Dear Chelsea - Polyamory & Pronouns with Nico Tortorella & Bethany C. Meyers

Episode Date: December 30, 2021

This week, Chelsea is joined by Nico Tortorella and Bethany C. Meyers to talk about polyamory, life outside the gender binary, and getting married because you want to be family. Then: Two husbands wonder what life will really be like when they open up their marriage. A college grad wants to move to London to advance his career, but worries he may miss home too much. And a couple tries to decide, once and for all, whether or not to have kids. *Executive Producer Nick StumpfProduced by Catherine LawEdited & Engineered by Brandon Dickert*****The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees. This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all. Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together, our mission on the Really Know Really podcast is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why the bathroom door doesn't go all the way to the floor, what's in the museum of failure, and does your dog truly love you? We have the answer. Go to reallyknowreally.com

and register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead. The Really Know Really podcast. Follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, everybody. Hello. Hi, Catherine. Hi. How are you?

Hi. It's the holiday season. It's upon us. It's in it. We're in it. It's in us. Yes, it is. I'm actually recording today from my niece's room.

So it's very decorated with butterflies. Well, why don. I'm actually recording today from my niece's room. So it's very decorated with butterflies. Well, why don't I see any? Oh, there's some. Okay. Yeah. That's you seems like you were exaggerating there for a minute. Doesn't seem that decorated with butterflies. And you know, I mean, like fluffy things. Yeah, yeah. Well, that's what nieces are for, right? Uh huh. You will never catch me recording this podcast out of my niece's bedroom. So I would like to say thank you in advance for that happening. Okay, so today's guests, we have a couple that is coming. This is a couple who are non-binary and polyamorous, and they speak a lot about their relationship. So I thought it would be

a great opportunity for us all to get a little bit more edumacated. Today's guests are Nico Tortorella and Bethany C. Myers. Nico is an actor that you may recognize from The Walking Dead, World Beyond, Younger, and an upcoming indie drama called The Medeshin Family. And Bethany is the founder and CEO of the Become Project. You can follow her on Instagram at the B.COME Project, which is a body neutral movement and fitness program. So those are our guests today. And I am very, very honored to introduce them. Hello, Bethany and Nico. Thank you guys for coming down to this podcast in New York City. No less. Totally. Thanks for. Oh, I'm excited to have you. I've seen a couple of things that you guys have

spoken about, and I'm so excited to talk to you about your relationship and your careers. And in this time, I know that you must get sick and tired of having to explain your relationship to people who don't know. But of course, it is so beneficial for our listeners to have a better understanding of what polyamory means, of what not identifying with a certain gender means, you know. So I know that you probably feel like an educative onus on your back. But I mean, it's great that you're willing to talk about it and kind of let people understand, have a better understanding of what that means. So let's talk, first of all, I know you just changed your pronouns, right? You identify as they, them, and you recently changed it to her, right? They, she. They, she. Okay, sorry, they, she. And why did

you change that? Yeah, so originally I always used she, her pronouns, you know, hadn't really known anything else. Then like several years ago, I started using they, them pronouns, really liked the way that it felt. And I feel like this switch to they, she is for many different reasons. I think in part, I was kind of tired of educating people. And I think in my work that I do, I really like to allow people a space to be able to have conversation and have nuanced conversation and get things wrong without feeling really bad about it. And it started to feel like, you know, maybe somebody would use a she her pronoun and then they would. Oh, my God, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. And then I think also for me, that felt really right.

And I think like for both Nico and I are our relationship with gender is so fluid and in being fluid it changes right and so it kind of shifted for me and I'm sure we'll talk more about this later but we've been trying to start a family I've been trying to get pregnant it has been a fucking annoying year there's so much that I learned that I feel like I should have already known we've been having a hard time and there's something that is like really connecting me very specifically to the biology of my body, right? And like uterus and like there's a piece of kind of maybe, I don't know if it's getting more in touch with that or connecting with that side that has allowed she she her pronouns to also feel

good along with they them pronouns yeah we're definitely a house of all pronouns are welcome at this point i think language fails us across the board you know well i think people are drawn to it you were saying you were drawn to the pronouns without using he or she to sexual identification right as a man or a woman born with those genes, right? You were drawn to saying they or them for what reason? Well, I think like they, them pronouns allowed me to feel like I was working outside of a box. And I actually feel this way a lot about really gendering things. So like going outside of the queer conversation, I think that the emphasis that society places on gender really puts people into a very specific box. So like when you look at kids, like young girls,

if they're girls, they need to like these things. They need to be a certain way. They can't be assertive. They can't be bossy, right? Young boys, if they're a boy, then they can't be sensitive. They can't cry. They can't wear pink. Great. And we like box people into these gender stereotypes. And personally, I think that if we had less focus on gender, I just think everything would be a little bit better in a lot of ways. Well, it would certainly be better for a lot of women. You know what I mean? The reasoning behind a lot of that for women is to not be identified as a woman in the workplace because of the negative connotations that has and the ostracization that that can come with, you know, and they not getting hired for a

job. So it, it, it totally makes sense on, you know, if you're following that line of thinking to not have the disadvantage of being a woman, which in so many instances, more so than not is a disadvantage. Right. Yes. And I would also say that for men, I think it can be really beneficial as well in the sense of like, you know, if you want to boil it down to like toxic masculinity, right? Or I think that that kind of helps strip it down and to be like, no, you can be sensitive and you can be sweet and you can cry when you scrape your knee and that's okay, you

know? So I think for me, like they, them pronouns felt like it opened up a lot of doors to be able to dress in the way that I wanted or grow out body hair if I wanted to grow out body hair. It just kind of levels the playing field, right? It's all encompassing. The reason we decided to start using they, them pronouns wasn't even limited to just our gender. It's kind of this idea of all of it in the universe is you. And if I can encompass all of that and in just with one word, they, them, a pronoun, but we're not ready to have that conversation on a global level. Like we're still having the black and white conversation, the gender

conversation. Like I feel like we have a ways to go to really start understanding internalized identity. Right. Yeah. Internalized identity and the idea of togetherness and of humanity and that we're all here together. Because that is the overarching idea, I think, behind a lot of it. Also, this inception of this conversation has just begun, really. And it has a long runway. But I think the idea of reminding people instead of, you know, why are we identifying saying that person, they're black, they're white, that's a girl, that's a boy, right? When you think about it in the grander scheme of things, not as a personal affront to a person, you know, or a way

of separating people, and you think, oh, you want to remind yourself about humanity, togetherness. This is all of us. We're all together instead of the zero-sum game that we've come to understand. This country, especially right now, is very much a zero-sum game. First of all, how did you guys get together? How did you meet? 15 years ago, playing beer pong in college. Oh, really? What college? We went to Columbia College in Chicago. It was like two days after I moved out of my parents' house. We met. Yeah. And I had just left Missouri. So I'm a couple of years older than Nico. So I was a junior going in and Nico was a freshman. And we met playing beer pong. Nico was very enthralled with me. I was kind of like, whatever. But we lived in our dorm. We lived five floors away from one another.

And it was like a very magical start. Very much lightning bolt. I was so enthralled with who this human was. I was raised super conservative, super religious, very little small town. Always wanted to

get out, but had never seen any of the world, like had never been to a big city, right? Chicago was like the biggest city I'd ever seen. Now I go back to Chicago and I'm like, oh, this is cute, you know? And Nico was like this force that came in and just challenged so many of my ideas and my thoughts. And I had never really met someone that grew up as religiously as Bethany had. One of the first conversations that we had was around evolution and creationism. And day one, Bethany looked at me and was like, you believe in evolution? Like that was like the craziest thing in the world that I could

possibly believe in. And it wasn't this immediate challenge, but it was just like, oh, wow, there's like so much that we can learn from each other. Let's just like jump in. Yeah, that's sweet. And who made the first move? Well, I did. Yeah, kind of. Because you had a boyfriend, too.

You were like, wow, it looks like you were leaving Missouri. Like, you know, yeah, in a flash. You're like, fuck that shit. Yeah, that's exactly what happened. I like had a boyfriend that had like a couple of weeks and I was like, what am I doing? Called my boyfriend one night. It was like, we got to break up. Went to a party, got drunk, came back and was like pounding on Nico's door.

I was convinced there was a homeless person at my front door at four o'clock in the morning. Just like banging on the door. And it's just Bethany. Yeah. And then we had sex. And then our relationship. That's very say anything. Yeah.

Yeah. And then our relationship really, Oh, that's very say anything. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, and then our relationship really, it's interesting. I think, like, our relationship in a weird way has kind of always been poly and it's always been unique. Like, there was never really a time where we were strictly like, and we're boyfriend and girlfriend, you know?

We had a time when we were just, like, sleeping together in Chicago and then we kind of started moving to different cities and Nico would go away for work and when we were in the same city we would live together and we never like had a breakup conversation but we left each other many times spent plenty of time with other people while still staying connected and then just like our paths kept finding each other and crossing and ultimately we decided to get married but before we got married we weren't

really even dating we weren't living together we weren't living together we got married no we're living i was in brooklyn you were in the city we actually went to the jungle and uh did i was i was just gonna say and that sentence goes we went to the jungle and it's followed by and did i was actually every time i tell someone i did ayahuasca, they're like, have you watched The Chelsea Handler? I mean, it is like, it is like one,

like you are now synonymous with that conversation. Another notch on my bedpost. So we went to the jungle and did ayahuasca and in our journey, there was like very much this like,

you two have been rooted together for lifetimes. You are supposed to start a family some crazy shit went down in our first journey we walked out of the jungle and looked at each other we're like okay so we're getting married yeah we were married three months later i had gone to the jungle the year prior right when trump got elected i decided like that day got on my phone booked a retreat went for a week and a half knew knew that I wanted to bring Bethany the following year. We went.

And in one of our journeys, I kind of saw us both as these two massive trees, separate trees, roots connected underground. And there would be all of these animals and bugs and creatures that would come and spend time on these trees. And they could, you know, live there for extended periods of these animals and bugs and creatures that would come and spend time on these trees and they could you know live there for extended periods of time leave but at our base at our foundation we were always together and uh that's kind of been the symbol for our relationship ever since yeah trees are a beautiful symbol of anything right on the subject of polyamory because that's something else i would like to set the record straight with for my audience to understand what that means, because people are very judgy about that subject matter, as you well know. So take us through that.

Talk to us about what it means to you and what it means to you guys individually and as a couple. Yeah. I mean, I think we're still figuring it out. You know, I think it's important to note that we don't claim expertise in any of these fields, right? We're curious folk. Just like I'm not a doctor, you guys. Not yet.

Not yet. Everyone out there always wants you to be the expert, you know? It's like whatever you're talking about. Yeah. Yeah, that's not something we like to claim. And also, I think it's important to note that, like, polyamory or open relationships. Non-monogamy. Non-monogamy like exists

different for all different people but we date other people you know i mean we've been married for four years we've been dating other people for 15 years we have emotional space it's beyond the physical we're not just out here just like sleeping with people on a regular basis we both hold space for real relationships with other people. And it's something that we know that we will always do for the rest of our lives, even if it's not in action. Our polyamory is more of like a state of mind rather than a state of being, if that makes sense. We just have a lot of love and we want to share it. How does this delineate itself or is there a delineation

between an open relationship and a polyamorous relationship in your opinion? I think a lot of people would say yes. I think most people think of open relationships as just sex and polyamory is like actual relationships. I personally just like the word open relationship more. Like we don't really subscribe to that, but I would say that's how most people would perceive those two pieces. Yeah. And did you guys or do you guys, have you had to lay ground rules or, and can you talk to us about that a little bit? Yeah. I mean, there were a set of rules when we first got married. I mean, even just living in two separate households, like deciding we were going to get married. Well, first I think it's important to note that like we were both dating other people when we decided to get married. I mean, even just living in two separate households, like deciding we were going to get married. Well, first, I think it's important to note that like, we were both dating other people when we decided to get married and every relationship that we had had outside of

this primary, it wasn't even our primary relationship when we were best friends, right? Every relationship that we had had, like there was always something getting in the way. No one really understood what we meant to each other. Like at the end of the day, Bethany was always something getting in the way. No one really understood what we meant to each other. Like at the end of the day, Bethany was always my emergency contact on any piece of paperwork, even if I was in a serious multi-year relationship with somebody else. And like, that's really hard. Like I get it. That's not an easy thing for someone to wrap their head around. So we kind of decided to get married as, as not the the only reason but we thought it would make it easier dating other people as putting this this like title on this is primary relationship and this

is the space that we have for other people in our lives there were a set of ground rules but i think they change you know over this this last year as we've been trying to make a baby, you know? It's like the priorities have shifted and where we are right this second, all of our energy is being focused on trying to create life at a time when life seems the most fragile, you know? So the rules are flex for us right now and it's just like based in honesty and communication.

And also when you have a child, they will still be in flex. I mean, you're gonna have to figure out how want to go about that, right? Totally. Yeah. I want to understand, I think it takes a very special individual to have enough bandwidth to not only admit this, like that they're interested in pursuing a relationship with these kinds of understandings, but also to be okay with the other person, right? You know, there are so many jealousy issues between couples and insecurity issues. So what do you attribute your self-assuredness to even come to a point like this, you know,

where you can be confident in your relationship and your trust with each other while also exploring other relationships that you both desire? I mean, I think jealousy, jealousy is certainly something that I struggle with. I also have like, you know, I mean, if we're going to go like therapy terms, I have some abandonment issues in my past. I had a dad that died young. Usually people that have abandonment issues, jealousy is like kind of high for them, right? It's hard. So that's definitely something that takes working through. I think that polyamory for Nico and I really saved our relationship in a lot of ways. And previously we would just kind of, you know, over this course of 15 years and the course of us drinking party, like, you know, growing up in our 20, like all

the stuff that happens. Discovering that we were queer, like simultaneously at the same time, like growing up together. Right. There was a lot of figuring shit out. And we did a lot of just cheating on each other. We would cheat on each other. We would end up telling the other person or the other person would find out. We realized, I don't really care that much. Okay, you cheated on me. Yeah, you know what?

I actually cheated on you a couple weekends ago. Okay, are we going to move forward? All right, sure. Let's get over this. Let's move on. We were supposed to feel angry about it, right? But neither one of us ever really was. Well, the term cheating is just so, right? Like that's one word we have for what you're doing in this society. I would argue, like you say, we don't have enough language, right? I argue we have

too much language, but it depends what language you're talking about. In English, you know, we have 85 words for so many things. And yet when you cheat, there's one word for it. Or being unfaithful, I suppose, is another. Or an affair. But it's a limited vocabulary. And so terms like polyamory are opening up the dialogue to understand, to have a better understanding. But there's not more than one word for that. So sometimes your point is true.

Like there are limited words to describe something because there is a black and white definition of things. Whereas what we're all learning or people who are really interested in deep diving are learning and people who are spiritual are learning that it's, it's all a bunch of gray. Nobody's right. Nobody's wrong. It's what your desires are, your honesty level, you know, like the communication has got to be the most integral part of your relationship. Right. And it's not fixed, right? It's like allowed to bend and shift. And a line that we've always kind of used, like it's hard to break something that bends, you know? And we've always just, we're benders.

You know, I think in this time where we were, you know, cheating or kind of hurting each other, polyamory like this idea was like it saved us. I mean, it really made it made it more ethical. It opened up communication and opened up a space to talk about what we really wanted, what we needed. So I think being able to define our relationship with this and our marriage really took us to a different place in a really healthy and positive way. Yeah. I mean, I just think our vocabulary and understanding of the world was very limited, right? When we first started dating each other and the more we learned about ourselves and our queerness, we gained just more language for who we are and were in the world. And I think over the last couple of years, as the world has kind of like fallen apart and getting put back together, like even that language is is continuing to change.

And we're just like trying to stay with the times on a public level and also like on a private level and do you feel to both of you feel since you are public and out about this and it's since it's a subject matter that is still considered taboo to an extent do you feel the burden of having to kind of be out there and like front and center talking about it? Do you feel a response, a sense of responsibility? I do. And I hate it. I mean, I am constantly battling how public versus how private do I want to be with my

life? I think that you have an easier time with it. But for me, like I'm a people pleaser. I don't love negative, you know, negative critiques like that's something I definitely have to work on. And, you know, people have a lot to say as we've been trying to start a family. And I have been somewhat vocal about that. You know, you get comments from people that are like, you shouldn't have a family, you know, and it shouldn't hurt, but it does. And so I think that

I'm constantly battling where do I straddle this line and like how much do I want to talk about it how much do I want to go into it and how much do we just want to keep to ourselves yeah yeah I think that's a I think a lot of people struggle with that regardless right so you add something else to the mix another conversation starter and you know thought-provoking term and way of life and then it adds you know that adds another tenfold to the mix of how private or social anyone in the public eye is. For sure. I mean, I feel like. As we sit on this podcast.

As we discuss this for our 1.5 million listeners. I don't know, guys. I think I just want to keep it private. This is a good time to come out as a private couple. But it's so much part of your job how you speak to yourself. I mean, that's like kind of what you do in the world. Yes, absolutely. So I have a workout, the become project all centered around body neutrality movement to feel good. And a lot of it is how we talk about ourselves, how we talk about our body, um, and how we get to a more neutral ground within ourselves.

And I think that's something as both of us being extremists, right? Having this pendulum that swings from one end all the way to the other and has to go big. It's like with everything. How do we get that to kind of, it's always going to move, but how do we get that pendulum to sort of sit a little bit more in the middle and be able to feel neutral about some things? And empathy for, you know, for the whole spectrum, no matter which one we're speaking to, you know? Yeah, absolutely. Instead of judging other people that are doing

something differently than you to empathize and have compassion, that's another human being that's making different choices. And the judgment factor comes in so hot and heavy for so many people, myself included, for so long, you know, so judgy. And it's like you're sitting there and you hate people who are judgy. And then the reason you hate that so much is because you're practicing it yourself. But anyway, this is a perfect opportunity. We have a lot of people that call in about this subject matter. So we're going to take some callers and we're going to give them some feedback about their own situations and answer some questions for some people. Right, Catherine? We love a question. We sure will. And we're going to take a quick break, but we'll be back with callers.

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So our first email comes from Ryan. This dovetails perfectly with what you guys were talking about with an open relationship. Ryan says, Dear Chelsea, my husband and I are two gay men in our 30s, together almost 10 years, and we have newly opened our relationship. Quick background. This has been a stated goal of his for years, but I was hesitant. There was a history of infidelity on his part that we moved past with counseling. Now we're in a good place and we made the decision to allow each other sex with other people.

I'm overall happy about this, but I'm struggling with the specifics since it's still new. We have set rules and boundaries, but I'm still deciding what would be a deal breaker. My question is, how do I know if he'll respect my wishes or if it's the boundary stepping aspect that he really likes? If the latter, the rules we set can always be broken. Second, how do I handle hypocritical thoughts? I can do something I don't want him to do. And third, we have a couples therapist we still see, but she's not as up-to-date on non-monogamous relationship structures. Should we switch? Sincerely, Ryan. Well, I'll jump in first just to say yes, you should switch therapists. You need somebody who

is familiar with this conversation topic and not somebody who's getting to know this. So many people are so far behind this that you need somebody, you need that tool. Like you're already seeing somebody put it towards somebody who is well-versed in the subject matter. And that can only help you to accomplish, you know, a state of being that you're both really comfortable in. Why don't you guys jump in with what you think off the top of your heads? Well, I was just going to say this idea of what is a deal breaker, right? Like, I think that's kind of a scary way to think about it. Like, if you draw such a hard line in the sand and I'm like, he's going to cross that line, it's game over, right?

You're just putting both of yourselves in a box and setting yourself up for failure. So I wouldn't think about it necessarily like that. I would just try to be as honest and open with each other about your desires and keep everything on the table. Like if you're going into this, it takes work. This is not something that you can just do willy nilly and like hope it works. Right. Like this is commitment. Right. And like you will get closer because of it. You have to be. I agree with everything that you said.

And also when you were speaking about I can do something but he can't do something right and i think it's important to note like you all don't have to experience it the same you don't have to have like maybe there there are things that i can do that nico doesn't care but i care if nico does them you know and we're really honest about that. And I think that that's okay. Like, it doesn't have to be even because you're both individuals. So what works for each of you may be different and that's okay. And that should also be respected. You have to make different sacrifices for each other, right? Because we're different people. Right. And you also want to set yourself up for success. So before you go into this, you want to create all of those boundaries

that are acceptable for both of you so that you can find an area where you both agree and how you're going to operate. Because if you're saying, oh, if he does whatever the unthinkable, so to speak, there's no turning back. Like Nico was saying, like you have to set this up so that you're both going to come back together no matter what. So nobody ever is going to do the unthinkable or the unspeakable. And I think as you start to have these conversations, you understand, you know, sometimes what we think is unacceptable is our idea of that. It's not the actual reality of that. And you may not even, you know, want to participate or he may not even want to participate in the way that you're so worried about, you know, with another partner or, but you laying it all on the table is only going to help your communication.

It's only going to bring you closer together. It's only going to create more intimacy. So it's a huge growth opportunity. Again, it's a huge opportunity to learn about respecting your partner and about respecting yourself. Right. And I think like, you know, going off of that, the idea of really staying in the present, like you can write things down on paper, you can have ideas of what it should be, but the other partner that your partner is engaging with, I think oftentimes can change the way it feels. And it's so situational. You know, there's Ryan, you mentioned that there was like some infidelity in the past. So there are probably very certain things that can really trigger you and like set you off because that's, you know, that trauma is being touched on. But

letting it happen in the present and like assessing each situation and determining how it makes you feel and talking about it, I think can be helpful than sort of getting stuck on these hard, fast rules. Yeah. And the past. And that's, you know, getting stuck on the past is also you're not operating in the best interest of yourself because what was infidelity before may not under these parameters register as infidelity. So you're opening your, you're broadening your horizons. You're becoming more open-minded about this relationship. And with that, your partner will likely do the same. So I hope that helps. I think we answered a couple of his questions with some advice from all of us, right?

Good luck, right? Yeah. Yeah. And Ryan, follow up with us. Let us know what happens, what transpires, you know, yada, yada, yada. Yeah. And good luck. Yeah.

What was the book that you referenced, Catherine, when we had that call? Oh, sure. The Ethical Slut was one that I recommended. Kind of just tells you how to have those conversations and adjust expectations. And the other thing is it sounds like he's not going to be in the room while these acts transpire. So I think it's really a trust builder

to be venturing into this. And have some threesomes. And some trust falls. Have a trust fall, you guys. Have a trust fall and then follow it up with a threesome. Not at the same time. This kind of looks, this camera looks like we're having a threesome where I got kicked to the end of the bed. Do you see? Like I'm just over here, just out. Do you want to scooch a little bit? This studio is at one hot fucking mess. So

we're doing the best that we can. Well, our next question comes from a very sweet caller with my new favorite name. His name is Brayden Cantaloupe. Oh. He's from Canada. I know, like, how charming is that? And he's a sweetie, you'll see. He's 21. He is in Canada, and he just graduated.

He wants to be working in fashion, fashion business. So he says, Dear Chelsea, I'm 21 years old from Canada, and I'm currently feeling very unfulfilled in life. I grew up in a small city in BC's interior. I decided after graduating high school, I'd move to Vancouver for post-secondary. I have since graduated school and moved back to my hometown. The move back was because I decided Vancouver wasn't a perfect fit for me. However, there's nowhere in Canada that I feel is.

After a trip to the UK a month ago, I decided London would be a perfect match for both my personality and my career. However, I'm having a hard time deciding whether a move that big is really worth it and if it would truly make me happy. On top of this, I feel as though I would miss my family and friends incredibly. Brayden. Oh, well, Brayden, I'm just going to go out and say go for it. Oh, Brayden, you're there. Brayden's here. Oh, good, even better. Hi, I'm here.

Oh, look at you. I didn't know cantaloupe was a real last name. Yeah, I know. Tell me about it. As far as I know, I'm pretty sure our family's the only one with it that I know of anyways. So I don't know. Maybe someone's going to hear this podcast and be like, hey, I have that too. But as far as I know, I think we're the only ones.

You need to find a honeydew for sure. Do you think you can do that before the end of this call? I have no idea. I'll try my best. Well, Brayden, I would say that it is always a, I'm going to always just say to take a leap of faith and get the hell out of a small town and open your eyes. And, you know, it doesn't have to be the UK, but like, if you had a good feeling about that, there's no reason it shouldn't be. I'm of the belief that you should always be expanding your horizons. And, you know, you may not feel like your world is narrow, but once you get outside of it, you're going to realize how much there is to see. And it doesn't mean that you won't eventually go back there one day, but you should use your youth and this time to explore

and understand the way the world is and how many different sorts of people are out there for you to get to know. Yeah, I mean, absolutely. I have some situationally, I grew up in a really small town. I always wanted to go to a big city. When I 20 I started moving I moved to Chicago I moved to Los Angeles and I moved to Dallas and I finally landed in New York and when I was you know younger and and moving and at a similar age to you all of my family like everyone would look at me like what are you doing like you're not you gotta you gotta get in one. You have to get your job figured out. You have to settle. And the best thing that I ever did for myself in my early 20s was like, go explore, find different cities, find the one that connects with me. And now I have great connections in all of those places that has hands down furthered my career.

So I am super on board with you moving and home never went anywhere you know like you can always go home your friends yeah no for sure I guess that's how I felt when I moved to Vancouver so originally I was there right and then um it was a great experience but I felt like it was really like as far as Canada goes like the monologue goes on in Canada it's like as far as like for us Vancouver is like oh my, like it's such a big city. But it's like, if you look at it as a world stage, it's like not at all. So like I was there and I felt it was very,

I didn't feel like there's like huge room for progress or at least like to leave some bounds that I always like think to myself, well, I want to get there. Like it's definitely not just London that I would be like, I'd totally down to live in. It's more so just, I've always had that connection and being like, oh, I think I would really like it there. And then obviously I was just there

in October. I went for a trip to see some family over there. And then I was like, you know what? Yeah, I should just move here. But then since being back now, I'm like, Oh my God, I don't know. Do I really want to leave everyone? That's fear. You just said gave another great reason to try it out in the UK. Cause you have family there. Like that's a great, like kind of insurance policy, you know, to move somewhere. You already have a connection with that place. You are never going to look back at this time in your life after making a leap of faith like that and be like, I wish I hadn't done that. You're never anyone who stays. If you came back and you're like, oh, I'm scared. You know, my family's here. That's all fear. That's all you're like ego going. No, no, no. You have something good here. This is

steady. You will regret this because you're talking about making, taking a leap that if you don't do it, you're always going to look back at this time and go, God, I wish I did something. I wish I had tried London. I mean, London's a fucking awesome town. Who's going to move there and have a bad time? You know, for real. Yeah. Especially since you like got the feels when you were there, like the fact that you have a connection, I like fully believe in city connections and location connections, you know, like I feel that with New York. I moved to L.A. when I was 19 years old and I never, ever one day ever looked back and thought, shit, maybe I shouldn't have done that.

I knew in my gut that I had a connection to L.A., that I needed to go. That was where I needed to be. And I just never had a doubt in my mind. And so I think you should always listen to your instincts. You know, sometimes we want to play that game and be like, well, da, da, da. And the pros and the cons, it's like your instinct is the most important, valuable thing, intuitive, like intuitiveness that you can have. And the most important relationship you can have with yourself is your instinct. So trust it. Yeah, definitely. I mean, I do know for a fact, like regardless of what happens, I'm moving come spring.

So I'm like, I cannot be here any longer. Like I really feel like, oh my God, like I should be doing something right now because like while I'm home, although it's like comfortable and obviously I have all my friends and family I grew up here. I also feel like I'm not progressing in any way professionally or like even personally, like I have like my connections and I'm not like gaining any more connections while being here like i just have what i've always had so i definitely now i'm getting that headspace i'm like oh my god like what am i doing like i'm literally spending months here and i'm accomplishing nothing i will say you can do and create wherever you are

in the world you know i mean that is not limited to, to space and, and like as, as a creator, as an artist, right? Like you should be doing stuff all the time if it feels right, wherever you are. Yeah, no, for sure. And I have been trying to do that, but wherever you move, there you are, like you are going, you are going to still be there. So find those things in your own body and space first and bring them with you wherever you go. Yeah, I mean, it definitely has helped because I think like you always talk to your family. Like, yeah, don't go too far. And then but like it's nice to talk to, you know, other people that like, I guess.

Planes are only getting faster. Planes are only getting faster. And also your relationship with your family improves once you get the fuck away from them. Everybody gets closer when there's some distance. I have a very tight knit family and that works because I left. And we are very strong. We spend all of our holidays together. We spend our summers together.

We are inseparable because, you know, distance doesn't create more space in that sense. You know what I mean? That's a physical thing, you know, distance doesn't create more space in that sense. You know what I mean? That's a physical thing, you know? So that could even strengthen the bonds with your family, being away from them. Yeah, no, I definitely agree with that. I think I definitely got a lot closer to, like, my brother, for example, when I moved to Vancouver. Like, when we were living in the same house, you know,

growing up with brothers, how that is. Since moving to Vancouver and now that I'm back, it's kind of, like, still been the same. But, yeah, when I moved away, it's when we i'm actually got like couldn't be able to talk and actually have a conversation so i definitely believe in that and totally agree with that so i guess it's not so much like about that the connection of things it's more so just like i think it's also the fomo you know like oh my god i'm gonna miss out on something or what happens if i can't get this time off work and i can't go home to that event or whatever. But think about what you're missing in London. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. It sounds

like you already made up your mind anyway. You just need a swift kick in the ass. And that's what we're here for. London town. Off you go. Keep us posted as to what you do and when you do it. Okay. Yeah. We love, We love updates. I'm excited. I love when people make big moves. I think that it opens up so many doors and pushes you into new places. I think it's such an incredible growth experience. So I'm very, very excited for you. Also, maybe try telling people that you're moving to London, even if you don't have a timeline.

See how it feels. And as you start to hear people be like, oh, you're moving to London, even if you don't have a timeline, see how it feels. And as you start to hear people be like, oh, you're moving to London. Oh my gosh. You'll feel whether it feels like right or wrong. And then we'll start to get very excited. But you have to start saying it in an English accent when you start telling. Can you do that? Yeah. I mean, every time I do, like, you know, sometimes like you just joke around you talk like in an accent and everyone's like you need to stop right now you're so bad at that okay I have told some people like I have been like yeah I know I'm planning on moving to London

everyone's always like oh that's so cool so I mean I have kind of done that as well but I definitely think that did help because like when you solidify it in your mind or at least like solidifying it in the sake of this person believes I'm going there, which means like I'm already one step closest to actually going because like people think I am, you know? So I definitely, I definitely believe in that. I definitely agree with that for sure. Well, thank you for calling in and good luck with everything. And yeah, get that move going. Put it into motion. Well, thank you so much. I know. Absolutely. I will keep you posted i'll let you know i'll get i'll get to the date when i'm peacing out all right do that

thank you i just realized i forgot my anti-psychotics i've got to take this before the next color i don't want to lose my shit, you guys. With a name like Cantaloupe, does it, I mean, Brandon, you got Cantaloupe, we're good. He was burying the lead. He should just go as Cantaloupe. Holy Cantaloupe.

He's got to move to London and change his name to Cantaloupe. Well, our next question comes from RH. Restoration Hardware, the outlet in Paramus. Yes. They say, Dear Chelsea, I'm 35 years old and the youngest of four.

My siblings all have kids of their own and I'm the only one without them. My husband and I have been together for 10 years and can't seem to fully commit to deciding to try to have our own kids or not. When I'm with my family, I sometimes feel not as included or seen. I know that's not enough of a reason to have kids, but we're struggling deciding if having kids is for us or not. How did you decide what you wanted and what tips do you have for me, RH? Well, I would say that if you're on the fence about having children, the answer is probably not to have children. I think if you want to have children, it's something that you are really you should be really sure about. You know, you're bringing that's a huge responsibility. You're bringing a whole other person into this world and you should be 150 percent sure you shouldn't be vacillating back and forth. And you certainly obviously should not do that for anyone else's feelings about your relationship or your merit within your family. I would argue that that's a you thing and that you should try and work hard to get past that

about your family, not taking you guys seriously because you don't have children. I think that's something that you kind of have to own and, you know, and be vociferous about, you know, like once you make your decision about whether or not to have children, if it's not to move forward, you the reasons will be solid for not doing that. You know what I mean? You can't be shamed or, you know, felt left out as the reason behind having a child. That's not something that to hang your hat on either. You guys are trying right now for a child, so you can speak to this. I've always wanted to be a parent. We've always wanted to have kids. I'm also 35 and the youngest of four, and I have 13 nieces and nephews. So I totally get the idea of having more merit.

I mean, I definitely gained more merit in my family when I got married. That was like a game changer to a man specifically. And we're so happy. I didn't end up with them. I love them. I love them. We're so much better than we've ever been, but I do really understand that feeling.

And I will say that I imagine you being the person who has a uterus being 35, you're probably feeling a lot of that society pressure that's like if you're gonna do it you have to do it now I know that as we've been struggling with getting pregnant for the last year that is like this constant piece that's on my mind even though I know 35 is not that old but like if you look online it's a fucking geriatric pregnancy like it is language like it's so wild the way that you're made to feel at this time and like making a decision because you feel pressured,

just like Chelsea said is not the way you want to go. But if you wanted some more security, you know, maybe freezing eggs or freezing embryos or doing something along those lines could help you feel more secure in the idea that you personally know you need to wait, but you don't always know if you're going to need to wait. And maybe something like that, whether or not you ever use them could feel like you're buying yourself a little more time. Yeah, that's a good idea. That's, I mean, you know, if you're

willing to go through that process, then, then, then that's a definite great option for you. But it definitely is a process. It that's a definite great option for you. But it definitely is a process. It's not a process that I've been through. And now, you know, we're doing IUIs now, which is like the step before IVF. I'm terrified to have to even think about doing IVF. Egg retrievals at all. Right.

Egg retrieval, the hormones. Like, I've never even taken birth control like I hate this shit you know but there is a world where like having these embryos safe could set us up for multiple children in the future I don't know it's like a game you have to play but I think it's definitely worth having the conversation and kind of sussing out options if if that you know feels right for you which it may not right I have a question for Chelsea actually on. On this subject matter? On this subject, yeah. Okay, perfect. Do you ever feel like, I know that you're in love currently, that potentially your future could be different than the one that it is now with kids?

No. I'm very steadfast about, I mean, I told him the other day I was pregnant just to see what his reaction was. And he was just looking at me like, because Joe's the type of guy that would be open to whatever. If I said that, yeah, I'm down, he'd be down. I'm not down though. And I know I'm not down because it's just like a fanciful idea. You know what I mean? It's only because I love him that I would even think of it, but I'm not down for it. I'm not down for raising a child. I'm not down for having to put a person in the world and be responsible for them. I mean, as a childless person, I would also say to you as somebody who has siblings, I get to be the best aunt that I

could ever be, mostly because I don't have children. You know, I get to shower attention onto a families that I'll never even meet. I get to give money to people in need all the time because it's not being used up for my own purposes and my own family. So there are real upsides to making that decision, you know, if that's where you go. And also I'm very present in all of my nieces and nephews life. And I take a lot of pride in being like that aunt that is going to be there, that is going to provide for them, that is going to have those conversations with them that are, they're not going to have with their parents. And so there are a lot of upsides to having that role in your

family as well. And I've never in my family not felt like I was part of my family because I'm kind of like the center of attention of my family. And I force us all to be together all the time. You know, I'm the ringleader. So I don't have, you know, that same thing where I feel, oh, my brothers and sisters have kids. I feel left out. But I would argue that is a state of mind. You know, it's a state of your own being, you know, because you do still have plenty to offer. Children don't define you, a few, I should say. So let us know how that goes. Thank you for writing in. And yeah, if you're thinking about possibly getting some eggs fertilized and going down that route, that's a great avenue, too, until you make a real decision, until you're really solid on one side or the other of the issue.

Check your insurance first before you do that, though. Chels, let's talk about this. SAG-AFTRA does not cover infertility. What are your fucking thoughts on that? What a surprise. What a surprise. I mean, I'm ready for a lawsuit. Well, I mean, that's going to have to change in the near future.

But every system is antiquated. Every health system is antiquated. I mean, women, you know what I mean? Health care for women. I mean, look where we are in this country. It's system is antiquated. I mean, women, you know what I mean? Health care for women. I mean, look where we are in this country. It's not surprising, unfortunately. It's just everything. Everything needs a major fucking update and people need to get with the program. But instead, we're sitting here having to fight abortion rights that, you know, from 50 years ago, instead of being able to tackle real issues like what you're describing, you know,

ironically, Republicans want to force women to have children, but they won't do anything about infertility. They won't do anything about women that want to have children that can't. So there you go. The irony and the hypocrisy at play every single day in this country. Everywhere. And on that note, we're all going to commit suicide. This has turned into a Christmas suicide podcast. Just crying in the corner. Excuse me. Well, while you're all doing that, we'll take a quick ad break and be right

back. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together on the Really No Really podcast, our mission is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like... Why they refuse to make the bathroom door go all the way to the floor. We got the answer. Will space junk block your cell signal? The astronaut who almost drowned during a spacewalk gives us the answer. We talk with the scientist who figured out if your dog truly loves you. And the one bringing back the woolly mammoth. Plus, does Tom Cruise really do his own stunts?

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app on Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay. And we're back nico and bethany do you have a piece of advice that you'd like from chelsea i have a piece of advice because i mean i've watched you over the years in many different phases of your career and what i've always loved about you is that it seems to me anyway like you don't give a fuck and i kind of mentioned this earlier and i think giving a fuck is something that often gets in my way kind of a question, but any advice for like tossing off the other voices? Yeah. I mean, I think it's something that you put into practice and it gets easier and easier as you go on, you know, not giving a fuck is like an actual practice. It's like meditation, you know, when you're doing the work on yourself and you're constantly paying attention and you have your self-awareness in check, it makes it a lot easier to not give a fuck.

Before it was like it was more flagrant for me when I was younger. I didn't give a fuck because I was arrogant. Now I don't give a fuck because I know I've done the work and I'm solid. Like I'm not worried about any of my behavior or, you know, offending people in small situations. I'm not worried about not making small talk with somebody and not hurting their feelings. I don't have any of that anymore because I understand it's not my job to make everyone feel good. It's not my job to make everyone feel comfortable. And if people really have a problem with me, then they have a bigger problem with themselves.

And that really is all you have to remember. Like if anyone is sitting there on Instagram commenting on your page about how much they dislike you, think about what's going on in that person's life. Yeah. Right. Absolutely. Never in my entire existence have I ever commented seriously. Like my male comic friends, I will fuck with that. I'd be like Kevin Hart's page and be like, you know, nobody thinks you're a good actor.

But that's because we're good friends. And I take it back as his latest movie or series, True Story. He did do some good acting. Come on, Kevin. And I take it back as his latest movie or series, True Story, he did do some good acting. And I wrote that on his Instagram page too. But as attacky as I've been in my life, or as, you know, giving people unsolicited advice and going off on people who I thought were fucking idiots, I would never spend my time tearing somebody down in that way. So that's all you need to know. You know, anybody who has a strong opinion of you that's negative is really none of your business. I think, you know, logically that's a train of thought.

So I am in the practicing phase. It's better than it used to be. I've also like taken some tangible steps to maybe like not read every single DM. Like I don't need to read these DMs that are coming in. Maybe I don't need notifications on my phone or like maybe there's some places where I can kind of tune out. And I think like logically, I know, but there's definitely an emotional part of me. I'm also like a teacher and a trainer and I work with people's bodies. So like caring about how other people feel is like built in to who I am. And I think there's like a place where like, how do I still find ways to be compassionate and have this part of me that is like vulnerable and sweet and that I love and also like put up the walls to protect myself at the same time.

And I think that's a balance. Well, even on your Instagram page, it's called the become project. Even on your Instagram, on that page itself, right? You have to look at what you're representing on that page and embody it, right? You're helping people to be in touch with their feelings about themselves, not to be in touch with their feelings about you, right? You have to look at what you're representing on that page and embody it, right? You're helping people to be in touch with their feelings about themselves, not to be in touch with their feelings about you, right? So when you need sometimes to remind yourself of who you are, I do this a lot. I'm like, if I go down an insecure road or I think about something somebody wrote or said about me, it only takes me a minute to remind myself of who I am and what I stand for.

And for you, I would say to go to your page and look at what you've created and look at what you stand for and look at what you're trying to extol, right? And that's your reminder of who you are. Right, right. Yeah. And getting back into that center. Yeah. We all just need to remind ourselves who we are, you know, none of us are good or bad or, you know, we do bad things or we do good things. And once your ship is steady and you're moving along and you're conscious and aware of the world around you, your purpose and your gift is to make other people feel that way. Right. So you've always got to kind of remind yourself

that, hey, this is me. This is what I represent. And this is all I have to worry about. Yeah. You know, and you're always becoming right? It's not called The Cum Project. No, that's a separate project that I'm working on. That's my project. That's going to be released this summer. The Cum Project. It's actually called

The Cum Dumpster. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. And don't try to get that. I have cumdumpster.com taken. Joe bought it for me for Christmas, so don't even.

Sweet. That's how you got pregnant, right? Yes. The third time. Oh, good. Good stuff. thank you guys so much for coming what a delight the two of you are so happy to meet you yeah that was fun i can't wait to hear that you're pregnant and you guys are expecting a baby yeah it's gonna happen yeah absolutely yeah and good luck with everything thank you so much yeah nice to meet you guys. Appreciate you having us. Thank you, Catherine.

And thank you guys for listening. We will see you or you will hear us and possibly see us next week. Chelsea, do you have some upcoming show dates that you want to tell people about? Oh my God, always. February 2nd and 3rd are my Seattle shows. Oh, also we added Philly. So come to Philly or Honolulu or Kauai or no, Maui. Shit. Who knows? So we have added second shows to a lot of markets, but those are the immediate dates coming up. Anyway, does that answer your question, Catherine? It absolutely does.

Great. Well, that's all we have for today's episode. Okay. Well, that was a definite therapy session. We will see you next week, guys. Bye. Bye. Bye. And if you have a question, or you and a loved one have a question, please write in to DearChelseaProject at gmail.com. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together, our mission on the Really No Really podcast is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why the bathroom door doesn't go all the way to the floor,

what's in the museum of failure, and does your dog truly love you? We have the answer. Go to reallynoreally.com and register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead. The Really No Really Podcast. Follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.