Dear Chelsea - The Psychology of Your 20s with Jemma Sbeg

Episode Date: August 14, 2025

Jemma Sbeg joins Chelsea to talk about age-gap friendships, how life is a series of waiting rooms, and why friendship breakups can be as awful as romantic breakups.  Then: A newly queer woman wonders if she should move to a larger city to surround herself with community.  A long-distance daughter struggles with her family’s oscar-worthy goodbyes.   * Pick up a copy of Jemma’s book Person in Progress! * Need some advice from Chelsea? Email us at [e-mail] * Executive Producer Catherine Law Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert * * * The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees.  This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all.  Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice.  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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It's time to talk about ownership, equity, and everything in between. Black and brown communities have historically been last in life. Let me just say this. AI is moving faster than civil rights legislation ever did. Listen to Money and Wealth from the Black Effect Podcast Network on IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, Catherine. It's Thursday. Hi, it's Chelsea Lately. I mean, sorry, dear Chelsea Day.

Dear Chelsea Lately. Dear Chelsea Lader. It's all the things. You know what? I always thought that was a brilliant piece of branding that you did. It's like everything you do has your name in it. It's beautiful. Well, you know what?

It's really hard to come up with titles. So I were just, I'm planning a big tour next year, a big stand-up tour. and we were going around titles because tour names usually don't have my name in them. Okay. They usually are words. So this isn't unusual,

but you're right. Everything, I don't know, is it good branding or is it a fucking annoying? What did I have to say? Oh, I had something I was going to say. What have you been up to? I actually have something to tell you about.

Oh, okay, great. Hit me. D-May. I've been taking Spanish sessions three times a week and I almost started crying during my class this morning because I was so frustrated. That's what she's dealing with.

Was it subjunctive? A 50-year-old woman who's getting emotional about not understanding certain things. Now, she's just only speaks to Spanish. Oh, that's tricky. I'm missing half of it. I mean, I'm assuming I'm going to get it at some time, but whatever. Yeah. You just kind of smile and nod sometimes. But I read this article yesterday that I was like, I have to tell Chelsea about this.

It was in the cut, and the title is, this economist crunched the numbers and stopped dating men. And she's never been happier. All I see on social media is how happy. be women are who are alone, single, and child free. Yes. It even goes on to talk about... And how much longer we live. I'm not trying to live longer, but I know that I fucking will. You're going to live to like 120. But she talks about like she did the research and she was like, I could actually be doing, she was married to a man. She goes, I could actually be doing less domestic labor if I was single than being married to a man.

Yeah, of course. Of course. Now she's married to a woman and they are co-parenting beautifully and having a great time. Yeah. And they get along and they actually can, I've, I've actually into it what the other person might need ahead of that person asking. I mean, I was just training with Ben Bruno. I went on to say I'm at 85% from all of my medical issues this year. Great, good. So I'm now back training with my foot is healing. Everything's good.

I'm doing so well. I decided to pop over to Abiza for the weekend for a friend's birthday celebration. So I'm leaving tomorrow night. Oh, this weekend. Yes, this weekend. I decided, you know what? Fuck it. I'm just going to go.

I was like, I can't go. And then I was like, I'll get up for a couple. days. And then I have to go to New York anyway because, you know, the U.S. Open is starting. And I have some shows in West Hampton. By the way, there's still shows tickets for the 22nd, August 22nd, West Hampton. I've been staying with my friend Kat, who is a home.

She should be a home health care nurse is what she should be. She is so, such a caretaker, you know, and it's that. You've needed it. I can take care of people in financial ways only. That is what I, and pep talks. You know what I mean? Like, emotionally, philosophically, that kind of thing.

But when I started staying, there because, of course, my house is still not done. The new date is August 25th when I return from New York, and we'll see about that. So anyway, I was saying, oh, when I moved in with her, I was like, listen, I, she cooks all the time. I was like, I really would like to learn how to do a couple of basic things. Like, I want to be a little bit more self-sufficient. So she started out showing me, like, little things to do when you're cooking and how to use

an air fryer, how to use an oven. properly like you know I don't have the attention span like my brain just I found a word that describes me today this is unrelated to my domesticity or lack thereof it's called enumerate is somebody who doesn't understand math okay like I can multiply divide very quickly like my cousin Molly can't add she she if you go if I say okay it's three o'clock we have to be somewhere at six she uses her fingers she's like three four and I'm like okay she's so smart yeah yeah she's very smart but like I'm like what and I'm like you know I want to meddle the multiplication tables when I was in like third grade like any multiplication I mean maybe not four digits but

you know yeah but anything that's like long division over time interest rates anything like that fuck a recoup I don't understand so anyway I went moved into Kat's house that's who I'm staying with my friend Kat and she was started showing me little things to cook like basic recipes that I could make. And then within like the first week, we just started going out, ordering takeout. And then last night, she's like, I haven't cooked since you moved in, basically. And I'm like, I know. I've broken you. I've made you into me. Like, I've turned you into me. Like, you know, bring us things and people. And half of the stuff I get delivered, I don't even eat. It's so wasteful, right? Right. And so last night, she did cook for us. And I haven't learned anything. I mean, I think

I think I know how to use an air fryer, which will be helpful if I ever move into my actual house. There's actually a shoot at my house on the 25th of August. So, I mean, the construction company just has to, you know that. But I've tried this move before where I'm like, okay, I'm moving in. Ready or not, here I come. That was six months ago. That was six months ago and then six months before that. But who's complaining because my life is beautiful and fun?

And I've been writing in my gratitude journal every morning. I have two gratitude journals. Okay. You write down like three things that you, you know, would make today a great day. Then you make, write down three things you're really appreciative of. And then you write down like your mantra, your three, whatever three things you want to say to yourself that day. And then at night you get it and you're like, what are three highlights of the day? It's like, takes less than five minutes.

I love that. And then I do my full one, like where I write down 20 things I'm grateful for, however many the page will fit. And that's helping most days. But today, I started off, you know, I did that, and then I took my Spanish, my Zoom. All went out of the window. It really pissed me off. And then I went to Ben Bruno's and I got my strength back. And now my hair's wet from sweating because I took a shower before my workout instead of after my workout.

I do things a little differently around here, people. Okay? I'm working backwards. Well, we have a fun guest today. She is all about the psychology of her 20s. Oh, yes, yes. This is good. This is, yes, all about the psychology of your 20s podcast.

She is the host of an author of a new book, Person in Progress. Please welcome Gemma Spag. Hi, Gemma. So nice to meet you. Yeah, lovely to meet you both as well. From America to Australia. Doug is coming in to say hello. Doug, say hello.

Say hello, Doug. You have to look the other way. I love every time we feed him, he comes over to thank me. Oh, I see. He comes over to say, oh, no. Actually, I think he wants food. Anyway, so Gemma hosts a podcast called The Psychology of Your 20s. And you talk about, you have a lot of interesting subject matter and chats about what it is like to be in your 20s today.

And first I want to ask you what you think is the difference between being in your 20s today versus previous periods of times. That's like the million dollar question, right? I feel like if I could answer that in one word, it would be there is more, more, more technology, more opportunities, which is amazing, but then also more competition. more of a choice overload, more pressing threats from the economy, from the climate. I think that there are ups and downs, right? There is, it's kind of giving with one hand, taking with the other, as a generation. You know, we have a lot more freedom. We have more options in terms of who we date, how we express ourselves, what we want to do for work.

But that can also come with a lot of downsides and a lot of additional stresses that maybe previous generations didn't have to deal with. It always comes back to social media for me, right? Because that's pretty much the real, the biggest difference in our society is that everyone knows what everyone else is doing and when they're not invited, which I think when you're in your 20s, you still care about that stuff. I mean, I think there's a lot of people in their 50s that still care about that stuff. So one of the things that you talked about recently in one of your episodes was about the ability to handle being disliked or the just ability to be disliked.

So what did you learn from talking about that? So much. It's kind of scary what you just said that you still care about that at 50 sometimes because I was hoping that I would age out of that conundrum. I think many people do. And then some people don't. It's just like anything else.

I remember growing up and having my friend's parents be so invested in my friend's life. like I remember her mom, I had two friends and their moms were just so interested in everything and wanted to orchestrate everything and be involved in every party and wanted to know everyone who had a crush on every, and I was like, these women are reliving out, they're living out their fantasies vicariously through their own children, like how pathetic. But then, you know, you get to be that age. I mean, I don't have that problem because I don't have children, so I'm not like trying to live vicariously through them. But I've definitely seen some of my friends be trying to live out their fantasies through their children, yeah, for sure. So that's a different beast. I think it all comes back to like this very human, very instinctual urge to just be accepted and to belong and to feel like you matter. Like one of my favorite quotes or ideas is that the only thing that anyone wants is for someone else to bear witness to their life. And that doesn't have to be a romantic partner. It could be friends, it could be your colleagues, anyone around you. You want to feel like if you were gone,

people would care. And so that fear of missing out and that fear of being disliked, I think comes back to that very primal need. You know, any of those instances where you weren't invited to the party, you know, you weren't invited to your friend's wedding, even though you thought you were really, really close. Those are all instances where you're like, okay, maybe my perception of my social circle wasn't accurate and that's really scary because that could mean that come the end of my life come tomorrow I could be a lonely person especially as like in your 20s I think I've noticed as to further along I've gotten into my 20s you're not quite sure yet how to ride the wave like your first big friendship breakup is like huge and like life altering because you've never experienced

it before but you know my mom such a wise woman she was like by the time you get to like my age like you've had that happen and you know that you're going to survive maybe like in your 20s you just don't have that experience yeah i don't know if that's something that you got you've found Absolutely. I mean, and the more you experience anything, the more used to it you get. You know, it's just like going to prison and getting in in only penetrated every single day. And that didn't happen before you were in prison. And you were like, oh my God. And then all of a sudden, a few months go by. And it's 5 p.m. And you're like, okay, my boyfriend's coming over. And that's what's going to happen in my life. So, I mean, unfortunately, the human condition, what is amazing about the human condition is we can almost acclimate to anything. I think it's really all about a sense of self. And it's about how much inner work you're willing to do. between the ages of 20 and 50 to get to a place where you are so confident and secure in who you are that you aren't really swayable or as vulnerable to outside sources as you are to your own self-esteem, you know, like how you feel about yourself is more important than how others feel about you and how you feel about yourself is more important than getting invited to a something. But I know that's more of a, you know, kind of philosophically spiritual

way to look at things when you actually have enough experience or... And we've kind of talked about this before where it's like, that doesn't necessarily just happen because you get older. It's also something you have to put effort into and work to grow toward. Yeah, because we can get upset about really small shit, right? Like, you can get upset about the dumbest shit. And you can also choose to not get upset about anything. You could get delayed and your flight could... You'd be at an airport for five hours waiting for a plane and be in a perfectly happy mood and read a book. And, and... and occupy yourself, watch a fun show, whatever.

Or you could be a fucking cunt about it and be sitting there screaming and pissing and moaning. You know what I mean? I guess you think sometimes you would outgrow that behavior, but it's also your personality and what you're willing. Like I used to have a very rageful, crazy, reactive personality. Now I go, you know, if things aren't going well or if I'm upset, I go within.

I don't act out. I take my business upstairs and deal with it myself, like a big girl. You know, I wish I had those tools when I was younger, but I don't think that's every 20-year-olds. I mean, some 20-year-olds are pretty mature, and I'm sure you know because you're doing this podcast, so you talk to a lot more people in their 20s. Oh, 100%. And also, like, we all have our heart.

We all have our thing. So I'm going to, like, fully call myself out. I really have never had a problem with people not liking me. Like, that's a big one for me. And I see it as such a blessing. Also, you kind of have to have that attitude if you're going to do what we do. right like having a somewhat public face having people know what you're doing i've just never had a problem with it organically but when it comes to other parts of my life i really really suffer when it comes

to like anxiety over the future over thinking my future that's something i wish i could turn off and then there's other people who will be like oh you know i am paralyzed by this idea of people not liking me or whatever it is but i have like no worries that i'm going to figure it all out like i don't worry about the future like what are you talking about you know I don't think about like really big questions around like where I'm going to turn up what's going to happen am I going to be okay I don't worry about money so I do also think that it's personality and then it's just like whatever your brain I think the insecurity like whatever your big insecurity is is what it latches onto so maybe like anger is like oh am I worried that I'm not going to be in control and so I have this like very vibrant

emotional reaction because it feels like the biggest thing I could do to bring anything back into my control or any number of things like that where it's like it all links back to personality but also insecurity and individual differences about what is your hard and what is your kind of journey through that as well. You're saying heart like heart like you're like a your organ like you're hard like a big hard rock like what is your hard oh you're hard okay I didn't I don't know if it was the accent or if I was like, okay, is she saying hard? Okay, we don't use it that way, so that's good to know. I'm glad you explained that.

You talk about breaking up friendships, which is a good subject matter because that happens at any phase in life to people. And I guess the first time it is the worst time, right? It's kind of like it can be very hard to recover from that. So what, have you, did that happen to you? Yeah, and it's happened to me a few times. And I will say there did come a point where it happened like maybe three times. in a year and I had to be like, I'm the problem. Like, this is not a, this is a me thing.

It was especially like this very pivotal point of my life when I was leaving university, college. And I basically had this huge falling out with my roommates, with this person who had been my best friend throughout my college university days, like best friends. We thought we were going to be each other's bridesmaids. She was going to be the auntie to my children. And I think the reason it was a breakup but it felt more like a fizzle it felt like we'd fallen out of love with each other that there were these things that had always bothered us about each other almost like a relationship that we just kind of swept under the rug because we were friends when maybe if that was in a romantic relationship it would have ended decimated the relationship sooner but because

it was a friendship everything was a little bit less and just tiny bit less intense and it was this fizzle and then it was this huge break where I just never heard from her again, never heard from her again almost overnight and never really knew why. And then you have to kind of go back and examine your behavior. And recently, I actually saw her. She lives in Sydney now, which is where I live. And it was actually quite a beautiful moment. Do you guys have sushi train? We don't have it, but I know what it is. Yes. Explain what it is. Well, basically I'm pitching anyone who's listening the best big franchise idea for America, which is basically a tiny train. Like, you sit at like a counter and this train carrying all types of sushi like comes around and you can like pick

what you want. We have it. We just don't call it sushi train, right? It sounds wonderful, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We know what you're talking about. Yeah, that is wonderful. There we go. It's vital for the story. So I'm sitting at one of these and it's kind of like onto the street, like where I'm sitting, you can kind of see out these glass doors. And across the road, I see her and her, obviously her new boyfriend and we haven't seen each other in probably two to three years at this point and they're standing at the lights and she's like looking at him and she just looks so happy so happy and i had this huge inclination to like go out and run to her and be like i'm so sorry i'm so sorry i'm so sorry like i miss you yak i know it's been a long time and i just kind of left

it i was like she everything's worked out for her she's got this beautiful boyfriend she's in this beautiful city on this you know the main street like she's probably going to get dinner and i think it's also those moments where you realize how like with most breakups you mature from it you get something from it even when it's really really painful and that was just like a beautiful full circle moment for me that's nice at the sushi train yeah at the sushi train i do i love what you say about like you needed to examine your behavior in that moment because there have been a few relationships that fizzled like that and i wonder you know there are certain times when like you're like you yes, I'm the problem. And other times when you just find yourself outgrowing a friend group or

outgrowing a friendship. And what would you say are the ways that someone can tell, like, am I the problem? Am I the asshole here? Or maybe you just outgrew these folks? That's a really, really great question. I think the best way to tell is, is your life changing? Is there something about your life right now that is causing a transformation or an evolution? Or do you feel like you're the same that you've always been? Maybe that's actually why your friendships are also. fizzling because you're stagnant, you're unhappy, like you're kind of taking things for granted. The other way I think it's really easy to tell if it is you that's the problem is the level of conflict. Now, I'm going to say this. For women, conflict does not look the same in their

friendships as it does for men. And I was talking to my partner about this, about this kind of fight that two of my friends are having at the moment. It was very intricate. And he was like, how do you even how did you even know that they were fighting in the first place like when you were in this room with them when you were having dinner and i was like it's it's the it's the pauses it's the silence it's like you've got to remember conflict isn't an all out fight it's are they avoiding you like are these people perhaps excluding you not because they don't like you anymore but because maybe you're just bringing a really negative bad vibe or because you've done something that's offended someone that you haven't owned up to those are some of the more subtle signs i think

that there's conflict to miss. Yeah, I feel like most men just, like, can't pick up on those subtle things. Like, just those, like, intricacies. No, men don't pick up on nuances at all, for sure. Yeah. But, and I think another topic that people are obsessed with, and it doesn't, I guess it starts in your 20s, but it probably starts earlier than that, is falling in love. And I know you've talked about this on your podcast, finding love and the idea that they

may not find it, which I find to be just a silly, silly notion, because I've never met anybody that's never been in love, you know, unless they're eight. So I find that most people do find love. Do you feel like it's different? It's a really great question. Honestly, I wish that you could come on my show and tell people that. Because I, perfect. Like, I think they just don't believe it coming from me because I'm not older and wiser.

We get people writing all the time about that. I mean, people are constantly asking us, this, that on our podcast. But I just always, also, I just feel like it's one of those facts of life. Like, it's going to happen. And the longing and the pressing or pushing for things, it's like, it's one thing to have an intention for something. But to be actively, constantly pursuing it almost defeats the intention of what you want. You know what I mean? If you spend so much time almost, it's almost like becomes like you're begging for something. And things happen in a natural way. And like,

you have to kind of accept that that's one of the natural things that happen in life and that it will happen. Like, it is very likely to happen. More likely than unlikely. Here's the thing, though, I think with everything else in our life, right, we're told to be really like go for it, really proactive and to have like a five-year plan, to have all these other things, like if you want something, if you want the promotion work for it, if you want the dream house, save for it. And then when it comes to love, you're right. You can put yourself out there, but there's nothing that you can really control sometimes. That's where I think the fear of never finding anyone comes from, is that it's unpredictable. There's not like a,

there's no structure for finding your soulmate, the way that there's a kind of a structure for finding all the other things that you really want in life. And I gave this analogy to someone the other day, which is like, you remember when you were in high school and you just like couldn't wait to graduate? And you thought about it like all the time and you were like, oh my God, I just wish that I could be done with this and you know what's going to happen right but there is still this like longing that is filled with time and it's like within that time where you want to make plans you want to do fun things that you just want this final closure of like I'm going to graduate I'm going to find the love of my life before the rest of your life kind of starts does that make

sense it does but it's just so backwards when I hear that it's like before the your life starts I remember thinking that when I moved out to L.A. I was like when my life begins and my Life will begin when I have a career. That's when my life begins. And all those years leading up to getting the career are part of my life, too. But for some reason, at that time, they didn't feel like it. It was like, when I become successful, that's when everything starts. That's when it begins.

And I now realize how silly of a mindset that is. Because, yes, I was driven, but I also missed out on a lot of being present and enjoying the time and the ride and the climb and all of those things. It was always a means to an end. It was always a temporary part of my life. And I'm not sure if that attitude got me to become successful or if I could have, or if there was more to be taken out of, like more of a bite to be taken out of life at that moment. You know, I think when we have our minds so focused on our goals, we can sometimes like

miss the forest for the trees. It's too much focus sometimes. It's one thing to have an intention and to know this is what I want to do with my life and take steps to get there, but it doesn't have to be every facet of your being. Just like finding a love doesn't have to require like all of your effort. It can happen in a natural, easygoing way when you have a natural, easygoing attitude about things, which I don't think you get when you're in your 20s. I think that takes time to build. It does feel like one of the defining feelings of being in your 20s is that feeling of like, well, my life hasn't started yet or I'm falling behind and like,

am I doing enough and I'm not where I thought I would be by now. It's almost overwhelming. We get a lot of emails about that as well. Oh my goodness. I mean, I feel that way as well all the time. And it's exactly the same. It's like the predominant feeling. I want to say something though based on what you were saying, Chelsea. And it's the story of how I met my partner because I totally believe in your philosophy. I went on like a full dating detox. Like didn't date for a long time. was just like I just I'm not going to leave space for it and then I think it was like six months to a year later I was in like Bali with all my friends and they had all come out of these like terrible breakups and they they just wanted to you know have sex they just wanted to get late like they

just wanted to have the fun holiday experience and I was like yeah I'm going to get on that and I read downloaded the apps the first person I matched with hit it off with it just happened and we've been together for two years now. I love that. Almost longer. And I think it's that like, just let it be. But actually what your point was is in your 20s, it's kind of like, but when is the, like, when is the letting it be starting?

Like, when is the chill time starting? Like, can I do that now or is that going to like take away from the planning time later? Is that going to take away from like the fun, successful times in my 30s? If I like take a time off, if I take a break. if I'm not doing everything the way that everyone else is. The thing I always say, though, is like, what's this finish line we're racing towards? Well, right, because it's like your life is, if your life doesn't begin until you're, what, 30? Like, if you're in your 20s, preparing for your life to begin, when does it begin?

25, 30? And then what happens when you're 40, 50? You're dead? Like, what is the cycle of, like, the thought of a 20-year-old? Because I know when I was 20, I never thought beyond five years. Like, you know what I mean? I mean, it wasn't, I'm sorry, I never thought beyond five months, you know, I thought about the future, but the future was way beyond five months. And the immediate future was, you know, the real day in, day out of everything. So I don't know. I wonder if more like younger people were able to kind of not be so, I mean, I don't want to, because it's, I don't want it to confuse it with the word lazy. I don't mean being lazy. I mean being very clear about what you want in life and knowing it, but without being. crazy aggressive about it, I guess what I'm saying. And I think a lot of people would probably

disagree with that, because a lot of people would say you have to be crazy aggressive to get what you want. Oh, I don't agree at all. I think that having passion and genuine love for what you're doing is more important than discipline, because you're actually fall in love with the process. I also think the biggest thing that has sued that anxiety that you're explaining around like thinking way too far in advance, thinking that life ends at 30 or 40. was having age gap friendships with being friends with women and men who are a lot older than me. And I have this amazing friend called Emma, who I do pottery with. And she's in her 50s.

She has two kids who are almost my age. The amount of just solid advice that she gives me and just perspective of being like, what are you talking about? My 50s are like the best years of my life. I'm having more fun than I've ever had. I'm more relaxed than I've ever had. it just soothes so much of my anxiety that I think and I'm saying this and it's going to like almost I'm going to stab myself in the back like sometimes another 20 something year old can't tell you that

because they don't have the experience at that time does that make sense like yeah it's really important I mean I think I guess it goes back to what you were saying at the beginning which is everybody wants to be seen everybody wants to be you know valued everyone wants to matter because if you don't matter then you feel invisible and so that's very common and I think that's starts early, you know? That starts like when you're a teenager because that's when you're a kid and you have your parents and if you have an ideal childhood, you're getting all this love and attention. You don't have time to think about anything else. But if you have a single parent or you don't have two parents or you're not brought up in a loving home, then your circumstances could

be different, you know, earlier on you could start to feel alone or I think the feeling people jump to is to is your it's more of a survival right it's survivalism you have to survive whatever circumstances you're in and i think in your 20s the idea of survival becomes a little bit more abstract you know what i mean it's not real survival it's like social survival love survival you want to you're you think everything is the most intense it could ever be and everything is so much more important than it is even though certain things are fucking important it's like kind of the accent of importance on everything. I think that's what I definitely don't miss from my 20s, is thinking like the end all, be all, like there's one love of my life. There's going to be one love

and he's going to understand me and he's going to be my soulmate, you know, which is a pile of garbage. There isn't, who wants one lover anyway. You can have a bunch of soulmates. Yeah, exactly. Like my sister's my soulmate. You know the one I'm talking about. And yeah, I think there's just a lot of, I would hate to be 20 years old today and I don't want to see. that because I'm sure 20 year olds are fine but I when I think back at my 20 year olds I'm just like oh my god there was there was nothing like this shit that you guys have to deal with jama are the 20 year olds fine no no the amount of like the anxiety levels are just like through the freaking root I mean I don't even think I understood when anxiety was until like a few years ago same

and and because it would you know the over explanation of it in society now almost everyone has anxiety which is causing me anxiety you know so and you've got to think about why that is right like I always get these comments from people who are a lot older being like what do you have to worry about like you don't have kids you don't have you know a mortgage you don't have any of these things and I'm like look at the environment that we're living in look at the context how could you not be an anxious wreck right now like nothing about our environment is stable yeah it was so over stimulated everything is constantly changing read any newspaper it's horrific like how as a generation that's like now responsible for that future guys we're getting very deep here but you know you feel

responsible for that future you are the future how are you meant to feel sane knowing that everyone thinks is going to shit right like I don't know I just feel like it's uh that's a common reason for the anxiety levels and then you have to worry about like what your dream job is like What? Well, on that note, should we talk to some people with anxiety? Yeah, definitely. Okay, we're going to take a break, and we'll be right back with Gemma's beg. This week, we'd love to hear from people who perform in drag.

If you're a drag performer and have questions or would like some life advice from someone who's an expert on the topic, please write in to Dear Chelsea Podcast at gmail.com. What's up, guys? Welcome to Augusto Papa, the go-to spot for everything Musica Mexicana. We're proud Mexican Americans who live and breathe this. music, we started this podcast to share and discuss our views on Musica Mexican. Whether you like Pesso Pluma, Los Aligres del Barranco, Ariel Camacho, or Ivan Cornejo when you gain your fields, then this podcast is for you. We deep dive into music reviews. Pesso Pluma show last year,

everything was a 10 out of 10. Fashioning and lifestyle inspired by the roots of music Mexica, the craziest controversies and chismes. I don't have nothing against Fuerza, I know, and I don't think J.P. should be mad at me. Song and artist's comparisons, competition in the scene, There is competition, there is sides to this. There's Pesso Pluma, Double Pee, and there's JOP, Stream, Mob. I think at the end of the day, it's business, it's all competition. And, of course, our personal stories and opinions along the way.

This isn't just a podcast. It's a movement for fans who live Musica Mexicana every single day. Listen to Augusto Papa as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Have you ever wished for a change but weren't sure how to make it? Maybe you felt stuck in a job, a place, or even a relationship. I'm Emily Tish Sussman, and on she pivots, I dive into the inspiring pivots of women who have taken big leaps in their lives and careers. I'm Gretchen Whitmer, Jody Sweetie.

Monica Patton. Elaine Welter-A. I'm Jessica Voss. And that's when I was like, I got to go. I don't know how, but that kicked off the pivot of how to make the transition. Learn how to get comfortable pivoting because your life is going to be full of them. Every episode gets real about the why behind these changes. and gives you the inspiration and maybe the push to make your next pivot.

Listen to these women and more on She Pivots, now on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I don't write songs. God write songs. I take dictation. I didn't even know you've been a pastor for over 10 years. I think culture is any space that you live in that develops you. On a recent episode of Culture Raises Us podcast, I sat down with Warren Campbell, Grammy-winning producer, pastor, and music executive. to talk about the beats, the business, and the legacy behind some of the biggest names in gospel, R&B, and hip-hop. This is like watching Michael Jackson talk about Thurley before it happened.

Was there a particular moment where you realize just how instrumental music culture was to shaping all of our global ecosystem? I was eight years old, and the Motown 25 special came on. And all the great Motown artists, Marvin, Stevie Wonder, Temptations, Diana Raw. From Mary Mary to Jennifer Hudson, We get into the soul of the music and the purpose that drives it. Listen to Culture raises us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine that you're on an airplane, and all of a sudden you hear this.

Attention passengers. The pilot is having an emergency, and we need someone, anyone, to land this plane. Think you could do it? It turns out that nearly 50% of men think that they could land the plane with the help of air traffic control. And they're saying like, okay, pull this, until this, pull that, turn this. It's just, I can do it my eyes close. I'm Mani. I'm Noah.

This is Devin. And on our new show, no such thing, we get to the bottom of questions like these. Join us as we talk to the leading expert on overconfidence. Those who lack expertise lack the expertise they need to recognize that they lack expertise. And then, as we try the whole thing out for real. Wait, what? Oh, that's the run right. I'm looking at this thing.

Listen to No Such Thing on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back with Gemma Spag. Okay. What do we got? We are back. Well, we're going to start with a couple of callers today. Our first caller is Michelle. And Michelle says, Dear Chelsea, I'm 25 years old.

And over the past two years, I've questioned my sexuality and recently accepted that I'm gay. I haven't told many people. And I'm not sure when I will fully come out. I live in a small town. It's a cute mountain town where I can do all the things I love, like trail running, climbing, and skiing. I've met some great people and have formed some really meaningful relationships. I have also been given a huge career opportunity here.

I was recently asked to be a partner in a business that I really believe in and care about. However, since coming to terms with my sexuality, I have struggled with the idea of staying in my small town. I don't have many friends in the queer community here, and I've recently realized how important it is to have that. I can't help but think I might be happier. living somewhere bigger and more diverse. However, the work opportunity is keeping me here, at least for the time being. We've discussed opening locations in other cities, but I just don't

know how well that would go over with my boss. I just don't know if I can stay here long term. Is it crazy to want to try something that I don't even know would be worth it? Should I risk the opportunity that I have now? Any advice is so appreciated, Michelle. Hi, Michelle. Hi. Hi. How old are you? I'm 25. Oh, perfect. This is a good. is the perfect age range. This is literally right at my alley. Yeah. Do you mind telling what mountain town do you live in or is that too? Are we going to? I live in Jackson Hole, Wyoming. Oh my God. Nice. I knew you were going to say that. I fucking knew it. I was as soon as you said Mountain Town. I'll say, oh, she's from Jackson Hole. Okay. Anyway, I'm not from there,

but that's, that's where, yeah, it's where I live. I understand that you live in a small mountain town, but I feel like you're, do you have any information that leads you to believe that your co-workers or your is going to have an issue with you being gay? No, no, no, no. That's not the problem. What is the problem? You think you're not going to find enough community there? Right, right.

I see. I feel like you have a great job opportunity that already sounds like it could bleed into going to a different city and opening up different franchises or whatever, the business, you know, different outposts in different cities. I wouldn't want you to project what you think, is going to be the result of your sexuality before you find that out. Do you know what I'm saying?

Like, have you really given yourself a chance to be out and about in Jackson Hole in your job in your community? No. That's a good point, actually. Yeah. I guess my issue is also I have a gay brother, which is just a coincidence. But I think that I see his community and then I see communities like in bigger cities about like all of these other people that have friends in the queer community and Jackson Hole is just so small that it is so accepting and that's not the issue like acceptance would be fine the issue would be like just having that community there as opposed to like living in a bigger city and having a community I guess I just think that you're 25 years old you're you have we were just talking about this you have your whole life ahead

of you even though I'm sure you feel like you're already halfway in the grave because because 25-year-olds think they're fucking old. But you have your, like, this is, you have a great job opportunity. I would combine the two things and see how it works out in Jackson Hole with the intention of moving to a bigger city down the road. Like, you don't have to do that this year. You could wait a year. You could maybe wait two years. But you don't have to spend the rest of your life in Jackson Hole. You can stay in this town, develop your job, like see where that takes you. And maybe that will be the vehicle that takes you to another city. You know, if you give yourself some time to just like chill out and feel the vibe out. You don't know. You could

fall in love with somebody in Jackson Hole. I'm just going to say, I do really appreciate though the being young in the queer community, right? And it feels like that's where it really is when you're like in your 20s and you're young and queer and like in New York, in New Orleans, like in one of those like vibrant places. I do think that sometimes it's like life is sometimes a series of waiting rooms and you're probably in this waiting room right now where you're like Can I have it all? It's like, yes, you can. Just not all at the same time. So you could be in one of those huge cities and being like, I'm so accepted. I'm loved. I've got all these friends and we're going to like chapel rowing gigs, like super fun. And then be like, but my job sucks. So I think

like right now it's like you're really coming upon like this major problem and conundrum, which is like, how come everything in my life isn't perfect at the same time? Like how come I couldn't have both? So I really think that you kind of have to like flip the dice here. what's more important to you right now, knowing that you might not be able to have both, is it having the community that is brought by, like, being, like, gay and, like, open in, like, a bigger place, or is it having the career that then you could build that community on in the future? It's kind of up to you to choose. Yeah. And I think just, like, it being so new right now or new to, like, me accepting it, that feels like the, like, the bigger part is that,

like, it feels crazy to be in a big city where, like, I could just be open and free. And, like, I don't know everyone at the store when I go to the grocery store every week. Yeah. Like that feels like a crazy feeling. So I think that's like the desirable thing right now. But if I were to wait a little while, I think it would be less exciting. I would also encourage you to get involved in some little community that's in your town because there might be folks that you don't know are gay or just aren't really out or maybe they are out and you just didn't know.

But also like maybe there's some travel opportunities here too. Maybe there's like going to Pride in New York City or a smaller town. town, if that's more your vibe. There are events all over the place all of the time. So maybe this is like getting one friend in your community who maybe you can travel with and do that sort of thing. But I also think like just as you begin to come out to more people, you'll start to build that community even though it's a small town. Yeah, I think that's true. Is there the potential, did you say with this job, there's the potential you said, of possibly opening up different branches or what was that part? Yeah, we've talked a lot about opening different locations. Actually, I am also in

school and having a really hard time finding nurse practitioner clinical. So we've talked about just like me moving somewhere for the eight months that I have to do my clinical is to open up another branch. So that's also an option. Oh, well, there you go. That's great. That's too killing two birds with one stone or killing, no, or killing one bird with two stones. I'm not really sure. I'm a little upside down today. It's also, I guess like also hard like little things like Jackson Hall housing is horrible. So like leaving is kind of scary because then you don't know. if you're going to get housing when you come back. It's just all. But yeah, I definitely have the opportunity and I'm definitely not complaining. I live in the most beautiful place ever.

Yeah, but you're in grad school. You've got a gig. You've got a job. Like, you're comfortable with your newfound sexuality. Yeah, that's awesome. All of these things are awesome to know about yourself. You're ahead of the game. So these are all good things. The future is bright. You just have to figure out what you're going to do. And it sounds like I think I know exactly what you're going to do. Yeah, I think, yeah, I guess I do too. Talking it out is definitely beneficial too. Yeah. And the most important thing, like the biggest takeaway is it is so important to identify what you want out of life. You know what I mean? It's so important to hear you say, like, this is who I am. This is my sexuality. This is what I want. All of those things, saying that out loud is just so valuable. Like, these things will all come true for you. Yeah. So great. Have it.

a great life. It's going to be awesome. Yeah, this is all really exciting for you. Thank you so much. Yeah. Thank you so much for all the advice. Yeah, for sure. And enjoy the town you live in while you're there.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Thanks so much, Michelle. Okay, thank you. Take care. I have so many friends who didn't come out, which by the way, this is also fine, but like didn't come out until they were in their 30s or even in their 40s in some

cases. And like, this is so great for her. I'm so excited. What about Will Ferrell's Harper? Harper. What's Harper's last name? I don't know Harper's last name. I always, I want to say Harper Lee every time and that's the author. But she, I mean, she just came out and when she was in her 50s. Yeah. It's so hard though because it's like there's this whole thing of like being young and queer and like having all those opportunities. Like living in Sydney, I say all the time and I live in like Newtown, which is like the like gay capital of Australia. And you see that and I'm sure. she's seeing that and being like, that looks so fun and like exactly what we were saying before. It's like, that's where my life is going to start when that happens. I don't want to wait. I don't want to wait. But I think she's going to, I think everything's going to turn out so perfectly for her. Yeah. Yeah. And she'll expand her community when it's the right time.

Yeah. Yeah. More next caller is Ray and she says, dear Chelsea, I need your advice on being homesick, but also on being too emotionally exhausted to go home. Here's the situation. What? About five years ago, I moved a little over 1,400 miles away from my family, and honestly, the distance worked wonders for us. It's given us the space we've needed to heal our relationships, and we're all closer than ever. I miss them dearly, but every time I visit, the goodbyes are Oscar-worthy tear-jerkers. I've tried every family member for the airport drop-off, trying to find the one that won't make a scene, and spoiler alert, they all do. It's gotten to the point where my return flights are filled with dissociation, panic attacks going through security, and I spiral into a post-visit funk that lasts weeks after returning. Every time I get back to my life, which I might add is going great. It takes forever to remember that a homesickness doesn't mean I need to sell everything and move back. It just means, well, I miss my people and that's not a bad thing. It's not just airport drop off either.

Oftentimes, I'll visit for a full seven days, and we barely make it tonight, too, before someone's tearing up over the impending farewell. Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the love, but I am so tired, exhausted, spent. I'm torn between wanting to visit more and wanting to avoid the emotional Olympics. And by the time I recover, it's time for another visit. And we do this all over again. I do want to hold space for everyone's emotions and all that jazz. But I'd love to be honest and just say, y'all, I need you to be okay, please.

Am I the asshole here for feeling like I need to manage everyone's emotions? Please give it to me straight. Ray. Hi, Ray. Hello. Why is your family crying? What's up? How many people are there?

What's their problem? Uh, it's like four of us in total, including my niece now, who's starting to be old enough to, like, feed into all of this emotion that's around her. A baby crying is going to be, that would be so hard. It's like you've got the adults and then you've got the child, the child wailing. Absolutely. Yeah, no, it's not, it's like, I get phone calls every now and then saying, like, we miss you, when are you coming back? And they'll be like, they'll put her on the phone. And now she's the one who's like, when are you coming back? So it's a lot. I don't know.

And do you feel emotionally depleted because of their emotions, or are you also emotionally, is it emotionally difficult for you to leave? It is emotionally challenging for me, but the times that I've had a friend, like a non-biased party, like drop me off at the airport, it's all fine. Yeah. Like the flight's fine. Coming back here's fine, not a big deal. But yeah, anytime I've had family members drop me off, it's awful. It's so awful. Do you know how to take a fucking Uber?

Yes. But I'm saying like during the times that like, you know, we're sitting down for family dinner on night two out of seven. And my dad's just looking at me tearing up and stuff, thinking about how I'm going to leave already. You know, it's like I want to be kind of like, guys, get your shit together. But I talk to my therapist about this. And she's like, you need to be grateful that they love you so much. And I'm like, I get that. But I also want to.

But both can be true, right? You can be grateful and also be like, get your shit together. It's not productive. And it's clearly not helpful to you when you're leaving. And who knows what's going. I mean, it's not productive for any of you together and your family to be crying about leaving when you've just got somewhere. That doesn't make any sense. So. And you've never broached the subject with your family? No. I'm really trying to like let them have their feelings. And I'm not trying to like make them feel any type of way. But it's it's just getting to a point where. it's making me want to move back. It makes me forget about how good my life is here. And it's not really like me to want to just, like, give up everything just to go back and like coddle everybody. But that's the way it makes me feel.

But that's guilt. That's guilt. Yeah. So they're making you feel guilty by their behavior. And they're not intentionally making you feel guilty. Or maybe they are. I don't know. But that's neither here nor there.

What you're feeling is guilt. And that's not a reason to do anything. Do you know what I mean? You didn't do anything wrong. you're living your life, you can't go back and live with your parents because it'll make them feel better. Then you're sacrificing yourself. And there's a way to have like a healthy, balanced visitation with them whenever you choose to go home and also live your fullest best life. And they kind of have to get on board with that. What do you think, Gemma?

All right. I totally agree. I totally agree. I've got some solutions. I think that Chelsea, you've put nail on the head, it's guilt. I really think that they should be coming to visit you a little bit more as well. I know it's hard with like little kids, but if the main thing for you is like coming back and the homesickness and the disruption to your routine and your like sense of joy with your current life, maybe it would work better if it's like they're in your home, they're in your place, your return, return after they've left is less of a calm down. Also love to the advice, get like a friend to drop you off.

have this problem with my family as well and it's exhausting right it's exhausting yeah and sometimes i don't really oh can i come home for christmas i don't want to deal with that and it's right love them yeah you love them so much but you're like i want to move forward with my life but i also don't want to lose this relationship that we have that is so beautiful what am i going to do and i think the way i've really dealt with that is like we're going to meet in neutral places so now we go on family holidays together where the experience is like, oh, I'm so sad that we're leaving this beautiful place. Or they come and visit me 50% of the time. So it's not as jolting.

And also they appreciate that like my life is really lovely. And if I was to move home, I'm going to give that up. If I was to move back to Melbourne, like I'm not going to have this. And surely that's what they want for me more than they want my presents. See if they take the bait. See if you can do Christmas wherever you are. See, that's a great idea. That's a great idea to switch it up.

so you're not going to their house all the time. And how frequently do you see them? It's like once a quarter. Uh-huh. Once a fiscal quarter. Yeah. Yeah, break it up. And I also don't think, I think you should,

I think there's a way to have a conversation like with your family and not necessarily face-to-face, like maybe in an email. Or a text. A had a time. Not a text. That seems like a family email. to be like, listen, you guys, I know it's emotional when I come home. I feel the same way about you guys that you feel about me. But it really weighs heavily on me every time I leave. And I have

this overwhelming guilt. And I know you're not intentionally, just let them off the hook right right away. Like, I know you're not trying to make me feel guilty. But it's becoming more difficult for me to visit you if this is how I have to leave. Like, I don't want all these tears. It's, you know, it makes, it pulls at me. And I don't want to stop visiting. visiting you. So isn't there a way we can figure out, you know, a more like pleasant way to spend our time enjoying each other's presence rather than fearing each other's absence? Absolutely. Write that down. I like the idea of an email. Oh, I'm taking this. I was going to say, Ray is actually like our first caller ever who's actually writing things down.

Because it's true. Like I saw the pen. Your family, that's true. The time spent should just be loving and joyous and fun and a reunion not foreboding and oh no she's going to have to leave again that's like very fearful very guilty behavior and there's so many nice ways to say that without making you know making it something like you know it doesn't have to be cantankerous or vitriolic you're just saying out of love like it's getting harder for me to deal with leaving and you know i have a full life here i'm very happy i you know so i mean do they actually put it on the table for you to come move back. Do they suggest that a lot? Oh yeah. They're always like, we have a bedroom for you. We have some land. We can put you something on. Like, you know, if you ever need to come back, you know,

we've got spare funds for you to get you back here soon. So that's all. I mean, so you should definitely be clear. As an adult woman, you should just be clear being like, I also would rather you guys not keep saying that every time I come home. It's almost like you're ignoring my life and the present, you know, like I have a life. I'm happy. Don't you want me to be happy? I'm your daughter. You must want me to be happy. I am happy. So can you please let me be happy so we can all be happy together? Yeah, I think you should say that too and let them know, because that's all, it's all very manipulative. And even though they're your family and they love you, that's who you manipulate the people that are closest to you. That's true. Have any of them been to visit

you yet or not yet? They've all been out here once. They've come out here separately in the five years that I've been here. So there's definitely some opportunity for some more visitation on their end. Yeah. And then maybe you guys can find somewhere to go away for one of the holidays, like Christmas one year. That would be fun. Yeah, Gemma, I really love that. I love the idea of meeting in like a neutral place. It's really good. And then you do activities rather than just sitting at the home, that you go out and do stuff rather than just being like, oh, let's go through the baby album. Like, yeah. You've done with your old room. It's like, no. Like, let's Let's go see, let's go to the zoo. Let's go, like, go get coffee.

Yeah. Yeah. And make sure you, you don't forget to mention, you know, how lucky you are to have such a loving family and how lucky you know you are, you know. Absolutely. Because you are. Thank you so much for not making me feel delusional because, you know, like I said, I'm getting a second opinion here because the first time around my advice was like, be grateful. I'm like, wait, I am. Your therapist sucks.

Just going to tell you that. Sorry. I know that's probably not right. But you should get it in one. It might be time for a switch up, for sure. It's never a bad thing. All right, Ray, thank you so much for calling in. Hopefully she's listening to this podcast.

I can imagine. We'll just send those to her. It's fine. Well, I see her tomorrow, so I'll check in. After I'll find out. Bad tape of her. All right. Thanks for calling.

And good luck with everything. Thank you so much. Nice to meet you all. Bye. Bye. Bye. Okay. We'll take a break and we'll be right back with Gemma Sbeg.

What's up guys, welcome to Agusto Papa, the go-to spot for everything Musica Mexicana. We're proud Mexican-Americans who live and breathe this music. We started this podcast to share and discuss our views on Musica Mexicaa. Whether you like Pesso Pluma, Los Alaires del Barranco, Ariel Camacho, or Ivan Cornejo, when you gain your feels, then this podcast is for you. We deep dive into music reviews. Pesso Pluma show last year, everything was a 10 out of 10. Fashion and lifestyle inspired by the roots of musica Mexicaa, the creativity. craziest controversies and chisements.

I don't have nothing against Fuerza, I know, and I don't think JOP should be mad at me. Song and artist comparisons, competition in the scene. There is competition, there is sides to this. There's Pesso Pluma, Double Pee, and there's Jop. Street Mob. I think at the end of the day, it's business, it's all competition. And of course, our personal stories and opinions along the way. This isn't just a podcast.

It's a movement for fans who live Musica Mexicana every single day. Listen to Augusto Papa as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network. Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Have you ever wished for a change but weren't sure how to make it? Maybe you felt stuck in a job, a place, or even a relationship. I'm Emily Tish Sussman, and on she pivots, I dive into the inspiring pivots of women who have taken big leaps in their lives and careers. I'm Gretchen Whitmer, Jody Sweeten. Monica Patton.

Elaine Welterah. I'm Jessica Voss. And that's when I was like, I got to go. I don't know how, but that kicked off the pivot of how to make the trend. transition. Learn how to get comfortable pivoting because your life is going to be full of them. Every episode gets real about the why behind these changes and gives you the inspiration and maybe the push to make your next pivot. Listen to these women and more on She Pivots now on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I don't write songs. God write songs. I take dictation.

I didn't even know you've been a pastor for over 10 years. I think culture is any space that you live in that. develops you. On a recent episode of Culture Raises Us podcast, I sat down with Warren Campbell, Grammy-winning producer, pastor, and music executive to talk about the beats, the business, and the legacy behind some of the biggest names in gospel, R&B, and hip-hop. This is like watching Michael Jackson talk about Thurley before it happened. Was there a particular moment where you realize just how instrumental music culture was to shaping all of our global ecosystem?

I was eight years old, and the Motown 25 special came on. All the great Motown artists, Marvin, Stevie Wonder, Temptations, Diana, of all. From Mary Mary to Jennifer Hudson, we get into the soul of the music and the purpose that drives it. Listen to Culture raises us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Imagine that you're on an airplane, and all of a sudden you hear this. Attention passengers. The pilot is having an emergency, and we need someone, anyone, to land this plane. Think you could do it?

It turns out that nearly full. 50% of men think that they could land the plane with the help of air traffic control. And they're saying like, okay, pull this, until this. Pull that. Turn this. It's just... I can do it my eyes close. I'm Manny.

I'm Noah. This is Devon. And on our new show, no such thing. We get to the bottom of questions like these. Join us as we talk to the leading expert on overconfidence. Those who lack expertise lack the expertise they need to recognize that they lack expertise. And then, as we try to. the whole thing out for real.

Wait, what? Oh, that's the run right. I'm looking at this thing. Listen to no such thing on the Iheart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back with Jabba's Bag. We are back. So we have one final question.

This comes from Brianna. She says, Dear Chelsea. I'm a 26-year-old woman, and I've recently started a new job as a marketing coordinator for a small company. I previously worked as a bartender since I was 18 years old. She must be in Canada or something. I bartended through college and always made great money. So after graduating, I kind of got stuck in the industry and wasn't thinking about looking for a different job. I started to get sick of it and

decided it was time to start a more stable career. And now that I have that, I'm realizing it may not be what I want. At my entry-level position, I'm currently making less money working eight to five Monday to Friday than I was working maybe 30 hours a week at a bar. I'm picking up weekend shifts at the bar for extra cash and I'm starting to feel burnt out. I'm also struggling with the lack of freedom that comes with the eight to five and feel like I don't have time for things that I love to do like working out or going to a yoga class. I hate sitting at a desk all day and it feels like the company I'm working for doesn't have enough for me to do. So I'm extremely bored and feeling very unfulfilled. Get out of there. Yeah. I also have a passion for traveling and scoop a diving

and I know that working in the corporate world will limit the amount of time I can travel compared to being able to take time off whenever I want while bartending. I'm torn between wanting to stick it out and give it some time to get the experience and hopefully move up to a different position or company that I enjoy more and saying fuck it and going back to bartending. Any advice is greatly appreciated. P.S. Your podcast is currently the only thing getting me through my long, boring days at the office. Much love, Brianna. That sounds so boring. Honestly, that job sounds awful. I would go back to bartending. Honestly, you'd feel like you're adventurous you want to do more things with your life sitting in a job hoping that

you're going to get promoted at some point to a different position where you'll still be at a desk where you're still if you're not some people are meant to be sitting at desks and some people are not I'm not I can't sit behind a desk I can't even sit on a couch without you know like this I have to sit crisscross applesauze I'm like I can't even do anything you know like I get it I totally feel you And I would say that's your deep inner self telling you this is not the way you want to go through life. And if you can go through life being a bartender, making probably twice as much money as you're going to make at that entry-level office job and working half as much and I have all that extra time to do all of the things that you want to do like yoga or scuba dive or travel, then I think it's a no-brainer. What I would say also is, just because this isn't the job, doesn't mean that there isn't another job out there for you that can, like, use your creativity or your brain in a way that you would be more attuned to do or better equipped to do, I'll say. You should keep thinking about what you are passionate about.

You know, maybe you are, maybe you're so passionate about scuba diving, you want to become a dive master. Maybe you're so passionate about travel. You want to be a flight attendant or you want to be in some sort of, you know, run a travel group. Like, you should look to your areas of interest that are really like, that take up your time and look at job opportunities in those areas. And you know what is a great side hustle while you're learning to be a scuba master? What is a dive master? Bartending. Help pay the bills while you're seeking out the thing that you're actually passionate about.

Yeah. What do you think, Gemma? I agree with everything above. I will say one caveat. I have a six-month job rule. So if you're still within that six-month period, I know it might sound counter to what you want us to say, but wait out the six months.

You don't know whether it's just the adjustment that's scary or whether it's actually the job. I know it sounds like it's pretty boring. So I'm guessing that like maybe you get to six months and you still hate it. But then you can say like I gave it a shot. I tried this, it didn't work. Instead of leaving after two to three months and being like, maybe I just didn't give it enough time and then finding yourself in that cycle of like feeling bad and then going

back and then hating it and blah, blah, blah, blah. Also like, I don't know, I'm someone who hated working a desk job, worked a desk job for like a long time, always knew I didn't want to do it. But I use it as my security net to do something else that was more what I wanted to do. So there isn't one way to go through it. You can work the corporate job, get maybe a couple of promotions, start making good enough money to be planning for a new branch to your life. As of right now, though, I would say maybe time to get out of there. I think the six-month rule is good.

You know, I think that's a good kind of barometer too. I don't think it has to happen tomorrow. You know, you can wait a little bit and see. But either way, you're probably leaving. so yeah that's the story all right well brana let us know how it goes and we can go to wrap okay okay well jemma thank you so much for coming here with your 20 year old self and giving advice to other 20 year olds we really needed it yeah i'm glad that you guys learned how absolutely fucked it is for us i know i know i don't love that part but i guess i understand it but i think every generation

every like you know is dealing with their own ball of bullshit but it always is feels like whatever the youngest generation is right now has it the worst you know what I mean like before that it was the 30 year olds and now and so it's it's it's really hard to say if it's just that period of your life or if it really if the world is really a scarier place than it was and I am of the belief that the world is scary place than it was sorry 20 something essence is over there is no longer innocence yeah have to agree with that one and Gemma where can everyone find you So I have my own podcast. It's called The Psychology of Your 20s. We talk about a lot of what we spoke about today. You can also follow me on Instagram at That Psychology podcast or at Gemma Speg, Gemma with a J, speg with a B. And you can pick up a copy of Gemma's new book, Person in Progress at the link in the description. Thank you, Gemma. Thank you, Gemma. Thank you, Gemma. Bye. My remaining dates for Vegas, there are remaining dates for this year.

Summertime is coming, and I will be in Vegas at the Cosmo doing my residency on August 30th, and then November 1st and 29th. November 1st and November 29th. I will be in Las Vegas at the Cosmo, performing inside myself at the Chelsea. It's called Chelsea at the Chelsea for a reason. Okay? Thank you. Do you want advice from Chelsea? Write into Dear Chelsea Podcast at gmail.com.

Find full video episodes of Dear Chelsea on YouTube by searching at Dear Chelsea Pod. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert, executive producer, Catherine Law. And be sure to check out our merch at chelseahandler.com. Every case that is a cold case that has DNA. Right now in a backlog will be identified in our lifetime. On the new podcast, America's Crime Lab, every case has a story to tell, and the DNA holds the truth. He never thought he was going to get caught, and I just looked at my computer screen, I was just like, ah, gotcha. This technology's already solving so many cases.

Listen to America's Crime Lab on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Everyone thinks they'd never join a cult, but it happens all the time to people just like you. and people just like us. I'm Lola Blanc and I'm Megan Elizabeth. We're the host of Trust Me, a podcast about cults, manipulation, and the psychology of belief. Each week we talk to fellow survivors, former believers, and experts to understand why people get pulled in and how they get out.

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