Dear Chelsea - Two-Day Pity Parties with Phoebe Robinson

Episode Date: December 9, 2021

Chelsea is joined in the studio this week by comic and author Phoebe Robinson (2 Dope Queens, Don’t Sit on My Bed in Your Outside Clothes) to discuss why your co-workers are not your family, what kind of sex to have on a first date, and how she created alone time when suddenly stuck in an NYC apartment with her boyfriend during the pandemic. Then: A girlfriend considers when to tell her boyfriend she won’t change her last name. A twenty-something makes less money than her partner - and wonders if he’s weaponizing the dynamic. And the discovery of secret sexts from a partner leads to a confrontation about addiction, infidelity and kink-shaming.*Executive Producer Nick StumpfProduced by Catherine LawEdited & Engineered by Brandon Dickert*****The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees. This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all. Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together, our mission on the Really Know Really podcast is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why the bathroom door doesn't go all the way to the floor, what's in the museum of failure, and does your dog truly love you? We have the answer. Go to reallyknowreally.com

and register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead. The Really Know Really podcast. Follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello and welcome to Dear Chelsea. Hello. Hi. Chelsea, I heard that you received an award. That's very exciting.

Oh my God, I did. You guys, I won the People's Choice Award for Best Comedy Tour for Vaccinated and Horny. That's amazing. I know. It's so exciting. It's so exciting. And I want to thank every single person that spent the time to vote for me because I people that did that. I really appreciate the love. And this tour has been awesome. We're adding new cities. We're adding L.A. we just announced. Great.

Maui, Philly, Pittsburgh. We're adding a second show in Portland. And we have second shows up for Seattle, Winnipeg, Vancouver, Toronto, all of those places. And we are continuing to add dates. So make sure you go to ChelseaHandler.com to come see the People's Choice Award-winning Vaccinated and Horny Tour. That's so awesome. I never win awards. I mean, well, I guess I do now.

Yeah, I mean, exactly. We'll put that out in the universe. You do now. I'm nominated for a Grammy, you guys. I got nominated for a Grammy for my last special, Evolution, for Best Comedy Album. That's amazing. I know. I cannot tell you the amount of emails we get about Evolution. Of course, it's the most recent one, but also people mention your other books and your other specials, but this one, it just touched so many people so deeply. Oh, I love that so much that's so meaningful

to me thank you I mean I woke up we were in Hawaii for Thanksgiving Joe and me and then I woke up and I was like my agent Heidi was like you've been nominated for a Grammy and I was like I wrote back for what and she's like for best comedy album for evolution with HBO Max and I was like Joe I've been nominated for a Grammy and he's like what I mean so that was really fucking awesome and I'm so excited I mean ever since Joe Coy came into my life it's just been raining goodness ah that's so wonderful but it's also because you did the work and you leveled up and like all the good things are trickling in oh yeah it feels really good thank you I'm feeling really good that I dove deep into myself because the payoff doesn't come right away. But you see the results.

When you start to see them, you really see them. And yeah, it feels good to have done all of that stuff. Yeah. That's so good. Congrats. Thank you. Thank you. I'm very excited for today.

Yeah. We have a very special guest. This girl is, well, she's not a girl. She's a woman, but I like to call all my female friends girls because it keeps us young. She's a standup comedian as well. She's an actress. She's a producer. She's a writer. She's got her own production company. She just came out with her new HBO Max special, which was called Sorry, Harriet Tubman. So please check that out. And her most recent book is called Please Don't Sit

on My Bed in Your Outside Clothes. And her name is Phoebe Robinson. So welcome, Phoebe Robinson. Thank you for having me, Chelsea Handler. This is great. I'm excited. Oh, I'm excited to see you. I know we just met recently. Well, we've met online and on Instagram DMing and stuff over the course of some months. But I had read one of your previous books and you came to my show at the Beacon recently with your lover who you talk about in your book. Please don't sit on my bed in your outside clothes. about him and a lot about how different you guys are from each other and what a successful relationship you are experiencing, which I found very inspiring and I think helpful for a lot of people to hear about because you guys started out in a situation where it was a long distance

and not looking very hopeful considering his career trajectory as well as your own. Yeah. I mean, he, so he works in music. He travels all the time. And when I met him in 2017, I didn't want to date. And I certainly didn't want to date, like, a tour manager for rock bands. I'm like, oh, okay, so this guy's going to, like, cheat on me, like, do whatever, like, who cares? And we just really hit it off.

Like, I never expected to end up with a British guy. He's a little bit younger than me, four years younger, which I don't even know if that really counts as anything. But he's so great. And honestly, like, we do couples therapy, like, once every three months, just to, like, I feel like people,

like, don't want to talk about that. And they're just like, your relationship is just supposed to be perfect. And it's like, no, it's not. Like, it's two different people who have, like, different thoughts, different upbringings, different everything. And so you really have to be like, alright, we're gonna's like, no, it's not like it's two different people who have like different thoughts, different upbringings, different everything. And so you really have to be like, are we going to like constantly like check in and work on each other? But he's so amazing. He's so funny and he's a much better person than me.

So I really hit the jackpot with him. Did you not want to date anybody at that time in your life or were you just had to have it? In 2017, so I was what, about to turn 33. And I was just I come out of a long-term relationship in which I thought I was gonna marry that guy and then it didn't happen what happened there it was just like it was so it was a lot of things like I think it just sort of like we were just growing apart differently and like to be fair my career at the time was not anything to like write home about like I got like a writing job on this like crappy show on Fuse TV that like no one watched and like the Tito Queens podcast

was about to come out but he felt like a little like threatened by and I was like dude it's a podcast it doesn't mean like my life is gonna like I'm not like a famous person having a podcast I'm like a broke comic having a podcast it's like not the same thing but he just sort of felt weird about it and he was like I don't want to be in your shadow and I was like a broke comic. Having a podcast is like not the same thing. But he just sort of felt weird about it. And he was like, I don't want to be in your shadow. And I was like, there's no shadow. Look at my bank account. There is no shadow. So that didn't work out.

And then after that, I was like so thirsty. I was so desperate. I was like, I need to find a new boyfriend. And then I got to a point where I was just like, girl, why are you so desperate to like be in another relationship so I was like okay I'm just gonna take the next year to be by myself figure out what who I am in my 30s now because I started dating this guy when I was in my 20s and just really sort of figure out like what do I want the next 10 years of my life to be and of course I meet my boyfriend like three months after I made that declaration here we are and. And here you are, guys. And your schedules aren't easy to work around. I mean, if it hadn't been for COVID, you guys wouldn't have

been forced to spend that much time together. Yeah. In 2019, I would say we probably spent like 35, 36 weeks apart. Like it's just it's tough, you know, like you travel all the time and it's a grind. And so then 2020 with COVID and everything, we really had to like be around each other all day, every day. And I love him. He loves me. But I think I'm a person who like really needs their alone time to sort of like did some work on myself. So I read this book called Quiet by Susan Cain, which is amazing and talks about like introverts, extroverts. And I'm an ambivert.

So I'm a combination of both. So when I'm around a lot of people, like I get my energy strained. So I really need to just like pull away for a while and then come back out. And so he was just like, oh, this is great. I could be around you like all the time. And I was like, I don't think I feel that way about anyone. That's how I am. I can relate to that a lot.

I'm an ambivert, but I also can relate to I feel sucked dry when I, you know, when I perform, if I have shows like the next day, I need to be alone in my bed, not out and about. It's like it's a big energy suck for me, which is something I didn't recognize earlier on in my life. Yeah. Which is why I would, you know, my battery would run out so frequently because I wasn't mindful of the fact that how much you're expending versus how much, you know.

And other people who don't feel this way, if you're listening, it's like, it's a performance thing for sure if you're a performer. And, you know, I try to explain to my girlfriends all the time, like if I go to a dinner and I feel like it's expected of me to be entertaining. It's expected of me to be the life of the party. And, you know, when I explain that to my girlfriend sometimes when I feel like it's, it's expected of me to be entertaining. It's expected of me to be the life of the party. And you know, I, when I explained that to my girlfriend, sometimes when I'm like, I don't want to go to this thing because I feel the onus, she'll be like, but no one's expecting that from you. I'm like, it doesn't matter if you say that or not, I'm expecting it from me,

you know, it's my condition. So I have to dismantle that for my own behavioral, you know, behavior. It's hard because you're you're a really funny person so everyone is going to be like oh I was at this event and Chelsea Hanlon there she was really funny you know like you just you just know that people are thinking that even if they're not saying it like let's just be real so how did it work so tell us a little bit how you acclimated to spending all that one-on-one time with him her partner is a tour manager and he wants to do that for the you know for the next 10 years of his life right or 15 now he's like i think i think he wants to do one more tour and then he's done he's like i want to be

home that's more reasonable yeah yeah so but with that those expectations were not that you would ever be in the same city for more than a you know a 24 hour 36 hour period unless it was a holiday yeah yeah yeah so we went from like that where it's like everything feels romantic and it feels like a vacation because it's just three days together so everyone's on their best behavior and then it's just like we're quarantining together it's like i'm a gassy person i want to let it rip i want want my alone time. He wants to, you know, play video games with his friends over in the UK. And we were quarantined in a two bedroom apartment, which is a great size. But in New York, that's kind of tight. There's no balcony. So it was just we were constantly around each other. So there are moments where I just had to be like, OK, I need

my alone time. And so I would just go into a room with a cup of tea and just like read a book or scroll on my phone or watch like Sex and the City in the bath and just like have that little bit of time apart but it was definitely it was definitely hard and we had to sort of figure out our rhythm because I like um I didn't really know this is about me but I like kind of a quiet home and he would like wake up at like eight in the morning and put on like band of brothers like he loves World War II movies and so it would just be fucking machine gun firing for like an hour I'm like I'm on a zoom I just I was like you need to turn this shit the hell down so it was a lot of that but we we figured it out but definitely

we had to be like okay i need this i need this you're cranky you can't be cranky like this much because we're around each other all the time and i was like all right yeah i mean if my boyfriend wakes up with a loud voice i'm like shut the fuck up i'm like morning voice morning voices you know i don't like loud volumes in the morning i don't either it's too much i'm like i'm like there's no reason you need to talk to me before 11 a.m., which I realize is kind of extreme, so I dialed it back. Yeah, and video games and sports. To me, video games, the sound of video games

and the sound of sporting events in the background makes my vagina close up. I cannot fucking handle constant sports announcement on in the background. It just reminds me of everything about my childhood that was depressing about a Sunday. Sunday football games, having to go back to school, and having everyone just sit like a bunch of couch potatoes on the couch watching football all fucking day long. So that's why I don't like sports, everybody. Have you ever been to a Formula One race? He got me into Formula formula one and it's so

fun i bet i could i could get into i could get into a specific niche i could i how many times have you been to one of those things we went two weekends ago in austin there was like 140 000 people there so we of course got tested when we came back because i was fucking wild but i was never really into the sport i was just like oh i like le I like Lewis Hamilton. He's hot. He's black. I want him to win. And then he would always like watch it every Sunday. And I would just fall asleep to the race because like the car engine is like really good ASMR.

And then we went to actual race and got to see everyone. I was really impressed. And I was like, oh shit, this is a really hard sport. And I'm super into it now. Oh, that's cool. And what does ASMR stand for? Just like it's a soothing sound. Like, just hear the vroom, vroom.

Oh, the sound. And then I would just, like, fall asleep to that on Sundays. Yeah, okay. That's like me just putting on my rain machine at night. Oh, you have a rain machine? Well, to drown out Joe Coy's CPAP machine, because he has sleep apnea. So he goes into a submarine every night. He has to put this mouth guard over his mouth and turn it on.

And it sounds like a very low level storm. And so then I have to up that so that I'm not listening to that. And I put on my little rain app, which is like thunderstorm or, you know, a hurricane, whatever you're interested in listening to. Is there any cure for sleep apnea? Yeah, well, you could get surgery. He has a special kind. We're going to go to the doctor together when we get home to L.A. because I need to talk to his doctor directly since I'm also a medical professional.

But he claims that he has the type of sleep apnea that there's nothing he could do anything about. You can get surgery, but it requires your mouth being wired shut for like two to three weeks. So, you know, obviously people aren't apt to get that. Men will barely even use that fucking machine because they're just like, oh no, you know, it's a weakness. But like without it, he couldn't sleep. And you're just, you know, without when someone has bad sleep apnea, if you've ever been with anyone who's had it, it sounds like somebody is dying right next to you because they lose their breath and then they wake themselves up because they're, they're, they're choking. So it's like, like you, their stomach goes in and then it's a gasp. So it's very un, you know, it's not very

cooperative. So you definitely need to use a CPAP machine because then he sleeps like a baby. And that's what I wanted to do is sleep like a baby. In your book. Also, you talk a lot about, which I think is really critical because there aren't a lot of blueprints for how to be a black female boss, entrepreneur, captain of your own ship. And you talk a lot about that and you break it down how it works for you and all the work that is involved in having your own imprint, in having your own production company and also being the guiding force of your very own career. So what are some of the things, something that has helped you that you've learned on your own that you didn't necessarily learn by reading about somebody else? One of the things that, so I started going to therapy like a little over a year ago. And when I started going, it was just because I was during COVID, I was just like, my whole personality is just work now. Wake up, work, go to sleep. Like I did, it was just because I was during COVID. I was just like my whole personality is just work now.

Wake up, work, go to sleep. Like I did. That was the only way I could cope. And I was just sort of like, oh, this is not healthy. So let me go. And one of the biggest things that I'm currently working through is I go to my therapist and I'm like, oh, you know, like we're all a family here. And I feel like the mom and blah, blah, blah. And she's like, y'all are not family.

And I was like, no, but it's like, you know, like we're all like we spend time together blah and she's like y'all are not family and I was like no but it's like a you know like we're all like we spend time together and she's like you are not family like you need to make this professional so one of the things I've been working on is compassionate detachment is that what it's called I think that's what it's called where it's just me not me just establishing boundaries and just being like I can be professional and that doesn't mean that I'm being a bitch because I think I was so worried about like as a black woman I'm like I don't want anyone to think that I'm angry or that I'm mad at them and so like I'm going to like go above and beyond and being like really cheery and like being super nurturing so everyone knows that

I'm cool and like I'm not this horrible person and she was just like you need to be professional if you're going to be a boss you can't be here trying to be everyone's best friend making sure everyone likes you she's like not everyone's going to like you and that's just a part of it and you know sometimes it is like hard for me to just be like I want to fix this thing or do this thing for another person but I have to sort of reel it back I'm the kind of person or friend where I will bend over backwards for other people and I have to sort of be like you don't have to do that for every single person you could be a little more sort of discerning about it but it's hard because when you're I don't know if

you ever felt this I mean you have been a boss for so long you're like so fucking dope but like did you ever have those moments where you were like I want to do xyz but I'm afraid to do it because I'm not sure if people are going to like me afterwards I think it falls into the same category like it's just it's about people pleasing you know what I mean it's what you how you are in your life when you want people to like you and you want people to respect you. And that bleeds over when you do become a boss of something. You also, those characteristics are the same. Like if you're relying on people to like you, like you're, you're not going to be the most efficacious boss because that's not how it works. It's not a popularity contest. People are working for you for a reason and they have to deliver a product to, you know, there's, you can be cool and you can be fun, but whenever we overextend ourselves, it's like, we don't get what we want. We ended up

just depleting our own energy resources. And that's something that I learned a long time ago. My, my shortness or shortcoming is more that, you know, I just like, I like to just fuck off. You know, I like to have a lot of people around me and get very little work done. You know, I'm a bad influence in that way because I'm not really, you know, professional. And so I like to have a lot of people around me and get very little work done. You know, I'm a bad influence in that way because I'm not really, you know, professional. And so I like to just get down to business when I'm there and it's my time. But when it's, you know, when everybody's around an office all day, I couldn't have probably set a worse example on how to behave because I just wanted I wanted to have fun and I wanted everyone to have a good time. I wasn't as concerned with everybody liking me as I was concerned with everybody having a good time and wanting to be at that place of work, not because it ended up in a better bottom line, but because it ended up in a really fun place to be, you know,

because I remember being on, you know, even as far back as Chelsea lately, like I'd be so excited to get into work. I'd go in early because it was just like one big fraternity house, you know, and then I remember doing my Netflix show a couple of years ago and the vibe wasn't like that. It wasn't fun because I wasn't in it anymore. I was just like, how little of time can I spend at this place? You know, like I would literally go in for my hair and makeup, approve all these ideas, go watch the edit, do that shit, but get out as quickly as possible. And that's also a bad way to behave as a boss. So I think we're always all learning, but it's your personality that drives how you are going to be in a professional environment. And it's a much different thing. And I think as a black woman

for you, you will tell me, but I think it's even more pressure because you want to set an example and you want to be the person that people are going to respect and look to for advice and so on and so forth. That's for any woman, but especially a woman of color, there's a there's a lot more, I would imagine, pressure on your shoulders. Absolutely. Like one of my former assistants, she was like, I've never worked for a black person before. She was like, all my bosses have been white. Most of them have been like white dudes. And she's like, I'm really, I'm sort of like curious about this new experience. And it's just sort of one of those things

where it's like, well, now there's this weird sort of pressure that I have to sort of like represent or behave in a certain way. You know what I mean? It's just, it can get tricky at times. It's like, I just want to do the job and I just want to be able to sort of like

say what I need to say and not worry like, oh, is this not making the environment not fun? Or, oh, is this like me being a boss in a way that's not going to make people feel good? But I just am getting to a place where I have to sort of trust myself and go, you know what? I don't need to second guess myself. I know what I'm doing and I'm paying the bills and I should be allowed to express my opinions because of that. And also be open to people's feedback, right? Yeah, exactly. That's really the best you can do is to hear when somebody's telling you something or

there's something rubbed somebody the wrong way, then of course, then you should be there for that. You should always be open to hearing feedback and making adjustments, right? Because none of us are fully cooked and none of us are done growing or evolving or understanding our power. But the most important thing to do is to trust your instincts and is to operate from, you know, the source of your power. Who are you? Why is your personality strong? How did you you're the reason you got here in the first place, right? You're the reason you're in this position. So all of that data is backed up by the virtue of you having this opportunity.

And that's something that I think women forget a lot. And they have to remember, you know, you're in the position you're in because of you, not because somebody did you a favor. Ooh. There we go. I love that. And on that note, Catherine, should we take some callers? Absolutely.

Now let's take a quick break and we'll come back and get to some callers. We'll be right back. We'll be right back. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together on the Really No Really podcast, our mission is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why they refuse to make the bathroom door go all the way to the floor.

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So we're here with Phoebe Robinson and Catherine, and we're going to take some callers or some write-ins. You know that I'm always confused about how this podcast works. I don't know if people are live or if they're writing, but Catherine's in charge of that. So I abdicate all of my responsibilities to her. It's always a fun surprise for you. So our first email, just an email, comes from Kayla. She says, Dear Chelsea, I'm a 28-year-old heterosexual woman. For as long as I can remember, I've known that I do not want to change my last name if and when I get married. I strongly identify with my father's side of the family and feel connected to my maiden name. On top of this connection, the tradition of changing a woman's name is so deeply rooted in the patriarchy

that I struggle to think of it outside this framing. And not for nothing, it's also a pain in the ass to legally change your name. My question is, when's the right time to tell my current boyfriend that I don't want to change my name? We've been together for a few months, and I could definitely see myself marrying him if our relationship continues to grow as it has been so far. I know that he feels the same way, but I worry that if I bring it up too soon, it'll freak him out or make him think I'm looking for a proposal ASAP, which I'm not. In my last relationship, I told my ex at about seven months of dating. It came up pretty naturally in conversation, and I didn't think twice about telling him at the time, but he was very upset

and told me he felt that I had been hiding something from him by waiting so long to tell him. I would like to avoid a repeat of that scenario, but I don't want to freak out my current partner by telling him too soon. So when's the right time? Best Kayla. Oh, is Kayla on the phone? She's not. She's not. But I thought this would be such a good one for you to talk about with with Phoebe, because that's like right up your alley Phoebe yeah I'm not changing my last name I I told my boyfriend maybe like a year and I was like I will never change my last name for a man and he was like okay I mean I I even have a problem you know I struggle with this like I with the concept of marriage because I just think it's such a construct created by men to control women. So even the construct of marriage is I have,

I just bristle at it because of course I want to marry my boyfriend. I, because it's important to him and I love him and, and he's worth marrying, but like, I don't want to be a married woman. You know what I mean? I don't want to be somebody who's married because I feel a responsibility to not get married, to say like you can achieve all of this without that. But that personal feelings about marriage aside, it's not an uncommon thing to keep your maiden name, to keep your birth name, your father's name, whatever. So your ex-boyfriend sounds like an idiot. So disregard him. And I just think the natural time to bring it up

is the next time marriage comes up in the conversation in a very warm, calm, you know, loving way. Like, just so you know, my father's name means so much to me that I would never feel comfortable changing my name. It has nothing to do with our relationship. In fact, I really have thought about this because I want to marry you so much or whatever, you know, your version of that is because it sounds like you do want to marry him. And you said you did that. You know, it's just it's a totally reasonable, acceptable thing to say to somebody. And you don't have to bring it up prematurely. Just wait until the time is right.

I think we always have these ideas in our head that we have to have these conversations like when, when. Just because you thought of it doesn't mean it needs to happen right away yeah and i feel you could also sort of test the waters if you're still kind of scared you could maybe just talk about other sort of like relationship things are kind of like milestones for you guys just to see if he's even on the same page as you in terms of seeing this as a long-term relationship, but definitely don't shy away from it. Like, like Chelsea said, it's not an uncommon thing to keep your maiden name. And if it means that much to you, he will respect that. And if he doesn't respect that, then he's out the door straight up. Exactly. If he doesn't respect that, then there's no question there, you know, like what he's going to force you to change your name.

That's the man you're going to marry. I doubt it. What was your boyfriend's reaction when you told him that? He was totally fine with it. Like he doesn't know, like we're in the, we don't want to have kids sort of thing. And I don't know, we just sort of want to live life in a, our own sort of way. And we were talking about getting married. He was like, I'm going to ask your father for your hand in marriage and I was like what like who cares and then he was like I think your dad will care so I just I'm gonna do it for your dad I know it doesn't mean anything to you but he's like it would be a nice thing to do for your dad and I was like all right but I'm we're going back and forth about it where I'm just sort of like I don't know like I don't want to wear white I'm 37 I don't want to fucking wear white and walk down I'm being a church like I just don't want to wear white. I'm 37. I don't want to fucking wear white and walk down. I'm being a church.

Like, I just don't want to do any of that. So we're trying to figure out, like, do we just want to do, like, a backyard thing? Like, I don't know. I just wanted to feel, like you said, not like the patriarchy. Just sort of like, I love this person and that's it. And also just the wedding industry, the capitalistic nonsense. Like I said to Joe, I'm like, listen, we can talk about being married, but like, I'm not walking around with a rock on my finger. Like that is embarrassing

for me. And I'm never going to participate in that way. You know, it's got to be something low key and it's not going to be like an engagement ring. I don't want you getting on your knee, which he would totally do and all of the things. But yeah, all of a sudden I feel the pressure of like the, just this idea, because that's the next but yeah all of a sudden I feel the pressure of like just this idea because that's the next step that's the way you demonstrate the most love and it's like well then what do we do after we're married yeah you know anal I guess but you got you know what I did it anal on the first date with my boyfriend really yeah that's a way to introduce yourself I mean it's just like listen who cares let's into it. I think people are getting warming up to anal a lot more

than they used to because it's just another orifice that you should be, you know, using. Why not? Why not? As they say in España, porque no? Exactly. Okay. Well, I hope that helps you. Yeah. Let us know what happened. Follow up with us and yeah, you hold on to your maiden name. That's yours and that's yours. That's your family and that's what happened. Follow up with us. And, yeah, hold on to your maiden name. That's yours and that's yours. That's your family and that's your history. So stick with it. Yep. Problem solved, it sounds like to me.

Sounds like it. So our next question comes from Sarah. We have her on the line. She works at a community center and her boyfriend is in tech. Dear Chelsea, I feel like my relationship is in a constant power struggle due to my boyfriend making significantly more money than I do. We split almost every monthly bill, including mortgage and groceries, but the expensive things like the house, the furniture, the TV, and many flights and hotels are all paid for by him.

In theory, that would be fine, but there are times he uses it against me. He'll say that he pays for more stuff and makes it seem like that's a valid reason for him to make more decisions. We aren't married but live together and have been dating for four years. I want to be in an equal partnership but find it difficult when he is the one who can afford everything and therefore calls a lot of the shots. I do think he should pay for more because he makes so much more money, but I also want to be equitable and have just as many choices in what we do with our life together.

Are we doomed to fight about money forever? Sarah. Hi, Sarah. Hi. Hi, this is Phoebe. Hi, nice to meet you. You too. So get a little bit more specific.

Does he kind of hold it over your head? No, I wouldn't say that. I know it kind of sounds like that, but I think it's more just like specifically financial decisions, like things about like what we buy, like in our house and strictly financial stuff, really that he's like, well, if I'm paying for 90% of it, like, I think he thinks his vote sort of holds more weight, you know? Okay. And you don't feel that way, obviously. Yeah. I mean, I feel like I kind of have to argue for things that I want.

Like, we really need, like, a new dishwasher. And he's like, no, we don't. It works fine. We don't need one. Like, I have to kind of fight for fight for like all of those types of things. And it sort of makes me feel like I don't have as much of a voice, I guess, when it comes to that kind of stuff. And even though I'm probably never going to make as much money as he does, I still just want to feel like it's 50-50 with the stuff that we do together, the things that are in our house. I don't want it to feel like it's his house and I'm living in it. You know

what I mean? Absolutely. You shouldn't feel that way because it's a partnership. You're in a partnership. And however much money one person makes isn't what a partnership is about. So him holding the kind of purse strings in that way isn't hot or sexy. And you will only build resentment over that over a course of a long relationship. I just had this conversation with a woman three weeks ago and she was just like, my husband made all the decisions in our marriage

because he made all the money and I had never had a say in anything and she's sick of it and she left him and he doesn't know what the fuck to do. And even when I told him, I'm like, she's resentful of the fact that you were in control of everything. We all have a voice.

You know, how much money you make doesn't define your value in a relationship. So that's a sentence you might want to write down to make sure that you bring up when you have a normal, calm conversation with him, because it is very archetypal for people, men specifically, to think that they have more control because they make more money. And we're just not living in that time anymore where that's acceptable when you're a free thinking person and you are well aware of your own value and self-worth and that has nothing to do with how much money you make. Yeah.

Yeah. I think that, cause I am the breadwinner in my relationship and Bay is totally fine with that. But like, if you're not both making the same amount of money, one or both, you might feel a little whatever about that. And so it's good to have open communication about that. And for him to sort of also voice

what he's thinking about it. And then he can, if he even just says what he's thinking of, oh, well, I think I should make all decisions because I make more money. Just him saying that he might go, oh shit, I can't believe that's how I actually feel. And then he might go, oh, I need to unpack that. how I actually feel and then he might go oh I need

to unpack that not we but he needs to unpack like how he feels like that creates a hierarchy in the relationship instead of it being equal because like Chelsea said like you don't want to resent him and he shouldn't be walking around like it's like the 1920s where he's making all the decisions because it's not and like you both bring so many things to the relationship. And my boyfriend brings so much to the relationship that is not related to money. And you bring so much relationship that has nothing to do with money. And it's like that adds value. That's a contribution.

And that should be recognized as well. And he should also respect your contributions and bow down to you for all the great things that you bring to make the relationship special. Right. And reminding him of those things isn't a bad idea. You know, sitting down and just evaluating like what your qualities are, your attributes with regard to your relationship is an important reminder. And a lot of men are stuck in their roles as men and they needed to be reminded by us, the closest people to to them and sometimes with very gentle prodding and sometimes with very loud prodding depending on what kind of guy that you're with are you guys in therapy at all or counseling of any kind we're not i've suggested it before but i think and then he's like i have to fucking pay for it

yeah no i think he would be open but we're good in every other aspect. I think it's really just, I think I internalize a lot of it, which I think therapy would probably help. Like, I think that it's my own insecurity sometimes. Like you're saying, like feeling like I'm not the Brenwitter and maybe I'm just, it's my own issue. And I think in his mind, he thinks that we are equal. And like, I don't think he's intentionally trying to make me feel that way. But I don't know how to get past feeling like that. You might also think about going to since that is kind of the crux of the issue, a financial therapist. There are also financial psychologists that could help you guys unpack

like where this is coming from for him, like why he feels like he needs to make the decisions. And that way, rather than going to, I mean, I'm all for, you know, relationship therapy and marital therapy as well. But that could be something if he's not open to just regular therapy, helping you unpack some of the financial issues around that. That's a good idea. And also, you know, what you're saying about internalizing it. Yes, you're right, because I'm sure you could bring it up to him and he'll be like, I don't feel that way. What do you mean? We are 50 50, but like, you know, the dishwasher example, I'm sure you have other examples either way. It's important to start the dialogue and communicate between the two of you so that you have an open communication so that he understands how you're feeling about it

and how his actions can impact your feelings and vice versa, right? So he could be oblivious to this and say, oh my God, I totally think of you as a partner, yet you're having all these emotions. He still should know that you feel this way, that you are internalizing this, that you are thinking about it in a way that makes you feel like in this way, in the financial aspect of your relationship, you don't feel like it's even Steven and the rest of your relationship is great. And you do feel like it's equitable in those terms. That's also worth saying to him too. I mean, start out with all the positives, you know, and then give an area where you can, where you would like to see some improvement and then start from that starts with you. You're going to

start to improve the way that you internalize it and understand your value. But he also should be made aware of it because that's only going to bring you closer together, being communicative in that way. For sure. That's good advice. I've definitely tried to talk to him and he does the whole, like you said, like, I don't know, we're 50-50. I don't know what you're talking about.

So I don't know. Maybe I need to word it in a better way. Well, yeah, it's also his actions, right? Because he can say that, but like, what are his actions showing? You know what I mean? And that's where you can point to him and be like, hon, even if you do feel like we're 50-50 in this moment, work for a couple months. And then you're the breadwinner or maybe you decide to change careers. But you're doing good work. And we just don't know what our relationships have in store. So. And look at it as like, it's an exciting challenge to kind of face this. Like, it's not a huge problem. It's just a little bit of a thing, right? And like, look at it as a great way to like experiment with your communication skills and also facilitating a relationship that grows together instead of apart, right? Because resentment builds and that's all, that's when people start to separate and they go off in their different directions. So this is a great opportunity for you to kind of model for yourself the behavior that you would

like to see in your own relationship. It doesn't have to be a burden or it doesn't have to be scary. It's like, okay, how can I have this conversation the right way? How can I have it? So we're both on the same team. You'd want to remind yourself that you're on the same team. You know, you're both playing for the same team. It's not one against the other. So how can you both take care of each other's feelings in that way? Yeah. Resentment building is kind of like my biggest fear because I can like sense that starting. And so, yeah, that's good advice. Well, that's what women are known for. We build resentment because we have so much to be resentful for and we have no outlet to speak about it. So this is your moment. You're living in the best time ever to be a woman and fucking tell your truth. So figure out how much you need to live on depending on what expenses

you're sharing. Maybe you don't share expenses for vacations, or maybe you do, but you share expenses for rent and for groceries and electric bill and those sorts of things. So you figure out how much you need, and then you both put in the same percentage until it equals that amount of money. So it might be 50% of your incomes. It might be 90% of both of your incomes. But what that then allows you to do is even the playing field when making those decisions on what sort of stuff you're going to buy, because it's already in an account where, you know, the amount of money you've put in feels the same to both of you, even though it's not technically the same amount of money. It's the same percentage.

And having an even playing field is kind of what we want, right? True. True that. True that. Okay, well, good luck with everything. Let us know how it goes, okay? Keep us posted. Thank you so much.

Okay, take care. Bye, Sarah. Thank you. It's funny. I have the exact problem with Joe Coy. He won't let me pay for anything ever. And to the point where it's like, Joe, I know I have more money than you. And you know, I have more money than you. Please, this is not

about and he will not like not even like an Uber drive. And we don't take Ubers, but he won't even let me pay for anything. And we go out to dinner with my friends. He doesn't let anyone pay because he has such an ego about wanting to be the provider and it's just so it's just so silly the way that men have that you know and it's going to take so long for us to peel that away and I find it so attractive to hear about your boyfriend who's okay with like you being the breadwinner because that is the way of the future you know more men need to warm up to that idea but i i will admit that when kovat happened and he like couldn't tour anything at first i was a little bit like oh i have to like pay for everything like just it's like it's sort of like not a thing that you expect or you're sort of prepared for but it made me go

like well what sort of like gender hangups do I have about this? You know what I mean? And now I'm in a place where I'm like, oh, it's great. Like his contributions are like amazing. He makes our home like so loving and incredible. And it's just sort of like you have to sort of deprogram kind of the what society tells you is like what counts. Yeah. You know what I for so long, cause I've been single for so long and I was so fiercely independent and so strong minded about not ever relying on a man or his income or in any way, really, even emotionally, I was stunted in that way that I couldn't rely on a man for that because I just have been disappointed by my brother or my father

or whatever. And so for so long, I was always me, like the hustle was always up to me, my family, my friends, I was in charge of that domain, you know, of our, the worlds we create for ourselves. And so to come along and now be in a relationship with somebody who can contribute in that way is also a learning lesson for me, because it's, it's like, it's such a nice idea. It's like, oh wait, it's not all on me now. We're going to, you know, on safari, we're going on some trip to Africa and we're taking my three nieces and we're taking his son and two of his nephews. And I was like, let's split this trip. It's crazy. And you know, of course he said yes

to that. He said, yeah, to his credit, he said yes to that. But I thought, oh, this is so nice that it's not all about me having to deal with everything on my own all the time now. I forgot about that. I forgot about that element of like, oh, there's somebody else contributing. So that's amazing. Yeah, that's a nice development that's happened here. You know? Yeah, he's a peer. Exactly.

Yeah. What if you guys didn't get married? You just did sort of like the Kurt Russell, Goldie Hawn thing. Would he be fine with that? Because that can be an option. He'll be fine with whatever I'm fine with. Ultimately, he's very respectful of whatever my there's part of me that wants to marry him because it'll make him so happy. And it's really about I do want to make him happy.

You know, I want him to be happy. I want him to be able to say this is wife, because that's what he wants to say. But he's already my husband. You know, I'm not going to date anybody after him. It's him and me. That's it. So, I mean, that's how you feel too. Yeah.

I told him, I was like, when you die, because he's going to die before me, I'm like, I'm just going to, my best friend from college, Karen, we're just going to get a house upstate and then we're just going to like sit and drink wine and that's it I'm not gonna date again that's right I told my sister that's what I said I said Simone you and I are going to transition into later in life lesbians together at some point it's just gonna be you and me and she's like why do we have to be lesbians why can't we just be together without being lesbians I'm like that's part of the deal so she's warming up to that idea. It's going to be a while though.

I mean, you know, but she's getting older, my sister, cause she's 10 years older than me. I'm 46. She's 56. So we'll see.

I mean, hopefully, you know, Joe has stamina though. I mean, I'll probably die before Joe cause he's older than me. He's 50, but he's got some sort of Filipino DNA that gives people extra energy.

He can do, I've never seen anybody like him. We went to the gym this morning and he ran four miles. He hasn't run in like a year and he just ran four miles. I was like, what? And then he's been working out for four days. Like he comes to the gym with me every morning. He's been working out four days and his body already is like more muscular and leaner. I'm like, I can see your muscles already.

It's just a fucking joke. But he's got some weird strength. Well, our next email comes from Jess. She's 35. Dear Chelsea, I recently quit my job of 8.5 years at a small nonprofit organization because of its extremely toxic work environment. I left very abruptly, and to my surprise, many people close to me, both personally and professionally, were very supportive. Everyone assured me I'd land something better and that I deserved more respect and, frankly, a respite from the burnout. It's now been about two months, and I haven't found anything.

I'm having a bit of a crisis of confidence. I went from an independent career woman living on my own terms and taking care of all my own shit to a 35-year-old loser living back with her parents. I want so badly to get back my independence and self-reliance, but I also really want to wait for a job opportunity that feels like the right fit in a field I have more passion for. Any advice? Jess. Stop calling yourself a loser. Yeah. First of all, stop that.

Yeah. If you're not on your own team, then you are behind. You are setting yourself back by so much when you are not rooting for yourself. So you have got to be rooting for yourself. And if it takes you writing down sentences that say, I matter, I have value. If you have to write that down and say self-affirmations every morning, when you wake up, start there because nothing is worse than calling yourself that you don't, you're not a loser. You had a bad situation that you're not in anymore. That's a good thing. You're living with your parents. That's temporary.

That's not permanent. It's only permanent if you believe it's permanent. And now you can work towards building a better life for yourself and getting the job and the opportunities that you want, but that's not where your happiness is only going to come from. You know, all of this is an inside job. So you're not just gonna get your meaning

and defining moment for yourself through your work. You also have to cultivate that in other ways with your friendships, with your hobbies, start there, you know, start exercising, getting outside, getting out of your own ass because you're having a pity party for yourself right now. And that, that doesn't go anywhere. You're the only person able to pull yourself up out of that. Two months does not a career make. I mean. No.

No, not at all. And, you know, it's okay to feel sorry for yourself. I mean, we've, I'm sure you, Phoebe, have had periods of time. I love a pity party, but you have, I stop, my pity parties can only last for two days. That's my new rule. It's like after that, you have to just move on. Take the 48 hours, take the hit feel bad but then like Chelsea said like what maybe like while you're in the morning you decide okay I'm gonna I'm gonna apply to like five jobs a day in the morning and then like you can spend like your afternoon like cultivating some hobbies hanging out with friends

like taking this time to sort of eat pray love even love, even though this wasn't like intentional, you know what I mean? But take this time to really sort of figure out what you want to do, what brings you joy while you're looking for a job. I remember during the recession in 2008, I worked at this film company, it shut down. And so then I just took like temp jobs, like I worked like half the day

and then I spent the other half of the day like journaling or writing or what have you. There are so many things that you can do. And also it's so amazing that you could stay at your parents place during this transition because so many people don't have that. And so use them as emotional support too. And like have them like help you get through this season and encourage you. But you have so much going for you. And the fact that you could recognize you were at a toxic work environment and you could leave it, that is amazing because so many people don't have the ability to believe in themselves enough to step out of a bad work situation. So give yourself some freaking props for what you did with your life instead of sort

of looking at like, oh, I dropped the ball. You didn't drop the ball. You're getting yourself to a better place. Exactly. Exactly. And it's an opportunity for growth. Anytime you come out of a bad situation, it is an opportunity for you to open newer doors that send you in the better direction for your life. So when you say no to something that doesn't meet your standards, you are raising your level of standards to something else. You know, whether the decision was made for you or you made the decision, your standards are different now because you're not in that situation anymore. And so you can apply that to your love life, your friendships, your hobbies, and your work. You set the standard of what's going to be

acceptable to you. And you look at this time in your parents' house as a gift. This is a gift for you to recalibrate and get yourself on the right track so that you can be in a different place in six months. Don't denounce the place that you're in, accept it and understand this is temporary too. You're not going to live with your parents for the rest of your life. So it's, it's a huge opportunity and you just need to flip the script on yourself and honestly start out with affirmations in the morning that they're not going to hurt you. Just wake up and say you're valuable, you're beautiful inside and out. You mean something and who you love and who you're grateful for. Instead of looking at what you don't have, look at the things you do have and build on that because that is the power of positive thinking.

It sounds like a cliche. It sounds like something only spiritual people can access, but it is very practical. And it's a huge tool that will help you through the rest of your life. If you can learn how to use it and apply it to your life right now, it's gonna be your best friend.

There's this app that I use, it's called I Am Affirmations. And they send me, I wanna say maybe like 10 to 20 throughout the day. And I always find, especially on low days, the affirmation that they send me somehow is the perfect thing that I need to read in that moment to get my shit together. So I highly recommend you can choose a cute background. They have like a play sound where you can just like press play and they'll just like say it to you over and over and over again. But it really will help you on those days when you don't feel that great about yourself. I love that. What's that called? I Am Affirmations.

I Am Affirmations. That's a good one. Thank you. And what was the book you referenced earlier in the episode? Quiet by Susan Cain. Okay. Yeah. I haven't read that one. Let me write that too. It's so good. I read it in like a week. I was just devouring it. It's so good. That stuff is very valuable because our narrative is what our, you know, especially when we sink low, we just get into ego. And when we're down, we just think about everything that is not important and rarely get to focus on the things that are. So yes, have the power to lift yourself out of this.

You take your two days, like Phoebe said, and then get your shit together. I love that. Well, our last question comes from Samantha. She says, Dear Chelsea, I met my boyfriend on Tinder and our relationship started off very sexually, sexting often and hooking up. I wasn't looking for anything serious at the time, but we ended up together. We've been dating for a year now, and everything is perfect, except... A month ago, I found some messages on his phone

that looked like he was sexting other women. I confronted him about it, and he explained that it wasn't what it looked like. He said that it's basically role play and that he messages other men about the women in their life. The men he messages get off on the women in their life. The men he messages get off on other men wanting their wives and girlfriends. Should I believe him? He seemed really embarrassed and I could tell it was hard for him to talk about, which makes me think

that it's true. Who would make that up if it wasn't true? I did believe him right away, but I have a history of being naive and trusting too easily in relationships. I didn't want to kink shame him, but I told him I was uncomfortable with it, and I didn't think it was appropriate for him to sex to anyone else while in a relationship. He told me he felt he had an addiction, and it started before we started dating, and it was hard for him to stop when he met me. He promised me and has since stopped, and I have reason to believe that's true. Since then, I found a few more old messages, which were all dated from before I found out. Every time I bring it up or ask about it, he's very open, answers all questions, and is very apologetic. Do I believe him? Is this a deal-breaker either way?

He views it as a form of porn, but I can't help but feel hurt and betrayed. Thanks in advance, Samantha. That's tough. Tricky one. Yeah. Yeah, I vacillated there because at first I'm just like, listen. But I mean, and then she says he stopped. I think if somebody has an addiction and they throw around the word addiction, you should listen to that because that's not a light term. Even though men can use that term just to get out of

shit. Right. You know, men are like, oh, I'm a sex addict. It's like, why aren't I a sex addict? How come I don't know women who are sex addicts? But I can't tell you what to do in this situation because this is your relationship and this is you have to trust your gut here and follow it. If you believe him and you're still checking his phone and he hasn't made any more, you know, contact with other people, it just, it sounds like a bigger issue than just the texting, right? Like if this is an issue, then there's more to the matter. You know, you are very hurt. People can change if he had that problem, you know, and if he seeks the right help, but him changing because you told him not to do it anymore, isn't exactly the right way to go about having change, right?

Yeah. I feel like it won't stick because he's just doing it for you. And then he's going to have a moment of weakness and then the floodgates are going to open. And so I really do think that if he does think this is an addiction, he might need to really talk to someone about this in order for this to stick. Because I just am worried that in six months, it's going to start up again and he's going to be sending messages. You're going to find something. I just don't know. I just don't know if it's going to last. Yeah. When somebody says, I'm going to stop doing something because you asked me to, and that the fact that he's been doing it since he met you implies that you guys have been together for a year, right? I mean, that implies that it is an addiction. Yeah. So I think it's a deeper, it's not just

like one and done. You have to have another conversation about it and possibly several to make sure that you can trust him. And you being hurt is very valid and a good engine for him to make some changes. But it sounds like you're going to find that again, like just off the top of my head and instinctively, it sounds like you're going to run into this problem with him again. So I guess my advice would be to sit down and really unearth, possibly with a third party, you know, a therapist, unearth what this is really about so you can get to the meat of the matter instead of just kind of putting a bandaid on the behavior. You want to find out why that behavior is happening in the first place and why he has an addiction to sexting people when he's in a relationship with you. Yeah. And I also feel like maybe there's because I don't want to kink shame at all, but maybe there's a way that you guys can find something sexually together that gets you guys off rather than him doing this.

This whole thing on the side that's like making him excited that you know nothing about. It seems like he's putting up a wall there and it would be, I think, better for the relationship if you guys could just like have fun sexually together without anyone sneaking around. So I don't know if that helps, but. Yeah. Yeah. So I think you should just don't let it go right now keep unearthing what the get to the root of the matter on this one is what our advice is yeah i mean he obviously has some shame around it or you know he wouldn't feel that sort of embarrassment so maybe having her to talk to about it might help a little bit and maybe he also just like needs to see a therapist on his own to really, like you said, Yeah, right.

To get it sorted. Yeah. So we'll have Samantha follow up with us. Good luck. We are going to take a quick break so you can hear an ad and then we'll be right back. I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. We'll be right back. the answer? We talk with the scientist who figured out if your dog truly loves you and the one bringing back the woolly mammoth. Plus,

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on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I want to follow up with you, Phoebe, about anal, because I think that's an important thing for us to be. I think it's important for women to talk more about anal. Because I remember my girlfriend, I won't mention her name because she's pretty famous, and I don't know how outspoken she is on the subject matter, but I remember hanging out at her house, and she was like, God, I love anal. And I remember going, really?

Like you love anal? And I don't. I like anal, too. I don't have a problem with that. And I think it's all part of the same machine, especially when you're on your period and you don't want to do that, you know, and it's a hot mess. And I think there's something very erotic about anal and i feel like we all have this kind of dirty notion of it because why because it's for gay people or because it implies what because of the real is of its relationship to aids like what is our

dirt why do we find anal to be such a taboo subject for women to talk about? Yeah, I think it has to do with being homophobic. This whole like you don't want to be like related to that anyway. And then also, I think we just find a way to sort of make women feel bad about anything they do. You know, whether it's blowjobs, whether it's just, you know, straight up like regular penetration through the vagina, like all of it. Like we're always supposed to. Right. It's like we can't win. We can't win. No, no, no. That's exactly right. There was so much the shame and master. Like I grew up with shame and masturbating because I got caught masturbating on a jungle gym when I was like in first or second grade.

And I had found out about the feeling. Maybe it was a little bit older. But anyway, I knew when you rode up and down those metal bars that held up the swing sets, that that rubbed your vagina in a nice way that eventually would be like, like my teachers would have to come outside and get me and be like, I'd be running those monkey bars or those metal bars like for way past recess because I had found myself. I was like, oh my God. But there's so much shame came from being just yelled at on the school playground by my teachers that for a long time, I never even touched my vagina. Like I didn't want anything to do with it because of the shame. And so I think sometimes we get, yeah, exactly. There is, if there's a way to shame a woman,

why not? Same thing with blowjobs. The first guy I gave a blowjob to, I remember him putting his hand on the back of my head to push my head down and I lost it. Like I was like, no, no, no, no, no, no. That's never happening. I'm never having a man do that to me. And now, you know, I do, you know, I feel completely fine giving blowjobs because I'm in love with somebody who does respect me and I don't have to worry about that. So there is like, I'm definitely having a sexual awakening in my forties for sure. Oh, that's exciting. Because I'm so much more comfortable with all of this stuff and talking about it. Even though I used to be very promiscuous and outspoken about it, it wasn't about being intimate. You know what I mean?

So there is some there's a lot of value that comes with your ownership over your own intimacy. Yeah. And just talking and communicating with your partner about what you like, what you don't like what you're sort of like interested in, but you'd like been too scared to admit it. Like all that stuff is only going to make sex better and more exciting and you're going to feel more comfortable with yourself. So I think we got to just like open the floodgates and talk about it all. And when did you become when do you feel like you became your most comfortable self with your sexuality? I think it's probably with my with my bae with British Bake Off that's his code name I just feel like he there's just like an openness and a vulnerability with him too so it just feels

like a safe space where we could say whatever we can try whatever we want to try and it's totally fine and I there's no worry like, oh my God, so you're going to think I'm like, whatever, you know what I mean? Because I think just growing up, you're sort of, the notion is that we're all supposed to be very like chaste, right?

And like not have that much sex at all, but we're supposed to know how to do every single position and have such mastery over it. And none of it makes sense. And so I feel like with him, we could definitely have the moments where we're like in the zone, it's And none of it makes sense. And so I feel like with him, we could definitely have the moments where we're like in the zone,

it's really hot and like animalistic. And there's also moments where it's like, we're trying to be sexy and we like mess up. We end up just like laughing and then we get right back into it. And I think that's hard to find. And when you find that person, it just brings all your walls down.

It brings all your walls down. And the more comfortable you are with yourself, the more comfortable your partner is, right? Yeah. Because it's just an energy that you give off. It's like when you're nervous, you can make other people nervous around you. And so the more in touch you can get and the more grounded you can get with your own vibes, I think is an important tool in grounding you and your partner's sex lives.

Sex life. Sex lives. Sex lives. Sex lies and videotapes. Anyway, Catherine, do you have anything to add on your sexuality? I mean, just that it changes. I've been with my, we've been married for 13 years, my husband and I. And I mean, really, even in like the last five years, like there's still surprises that happen.

You're like, oh, this is what we like now. It's fun how it continues to evolve. But that really depends on being open. Like you said, like trying new things, just try it. If you don't like it, move on to something else. But having that partner that you trust and you can just like have a good time with, laugh, you know, make fart jokes in the middle. Yeah. And it's always good to say like to push the boundaries a little bit. Like if that's something you're interested in, or if you want to talk a little dirtier, or if you're interested in having a threesome, like talking about that stuff, you're going to be surprised. Like some people are so embarrassed. I know I was for a long time to talk about what my actual desires were, but, but because I didn't want them to be like, oh,

put off or emasculated or whatever. And then it's like, you know, the response usually is in kind. Like, you know, you'd be surprised what you're going to find out about your partner when you're really honest with yourself and with them. Yeah. Phoebe, before you go, did you want to ask Chelsea for a piece of advice as well? Oh, Chelsea. OK, so I am 37. A lot of my girlfriends are my same age or a little bit older. A lot of them are having kids. And I have made the choice to be voluntarily child free, which I'm very happy

about. But when you don't have kids, your friends have kids, like your relationships and your friendships change. And so sometimes I'm like, shit, I don't want to bother my friends should I reach out to them to hang out or am I like not important enough like I just don't know how to like navigate these friendships as they change or should I just find new friends who don't want to have kids either and then we can like hang out together I'm just trying to figure out like what's the new normal and all this happening under COVID where everything is just socialization has changed in general. I just don't know where my place fits in. Yeah, I think I think, first of all, it's always nice to be making new friends, whatever stage of life you're in.

You know, like I just was living in Whistler last year for three months and I made a group of girlfriends because I was there by myself. I couldn't bring my family or my friends because of COVID. So I had to make new friends. And it was just one of the most joyous times of my life because I had never had to make friends. I hadn't been in a situation where I was just like, I didn't know anybody and I just had to be like a local yokel. And I loved it. So A, you're going to be always making friends

and being open to that is good. I mean, you seem like you're pretty well-rounded. So you're going to be open to meeting people anyway. And with your job, you're always going to that is good. I mean, you seem like you're pretty well-rounded, so you're going to be open to meeting people anyway. And with your job, you're always going to be meeting people. So being in this industry, there's always people coming in and out. But the other thing is, is like, you know, when my friends have kids and they're important to me, I just make sure that I show up at their house, you know,

like I show up so that they're not having to go out of their way to meet up with me. Like I'll go over there, have a coffee, have a drink, hang out with them, hang out with their kids in the background. Or if their kids are cool enough, I'll hang out with their kids too. But there's a lot of people in my life that have babies or small children. And I always prioritize those people and make sure that that I know that I have to go to them. You know what I mean? And you know, I don't love children or anything. I mean, but I love my friends' children enough to be able to like be present in their lives and understand that like the first eight or nine years of having a child is like somebody is in a completely different situation. I have the leisure and license to be able to pop over there more easily than they can do it. So in those times, I think it's really important to show up for your friends in those ways. It's not mandatory, but it is a nice thing to do out of friendship to be like,

hey, you know, you've got a newborn, you're dealing with this. And then, you know, if you have the type of friend that all they can do is talk about their child and want to be with their child all the time and everything's about the child, that doesn't work for me. If you have the type of friend that can separate the two and have a life that's independent about the child. That doesn't work for me. Yeah. If you have the type of friend that can separate the two and have a life that's independent of the child and still as like a woman who's your friend, who's interested in talking about world issues or gossiping or whatever floats your boat, then, you know, you can still honor that in certain ways, too. But, yeah, people who are completely consumed by their children, I have a hard time with. Yeah.

Because that's not my life. That's your life. And now we're not sharing. Yeah. And then sometimes it just feels like because I'm not a mom, I'm constantly, hey, how's it going? Is there anything you need from me? You just feel like sometimes you don't get that back. But maybe that's just an expectation that I shouldn't have. You know, I think it's unfair. I think when people are really in the throes of it, we should cut them a little slack when they're parenting. Because look at how we don't have like we don't have those, you know, we don't have to do that. So what's our excuse? What's keeping us from showing up a little bit extra for our friends when they're in that moment?

Right. They're looking at us like, fuck, she's single. She can't ever fucking come over here. What is she doing? She's got to drink all day. It's like, yeah, I have responsibilities too. No, I could totally come over and hang out there for a couple of hours. Yeah. And that goes a long way. You know, spending time with people in their homes when their kids are around is a very great way to spend time with somebody. You know, when you grew up and your family was like watching TV, doing nothing. And that's, those are the most comfortable moments when you're all just together in a house. So it kind of takes also, it lessens the pressure of having an incredible time. You know, you swing by, you show your face, it goes a long way. You have a coffee or have a

cocktail or smoke a doobie, whatever you're into. And it kind of brightens their day. That's how I feel when I go to my friend's house who have kids. I'm like, okay, it's time to go brighten their day. Oh, I love that. Okay. That's great. I'm going to do more of that. Oh, good. Great.

We're going out with a bang. Woo-hoo. Thank you, Phoebe, for being here today. It was such a pleasure. So nice hanging out with you and talking to you. This has been so fun. I'm not going to, like, fangirl over you, but this is really cool. So thank you so much for having me on. Well, thank and talking to you. This has been so fun. I'm not going to like fangirl over you, but this is really cool.

So thank you so much for having me on. Well, thank you. Thank you. And make sure you guys, you can check out her HBO Max special, Sorry Harriet Tubman. And you can check out her latest book, which is Please Don't Sit on My Bed

with Your Outside Clothes. That's correct. Boom. Okay. With regard to my standup, you guys, I have added 30 cities. We've added Des Moines. We've added your requests. People who requested Louisville, Kentucky, guess fucking what?

I'm coming. We've added Montclair, New Jersey. We've added a whole slew of cities. So if you have not gotten your tickets yet, do it. ChelseaHandler.com. We just announced 30 more cities. Niagara Falls, I'm talking to you too. So suck on that. I'll see everybody on tour. Loving it. Vaccinated and horny. And if you have a question or you and a loved one have a question, please write in to DearChelseaProject at gmail.com.

I'm Jason Alexander. And I'm Peter Tilden. And together, our mission on the Really No Really podcast is to get the true answers to life's baffling questions like why the bathroom door doesn't go all the way to the floor, what's in the museum of failure, and does your dog truly love you? We have the answer. Go to reallynoreally.com

and register to win $500, a guest spot on our podcast, or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead. The Really No Really podcast. Follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. a guest spot on our podcast or a limited edition signed Jason bobblehead the really no really podcast follow us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts