Dear Chelsea - Vag of Honor with Naomi Watts

Episode Date: February 13, 2025

Actress Naomi Watts joins Chelsea to discuss starting perimenopause at 36, why she’s so passionate about helping women know their options around this life stage, and what you should be looking out for.  Then: A medical professional feels like there’s no help for her early signs of menopause.  And a sniffer calls in with a series of mysterious symptoms.  * Pick Up a Copy of Naomi’s Book Dare I Say It? Everything I Wish I’d Known About Menopause * Other reading referenced in this episode: Inconceivable by Julia Indichova Women Have Been Misled About Menopause by Susan Dominus * Order Chelsea's new book I'll Have What She's Having today. Best enjoyed with a tasty Owl's Brew hand-crafted boozy beverage. * Need some advice from Chelsea? Email us at [e-mail] * Executive Producer Catherine Law Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert * * * The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees.  This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all.  Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice.  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hi, Catherine. Hi, Chelsea. Hi. Here we are. Here we are. It's, what day is it? Is it Thursday? Yes, it's Thursday.

It must be Thursday. It's our podcast day. And you're back in Whistler. I am. I'm back. I'm home. How has the ski, I mean, as much as you've been able to be there, how has the skiing been this year?

Well, the skiing's been good. I mean, a couple of dry spells or rain spells. Whistler gets wet, so it kind of ruins the snow. But there's a lot of snow right now. I mean, I'm still recuperating from my shoulder stitch. So I'm not really skiing, but I just love being here, you know, in the snow. And I've been reunited with Doug.

My dog trainer up here was with him. She moved into my house. Abby from, Tales from Whistler. I don't know what the company is. Hot Tales from Whistler. Doggy Tales. Yeah, but she's so awesome. I mean, she really saved me when I had found out I don't know what the company is, Hot Tails from Whistler. We'll put a link in the bio. But she's so awesome. I mean, she really saved me when I had found out

I had to get that shoulder surgery. So Doug now thinks she's his mother. So I have to contest with that, but I'll fucking take it. You know what I mean? She's so good with him. That's great. And he's so, I mean, you should, when he sees me, he puts my hand in his mouth and he's not biting, but he's playing.

And he just like, and she goes, that's when he is so overwhelmed with emotion that he can't express himself. Like he just, and he, when I got home, I mean, he had my hand in his mouth for like almost 40 minutes. I could not get it out. It's like cute aggression. You ever get that?

He's just like, look at me, look at me. I'm like, oh, Doug, I didn't want to leave you. I didn't want to. I added more Vegas dates, you guys. So I want to make sure I mention those. So my next dates are March 21st. This is my residency at the Cosmopolitan in Vegas at the Chelsea Theater, March 21st and April 18th.

And then we added July 5th, August 30th, November 1st and November 29th. So go to ChelseaHandler.com for your tickets. Great. And your book is like about to come out. Oh. It'll be like a week away. Oh. Very soon. So get your pre-orders in.

Yes. And you can actually on Barnes and Noble, you can like say, I would like a signed copy. And yes, I signed 8,500 copies for Barnes and Noble. So you can get that if you want a signed copy or come to any of my book signings. They're all up on my website too. I'm going to New Jersey. I'll be at the 92nd Street Y in New York. I'll be in Cincinnati.

Let's just read it while I have my phone here. Let's see where else I'm going. Yeah, Boston, Cincinnati, Chicago. I'll be in New Jersey on the 24th, my birthday, I'll be at the 92nd Street Y, 26th I'll be in Boston, then Cincinnati, then Chicago, then LA at the Grove, and then Seattle, Washington on March 3rd. So go to ChelseaHendler.com for all that information,

make sure you order your Owl's Brew or buy your Owl's Brew so we can have a nice boozy book club. And I'll put a link to that in the description as well. Awesome, thank you so much, Catherine. Drum roll, Catherine, please. Chelsea Handler Abroad Abroad is my European tour, which I just announced yesterday. Tickets go on sale tomorrow or today,

or there's a pre-sale code Chelsea. So I'm coming to obviously find a husband abroad. I need to get the hell out of this fucking country. And it's not as easy as you think. So I'm coming to Reykjavik, I'm coming to Dublin, I'm coming to the UK, I'm coming to Brussels, Paris, Belfast in May and June. I'm coming to Oslo, Stockholm, to Copenhagen, Manchester, London, Glasgow, New Zurich, Vienna. I've never ever been to Vienna. Berlin, Barcelona, and Lisbon.

I'm coming. Abroad is abroad. That sounds like fun. I'm gonna go see you abroad. I know, I wanna go see me abroad. And there I'll be and there I'll be. There I'll be. Excellent.

We have a bestselling New York Times author on today. Her new book, Dare I Say It, Everything I Wish I'd Known About Menopause, debuted at number four on the New York Times bestsellers list. Please welcome actor, author and entrepreneur, my friend Naomi Watts. Oh, hello. Oh, hello Menopause lady. Hi. Oh, hi.

Are you excited to continue your talking about menopause? I know that you have. I've seen you everywhere. I know. I feel very exposed. Yeah, definitely. Billy too. Poor Billy. Poor hot Billy. She's married to Billy Crudup who I have a very intense crush on. I've expressed such to him and Naomi together

and luckily he's very gracious at my advances but also keeps his distance. First of all, on behalf of my sister, I want to say thank you for sending all of your products to my sister, Shoshana. She got all of your products. She fucking loves them. Oh, it's so good. I love them too. And I have to say, so Dare I Say It is this book.

And this is perfect for our audience because we have so many women listening and all of you women are going to get to experience the joy of menopause. And the great advantage and the bravery that Naomi is bringing to the subject matter by discussing it so openly and encouraging so many other women that are now discussing it so openly

is that we don't have to go through this without having the information like women 50 years ago did. We don't have to go through all of this without talking about it like women 50 years ago did. And there are so many tools and there are so many brands including Stripes which is Naomi's brand that has so many ways to help you deal with all of the experiences that you will go through during perimenopause. And you also mentioned, which is very funny, because my sister Shoshana, who is a nurse, said on the podcast, she goes, you know, menopause is just actually one day. It's a year from

the day of your last period. Is that right? Is that what it is? That's exactly right. And I said to her, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. This was a couple of years ago. This was a couple of years ago. Right, right. And meanwhile, she's an RN. So clearly she knows way more than I do. But you also talk about that in the book, which is, which I think a lot of people didn't

know, right? Yeah. And that also, you know, it's basically a third of our lives that we will be in this menopause, perimenopause, post-menopause state. Not to say that the doom and gloom of your symptoms will last this many decades, but you could still have some menopause-related, unless you're getting treatment and that is obviously everyone's choice, whatever is safe for them.

So it is something to prepare for, but not with fear. And we don't have to flail around trying to piece it all together by ourselves anymore because it's now broken open. We can talk to our friends, we can go to our doctors with the right questions and explore it with feeling armed with what's available now out there on the internet. I mean, there's that fantastic New York Times Susan Dominus article that was written a couple of years ago that really goes granular into how to approach treatment if you want to. It's a different time. And one of the things that you talk about in your book that I think is so

people don't really realize is that you can be going through perimenopause and also becoming a mother. Like motherhood can be in conjunction with perimenopause. So which is something that happened to you. Yes, well the news came to me that I was close to menopause, quote unquote, at 36 when I was not getting pregnant, my doctor said, let's take some blood work. And I did, and then the results suggested that I had a high FSH level, which is follicle stimulating hormone. And I kind of ran out of the office, not ran, but like walked out of the office in pieces

feeling terrified. Oh my God, two bits of bad news. My fertility was done possibly, and I was gonna be going into menopause, which just felt like the end of everything. I called my mom right away and said, "'Why didn't you tell me more? She had told me that she went into it at 45.

But when I asked her why she didn't give me more detail, she said, well, these were the conversations I never had with you because my mother never had them with me, like there was some code of silence that was just agreed upon. We suck it up. We suffer through. We soldier on. And yeah, that's that's just agreed upon. We suck it up, we suffer through, we soldier on, and yeah, that's just the way it goes. And it just makes no sense when we're half the population that is going to get there, God willing, that we live that long. And yeah, why should we suffer? Why should we have to deal with any kind of conversation that is taboo or stigmatized?

It didn't make any sense, especially now that we're living longer. So we need to optimize our health. And if you don't get things under control, it can lead to other issues. Yeah, there's a lot of suffering, like the subject of women suffering and women being tough and having to deal first of all

We're juggling more than most men are on a daily basis, you know, we're able to multitask We're able to do all of these things But the idea of like female suffering is just it's so crazy that people I mean There are certain people who think you have to suffer that it is part of the journey that it is part of the game You have to suffer, that it is part of the journey, that it is part of the game. You have to suffer in order to get stronger, you have to suffer in order to, you know, be the body weight you want to be, you have to suffer. It's like, that's all bullshit. You don't have to suffer. You have to work hard and be determined. I know it's like it's part of our programming. I mean, and you know, even going back to the

first time we had our periods and there was pain and it was like, come on, everyone has period pains. Just suck it up, you're fine. And then you find out 10 years later, this young woman has got endometriosis and has been complaining about it, but everyone around her has said, you can deal. So I think it's just part of our wiring that we think that we must just soldier through.

And I don't think we need to do that. And I think as we get to this point in our life, as older women who have experienced a few things, we get to say, no, actually not, I'm not just going to roll through this, I'd like some support. And I'd like to have some compassion and empathy from all those around me. What was the issue for you? Coming up with this product line is incredible. It's incredibly helpful for so many women.

What was the issue for you that made you develop your first product and which one was the first one? I developed this company called Stripes Beauty because we've earned our stripes. I wanted this woman to feel seen that it was not the end, that she should head into this time with support and agency, unapologetically so. I really wanted to create a brand that recognized her symptoms, her age, exactly where she's at,

and not promised the world that you could look like a 25-year-old. Because frankly, when I was 25, I didn't like how I looked. I want to look my best in this moment right now. And also that this is a part of your life. This isn't the end of your life. And there is more to be excited about after, after you're done with menopause, and quite possibly during the whole process of menopause, which I would argue is something that you can go through

with the right help and the right support and the right products, while enjoying the time that you're going. It's not like a funeral. You have a whole life ahead of you after. Exactly. It's just, it's a whole new chapter. The, yes, some changes take place and not just physically, emotionally, you know,

your household emptying out perhaps, or the about to, your ailing parents, job pressures, marriage issues, you know, like that so many things can happen at, at this exact time and it's kind of a cruel trick that you do get that zinger of the old menopause thing, but we can get through challenges again with support systems and good doctors, good community, all of it. But to go back to your question, Valgivana, if I may, is our best seller. And you've got it right there. It's one of the curvier bottles.

I think that's the lube. This is, oh, my glide. That's the Play Oil. Going to use that for butt tacks later. So I wanted to create a product line that was from scalp to vag, because we need extra hydration at all of those points. need extra hydration at all of those points. And that's a deep hydration level for your skin, for your hair, for your body and the vag.

And so you can put this anywhere, right? You can put it on your scalp or your vag. Oh, no, wait, what are you, you've got the, I'm doing the power move. Oh my god, no, that's just for the vag. The power move. Oh, the power move is just for the face. Just face, you don't for the face. Just face.

You don't put the face on your vagina. Just want to clarify here. You can put it on the face of your lover and then maybe he can put it on the base of your vagina. This is what is called rest. Face to base. This is called resting clean face. Very clever.

I love that. Which is a nourishing and calming face wash. And is called resting clean face. Very clever, I love that. Which is a nourishing and calming face wash. And then there is lube. And then what do you have for night sweats? Well, there's different things you can do for night sweats. And if you are into supplements, we have something called Inside Edition. Is that what you have there?

I have Inside Edition, yeah. I think that's it right there. Oh yeah, this right here. Yeah, that's gonna help you with your night sweats. I've taken these for my night sweats and they work. I've taken these. Oh good, good. I'm glad to hear.

People in perimenopause have really had a great time with those, that is a great way to start when you don't know what's going on. But certainly the sweaty nights is a big one. And something that I ticked on medical forms for years and years and years before I was told I was in menopause. Anyway, I have since gone on HRT, which is working for me.

It was a great conversation with my doctor. He went through my medical history. We talked about my symptoms. If I wasn't getting enough sleep, it was going to lead to other things, depression, anxiety, memory, you know, brain fog, all those kind of issues. So based on my medical history, he felt it was safe for me. And what kind of HRT are you on? Estrogen and progesterone.

So there are so many different delivery methods. I have pretty much tried them all. It's all trial and error, whatever works for you, different doses, different methods of delivery. I am currently on the gel, but I, before that I was on the patch. I kind of missed my patch. And before that I was on the pill. I don't know.

I may have the chronology off here, but I've tried the pill, the spray, the, the ring that you insert inside. They're all great things. The pill is meant to be the least safe one because it goes through your liver and can cause blood clots. Yeah, I'm on the patch. I just started the patch and I take the progesterone when I go to bed at night. But it really has helped. The Inside Edition

stripes really helped me with the night sweats. The progesterone and the estradiol, that's helping with the sleep. Because the sleep, we've talked about this. When you drink and you can't, I mean, it's like you can't drink anymore because if you drink and go to bed. Yeah, you need a few hours before you go to bed. It's gonna, the sugar is gonna spike in the night and wake you up, I think. But yeah, takes the joy out of. It's day drinking from here on out, girls, day drinking.

You're not there yet, Catherine. Not yet, not yet. Oh no, I'm cresting right now. I'm cresting in my peri-monoposture. You're crowning into peri-monoposture. Yes, yes. Not yet, not yet. No, no, I'm cresting right now. I'm cresting in my peri-monocostal. You're crowning into peri-monocostal. Yes, yes. When you talk about hormone replacement therapy

or like bioidentical hormones, like that's a buzzword I've heard a lot. Is there a difference between those? Are those like two terms for the same thing? Basically, yes. Okay. As I understand it, it's a marketing term. They're basically the same thing.

But yeah, I mean, again, I'm not a doctor. I don't know why I said again. It was like I was in the last meeting. Sorry. She's still not a doctor. That's what happens when you're on the treadmill of doing promotions. You have to keep repeating to people, I'm not a doctor. I'm not a doctor. I'm not a doctor. I'm not a doctor. Yes. I have not even played one. So but you do have a story in the book about someone who kind of went with some info from

the internet and then used some hormones and used way too much of them and then found out she was using maybe way too much of the testosterone. Yes. She had a terrible experience and she didn't get enough instruction from her doctor or at the pharmacy and she Googled it and she looked up, I think the dosage of what the male, what men were doing and she blew through this testosterone at a rate that was just not safe. And as a result, like started losing her mind and almost her marriage because it,

you know, she started making stuff up and it was a big problem. So yeah, you do really need to be on top of this and be the CEO of your body and your whole menopausal journey because we're just watching doctors get educated in real time about this. With the conversation not being open, nobody was saying, I've got a problem. So the research wasn't there. So it's just on the, you know, on the on the on the on the precipice of change in the last five years. It's only going to get better.

And I think your generation or the next generation is going to be much better set up for success. Yeah, thankfully. I mean, we could at least do them that favor after what we did to the climate. Yeah, that's true. What are some other things, knowing that you're not a doctor, Naomi, what are some other things that progesterone and estrogen do provide you with? Well, I find progesterone helps me sleep. I find it takes away anxiety, and I've found that that has been a game changer in my sleeping.

I know that some people might even take higher dosage than I do. I've heard that, and I'm definitely curious about that at some point for myself, but it's definitely helped me with sleep and anxiety. I'm curious as to like when you were starting this kind of you know research for yourself and then started to become more outspoken about it like when did you decide you were going to write this book with this book you have to get if you a woman, you have to read this, you have to understand what your body's going through so that you can get ahead of it. Like, arm yourself with information. Information is so powerful with everything. Like, and it's just so easy to pick up this

knowledge, you know, and then have, once you have a, like a base of knowledge about something, to be able to talk to other people about it is just so advantageous. But when did you think, because it is not a sexy topic. It's not hot. You're not talking about youthfulness, which is what everyone wants to be talking about. So how did you feel about taking this on? I know Billy wasn't so excited about you

talking about this publicly. But when did you decide to take this on and become kind of an ambassador for such an unsexy subject? Okay, so after my second child, I was able to get pregnant naturally, mercifully. And after my second child, I went into hardcore symptoms. And in my early 40s, I was like my early 40s, the internet was barely active. I was trying to piecemeal information together. I was like, there should be a guidebook, a manual of how to navigate this time that is

not telling me it's the end. It should be sexy and funny and informative and warm and cozy. Where is that book? And I had a book to support me through my fertility that I was, it was like my private little Bible in a way that I would read. And it was called Inconceivable. It was a fantastic book written by Julia Indachova. And it was my everything that gave me hope and

I wanted the same kind of book for this topic and it just wasn't there and I remember talking to her friend of mine and she was like you should write that. I was like oh come on I'm an actor I'm not a writer and there's no way I'm gonna say that out loud in my industry. God, talk about Korea suicide. And so I just left it. That idea came to me first. Then I came to Stripes Beauty. That idea came about, I guess, 10 years later.

And I guess being 50, where I'm suddenly the average age, quote unquote, of menopause, which is 51. And so I just thought, okay, maybe I can just actually own this now. Maybe it's just too exhausting to keep carrying this secret. Maybe I'm going to do it. And I went and cold pitched the idea to a company that partnered with me right away. And then, you know, I just got more and more into it. And yes, even talking about the vaginal offerings, I was like,

I'm not going to speak about that though. I'm just going to talk about what a woman needs, which is hydration, hydration from scalp to vag. But, you know, you can't do this in half measures. You have to just be all in. And the chances are what's happening to me are going to be happening to several other women out there too. So it got to the point where it just got more and more comfy with being, you know, more personal and exposing my secrets in service of, in the hope that I would heal or soothe other women. And, you know, it just felt ridiculous that women could come together and talk

about every awkward moment in their life, whether it was their first kiss, their first period, their first, you know, pregnancy or, you know, all those things. We came together and we would talk and compare notes, but then suddenly there was this silence, like we're supposed to just manage this on our own. So that, that's when I just went, I screw it. I'm going to write the book and I want it to be informative. I want it to be like a cozy chat with my girlfriend on the couch. I want it to be hilarious and fun.

with my girlfriend on the couch. I want it to be hilarious and fun. Other women's stories, knowledge, information, you know, all peppered through it and hopeful. And it's not the end. That was the point. Yeah. Okay. On that note, we're going to take a break and we'll be right back with Naomi Watts. This is David Eagleman, host of the science podcast, Inner Cosmos. For Valentine's Day, we're diving into the question, what is love from the brain's point of view? What does love have to do with how you were raised or the symmetry of someone's face or the smell of their underarms? Why does the character of love change throughout our lives?

Why is heartbreak like drug withdrawal? And what does any of this have to do with sweaty t-shirts or rom-coms or monogamous animals and the future of love and AI? Join me for this week's Inner Cosmos for a deep dive into the neurobiology of love. Listen to Inner Cosmos with David Eagleman on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

And we're back with Naomi Watts, author of Dare I Say It and Stripes, the company that offers all sorts of relief to people who are experiencing menopause, going through menopause, which as we've learned can be a long period of time. So you wanna get your products. I personally like the Inside Edition, which just helps with night sweats, because I too am going through peri...

And it keeps you regular as well. Keeps you regular? Oh, oh, I was like regular, what kind of regular? There's so many kinds of regular too. I know, not regular period. Not regular pooping. I was like period. I was like I already got an ablation to map that you've blocked that out. But I'm Oh, good. Good. Keeping you regular is always a bonus. Wait

one question before we begin with colors. One question Naomi, when you since you were experiencing menopause when you were going through your fertility and then you had your children, and then the symptoms became even more exacerbated. Did you confuse that at all with postpartum or did that play with did those two was it postpartum too? Well, it could have been yes for sure. But I was pretty keyed into the menopause thing by this point because at 36, I had had that message given to me. And then I understood that my night sweats were in fact menopause symptoms, that my irregular

periods thinning out and everything was also a symptom. I didn't join the dots until then. In fact, those medical history forms that you fill out, I'd written night sweats on them for years and years and years and everyone just chalked it up to, oh, it's an allergy or oh, maybe it's that extra glass of wine or they just didn't ever say this could be menopause or perimenopause. In fact, that word was not a word I was familiar with until the last five years, which is a much nicer word, much gentler. So yeah, I was pretty understanding of the symptoms by the time my second baby came. Yeah. Okay.

But there was still more that I came to discover later, which was itchy skin that also led me to creating stripes. I was working on a TV show and I had long days under hot lights with makeup and I would come home and after having taken my makeup off and just be ripping the dry skin off my face, it was just angry and itchy and I didn't understand what was happening. I'd go to the dermatologist, I'd get a little, you know, cortisone cream, which would work for a few days, and then the same thing would happen, flare up.

And, you know, I was just running in circles. Again, no one connected the dots. And then I figured out later that indeed, as we lose estrogen, everything thins and dries out. And you become irritated much easier with things like retinols or things that I've been using in my skincare regime, which was working perfectly for a number of years, now was not going to not only not work, but it was going to aggravate me.

So I had to really change out all of my skincare and that's when I created the brand because I wanted to have something that was ultra hydrating and good for sensitive skin. Well, that's interesting that you say retinols because those are specifically marketed to like aging skin quote unquote or like fine lines and wrinkles and that sort of thing. So it's like right at the same time that you're having this thinning. Yeah. Well, there's retinoids. We have retinoids in our evening wear,

which I've got to get into your hands, Chelsea, because I see you don't have it there. And yes, so that's a gentler form that will help with fine lines. Wonderful. Well, are we ready for some advice questions? Are they menopause advice questions? They sure are.

They better be. Okay, yes, we have to curtail everything to our special guest. Yes, yes. Well, obviously like blanket statement, as Naomi mentioned, you know, there are so many different variables for everyone, so talk to your doctor, but this is just some advice from our perspective. So that's what we'll name the episode. We are not doctors. I have to tell you sometimes. Naomi, you'd be surprised how many times I have to say, I'm not a doctor also. Really?

Yes, yes, you'd be very surprised. Yeah, because people are calling in for your advice. I know. Yeah, and then I dole out unsolicited medical advice as well, pretty typically. Our first question comes from Kelsey. She says, dear Chelsea, I am 36 years old and stopped taking my birth control two years

ago. I had taken oral birth control since I was 18 and would skip my placebo cycle every two months and maybe have a period every three months. Since stopping, I've had night sweats, dry skin, acne, rotator cuff pain without injury and Jesus Christ, the low energy is killing me. My question is, if I'm in perimenopause, what kind of supplements and skin care should I use? I tried a number of lotions and washes and nothing seems to help my dry skin.

Note, I have not been officially diagnosed with perimenopause. I'd like to be tested, but I work in the medical field, CMA, and I feel like getting tested or asking for help is pointless because there isn't much treatment from the MD perspective With so much love at Kelsey. Hi Kelsey. Hi. Hello Hi, this is our special guest Naomi Watts who just wrote a book called dare I say it which is all about menopause. So you're in good hands today So you're 36, right? Is that what you said 36? Yeah, just turn 36 That's how old Naomi was when she discovered she was going through menopause.

Exactly my age, yeah, when I started having the symptoms. Well, actually, I'd had night sweats for a number of years, and I had migraines and irregular periods. I did have blood work done, and you're right. There's no one exact defining test except for if you've had a full year without a menstruation. But I think there are lots of other indicators like- But there's also a urine test that you can do that Dr. Nygma told me about called the Dutch test. Naomi, do you know about that one? I don't. I heard that Clear Blue is doing one

now as well. Yeah, there's something called the Dutch test and it requires you to like you pee on this little stick like three or four times from like in a 12 hour period and that they say is a better indicator than blood work will like indicate when you come back. Yeah. So you might want to look into that too. Yeah. I've never heard of that. Yeah. The rotator cuff thing, I had a frozen shoulder. Many of my friends have had that and that can be very painful, particularly when you're sleeping. But you're in the medical field. I would say, can you talk to your colleagues? Can you get some, I mean, this is the thing is that it's so many doctors were not even trained in this area specifically, gynecologists.

I've done panels and symposiums and with a great number of fancy doctors and they talk about their one hour specific lecture centering around menopause. It's mind boggling considering half the population will go through it. So I would just try and piecemeal together all of your symptoms and go to your doctor and ask them what they think is best based on your medical history.

And also frozen shoulder for that specifically. Like I've had a lot of conversations around this recently, cause I've had a lot of conversations around this recently because I had shoulder issues and I thought maybe that was what I have, but I had an infection in my shoulder so it wasn't given to me by a doctor who shall rename nameless for now until I decided to blow his gasket. But frozen shoulder, I've had a lot of conversations about that and you want to treat that like you would treat a shoulder in physical therapy.

Like you really want to keep mobilizing it. You really want to keep moving that and just kind of doing daily exercises to increase mobility because the less you use it, the worse you're going to be. Yeah, motion is lotion. So basically we have estrogen receptors all over our bodies and receptors all over our bodies and you know, that's what happens there. It just kind of locks up and Chelsea's right. I was doing a lot of PT and I did suffer through it for a good year. Eventually I did something that I didn't want to do, but I ended up having to do it because the pain was too excruciating. I ended up having a cortisone shot and just giving it some relief was really helpful.

And then I did hardcore PT, you know, grabbing a towel or a band and going up above your head and down and forward. That was really good. And, you know, like car wash kind of round and round, those kind of things to just increase mobility. And did you do that cortisone shot that helped, right? That gave you some relief? It really, really helped. And it has not come back since. And I'm, you know, I'm knocking on words, but that has been a game changer for me.

Yeah, that's good to know. I ended up getting cortisone shots too, cause- Oh, you did? Oh, wow, you're on- I did physical therapy for a long time. And even my physical therapist doctor was like, I don't know really what else to do for you. But I didn't think about doing PT after that because now that it doesn't hurt so much,

I might be able to move it. Yeah. And that's also the thing when it doesn't hurt is the most important time to keep it up. You know what I mean? To keep just that mobility going because I don't know, I've talked to so many PTs about frozen shoulder because it's my obsession since reading Naomi's book.

I read Naomi's book and just had every symptom that she described. Like, I'm like, and then I came back and I was like having night flashes and I told my sister, I'm like, I'm having night flashes and I tried this other over the counter stuff before Naomi, you sent me this. And I was like, and they worked for my night sweats.

And my sister's like, you are so, you're so impressionable. She's like, you read a book about menopause, then you decide you have menopause and then you cure it in one day with this over-the-counter drug. You are on it. I know, I'm on it. But yeah, so the frozen shoulder thing is like,

you really wanna stay on that because it's when you ignore it or when you're in so much pain that you lose your mobility that you kind of can get stuck. So you want to stay on that too. And yeah, inquire about that Dutch test. That's very interesting. I haven't heard that because you have like hormone level checks, but if they're not off

and it's kind of like, well, I don't have any proof. Yeah. The thing is, is the hormone checks can change every single day. Yeah. Right. That's why they don't find them completely reliable. Yeah. And a Dutch test, I think that was for my naturopath. So if you look that up online, I'm sure you can order one because, yeah, it's like your blood levels, you could be on your period and get them, or you could be two weeks into

your cycle, which are going gonna have completely different results. So I think that's why they're not accurate. And we live in LA, so we have doctors that are just willing to dole out anything at any moment for anything, you know? So it's like, you don't really know what's working sometimes because I know for me, I'm just taking so many different things,

whether it's peptides or anti-aging stuff, it's like, I'm not sure what's working, I just know something is. Yeah, that's all. Now, for someone like Kelsey, who, you know, maybe you're not getting the help that you need from your current doctor, your current OB-GYN, what are the sort of things that she should be looking for in a specialist? Okay, so I think at a minimum, if the doctor is not willing to give you a full spectrum of what's available, if that conversation is not, if he's blocking, he or she's blocking that conversation, then that's not the right doctor. I think you have to go in with your list of symptoms, your list of questions, your medical

history and your families, and if they're just flat out gatekeeping, then it might not be the right provider. And it's a bummer to have to change because I know that takes work, but you can go on the menopause society and look for a doctor that's suitable in your area. And also there was a great article in the New York Times by Susan Dominus two or three years ago called Women Have Been Misled. And that is, she goes really deep into the whole experience of treatment and how we've been misled because there was a study that went wrong and the media got ahead of the study and basically everyone

feared hormones from that day forward. Now of course they're not going to be everyone's choice nor are they safe for everyone, but they should not be ruled out if you are in need of symptom relief and it's safe for you. So you do have to trust your doctor. You do have to make sure they're hearing you. Yeah, that's right. And we do have a naturopath in town. I was actually thinking about... Yeah, I think naturopaths have a better vibe on menopause than medical doctors. You know what I mean? Sometimes. I mean, not overall speaking, but like until we have menopause specialists,

like naturopaths seem to have some better kind of elixirs. There are some specialists, it's like HerMD, Alloy, Midi Health, EverNow, these are all available. You know, they're not, that's telehealth places. So I think we're up to navigating it. It's a bummer that we have to do a lot of it on our own. But I think the change is only just started,

and it'll be better for the next generation. But there's still a lot of work we have to do in order to get the right support and treatment that we need. I totally agree because I feel like all my symptoms are like, oh, well, try this or that. I'm like, but when you add them all up, like I'm having a good amount of these specific kinds. And it's also, you have to understand, like you have to trust yourself and understand

that you know how your body feels and if it feels off or if it feels regulated. And like, when we talk to other people, sometimes that there's like this placebo effect of like, oh, well, they said it's not this. It's like you have to know your body. You're in the medical industry. Be like, sit with yourself and actually feel what you're feeling and you'll know, okay, this doesn't feel right. I do want to do something about this, you know, regardless of what other people's opinions are. Yeah. Have you considered HRT or have you mentioned it with your doctor? I know you said you were on birth control.

I haven't talked about any hormone replacement yet. I was actually even recently thinking about going back on birth control, but I don't really want to do that. Right. Well, I know what you're saying is, Chelsea, that naturopaths, there are lots of things available and it feels like you're getting a lot of focus, but I personally go for the FDA approved way because it, it just feels, it feels certain and you know, things have been tested and, but again, it's, it's gotta be your choice.

It's your body and obviously what's safe for you Thank you. All right. Well, thank you Kelsey. Will you report back in a few months and let us know if there's any any change? Yes, that sounds good. I will Yes report back and let us know if you get pregnant. We're interested No, not whatsoever Thank You Kelsey, I mean just the irony of this woman working in a hospital, calling into a podcast, asking us about menopause is just like, you're in a fucking hospital. You can't even get a straight answer.

Yeah. And I wonder if she does see a naturopath if they might suggest an MD that they have worked with or that sort of thing too. So, yeah. Well, our next caller is Karen. And a little bit of a, a little bit of a, to fill Naomi in, a little while back we had someone call in that was so annoyed that their friend kept sniffing constantly. Do you remember this? Like, like they were sniffing, sniffing, sniffing. And they're like, how do I tell my friend to stop sniffing? I've tried. It's upsetting. It's a whore, sniffing, sniffing. And they're like, how do I tell my friend to stop sniffing? I've tried, it's upsetting, it's a whole thing. Are we gonna find out this is a symptom of menopause?

Well, we'll see. Because wait, I just edited my next, I just edited my standup special and I was sniffing throughout the whole thing. And I was like, why am I sniffling this whole time? Chelsea, you have it too. I look like a coke head. And then my manager goes, can you why am I sniffling this whole time? Chelsea, you have it too. I look like a coke head. And then my manager goes, can you lift out the sniffling?

And I was like, I just gave them that note too. I'm like, I don't know, I must've had a cold. And I'm like, do I do that all the time without knowing? Well, Karen says, dear Chelsea, of all the things I've wanted to write in and ask about, my 48 year old perimon and pause symptoms, et cetera, here I am wanted to write in and ask about, my 48-year-old perimonopause symptoms, etc., here I am responding to a recent pod episode about a friend's annoying sniffing. It's me, not literally.

And I'm not snorting any drugs, I don't have seasonal allergies, I have inner ear congestion and the sniffing helps clear my ears. I've caught myself doing it and I annoy myself. I've even seen myself in videos doing it. I can't imagine what people think. I've seen at least two doctors and they couldn't help. No amount of decongestance work. I feel like I'm underwater.

I feel for these two friends, the sniffer and the sniffy, which got me thinking. I have a host of seemingly random symptoms. In addition to the sniffing, I'm exhausted, I have headaches, and I constantly feel like my head is in a fishbowl. My periods have changed and I'm back on birth control to help with the heavy flow. I find myself wondering if it's something serious, but could it just be menopause? XO Karen."

I don't know. Hi, hi, Karen. Hi. Hi. Welcome to Dear Chelsea. This is Naomi Watts, our special guest today. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah.

I mean, look, as far as I've been told, I knew that fertility changes after 35, but what I didn't know is that you can experience perimenopause symptoms right from then onwards. And certainly in my case, that's what was going on. So it sounds like with the exhaustion levels and the heavy periods, I mean, was that regular, the heavy periods, or is it just suddenly or in the last? It was new and it was so uncomfortable. I didn't want to leave my house. And I went to my doctor to make sure everything was okay. And then I ended up going back on birth control pill and it helped, but there's so much stigma

around the birth control pill. And why is that? Why is there so much stigma around birth control, Naomi? Do you know that? Yeah, there shouldn't be, let's put it that way. Is it just such an adjustment when you get off of it? Is that the downside of it? I was on the birth control for, gosh, maybe, and, you know, of course, when I wasn't getting

pregnant I thought, oh, is it because I was on it for too long? But no, I don't think it was related at all. It's probably a big adjustment. How long did you say that you haven't been on it for? Well, I was on it for probably 15 years. I got pregnant like two months after I stopped with my first daughter when I wanted to start a family. And then I went back on it.

And when I had my second daughter, the same thing, I was able to get pregnant right away. And then after her, I was like, oh, maybe I know, do I have to give my body a break from it or, you know, so I was off it for five years until just like 14 months ago when I went in, I was like, this is miserable. I was getting like really bad headaches. When I was young, I was like the only one of my friends that like took it. I'm very type A, so I was so good at taking it and it made my period like three days, very light. I had a lot of friends that said, be careful, that's not good for you, but here I am on it and it's helping me, but there's something in the back of my head, like am I hurting myself?

It's hard. No. Look, I think HRT is, as I understand it, lower levels of estrogen. So, if you want to go to, if you ask your doctor if it's safe for you, that would be maybe better for you. I mean, people stay on HRT till the very, very end. I know people that are in their 70s still taking it. So, the old messaging about, oh, you're only supposed to be on it for a certain amount

of time, the lower dose, the least amount of time, that's old education right there. So I think you should maybe investigate. If you want to get your regular periods under control, you should investigate that. I sound like I'm pushing HRT on everyone, but it's an option. No, I don't think so. I think that is exactly what you're dealing with right now. It sounds like you're going through early perimenopause. Yeah, I feel like it's just really helped me.

And it's very confusing because this study that went wrong put the fear of God in not only women who were taking it, they literally flushed their hormones down the toilet, but doctors started doing the same thing and that was it. They just stopped the research. But you're talking about the article that came out that's saying it caused cancer, right? Yes, exactly. That it was leading to breast cancer. This was in 2002, and this is like more than 20 years ago now,

and we're still dealing with the fear of what happened there. I would say look at the Menopause Society, that is a great website, it leads you to doctors, and all kinds of education, and get your symptoms under control. And the sniffing thing, that, so that, tell me more about this. You know, I had this, I had this, a doctor looked, he's like, oh yeah, it looks like you got some fluid in your inner ear, you know, take some decongestants, which I love

taking honestly, I understand why they make them in meth, or use them in meth, but sometimes it wouldn't work. And so I do this kind of big sniff because it clears my ears. So I was taking a video of bees in my garden, and I was watching the video back, and I could hear myself. And I'm like, oh my gosh, it's terrible. And then I hear the episode, and I'm like, oh, I, it's terrible. And then I hear the episode and I'm like, oh, I wish Chelsea could tell me like, not that off. But it's really if I don't do it,

then the congestion kind of builds. And then I'm like leading my head over and people like, what are you doing? And I just kind of wonder if it's just kind of well, also my my ears would like they ring sometimes and then they started- Well, tinnitus is definitely a symptom. And I've definitely been there with sticking my fingers so far down my ear that I look like a- Because I started itching and I'm like, I'm literally turning into a bitch. I feel like you need to go to a hormone doctor.

I think you should go get some testing done, not just blood work, like to ask for the urine test, ask to just test all your levels at the right time of the month, like track when you're going to be in mid cycle or whenever the most optimal time for hormone testing is. 48 is around the exact age for all of those symptoms to be taking place. And it's the not knowing what's going on with your body, the feeling of like, wait, I, this didn't use to work like this, that that kind of period, the transitional period from perimenopause through to that

menopause day, which is one year after you've had your last menstrual cycle, you know, that is a confusing time. So I would definitely try to get in front of your doctor that you trust. Yeah, I need to. And you have to advocate for yourself in these situations. Yes. Like you have to be a little bit more pushy and a little bit more, you know, bold than you might feel comfortable with. But no one's going to advocate for yourself better than you are.

So like you want answers, especially with your nose and your pressure and your ear situation. Like you need to go to an ENT and go, what is this and what can I do about it? There's got to be some solution out there that can at least abate the symptoms to a degree, you know, like so you're not feeling pressure in your ear, whether those are ear drops or what, you know, whatever, like there are answers out there, but you kind of sometimes, especially with this as Naomi has demonstrated, you really have to push and be pushy to get answers. Women's health is not a priority for anyone

in the history of the world. So we have to make it a priority and you have to go in there and ask for answers and demand to get them. And if you don't get them from a certain doctor, then you have to change doctors. And that can be an exhaustive process, but it's going to be worth it in the end for you. Yes, exactly what she said. Yeah, I agree.

And then in the meantime, we're going to rename Naomi's book to I am not a doctor. Okay, do you feel better equipped? You just needed a little bit motivational push right here. Yeah, yeah. Always. There'll be a squeaky wheel, Karen. Yeah. Well, my name's Karen.

It's so funny. I know. Live up to your potential. Don't worry. That's the name. That's my alias. I have to travel with an alias. Like when I'm in hotels and stuff, I don't have to.

I choose to. But Karen is my alias and everyone thinks that's the funniest thing that my name is Karen. I'm like, yep, she's sitting right here. So we're sisters. All right. Thank you so much. Bye. Take care. Thanks, Karen. Thank you. Bye.

All right. We just have a couple more minutes, so we'll take a quick break and come back to wrap up. Perfect. Okay. We'll take a break and we'll be right back to wrap up with Naomi. This is David Eagleman, host of the Science Podcast, Inner Cosmos. For Valentine's Day, we're diving into the question, what is love from the brain's point of view? What does love have to do with how you were raised or the symmetry of someone's face or the smell of their underarms?

Why does the character of love change throughout our lives? Why is heartbreak like drug withdrawal? And what does any of this have to do with sweaty t-shirts or rom-coms or monogamous animals and the future of love and AI? Join me for this week's Inner Cosmos for a deep dive into the neurobiology of love and AI. Join me for this week's Inner Cosmos for a deep dive into the neurobiology of love. Listen to Inner Cosmos with David Eagleman on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back with Naomi Watts, who's written this new book called Dare I Say It, which every woman should read, and most men should read too, quite frankly, so you can understand what women are going through since you guys don't really have to go through fucking anything except getting us pregnant. And there's a quote for, there's even a blurb for me on the back. I hear a man laughing in the background, ha ha ha, he goes ha ha ha ha, he says show us

what you go through, prove to us what you're dealing with. I was always like, oh, what's something embarrassing that a man has to deal with? Like periods, we can't control when we get them. We could be on a plane, bleed out through clothing. I've told the story of meeting my sister on safari after she was on a plane and like bled for 17 hours. And she had, she's luckily she had those zip safari pants

that I had sent her as a joke that she had zipped off and then taken her and taken them and wrapped them around her waist. And I was like, God, what is comparable to like the woman's humiliation of getting our periods in school and in public places? And then I was like, oh, boners, like those are embarrassing. But a boner, it's like-

You can hide it. Yeah, you can. I mean, unless it's a really big one. But I mean, that's embarrassing for your boner to get hard like first, yeah, you can. I mean, unless it's a really big one, but I mean, that's embarrassing for your boner to get hard all of a sudden, because then everyone knows exactly what you're thinking, you know? But also it's just like, that's, that also could be argued. You know what I mean? There's no evidence. With a period, there's evidence. With it, like with a boner, there's no evidence. Like you just see, you think you see something

and someone can kind of push it away. But yeah, I can't think of anything that men go through that is comparable to all of the levels of pain, childbirth, child rearing, all of it. And then a menopause on top of it. It's the exclamation point. So we have to educate them. We have to bring them into the conversation and say, this is what's going on. And I find that most times if they're included into the conversation, they don't have to bring them into the conversation and say, this is what's going on. And I find that most times if they're included into the conversation, they

don't have to like imagine what's going on. If nothing's a mystery, then they will want to help. They will want to be empathetic. Uh, they just need greater understanding. And sadly that's our job to make them understand, but you know, again, this is the, the, the, the changes are happening in real time, then I'm certain that this is not going to be the case for the next generation. Everything will be more normalized and humanized and it'll be something that everyone knows how to talk

to. We can talk to our children and say, mommy's having a bad day, I didn't mean to snap. This is why. Hormonal shifts. Just like when a teenager slams the door in your face, we know what that's about and we empathize. We've got to bring everyone into the conversation. We have to tell our bosses at work if you're suddenly in a boardroom meeting and you're doing a PowerPoint with 10 men and you have a memory blip and you forget something that suddenly unravels the whole meeting,

that can happen. I've heard countless stories of women, which can lead to greater anxiety and retreating and nobody understands what's going on until you tell them. And so if we bring them in and say, hey, this is what's happening, I'm going to need a few hours or I'm going to need a day, they can adjust and figure out how to behave, hopefully. I love that. I want to say, Naomi, I'm really proud and impressed by you for bringing this subject to the fore in the way that you have. And I really, Naomi, A, I'm really proud and impressed by you for bringing this subject to the fore in the way that you have.

And I really wanna say, especially in our industry, because I have so many friends that have gone through a menopause before me, who were very loathed to even admit that that was an issue, who were very secretive about it. I really feel like this is the dawn of a new era, and you are someone who can really be credited with bringing that conversation forward. So thank you for doing that for women and for doing that for people within this industry to make people more comfortable with the idea of

talking about it and not being so ashamed at getting older. Like it doesn't have to be a dirty word, it doesn't have to be a dirty thing. And I think by welcoming men into these conversations as well, it's just another opportunity to get more educated for all of us. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, it was, it had to happen and I'm glad to be a part of it, along with a lot of other people. It's all things coming from every angle. All the doctors now who genuinely want to care for people who are coming together and making sure the conversation is not only open, but the treatment is available and we need to optimize our health because if you don't get your health under control at this point in

time, it can lead to other issues later. We're living longer, so we need to stay strong. And that means, you know, protecting our bones and things. I've seen you do it, Chelsea, you're lifting weights. That right? That's what you do. And that's protecting your bone health. And you know, there's so many, we don't wanna be fragile. No, I know, that's so many we don't want to be fragile. No I know that's exactly right we don't want to be fragile we don't want to be feeble we want to be

strong enough to take care of ourselves. Right to the end yeah. So thank you Naomi congratulations on your book and her product line is called Stripes for anybody and you go to what is it? StripesBeauty.com. StripesBeauty.com. Okay, thank you, Naomi. Have a wonderful, beautiful day. Hey guys, thanks, Catherine. Great to see you. Take care.

Safe travels. See you soon. If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email at dearchelseepodcastatgmail.com and be sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert, executive producer, Katherine Law. And be sure to check out our merch at ChelseaHandler.com.