Dear Chelsea - Does Everybody Have a Secret Sibling? with Mena Suvari

Episode Date: November 18, 2021

Chelsea is joined by actress and author of The Great Peace, Mena Suvari, to discuss owning your story, opening up about hard topics, and overcoming years of sexual coercion & abuse. A mom of two struggles with guilt over taking time for herself. A new transplant to a big city is concerned about her friend’s risky behavior when they bar-hop. And a young woman wonders whether to approach her half-sisters about their father’s past… when they don’t even know she exists.*Executive Producer Nick StumpfProduced by Catherine LawEdited & Engineered by Brandon Dickert*****The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees. This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all. Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together, our mission on the Really Know Really podcast is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why the bathroom door doesn't go all the way to the floor, what's in the museum of failure, and does your dog truly love you? We have the answer. Go to reallyknowreally.com

and register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead. The Really Know Really podcast. Follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever Welcome to Dear Chelsea. This is Chelsea and Catherine. Hi. Hi. How are you? I'm great today. Are you?

I am. It's like, I mean, I think I've said this before, but it's finally sweater weather and I'm just really excited about it. Yeah, I'm with you on that. I'm with you on the fall weather like vibes. I don't, somebody said it was going to be 90 this weekend and I'm like, well, luckily I'm on tour and I'll never be home on the weekend again. You can save the 90 degree weekends for when I'm out of town. Yeah. Not interested at all. I'm interested in coming home, snuggling up to my two furry beasts. Yes. I'm interested in coming home, snuggling up to my two furry beasts in my bed until they jump off the bed after they've rejected me and enjoying the cold weather as well. So, yes, I can see that you are too, Catherine.

Yes, just like sitting by the fire, a spooky movie. That's what I want. A spooky movie? Really? What about, have you seen the Halloween movie, the new Halloween movie? No, I haven't. Oh, okay. Joe's son wanted to see that last night.

I was like, you guys go. I hate scary movies. Have some bonding time. I can only watch that during, watch a scary movie during the day with the lights on. Yeah.

Because I get really scared. I've done that with some friends before and we call it spooky brunch. We'll just like make brunch and watch. When Hereditary came out, it was too scary

and so one of our friends wanted to see it. We'd already seen it and we said, come over for brunch. We just made brunch. That's cute. I mean, that's a cute, I had no idea about her history. So she grew up as a child actor, very young, moved out here with her family. They started out on the wealthier side of things and then bounced around and started to kind of live like a more toned down lifestyle. So I think she was introduced to a style of living and then slowly, you know, they started to pare it down.

And then they moved to California with the hopes of her acting and modeling career taking off. And there seemed to be some form of neglect on their behalf because she became sexually active at a pretty young age. I also became sexually active at a pretty young age, and I was neglected too. So there's definitely a pattern with parents neglecting their children,

which is why I don't have children because I would neglect them. And I'm aware of this problem, just like I neglect my dogs. I know that's okay for dogs and I know it's not okay for babies. Right. So I would like some sort of fucking carbon credit for not producing children. But in the book, I was talking to Joe about it and I was just so— she gets into one relationship after another, and there's a lot of sexual and emotional abuse, and her self-esteem is in the toilet, and she doesn't have the tools or the skill set to get out of these relationships.

She had a long-term relationship with a guy that treated her terribly, that, you know— Some, like, sexual coercion and things, a lot of sexual coercion on doing a lot of sexual acts that she didn't feel good about, didn't want to do and just stayed in a real. She tried to leave several times, but he always lured her back. And then that cycle of men just kind of repeated. Yeah. And within that, she was married, I think, one or two or three times. Two times. I think who she's married to now is number three. Number three. So she was

married twice. And both of those marriages didn't work out, obviously, because she was traumatized and it wasn't resolved trauma. And there's a lot of addiction that she battled. She was doing crystal meth for a while. Then she was smoking pot, more pot than I've ever heard about anyone smoking, quite frankly. I was like, wait, what? And that's coming from you. I know. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I was like, fuck, I don't even do that.

I haven't been smoking a lot of pot at all lately now that I think about it. Oh, my God. It's so strange. What's happening? You know what else I stopped doing is cracking my knuckles. Oh. That's, I think, from the grounding mat, though. Anyway, I digress. This is a serious topic, so let me address it with more respect instead of getting sidetracked. And it made me really think about how long it takes women to recover from sexual abuse and the work that it

entails. And it is almost like a lifetime of work to get yourself to a healthy place where you can understand that you were violated and that your behavior is a direct reflection of that. And your lack of trust in yourself is a direct reflection of somebody stealing your trust. Right. And shrouding that as I love you or as I'm the only one that loves you, or as you're so important, or nobody else will love you. And all of that is just such horseshit. And so my hope is that anyone going through that, that there are listeners today that have experienced this or that are at the precipice of discovering this about themselves and stopping a pattern of abuse, whether it be emotional or sexual. I really want you guys to pick this book up because it is a clear view into the psyche of

how you break someone down. And she's lucky that she was able to pull herself out of that. Not everybody is. So it's an important book to read. And it's quick. I read it yesterday and this morning. So the addiction part is obviously a product, too, of not wanting to feel pain. And when you think about that, you know, it makes me I actually did think about my pot use when I was reading it because I was like, yeah, excessive use in any drug is always covering up pain. Right. You're trying to numb something. You're trying to push that feeling back down. We're all familiar with doing that.

And there's a lot of freedom and power in getting rid of those vices so that all your feelings are going to bubble to the top. A lot of people are scared for that to happen to them because they don't want to have those feelings. And I would like to impress upon you that those feelings are the only way to get to the truth and to get to being healthy. Right. And feeling those feelings is the only way to process them, even though it's hard. Many people get to a point where they have to say, is it harder to process these feelings that are really difficult or is it harder to keep suppressing and keep numbing and keep really like wasting parts of your life on suppressing those feelings. Yeah, right. It's never a fun endeavor. I have a girlfriend who's going through something, a separation, and she wasn't prepared to go through any sort of pain because she left him and she moved out and she kind of held all the cards and then she went on a big trip and she

came home and of course all of the adrenaline from everything kind of came crashing down and all of a sudden she was sitting in the reality of the choices that she made which were the right choices but for the first time she was questioning whether or not she made the right choice and I was telling her you did make the right choice you're just now going through the grieving process. You delayed your grief with all of this other distraction with partying and drugs. And I'm a total supporter of drug use, but when you're covering up pain,

it becomes very obvious to other people that something deeper is happening. Just like when I used to drink excessively, that something deeper was happening. I was covering up pain. And so now that it came up for her, she's like, wait a second, I wasn't expecting to feel this way. And it's like, well, that's, I've seen so many women go through this. You're going to feel this way. It's going to

happen. And it's great to just take the weekend and sit through it. I was like, I said to her on the phone, I go, I want you to stay at home, do what, you know, and just whatever comes up, let it out, get it out, out, out, out. And I guarantee you by Monday, you'll feel better. And she goes, I hope so. I hope so. I'm like, I know. So you're going to feel better by just being present with your own feelings of discomfort and pain, because we all have the power to get through anything. We all do. Yeah. And having that support system of a friend or a therapist or someone around you to be able to encourage you to do those things is is invaluable. It's huge. Yeah. And that's another

thing she said. She goes, God, I've been reaching out to friends, which is something I've never I've never been comfortable doing. And the response has been so overwhelming that so many people want to help her and that are there for her. And that's something that we're all so guilty of, too. People don't want to ask for help. And it's like, that's what your friends are for. That's what your family is for. Ask for help. People want to help you. I want to help people all the time. And I'm a bitch. So I guarantee you, you can find someone to help you. Absolutely. Anyway, so that's who our guest is today. Meena Suvari. She wrote The Great Peace. That's her book. It's out and available. So a lot of you may know Mina Suvari from American Pie, American Beauty.

One of the things in the book she talks about is when she was filming American Beauty, she was in the most toxic relationship that she had ever been in. And she was, this guy was, you know, wanting to bring women over all the time, having threesomes. And at first, you know, she didn't like that. And then she just got on board with it. And she was having sexpot, the, you know, fantasy for a middle-aged married man going through his midlife crisis. She was the ultimate young, hot girl that he fantasized about that was going to give him all the pleasure

that he no longer got from Annette Bening, who plays his wife in the movie. It was a fucking awesome movie. But to hear the backstory of what she was going through personally while she was filming that movie was heartbreaking. Yeah, and it really ties into a lot of the questions that we're going to get to today. Some big questions, some really tricky ones today.

Okay, well, I'm glad I took an Excedrin. Well, I think we have to take a quick break right now. So we'll be right back with Mina. Okay, I'm going to make a pee-pee on the potty. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together on the Really No Really podcast, our mission is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like

why they refuse to make the bathroom door go all the way to the floor. We got the answer. Will space junk block your cell signal? The astronaut who almost drowned during a spacewalk gives us the answer. We talk with the scientist who figured out if your dog truly loves you and the one bringing back the woolly mammoth. Plus, does Tom Cruise really do his own stunts? His stuntman reveals the answer.

And you never know who's going to drop by. Mr. Bryan Cranston is with us today. How are you, too? Hello, my friend. Wayne Knight about Jurassic Park. Wayne Knight, welcome to Really No Really, sir. Bless you all. Hello, Newman. And you never know when Howie Mandel might just stop by to talk about judging.

Really? That's the opening? Really No Really. Yeah, really. No really. Go to reallynoreally.com and register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition sign Jason bobblehead. It's called Really No Really and you can find it

on the iHeartRadio app on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, Mina. Hi. Hi. Can you see us? Yes.

We can see you. Sorry, I'm in like a... It looks like you're in a prison cell. In a prison cell. Sorry. Are you in prison? Yeah. Just emotionally. No, I'm okay. How are you doing? I'm good. I just read your book yesterday and this morning on my plane ride home. So I'm emotionally, you know, I'm emotional. It's fresh for you. Wow. Thank you for reading it.

Absolutely. I don't fuck around when it comes to books and interviewing people. I take that very seriously. Well, thank you. I'm happy to be here and talk. I'm happy to see your shining face. I want to ask you a lot of stuff, but it was really must have been very, very difficult while also cathartic for you to write all of that stuff down because some of it is so personal and some of it is just so heartbreaking, you know, to even know that your younger self or part of you had to experience that kind of pain, even as an older person. It's like almost like you're talking about your own daughter in a sense. You know, that's how I feel when I look back at my childhood. I'm like, oh, that poor little girl.

So I'm wondering how it felt once the book came out. I know the book is recent and it just came out a couple of months ago. How did it feel to share all of this stuff with the world? I mean, very weird because, you know, initially I felt so compelled to share it. I just had to express myself and it had its own process. I, over the years I had moved and I had my diary and I had this, you know, book of poetry, this binder that I'd entitled The Great Peace, you know, from the past that had traveled with me for so long. And I finally just looked into it again. And at that moment, you know, at least a couple of years ago, I initially wanted to just publish the poetry book.

I felt like I could share enough, but not all of it. And then through the process of sharing that with a friend, and then I was sharing some of the stories that went along with some of my writings, because some of them were even timestamped or dedicated to a specific person, they encouraged me to tell all of it. And so at that moment, I kind of went back and I sat with myself and I just felt ready. It really was a personal thing. And I knew that that was part of it. I just got to writing and it took me quite a while. So then going into the process of like talking about it, I mean, that's very weird. I kind of refer to it as like therapy with the world. You know, it's strange. I'm like living my life in front of everyone. That's very odd to me. But there's

also something really beautiful. And there's so many things that have come out of this. I mean, this work isn't done for me. I'm still very actively in therapy. I love my therapist. Oh, well, that's nice. For those of you that are listening, the book is this is Mina Savari, as we mentioned, the book is called The Great Peace, and it is a recollection. It's a memoir, but it's a recollection of your whole life and a lot of abuse that you encountered, sexually, emotional abuse, just a series of running and running and running, a series of relationships of going from one person to the next to try and heal old wounds, which is a story that's as old as time for so many women. And I think it's always so powerful for anyone to share their story, especially someone in the public eye, when they can be candid and they can be honest

because there are details in there that I was shocked to read. I was like, oh, and I'm a shocking person. So I'm always oversharing everything. So I was like, holy fuck, I can't believe she wrote this and that you put that stuff in there. And I just think it's so brave. And you should be applauded for that because sharing your story is helping so many people understand that they're not alone, that other people experience this and other people and what they think are powerful life positions are going through stuff like this. And, you know, what happens when your parents aren't really present for you in a meaningful way that helps shape you and protect you during those years

when you're coming of age as a young woman, which is something that you talk about a lot in the book and your relationship with your father, who is no longer with us, but who was much older, and your mom in the book and your relationship with your father, who is no longer with us, but who was much older, and your mom and the distance and everything and moving to LA and living in that apartment complex that every young child actor lives in. So, I mean, obviously, it's an ongoing journey for you. How do you feel now about your life and where you're at and your mental health? Oh, that's a good question. I mean, I feel like it's an

ongoing process. I mean, like I said, I love my therapist. I'm still very active, you know, in working with her. It's I feel like more than ever because of my son. I'm trying to do the work as much as possible in a way that I've never done before. A lot of it is just up in the air for me now and just trying to process it and live in the gratitude. I feel like so much of it for me was just, I totally felt like I was alone. You talk a lot in the book about your weaknesses or what you perceive to be your shortcomings or emotional weaknesses. What do you think that you've learned about yourself through this? What do you think that you've learned about yourself through this? Like, what do you think your strengths are?

Definitely a survivor. Yeah, I came across this excerpt. I think it's Agamemnon. And it was the translation was to suffer, suffer into truth. And I just thought it was so beautiful and so powerful. And I don't know, I guess I tried to make that one my own in a way. And I think that that's my strong suit. I try to find solace in that within myself. I know that I have the strength to keep going. And I guess working with organizations like Child Health and Vista Del Mar. And because that to me is, I feel like this is just the real reason why we're here, to share of our experiences, to help encourage one another. And to break cycles, right? To break cycles of behavior, patterns of behavior,

cycles of abuse, and, you know, moving forward in your marriage with your husband now and creating a different kind of set of patterns, right? You want to create change in your life. Yeah, not easy, but trying to just be present. And I think also understanding and working with the full spectrum of emotions, learning to express oneself. The part of your book where you're in the hotel room in Australia with, you know, your Pilates instructor and that shutting down, you know, emotionally when you were being vulnerable, telling him something that you wanted to share with him out of respect for your sexual relationship and then him reacting in that way and you shutting down and kicking, throwing him out.

I can relate to that so much because it's such a default that we go to, you know, like when you're not emotionally healthy, like you have two modes of operation. It's like aggressive or rejection. And how would you characterize your marriage this time with your husband now in the way that it's different than your past relationships? I try to be as present as possible. We try to talk, you know, address everything, just communicate and hold space for one another. I think, you know, that's the work for me is understanding what those triggers are. It's doing the work for me to try to understand what might really be happening or how I might be reacting to it. You know, it's that kind of thing. So I think we just try to be present, communicate with one

another about everything so that it's, um, I think that's what I didn't do enough of. And how did your mom and your brothers react to reading the book? A good question. Haven't had those conversations. Yeah. Really? reading the book? Good question. Haven't had those conversations. Yeah, really? Yeah. Yeah. But again, that's not why I did this, you know, and it was important for me to say like this. I was never trying to write this as like a blame game. You know, this was my experience and my story and my sharing of it. I think that's important for people to remember. I'm curious, and this is kind of a question for both of you, but where is the point for you where you feel like with something traumatic like that, that it becomes your story to tell and, you know,

you have to take the onus on yourself to tell your story, even though it may hurt other people? I would say that everyone has the right to tell their story. And it's really not up to other people what your story is, because that is your agency. I always try to explain to somebody, like, you might think something that could be something so small, like a sentence said to someone could affect one person in no way, and then it could destroy someone else's world. So it just depends. You know, I think, yes, we are entitled to share of our story and how that experience was for us. You know, I wasn't ever trying to say that no one else had an opinion. And again, what was so great for me is how there were people

who, because, you know, there were names changed, not all of them, but there were people that knew who I was talking about. That was terrifying to me. They actually figured out who that person was. Or people wrote to me on a relationship that they had with that person after me. God, yeah.

That was very powerful for me too. Yeah. It's funny. I wrote one of my books. I changed the names, blah, blah, blah. But I wrote about a friend of mine. And it wasn't in the most complimentary way, but it wasn't really... We all took a trip to Africa, and she was a hot mess on the trip. So it was kind of, you know, neither here nor there, nothing super incriminating or anything like that. But she was pissed about it. I had sent her the book before. I had changed her name, her description. And she got so upset about the book. And then I had dinner with her a couple of years later and I was like, oh, I have a new book coming out. And she leans in, she goes,

is it about me again? And I thought and I said, no. And the fucking other one wasn't about you either. Like, relax. It was so annoying that she took this section of my book that was one chapter and made the entire thing about her. And while it was, you know, a component of many, many stories and many chapters in my book, and then had the temerity to think that I would write about her again after the last round of annoyingness that it caused. It's like, no, I would never do that again. I just dedicated it to you. Yeah, yeah, exactly. To your fake name, so you won't know who it is either. See if you can figure that one out. Anyway, Mina, I'm glad

that you're doing so well. I mean, this is a really courageous thing and a courageous book. I really want everyone to read this because it's important to know, you know, about the experiences that you don't have when you're growing up and to kind of feel other people's pain because it is a painful book to read. And there were times where I just wanted to put it down to give myself a minute. And I had to remind myself that everyone's story is so important to know about, especially when it's dissimilar to your own, you know, to really work on your empathy and compassion for others when it's especially when it's uncomfortable. And I know that many women have had similar experiences to you and so that it will be

helpful for them as well. You're welcome. You're welcome. Oh, by the way, I was just within, I don't know if you keep in touch with Jason Biggs, but after reading about American Pie, I was just with him in New York, he and his wife, Jenny. Yeah, no, I do. I mean, I know that you're close with Jenny too. They're amazing. Yeah. Well, they're two hot messes also. So yeah, too hot. We went to dinner with them and I always forget Jason's not Jewish because he reminds me of such a Jewish guy. I'm always like, Jason, you know, like, and then he's like, no, Chelsea, I'm Italian. And I'm like, Jason, Jews and Italians are basically the same thing. All that guilt. Okay. So we have some callers. We're going to give advice. This is an advice podcast

and it's all stuff that's in your wheelhouse and you and I and Catherine will go for it and talk to people. I'll try. Yeah. Great. Well, our first question comes from Brianna. She says, Dear Chelsea, I recently moved to a new city, and I was fortunate to meet a girl that I really get along with. We both moved to the city around the same time and have spent quite a lot of time exploring the bar scene in the area. We've been hanging out for a few months, and I'm starting to notice that every time we go to the bar, the main focus is on meeting men and having them pay for our drinks. Now, don't get me wrong, it's fun having guys pay for drinks and flirting with strangers sometimes, but it seems like that's the only thing she likes to do. Now we're at the point where I feel like we don't really have anything interesting to talk about. Because we're both new to the city and don't have many friends here,

I don't feel comfortable leaving her at the bar alone with the sometimes creepy men she meets, but I also hate waiting around while she entertains losers for the chance at getting a free gin and tonic. This past weekend, she was involved in a pretty dangerous situation where the guy she decided to leave with wouldn't take her home, and she ended up having to sneak out in the middle of the night and call an Uber to get home. She's such a pretty girl and has a really well-paying job, so I truly don't know why she feels she needs to do this. How do I tell her that her behavior is coming across pretty desperate and annoying? I really don't want to lose my new friend, Brianna. Well, Mina, this is something you talk about a lot in your book when you talk. I mean,

not that this woman is an addict. We don't know what her history is or if she has a drinking problem or anything like that. But you talk a lot about friendships and addiction in your book. So what are your thoughts on that, on having an honest conversation with somebody? Because a lot of people are not in a state to hear that. Yeah. I mean, I don't know if there's addiction at all involved there, but I feel like the thing that came to me first is just approaching this person and saying, I love you. I'm worried about you. And I worry that you might not be in the safest situation. You know, let's talk about that.

Let's have a conversation, you know, approaching it with love. Because I mean, I think about my friend Tracy, who just simply said it doesn't have to be this way. It was just somebody who really engaged with me, really saw me. Maybe having that moment of, you know, really engaging with her in a quiet surrounding, right, where you can focus on one another and approach it with love and concern. Isn't that what it's about? We're worried about her getting hurt eventually. Yeah, I think that what was powerful with your friend Tracy in the book is that she said it in a quiet way and it wasn't a loud confrontational way. She looked at me and she stopped me with it because she was in the car and I was running to

her and it was just hurried. But she just stopped and turned to me and just held space for a second. And that's why I think it hit me because she was facing me. And to give people context, this is a situation with a person that Mina was in a relationship with. They were having what they hoped to be a threesome with this woman, and she was not interested. And so she kind of she left. Well, she didn't kind of she left. And Mina chased her out to the car to give everybody context. So I would say also, yeah, I think, you know, anytime you're having a conversation, it has to be coming from a place of love if you want any it to land at all, which is something that took me a really long time to understand, because I like to tell people the truth all the time and people don't necessarily want to hear that. So when you start out with I love you, I care about you and try to take out any sort of

condescension or any sort of tone that could be read as patronizing. And I mean, the fact that she had that a guy wouldn't take her home and she had to kind of escape his house in the middle of the night is a red flag. And you want to make that first experience the last experience that something like that happens. And you don't want to be in a relationship with a friend that you're going to constantly be worried about. You're there for her and you and you love her, but you don't want to be put in that position. You know, it's not a safe situation and it causes you distress. Even hearing about that one night stand kind of causes me distress, you know? I mean, for any woman out there.

So it's just out of a respect for your relationship when you're out together that it shouldn't be all about getting guys to buy you drinks. That's kind of a boring story after a while anyway. It seems like a fun endeavor. And after the third or fourth time, it's like, you know, wouldn't you rather just enjoy each other's company and then meet people naturally instead of trying to get them to do something for you? I mean, I'm more curious as to why she feels like she can't approach her friend in that way. She's clearly worried enough where she's writing to you about it. Yeah. Yeah. Well, some people don't like to have those conversations at all. Yes. And one of the things that I learned earlier on was, again, just approaching it instead of,

I think, I feel. Yeah. And we're saying, I think if you do this and you're doing this and don't do that, it's accusatory and we want to shut down. Yeah. Or like I'm approaching you with love and I feel that, you know, I'm worried or I feel that this might not be safe for you. I think that because we all have our trauma, right? The walls don't come up as much or as quick. Yeah. And I also think it's always good to frame everything as we, when you're talking to your girlfriends, you know, when my girlfriends are going through a bad thing, it's always like, we're going to get through this. We're going to do this. And when you're talking to a friend, like, I don't want us to be put in these situations. I don't want us to be in dangerous situations so that it's not accusatory and that it is more of a concerted effort.

You know, if you feel like you have a team member, it feels like you're more, you know, on a team. So I think it's always good to frame things as we, like, let's be safer when we go out. Let's not rely on guys to be buying us drinks. Let's have open conversations about, you know, if things are bothering us and this is bothering me. So I want us to be able to last long in this friendship. So, yeah, those are all good ways to start the conversation. And you should definitely have that conversation with her sooner than later. And listen, if she gets upset and she doesn't want to be friends with you, then that sucks. But, you know, you have to be honest and you have to be forthright and truthful.

I think it's really powerful to, you know, have people know that you're always coming at them with truth. And that's a great attribute to hold on to. Yeah. And sometimes it's just like more fun to go out with your girlfriends than to have to like worry about hooking up with a guy. I used to do that all the time. more fun to go out with your girlfriends than to have to like worry about hooking up with a guy. I used to do that all the time. Like when I was in my 20s and I'd go out to bars, it was all about getting guys to buy us drinks. And I don't even understand why. I think it was the validity of being hot enough that like, oh yeah, I go out and no, you know, I don't have to pay for anything. And it's like, it was just so, it was just as such an immature part of my life. And that's what I guess your 20s are partly for, not the entire 10 years of your 20s, which is what I did.

But it wasn't like I didn't have the money to buy myself a drink. It was like this thing, like it made me feel wanted. Like I wanted to be able to walk into a bar and just have any guy at my disposal and be the hottest girl there and have my friends know how powerful I was with, you know, the way I looked and the way I felt, which is all silly now that I think about it. So it's not something that you're ever going to look back and be like, oh yeah, I used to get guys to pay for my drinks all the time, like high-fiving each other. So, you know, you want to wrap that behavior up sooner than later anyway. Yeah. Okay. Good luck to you, Brianna. Let us know what happens. Stay in touch. Yes. And our next question comes from a caller.

This is Katie. Katie says, Dear Chelsea, I'm 29 years old and I'm married with two kids. My whole world revolves around these kids. I'm so obsessed with them. It hurts. I still work full time, but I'm always home with them outside of work. I rarely see friends or take much time for myself. My husband and I have had about two date nights in the last calendar year. Our youngest is only five months, which I know, Mina, you can relate to that, and is still in our room at night for breastfeeding, so intimacy has to be pretty planned out. When I make plans with friends, I tend to feel guilty being away from the kids or

leaving my husband home with both of them, though he never complains. We don't have many family members around that are capable of watching the kids, and I'm not comfortable asking anyone I don't know well, like a teenage babysitter. Obviously, I'm struggling to balance life as a mother and finding time to maintain other relationships, needing some encouragement. Katie. Oh my gosh. Hi, Katie. I feel you, Katie. Hi, it's so nice to meet you guys. Hi, how are you? I'm doing really well. I'm sorry, I have managed to go this whole pandemic without using Zoom at all. So this is relatively new for me. I feel like the new Zoom is DocuSign. For some reason,

I get five things to DocuSign every day when I used to get five invitations for Zoom. And I'm like, are we slowly transitioning from Zoom to DocuSign where we just sign documents instead of having to talk to each other? Well, you're doing fine. You made it happen. We can see you. And we're both here. I'll let Mina start this because she's a new mother and I'm not. Oh, gosh. I feel like, I mean, my son's only six months. I am not doing it any better. I feel you. It's so hard. Yes, it is. And there have been a couple updates since I sent in my submission, one of which we did kick our son out of our bedroom. So that has been huge. Great. Congrats.

Yes. So a little private time with me and my husband after the kids go to bed, sometimes just the me time. That's been a huge improvement there. Oh, wow. You sound like you've really gotten ahead of your own problems, though, writing in here and already solving like two of them, because that's what I was going to suggest is really setting time aside for yourself. with this person or that person or the strength of a relationship or the quality of it. You know, I was at a dinner the other night and I was like, is this quality time? Is this enough quality time? Like I was trying to stuff it all in. And when we put that pressure on ourselves, it's just unfair to the entire situation because it's just unnatural to try and force like when you go out with your girlfriends, you should be able to have that time with them and enjoy it and not feel guilty about

leaving your husband at home. And he's not making you feel guilty. So why are you making yourself feel guilty? You know? Exactly. And there's a big, I think, social media aspect to this where every mom is spending tons of quality time and, you know, there's no screen time and we're exposing them to all the right things and which thing is going to screw them up for the rest of their lives. All that stuff to look at on social media. And I think everyone's slacking off secretly and, you know, it's just all curated and I just need to get over myself. I went over to my friend's house the other day. Let me just tell you this.

And her four-year-old threw an iPad at her face. This is the seventh child. No, this is the second child. I have another friend who throws iPads as well, whose son throws iPads. And I'm so horrified. And just to let you know, everyone is slacking off. You know, everyone is completely full of shit on Instagram and social media about what they're doing right. And anybody that is really doing the right thing isn't bragging about it. So nothing replaces real, genuine, authentic love and time spent. You know, somebody said, or I think we were talking last, one of our last episodes, Catherine, about quality time versus quantity, right? Quality versus quantity. And that you

can't force, it's the quantity of time you spend with somebody that leads to the quality of time. Right. Right. You don't just meet somebody on the fly and then about how much time you're spending and taking care of yourself, as well as setting aside time for you and your husband, is all that you need to do. That's all you need to do is just be present in all of those moments. Because every time we're able to just access our presence, right, it always leads to more and more presence and happiness and less anxiety about what you're doing wrong and more confidence about what you're doing right. Yeah. And you know what? I know that you're exactly right. And to be honest, I tell people this, I work in a pediatric hospital, I'm a nurse and I meet these parents that are staying in the hospital with their kids, which is totally appropriate.

But at the same time, I try and remind them, you know, you need a break. You can't take care of your kid if you don't take care of yourself. And I say this to people all the time. And I just don't do it myself. I do the same thing. We all do that. You know, I don't know. There's something about.

I feel like it's so like embedded though, too. My son's only six months, but I'll wake up with that panic or that like angst when you feel like you have to take care of yourself, but then you feel guilty taking a shot. I don't know. It's hard to describe. And also there's that great quote, the advice you give best is the advice you need to seek most. You know, that's what you're saying, Katie. Yeah. When you're giving that advice and doling it out at the hospital, remember to direct it right back at yourself because you've got all the knowledge you need and you've got all the skill sets you need. It's just about applying it to your own life rather than giving it out to other people. I mean, you could do both, obviously.

You don't want to withhold from giving out great advice to other people either. Yeah, I really appreciate you guys giving me this time. And like I said, I know what I need to do. I just need other people for some reason to just tell me to do it. How's your sex life with your husband? It's good.

It's not what it used to be. We still are pretty active, but I do still have some discomfort sometimes from delivery that I maybe need to talk to someone about. But it has made drastic improvements since, like I said, we kicked our son out. Yeah, I would imagine that would be a better scenario. That is my worst nightmare, waking up and, oh, I slept with my Burt, my baby Burt, who's my dog, not to compare my dog to your child, but I did trap him in the bed last night because I'm only home for three nights. I'm on tour, so I'm never home. And I

had my boyfriend over and I had Burt in the bed and he goes, is he really going to sleep between us? And I go, don't even fucking say that sentence. Yes, he's going to sleep between us. And he's like, what is going to happen? I'm like, we're just, don't worry. We're going to have sex too. Everything's going to work out. Don't get it twisted. But yeah, I slept with my baby in my bed last night, so I can't even pretend that I don't sleep with my child as I'm sitting here telling you to get discomfort. You are always just very aware of the dog or the baby who might be asleep, but you just always kind of know they're there. I think, you know, the thing that kind of keeps popping into my brain, too, as far as like making the time and taking the time for yourself is sort of like bravery is feeling the fear and doing it anyway. I think some of the most amazing moms that I know in my life are women who feel the guilt, but they take time for themselves anyway. They take time for the occasional massage or just to go be alone for a little while. And, you know, to your point about

the way that social media makes things look too, it's like we don't really know what's going on in those homes. We don't know what kind of child care that person has. We don't know what else they have going on. And it's not always all about being right there. There are eight nannies. Right, right. And also to just to relate it a little bit back to Mina's book, you know, like when we avoid something or ignore something, it doesn't go anywhere. It just gets deeper embedded in us, you know, and it becomes our story and our narrative. So like when you ignore yourself or your needs or your wants or you don't take the time that you of resentment or however it manifests itself in you and your psyche in your body isn't worth it you know you want to be healthy and strong for your children so that means being healthy and strong i have a friend who's always like i don't have time for self-help i don't have time for self-care i have three children you know and she has this

kind of martyrdom around it and it's well, and she's always frazzled and she's always at the end of her rope and she's always about to lose it. And that's no way to go through life either. Hopefully she's not listening. Yeah, you don't want a stressful mom. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I do.

A couple people asked when we had our second child, are you going to stay home? And that was never really thought in my head, But I always said, I'm really a better mom when I can miss them just a little bit when I'm at work and I can come home and cherish that time a little bit more. Right. And I think that you speak for a lot of mothers when you say that. So your problem is easy. Be grateful you don't have a bigger problem. This is easily solved. Yes, you're exactly right. You're exactly right. They're happy and healthy, right? Yes. Yes, they are. And if you feel this way, you're probably a really great mom. You know, if you're feeling

this much guilt, then, you know, you're probably giving them a ton. You're clearly a giver too because of what you do as your occupation. You're clearly a giver. So you need someone to give you a little more. Yeah. Time for you now. Yeah. Thanks for calling in, Katie. Yes. I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much. Sure. I love giving parenting advice. I'm going to teach a parenting class. I've decided at my pool every morning between 9 and 9.15 a.m. So you have a very small window to get there. Yeah. Would you like that, Mina? I love it. I love your advice. I want you to be my mom.

Well, our next caller is Gabrielle. She says, Hi, my name is Gabrielle and I am a 25-year-old woman lost in the world. My mother's largest goal of her life was to have a baby with or without a man. Eventually, after many miscarriages, I popped into her world. At a young age, she told me she'd had an affair with a married man who was my father. He would show up from time to time in the first decade or so of my life. The issue is that he never told his wife or children about me. I'm still a huge secret. My mother passed away in my late teenage years, leaving me to grow up too fast. The advice I seek is, should I break my father's 25-year secret and introduce myself to my siblings who are now married with children of their own? Deep down inside, I know revealing myself would destroy their childhood memories of their father. And to add to that, my father is a prominent man in a big city, and revealing myself could make quite the waves for the entire town. Gabrielle.

Wow. Wow. Hi. Oh,lle. Wow. Wow. Hi. Hello. Hi. Hi. Oh, how are you? I'm well. How are you?

I'm good. Thank you. I'm good. I'm sitting here with Mina and Catherine. We just read your submission. Wow. That sounds like a lot to be dealing with on your own. Yeah. You know, honestly, there's been so many things that have happened since that it's kind of one of those things that's in the back of my mind. Doesn't really hold a lot of weight, but it's something that comes to the forefront, you know? I mean, right off the top of my head, Mina, tell me if you agree with me. And also, Catherine, I want to know what you think, because it goes back to what we were talking about earlier in the episode about everyone has the right to their own story. And while your identity would be a major disruption for this person, it's his history and his accountability and it's your story. And you have every right to reach out to him or to reach out to your brothers and sisters. That is your right as a human being. You know, you don't get to be invisible because he doesn't want to acknowledge something. And you don't even know if that's still how he feels. You're assuming it's how he feels, which could be accurate.

Well, honestly, after my mom passed away, I reached out to him. And this was when I was a freshman in college. And I asked for his help. And he told me he'd financially help me if he made sure that this didn't come to light. And it was just because I needed a little bit of help with my tuition, I accepted. So I'm pretty sure I know exactly where he stands on that. And that's really rough, but that's where I'm at. Yeah. That sounds painful. How did that make you feel when he said that? A little frustrated for sure. I mean, I, I told him that my mom had passed and

he didn't even really get that into his head. He's perfect Catholic. And so he said that his prayers and thoughts were with me. And then I had to like really break it into his head that like she actually died. It wasn't just something that like she was going to recover from. And it made me feel really frustrated, but I was thankful to be able to finish my school because of it. And I hated to go to those lengths. I hated, you know, being in that predicament just because I went to a really good school that was a lot of money. And so even with financial aid, I just had a little bit of a discrepancy that I couldn't come up with. So it did make me just, yeah, really sad, really sad. And that's also something to consider, you know, putting yourself out there in that way, if it's only to be rejected and, you know, there's no guarantee of being embraced by your siblings.

It sounds like he's not going to be embracing the situation. Do you want to set yourself up for that? That's why I came to you, honestly, because, you know, everybody says you should do it. Just rip the bandaid off like you deserve this. But it breaks me out. I mean, I've had a lot of death in my life. I've had a lot of abandonment, you know, and I'm not sure if I want to open myself up to that. But at the same time, do I just never say anything? Because if not now, when I'm actually an adult, when? And is it going to be something I like take to the grave as a regret? I don't want that either. Well, what would be your motivation in reaching out to them to develop a relationship? Like what would be your ultimate goal?

Yes, I would like to know my family. I mean, I'm an only child technically other than them. So without a mom, without parents, stuff like that, I mean, I want family just like everybody else does. And who, who do you have in your life that is close to you and important to you? Um, for a long time, I've been just like you, Chelsea, my biggest people in my life were my dogs, but I have a significant other now and some of my mom's side of the family. But it's different when you're just a cousin or a niece compared to if you were actually a, I don't know, larger member of a family, you know? Yeah. I just worry. I worry about, you know, if their reaction, which all sides are pointing into the direction that it's a big secret and that they're not going

to be welcoming you with open arms. And that's not to say that after time passes and they're able to digest it, that they wouldn't open you with open arms. But I don't want you to set yourself up for that kind of rejection because that's just going to create more and more reason for you to go to therapy. You know what I mean? It's creating, it's creating trauma in a way if it doesn't go your way. So I, before you would even be able to consider doing that, you would have a conversation with me before I spoke with my mother. And that was sort of surprising to me because I thought, oh, well, you know, I was just going to do it on my own, but it was important for her to, I don't know, guide me through that or make sure that I was in the right place. And I also feel like with

what you're saying, it's just like, I mean, I think about my own experience. You're the only one who's going to know when that time's right. And if you're going to take that chance, you're the only one who's going to be able to give yourself that answer. Because I feel like that's the only real way to do it. I mean, this is important. And I think part of that process. But ultimately, I think you're going to have to decide if you're going to take that step or not. I am actively in therapy. I do have a lot of friends that are

basically like family and my significant other is so supportive. He was even incredibly surprised that I would write into a show about it because I am quite private about it. It's not something that I speak about often, but thanks to my therapist, I've been trying to come to some sort of conclusion. And Chelsea, I've even microdosed to it in mind, for that matter. I have really thought about this a lot. It's just, it does. I have a fear. I have a fear of rejection. I mean, it would really stink to actually go through with all of that. And then for them to, for one thing, maybe not believe me. I mean, that's a huge possibility. How am I supposed to force them to like swab their mouths or like to get a DNA? You know what I mean?

Is there freedom in that fear? Yeah. Yeah, there is. There definitely is. Well, and I mean, you bring up a very good point, you know, with 23andMe and all these other ways that you can share your DNA now. I mean, if you have done something like that and one of them decides for the moment, like, oh, let's like find out what my ancestry is. And they find out there's a half sister out there somewhere. You know, that's kind of a way you can leave that door open without taking direct action. What was your microdosing experience when you microdosed with this in mind? What what what came to you? Well, actually, it was funny that you mentioned 23andMe because I was thinking about that as well.

I mean, that's another huge reason, not just because I want family, but because I deserve to know what I have in my genetics. You know, I want to know, like, if and when something's going to happen to me, what runs in the family, why have people died on that side, you know? And so that did come to mind a lot. And I felt more open. And you know how it gives you the euphoric after effect. I felt a little more calm and less fearful. But after a while, without microdosing again, then the fear kind of creeps back in. So I definitely thought of that idea because that's a huge reason that I really want to know myself more. And I want to know the people that are related to me. Is that the psilocybin, just to be clear?

The microdosing, Gabrielle, is psilocybin? Yes. I love psilocybin. I've finally gotten over the stomach-related stuff and found a good way to consume it so that that doesn't happen. Oh, that's good. Yeah. Sometimes when I take it, I don't like that stomach feeling too. I get a little nauseated, right? Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I don't, I hate that feeling. But wait, I actually have more in common with you in this problem than I realized because I just remembered I have a brother that came out of the woodwork like 10 years ago. I forgot that. So there's six kids in my family and about 10 years ago, maybe eight, I have no sense of time, maybe eight years ago, this guy contacted us and said that my dad was his father.

He looked exactly like my dad, more so than even my brothers look like my father. And I guess my dad had gotten this woman pregnant right before he married my mother. So it wasn't exactly the same, but it was a brother that none of us knew we had. I was probably less interested in learning about him than my brother was. One of my brothers became, is in touch with him. They've met. They've met in person. They communicate online via email, et cetera.

But he wanted to know about his genealogy and his history. And he wanted to know about his health history. And so he had every right. I mean, my sister spoke with him at one point. I think a bunch of people did. I never have. And I think it's well, I found out he was a Republican. So that was a really hard pill for me to swallow. But I think people will have different. Do you know how many children are in that family? Yes, two. And they're both females. Yeah. I was just going to say, if it had been a woman, I wouldn't have hesitated no matter what to meet with her because I would want that feeling and I would want to acknowledge her. For some reason, because it

was a man, I didn't feel that need, I guess, because I'm just so close with my two sisters. I'm close with my brothers too, but it just doesn't even compare. You know, men are so stupid. So my sisters are just so powerful. So I mean I mean in that sense I think there's a different tie and a different pull once you get past the hurt so I think if you get to a place where you feel confident and you and again what Mina said is absolutely true it has to be your decision it's not going to be my decision for you but if you get to a place where you feel like that is absolutely what you must do, writing a letter in advance to them, breaking it down, breaking it down from your perspective that you're alone, you're an only child, you lost your mother, you just wanted to reach out to your family members and that you'll understand if they don't respond or, you know,

you don't even have to say you understand whatever's true to you. You know, giving them time to digest that. I think most well-rounded women would want to reach out to another woman and you can't really understand what their personalities are or anything like that. But given some time to digest that information, I think would produce a different result than obviously anything more dramatic like showing up or calling or any of those things. Not that that's what you had planned. Well, I think you had a really good point too, Chelsea, where we think of this as like they might reject you or they might accept you, but you might have sort of a mixed bag where one of them is really interested in meeting you and getting to know you and the other one

isn't as interested in that. So there's that potentiality, too. I know that's something that happened with a friend of mine. She found out as an adult after her parents had passed that while they had split up for a couple of years, her father had had a child with someone else, and two of her siblings want to have a relationship and the other two don't. And your health history is your business anyway. I suppose you could get that from your father anyway. You could email him directly and say

that you need that information, which you should do. That is true. And Mina's right. I need to do it when I feel like I'm ready to do it. And you are also right in saying that writing a letter instead of just showing up is definitely a better idea. Yeah. I just wanted to say you're such a beautiful, wonderful person, Gabrielle, really. Thank you. Yeah. I know we all come from somewhere, but I mean, to just have such a grasp over everything. I mean, it's really impressive and you should give yourself a lot of credit.

Yeah, you should. Thank you. You should. Absolutely, Gabrielle. And also recognize how wonderful it is to have a partner that you trust and that you love and that you have so many friends, like you mentioned. There are a lot of people out there that don't feel like they have any of those things. So you're so ahead of the game. And like if you if you want to live in that world, you already have enough to draw from from that you've created your own family. And so looking outside of that into a situation that is unknown, isn't necessarily going to be the most productive thing for you. Yeah, you're right. I'm going to take that into mind. Hopefully one day I'll be able to just pull that bandaid off and at least give them the opportunity to have their feelings about it rather than mulling it over in my head repeatedly, coming up with scenarios that may not

play out that way. Yeah, there's a lot of conjecture and speculation that we put into things that may or may not ever come to fruition. And that's our brain at work and our ego at work. And so enjoying what you have and relishing all of the wonderful things that you already have going for you, which we can all tell that you've got your shit together in a big way. That's big, you know, celebrate that and enjoy that. And disrupting the situation in the way that you're talking about is something that really needs to be seriously thought out. And obviously you are thinking about it, but it doesn't seem like you're ready to do that. And you don't have to make that decision tomorrow or the next day or the next day. An opportunity may present itself for you in the

future where then it makes total sense to do it. You know? Yeah. So when you know, yeah, it'll happen that moment. Thank you guys. Yeah. You deserve to be happy too. Don't forget that. Yes, of course. I've definitely taken all the traumatic things that have happened in my life and used humor, dark humor. It's a really big leaning point in my life. And finding the light, even when it seems like there isn't any, you have to find some way to turn your perspective because that's really all you have. As you're saying that, there's all these light beams coming down on you in your car while we're watching you. So I just want you to know the light has found you. Thank you, guys. Yes. Okay, Gabrielle. Well, take care and keep us posted. If anything changes, let us know.

If you do contact them, just keep us posted if anything develops. Definitely will do. Thank you guys so much. Thanks, Gabrielle. Well, let's take a quick break, but I think there's more to unpack with Gabrielle's story. Okay. Yeah. Let's take a break after that. Jeez. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together on the Really No Really podcast, our mission is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why they refuse to make the bathroom door go all the way to the floor. We got the answer.

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How are you, too? Hello, my friend. Wayne Knight about Jurassic Park. Wayne Knight, welcome to Really No Really, sir. Bless you all. Hello, Newman. And you never know when Howie Mandel might just stop by to talk about judging.

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Wow, that's heavy. Yeah. And especially her feeling this guilt around having accepted money in exchange for her silence. And, you know, to me, it doesn't feel like that's something that needs to buy her silence forever. No, no, no. I agree with you that he doesn't get to buy her silence. You know, I was going to suggest, you know, I was thinking while she was on the call, I was like, oh, well, maybe she should wait until the father dies. And I'm like, wait, why is she?

No, she should do whatever she really wants to, because why let him off the hook? You know, he's the one that is worried about it coming to the fore. But yeah, that is a, it's just, it's just so heavy to think about that. And the kind of need that we all feel about wanting those familial bonds, that desire to be loved by the people that have rejected you. Well, that's our basic human need, desire, connection. Mina, can I ask what the status is of you and your mom's relationship? I'm pending. Yeah.

It's generational trauma, too. You know what I mean? Like, we just had a perfect example of it, you know, and how these things just keep going. Yeah. It's generational trauma too. You know what I mean? Like we just had a perfect example of it, you know, and how these things just keep going. Yeah. I mean, again, what I did, I never wanted it to be a blame game. I never wanted this to be about like, you didn't do this for me. I'm very aware of how, like, even though I'm sure I'm going to give everything to my son, I'm sure he'll come up with some reason to hate me, you know, but that's the thing too. The process of doing that is like, I now gone into a whole different space of like what it must've been like for my mom. Right. I was the

fourth child was I lost in the mix. There were a lot of things my mom experienced when she was younger that didn't give her a chance to be a mature enough parental figure. And that's not her fault. For me, just trying to be present, do the work and break that pattern. Yeah. And I think when you put that effort forth, you get the results back in dividends. And it doesn't necessarily happen just when you want it or when you crack open that conversation because it is a prolonged

conversation. It doesn't happen overnight. But it does feel like when people are really honest, painfully honest with themselves, you reap benefits that you just weren't aware were even available to your life and to your psyche. And, you know, even trying, if you think about it as an investment for your relationship with your own child and breaking that intergenerational trauma, like I don't want to repeat the patterns of my mother. And yes, my mother's not a bad or good person. Like, you know, what happened between your relationship doesn't classify somebody as bad or as good because we're not taking into account their history. I didn't until I went to therapy like you, Mina, I never even took into account what my mother was dealing with, what my father was dealing with, what they experienced when they lost their son, who was my brother. To me, it was like my brother's dead, my brother's dead. To my parents, it was their kid. So until you become a fully realized or a self-actualized adult, you can't even contemplate what other people went through. And that is the meaning of being healthy

is understanding that everyone's experience is different and everyone has their own perspective. And the blame game is about as useful as an ashtray on a motorcycle because it gets you nowhere. And that is a narrative, a narrative, a narrative that just runs out of gas. As soon as it's someone else's fault, then you're not taking ownership over anything about yourself. Yeah, that's like how I lived my life for the most part. Blaming people, you mean?

Well, yeah, like I'm just racing towards this like idea of perfection, you know, and like holding up everyone up against it. So yeah, it's a lot healthier for me now to just be open and honest and real and talk about these things and I'm working on myself. And, you know, something interesting also that I've heard before and that you write about in your book is about how after you would have, you know, intimacy

or have an orgasm, that was when it would come into your body where you would kind of break down and really become vulnerable in those moments. And I've heard that before. And I find it so interesting because everything we were learning is that all of our trauma lives in our bodies, right? So we react in ways that we're not aware of when we're hit with these emotions and when we're hit and it just relives and replays in your body, in your body until you go inside and fix the problem. Yeah. There's a great book called The Body Keeps the Score. I'm reading that one right now. And then there's an amazing documentary called The Wisdom of Trauma. Totally recommend these. They're like mind blowing. It's like the best therapy you could ever get. This book's really helping me make

a lot of connections and understand all of that behavior. It's really all laid out in there. Yeah, I've heard about that book. I'm going to read that actually. That's a book I need to read, The Body Keeps the Score, because I've heard- That's what happened for me is because of the rape, the way that sex was intertwined with it, I turned over and started bawling. And so I believe that was the trauma that came out upon that release. So there's always some form of trigger, right? Yeah. That was the tension. I mean, I've had moments too, like, yeah, my adrenals are shot.

I've had moments too, where something's happened for me and my hands start shaking because my body's reacting to it. So this is what I mean. This book, I'm telling you, it is gold. And it literally tells you how it's proven how one of our hemispheres literally shuts down during the experience of trauma. So these are the conversations to have. It's not so much like trauma builds character. I mean, people literally cannot write their brains around it. So it's sort of a disservice to say like, snap out of it. The communication isn't happening. So a lot of the work that I have to do is like, oh, holy shit, my hand's shaking.

Let me try to work with my thoughts here to actually calm my system down, right? To me, that was the biggest gift because it truly helped me like understand how to help myself. Cause I think that's like the biggest thing is people think like, Oh, I'm the only one who's experiencing this. I'm totally lost. You know, I'm lost upon myself. I have no control. And you really do. I mean, like truly. And again, in the wisdom of trauma, Gabor Mate is like my hero. I love this man. I want, like truly. And again, in the wisdom of trauma, Gabor Mate is like my hero. I love this man. I want to like put him in my pocket and like carry him everywhere. He's such a genius. And he just expresses that like the most just literally

in and of itself, how powerful is it to just understand that it's just your reaction to the trauma? It's not you. Oh my God. Like that right there is so important to just remember and to work with. Yeah. I was talking to Joe last night about it. When I was reading your book, I was telling him about it and I was saying, you know, what our brains do when we experience that trauma, you know, how we go into, we have to shut down to survive. You have to go into denial about what is happening in order to survive the incident, because otherwise it's too painful. And we don't have the skills to deal with that kind of pain. And he was like, well, what happens when you get that knowledge and then you have trauma? And I

was like, well, I think when you get that knowledge, nothing becomes that traumatic. And he said, well, no, what if you know all the things you know, and you've been to the therapy, you get that you go into denial, and then you have a traumatic experience. And I said, well, no, what if you know all the things you know and you've been to the therapy, you get that you go into denial and then you have a traumatic experience. And I said again, I go, I just don't think it's the same level of trauma. Like you've been through something before. You can have a reaction. Yes, a building can collapse or you could be in a plane crash or you could get sexually assaulted. Those things are all possibilities. But I think once you've lived through that and understand the way that all works, you don't go into a denial phase. But it could go the other way because interestingly enough in the book, what they talk about is how the trauma in and of itself has a beginning,

middle and an end. And so sometimes it can backfire. So when we're reliving things, when we're being triggered, we don't know where we're at. It doesn't have that cycle anymore. And that's why for me, I'll start shaking or the bawling comes up. It's because all that tension, it's all just there. So I guess the thing that I try to do and what I've done over the years is just let it out, allow it to come out. I don't want to incorporate it anymore into my body. So I just work to allow myself to express it. Yes. And not resist it. Never resist it. Yeah. Because I think upon resistance, we just create more disease in the body. That's just my opinion. No, I think that's true. I think that's very true. I think we're all learning that now. People, they think the body's

just like, you know, this thing that's carrying us around. It's like it's carrying everything around. And we have such a short time here, even though it feels like it goes on and on and on sometimes. We have so many experiences and they happen so quickly. And, you know, most of us have an experience and then we have 50,000 other experiences before you can even digest what happened to you. So being in touch with your body is never going to steer you down the wrong path. It's only going to make you stronger and healthier. Yeah. Mind, mind, body, spirit. Right. That's right. That's right, sister.

Mind, body, spirit. Openness. Don't resist pain. Let it out. Grieve. Cry. Deal with your trauma and let it out because that is the way to extinguish it.

If it's ever going, I said this to my girlfriend yesterday. She was like, I didn't expect to be in this kind of pain. And remember, you're not alone. I'm telling you, watching the wisdom of trauma, it truly changed my life. After everything that I've gone through and the work that I'm still doing, just truly understanding that like every time you're entering the world, it's just, it's all trauma up against one another. It's, it's, it's, it gave me the ability to just hold even more space and compassion for other people and to not feel like, again, because I was just, I feel like trauma just

makes you feel like you're alone and then you're just pissed off all the time. And then when you just realize like, oh, we all kind of are like to a certain extent, it just, I feel like next level about this documentary and it can really push us into this space. We have to communicate more with one another. We have to understand that we're not alone. It's like it's reached the breaking point. And I think we can just work with each other more, you know, and understanding that we all have that, right? Instead of like looking at Instagram and acting like none of us do and constantly holding ourselves up against something that isn't real. Yeah. It'd be nice when Instagram goes away, won't it? Yeah. Will that ever happen? It will actually. Yeah. It'd be nice when Instagram goes away, won't it?

Yeah. Will that ever happen? It will actually. Yeah. I want it to just like, uh, overheat. Self-destruct. Maybe Instagram can go to the moon with Elon Musk and whoever else is going to the moon. There it is. Yeah. They can save it for that civilization that they create up there. They can give Instagram to them. We'll be like, we have this leftover from earth. Would you mind taking it from us? Cause we can't, I don't know. It was great and it was fun, but I feel like it's like, we have two, we have two gifts for you, Instagram and climate change. They're all yours. Goodbye. Anyway, Mina, it's been a pleasure speaking with you. I'm glad you wrote this book. It was really powerful. I want to encourage anybody who suffered trauma, please pick this up

and know that you're not alone. And people who haven't, it's a great book to get into the psyche of a lot of women in this world and a lot of people who have suffered things that, you know, maybe you haven't. But it's so important to understand what that is like and how that develops in a person and how patterns of behavior are so hard to break. But when they do, oh my God, you have like a whole new world. Thank you. Thank you for having me. I'm so grateful, really. It was our pleasure. Thank you, Mina. Have a great day. Thank you. You too. Okay. Take care. All the best. Lots of love. Take care. Bye. Okay. Well, in conclusion, Catherine, I'm eager to, well, I guess I'm still thinking about Gabrielle and I, I sticks with you. I know. And then I remembered my brother that I haven't even spoken

to, you know, I had no interest in meeting him. And then I thought, Oh God, am I going to tell her that? But then I just figured I had to because it's the truth. And yeah, I have no interest in getting to know my half-brother. I don't know what that says about me, but it's how I feel. Well, I think just like Mina said, if it becomes the right time, I think you'll know. You know, your family might change on that. I think also because I have so many siblings, it's just like, oh, not another one. That's how I feel.

I'm like, wait a second. Our party bus is full would you want to if you found out that you had a half brother or a half sister that contacted you what would your reaction be do you think I think shock of course first and then interestingly actually in my family my dad is that person he out, like met all of his family when he was in his mid 20s. And he was he was the he was the sort of secret baby who like everyone knew about. But he didn't meet any of his family. So he was in his mid 20s.

And so I grew up just knowing all of his siblings as like my aunts and uncles, but found out later in life like, oh, no, these are all his half siblings. And I mean, I think if that was my situation, I would want to know them because in my family, it's very like, cool, one more. Great. Like, let's add another, whether it's Thanksgiving or something. If there's a friend who doesn't have somewhere to go or someone doesn't have a place to stay for a couple of weeks, they would always come stay at our house. And so I think after the shock wore off so I think after the shock wore off, I think I would be open to meeting them. Does everyone have a secret sibling? I think that's the title of this episode. I think it might be. Okay. Well, problem solved. Okay. With regard

to my standup, you guys, I have added 27 or 30 cities. I'm not sure, but 27, 30 cities. We've added Des Moines. We've added your request people, people who requested Louisville, Kentucky. Guess fucking what? I'm coming. We've added Montclair, New Jersey. We've added a whole slew of cities. So if you have not gotten your tickets yet, do it. ChelseaHandler.com. We just announced 30 more cities, 27 or 30. Niagara Falls, I'm talking to you too. So suck on that. I'll see everybody on tour. Loving it.

Vaccinated and horny. Bye. Thanks for listening, everybody. We'll be back next week. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together, our mission on the Really Know Really podcast is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why the bathroom door doesn't go all the way to the floor,

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