Dear Hank & John - 331: The Edge of a Very Small Wilderness

Episode Date: May 9, 2022

How do I handle a loved one's astronaut aspirations? Should I pick dandelions? How do I sound more cultured? What is a "vibe" scientifically speaking? How do you think of new jokes? Why can't we send our garbage into space? Hank and John Green have answers!If you're in need of dubious advice, email us at [e-mail] us for monthly livestreams and an exclusive weekly podcast at patreon.com/dearhankandjohn.Follow us on Twitter! twitter.com/dearhankandjohn

Hello and welcome to Dear Hank and John. Of course I prefer to think of it Dear John and Hank. It's a podcast where two brothers answer your questions, give you the advice and bring you all the week's news from both Mars and AFC Wimbledon. Back together again the normal way. John at last. At last. I was going through my, I was, I went to turn over the calendar and I, I found out that it

jumped straight from April to June, I was dismayed. That got me a little bit, but only because it's been so long since I heard one of your jokes. I'm really glad that our fake feud is over. It was getting harder and harder to fake it. But man, what an intense period in both of our lives. And I'm just glad that we're back together again. I really genuinely missed you. And I am so happy that you're here. Can I paint an audio picture for you? Can we take it? I'm so curious. Because I can even through my little earbud, I can hear things going on. You can hear that it's a little bit of a different situation. So I'd like to take you. this is gonna be an episode of,

we're gonna go full radio app now, Hank. All right, so I'm painting an audio picture with only the tools at my disposal. I come to you live outside. Right now I'm looking at the back of a jiffy loop and at a dumpster. And if you had smell or vision, it would be working overtime right now.

I am, I'll actually have a picture on the Patreon because I'm not radio lab quality at describing my surroundings. I'm sitting on a five gallon bucket while my microphone is on another five gallon bucket. Opposite me and my computer, where the questions are, is on an empty fuel can of some kind.

Oh wow. It's a really, you think making movies, by the way, I'm on the set of the turtles all the way down the movie. I'm actually far enough away from the set that hopefully I can speak to you in my outside voice. But you think making movies is super romantic and fancy pants, but I'm just like,

I'm staring at half-burnt tires in a supper with Cincinnati. Well, I bet a lot of times it is pretty fancy pants, but this is not a slight at all, but your movies aren't like big budget blockbuster thrillers. They're certainly not. No. They cost, they don't cost as much.

No. Everybody wants to keep the budget, you know, where it needs to be so that it will work. Yeah, so if you feel like, wow, it sounds really, really weird. That's why I agree. Also, the direction, just so you know, Hank, the direction of the wind is such that I am directly downwind from the dumpster itself.

Right now in my view, I have, I think it's part of a car, like a bumper, like half of a bumper, and then I also have a number of discarded beer cans. So, that's the vibe, that's how we're coming to you today. Live. It's happening. Yeah, well, so you showed me a little bit, because we had our Patreon livestream before this, and I saw it a little bit, and I think that, well, you haven't expressed

just that you are in the woods. Oh, yeah. A little bit. Yeah. Well, that's the only thing. Yeah, I can't. It's not like you're sitting in a parking lot. You like went behind a fence to like one of those areas in between two spaces where they've just sort of let the trees

do what they will. Yeah, it's all, it's all honeysuckle bushes that have just grown wild for the last 35 years. It's very much, I am very much in the woods in a setting. I felt like I saw a pair of pants on the ground next to you. Yeah, there's some clothing. I would describe this as a liminal space, a space between spaces.

It's very similar to the space where our logo appears on the back of the AFC Wimbledon shorts. Is it butter, is it thigh, is it leg, nobody knows for sure. Yes. Well, it's all leg, John. It's all leg. If I've learned anything from being me, that entire area is leg.

Is leg. Well, I'll tell you what, heck, I am in the high upper leg of Cincinnati right now. Ha, ha, ha! I have to say, Cincinnati, by the way, is a great town. I am loving my time here. It's just, I'm a little jealous on Indianapolis's behalf.

I feel like we could achieve this with just a little bit of work, and I'm disappointed that jealous on Indianapolis's behalf. I feel like we could achieve this with just a little bit of work and I'm disappointed that we haven't. Look at you. Okay, but I mean, everybody on the coast needs to understand that the middle does exist and is available. I was in Austin, Texas recently and there was a sign for Ohio that was like,

Ohio, it's cheaper. That's true. I don't remember the exact words, but that was 100% the message they were trying to get across. Yeah. All right, yeah. We have less traffic. I feel like Indianapolis doesn't lean into that enough.

Indianapolis should be like, hey, you wanna be at work in 12 minutes, come to Indianapolis. Yeah, it works. Everything's working. It's fine. Well fine that is actually that's the that's one of the him that's the embarrassing motto that one of our former governors who shall remain nameless is tried to like make indiana the state that works oh wow i don't know i get it i get why he like or they like that

yeah it's it's a he that's correct yeah that's not I think that's good copywriting honestly well he used to be vice president so I'm like I can now guess who this is well actually you can't indianapolis as one of one indianapolis vice president put it indiana is home to more second rate men than any other state in the country because we do produce a lot of vice presidents. Yeah, but are they how many of them are around? two Oh, Dan Quale is the other one Dan Quale

But he now lives in Arizona and as you know Hank my home cemetery Oh God, we're gonna talk about whether or not Dan Quale is gonna get buried in your cemetery right now as you know I'm gonna talk about whether or not Dan Quayle's gonna get buried in your cemetery right now. As you know, one of the most important projects in my life. All right, I'm writing a letter to the Dan Quayle estate again. One of the most important projects in my life is trying to make sure that Dan Quayle should he ever die, God forbid, chooses to make his last and final rest in close ground hill cemetery in Indianapolis, even though he himself has lived in Arizona for several decades. Everybody get out your pens. Dear Vice President Quail.

I don't know much about you anymore. I've forgotten most of it. I'm sorry about the whole potato thing. That seems overblown. I'm sure that there was some other stuff that I was probably a bigger deal. Those, for those who don't remember, like the big scandal of Dan Quill's vice presidency

was that he mispelled potato, which like if only we could go back to those days. It was legitimately embarrassing. He was at a spelling bee and he told a child that he spelled potato wrong when the child did not spell potato wrong. Yeah, that was a little brutal. That's, it is the word potato.

So seems the card he had, and this would have totally happened to me. The card he had that told him the correct spelling of potato was the wrong spelling of potato. Not only that. And you're like, I don't know, the card probably is right. What do I'm Dan Quayle? Right. I don't know. Hank.

This is a spelling B card. Hank, just to be clear, though, we need to burnish the legacy of Dan Quill. We need to emphasize the many amazing accomplishments of Dan Quill's vice presidency so that he will listen to the podcast and think to himself, you know what I should do? I should make sure I end up at Crown Hill, home of more vice presidents

than any other location on Earth. Dear vice president Dan Quill, the thing I already said, you are, you live in Arizona, but you know in your heart, and deep in your genes, and your bones, and your body, and your blood, you're an Indianapolis boy. We're an Indiana boy anyway. Those amber waves of grain, those are yours. Those...

This is mostly amber waves of corn, but go on. The white river? Wow. It speaks your name with its noises. It just says, It's a great world. It's a great world. It's a greatail. And the straight straight streets, they spell out, with their straight straight lines, in angular letters, Quail.

And there's probably a quail. When we're gonna make the state bird, you're the quail. Even if we don't have a lot of them. Do you have quail? Probably. Probably. Yeah. We're gonna do that for you.

You need to get rid of it. And look, in Arizona, you'll never be a true part of the land. Because it's so dry, everything just fossilizes. You need to be in a wet place, like Crown Hill Cemetery. So, sincerely, your name. Print. First off, God forbid somebody actually does that Hank because I think it was actually pretty good.

Even the river whispering Dan Quill. That part was good. The power I was like, Dan Quill, your body deserves to be moist was a not great That's that part. Please don't include that if you write and by the way the vice president Quayle if you're listening I Look we all die and I just want to make sure that you and I end up in the same place my friend and that place is crowned hill cemetery in Indianapolis I think a lot about John Green's grave, because I think it matters to him a lot.

I think about it more than I think about my grave. I know. It matters to me a little. It doesn't matter to me a lot. I'm not. I think it matters to me more than it matters to you. I'm not like James Winkham Riley. I don't need to be buried top of the hill. Like I think I'm some Mr. Fancy pants. I want there to be something special.

I want you to come with something good. And like, you being like a John Green responsible for Dan Quayle's buried right around the corner. Like that's what you really took out of the life. A novelist of YouTuber, father, husband, man who oversaw the recruit Dan Quayle to Crown Hill campaign. Oh man, I bet I, oh gosh, I bet if I read Dan Quail's books I probably would be like oof, niche.

Well, I don't know that Dan Quail and I share values. That's not, that's not what it's about. It's about believing. We want to share some good wet dirt. It's about believing that Indianapolis is the right home, really for all dead vice presidents. And I want to also reach out to some of the vice presidents who never became president, who, or I should say, haven't become president yet, vice president quail,

because the arch of history is long. But, I want to. And presidents are very old. I want to reach out to some of the other vice presidents who have absolutely no connection to Indiana. You know, like, I want to write like, who is that guy? Lloyd Benson? Did he become vice president?

He is here out. I don't think so. That's an unfamiliar name to me. You got, here are your options. Okay. You got Al Gore. I want to reach out to Al Gore. Somebody who has absolutely no connection to Indiana and be like, listen man, you want to be a staff

on the Vice President tour. You need to be buried in Crown Hill. We've already got four of them. Yeah, and Kamala Harris too. Well, dear Vice President Harris, I know you're 57 years old. No, no, no, she's got a good chance of becoming president. We only at Crown Hill, we only want Vice President. No, I'll take Joe Biden.

I think Joe Biden should be at Crown Hill too. No, no, that's too much. No, we already, we've got one president, Benjamin Harris, and that's all we can handle. If we get two presidents saying people are going to start coming to Crown Hill, will he, nilly? We're going to have, we're going to have one of the leading tourist destinations of America. We asked a question. We have not asked a question, but I also want to tell you about my new

podcast idea. Is it this? Because it's not. Oh God. What? What's happening? We have not asked a question yet, Hank, but I need to tell you about my modifications. I don't want this like dear Hank and John just to become this weekend modifications, but can I tell you about the absolutely, truly, deeply mortifying thing that happened to me on Wednesday? Yes. Okay, so I'm on the set of the Turtles

All the Way Down Movie. It's the third day of shooting. I don't know most of the people, but I've like tried to be, you know, friendly and to meet people and everyone is really nice and it's incredible to have all these people pouring their love into this story and it's just an I'm it's an amazing experience and a young woman who I think works as a as a grip doing like construction stuff. I don't really I don't really

know what everyone does but I think that's what she does. She comes up to me and she says I'm sure lots of people have let you know about this, but I just want you to know. I just want to make sure that you know that there's a huge hole in your pants. Ha ha ha! It's that well! And I was like, what do you mean? You're sure a lot of people have let me know about this, and she was like, well, it's been there since this morning. And you, and maybe you're just the kind of person who just lives that way? Well, so then I was like, oh my God. And I was like, so I was talking, I was saying how embarrassed I was

as I was like walking backwards back to my car. Sure, sure. And the director of the movie, Hannah, God bless her, said, oh, I thought it was a fashion thing. Where was the hole in the seat? I would say. You know, the let you can say leg. It was the very upper leg.

It was in the upper upper leg. It was in the upper leg. It was near the pocket. It was near what many people call the upper leg pocket of the jeans. And I was like first off Sandra. Thank you. You are a hero indeed you are the everybody else is it everybody else is a disaster you are the only hero on this entire movie said everyone else is a monster everyone on nobody else

gets any points but you get all the points so that was nice all right let's answer good questions from our listeners. All right, Hank, this is supposed to be a podcast where we answer questions from our listeners. So let's try to do that beginning with this one from Leah who writes, Dear John and Hank, when my now husband and I started dating in high school, he wanted to be an astronaut like most people. But the thing is, the possibility of that happening over time has become higher because he is currently an astrophysicist working for NASA.

I am terrified of the idea of my partner being strapped inside of a giant rocket that is propelled into the cold dead reaches of outer space. Well, good news, Leah, as Hank is about to tell you, not actually that cold. Just very, very dead. Obviously, I want to support his dreams, though. How do I cope if and when my partner actually does end up rocketing into space? Pumpkins and penguins, Leah.

Well, Leah, first of all, I think that your partner probably has a higher probability than once, but still. Still low. Not, still pretty low. It's not easy to become an astronaut and there are not a lot of seats to get filled. But it certainly is a thing that happens to real people. It's a real job that real people have and they go to space.

It seems to be getting safer as time goes on, so that's good. But it is definitely a dangerous job, and there are lots of people who have dangerous jobs, and they have partners, and it is not comfortable. Yeah, that's the first thing I'd say, is that you're not alone in this. You know, you might be near alone in terms of astronauting, but you're not alone in terms of having a partner

whose work is dangerous and whose welfare you worry for That said like a part of Being in a relationship is making space for that other person whether you know it's a friendship or a romantic partnership or whatever and Part of making that space is understanding that they take on different risks than you take on and that they have a different Expectation of risk that said I think it should be a conversation. Like I think it should be an ongoing conversation where you're like, Manature does seem a little sketchy

up there. I don't, I wouldn't be afraid to say that. But like I was thinking like, when I read this question, if Sarah wanted to go to space, which admittedly is hard to imagine, but if Sarah wanted to go to space, I would be like, you know, just so you know,

I'm gonna stay here so that there's somebody else. Yeah, it's definitely not good to put two parents on a spaceship at the same time. Yeah, I'm gonna hang out here, but, but you know, if this is something you really wanna do, like come back. Yes, it's cool and I get why it's cool and I get why you would want to do it.

And I don't. I mean, the other thing is it's such like a, like it's particularly nerve-racking. Like there's gonna be a countdown and everyone's gonna be watching. Oh God, I would be unbearable. I don't really know how to deal with the anxiety of a moment like that.

I can't even like watch my, like when my soccer team, not me, other people, strangers I don't know are taking penalty kicks in a high-stress situation, I can't watch it. I couldn't, I couldn't, I, oh yes, that's, it's, that's it's Honestly, it does seem very stressful. I am deeply sympathetic to Leah in this situation John this next question comes from Jody who asks dear Hank and John whenever it's sunny I like to go out and pull dandelions in my yard and I keep at it until I fill a five gallon bucket and then I stop for the day

I'm sorry. Can you can we back up again? Can you say the first sentence one more time, please? Whenever it's sunny, I like to go out and pull dandelions in my yard. One more time, please. Whenever it's sunny, I like to go out and pull dandelions in my yard. Can we just roll it back just to this word that starts with the D, and can you say that four times

for me, just right in a row? That is not pronounced dandelions. Just four times, please. Dandelion, dandelion? Just four times, please. Dandelion, dandelion, dandelion, dandelion. All right, you got closer the way I'm hearing it. And I don't like to criticize an unceasing, but the way I'm hearing it is if you think

that it is actually dandy lions, like fancy lions. This is like much of a fan. They kind of look like a main, like a main they're like yellow. Yeah, yeah, no, I get but it's not but it's it's dandelion dandelion dandelion That's how I've always said it Like almost like Dan B lion, but with a duh dandelion And you say right you say like dandy lion like you and you say it like dandy lion say it like, dandy lion. Like, and you say it like, dandy lion. Like, it's a dandy lion.

Which I like. It's just, yeah, okay, great. No, I like it. I like it. I just, I don't think it's technically correct, but I find it very, very good. No, no, I've got gone and looked, and it's definitely pronounced dandy lion.

Yeah, that's how I've always said it, but I like your pronunciation better. So, I think we should convert all of us. Right now, it's dandy lions from here on out. said it but I like your pronunciation better so I think we should convert all of us right now it's Dandelions from here on out. Weakipedia, anyway. You say weakipedia. And then the thing about the Wikipedia thing is that your pronunciation at least in 2007

was correct. Yeah, well it's definitely on it. They wanted weakipedia. They called weakipedia but it just like overtime time became Wikipedia, whether they wanted it or not. Yeah. And that is indeed how we are going to make Dandelions happen. One day at a time. I mean, when you say Dandelions, it sounds right to me. So I know that I'm not like making this up. Yeah, no, I love it. I think I want, I'm a 100% in favor of it. It's Dandelions for me around out. Anyway, the question is, uh, between of it. It's Dandelions for me or on out.

Anyway, the question is, between the sunny days, the Dandelions are always growing. At this rate, am I going to ever get rid of all of the Dandelions in my yard? Is this a pointless and unending task? Is it worth it to just embrace the vitamin D and fresh air? Yardwork makes me grody, jody.

If you like pulling Dandelions, it sounds funny toody. If you like pulling dandelions, now it sounds funny to me. If you like pulling dandelions, pull dandelions. Yeah. If you start to see them as like a scourge that makes you a little mad to see every individual dandelion, you're gonna be in a bad place.

At least if you're in my town. You're gonna have a bad life. Because there's no controlling the dandelions. Every park is full of them. Every yard is full of them. There are a couple of yards that that use like a weed killer to kill the dandelions and also every other broadleafed plant. And so we have like violets that grow like volunteer in our yard and put the weed killer down we kill them as well And they smell really good and they look really cute So I like them. Yeah, and I don't want to and so it's just like, you know We pull the Andy lines to not have as many, but we don't pretend that we're gonna get rid of all of them

well right now from the Edge of a very small wilderness here in suburban Cincinnati. I can see approximately 650 dandelions. I'm trying to practice the pronunciation. Approximately 650 dandelions. I feel like there. Approximately 650 dandelions there. I think I got it. It's emphasizing the approximately 650 dandelions and there's a car alarm. I bet the people who are making the movie are really mad right now. I bet they're super annoyed with whoever that is. That's gonna be fun for them. But yeah they're it's like trying to get rid of all the honey suckle. Just picking them out

one by one. That said if you pick them out one by one there's lots of edible parts of dandelions that you can enjoy. I pulled a dandelion the other day and it came out with a root that was like a carrot. It was like as long and thick as a carrot. Apparently you can eat those. I didn't eat it. I mean, you can definitely make tea from dandelion roots. I've done that before. But in general, if you want to know about how to make your dandelions delicious I recommend the TikTok of Alexis Nicole Fantastic. Yes, so do dig them out as it pleases you as it pleases you and eat them if you want if it pleases you Yes, all right

I think we have another question this is from Jordan who writes dear John and Hank what are some words and phrases that I can use when going to art exhibits with my more high cultured friends that will make me sound Knowledgeable or at least less stupid. I feel like I shouldn't keep looking at paintings and saying I like the vibe of this one Vincent Penguins Jordan. Well first off. I actually think I like the vibe of this one is a really good response Jordan well first off I actually think I like the vibe of this one is a really good response Secondly, the thing that you can do when you are looking at art to sound the smartest when you are with your high-cultured friends Is to ask them to talk to you about that artwork Because nothing makes you seem smarter than letting your friends talk because if you just let your friends talk at the end of it, your friends will be like, ah, what a smart person that Jordan is.

He allowed me to talk for seven straight minutes. This is what the high-cultured people want. It's to be listened to. They want to opine. And so you give them an opportunity to opine. But so you say, so you say, why do I like the vibe of this one? Right. And they say, oh, it's the balance, it's the contrast, it's the texture.

Right. And they say, well, in the early 60s, as I'm sure you know, an awareness of materiality was emerging. And with that came the question of the thingness of a thing. And when does a thing, a attained thingness and all that came the question of the thingness of a thing and when does a thing obtain thingness and all that stuff and I mean Sarah read this book once called it was called like it was called something like the anxiety of chromatic engagement oh yes I have that you know I have most of the major anxieties, so I do... Including the chromatic engagement.

I can certainly feel anxious around chromatic engagement. Like right now, I'm chromatically engaging with the redness and the yellowness of the jiffy lube logo, and it is provoking some anxiety for sure. Yeah, it's meant to stand out. Yeah, to cause an emotion. But I think some rules of thumbs air gave me when we first started talking about our, where one, ask a lot of questions, don't make a lot of statements,

which I think is really good advice, just in general. Like, two, when you're talking about an artist's work, you're talking about their work, like their work in general, not just one work. When you're talking about one work, you're talking about this work, or a work, or this group of works. And the other thing is that when I was accustomed to saying modern art, a lot of times what I actually meant was contemporary art, like art being made after 1960, or art being made now, or whatever. And so modern art refers to a

specific moment, the moment of modernism which has passed. This is bad. Why? Because words ideally mean the thing that they mean when you're naming things. And I'm not in a way. Well, and this is yes. Yes, and this is hard. And chemistry has no, has no, or biology. We have no leg to stand on here. We name things terribly. Sometimes great, sometimes fantastic. But oftentimes it's like, how do you say it in Latin?

Right, right. So why didn't you just ask how you say it in English? Yeah, what's the worst version of this? How can we make this the least approachable thing in the world? And that is definitely something that the art world does. And the art world does that partly to build up walls to increase the perceived value, the perceived luxury goodness of the luxury good of an artwork.

Yeah, like that is, like that's not a coincidence that the art world sounds so stuffy and fancy. Now there are moments like when you dig really deep into anything you need a certain precision of language. This is something we've talked about before like when you're an expert in biology you need a precision of language that you don't need when you're talking about biology for regular people and the same is true of art history or would our area analysis or anything but Most of the time we can talk about most of what is interesting about art and art history with language that

Most people know So one of the most helpful things I've learned learned in art is that you can't say modern, unless you know what that means. And so instead you say contemporary. But isn't there like post contemporary now, which makes me very uncomfortable? No, there's sort of an emerging. There's a lot of that. We will not allow that to happen.

Contemporary is just what's happening right now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Contemporary is just what's happening right now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Contemporary is happening now, but there is like after modernism, you now hear some art museums talk about post-war art, like the sort of from the 19, say 1945 to say 1967, and then people talk about contemporary art as art being made since 1967 or whatever but like these are always changing definitions but I always found it hilarious that Sarah got an art history degree in contemporary art like it's such a wonderful contradiction in terms. Wow that's weird. It's like it's like getting a it's like getting a PhD in the history of biology happening now.

Yeah, well, I mean, you could though, you know, the history of my- What would you get a PhD in if you could go get a PhD? I would definitely get a PhD in internet communication stuff. Oh, you would, that's right. You totally would. And you might, like, that's you totally would, and you might, like that's still on the table for you. It's not. I mean, if I lost a couple jobs, like if I got awfully fired, I might. I would get a PhD in the history of infectious disease and our relationship to infectious disease, and it is very much on the

table for me. I think that that would be fantastic. That is not impossible. But I mean I would want I want to get so many different PhDs. But I mostly right now I think one of the big, like where like my interest aligns with what I think is sort of most important for society right now. I think it's like understanding how humans communicate through the internet and the impact of it and the extent, one thing I'm very curious about,

and I don't think there's been a lot of research on, is the extent, like the systems we use to build up inoculations to strategies for manipulation, and whether that's misinformation or conspiracy, or just advertising, how fast just culture build up inoculations against like everything from clickbait to conspiracy theory? Mm, that'd be really interesting.

Like how fast did we build up a, like I mean, you could look at it historically, like what happened after the emergence of the printing press? How did we come to establish an idea of truth in the wake of that technological revolution, but you could also just look at it in the history of the internet. Like we've tried to do that a few times and sometimes had some success. Like Wikipedia is a bit of a success story, it's not an ambiguous success story. And it's stand-aliance, but we but we're embracing the new Hank.

That's right. We're going contemporary. Hey, speaking of the last question, this one comes from Hannah who writes, dear John and Hank, hey, scientifically, what is a vibe? You're like, I feel like I might want to, I really now like the idea. That's a great PhD, yes. Yes, I want to get a PhD in vibes. What do you study? If you ever get an honorary doctorate, you get to choose what it's in.

I hope so. Because I would take vibes. I'd like to get a PhD in like just the vibe of this room right now. I'd like to study the vibe of this little Thick-it-a-bucket studio bushes My bucket studio You got a bucket studio John and two buckets Man two buckets and John and a fuel can Computer with no internet access no less

Men with two buckets a, a fuel can, and $3,000 of equipment. Seriously, maybe more. He can't buy food. Yeah. Yeah. Hank, what is a vibe scientifically? Hi, man.

I don't think that we're going to be able to answer that question. I don't think that science is going to have that. able to answer that question. I don't think that science is gonna have that. Hannah goes on to get specific and I think her specificity is really interesting. Hannah writes, When I get into the car with my mother or father, I can tell within two seconds whether or not the interaction will be pleasant. What's up with that energy, man? And that's so true. Like, you can tell.

You can tell the vibes. How do you know vibes? Yeah, well, this is, this, well, what I will say is not an answer to the question, but it is that human communication is tremendously complicated and we take in much more information than we know that we take in and we process it very quickly. And, you know, one of my favorite things is,

in order to sort of check myself in terms of my own, like, my theoretical ability to make judgments about people is that I can sit in an airport and think I know an awful lot about every person walking by. Which of course I don't. But my brain is making up ideas and stories about them. And it's like, that person's a college student,

that person's a business person, that's a suburban mom. You just imagine that you know who somebody voted for just by looking at them in an airport. And that's wrong, you can't, but my brain thinks it can. And so oftentimes the vibe is very much wrong. Probably not as much when you're talking about your mom and the car.

With your mom and dad, yeah. Like I think with your mom and dad, you know their body language and you may not be conscious of how they're sitting in the car or how their voice catches on their first syllable, but you know, because you have had so many previous experiences. But then I often times hear people talking about the vibe of things that they don't, of communities that they don't interact with.

And I'm like, I think that what you mean is that you don't like those people, and you're just trying to justify real quick. Yeah for sure and I also think that we fill in vacuums of information and we often fill them in incorrectly. This is a huge problem I have where I assume without with very limited evidence that like somebody is really angry or that somebody resents the hell out of me or something and then it turns out reality is more complicated. Right, like you got the vibe right but you didn't get like the source of the vibe right? This is constant problem in relationships and with

that and that having a five-year-old like, I understand that he's mad and he's mad at me. But the fact that he's mad at me does not mean that the thing he's mad about was anything to do with me. Right. Like he's mad at me because he fell down. Yeah. And, you know, and like he's five. So he's not projecting his anger in the right way.

Like he wants to be mad and he's like, you're there. And he's like, me, which is something that we all do, we get better at as we get older. But right now he's doing that a lot, and I'm like, dude, I didn't push you. You fell, it happens. Right. Right. But I think that especially at that age, you still sort of think of your parents as extensions of yourself.

And why did you let this happen? Why did you let this happen? You've protected me other times. You are part of me, and it's weird that my right arm didn't catch me as I fell. Yeah. And I'm mad. John, this next question comes from Abby who asks, dear Hank and John, how do you think of new jokes?

When I try, I invariably just picture a tomato and cease to have any other thoughts. Tomato tomato, Abby. Hey, before I answer the question, can I just give you another little peek behind the curtain here? Sure. My back hurts. I bet that's true. Squatting on a bucket is not as comfortable as it used to be.

John, how worried, like, are you squatting on the bucket because you're like worried that the bucket, it isn't like structurally sound? That sounds like it would be really uncomfortable. There is definitely a little part of me that feels if I move my body even very slightly, I will fall through the bucket. Yeah, like you don't wanna do is like,

have this be a real old bucket that is not well That's I mean that's what I would say about this bucket. Hey, this is not like a six month of a bucket this bucket is I would estimate it's obviously in the first half of its life because it lives for like 12,000 years Yeah, it's not in the first half if it's useful life like this may be the last time this bucket is meaningfully used by a human being This bucket may be having its last Proper experience of the Anthropocene like when I turn this bucket over when this when this podcast ends That may be the last time the bucket turns over When oh my god that is so loud. I know. I'm sorry. Is it somebody?

Back it up. It's'm sorry. Somebody from the movie was backing up. It's like a semi truck from the movie. I don't, I never, there's so many semi trucks associated with the movie and I don't know what's really happening in any of them. What do they all do? Who knows? What I'm worried about, John.

I know only know the one that has diet mountain doing it. Let's do that. You don't have a doctor pepper truck. I'm worried about. Yeah. Is that you end up with the bucket breaking and not only a new hole in the upper leg of your pant, but also in the hole in the upper leg of your body. So that was a joke.

I really cannot. I cannot afford another revelation on this set. So that was a joke. And the way that I thought of that joke was, okay, my brain was like, I'm worried that John is gonna hurt his butt. And then I was like, oh, earlier we talked about a hole in John's pants, and if you've hurt his butt,

then there would be, I can refer back to that that previous and it would have been funny if i could remember the name of the director hanna something and a mark cio okay so if i could have said like it will it will be you know i can sort of call back to john's mortification of needing to go up to hanna marks a uh... a st a director who he respects and has already uh... mocked him a little bit accidentally for his pant choices

and had to talk about an embarrassing wound that actually needs medical attention. That seems like it. There is a medic on set and the thought of having to go to the medic and say, I'm sorry, I felt the room bucket while making a podcast with my brother. It's not an appetizing thought. So I think that is the thought was funny and I said the thought out loud. Yeah, so that's a lot of it, but I also think that the way people come up with thoughts is different. And this is something that's been on my mind a lot because when Hannah and I have been talking about the script with the producers and when we're all working together,

a lot of times they'll be talking and all be typing. And I, the way that I have thoughts mostly is by typing them. And I can like work off of Hank jokes. And sometimes I can come up with jokes of my own, but a lot of the way that I think through something that is such a loud noise is by typing. And, you know, And typing is... Hold on. I mean, isn't it a problem for the movie people that you're making them with?

Anyway, so for me, the way that I think is partly through typing, and it's the same way for Hannah actually, and so we'll be like writing something together in a Google Doc while other people are talking. And that works for us. But I find that like if somebody says like, hey, what's a good idea for blank, my mind immediately goes blank. If somebody says like, what book are you reading right now, my mind goes blank. And so different people have thoughts in different ways. That's what I'm trying to say.

Yeah, and like, coming up with a joke, I don't tend to sit down to write jokes. Though what does often happen is when I'm writing fiction, the characters will make jokes. Because just the same way that I would make a joke during a conversation. I do love jokes, whereas what I don't love is that noise. Oh my god. I mean, the sound is so loud. Those air, those air breaks. I know. I'm really radio-labening

it up back here. Yeah. Well, I like neck. Are you going to do this? Are you going to be outside next week for the podcast? Oh god, I'm going to go outside for the podcast next week. Probably and we're going to have competing soundscakes. Probably gonna be outside forever, which actually reminds me that today's podcast is brought to you by the Turtles All the Way Down movie. The Turtles All the Way Down movie, apparently, where it's filmed entirely outdoors. This podcast is also brought to you by two buckets.

It is literally brought to you by two buckets without which John would be having an even worse time sitting on the moist Cincinnati ground. And of course, I don't know why Hank is obsessed with the moisture of Midwestern ground today. It's a wet place. It's wetter than... It's really not.

It's just that you live in a very dry place. Anyway, additionally, of course, today's podcast is brought to you by the FuelCan. The FuelCan currently supporting my laptop, an integral part of today's podcast. And this podcast is brought to you by Dandelions, Wikipedia and Vibes. Dandelions, Wikipedia and Vibes. Probably real. At least, thank for announcing vibes. Oh my God. We also have a project for us a message from Chelsea

who writes, a shout out to strangers. I'll never meet what I'm grateful for this year. To the greens and other creators, to health care workers everywhere, to activists and teachers, to whoever invented bacon maple donuts, and to people who have sacrificed holidays and family dinners and friendly gatherings to make the world safer.

That we've never met. I see you, I appreciate you, and you are not alone. We're here because we're here. That's lovely, Chelsea. Chelsea, that was so great. Thank you. Thank you. That is gosh, I feel like I've always felt like,

or for years, I felt like we just, one of the things that we really have is a deficit of appreciation and that it helps so much me personally and it also helps the people being appreciated. Yeah. So thank you for that reminder. Taking time to be grateful for... For strangers.

For strangers is really important stuff. Yeah. We should really hank just let the project for awesome messages be the podcast. It's much better than any of the writing that we do before it. Yeah. Alright, Hank, I have a question from Willaby that I really want to ask you. Hi Hank and John. I prefer John and Hank Willaby, but that's fine. Why can't we just collect all the trash in the world into a giant ball and slingshot it out into the deep space, which will simultaneously create a new planet and deal with all of the world's trash problems. I've been thinking about this for years now, will it be?

It's great, Will it be? Let's do it. Deep space trash planet. I think the big issue with it is that it's very energy intensive to get a massive amount of trash off the planet. Oh yeah, no, for sure. It was also for it to be a planet-sized thing of trash we would need all of the mass of the earth to be trash. Well, at least all the massive like mercury to be trash. Yeah, yeah, which would be very difficult. I don't know, hang on. Trash is it. We could do it. If it's based on this liminal space that I'm looking at right now, it's probably like 600 pounds of trash just back here. That's true, but the earth is a lot more than right now. It's probably like 600 pounds of trash just back here. That's true, but the earth is a lot more than 600 pounds.

It's very weird how big the earth is and also how small the earth is. Yeah. At the same time. Yeah. Yeah. But it would cost around $33 quadrillion. Someone calculated that.

Wow. Is that expensive? Basically all the money. around $33 quadrillion someone calculated that. Wow. Is that expensive? Basically all the money. So we don't have to work together really hard. Would it be so expensive because of the fuel costs? Yeah. It would basically use all of the fuel that we have,

which we don't want to use it for some other stuff. Probably would do a great deal of harm to the environment. Oh, really? So we would be removing the trash, but we would be dramatically increasing carbon emissions because of all the expensive, all the carbon we would burn shooting the trash into space. But you're significantly bad, yes.

What if we use the slingshot? Yes, what if we want to what if we use the slingshot? Well that also would unfortunately there is a thing that is this idea Where it's not a slingshot, but it is like a basically a Basic just like a thing that spins really fast Yes, spinner and they get spinning faster and faster, and then it like, let's go of it. Yeah. Sometimes. And yeah, I remember somebody did that to me in middle school.

It was sucked. Yeah. Yeah. It's like that, except you go all the way to space. Yeah, you fly. I've got a couple of problems. I've got a couple of problems. It was very exciting, but this would be an even more

extreme version where you go all the way to space. Yeah. It's got some problems. A lot of the trash would vaporize on the way up because of the, that sounds pretty serious. And then that would be in the atmosphere. So you wouldn't want to do that to a lot of trash. Then you've got another problem

of needing to power the spinner, which then would also require some source of energy, which maybe you could do with just acres and acres and acres of solar panels or fusion reactions or something. But the great thing, I think that we think trash is a, we've got a lot of problems. I'm not saying trash isn't a problem, but I think that we think that trash is a bigger problem than it is because we've got some bigger ones. I'm not saying it shouldn't be on the list, but it's kind of visible, we experience it,

we do a lot of the sort of throwing away of trash so we see it. We don't see that the hole in the side of our house that's burning the natural gas is sort of chugging natural gas, not natural gas, hopefully carbon dioxide into the environment, it's invisible. You can put your hand up to it and feel it, but you don't really ever think about it.

And that is actually a bigger problem for the earth than trash. Well, what is this hole in my house that is chugging carbon dioxide into the atmosphere? It's the hole, it's the vent that the water heater and furnace vent through. So, good to know. Water heater and furnace almost definitely run

on natural gas, though I don't know for sure. Mine do. Mine do. But they won't. Yeah, you have your hand up to the little, your house has an exhaust pipe. No one ever talks about the fact that houses have exhaust pipes, but they do. Yeah, no, that's, wow.

I don't think I knew that my house had an exhaust pipe. It does. It's one of your biggest sources of carbon emissions that the exhaust pipe in your house. Oh, Hank, speaking of carbon emissions, we had an idea on the Patreon earlier today, and I just want to run through the viability of it. Okay. So I'm in Ohio for the turtles all the way down movie and the two remaining racks is the roast beef restaurant that Hank and I went to as a child are also in Ohio that they are not close to me.

They're actually like as far away for me as Indianapolis is and if like all things being equal I'd probably prefer to drive home, nothing against racks. But I also really want to go to racks one more time before we die. And also, like, who knows when these racks are going to close? Yeah, right. I mean, we don't know about the health of these racks. So I'm wondering about the ethics of the next time you visit me

charging a plane to go to the racks? Like, you know how the famous YouTubers like Charter Plains and like make videos were there like- Like, Lister beasted up? Yeah, yeah, yeah, we're there. Like, I'm on my private jet. What if we did that, but we just went to racks? Well, here's the thing.

Yeah. No, obviously not, but there are more economical and fuel efficient methods of flying. Like doing a private jet, we're not gonna do that. But I bet a Cessna could get us there, and like three people in a Cessna is not that much less efficient than driving. So you mean the pilot.

I was gonna say who's the third person, but then I realized. We probably shouldn't consider that a person because like, they don't care where they're going. They don't want to go to the racks. Counter argument. Yeah. Three people in a sessinot who've just been to racks and are not lying back to Indianapolis in a bathroom free situation Seems like potentially my idea of hell. You know what it sounds like is a great YouTube video

Sounds like an awesome YouTube video and it sounds like too very stressed out lives Remember the finish racks where the Google reviewer said that the ice cream machine destroyed his pants. I do not want to destroy this man's plane! I mean not to mention our pants which would definitely be destroyed. Like, yeah, the plane might recover, but I think the damage to our pants would definitely be fatal. I mean, I'm not sure I could keep my crap together, glitterly or figuratively on the Sessna, even without racks being involved. Like, yeah, that sounds very stressful to me. I do not want to fly at 900 feet in with a stranger piloting a twin-engine aircraft so that I can go to racks. I mean, it is a great video.

It's a really good engine. It's a really good engine. That's too inefficient, John. Oh, God. I mean, imagine when we crash Hank. Imagine the obituaries. Hank and John Green died today doing what they loved. Being idiots on the way to a rat.

Trying to commit to a bit. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha but you're gonna make you say, Wimbledon have been relegated to the fourth tier of English football. So, League two. League two. Sounds bad for us. So yes, we have been relegated. It is so frustrating because it actually, to stay up this year,

required fewer points than it has ever required in the history of the third tier of English football. It only required 41 points from 46 games. We could have tied every game and stayed up. We could have won any of the lap, like two of the last 10 games instead of drawing. It's just so frustrating, but we, I mean the truth is, if you don't win a game for more than half the season, and Wimbledon still have not won a game since December of 2021, if you don't win any of your last 26 games, you're going to get relegated, and we got relegated. And I mean it felt inevitable for so long that to me the real...

I mean it started to pick one moment where it started to feel inevitable. But I mean, of the 26 games that we've gone without a win we've had 14 or 15 leads and so yeah, it's just hard to conclude that anything else would have been appropriate. The people, of course, will be looking for silver linings.

I mean, hopefully we'll win more games next season. You know, we own the stadium. It's our stadium, it's the fan stadium. It's the fans club, that doesn't change. And hopefully we will have a budget that is appropriate for League 2. But there's no getting around how difficult it is for a football club to be relegated because it's really hard to get back up, you know, especially for a club like Wimbledon that don't have gigantic money behind them. And so it sucks. I'm really sorry for all the fans, all the players, all the fans I've brought into the club.

I feel responsible for this. I feel responsible for their sadness. But I think at the core, the community is still there and they're home and I can't believe we got relegated in the first season with fans back at Plow Lane like I really thought that was going to be a path to sustainability in League 1 and maybe it will be eventually but not this season. So just sucks all around. The only other silver lining Hank is that and you never root for a team to get relegated, of course. But the only other silver lining is that we will next year in week two still play Gillingham and or Gillingham.

So I still get to make that joke. That's the only other good thing is that the Gillingham slash Gillingham jokes survives. That just is Giff and Giff do. So yeah, it just, you know, yeah. So we go again. It's a short off season this year, relatively short because of the World Cup being in the winter. So won't be too long without Wimbledon football, but yeah, next season will be in the bottom tier of the football league. So we need to stabilize and grow from there. Well in Mars News this week the ingenuity helicopter did something very very cool. What did it do? It went, it flew over to the place where the parachute and the back fell. I saw that it took a picture of its former self.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it's like super freaking cool. It's like this crashed, this spaceship crashed on the surface of Mars. Yeah. And can they kind of tell? It's wildly awesome. Can they kind of tell from photographing the crash site via helicopter, like if things went about as they hoped they would go? Yeah, yeah, it went as expected.

And you know, I don't know what they learned from this. I don't know if you can say, ah, good, well, this is exactly what we can say. Right, Martian gravity and geology is just as we expected. My guess is that it's more like we wanted to take this picture, but like maybe there's some good science, at least about the behavior of the spacecraft that is useful from the perspective of these photos. But like some of the weirdest photos of the surface of another planet I've ever seen.

Just to see like a literal crashed spacecraft on Mars. It looks very human for lack of a better term. It emphasizes that humans have made a pretty significant intervention. We're not just living in the anthropocene. Mars is also living in the anthropocene. Oh, but yeah. Mars is anthropocene is just getting started. And people are like, oh, I'm sure people hearing that are like, oh, that's really bad

news. But I would totally disagree. I think Mars having an Anthropocene is the best news Mars has had in some time. Yeah. Yes. I think that it's probably, you know, better news for Mars than it is for Earth than someone else. Oh, oh, yeah.

No, I... Well, it Mars than it is for Earth in some ways. Oh, oh yeah, no, I... Well, it gets a little rough for Earth. Yeah, for Earth, it's more complicated. Mars is probably like, oh, this is nice. Mars is like, oh, what's that? Someone's having a tickle. This is kind of fun again. It's been a while since somebody tickled.

Yeah. Yeah, I did see a couple of comments that were like, oh, now we're littering on another planet. Right. And again, I did, like, trash is a problem. But I think that it matters more, oftentimes, it matters more in terms of like what it looks like to human eyes than to the actual environment

as it is inside of. Yeah. Well, I just think the thing to emphasize in general is that we are a catastrophe, but we are also much else. Like we are complicated and embracing that complexity, I think, is key to being able to move forward. Yeah, I agree, John.

Well Hank, thank you for potting with me. I cannot wait to get off of this bucket. Well, you don't can't get off of it yet, because I'm going to make you go record this week and stuff with me. our patron-only podcast. Patreon.com's like Dear Hengajon, which is also where you can see three pictures of my sweet, sweet setup. This podcast is edited by Joseph Tuna Meticchets produced by Rosiana Holtz-Rohas. Our communications coordinator is Julia Bloom.

Our editorial assistant is Deboki Chakravarti, the music you're hearing now, and at the beginning of the podcast is by the great Gunnarola, and as they say in our hometown, don't forget to be awesome.