Dear Chelsea - Into The Great Unknown with Riley Keough
Episode Date: December 5, 2024 Riley Keough joins Chelsea to talk about loving and losing a non-traditional mother like Lisa Marie Presley, spending time at both Graceland and Neverland Ranch, and why it’s good to know where y...ou came from. Then: A cousin wants to spill the beans about a secret sibling. A groom-to-be worries that his best friend will drink too much at the wedding. And a surrogacy gone awry leaves a mom-of-two feeling lost. * Need some advice from Chelsea? Email us at DearChelseaPodcast@gmail.com * Executive Producer Catherine Law Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert * * * * * The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees. This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all. Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice.   See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Okay. Hi.
Hi, Chelsea. Hi, how are you? I'm great. How are you? I'm sorry. I'm sucking on
a energy mint. I didn't know that was a thing. I know. I'm trying out all these little different
sources of energy because I don't really drink coffee. Yeah. So excuse my sucking.
Welcome to the show, everybody. I don't think we announced last week that my book is available
for pre-order. My new book, it's called I'll have what she's having very exciting title my editor came up with just to be on the just to
go on the record and make sure people don't think I'm talking about myself that way but it's
available for pre-order uh everywhere Amazon Barnes and Noble they're signed copies at Barnes
and Noble I signed 10,000 books hopefully 10,000 I'm not about 8,500 right now. So I have 1,500 to go and I think I'll finish
it. I usually get the job done. And they're available at Amazon, Target, bookshop.org,
Audible, Barnes & Noble, Apple Books. Bam, books a million. That was the one I was thinking of.
Okay. So you can pre-order my book anywhere. It comes out February 25th, which is my 50th birthday.
So I was very excited to unveil the cover
on Instagram
and on some sort of
I think it was People Magazine
yes
Amazing
People Magazine
yes
and everybody
get your copy
because we're going to have a book club
and so if they want a signed copy
do they just go to one of these
real
like the first 10,000
I think so
the first 10,000
I'm not really sure
we'll find out
no
you can find out more here
I don't know
they just said
I know for sure Barnes & Noble bookseller and then Bam Books A Million has
signed copies.
Awesome.
That's fantastic.
And then we have another book author coming, book author, author of a book coming on the
show today who's here with us today.
She's an actor and director and her name is Riley Keough.
She is the co-author of From Here to the Great Unknown, which is the memoir of her late
mother, Lisa Marie Presley. She is the granddaughter of Priscilla and Elvis Presley. And now the sole
trustee of Graceland. Please welcome Riley Keough. Hi, Riley Keough. Hi, guys. So cute. First of all,
I want to say we're sitting here in my house. it's still not done. I watched a lot of your
interviews in promotion of your book, which everybody knows by now, it's called From Here
to the Great Unknown by Lisa Marie Presley and Riley Keough. I've been watching your interviews
and I just want to say, I wanted to start by saying that with everything you've experienced in your life and everything that you have been
through and exposed to, you have a very calm and grounded aura about you. And it's very easy to see.
So congratulations on that. Thank you. That's an achievement. Yes, it is. I don't feel that way, but the aura is important. You don't feel that way?
Not all the time.
How do you feel that way?
No.
Do you feel that way any of the time?
I do some of the time.
I have felt that, but I definitely have felt many other things.
Yeah, I would imagine that to be true.
So I was reading your book, and when I got to the end and was reading the little author's notes and it said at the end of
yours it says she is the eldest daughter of Lisa Marie Presley and sole trustee of Graceland
and I thought that sentence I was like like that made me just feel so overwhelmed for you
like the sole trustee of Graceland like what does that mean to you? You know, I don't know. I think it just, I think it's actually meaningful to me. I think it's
something that I have always, even when I wasn't the soul trustee, it's something that I've
participated in, in a sense with my mom and we were very close. So like a lot of the Graceland
stuff I was already involved in with her. So I don't know.
To be honest, it doesn't really feel like that intense to me.
I think on paper it sounds.
Yeah, I did.
I was like, oh, I don't want that kind of responsibility.
Yeah.
I mean, luckily, there's a lot of people involved.
So it's not all on just my shoulders.
Right.
Of course.
They've been running that operation for a while.
I was there a few years ago when I was performing over there.
I think I, is there a venue?
There is, yeah.
Yeah, I think I performed there.
That's where I was, yeah.
Okay, so this book was your mom wanted to write a book
and she asked you to help her with it.
There's parts that are in your voice
and there are parts in her voice.
And it's heavy and beautiful and joyful.
And you had so many beautiful, joyful experiences growing up and crazy experiences and different people in and out of your lives. And so I wonder, what does it feel like, A, to be the granddaughter of someone so legendary and knowing so much about him through your own family, but without ever having met him yourself?
Well, I think my answer is probably a lot less interesting than people would want it to be,
but it's felt very normal to me. I'm aware, obviously, that it's a unique situation, but I think that my perception of him was always familial and my relation to him,
even though I didn't meet him, was through my family.
So it felt personal. But I, you know, I can acknowledge the how unique it is. But I think
that even though he was always around, and his music was always playing, and he was kind of
everywhere all the time, it still just felt like a personal family connection.
Have you ever sat and watched his films and been like, oh my God,
this is my grandfather. This is where I've come from. I have, but I think I'm like the kind of
person who's like obsessed with where I came from anyway. So it's, what's really cool is that I have
so much of it to look at, you know, I think that I'm like very interested in my family history and
my family tree on both
sides of my family so it's it's actually very cool and one of the coolest things for me being
like obsessed with where I've come from is that our entire family tree and everything because of
like archives at Graceland we have like a whole detailed thing but yeah it's it's uh I definitely
have especially when I was a teenager, would watch performances.
And so with your mother and her losing her father at the age of nine, that was obviously something that she struggled with throughout her life.
And the way you speak about your mother is in almost, and you say this in the beginning of the book, you say, like, I almost have, I forget the exact wording, but like a maternal instinct. I sometimes think about if
I were a mother to my own mother and to my grandmother, which I thought was very powerful.
So tell me a little bit about that. When I was writing, I was talking to my publisher and I
said that. And then I thought, well, I'm going to put it in the book because I don't really know
exactly what it means, but it's how I felt. And I think that
that was a feeling I had as far back as I could remember that I felt like I wanted to protect
my mother and I guess nurture her or mother her. And I had that with my grandmother too. So I don't
know what, why. I think maybe, and not to say, by the way, they were both great parents and my
mother was extremely nurturing.
But I just felt this desire to, or empathy.
It was probably empathy, honestly.
Yeah, I think it's totally natural. I mean, I think you want a mother.
As a woman, like, you know, you want to protect the people that you love.
And that becomes a kind of like mothering kind of, not role, but you can be a mother to your own mother sometimes.
And I think you certainly have been from what's in the book. I think so. I mean, I think it's more common than I'd realized
in my 20s that you get to this point and you can become the mother or your relationship changes
with your mother. In my case, it was kind of drastic because there was drug use. So it was
like a kind of a 360 situation.
But yeah, it's like kind of an inevitable circumstance, whether it's due to age or something,
you know, so I think that it's always in you, I guess.
Yeah, I think that it's also the role that your father has played in your life and your
brother's life and your mother's life.
Always this constant, you know, this constant presence and them living
together even after they divorced and all in that relationship and how long they stuck together
and how he, as you say, was such a protector of hers. What is your relationship to your father
mean to you after having gone through all of these losses together?
Well, our relationship, my whole life has been incredibly close. Actually, all of us,
my mom, my dad, my brother, all of us four, and my two younger sisters, but primarily us four,
we're very, very close. And I think that there's this sense like that we're the only two left out
of that family that was created. And I also didn't expect it to be me and him.
So there's this weird, he's kind of a wild card, my dad. And I hope he one day writes his own book
because his story is so fascinating regardless of my mom. He's just one of those people that
has the most insane life. But I think that there is this sense of we share a lot of the same experiences and loss and grief and suffering in a sense, but also the love that was there.
So it is very unique.
Like, I feel very grateful to have him.
I mean, yeah.
I mean, during this time of loss, or I know it wasn't right back to back, but between your brother and your mother, I mean, you needed another witness there.
I mean, anybody would.
Are you close?
You're still close with your grandmother, right? I am. Yeah, we're close. We are. She's wonderful. I mean, we've been close
my whole life. And I think that a lot, I've been doing a lot of press who've, you know,
asked about our relationship because obviously there was a lot of news when my mom passed. But
ultimately, like, we have never, I mean, to this day, I've never really had an argument and we're fairly close, you know.
We're a pretty average family other than the random, you know, lawsuit and oddity here and there.
Oh, right.
I wasn't even talking about that.
Did that get sorted out?
It did.
It did.
Okay.
Okay, great.
That's good to know.
But your father lives in, you live in LA?
Yeah, I do.
And your father lives in LA, right?
He does, yeah.
So, I mean, I don't know.
I kind of looked at it, like I was reading it and I'm like, God, you're dad and you kind
of sound like soulmates.
Yeah.
I think we all, like there was a sense between all of us that we were soulmates or something.
Yeah.
You know, like him and my mother and my brother and myself and my father. There was such closeness there that I think a lot of my processing of their loss is like
also processing the closeness as well and realizing how unique that was.
Well, you talk about in the book when your brother took his life and that you knew that
your mom wasn't going to be able to survive that for very long, instinctively.
And you talk about how you guys all just kind of came together and stayed in the house and really grieved together and didn't talk about anything other than Ben and, you know, really honored him.
And I thought that was very powerful because not a lot of people know how to do something like that.
No, and I think that it was a unique situation because it was COVID.
So there was also nothing to do. and we were all stuck in the house. And so, but I also felt very grateful
for it because I think that had life been its usual self that maybe I would have, I don't know,
tried to escape some of the pain. And I think that the way that we grieved, you know, it's obviously like a lifelong
process, but in that moment was really effective. I just kept feeling like in the moment, like the
only way out is through, I remember. And I just felt like I had to feel it all and had to be
present through it. And I think that because we were all staying in this house and because it was,
you know, the pandemic allowed for that kind of grief, which normally you just kind of go back to work and have to process while you're juggling life.
Well, it seems like your mom, from what I read, organized times for you guys to be creative together and grieve together and process.
Can you talk a little
bit about that? Yeah. I mean, I think that when he passed, like her whole life was then grief,
grieving my brother, like in mourning essentially. And I think that at times that was intense
because that was, you know, she had a very strong personality. And so whatever she was feeling was how the room was feeling.
So I think that her feelings dictated everybody around. And I think that she was kind of firm in
not wanting to ever stop grieving my brother. And so it was kind of like when you're around me,
I'm in pain and that's just how it is. But the honesty in it was really,
I mean, in her whole life and in her grief was very powerful too.
Did you feel at all like you suspected your mother wouldn't be able to survive Ben's death and that she was going to struggle with it, which initially she didn't, right?
She stayed sober for a while, you write about.
But did you feel at all, I mean, it felt like when you were on the plane ride coming home and texting with your dad about, you know, whether or not she
was alive still, that there was almost an acceptance from you that that was the way it was going to be
instead of sometimes, you know, we resist and fight the reality that we're in.
I think a lot of my lifetime has been acceptance. Just being around a lot of addiction
and situations that were not in my control.
So by the time she passed,
I think I had had a lot of practice
in accepting what is,
not that it's not painful,
but I think that, you know,
through her addiction, my brother,
you know, things with my father,
like there's been a lot of things
where I've just had to, there's nothing to do other than surrender to what's happening.
And there were other things that had happened with her health. She had had a seizure,
which I mentioned in the book prior. So there were these moments where I kind of
had placed myself in that scenario. And also through her addiction, I thought it was a very
likely outcome that she wasn't going to make it through her addiction. So there was a lot of
bumps in the road along the way. But I think ultimately when my brother died, I did,
I could see that she was here, you know, begrudgingly, you know, and, and so there was,
for whatever reason, I, in that that moment I did feel a sort of
I don't know just I just felt like I accepted whatever was going to happen and also the idea
that she's finally at peace yeah right and on some new adventure and and I mean I know you're
probably spiritual right I gathered that from your writing yeah I think that's the other thing is that I like through these things that have happened I think I've I've chosen to look at death in a way that feels
I don't know truthful like like the most like from my experiences I guess through loss and
through grief and stuff I guess I've chosen that I like to look at it as more of like a wonder of
life as opposed to like the end so I think that I try to apply that it as more of like a wonder of life as opposed to like the end.
So I think that I try to apply that because we have, you know, no idea. So I like to live in the
wonder of it instead of the... I like people who talk about the idea that they do know what's
going to happen. It's like when people say something like drowning is the most peaceful
way to die, you're like, who told you that? Who told you that? No shit. I'm like, drowning is the most peaceful way to die you're like who told you that yeah who told you that worst nightmare no shit i'm like that is the worst possible scenario
um what do you feel a responsibility i'm sure you do but how do you how does this
work in your life with your younger sisters how old are they they're 16 oh yeah so you're like
are you like a mama bear to them? I think so.
You know, I'm not their mom, but I am their older sister.
And I think that I've, you know, spent a lot of my life.
I'm 20 years older than them.
So it feels more like an aunt or a mother kind of relationship than, I don't know.
The other day, one of them said, you feel like you're my age.
I was like, oh, thanks.
But yeah, it's definitely more like a, you know,
I'm much older, so it does have that sort of dynamic. And do you feel a sense of responsibility
to continue your mom's spirit with your sisters and to like carry on the traditions that she gave
you guys and taught you? Definitely. Yeah, I definitely, and they do too. You know, they want
to like, they want to, you know, honor her and do things she did and stuff.
I don't push them in any direction, but I kind of see what indicates to them and then follow their lead in that.
It's funny.
When I read about your dad and your mom, they both have such huge personalities.
You could see that.
And I'm not saying you don't have a huge personality.
I'm just saying when you come from two people with two huge with two big personalities like that how do you find your way because you're
an artist too yeah I think that my dad is actually probably more similar to me like I would say that
I'm actually I would say I'm an introvert and I would say my dad is as well I think that through
like film and having to be in this world I can be be extroverted. But naturally, like I am more of an introvert and not in a sort of like shy way, but just in a quiet way. I don't know if that has to do with my mom being so large or not. But yeah, I've thought about that before because she was such a, you know, presence. But I don't really think so I think that it's
maybe just my personality were you were you or lack thereof were you were you nervous when you
sang for Daisy and the Sixth no you weren't I wasn't because I don't know I think like I have
like something wrong with me where I I like don't get nervous really really yeah I know I don't know
why I just I think it's like I have a sense of humor maybe do you have fears oh yeah okay I have
fears because I was gonna say that's usually when you have no fear that means something it's like
your amygdala you don't have an amygdala no I'm I'm like a total like neurotic person, but it's like about, you know, I'm a
hypochondriac, like it's other things. Right. But I don't know. I think I just like if I fail at
something like this or if I was to try to sing and I couldn't do it, I just, I don't know. I
just didn't take it very seriously, I guess. That's refreshing. Seriously. I mean, especially
in this industry, a lot of people are very self-serious. Yes, I know. I'm very not self-serious. Okay. So you spent a lot of time
at Neverland on top of Graceland, which Oprah mentioned. She's like, this is the only woman
that's lived in Graceland and Neverland. How do you view Michael Jackson and your experience with
him? My experience with Michael was obviously through a six-year-old me's
lens. So it was like very fun and larger than life. And, you know, all the things that we
would do together were always like big events. So it was just like my memory of it was just
everything was fun all the time. But my life was kind of like that. Like our life was kind of nuts,
in comparison to my life now, which is very like small and kind of normal, you know. So I think Michael and my mom both enjoyed creating these extravagant scenarios. So that was kind of my experience.
Right. But with the impact of everything that we found out about Michael Jackson and all the allegations, like, did that have an impact on your view of the situation?
Of their marriage?
Of their marriage and just, yeah, like, I mean, you must have been like, are these things true, right, about him?
Yeah, I think that, I mean, at the time, I wasn't aware of the case.
And it just became something that was just sort of around.
Like there was never a conversation about it.
I'm sure my mom would have had those conversations at the time with other people.
But for me, it was just this thing that I guess I ended up just kind of knowing about.
But there was never a conversation with my mom where she kind of sat me down and went like, so, you know, there's this
allegation, you know, but by the time that that was in my world, I was much older and Michael
wasn't really in my universe. Well, when I was reading, I mean, I was surprised by what she was
divulging in this book about being married to Michael Jackson. I was like, oh, I didn't,
you know, as an outsider, you looked at that. You didn't know that that was real. You didn't
know that they had chemistry, that they had an intimate relationship per se as an outsider.
So I was like, oh, wow.
I found that fascinating.
So this is a nice Scientology success story, right?
It was nice that, like, I've heard so many negative things about Scientology.
It was kind of nice to hear your mother, them helping her get sober and wanting to be there. And that was the place she felt safest for a long time.
Yeah. I mean, I think it was like the way she would talk about it when she was here was very
funny. Like, I don't know if the tone comes across in the book, but it was kind of like
nobody would take care of her but them, you know? So I think she felt this sense
of like community and really cared for when she was a teenager. And I think she was, you know,
self-proclaimed like very difficult. So I think that, you know, that was her experience.
And then did she, she ended up leaving Scientology at a certain point, right?
Yeah. Well, she, she like, I think the way I phrased it was like, I don't know if it was a chicken or the egg kind of a situation, but she basically, when she started taking opiates, she kind of up and left like her whole life and moved to England and fired everyone in her life and left her religion and her life and her friends and just moved to England and wanted
like to totally start over and at the time I wasn't aware that there was like a substance
abuse issue so it just sort of to a lot of people around just felt like this random really intense
cleansing cleansing of people and things and and nobody really understood what was going on.
And then she got to England and then the sort of pills progressed.
So it wasn't so much her leaving Scientology.
She kind of just like left her life a bit.
Like it was an escape from everything.
What's your relationship with drugs and alcohol?
I would be so scared if, you know,
like, I mean, maybe not scared, mindful. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I think that, um, I've never had
like addiction issues. I've smoked cigarettes for a really long time and that was hard for me to
quit, but I never like had a sense that I had like a dependency on drugs or alcohol for whatever reason.
I have no idea because my entire family are addicts.
But I just, yeah, I think that there's like a fear there that it can, I think the reason why I think there's a fear is because my mom's addiction was, to me, felt random at 40.
So it felt like this like kind of scary thing that came out of nowhere.
But I don't, I don't foresee that. But I do have this sort of like fear around how it's sort of,
I don't know. I don't know what the fear is, but there is this, yeah. But I don't know. I also
just like don't really like drinking. So I think that's. Well, there you go. That's going to be
helpful. I mean, you know, and I think some people have that personality and some people don't.
Yeah.
And if you're in that kind of pain for that long amount, you know, for that period of time,
and it was clear from reading this book that she was never getting over her father dying,
which, why would you?
You know, a nine-year-old doesn't know how to digest that.
And then that hits you, usually at 40.
Like, I lost my brother when I was nine.
And I went into deep, deep therapy at 40 because everything turned.
And, like, I totally understand why it would creep up on her at that age.
Yeah.
Because you're suppressing and repressing for as long as possible, right?
Yeah.
And escaping and all of the other stuff.
Okay.
On that note, we're going to take a break and we'll be right back with Riley Keough.
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Okay, and we're back.
And we're going to take some callers, some questions for the rest of the episode.
We sure are.
And we're going to give advice, you know, feel free to let it rip.
I'll try my best.
I'm sure that you have very good advice that you don't even know about yet.
Well, our first question.
Oh, okay.
Thank you.
Thank you.
I'm going to use this for the first one.
Are you guys flirting right now?
This looks kind of sexual what's happening here.
They're married, by the way. Oh, yes, I knew this. Our first question, the subject is family secrets,
and this comes from Jay. Oh, perfect. Jay says, Dear Chelsea, I come from a large Catholic family
and grew up with 16 cousins on one side, the side that the secret involves. My grandparents had
seven kids. I was the grandchild whose parents had me when they were young and never married.
My mom's no longer in the picture.
When my parents dated, they hung out with his brother who was closest in age to him
and his then-girlfriend, my aunt.
This was around the end of the 70s.
And when I was a kid, my mom told me that as teenagers,
that aunt and uncle got pregnant and had a baby.
Anyway, my aunt... Wait, wait, aunt and uncle, that brother and sister.
No, no, no. Sorry. So this is the two brothers.
These are a lot of characters.
There's a lot going on.
After 16, I was, yeah.
So her, it's her dad's brother who was closest in age, that aunt and uncle. So his girlfriend
and this is just an aunt and uncle.
One of the seven. One of the seven. When I was a kid, they got pregnant and had a baby.
My aunt was, of course, moved to wherever for nine months for secrecy, and the baby was given
up for adoption quietly. Yes, my uncle knew and my mom knew because they were friends,
but my grandparents didn't know. Nobody knew until my mom told me. My aunt
and my uncle got married and have three other children together. So the oldest male cousin
is not actually their oldest. Fast forward to about three years ago when I was talking with
my aunt. I was tipsy and I told her that I knew about her first child. This child was a boy and
would actually be the oldest cousin she was in obvious disbelief
but told me they're still keeping the secret from their three other adult children my aunt has met
the son that they gave up he came to a church function and sat in the back and saw his parents
and siblings from afar i want to tell them so badly their other kids the aunt and uncle are
in their 30s and 40s and i'm bursting at the seams that i'm the only other person that knows this do I would keep that to yourself.
It's not your place at all.
In my opinion, you do not want to. This is not your secret to tell your mother for telling her her mother told her she's that was a big thumbs down. It's not your first. These aren't your brothers and sisters. This isn't your nuclear family. I know they're your relatives. But yeah, mind your own business here. That's not your secret to tell. What do you think? I think I agree with you. I've had some things like this in my family and I think that it is best to not, you know, I think.
Unless it's a, I don't know, I guess it depends on what your intention is. I think if it'll cause a
lot of hurt, then maybe it's. Yeah, well, you can have a good intention and it can still cause a lot
of hurt, right? Like you, it's not, it's lot of hurt right like you it's not it's just
it's like it's not your information to share and unfortunately you know about it so that's your i
mean that's yeah no i don't think it's your information to share yeah so it's really it
feels like it's just the three cousins that are her age-ish that don't that are the important
ones that don't know you know it's not like revealing an affair or anything like that. Yeah. And you don't have any sense of responsibility. Like, again, it's not,
it's not your thing. And I mean, I found out that I had a brother. We, my brothers and sisters found
out that I had a brother, we had a brother and I had absolutely no interest in pursuing that
relationship. I'm like, I have already enough brothers and sisters. Like I didn't want to know
that. You know what I mean? So don't assume that you know, like what other people are going
to want either. That's true. So yeah, I would keep that to yourself and just try to forget that you
even know that information. Would you even I mean, is there any world in which you'd encourage like
the aunt to reach out or where you would reach out? Like if you're this person who's bursting
at the seams? No, not to reach out.
It's not her situation.
Yeah, okay.
No, she's just accidentally found,
it's like overhearing a conversation.
Pretend you overheard it and it's none of your business.
That's what I would say.
So yeah, keep your mouth shut.
All right, Jay, there you have it.
It's encouraging to know that's happening to other families,
but I would suspect that's exactly right. Especially with famous people, people coming out of the woodwork left and right.
The amount of cousins and siblings and things that we get.
Oh, yeah, I'm sure.
Well, luckily now they have DNA testing.
So you can actually be sure.
Luckily or unluckily.
Yeah, right.
Yes.
Exactly.
All right. Well, Chris says, Dear Chelsea, I was lucky to have the opportunity to bring two little
boys into the world for another family as their surrogate.
I know that sounds like your worst nightmare.
The first surrogacy journey had a few hiccups with the mom being a bit controlling, sending
glass bottled water because our water wasn't suitable.
Is this the surrogate talking?
This is the surrogate talking, yes.
Organic fruits and vegetables because she didn't think the organic produce I purchased was good enough, but I chalked it up to her not being able to carry,
so she wanted to be involved any way she could. They asked me to carry their second embryo,
and the pregnancy started out a bit different. They were very consumed with baby number one,
and I get it because my wife and I have two very active kids of our own.
I'd have to reach out to let them know that my OB appointments went well or that the ultrasound looked fine.
They rarely asked about the baby or me.
The family is extremely well off, and I felt like I was just someone on their staff rather than a close friend like I felt with the first baby.
At 28 weeks, I was diagnosed with gestational diabetes, and that's when things started to go south. The mom was on me about my diet and exercise, even though the dietician she hired confirmed
that my diet was perfect and I was doing everything I could to ensure her baby's and my health.
At 37 weeks, I needed an emergency induction. The parents live out of state, and the mom actually
tried to negotiate my care with my doctor to delay the induction so she could have skin-to-skin with
her baby when he was born, all while I was on the brink of organ failure and in labor. They made it to the hospital with 90
minutes to spare, and she got to do skin to skin with her perfect seven-pound baby. I experienced
lots of blood loss and had an extended hospital stay, but still managed to kickstart my milk
production for their baby. The icing on the cake was when they were saying goodbye, they didn't even say
thank you. I was the one who thanked them for the opportunity to be part of creating their family.
In the days and weeks after, I struggled with all of the trauma around the pregnancy and delivery.
So my question is, do I confront her about this experience? I'll be done pumping soon and would
like some closure, but is it worth it to let her know how she made me feel, or do I just let it go and move on? Because at the end of the day, I achieved what I set out to do,
helped create a family for someone who could not. Thanks for your help, Chris.
Wow.
Hi.
Hi.
This is our special guest, Riley Keough.
Hello.
Wow, that sounds really, well, traumatizing. Yeah, yeah, it was.
And like part of me is just like, am I being so trivial that like, I don't know, I should
just like move on and get past it because I did what I set out to do.
But I still get triggered for little things.
So I don't know.
I think you have every right to speak your mind and it doesn't have to be in an angry
way.
Like I think
probably putting it in writing is the best way when you are ready and when you are done
breastfeeding and providing the baby with whatever things. I mean, you did finish your
quote unquote job and set of responsibilities, but I think it is cathartic to let someone know that you felt not looked after or taken care of.
Them not saying thank you, all of the things that you're talking about, those are real things.
And they're very hurtful.
And I definitely don't think you should just suck it up.
I think it's important to state your peace in a loving, kind way when someone has kind of crossed a line or a boundary or
taken advantage of you and not shown you respect and grace, doing something that is the most
invaluable thing you could possibly do for another person, which is carry their child.
I just felt like it was such a disconnect from like the first pregnancy to the second
pregnancy.
And like I, something like switched and I was just like this employee of theirs.
I don't know.
Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't,
I understand what you're saying
but I wouldn't focus it on that aspect.
Like your relationship changed.
You should just focus on what didn't feel good.
You know what I mean?
Because I think there's a sense
saying our relationship changed
is almost like you have expectations,
which you totally can have, but you are doing them a service. You are providing them a service,
right? They're paying you to provide them a service. That doesn't mean they should be
allowed to treat you any way they want. But I wouldn't start from that angle because it's like,
it's not a relationship. It is a service. It's a transaction. And that's what you were hired to do. So expecting
more of a friendship is almost, I don't think that's where you jump off of. I think you have
to really just voice what they did that felt so icky to you. Like this felt really bad. I really
was so looking forward to providing this for you again. And we had such a
great experience the first time, you know, you could mention that this didn't feel great for me.
Then I definitely didn't feel like, you know, you cared about my wellbeing or however you want to
phrase everything that happened to you, but you should definitely get that down. Not only for
you know, to send to her, if you decide to do that for yourself yeah okay I mean how do you feel
about it now that it's in the past I don't know I'm the I almost kind of like I do feel like I
need to address it it was very much swept under the rug it was just like okay they got what they
wanted and then okay and I'm like literally shaking in the hospital bed as they're like
they're skiing in the glow of their sweet perfect baby and I just like as a mom I'm a mom and I have
children and like for her to just disregard that aspect I think that is the most like the the thing
that's like eating at me the most but now I feel like if if I could write her a letter, I feel like that's probably
a really good. Yeah. And not in an accusatory way, just in a way that you felt so sidelined
and marginalized and all of the things that you're talking about, like that didn't feel good at all.
I wanted to do this out of, you know, like, this is something that means a lot for me to do
for you. And this is how you, it left me feeling. Yeah. What do you think, Riley? I agree. I
actually, my child was born via surrogate. So I'm very grateful for what you do. And I think that
it's really important that it's, of course, it's transactional and it's a job, and I think that it's really important that it's it of course it's transactional and
it's a job but I think that it's a big sacrifice on your body and your mind and your family
and I think that it's not just like somebody who's coming to you know clean your house clean
your house or you know so I think it's I think it is important to to communicate
that in my opinion yeah thank you yeah are you finding that you're having these thoughts like
the anger and the you know troublesome thoughts that you're having are they coming up at various
points during the day are you sort of ruminating on them so it's like when I'm driving to work and
like my mind is wandering or like I'm shipping
milk to them, like when I go drop off milk, I like replay everything all over again. Yeah. That's
when it's happening. Yeah. You might, as you're writing this letter, when these thoughts come up,
jot them down in like a notes app. Jot down these things as they're coming up for you because it
helps to just sort of get it out of your body, get it out of your mind. And then you'll sort of have all of the talking points
that you want to address when you go to write the letter to her. And then you can kind of just pick
and choose like, okay, this note I wrote in a moment of anger, this note is like maybe the
best version of myself or like this particular part of it and kind of choosing the best version
of how you want to express yourself. But you'll have everything sort of like over time dumped into
one place. So you can tackle that letter from a place of, you know, respect for yourself as well.
Okay. No, that's good. That's good. Thank you.
And with every negative thought you have in terms of like seeing this out of your own body and stuff
so that you are able to let go and be free of it. Every time you have in terms of like seeing this out of your own body and stuff so that you are able to
let go and be free of it every time you have these thought patterns i want you to also have an
opposite thought you know whatever your negative thought is match it with an opposing viewpoint
like oh but i was able to provide them with this child i was able to provide them with something
that they couldn't do for themselves make sure you're reminding yourself of the honorable thing that you did.
That is beautiful.
And like, so, you know, it's the most important thing you could do for somebody.
And I can't think of anything more important to provide.
So to start just getting it out of your body, because you don't want to be angry and hold
on to that anger, you know, and you might write that letter and then realize like, I
don't even need to send this.
But if you do need to, then you should. Yeah. Okay. Okay. That's good. I like
that. Reminding myself of the awesomeness. Would you be a surrogate again for anyone else?
So I'm 40. I'm so old. That's when you have your midlife crisis when you're 40, you have more,
that's what's happening. That's a part of it. We were just talking about turning 40 and what that does to your brain. Yeah. No, I can't actually. My
doctor would, she'd be like, no, you can't. She told me you can not have any more kids. Yeah.
Especially for anybody else. Yeah. Well, that's wonderful that you did that. So pat yourself on
the back over and over again. And I think in lieu of reframing too, you could also think, you know,
I did this for this family, but I did it for this child.
You know, so even, you know, forget the parents.
You did it for this child.
And that's really cool.
Yeah.
You're right.
You built a little house for a baby.
Yeah.
I did.
Two babies.
Two babies.
That's right.
That's right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
All right.
Okay.
Thank you, Chris.
Take care.
All right. Bye, guys. Bye. Yeah. All right. Okay. Thank you, Chris. Yeah. Take care. All right. Bye guys.
Bye. When you hire a surrogate, do you go through, do you interview a lot of people? You do. I think everybody's different. I personally interviewed or I looked at like
three different families because you kind of talk to the surrogate and also their partner if they're in a relationship too. And we use like an agency. So they also put the candidate forward that they thought was the strongest. And that was kind of the one we were leaning towards. But yeah, there were like three or four different surrogates. And I'm curious as like, you know, with your whole history, how do you feel about
being a mom? Like your family is so mom heavy with all of your girl experiences, you know,
and generations. I mean, it's a wild experience. There's definitely a lot of, I think it was very
unique to lose my mom when my daughter was five months old. I think that
having a young child when you're in grief for your own mother is like, because I think your
own mothering comes up a lot regardless. Because when you have a child, you start reflecting on
the way you were parented and the way you were mothered. And so that was already happening.
So losing her at that time, it was a very strange time. And I think that the hardest thing was I felt like my mother was such a great mother and she was exceptionally great with babies, like with infants. So I felt like very alone, you know? But this really beautiful thing started happening where I could kind of like,
her instinct was so loud that I could hear her when I needed help. I really felt like I could hear her voice and what she would want or, you know, like I, my daughter was really sick about
a year ago and I was kind of panicking about it and I could kind of hear her going, you know,
like 101's not bad
102's you know 103 go to the dog could like hear her boy it was very strange so it's it's definitely
been like an emotional thing and I think I think that I personally have so much attention on
parenting and wanting to be and I don't know if that's this generation, because like you go on Instagram and
it's 10 things not to say to your kids, or maybe that's just my algorithm. It's probably my
algorithm. But it's very like, there's so much therapizing and advice and things not to do that
it's very overwhelming. I just read this thing today on Instagram on my plane ride that was like,
when someone's having an anxiety attack, don't say everything's going to be okay. I'm like, I thought that's the way you're supposed to say it.
I mean, the stuff with kids is crazy. It's like, don't tell them yes. Don't tell them no. Don't
tell them, you know, they're doing a good job. Don't tell them they're doing a bad job. Don't
look at them, you know? And it's like really overwhelming. So I, you know, I don't, I think
I try and go by instinct, but it's, I think it's something I really don't want to do a bad job at to the point of obsession.
Yeah.
But it's also such a gift to be able to sit here and say, as an adult woman, I had such a good mother.
Yes.
Do you know?
That is a gift.
I know.
And she certainly was not like a, I don't know what a perfect mother is.
She wasn't a traditional mother.
She wasn't a traditional mother, by any means, but I am so grateful to have had her as a mother.
To have that kind of love.
And I know that's, you know, unique. you realize you're singing the same songs that she sung to you and using the same little cute voice that she used with you with your own daughter.
And I think that sort of like family, like channeling through ourselves, our ancestors is like kind of unstoppable.
Yeah, I wish there was more language around that, you know, because you touch on that a lot in the book, like this kind of intergenerational knowing, like you come from this huge legendary person
who you feel like you did know
because of the closeness of your family.
And I wish there was more language
because we are our ancestors.
We are living with the trauma,
with all of the, whether it's addiction
or whether it's other genetic makeups,
like we are carrying on
what our ancestors have been through, you know,
and we don't talk about it enough. Now we have like sprinkling, you know, conversations about
it where people touch upon it, like, oh, okay. It makes sense that if you're, you know, no one in
your family swam or, you know, that every, that you're scared of water or if something terrible
happened to one of your ancestors and they had a drowning, that you could have that reaction to water.
And it's like, that conversation needs to be opened up more.
Yeah, definitely.
Yeah.
Well, our last question today comes from Stanley,
and he's going to be joining us on the phone.
Stanley?
He must be gay.
I'm like, there's...
It took me a second, but then, you know,
so his fiance is not a woman, so we're relieved.
We don't have any straight men listening to this podcast.
Dear Chelsea, my fiance and I have been together
for 11 years and are finally getting married
in September of next year.
But there's one small issue.
One of my groomsmen is an alcoholic.
We became best friends while bartending together
and currently run two separate bars
for the same company.
When he's sober, he's amazing.
Great conversationalist,
amazing friend, and an all-around fun person to be around. A few months ago, he relapsed after four years of sobriety and has been drinking on and off ever since. When he's drinking, he's loud,
rude, obnoxious, doesn't know when to stop, and sadly, it only takes him a drink or two to get
to that point. Now that I've already asked him to be a groomsman, his return to drinking has put me in quite a dilemma. I do not want the drunk version of him at my wedding,
nor at my bachelor party, but I would obviously love for him to be there. I should also point out
that both my fiancé and maid of honor already don't like him, so if he ends up drinking at the
wedding, there's definitely going to be a problem. I do plan on telling him that he needs to be sober
at our wedding, but I also worry about him sneaking drinks or something. I don't need the stress of babysitting
a grown man at my wedding. How do I go about having this discussion with him, especially
since he'll be the only person at the wedding with that restriction? Thanks, Stanley.
Hi, Stanley. Hi, how's it going? Hi, this is our special guest, Riley Keough.
Hi, nice to meet you. you. I think you have to say
what, what do you think? I was just going to say, and maybe this is the wrong advice, but I have
had a lot of addict experience in my life, but I think what's hard is like probably not having him
there would probably be sad, right? Yeah. Yeah. Long-term. so i was thinking you definitely need to anticipate that he will get
drunk and maybe you need to get him like some kind of designated babysitter for the night
that's not a bad idea actually one of my um i don't know what we're gonna call it but she's
my wedding party too she already offered to be that too because i talked to her about it as well
you know she's
like i don't care i'm making sure there's no problems at your wedding i think where i've
always gotten caught up is expecting it not to be that and then it ends up they end up doing the
thing even if you have a conversation even with the conversation yeah i hear what you're saying
because if it's but you said sometimes he doesn't drink right, he goes off and on. I think right now he's not.
Right.
So maybe what you do is you have this conversation with him in the most loving way possible. Like, this is such an important day for me.
I'm so honored that you're going to be part of it with me.
I can't wait.
I do have to ask you to not drink.
I do have to just ask you just to put it out there so that he can, you know, he may take that very seriously. And in and then also as the backup plan, what Riley offered is to have the friends just be on the lookout, knowing that there's a good chance he might not be able to control himself and start drinking. But you might be surprised, you know, I mean, you might he might be able to get through the wedding without it. The bachelor party is another situation.
I think that's a little bit even more difficult to not drink at.
But I would just really tell him, this is so important for me. And you know that when you drink, you're not the best version of yourself.
And I need you to respect that this is my day and to be there in the way that I need you to be there.
And if you can't commit to that, then that's okay.
Just let me know.
And let me know and we'll figure something out.
Like give him the option to commit and make that promise to you.
I wouldn't say the bachelor party and the wedding.
I feel like that's too big of a hill to climb.
I don't know.
Do you need his presence at the bachelor party?
I guess if he's a groomsman, right?
I mean, I was honestly just thinking about it earlier today.
Like I wouldn't be mad.
I mean,
I have been to parties with him where he was sober and he was fine.
He was,
you know,
playing all the games with everybody and like just ripping soda water.
But yeah,
I also like,
I come from a family that has addiction issues.
So like,
I am totally up for people's boundaries.
So if he,
for that reason,
couldn't go,
I would not be mad at all.
Absolutely.
And, and, and you can, that's perfect. Then it's a trigger for you. You know,
you come from a family with addiction and you don't just give him the option. Like you're welcome to come to the bachelor party and I do want you at my wedding, but these are the conditions.
And if you can't meet them, no harm, no foul, like I'll miss you, but it would be better for me to be
able to enjoy my day and not worry about you drinking. You're a better version of yourself when you're sober. I understand
you're struggling, but this is my request from you out of our friendship. Yeah, it's really good.
That's really good advice. And I think that's a conversation you can have in person, right?
Yeah. Yeah. I think so as well. Yeah. I don't get to see him too often, but I definitely,
you know, especially working for the same people, we do get to see each other sometimes. So that's something I could talk to him about for sure. Yeah. And then your friend,
the one who volunteered, then just have her on it. And if he does drink, you know, she can have him
removed. She'd be totally fine with that. I just, that's covering all your bases.
Yeah. And you listen, you might be surprised. Yeah. I honestly was talking to my therapist
about it. She's like, he might, you know, just be sober already. And I'm like, that is, you might be surprised. Yeah. I honestly was talking to my therapist about it.
She's like, he might, you know, just be sober already. And I'm like, that is, you know,
best case scenario, but he could take to it really well. Yeah. Yeah. And it's honest conversation.
So there's nothing to be like, you know, it's nice that you're being so thoughtful about it as well.
Yeah. And good to have like a bossy bridesmaid in your corner. I love that.
Yeah. Yeah. I got a couple of them. So that's good. That's good. Well,
have a great wedding. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you so much.
Congrats. Awesome. Thanks, Stanley. Let us know how it goes. Okay.
I will definitely. Thank you.
Okay. We're going to take a break and then we'll be right back to wrap up with Riley Keough. Inside you, two wolves
are locked in battle.
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Every decision, every
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Which wolf are you feeding? I'm Eric Zimmer, host of The One You
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Listen to The One You Feed on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
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It's going to be filled with money challenges and opportunities.
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And we're the hosts of How To Money.
We want to be with you every step of the way in your financial journey this year,
offering the information and insights you need to thrive financially.
Yeah, whether you find yourself up to your eyeballs in student loan debt,
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I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together on the Really Know Really podcast,
our mission is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like... We got the answer.
Will space junk block your cell signal?
The astronaut who almost drowned during a spacewalk gives us the answer.
We talk with the scientist who figured out if your dog truly loves you.
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Plus, does Tom Cruise really do his own stunts?
His stuntman reveals the answer.
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And you never know when Howie Mandel might just stop by to talk about judging.
Really? That's the opening?
Really No Really.
Yeah, really.
No really.
Go to reallynoreally.com.
And register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason
Bobblehead.
It's called Really?
No, Really?
And you can find it on the iHeartRadio app, on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your
podcasts.
Hey, guys.
I'm Kate Max.
You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts
that arise once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after
a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real,
inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for
Post Run High. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run
and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun.
Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
The forces shaping markets and the economy are often hiding behind a blur of numbers.
So that's why we created The Big Take from Bloomberg Podcasts,
to give you the context you need to make sense of it all.
Every day in just 15 minutes, we dive into one global business story that matters.
You'll hear from Bloomberg journalists like Matt Levine.
A lot of this meme stock stuff is, I think, embarrassing to the SEC.
Amanda Mull, who writes our Business Week buying power column.
Very few companies who go viral are like totally prepared for what that means.
And Zoe Tillman, senior legal reporter.
Courts are not supposed to decide elections.
Courts are not really supposed to play a big role in choosing our elected leaders.
It's for the voters to decide.
Follow the Big Take podcast on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen.
Okay, and we're back with Riley Keough.
She's suffering from jet lag.
I'm suffering from my usual just day lag.
I'm constantly tired, always tired.
I don't know. I was thinking about
my schedule today. And then I was like, why are you even thinking about it? Just keep going.
What's a day in your life?
My life is I usually tour Friday, Saturday, Sunday. So I was in Houston, Dallas, Austin.
I flew home today, this morning. And then the rest of the week is crazy. So today I had a couple
hours and then you were coming in the afternoon.
So that was kind of nice because I just went in my hyperbaric chamber for two hours to read another book after I finished your book.
And it just is constant.
And I was thinking about it.
I'm 49 years old and I've been doing this kind of pace since I was at least 30 when I started Chelsea Lately touring, doing books.
I'm always on a book tour or a stand-up tour or da-da-da.
But I just realized, like, that is who I am, you know?
I'm high impact and then I crash for two days and then I go.
Yeah.
I think it's a good thing.
Yeah.
I think it keeps you young.
Yeah.
Spirited.
It keeps you vibrant, for sure.
You know?
Yeah.
And, yeah, it's nice to be, like, I like, I was thinking about it.
I was like, God, it's been like 20 years that I've, 25 years that I've been in this business,
but 20 years of like hustling like that.
And I kind of love that about me.
Like, I love that I'm still up for it.
You know what I mean?
Yeah.
It's amazing.
What's your schedule like in your life?
I'm a, I'm a, oh my gosh, it really depends. I think that similarly, like I will have moments where I'm working a lot.
If I'm shooting a film and then I'll go home and kind of hibernate and then I'll go back out and then it's like high intensity and then I'll go home and like hide.
It's like goes sort of back and forth.
Yeah.
And whenever I'm always like, I'm so tired, I think of Taylor Swift.
I'm just like,
how is this maniac
able to do this?
Three and a half hours, three nights
in a row. Dancing, singing,
choreography, guitar playing.
Jumping into the floor. I just am like,
what kind of energy is she, what
energy boost is she on? I need that.
So that's pretty impressive too.
But it was a delight to meet you.
This book is so beautiful.
From Here to the Great Unknown,
what a gorgeous tribute for your mom.
Thank you.
To your mom and following through
and getting this done for her.
And it's also an Oprah's Book Club selection.
So you know, that's a good endorsement.
How do you feel about everyone's reception of the book?
I feel really grateful.
I was very nervous to put the book out.
It's really personal, especially the last few chapters are very intense.
And I think there was a world where I didn't include some things in there.
But then ultimately, I thought about my mom and her honesty and what she would have done.
And I think that she would have put everything that's in there in there.
And ultimately, like, of course, there's some funny
like things in the news here and there, but people have been really receptive. And I think that
particularly people who have lost family members or in grief or dealt with addiction, I think it
like is connecting on a level that's human, despite the fact that it's like a super unique story. And so I think that that's been surprising, I guess.
I think I'm very used to people feeling very far away,
like sort of not perceiving my family to be human, I guess.
And so I feel like the responses have been very human,
which I really enjoyed.
Yeah, and books are always powerful.
It's nice to leave something in writing and let people kind of interpret it or reinterpret it and leave
it out there rather than per se telling your story. It's it's like it's something more permanent.
Yeah. You know. Yeah. So thank you for being here. Thanks for having me. Yeah. Yeah. And good luck
with everything. Thank you. Can't wait to see more of you in movies and TV and everything.
Okay.
We'll see you guys next week.
Okay, guys, stand-up shows that I have coming up.
I am going to Des Moines, Iowa, December 5th.
December 6th is Omaha.
And then December 28th, I'm coming to New Orleans right before New Year's.
And then I'll be in Atlanta, Georgia on December 29th.
And those are the rest of my stand-up dates for this year.
It's over.
New tour, new year.
If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email at dearchelseapodcast at gmail.com.
And be sure to include your phone number.
Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert, executive producer Catherine Law.
And be sure to check out our merch at ChelseaHandler.com.
Joel, the holidays are a blast, but the financial hangover, that can be a huge bummer.
If you are out there and you're dreading the new statement email that reveals the massive balance that you may have racked up, well, you could use our help.
That's right.
I'm Joel.
And I am Matt.
And we're from the How To Money podcast. Our show is all about helping you make sense of
your personal finances so you can ditch your pesky credit card debt once and for all,
make real progress on other crucial financial goals that you've got,
and just feel more in control of your money in general.
You know it. For money advice without the judgment and jargon, listen to How To Money
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. host of The One You Feed. Every week, I talk to brilliant minds and brave souls about the art of
small, powerful choices. Our listeners say it all. This is a lifeline. Transformational. The best
antidote to a bad mood I've ever heard. Join the pack and start feeding your best self. Listen to
The One You Feed on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts dog truly love you?
We have the answer.
Go to reallynoreally.com and register to win $500,
a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead.
The Really No Really podcast.
Follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Welcome to Decisions Decisions,
the podcast where boundaries are pushed and conversations get candid.
Join your favorite hosts, me, Weezy WTF, and me, Mandy B, as we dive deep into the world of non-traditional relationships
and explore the often taboo topics surrounding dating, sex, and love.
Every Monday and Wednesday, we both invite you to unlearn the outdated narratives dictated by traditional patriarchal norms.
Tune in and join in the conversation.
Listen to Decisions Decisions on the Black Effect Podcast Network,
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey guys, I'm Kate Max.
You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show,
where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs,
and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High,
is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories,
their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.