use code DEINFLUENCED at checkout for 15% off your entire order at www.vionicshoes.com when you log into your account. 1 time use only. Vionic Shoes. Wearable well-being for your feet. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello and welcome back to your favorite podcast. D-influenced. New hair who dis. You like it? I told Danny this is the best that she has looked in our entire marriage. Okay, Caitlin, my girl who just did my hair. Well, don't leak her. You heard it here first.

No, she's pretty like, I feel like a lot of people know her in Nashville, but, yeah, she's the best. It looks incredible. Oh, my gosh. thinks so everybody thinks like everybody always thinks i have extensions and now i'm like i don't just divvy and good coloring divvy good coloring um happy spirit happy spirit yeah um well you look good too you got a haircut i got a haircut i went to a barbershop yeah it looks nice i used to have someone come to our house which was pretty diva that was when i was like really really busy in life you can be honest i can it was like 250 oh

I know. He was a great guy, though. Jordan. He was great. You're canceled. Two. I cannot even believe that right now. I know.

Wait, what? It was when we were like... Did they shave and massage you and wash your hair? No. Jordan. No. It was just at the house. No, honey, no.

I know. It was bad. But that was like, it was one of those things that was like a remnant of a very, very busy time. You needed to save time. No, I had to save time when I first started doing that. Like I had, we, we, we, I think you were pregnant, uh, with what summit at the time. Yeah. We like, like, Divi, I was like in an active CEO seat at Divi.

No, I know. Your business was like Forbes top career. That, I had no margin. No, I understand. But then it kind of just like linger. There were a lot of things about our routines and lifestyles in Dallas that like were kind of like that. Like we, we did these services when we were.

super busy and had no margin. And then we got stuck with them. And then we kind of got like stuck with them. So now I go to the barbershop. He goes, it's 30 bucks. He's like, babe, my, my haircuts is 30 bucks. And I was like, yeah, how much was it before? That's normal. I feel like. No, they shave my face. No, that's the best. You know what's so funny is I never cut my hair. So I have no idea how much a haircut should cost. Yeah. But I know it shouldn't be 250 for a man's hair. Yeah, no, it's not good. The other, um, the other thing about the barbershop is there's, There's not a requirement to talk. Yeah, that's nice.

Because like you go to the, the, you go somewhere for three hours. And I'm like, man, do you have to like talk for three hours? Yeah, you talk a lot. But then they also kind of, there's like parts of highlighting where they leave you alone to process. So you get like breaks and stuff. You remember I always told you like, and I want to be super clear. The guy who cut my hair in Dallas, Zach, he was awesome.

Yeah, great guy. Great guy. And I like knew him through mutual friends. So I love talking to him when he came. But sometimes like you just want to go and just like not talk. Yeah. It's the same way I feel about Ubers. You know,

totally. It's not personal. It's just like this is my time with no kids and no wife. And like I can just think. But people, you have to tell them that on the front end. Like when I get my hair and makeup done now for like a shoot or something, I'll tell I'm like,

guys, I promise I'm not being a jerk. I'm like, I'm just like really tired. I'm going to put on podcasts today. And I always kind of set that tone from the beginning or I'll be like I'm gonna put my like I always just let them know right when I sit down like hey and then some days I come in I'm like I want to talk for the full hour yeah I can't do that I feel bad but like at the barber shop like I would have much rather

you know been able to like put my headphones in or listen to a podcast or something like while they're cutting my hair and maybe I should have gotten like those those blind people sunglasses the blinders the blinders and they would have just been like confused they're like You could wear your rabians. Yeah. So anyway, but there's no culture of not talking. And so it's great. I love it.

So you just sat there. I just sat there. Yeah. That's the thing. It's like how you start the relationship with these people is how you have to end it. Oh my gosh. I know. So like if you come in hot and you're talking and then it's like you set the bar really high and then when you stop talking, people think there's something wrong.

So if you just come in and like you're just like, I'm still we don't need to have this like full conversation. You know, in 20 minutes, I have to take a call. And that's just, you know, but you have to be kind still. Yeah, no, I'm actually surprised to hear that you set the tone like that. Because usually you're such a- Oh, because I'm so worried about hurting people's feelings. Yeah, you have such a people-pleasing tendency that I am shocked to hear you say. No, don't be wrong. 95% of the time we're just chatting away.

No, for sure. And especially first impressions. Like, you know, meeting your hair girl for the first time is like, I don't know, when you say it's like kind of like meeting a spouse, like, I was with my hair person in Dallas, like almost as long as our marriage, honestly, maybe the same amount. And so it's like, it's like a marriage. Yeah. And here's the thing, like, I don't cheat on my hairstylist.

Like when I go, when I get my hair color over you, like, I stick with you. Like, we will be together through thick and thin, through postpartum hair loss, through cancellations, through the pregnancies. Like, I'm coming back to you. And so I really like this person to like me, you know, because that's another thing is like, you want them to know, like, and she doesn't know how committed I am. Like, she doesn't know that she just met like someone that's not going to leave her side. Like, I'm loyal. Like, you know, because sometimes they meet these girls and they're getting their hair done and like, they're iffy, you know, they beep up around. And like, I'm not like that. Like, you're loyal. You met your

girl. And so I really wanted it like me. So yesterday I did go in like Blink Slate. I was like, I'm willing to chat. Like I, but I sometimes, like I like talking a lot. Yeah. Like, I like talking. But there are days like, I just, you know, you just don't feel like it.

You're just off. Speaking of days where you just don't feel like it, I had to be honest with you yesterday about how it's feeling. I texted Danny and I was like, Danny, I'm mentally not well. He was, well, you, it all started in Kansas City. So we went to Kansas City for a Divi shoot.

And coming off of like our trip to coast, So Rika, like traveling is is like, yes, it's a vacation, but it's also like not with kids. It's a lot of work. And, you know, that that flight on the way home, like we were traveling for over like 48 hours essentially because we had to stay the night in Charlotte, yada, yada, get back home. Our kids are sick. That's hard. And then Jordan's parents come into town, which is great, but also like exhausting, like you're hosting and, you know. And we're getting ready for like this big trip in Kansas City like this big work trip and um so just kind of like thing after thing after thing yeah and um and because like the kids were sick there was very little

sleep too very little sleep and smith was like sleeping with us every night because he wasn't feeling good so we both just weren't sleeping a lot and we go to Kansas City and stella comes with us and of course she's like says something that hurts Jordan's feelings. I can tell one day. What did she say? You said that and she probably did. She said, well, first of all, okay, back up. You were messing with her because you love to mess with Stella.

Stella, like, the running joke in our family is like, Stella doesn't like jokes. Like she doesn't like when Jordan messes with her. And Jordan's like very sarcastic with her. And like, I don't know, you just love to like push her buttons. And it's probably fun for you because. she gets so annoyed so easily, so fast. Yeah. And so you're pushing her buttons and you're like messing with her.

And so then like coming off of that, she's kind of a mommy's girl right now. Oh my gosh. She's such a mommy's girl. And Jordan goes, you know, I'm going to call Stratton because Stratton would want to hang out with me. And still was like, yeah, go call Stratton, going out with Stratton. And then you say something like, do you even love me? And she goes, no, I love mommy the most. Yeah, that's something like that.

And it hurt you. It took it too far. It was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, this just got real. I know. I was like, I even felt it. I was like, Stella, like, oh, give your daddy a hug. Like, you know, it was like, one of her. She's like, no, he's messing with me.

He's joking with me. He's calling me a tutu-tunana. She hates them. We call her tutunata. It gets her so mad. And so. Um, so yeah, like I could just tell like that that was like the start of you like kind of spiraling. Yeah.

And then the whole shoot, the whole thing the next day was like kind of all about me. So he didn't get a lot of attention. And then, um, we got back from that trip and I just, yeah, he was like your, your cup was empty. And so he's texting you and I'm getting my hair done. And he's like, I'm falling into depression. I'm like not doing well. Like, babe, I'm really struggling. Like I just feel like nobody cares.

cares about me. Like I don't know what to do. Like I'm really not, I'm not okay. And then. Well, so time out. So I think this is like actually kind of a relatable topic because, um, basically like with four kids, I think what started to spiral in my head is we have four kids. And I think that when like because Smith is coming out of the newborn phase, there's been a couple like very humanizing things. that have happened to me and in our marriage that have made me feel like, oh my gosh, we have four kids. Number one is the lack of alone time we have individually and collectively between you and I.

Zero alone time. Yeah. Like they want to be with us all of the time. Like you couldn't even have gotten your hair done. I could, I couldn't go to the barber shop because Stratton was like, and I get it because I had been away from Stratton for two days. He was like, can I come? And so I was like, please can I?

I'm like, I'm going to be there for three hours. She came with me. And she didn't want to leave. And like I grew up loving to be alone. Like I'm so like Stratton where it's like I like to be in my own little room or my own little corner and like have my alone time. And I get none of it. I don't even go to the coffee shop in the morning and I'm alone because they're like,

I take three children. They wake up and they're like, we go to the coffee shop dad? And I golf cart us to the coffee shop because the three children want to come with me. And then of course they like reek havoc. And so it's, it's really tested. Like, I think as you have kids, whatever selfishness you have, like, you get married and that rips a lot of selfishness out of you. But you still have your time.

You still have your time. And then, like, having one kid, more selfishness to more selfishness. Having four kids, it's kind of to the point where it's like, I feel like I have nothing. Like, it's semi-abusive. I have nothing to myself. Yeah. Like nothing. Really, I feel like I have nothing.

And we have great help and we have resources. And all you want is for your daughter to say, Daddy, I love you. Right. And so that has been hard on me personally. And then in our marriage, I think I started a doom spiral of being like, oh my gosh, like, what did we do? When Smith was sick, we were pretty much like in go mode from like 5.30 to like 8 o'clock. Whereas Smith usually will go to bed at seven and then like we have these little rituals that are so small but are so critical to rely on like we get together. We can talk. It's just me and you. We sit in bed. Like you know. Now we don't have that. And we watch a show. And then that was taken away coming off Costa Rica. And also taken away was any sense of like or space for like physical engagement between us. So let me just like fast forward a little bit.

Let me just get to the punchline. No, no, no, let me just tell you. Okay. So he's going down this spiral. He's spiraling. Babe, I'm not okay. I'm struggling. Nobody loves me.

I don't know what to do. Our marriage is it ruined? I come home. We do it. He likes up this morning. He's like, I feel great. I feel great. I'm back.

No, I feel great. He's like, that's all I needed. He's like, I feel so loved. Y'all, that was literally. No, it was all. It really struck me as like how simple. He was like falling into a depression. No, I was falling into a depression.

Men are so weird. I really was like I don't matter in this family. I feel so lonely. And then like that I could I could take four children to Costa Rica by myself right now and be totally filled up. He makes up. He's like, I'm loved. I feel good. What are we doing today?

You want me clean the whole house? He's like, I'll clean the whole house. What do you want? I was like, got men are so weird. Like it's so. Y'all, he was standing like he was like, you were going into the deep end. No, I was, though. I was sitting in a bookstore, sitting in a little kid's chair while Stratton was reading a book.

And I was like, texting me like, I'm not okay. I was like, I need to tell her. Because I was like, kind of trying to get out of my own head. And then we got home and we had this conversation before. And I was like, all right, so tell me what you're feeling. And he was like basically trying to diagnose like an issue in our marriage or an issue of like what I was feeling towards him or maybe, I don't know. We were just trying to diagnose it. And I was like, babe, I don't think that there's anything wrong.

Like, I think that it's just was traveling, then sickness, then another travel, than this. And then I think Stella is saying that thing kind of just set you over the edge, you know, and the whole thing in Kansas City was like very exhausting for you because it was like a lot of, you know, all this stuff. And, um, and I was like, babe, I just don't think that there's anything wrong. I think it's just, it's all circumstantial. It's seasonal. You know, my theory was like, we just had to bang it out. My theory was that, um, you know, you.

you weren't feeling affectionate towards me because I was making you carry more mental load in like the marriage. No, and I was like, I'm not stressed. Which I think is a very common thing for like females and wives to feel. I'm not stressed. I mean, yes, there was a mental load because of the circumstances, but it wasn't anything you were doing. It's like, yeah, a kid is sick, therefore I am worried. Therefore I like, but it's not like, I'm like, oh, this is Jordan's fault. Or like, I had a, I had a thing in Kansas City, therefore I am a little bit more.

stressed in normal, but that's not your fault. Like, it just is what it is. No, I mean, like, you know how like Christian, like older Christians, like, they're always like talking about like the importance of your sex life. Intimacy. And intimacy and like just like how, I always kind of was like, I feel like y'all are just like old and weird, you know, talking about that stuff. But now that we have four kids, I'm like, oh, I now understand the importance of the role

in like keeping us together within that. Because if that is like taken away, then I can see how resentment or just distance would brew on both sides. Yeah. You know, but we got to be careful because that's how that's how we got to four kids too. So I'm like, we can't just be playing with fire here. If you impregnate me again. No, I, I don't want to. But you also won't let me get a vasectomy.

So that's weird. I'm like, what do you want here? I just want to give it a couple years. You never know where we're going to be in a couple years. Right. You know. But anyway, we're great today. We're so great.

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Oh my gosh, absolutely. Especially in Texas and soon to be Tennessee. We can't really fake it through the summer in the wrong clothes, especially me. You know why? Why? I get rashes. You are very sensitive. I need very breathable clothes. You need very, no, literally like something very, very breathable.

And somehow I always know if it's going to make me break out in a rash by just touching it. I know. I do. I become the person checking tags now, especially with spring and summer clothes. I always look for cotton because it just feels lighter and more comfortable to me. I've actually started doing that with my basics too. Also, do you hear about like this giant pushback on like polyester and other clothes? No, especially for your skin because it's so sensitive. Your cotton basics have helped you a ton. Yeah, I don't really break out like hives, but it's definitely what did they call it?

Allergies. No, they call it. Exema? Sorriasis. Sorriasis. Something like that. But 100%. I can always tell a difference when I'm wearing a car. cotton tea versus something else. My skin doesn't really feel itchy or sensitive after. And also,

I think it's one of those things where you don't have to choose between comfort and style anymore. Some of my favorite pieces are just like super basic cotton. No, babe, trust me. I know. I see your rotation of your t-shirts. I get so mad. I'm like, at least choose a different color. But I love that cotton works year round too. Weather changes so much. It's changing like every five seconds. So layering is everything. So true. It's freezing in the morning. It's hot by lunch. Somehow India getting dinner. I mean, what's going on? No, Texas weather is honestly just bipolar like that. It really is.

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find your signature sent. Go to Saltandstone.com slash Danny and use code Danny at checkout for 15% off your first order. That's Salt andstone.com slash Danny and use code Danny for 15% off your first order. The one thing I was going to talk about related to like health and wellness is that's health and wellness. You brought up a last week something that I didn't know about that the blue zones were fraudulent. Yeah. So I researched it. It's like,

have you like dug into this? I went down like a chat, you know, rabbit hole. It's so fascinating. So basically here I wrote some things down. A lot of people say it's like because the censuses or whatever

are not accurate because it's only. It's pension fraud. Okay, yeah, I did read about that. It's pension fraud. Like here's a couple things that were so interesting. So the blue zones for those of all that don't know,

it's like, five areas in like all of, I think it's all over the entire world, like where people statistically live longer. Like they typically live to be up like into the one hundreds. Yes, centurions. Sure. Yeah, 100 plus. Yeah. And so like they find these like areas where there's a bunch of people living 100 plus. Then like it was like a national geographic guy, Dan something that found these spots, then commercialized it, created like books and Netflix series. So then everyone becomes obsessed with the blue zones. And why this is important is they started studying the lifestyles of these people like,

oh, plant-based diet or this, this. And so it became more common knowledge of like, oh, if you do these things. To build off of that. It's related to longevity. Yeah. Well, so then what happened was this guy named Saul Justin Newman started digging into it. And this was recently and started finding that most of the like pension fraud and unreported deaths are rampant in all of these areas. Japan found 230,000 centenarians missing or

dead. In Greece, audits show 70% of claimed centurions already dead. Costa Rica sentencing's corrections revealed 42% age misstatements. So basically what was happening is for pension's sake, which is like you getting paychecks after you know, while you're still alive but old. They were just misreporting or fraudulently reporting. to get the checks. And so why were they doing it in all those beautiful areas? Well, I mean, I don't know, but isn't Okinawa one of the places that the bomb went off? Oh, I don't know.

Yeah, I think, well, that was like a, I know it was like a big battleground in World War II. I don't know if it was like. Yeah, but they're beautiful places still. Yeah, they're beautiful places. But most of the people who were actually 100 plus were living in like poverty and were not following any type of like, strict plant-based diet or anything like that. And so the thing that's like coming out about it that is interesting is that, you know, we have to kind of rethink a lot of the dietary guidance and all of these things that came out that we were saying, oh, if you do this.

But everything that they were suggesting was just pretty like common sense. It was like some of it, some of it. But like they eat like heavily like local fruits and vegetables. It's like, yeah, that makes sense. There's not pesticides. Like they move. They walk a lot. They walk a lot. They have community. Now there was like the whole red wine thing.

I remember that was like in the book. Plant-based diet. That's now super in debate. It wasn't plant-based. It was heavily. They eat a lot of plants like vegetables and fruits. The only thing that, so there's this study called the Harvard study of adult development. Have you ever heard of this?

No kids. Yeah. Okay. It's been running since 1930. And it's like the longest. study on like adult longevity and happiness. And the whole study like studies, what do you smoke? What do you drink? What do you eat? All these things. But they basically concluded that the most important thing for longevity is like not

quantity of relationships, but quality of like a few warm depth connections to friends or family members. Yeah. And that is one thing. I think the blue zones got right. You know, like I remember when they were talking about like the Icarians in Greece. They were talking about how like they didn't really have a specific bedtime, but they would just stay up late and play games and like with their friends. And they would kind of wake up on their own time. And it just makes. That sounds like heaven to me. Like I think it is. The pressure I feel to go to bed at a certain hour like probably is taking years off my life. Because I'm so worried about feeling tired the next day. But like I remember not having kids. And,

just being like, I'll wake up when I wake up, you know. Well, okay, this is kind of random, but Krista Horton. Yeah. Okay, one time she... I think about this moment all the time whenever she brought her baby in the Duna to our house. Yes. Okay, so Krista Bryce Horton. Okay, we have one kid at the time.

She's probably going to live to be like 120 years old. No. Both of them. I think both of them. So... She's like not a stressed person. Krista Horton, we had one kid and we were very rigid with our first kid. We were like those parents that were like, oh, well, we don't miss

nap times and we don't miss bed times. And I'll never forget, she has three. So we actually have more kids than her now, which is crazy because I remember being like, oh my gosh, Krista Horton has so many kids. I also felt the same way about Amber Massey and we're only one away from the same amount of kids that they have now. But, um, well, and she has twins. So she really only had four pregnancies. Yeah. So Krista comes over to our house and I remember, you know, she was over until like 1 a.m. Yeah. And she was just carting around her baby in a duna and was like, ah, like, we'll get an Uber when we're ready.

Like, Bryce will call the driver. It's amazing. People like that live longer. They're not stressed. Because like, and I remember being like, oh my gosh, I don't know if I could live like with the structure that they like roll with as a family. Yeah. But I'm kind of like, I think they're actually doing it right.

No, I know. Like, who cares if their kids sleep until nine or 10 during the summer? The thing I've noticed about a lot of families like that is their kids go to bed later, so their kids sleep later too. True. But ours, like, we go to bed later, they still wake up at five. And it might be just the age of our kids. Like, maybe, like, as they get older, they'll sleep in later or something like that.

Yeah. The problem with our age is that they don't really get up without us either. Like, Summit sleeps in a crib. So he's just going to cry. Yeah, we have to get up. No, I mean, we have to, like, be pretty, I don't know, discipline about our going to bed. but but yeah sleeping is like stressful for me because I'm like just always trying to get enough of it yeah Dylan the Favours I've noticed that about them too like they're more chill they're more chilled

they're like hey like we just had a long layover but like let's still go to this force Frank concert and stay out till midnight yeah like I just don't I don't know if it's us or just the age of our kids that make us not able to have that type of freedom I think I think it's really Smith right now yeah or five month six months he's like six six months now. Yeah. You know, your parents were in town. I have a question. How, I've been thinking about this a lot. How do you feel about disciplining our children in front of our parents? Isn't that weird? Isn't that like a weird concept? No. Did something happen? No, I just, I felt there were times I had to get on to our kids, but your parents were there and I felt like weird about it. Did they make

make you feel weird? No, it was just totally me. Nothing to do with them. Yeah. Um, like, don't you also think that they're thinking in their head like, but I was just disciplining you. Probably. Isn't it crazy? And they probably have opinions about like how we handle situations. That was probably the biggest thing. Like, oh, do they think I'm being like a hard ass right now? Or like, probably. Like, what are they thinking? I'm going to be honest. I think that anyone that is around Stella is like yeah get her like like she's she is stubborn as a mule and like so hard-headed like she thinks she's the boss baby I tell her that all the time I go hey hey you're not the boss baby I say you are not the boss baby anymore like you know and I think that anyone who's around

Stella is like yeah like that was necessary okay stratton is tough because you the way that you have to discipline him is like he just has these like outbursts that are so like not necessary. But I understand everything. I'm just wondering if people, if that was just like a me thing. Like do you like I guess I'd ask like the audience like whenever you are disciplining your children in front of your parents, do you feel weird too? Do you feel like you're being studied and watched and like awkward? I actually feel more studied and watched when they're misbehaving.

Oh, because like what are you going to do about it? What are you going to do about it? Kind of, but also like, oh my gosh. Like, like it's almost like a reflection of our parenting if our kids are like doing something wrong or crazy. And I'm like, I feel more judged in those moments. Yeah. But I think my standard MO lately has been like, hey, I'm not going to do this in front of anyone. Let's go out on the back porch or like let's go like let's go talk in the other room.

Yes. And that way it's like a private and punish privately. Yeah. It's like a private sort of like talking to. or punishment. Yeah. And then once they calm down, they go back out. I feel like that's been kind of my emo.

Even in front of like our babysitters or nannies, like I just don't want to do any of that. Yeah. It is really hard to like, I don't know, punish or discipline in public. I always am very a kind of, I always just feel like weird about it. No, for sure. I feel like people are judging me if I'm. And sometimes like maybe I'm not doing it right. Well, especially in this day and age too.

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it's instant hydration's best offer available that's instant hydration.com slash de-influenced promo code de-influenced they were coming home from a what's the football team in Arizona cardinals yes cardinals football game football practice and they had their two and four year old and they the parents were like heavily intoxicated and made their kids walk home from a practice for three hours and 108 degree weather heat and like the police came and like were I don't know if they got arrested but they got in trouble for like basically what's it called children like child neglect not child neglect like abuse essentially but then there was like another couple that were being blasted online because they took their like two or three kids on a really intense hike and their kids were all wearing like crocs and sliders yeah and people were like filming

being like, this is child abuse and everybody's like, mind your own business. Like they're fine. They're fine. They're in support mode. Yeah. I mean, I hate the internet. Like I just feel like people like know too much and have opinions about too much. They have opinions about too much.

And like I feel like they think that they're so quick to believe that they're just by protecting the children. Right. Which 100 degree. No, like maybe that. Truly three hours and 100. Yeah. I'm like,

I get it. And they called the place. So it must have actually like been like a thing and like made caused a scene. And like their parents were probably like publicly intoxicated type of thing. Yeah. But like, dude, I went to six flags for like six hours a day when it was like 105 with my parents. The one that gets me that blew up on TikTok is did you see that lady in veil,

the doctor? No. So there was this lady. You should like try and watch the clip because I'm so curious. Like before I even say anything. that's the thing is just like I hate the internet. Like for, I love the internet,

but I hate it. It's like the amount of people that can have opinions about every single thing now is insane. Okay. This is it. And no parents are perfect. Okay. Don't, don't read it.

Just watch this, the clip. I don't know how rough that was, but like I feel like we've all kind of done it. He's a big baby too. He's not like small. So, okay.

So what you have in. this clip is you have someone who's filming yeah for whatever reason this mom i'm sure the baby's going ballistic someone pulls out their phone and starts filming and the mom doesn't know that she's being filmed and so then she's like like i'm sure the baby like i know the duna so the baby probably kicked up yeah and then and then like it and then she like forced him because sometimes they they kick up and so like their neck like their chin is touching their chest which you're worried about like if they can breathe at that point so sometimes you have to like lift them up and reposition them which he does this baby is probably over maybe a year old so like he's he's like at that point

where it's like you're holding on to the duna because you're like you don't want to go to like a bigger stroller but he's probably he's kind of big for it's kind of big for it baby think about this like when Summit is like overly tired cannot be calm down. Yeah. So he's like kicking and screaming and then she kind of like pushes him down. So the internet rallied around this clip and basically she's like a prominent doctor, I think tries to get her fired, tries to get her put in jail. Oh my gosh for like child abuse.

No. And I, I remember like as a parent being like, I guarantee you that that kid was like irate. Yeah. And you know, she probably had like a moment. of frustration. It's like a little aggressive. It's a little aggressive. I'm not going to lie.

She probably wouldn't have been proud of the moment. But like, but like we've all had maybe, um, within your parenting, like if you're parenting your kids up until, you know, they're 15,

16 years old like this, like you're gonna have a moment that you're not proud of. Okay. Yeah. Nobody's perfect. Right. And hers was filmed and posted.

Right. And so, you know, to your point about disciplining your kids, like I feel like the internet is so, thirsty for moments like that kid is fine like I'm sorry that kid is fine like no I agree that he probably went down for a nap and was like mom can I have ice cream tonight like yeah but these non it's like these young non parent kids that have the loudest opinions about

well I had a girl what is I can't remember her name now um she has like 500,000 followers I think and last week she made this whole like series on her stories. I didn't read everything because I kind of get the just of it, but I didn't like listen to everything, but she was like, can we talk about Danny Austin for a second? And it was a clip from our last podcast or a couple podcasts ago about how I was like making fun, ever joking about the fact that like I felt kind of silly rolling up in my green van to like my minivan to like mom's night out with like all my friends were driving like lifted, Black cars, Black Expedition, Black Explor, whatever.

It's a joke. And it was like a joke. Like, it's like, dude, I'm obviously not going to get, like, I'm not actually going to get a new car because I feel insecure about it. Like, it was just silly, joke. Like, if you know my humor, like, you know, I want to be able to go on this podcast and talk like I would actually talk to a friend. But when everybody, like, takes these little things and wants to get offended about everything, you can't have fun anymore. It's like, you can't be honest. You can't be joking.

You can't like obviously it was a joke. And so she like made this whole thing. She's like, I just went and unfollow Danny Austin because, you know, she's like so like out of touch. Like she wants to get a new car because she's insecure about rolling up to mom's night. Like people can't eat. And I'm like, dude, it was a joke. Like it like seriously like. It's really no.

But I can't remember. Like and I looked at our DMs and I had messaged her before being like, dude, it was a joke. So she just seems like one of those people that like doesn't get. my sense of humor. And if you don't get my suits to humor, honestly. So they took a clip from this podcast basically? No, it was a clip that we posted. Like obviously I wouldn't post it if I was actually being like, yeah, I'm insecure about my minivan that I'm obsessed with by the way. Like I drive it everywhere. I love that car. I was just totally like teasing. I don't know. It was just a funny moment whenever it's like do do too like you pull up in a green minivan when all your friends

are driving like black cars. Like I don't know. Yeah. It's just not. And it's like whenever you take everything so serious, like you take the fun out of creating content. And then you wonder, Danny, why aren't you honest or transparent about everything? It's like because like you guys are not fun. Like you take the fun out of it. Like just like seriously loosen up and like, you know? Yeah. It's like and that's why I like the podcast is because I feel like I can have a little bit more fun than I can have on like Instagram or reels or stories.

But then it's like people like that just prove it. And then people are like, you know, I'm. I didn't get any hate about, I typically don't get hate about stuff like that. Right. Because you are who you are. You're raised a certain way. And I was raised by a scarcity mom. Like we were always going poor, but we weren't.

But that was how I was raised. Like we were, everything was always scarcely. Well, it's because she was raised by, she had seven, seven siblings. She was one of five, but the oldest of five, but I don't, sorry. right, we weren't ever going poor. She was always just like thought we were because that's how she was raised. So like we are always scarcity minds that like, you know, if they charge you for three bananas, we have to drive an hour back to the grocery store to be charged for two bananas. Like, you know, and so you are who are. That's how you're raised and like you can't take that

out of someone. Like you just can't. And so I don't usually get comments like that. So when I joke about it, I'm obviously like joking about it, you know? And it's just like, dude, like lighten up a little bit like you're so uptight like your panties are so in a bundle yeah I don't I don't think we struggle with materialism I don't even I really don't I don't think we're attached like let's don't get me wrong I like a nice vacay I like a nice thing here like whatever but I just like dude if you're I don't know I don't know the one thing that has really confused me on this topic about non-parents and opinions on TikTok towards parents is what's happening to the LeBranes right now. I think we touched on this last time. But you didn't really

know what was going on. I didn't really know what's going on. I am shook by like TikTok's opinions on this homeschooling thing. And I don't know if it's because like I now have such a heart and understanding for these parents who are homeschooling, especially like there's a big homeschooling seen in Nashville. The heart of it is we care about our kids deeply. We want to teach them the values of our family, which is typically- Well, that's the problem that people have. Every family has different missions and values and talents and gifts and et cetera. Well, the issue was that they felt like they were going to not teach their children, like, everything and just kind of, like, indoctrinate them.

I get that. And I think it was said, no, it was, it was clip from a live, right? I know. And that's why, like, it was like a free flowing conversation. It's like, free flowing conversation. And, like, you know what she means. And I don't know them personally, but like. But you don't know what she means if you take just one aspect of what she was saying and

probably an hour long live and clip it and then contort it to what you want your argument to be. Like you don't really know what she's saying. Or like why rat on like the whole system and the whole idea if you just don't agree with like one family or one person. It's like just because you don't agree with one person doesn't mean that everybody does it wrong. Like but here's the craziest thing. For the majority I mean I think people want to homeschool because they love their kids. They want to protect their kids. And I I did see like another big influencer making like having commentary about it. And it's like dude, you have your kids in like a really a really prestigious, like nice private school. Like not every neighborhood has, you know, an amazing

schooling system or public school or whatever. Like, and a lot of these teachers are not being treated well and not, and they're burnt out because they're not being treated well by like the family or the community or whatever. And so I think that at a certain point, like, I think they're just kind of looking at their personal circumstances and being like, oh, this would be best for our family. yeah no for sure and like I know what influencer you're talking about and 100% they're probably in elite private schools yeah so it's hard to have like but that's the problem with kind of like this elitist mindset is it's like oh this is what you need to do to funnel them through this like system you're not doing it this system then you send your kids to some of those schools

you do it yeah no that's always like the thing is like is like oh well you should be doing this and it should be done by like qualified educators. Well, that's not available to like most middle American families. Like that you're having to choose between this public school that your district into or homeschooling. Right. So to blanket the statement. And it's not even just about education. It's like kids are brutal.

Kids are mean. Bullying. Like being set up into like this system where people like don't or these families maybe around not every neighborhood has that community where like the families actually care about your children. Like I don't know. And especially with just like how much there is now out in the world to like want to homeschool your kids and protect them from a lot of like the crazy things that are out there. Safety alone is like a crazy thing now.

And so it's like not every family can homeschool. Not every family can private school. Not every family can public school. But like having an opinion about it and making seem like one choice is better than the other is probably what annoys me the most. Yeah, because several of these families that do homeschool in Nashville, like, like some of the kids are homeschooled. Some of them are better going to like this public school.

Like it's not a one size. Yeah, it's not a one size fits all. When you homeschool, you typically go through like these programs that you're like, right? They have like homeschooling programs that like curriculum. Yeah. Sorry curriculum. Yeah. You're not just like literally.

And then she mentioned on that live. She's like, yeah, and I use chat, she BT. I'm like, great. I think that's a great resource. I use it all the time to learn stuff. stuff. Well, and so are your public school teachers. Dude, like, Chachinuu is like a great way to learn. And I know people are like ragging on that. And I'm like, I always am like, can you explain where we're two to me? Like I'm five. And I learned so much more that way than I would going

and pulling out a massive textbook and looking and pulling through all the chapters. Like, I don't know. I don't see anything wrong with that. The, the, so listen, if you have an opinion about like the Lebran's or homeschooling, like I don't mind that. Like, I think that, like, I think that, you can have an opinion about whether homeschooling is good or bad. For me, two things that bother me the most. One is that most of the talking head videos I saw, like clearly they look like 21 to 25 year olds.

Yeah, like, dude, you have no idea. You know, they don't really seem like they, like, have kids or anything like that. And then second is their answer to what the Lebrantz are doing wrong. is you need to funnel them to a qualified education system or a qualified teacher. So you're basically saying like, hey, I actually think what's best for your kids is for an underfunded state education run program to be schooling them where they're sitting in a home for eight hours a day under fluorescent light, taught one teacher per 35 kids. like what you're pressing as the alternative makes no sense it makes no sense like as a blanket

solution to the problem and like that's what's so weird about just the the divide in america is like it's like there's people who don't not trust institutions just are like hey i don't think institutions are entirely good at like looking at the individual and then you have people who are like institutions should be fully trusted. And it makes no sense because institutions have failed us for forever historically. And so it's like if the institution has failed us, which I'm like kind of, I don't know, I have a hard time because like I love my public school and I love. I had a great public school education too.

Yeah. And I know that things. You it's so. But no, there were some, but there were some like neighborhoods like neighboring neighborhoods where my friends went and it was like a very different experience. You and I both lived in upper middle class neighborhoods. So that means like the institutions that were available to us were far better than like an inner city Dallas school system. Right. So to blanket and say, oh, qualified education, qualified educators, that's entirely based on your socioeconomic status. Right, right. You know,

and so your argument and hatred towards this family that's like just trying to do their best. And yes, they have means and I totally get that. And if your argument is that they should have a tutor or a qualified educator that supports them in their homeschooling, they are. It's a co-op. Yeah, no, I mean, I agree, though. It is exhausting, just like feeling like you. It's kind of getting out of control.

It's getting out of hand. The talking heads. The talking heads, the opinions. The talking heads are getting way out of control. The filming people that don't want to be filmed, you know, the outing of families and moms, and trying to take down people. Like it is, it's getting, it's like next level. And I just feel like we all kind of need a minor on business.

This actually reminds me too about, you know, the Shibuzi. Have you seen like the Shibuzzi deal that just happened? I want to read this because I think that this is like part of the problem. I learned this term. It was coined by this guy named Peter Turchin. And it's called Elite Overproduction. and it basically says that a society trains far more credentialed status-seeking people than there are elite track positions to absorb them.

And the excess becomes a pool of frustrated, capable, surplus elites, people who did everything right and still can't get the seat that they were promised. Turchin argues that this glut is a leading indicator of political instability, idle, ambitious, credentialed people become counter-elites and go looking for a fight. This is one that is hard. So basically this theory is like this is what happened kind of in like a lot of like the war-torn countries is that you have an overeducated class of like I went to college. I took out student loans. I did this.

Well, then AI comes in and starts displacing these people because it's like we don't need lawyers. We need AI. We don't need mathematicians. We have AI. And I really feel like that's what's happening. And so if you study it over history, what happens? is you have these like college educated, did everything right individuals,

and they end up turning against the system. And it really kind of starts festering into resentment and hatred. And so they become almost like, they take that education and they go against, you know, a lot of the things that are not institutionalized. So that you're saying like that going against would be homeschooling.

Going against would be homeschooling. So like my, this is kind of a random story, but we were having barbecue in Nashville and someone who followed you came up to us. And she was in Seattle, super sweet girl. And she had studied, like health and epidemiology. Epidemiology, like a really like narrow track like within the healthcare system.

And she was with her mom and we were like, oh, like how's it going? She's like, I don't know. She's like, I've been looking for a job for like three years. And I remember her saying this because I really empathize with her. She goes, I don't, really understand. I did really good work. Like I had a really good dissertation. I did everything right.

I don't know why I can't find a job. And I remember feeling for her so much in that moment. And it connected me with this theory. And I think that there's a lot of young people right now who did everything right. But there's not enough jobs like requiring this like elite, you know, you know, social class structure. And so therefore that festered. into anger and pessimism towards the entire system. And it makes so much sense because I think that that's what's going on. Like I think a lot of these... Do you think that's why a lot of people are homeschooling? No.

Apparently homeschooling is like blowing up right now. No, I don't think that this has anything to do with homeschooling. This for me explains a lot about the talking heads on TikTok. Oh. It doesn't really for me like that's why I don't... I am frustrated by the talking heads on TikTok, but I'm at the same time not because most of the talking heads that, are like talking about something like the LeBrands homeschooling.

In my opinion, they are educated, they're kind of elitist in their mindset, they really want to trust the system and they're like, you should be using qualified educators. Like that's their thing and there's like, I know so many people who studied education. Why is this mom educating her kids with no background? So it's this mindset of like, why are you not hiring qualified people you're using AI to do this? And I think it's part of this like elite over production theory that we have too many college educated white collar minds in America when AI is starting to display, you know, displace that.

Does that make sense? And so where that festers is on TikTok in the form of these talking heads being like, let me give you my opinion of why I'm not like, why are you rich and successful influencer whenever I studied this and I did this and I get it. I get their frustration. Yeah. And I actually don't really, I think if you really want to get doomsday with this, I don't really know where this goes. Because historically speaking, when this happens to civilizations or societies, it inevitably ends up leading to class warfare, which is like civil war or the collapse of an empire because the collapse of TikTok. No, no, like truly the system,

And this is why, you know, and I'm not taking a political stance on this. This is why Mondami or whoever is in New York is rising to power so quickly because he's hearing the woes of this class of educated people who are like, hey, I did everything right, but I can't even afford to live here. Right. And their answer is like we want some one version of the answer is like we want representatives of the government to hear this. Bernie Sanders is a great example of this like wipe out student debt or make education. free. And like, I'm not saying what's right or wrong, but this is kind of what's starting to happen. It's been going on for like 10 years. And I think that what the Lebrantz are experiencing of like,

you're not qualified to educate your kids is the same. It's probably a little bit of that. But wouldn't you also say it's a little bit of like, I think people like to attack their family because like of also probably what they believe, what they put out there. I don't really know much about them beyond like I mean they obviously are Christians like they've posted a lot of like pro life like you know stuff like that and so people know like they are believers and I think that that probably annoys people too well tick tick to tick talks seems like a very like it just seems like a very like urban centric platform meaning like it's a lot of like city dwellers that are like posting and like you know what do they call it like

chronically online. You know, it's a lot of chronically online people. And unfortunately, those chronically online people don't really understand the culture of like rural or small town America at all. Yeah. And so it's like, hey, let me let me like talk about small town America, which Franklin is small town. You know, Nashville I would say is like small town feel. Let me talk about this based on every headline that I've read on CNN. And so there's just this like vast misunderstanding of who these people are, like what family values are. Like what I guarantee if like a lot of these people and this happened during COVID, so many people from New York or L.A.

I meet them at the coffee shop like every day. They're like, oh yeah, I moved from New York and I was really worried about moving here. But like this is the best thing I've ever experienced. I think if you came here and experienced the culture and experienced the community, it would just vastly change your opinion on what you're commenting on these families like trying to homeschool their kids on right it's just pride the yeah i've said this so many podcasts like it's intellectual pride that drives me nuts just not being open-minded like i feel like the people that hate me the most try to be very intellectual about they do my the the hatred they have towards me

it's kind of funny no like how much they try to like assign terms or words or or, yeah, it's like they're trying of like, they're, it's almost like they have like this dissertation on me. Like they feel like they've studied, you know? Yeah, no, I think that that's. It's like a PowerPoint slide. It's, it's narcissistic in a way because it's like, it's like I know best because I went to school and I studied this.

And it's like, you know, you really don't. Like I think so much, so much of like curious like intellectual people. Like I mean, so many. of them are humble enough to be like, I don't really understand this, but I want to understand this. That's why I love learning because I'm like, oh, I want to approach this subject with an open mind. Here's the thing. I think the core at like the core root of the issue with a lot of of these talking guys, all these people that have all these opinions is they so badly like want to be seen. Like they're probably feeling really lonely and they really want attention.

And their their lives are not interesting enough to just like post. normal content and have people follow them. Not that their lives are not. That sounded mean, sorry, but just it is what it is. Like, it's very competitive now. And so if you're just posting like normal content that doesn't like rile some feathers, like it's just probably not going to do well because the only reason I feel like I'm able to do that is because I started 15 years ago. Like, I'm lucky. Like, you know? Yeah. And but people that are trying to do that now, like I don't know what advice to give you because it's so competitive. So I think that they're not getting attention in that way. And so then they know, man, the only way I'm like, I'm going to really get like some

attention, some like momentum going is if I make a video about the Libranth or if I make a video about like how horrible Danny is right now or make a video. And because to me, I don't, I don't truly, I don't believe that they're actually coming from like seeking justice. I really think they're seeking attention. And I think it works because then you get all these other people that haven't felt seen. And they're like, oh my gosh, I feel so good that you feel. feel this way now we can all be, now we can all be seen in our opinion together. And so they kind of rile together and they're like, I'm gonna make a video, video about that too.

And so I really think that a lot of it just comes from a place of like just not feeling filled up in like other areas of your life. And so, yeah. I even see it now with like this makeup artist that gets attacked or Shibuzi, like everybody is hating on Shibuzi, he was like floating down a river while this bride was getting married and they're taking wedding. wedding pictures and Shibuzis in the background with like a beer being like, hey. And like everybody is like hating on Shibuzi now because he was floating down the river in the

middle of somebody's wedding. And you have all these people from the wedding party like making videos about it. Like it's like this is my time to shine. Like I can finally get the attention that I need and I want. So like let me go and make an opinion about it because if I don't, I won't be seen. Yeah. And so I think it's just like a really quick and fast way like like really get to the root of it. it's it's something to do with like who you are and not feeling enough. Well yeah and I think the and that's why you feel the need to talk about other people is because there's something going on in in here. I think that's the personal side of it. I think that like the societal side of it is really like

again I think this like elite overproduction theory is that everyone's trying to find their place in society right so you go like you want to be a part of a certain class, you want to be in a certain neighborhood, and you go to schools, like, thinking, like, this is what my future is going to look like. And that's why I empathize with the talking heads, because I'm like, man, I get it. Like, if you did everything right and you didn't feel seen by society or in the right sort of like socioeconomic state and you're burdened by student loans, like, I get it. This actually is kind of funny.

It might kind of play into this. but have you heard about how all these helicopter parents are entering, like the workplace by like with their Gen Z kids? Have you heard about this? Yeah, like they're like going, they're like calling bosses. So helicopter averaging is apparently following Gen Z into workplace. A new trend called career co-piloting has parents getting involved in their adult kids careers from editing resumes.

Oh, that's normal. And contacting hiring managers. That's kind of normal. To negotiating salaries and even getting involved in performance reviews. That's weird. The wildest stat, 20% of Gen Ziers surveyed, said they'd had a parent attend a job interview with them. That seems. There's no way.

There's no way. Where is this coming from? There is another side. Gen Z is facing a tough job market with fewer entry-level opportunities in growing competition as AI changes traditional early career roles. Where is the line between helping your adult kids and doing too much? I think it's way before showing up to a job interview. I can't. I like don't believe that.

That's tough. I have no exposure to that culture. I mean, I could never in a million years. Well, let me ask you this. If somebody came to divvy a job interview with their parents, absolutely not. I'm just thinking about it. I'm like, no.

No, I'm like, I always am like trying to like empathize and be like, okay, how did we get here? Okay, well, let's think. No, I mean, that would be, no, okay, but what's the difference between that and, like, nepotism? Oh, my gosh, please. No, truly. What do you mean nepotism? Like, just being born into the family?

No, no, like that and, um, hey, hey, Roger, it's Jordan. I need you to give Stratt in a job. Dude, that happens all the time. No, that is not like a new thing. That's like all of my fraternity, like all the guys in the front of. fraternity at UT. It's like they all just go work for each other's dads. I know that my point is like maybe it's kind of the same concept. It's like no, but I was actually talking about like the actual thing that they're like showing up to it. Oh, okay. I see what you're saying. Oh, I see what you're saying. Oh, I'm

so sorry. Like I totally get it now. It's like, hey, Roger. I just want to like, Goldman Sachs. It's like your dad works for Goldman Sachs. Yeah. So then it's like, hey, Stratton, like come with me to work today. I want you to come meet Roger and you can work. Oh, yeah. Yeah, totally. What am I talking about? That happens all the time. So like, you know, so what's the difference? No, there is none.

There is none, right? No, it's like if we. So maybe it's like the new nepotism. It's like if we are still working with Divi in like the next 15, 20 years and, you know, and, you know, one of my best friend's kid, like, wants to intern. I'd be like, sure. And it's all about who you know, you know. And it wouldn't be weird if your best friend and her daughter showed up to a lunch.

No, I already told Lori Paranjipay. I was like, listen, Stella's going to work for you. Right. So maybe it's being spun by the media is like this like really weird thing. But maybe it's, it's more just like nepotism. It's like the new nepotism.

Yeah, or it's just being like. Now, now, okay, like let's say I'm, let me give me an example. Like let's say I wanted to go work for golden sex. And my mom, Tammy, who has no exposure to golden sex comes with me. That's what I was thinking.

And he's like, listen, my son's so amazing. Like Jordan, tell him about that thing that you did in grade. Like that's different, but I have a hard time believing that's actually happening. No, I don't think of that. No, you're so right. No, to me, I am like, with my kids,

I will work every single angle I have for my kids. Okay, so basically you're agreeing with you. If I had the president of the United States's number, I would call the president and try to work that for my kids. But here's the thing is I will give them an opportunity, but it's going to be, I'm not going to be doing the work for them. I think you're agreeing with the article then.

No, I totally am. That's what I'm telling you. Oh, okay, gotcha. No, like I'm like, you're like a Gen Z helicopter brain. I wouldn't, I wouldn't call myself a helicopter parent, but like to me,

that's the way, but here's a thing. Okay, maybe, maybe I am a helicopter parent. Sue me, go make a talking head video about it. No, to me, that is life. Life is all about who you know. Life is all about just massaging those relationships.

calling who you know, especially when it comes to business. Now, I'm not saying like personal relationships. And so, yes, I will work it and then my kids will see how I work it and then they will work it one day.

That's what you got to do. I'm not going to follow the system. If there's a way to shortcut, I am going to shortcut. And then Danny's going to tell Stanford that Stella's a rower and then Photoshop her picture on a rower's body. No,

within legal things. And then we're going to have project or operation. varsity blues part two. I do have to say something about that whole rowing thing. I will do everything legally, especially because I know that people want to take me down. So it's like the same thing whenever I like, you know, DM someone.

I'm always thinking it's going to be screen shot. But if girls do get into Stanford that row, I will encourage Stella to row. Yeah, 100%. Like, work the system, baby. Like, you know what I mean? If it's easier for you to, like, for example, when I applied to UT in Austin, like I wasn't top 10%. So you were probably top 10%. So you know, oh, okay. Wow. We're just. I was remittes.

You got in because you were smart. Let's be real. Um, so I was like, me too from here. Um, but. Oh, when I applied to UT, like we both, UT is a really hard school to get into them. Now it's like top 3% top 5%. Yeah, but it still was really hard when we were getting. Like none of my friends got it. We should just keep saying it's top 5%. Babe, it really was hard to get in whenever we were going there too. I agree.

Stop, you're someone weighing something. No, I'm saying that it's good for us. No, I know. Because now we're able to. It was hard to get in when we were applying to you. I agree. Okay. It was both hard. Okay, so anyway.

So the business goal is basically like an Ivy League. Like, it really is. one of the best business schools like in the nation. And so everybody knows you don't apply to the business school. Like if you're, if you're thinking you won't get in, like don't apply to the business school because you won't get in. Everyone knew the school of education was the easiest to get into. Yeah. So that's why I applied to the school of education. Did you too? Or it's communication, that one too. So I did as education, which also just so happened to have the school of kinesiology. Yeah. And if you wanted to be, so like honestly, that was like

half the reason I did PT. I was like, that's the school I got into. So I have to go down the kinesiology, like physical therapy biology route. Yeah, so like that was a way of like working the system legally. Yes. I will work the system legally forever and always and I will call all my friends. Like I will make the friends and see if my daughter can get a job. Yeah. You have to, I mean, you have to hustle if you're going to be successful.

I'm like, dude, I'm not going to just like wait around and twiddle my thumbs and be like, oh, I'm going to get a job at the college job fair. No. No. That's not going to happen. I remember I walked around that place and I was like, oh my God, it's so embarrassing. Because you're like one of. It's like you're one of thousands of kids.

Like, yeah, you, what am I going to impress you in like a one minute conversation? You know what I actually think I did at that job fair is I went around and got cards. And then I would just email them, be like, love talking to you at the job fair. Like, let's get lunch. And you didn't even talk to them. Yeah, because no one's going to remember anything from that job fair. You know what I just knew? I just knew that no one was ever going to help me with anything.

And I probably wasn't smart enough or wasn't good enough at working to beat out all the other girls. So I was like, I'm just going to do my own thing. You know, I should have told you this story. I don't know why I didn't tell you this story. So we were in Kansas City, right? And you probably don't remember. But right before we crossed into the Kansas City side, crossed that river.

On the right, there was this ad agency called VML. Did you see it? No. Okay. So what I used to do is my dad worked for Southwest. And so in college, I literally just had a code and I could fly anywhere in the country for free. It was the best. Yeah, you'll have to wait 18 hours though.

Yeah, I mean, I would get stuck a lot because I had to fly standby. One time I got on a plane and flew to Kansas City because that's like a really cool creative ad agency. And I was like, oh, I really want to intern here. And I emailed the VP and was like, hey, we met at the job fair. We never did. and I was like, I'm going to be in town for a couple of interviews. Would love to stop by and see you guys. Can I just stop you right now?

The talking heads would be like, liar. He's a liar. But see, I'm listening. I'm like hustler. Yeah, no, that's hustle. That's like fake it till you make it. I was like 20. You know the talking heads would be like he's a liar.

You should never hire him because he's going to lie every day on the job. Well, then I got there. To be clear, I got there. And I met with the head of talent. And she was like, she gave me a tour. And she was like, and I kind of flipped. I remember like messing up like with my, my story because she was like, she was like, who else?

Who else are you all are you here to see? And I was like, oh, just you guys. And she was like, you flew in just to meet with us. And I was like, and then I like spun out a bit. But that's the kind of things that you like have to do to find an edge. Totally. You know? And that's legal.

But I understand. I'm not going to lie. Like I think what the varsity blues parents did was like 1,000% wrong. Yeah. But I understand how they got there. Or like editing your kid's resume. What's wrong with that? Well,

I'll help them out with their resume. Because what happened with these parents is they had this consultant who came to them. And this guy was like the real criminal. Like he was going to these parents and being like, if you pay me X, Y, Z. No, that was like literally like a scam, like fraud. No, that guy was fraudulent. But they took the path because they had the money to do it. Right.

And so I understand their mindset. Right. But I think people have the money to do it and decide not to do that too. That's like crime. No, I, no, for sure. You know, I get it. Like, I would pay a tutor to tutor my kids for the test, but I would never like, like pay someone to like literally accept them into the college.

And like Photoshop them on too. That's like illegal. No, I understand. But like what I'm saying. saying is that it's all part of this mindset of like I will do anything for my kids. Oh yeah. It's sweet. Like you know what? Maybe I would one day. No, no, no, no. You would never do that. I'm just saying I understand and empathize with how they got there, but it still was wrong. Totally. You know, it's like in their mind they were like, I'm justifying this because I want the best for my kid. And then that's what's

also probably the guilt that they live with is that they ended up who was the. But, Who's the YouTuber that, like, really got blasted? She always hangs out with David. Oh, well, her parents were in a full house. What's the mom's name? I don't remember. Anyway, that, that girl, she really. Yeah, but she's doing great now.

She's doing great now, but she got blasted. Someone would argue is, like, you want the best for your kids, but getting them, like, cheating their way into, like, a really nice Ivy League is not the best for them, because it's, like, where they shouldn't eat. Trust me. I think that those parents for sure learned their lesson. Like, you know. Yeah. Well, they went to jail.

The parents did? Yeah. I think it was like for a couple days, right? No, I mean, I could be wrong with that. I know the guy who was the architect behind it. He went to jail for sure. Let's see. Let's ask.

Let's ask. Did Lori Lachlan go to jail for the college scam? I think her husband took the fall. And they're divorced now. They just got divorced. That... Massimo. Yes.

If you mean Lori Lachlan, Aunt Becky from Pohlhouse, she did go to federal prison for the college admission scandal.

She and her husband, Masimo, admitted to paying $500,000. That's so much. Oh my gosh. That's crazy.

To other $2 presented as USC crew recruits even though they weren't competitive rowers. She pleaded guilty. She was sentenced to two months in federal prison,

a $150,000 fine and 100 hours of community service. In two years of supervised release. Her husband went to prison for five months. That's a long time. There's one other thing, I mean, just because we're like kind of on these topics today, there's kind of one thing that I want to talk about, and we can cut it if we want to.

I'm scared. I really want to talk about LakePoint's podcast joining the Blaze Network. Okay, yeah, I don't know much about it, so tell me about it. So what's the Blaze Network? Lake Point Church, led by Josh Howardton, has this massive podcast. How big do you think it is? I know it's the number one, I think it's the number one faith-based podcast. Let's see how many like listens because you can see, what's it called? Live free podcast maybe. Okay.

Oh, it's not that big. Are you sure? I mean, so like every single episode says, is 75,000 plus plays, 50,000 plus, 100K plus, 100K plus. On YouTube? Oh, no, these are on Spotify. No, go to the YouTube. I think it's like massive on YouTube.

Oh, really? Yeah, massive. Okay, let's see. And I think we've talked about Josh quite, I think we've talked about him before on the podcast, but he was just on Sean Ryan. He is very, very, very, very talented.

Mm-hmm. Like, just like, game recognized game and, like, what the internet likes. Like, he's, he's, he knows when to poke. He knows how to clip. Like, he just, he's incredibly talented. It's big, but it's not like millions. It's like 131,000, 235, 289. But for a faith-based podcast, 198, 203.

I think it's top five at least in its category. Yeah, I was just compared to the toast. well they're huge so anyway um we we went to lake point when we were in Dallas I actually grew up going to lake point um and we actually asked Josh to be on the podcast a couple times because um we wanted to have a discussion with him about um just like walking the line between like social media pastor versus like pastor of like such a big church like how do you like keep yourself in check because I think one of the themes we've talked about on this podcast a lot is like the church not preparing these pastors well enough for like what what it does to the mind from a dopamine

perspective to get that much attention and likes and comments and all that and I think I even commented and commended Lake Point for having this this role called the head of digital discipleship which I had never heard before. We talked about this. And I was like, man, I want to have that guy on because I think that as the church continues to get into social media protecting these pastors and protecting the work of the Lord with like everything that social media can kind of corrupt and get really complicated just from a human nature standpoint.

And so I think that they've done a lot of things. Well, they just signed over their podcast to the Blaze network. which I don't, I haven't followed the blaze in years. The things that I know about it is that it was founded by Glenn Beck, who's a Mormon. Oh, really? It's a very like, it would be perceived by culture as a right-wing political media entity. The most thing, the most famous part about it that I remember was Tommy Lauren. You remember her?

Oh, yeah. She was like, I think big on the blaze. And she was like kind of like one of those. like, I don't know where she's at these days, but she's like one of those figures. It kind of runs in the same group as like the Daily Wire or Prager You or Bright Bart. And so culture would perceive it as like a right way organization. Okay. Josh, I don't think he's like bashful about this at all, would call him.

I think he would say, I think he even says it like where he aligns politically. Right. Okay. So there's that. So Josh, so great fit for Josh, you know, great fit for like him personally. But to me, I struggle with this decision because I'm like, isn't that just inherently divisive to join that network? You know? It's like now you're only speaking to the right.

Kind of. And listen. And there's kind of like two ways of looking at it. Like Lake Point is blowing up. It's one of the largest churches in the country. And a lot of that is Josh's charisma, his talent, his preaching, his leadership, et cetera. So I'm just like thinking about this from their perspective strategically. So like I'm an elder in the room.

It's like, do you play to your base? And you're like, we know that we have more independent to conservative leading congregation. So like let's just lean into that further. or do we try and like keep the church out of politics and not let the divisiveness of politics corrupt like our stewardship and our you know is the podcast separate than the church? I don't know. I've asked so many people that I can't figure it out. Like I can't figure out if it's an asset of the podcast or of the church. If it is an asset of the church, I think it's like the first precedent in history that I know where a church has like literally signed over a media asset

to a political organization. Why would they sign with a network? That's the other thing that's really complicated. They're already getting ads. They're already monetizing it. So that's what's really complicated. So they probably got typically I think you sign one of the biggest reasons to sign with a network is you can get like a huge lump sum up front. You can get just like they could pay you like a million dollars up front for your podcast. Yeah. And then a lot of times though you are paid, it's almost like you're in debt.

And so then you're paying like that off with your ad reads, right? Yeah. Well, I think that his position, I watched like the hit their statement on it. It was from Josh and he was like, I'm a pastor, not a podcaster. And I struggle with that one too because I'm like, you are a podcaster and I think you know that you're a podcaster and I think you know you're

really good at social media and you tweet and like you understand the game of social media and then he said a lot of like we needed to get rid of the back in logistics and I'm like y'all are already so good at the basket like y'all are you're so good at thumbnails like you already know you've already grown it you've already grown it like what are you talking about like the only benefit just knowing the business uh You get support. You get alignment with other podcasters. And what you also get is you get, why did we sign with Dear Media instead of doing it ourselves?

You get advertising dollars. Because the way that ads are bought within the podcasting world is like no one wants to go to an individual podcast. They want to go to a Dear Media or a Blaze network. They're like literally taking their dollars and saying, hey, here Blaze Media, here's our, you know, million dollar budget. You divide it up between your podcast. Right. So advertising doesn't work at an individual level at podcasting like it does elsewhere. So then I start to wonder like, okay, well, so was the goal of signing with a network that you wanted more dollars flowing into this podcast, but then where are those dollars going? Right. Is this a Josh owned asset, which I don't mind that. Like I, I, I don't mind. Like passers making money. Right. There's a big debate right now of like Forrest Frank is making millions. like he is 100% like is that a bad thing is that a good thing you know we make a lot of money we

steward it right and so everyone is responsible for stewarding what gets really tricky with this one for me is like it's just unprecedented and I'm not I'm not saying they're doing it wrong and I'm not commenting on like the elders doing it wrong at lake point or whatever it's unprecedented to figure out how to sign a church's podcast to a big podcast to a big podcast I don't think it's ever been done. Yeah. And so I know the biggest bummer for me is that I just feel like obviously politics are so divisive and it's like as soon as you hear like something is associated with like Fox

versus CNN, it just like puts a label on it. It's like I don't want to listen to it. Well, you lose half the country. You live, you lose half the country. Nobody's interested in it anymore. It always seems biased. And I feel like a lot of these podcasts could have been. been very, what's it called when it's not political?

What's the word? A political. A political. Yeah. It could have been for anyone and everyone and just anyone trying to like figure out their faith. And so it's kind of a bummer. Like to me it would have been cool if like they signed with just like a normal, you know, what's like a big podcast agency.

I don't know. I think a serious XM or something like that. That would have been cool to me because I'm like, wow, like so many nonbelievers are going to hear the message and like. That's kind of how I feel. I love whenever like Christian podcasts or Christian like Forrest Frank like they enter like the mainstream media. That's always like the coolest thing for me. Especially being in the space that I'm in.

And like I love I feel like it would be cool if Josh's podcast would have done that. Well, I think that that's I'm glad you said that because I think that that's like it's exactly how I feel. We're both looking at this light. I'll tell you. I'll tell you. We're both looking at this light. But I think that that's how I feel too is like. And maybe that's just like our style.

Like whenever we always say like we're not Christian influencers. We're like influencers that are Christian. So like we aren't really like like our calling it doesn't, I don't think our calling is to be like segregated into this like Christian bubble world. Like I love engaging with like other face. I love talking about Mormonism and like trying to understand where you're at. Like I love sharing our beliefs, but then like really trying to understand and empathize with like other worldviews or like other

cultures. And I feel like we are like gifted in that way where like we can hang out with people from all different backgrounds and like it's just very easy. Not everybody can do that. Yeah. And people are a little too confrontational, a little too whatever. And I would put Josh in that category. Like I would say I don't know if like his style or calling is to be like, hey, I want to go talk to this, you know, like liberal Jewish person in New York. Like he's very clear about, and I think that. And I think that. that's what makes him so good about social media at social media too is he's like he takes those bold stances and he's like, this is what I believe and that's this is what I'm doing. And so that's what makes him so good because he's getting that like hate and all that love. And I don't,

I would just love to understand like what the mindset was because maybe it was being like, hey, listen, we can't be for everyone. We're going to be for this. And we believe that like, we believe that the new people at the blaze, it's not Mormon owned. either, by the way. Like, I think that it was started by Glenn Beck. He sold it. And so I think Josh is getting a lot of hate right now saying like you've spoken out against Mormonism and now all the Mormons are like blasting him on Twitter being like,

I thought you said we were demonic. What people don't understand as factual is that it really has been bought, I think, by more Protestant. I think it was brought by like a Protestant business person. Well, it's like if you're going to trace back the root of everything, it's like, dude, you're always going to find something. So it's just a really, it's fascinating to me. I would love to like, he's too big now.

Like he just went on Sean Ryan. So he's never going to come on this podcast. But like, he never know. He even said he was like, I don't do this man. He's like, I don't leave my bubble. But he's like, you're the only person I did this for. He said that to Sean Ryan. Yeah.

He really does have a very protected bubble, which means that this was a very like preyed through intentional decision. It's just unprecedented. It's fascinating. I'm not saying yes or no. Yeah. And here's the other thing is like if Josh and the Live Free podcast was on like a dear media, I would have probably had equal wrestle with it.

I'm like. Oh, yeah, would have loved it. Really? Yeah. I'm like, get him on call her daddy. Oh, I would. That would be a crush. Like those those type of things are like what I love.

Yeah. That's why I love the whole forest frank just selling out. Is he selling out stadiums? Yeah, you're selling out stadiums. Yeah, I mean, I love it. I even love it. Even when the people sometimes aren't as good as you think they are, I still love it.

Because it just to me is like God using just people. Like even when people get upset and they're like, oh, but he's like really not. And I had to like wrestle with that because I have met some Christian influencers that. I'm like, wow, you're just like not a good person. But like, seriously, I'm like, I don't even know. how that happened. But I've like so gotten past that because I'm like, I mean, it really does like put things into perspective when you start, when you really like picture yourself as like one of the disciples and like all the crazy people that Jesus like actually did change their hearts. Like

I mean, just Paul like is a biggest example. It's like, dude, Jesus was using people that were way worse than Alex Cooper or way worse than, you know, whoever it is. And so, um, so I've gotten past the fact like I just know for a fact any human being is going to disappoint me. They're every single person. There is not a person that is going to like ever be perfect. And like every single person, whether they're a musician, whether they're Taylor Swift, whether they're Frank, Forrest Frank, whether, whoever they are. Whether they're Danny Jordan. Like they're all going to make mistakes. They're not perfect. They've made mistakes in the past. They probably have crazy tweets. I don't know. I just it's just God is going to use anything

and everything that he wants to. I feel like God used Carl Lentz the most during his fall. Oh yeah, for sure. So it's like, Forrest Frank falls, like God still got it. No, I, not that I expect him to fall. I don't want to speak that over him, but like, he's, dude, he's a human. And honestly, here's the thing about a good, a good whiplash from a cancellation. It changes you.

Yeah, but sometimes it's just like the hate that you get. I'm not speaking for myself. I'm just from other people that I've seen. the hate that they get is not warranted. No, I get it. Like they made a mistake, but like you guys are pushing them to like suicide. Like I swear to you, it's like that bad. No, true.

But at the same time, there's nothing like a good public shaming that will bring you closer to Jesus. Let's avoid that. Let's get closer to Jesus without that. Yeah. Please. If you got pride though, it'll. This has been a really great podcast. Do you have any other closing thoughts?

No. Well, if you guys want to check us out on Instagram or TikTok, you can go find other clips of me saying things that you don't approve of and then you can make a talking head video about it. Have something to do for your Tuesday evening, why don't you? No, seriously, I love you guys and we'll talk to later. Bye. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services.

Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this. episode.