Dear Hank & John - 452: The Brotherhood is Broken

Episode Date: May 13, 2026

Do humans have instincts? Why are there so many “French” foods? How do I introduce Formula 1 fans to the Indy 500? Why does beautiful music give me goose bumps? What’s the difference between Hank Green and Tom Hanks? …Hank and John Green have answers! If you're in need of dubious advice, email us at [e-mail] us for monthly livestreams at patreon.com/dearhankandjohnProduced for Hank and John Green by ComplexlySee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening to a Complexly podcast. Hello and welcome to Dear Hank and John. Or as I prefer to think of it, Dear John and Hank. It's a comedy podcast where two brothers answer your questions, give you dubious advice and bring you all the week's news from Morrison, AFC Wimbledon. Oh, boy. Is that Dracula? John.

Yeah. If pronouncing my bees like they are vs makes me sound Russian, then Soviet. Ah, I see how you put this all together. How are you doing? I'm good. I'm a little embarrassed. You should be. Not least because... Other than that, I'm doing okay. I don't think it was quite far east enough to be fully Russian, but that's neither here nor there.

You're doing your best. I'm doing my best. I'm feeling okay, you know? I just... When there are certain times I've been sick, when it just takes a long time to get better. and you're a little better every week and that's all that matters. This bout with shingles has lasted almost as long as your bout with cancer.

Don't think I haven't thought about it. People always say like, you know, you got a pretty easy with cancer, maybe like you learned enough that it was worth it. But this is an example of how it probably wasn't. I'm not sure people always say that. Do people say it to you? People have this said it to me several times.

Yes. Like in interviews, You're probably grateful to have had cancer because of all you learned from the experience. You got all this insight. And like this, you know, I am obsessed with cancer now. So I've got a new hobby. Right. Which is valuable, but not.

I remember when I was being interviewed about looking for Alaska half my life ago, which is a book about grief and loss and forgiveness and guilt and everything. Sometimes people would say to me, like, are you, you know, are you, are you grateful for all that you've learned from your experiences with grief? And the answer to that question for me is no, I'm simply not. And I know that that's not the answer you're looking for, but I'm not. Have I learned stuff? Of course, but I could have learned it cheaper. Yeah. Yeah, you have much more experience with grief than I do, which terrifies me because I am not ready. It's not something you get good at. It's not like a skill to be perfected.

Is there some amount of at least like knowledge going in that feels safer? No, not really. Like when I think about... Then I definitely am not jealous. But again, I think I could have gotten this cheaper. Maybe there's a sense in which I know that everyone dies, you know, and that that's okay. That's how it's supposed to be. That's how the whole universe was set up.

Hmm. Supposed to be is so interesting to me. I know, of course, you don't think that's the way it's supposed to be, because you don't think anything is supposed to be anything. That's correct. You think things just are. Okay, counter argument, secular counter argument, Hank. I'm going to push back against that a little bit. Okay.

The universe was set up with certain rules, and we don't know what set the universe up or how the universe was set up. We don't know what with the match of the universe. Sure. We do know that it was set up with certain rules and one of those rules. In fact, I would argue the central rule is that things die. Yeah, I mean, yeah.

Well, the central rule, if I'm going to state it in like my sciencey way, is that things fall apart. You know, like eventually randomness wins. Like the tendency is toward things not being organized. So anything that looks like an organization to you. star or a galaxy or 30 trillion cells trying to maintain homeostasis. Yeah, those things are all temporary for sure. I don't

see that as I see that as an inevitable consequence to some extent of there being stuff. The weird thing is that there is... It's not inevitable no, it's not inevitable. Things falling apart is inevitable. The non-invisible things is things sticking together

for a little while. You're right in the sense that you're half right. There is nothing inevitable about the way the universe got organized. It could have been different. Yeah, but things falling apart. Like entropy, randomness, like tendency toward randomness is an inevitable consequence of any amount of organization. Only in a universe with the current rules. In fact, it is math the way two plus two equals four. I think. I'm pretty sure. I think that,

I think that, like, that's how entropy is understood in math. But, like, things could have fallen apart immediately. And that's the weird thing. Or things could have never formed. Yeah. Yeah. There's no reason that we know of why there's stuff in the universe. So there's no reason that we know of why things formed.

Yes. The weirdest thing is that there is any organization at all. I think it's funny that you find God to be in. utterly unrealistic construction in a universe when there's no reason for why there's stuff. Yeah. Well, let me tell you, I have a, I have like a different version, like a different definition of atheism than most atheists. Okay. Which is that I don't think that the gods of my world exist. Oftentimes, like these theological arguments, like move from being like, okay, so we've got Christian God and then you're like, okay, well, Christian God, I don't think that that's

a thing. And then they're like, the goalposts move to like, but maybe there was a first mover. Maybe there was a person who pushed the button. And I'm like, that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about like the construction of religion in my society, as I understand it, is a technology that we developed in order to have cultures work, in order to have societies. Yeah. It's a, it's a, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's too useful. Like, the idea of an afterlife is too useful for me to think that it's, that it could possibly be real because. And so there's this baggage that comes along with it. But like the idea of there may be being something that you would call a God if you found out about it, sure, maybe. Right. But that's very different

from all of the discourse around the religions as they exist. I'm not particularly invested in the afterlife, I have to say, and neither in my reading of the Gospels is Jesus. How do you feel about the Old Testament? Is that where the afterlife lives? I don't know. No, not really. I think it lives primarily in, I mean, look, there are references to after, especially in the rest of the New Testament. There are lots of references to the afterlife. I'm not, I'm not pretending that there's no. I couldn't have told you that the Gospels were different from the New Testament. That's great. There's four Gospels. Those are the life and teachings of Jesus. And then there's a bunch of other books in the New Testament that talk about other stuff, like what the apostles did and how the

end times are going to look and all kinds of other jazz. But, um, the gospels are where it's at for me. He's a gospels boy, everybody. I mean, this stuff is very complicated, and probably this podcast is not the place to get into it, but I don't think we're going to get to the bottom of it today. But I think Jesus was a historical figure who almost definitely lived. We have more information about Jesus's life than about most people's lives, who we assume to have been historical figures.

And so, yeah. But that doesn't mean that the historical, Jesus and the Christian Jesus line up particularly well or any of that stuff. I'd love to, I'd love to ask. I'd love, if I could go back in a time machine, I would definitely go to like 12, 20, 22 AD. 12. 22 AD. Oh, 22 AD. Yeah, yeah. Jesus is, is he working at that point? Is he up to it or is he just building houses? He's like 26. I just would like to inquire how things are going for him. How's he 20? How's he, how's he 26 and 22? He should be 22.

He was born in 4 BC. There was a miscalculation. That's awesome. I know. That's a great fact. It's great fact. Great fact. Well, I mean, we think he was born.

Look, we don't really know any of this stuff. That's why it's possible I'd get to 26 BC or 26 AD and be like, wow, well, that's disappointing. And now, and now there's no antibiotics. It turns out I'm 200 years before. Turns out none of this stuff, this stuff happened a late, like a long time ago. I'm 40 years later. He passed this up so bad. Jesus is super dead.

Yeah. Then there'd be a 13th apostle who would be me. That would be weird. It would rewrite all of history, you know, because I'd be like, I would have found Jesus first while he's still a carpenter, and I'd be the anxious apostle. There's the one that there's the one that Jesus especially loved and the one that Jesus especially found a little bit much. He's like at the last supper and you're like, everybody's got the same food?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is there any way that we could not like just stick our hands in the plate to get? It's just gross, guys. Oh, you'd die immediately. Don't worry. I would never. If I arrived in 26, I would never make it to 33 when, or whatever, when Jesus was actually arrested and whatnot. John, do you want to really get into it in a different way with some questions from our listeners?

Great. Because this was wild. Yeah. All right. We never know how this first segment's going to go, but it usually doesn't go that way. We don't plan it, that's for sure. This question comes from Charissa or Carissa. Dear Hank of John, I saw some buzzards circling in the sky,

and I just think that it's so interesting that things have instincts that are so deeply ingrained that they all just do them, like a spider makes a web or birds and butterflies and fish migrating. Do humans have instincts that are like that? Pumpkins and penguins, Charissa, or Carissa. Good gracious. We have almost nothing but. Well, I'm not convinced that we do have anything but. Like, on the topic of, on the topic of everything dies and, you know, we live in a universe that was determined in its first spark.

Yeah. If we live in a fully deterministic universe, that includes us. And so there's no, if there's no free will, there's no choice, there's no, it's no, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it. It's all just going the way that it was always going to go. It's so interesting. Like, where is the line? Where do you? But, like, I think that it's really illustrative to, like, find a place where it's like,

that was an instinct. I had one. Toboki just, and I just spent, like, our entire pre-call talking about instincts. And she was talking about pregnancy where she was like, and suddenly I needed apples. And, like, I'd never cared about apples before. And then I was, like, in the kitchen all the time, chopping apples. And then she, you know, she was like, and then there's often. time there's a nesting instinct where suddenly you feel like the house needs to be clean.

Yep. So there's that, which of course I didn't, don't get the chance to experience, but just like something like disgust, you know, like put your face in a dumpster and be like, ah! And that's just, that's just an instinct. That's what instincts are like. Are autonomous functions of the body's instincts? Like, is it instinctual to, it's not instinctual to breathe? Yeah, the beating of the heart is not an instinct.

That's just happening. It has to, like, hit the brain somewhere. But I guess maybe it doesn't. Like, you know, sometimes you can pull your hand back from a hot stove without the brain getting involved. And that kind of also feels like an instinct, but maybe not. I don't know. I recently read this book, you've been pooping all wrong. Yeah.

Which is a great book. I made a vlog brother's video about it. I liked it so much. And in that book, she talks about how many neurons there are in the gut. Yeah. In the stomach. They like the stomach as its own brain. Yep.

It's doing a lot. It's very upsetting to me. Yeah, I mean, it's doing a lot. I wouldn't be too concerned about it being a decider because, like, how's that even different than the brain? You know? No, I know. The point is that the decisions are occurring, many of them without me being conscious or aware of it, which is its own kind of body horror story, right? Well.

But also, it's just what it is. Like, I am instinctually disgusted. I am instinctually... Compelled. Beauty. You know, like all these things. Smell. Uh-huh.

Hunger, taste. Yeah. All this, yeah. Thirst. The cries of a baby. The feeling of being in bed and being like, I got to turn to the other side. Yeah. Like, what is that?

You know? Right. And it's like, it's like so difficult to not do because it's an instinct. And that's like, I think like that's, like, I think like that's, There was this long period of time where we thought that, like, we thought there was like a series of thoughts in, you know, European Western tradition that like animals were instinctual and people worked. And I think we've like fully erased the idea that animals are just instinctual and we like understand that they have experiences that drive their instincts. But but what most people haven't yet come along with is like we also, like, that's also what happens to us, that we just have these sort of. sensations, and that's the thing that drives the instinct. The sensation of hunger is driving you

toward a food. The sensation of disgust is driving you away from the poop. Well, when you think about what babies do, right? Like, babies cry to express dissatisfaction, spiders weave to catch food. Yeah. Yeah. Do you think it feels good for a spider to make a web? I don't think, I, I, I, I, In the same way that I'd be interested to visit 26 AD, I'd be interested to be a spider for a hot minute. Yeah. If I could carry whatever sensations that they had in that away with me, I'd really like that. Yeah. And then every time I'd see a spider, I'd be like, oh, you either are or are not having a pleasant experience.

And I either will or will not feel bad about killing you. I'm going to do it either way, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, either way, you're dead. But, yeah, there may be some guilt. God, what, yeah. It can't be anything to be like a plant. I'd like to be a plant, too, for a minute.

Yeah, just to see. Experience that, you know? Get that flow of moving. Yeah. Yeah, that feels like it'd be nice. Just to have like some crisp, cool water coming up through your whole body and out your head. Mm-hmm. Powering all your, powering all your ATP's.

Wetting out some oxygen here and there. That feels good. I bet. I bet that feels good. All right, Hank, ask me another question. This next question comes from Andrew, who asks, dear Hank and John, does French have some incredibly strong influence on American food that I'm not understanding? We've got French vanilla, French toast, French fries, French press coffee?

What's going on? And why does it seem to be happening with no other nationalities other than Canadian bacon? Adieu, Andrew. Well, we have American Chinese food, I would say, first off, which is a very American. It's just, yeah, it's like Chinese. food. Yeah, but like Chinese food in America is American. It started in San Francisco.

I mean, it's from Chinese Americans, but it's as American as anything else. So I do think that we have other, we are reliant upon other things. It is interesting how much the French have deeply enmeshed themselves in our language, especially since French fries are not French. And I'm not sure that French press coffee is very. particularly French. I bet it's just that, like, Americans kind of feel like French is fancy. And we're like, let's call things French.

And because, like, is French, like, French toast is, like, a gross idea. But it's good. So if you call it French toast, then it'd be better. Also, French kissing, which is probably also not French. I bet they were doing that before France existed. I'm almost positive they were. Maybe that one's the way that, like, the French called syphilis, the German disease, and the Germans called it the French disease.

But you know what it makes me think about actually is French cut green beans? You ever had a French cut green beans? Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. My late mentor Bill Ott, one of my all-time favorite people, one of the people I admire most in the world. Bill used to work at a green bean factory.

And one time he lost part of his finger in a slicer. And they shut down the whole factory and looked for his finger for about 45 minutes. And finally, the supervisor said, Well, it's just a French cut and back it all went. So that's why I get whole green beans. It's just the French cut. Just a French cut, man.

Why was it? Oh, man, I bet that's not the French cut. I bet that's got to be just marketing. It's got somebody who is like, what do we do with the little beans? Call them French. Yeah, what do we do with the beans that we got to like slice to make them edible? Yeah. When you say that's the French cut?

But there are a lot of non-like French thing that are French things like Brie and like Champagne is named for a place in France. I think we just, I think we're just like a little bit obsessed. Well, the French have a long history of exporting food and wine and cheese and stuff as part of their cultural products, right? So like that's that's their cultural product in the way England's cultural product is fish and chips. Yeah. Eat ones. What do we have anything? English muffins.

They got, they gave us those. Full English breakfast. Oh, full English. Good Lord. What a, what a delight. Well, you want a baked bean. What a strange, what a strange thing to do to a man. You're about to wake up.

You're going to take on the world. Have all of your day's food and tomorrow's at once. Yeah. No, it's an impressive. It's an impressive feat, the full English. Yeah. It's like finishing the big Texan at that steak. house that's like a seven pound steak or whatever. I'm like, can I have like a third English?

Do you ever hear Chris Waters' story about that that he tried to do the big Texan challenge? And you have to eat a whole six pound steak, a large Coke, a full baked potato, a salad, and something else, maybe some French fries. And Chris was down to his last three bites of grizzle when he had a reversal of fortune of epic proportions on the stage. On the stage. They put you on a stage. You're on stage. And so he was on stage and he had the reversal of fortune.

You've got to eat the gristle first. That's right. You start from the outside in. You got to take the least appetizing piece. And that's another instinct. Like you look at the food and you're like, which part do I like the most? you don't know why. It's an instinct.

Well, you do know why because you've learned. That's a learning the way walking is a learning. Maybe. But I would argue that like learning itself is a little instinctual for humans. But some foods are better than other foods, you know? Like liking a Dorito more than you like a turnip is not, is instinctual. I'm not sure a baby likes Doritos more than they like turnips. It has nothing to do with babies.

Adults have instincts too? Yeah, I know. But I'm saying that you like have learned. No. Okay, just. A turnip? We shouldn't be belaboring this point. But if you were to go back to 26 AD and bring with you some cool ranch Doritos and a turnip,

there is a zero percent chance that the people would prefer the cool ranch Doritos. They would prefer the turnip. Like it's not a universal human thing to think cool ranch Doritos. are delicious. I completely disagree. This is, this is, we're going to, the brotherhood is broken. Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

You've chosen to die on such a bad hit. No, I just think that that's wrong. I think that, like, if you gave people at 26 18 cool-range Doritos, they'd be like, these are amazing. No, they wouldn't. They would probably vomit. Like, they would be like, this is a horror. They've never had that much sodium.

They've never had that much sugar. They've never experienced anything like that. A Coke? You think, you think, you think Jesus. wouldn't have loved a Coke. That's un-American. It's not just un-American. At this point, it's un-global. I don't know. I don't think that, like, I don't think that food preferences are universal throughout history. I think that there's a lot of social conditioning involved in them. A blueberry muffin's going to be good to pretty much everybody, you know? No, I don't think that's true at all. I don't think

that's true. There's zero evidence for that. And I think you're bringing a ton of your like social, psychological back baggage to this. Well, we'll see. But it does remind me that this podcast is brought to you by Coke's new spokesperson, Jesus. Jesus. He would like to bring the world a Coke. Additionally, today's podcast is brought to you by the spark that began it all. The spark that began the universe. Mysterious. This podcast is also brought to you by the French cut. It's just a French cut. French cut green beans.

Don't buy them. It's the rare sponsorship that's actually an anti-recognition. And, of course, today's podcast is brought to you by German pancakes. German pancakes. I think that's a thing. This episode is brought to you by no CD. Have you ever had a thought pop into your head that feels so foreign or distressing that you just can't move on from it? like suddenly wondering if your headache means you have a brain tumor and then Googling symptoms for hours,

or having the inexplicable urge to swerve your car while driving, feeling horrified, and then spending hours trying to figure out why you had that thought? Well, that's what OCD is like. It's nothing like the stereotype about enjoying things being neat. Real OCD causes relentless, unwanted thoughts that make you question everything about yourself and the world around you. It is scary and exhausting and can really take over your life. I have OCD, and it is highly treatable when you get the right care. I am living evidence of that.

The thing is standard talk therapy, the kind you hear about a lot online, is not recommended for OCD and can even make it worse. OCD needs specialized treatment, and that's why I want to tell you about no CD, which is the largest provider of specialized OCD treatment, connecting people with licensed, highly trained therapists for convenient virtual sessions. Their therapy is covered by insurance for over 155 million Americans, and they provide support between sessions, so you're never facing this alone. If any of this sounds familiar, go to nocd.com and book a free call to learn how they can help. That's n-o-cd.com. This episode of

Dear Hank Goodjohn is brought to you by Lisa. When Lisa first said they were going to sponsor the podcast, they offered me a mattress. And I was like, I do not know where I would put one. So I asked around, and my friend Aaron asked her teenage son if he needed a new mattress. And it turns out he's been hanging off the end of his old childhood mattress for way too long. These kids They need to learn how to complain more. So they got a queen-sized mattress for this 6-2 teen, and I quote, not only does my son now have a bed that fits his body,

the Lisa mattress is the perfect combination of luxury, support, and cooling comfort. The first time he slept on his new bed, he slept right through his alarm the next morning, which might seem common for teens, but is not normal for him. Excellent mattress company, highly recommend. So that's one testimonial, but Lisa has also been awarded Best Hybrid and Best Memory Foam Mattresses by the New York Times Wirecutter,

and is featured by West Elm as their go-to mattress partner. Plus, Lisa is committed to eco-friendly materials and sustainable manufacturing practices and partners with organizations like Clean Hub and Green Worms to help remove harmful plastic waste from the environment. They've also donated over 43,000 mattresses to date to families in need. Lisa mattresses are designed and assembled in the USA for exceptional quality and they back it all up with free shipping, easy returns, and a 120-night sleep trial. Go to Lisa.com for 25% off select mattresses, plus get an extra $50 off with promo code Dear Hank, exclusive for listeners of the podcast.

That's L-E-E-E-S-A.com. I know that was a real plot twist for some of you here at the end. That's L-E-E-E-E-SA.com promo code Dearhank for 25% off select mattresses, plus an extra $50 off. Support our show and let them know we sent you after checkout. Lisa.com, promo code Dearhank. This episode of Deerhank, it is brought to you by Quince. I doubt you have noticed, but I do like to be somewhat intentional about what I wear on any given day. There's a lot of hoodies that get thrown in, you know?

There's a lot of decisions that I'm not super proud of. But help has arrived in the form of quince because I want to open the closet and have there be not a lot of work for me to do, but a lot of things that, like, work well with each other and look good and almost like maybe I'm doing a good job of being an adult. Quince can be a huge help here. You got 100% European linen shorts for $34. You got Pima Cotton T's teas that feel the way a T-shirt's supposed to feel. You got to wear it around the house, but put together enough that nobody's got to polite, you'll ask if you're doing okay.

And the reason everything costs 50 to 80% less than what you would pay at comparable brands is that Quince works directly with the factories and skips the middleman layer. This is how you could do premium materials without the premium brand markup. Refresh your every day, with luxury you'll actually use. Head to quince.com slash dear hank for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada, too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash dear Hank for free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com slash dear Hank.

John, we got another question is from Megan who asks Dear Hank and John, but mostly, John, my husband and I are preparing to go to our third indie 500. It would be our fourth. It would be our fourth, but we missed last year because I wasn't ready to leave my three-month-old alone. to be watched by another person. Lame. This year, we will be staying with my parents, and we are taking my cousin and her partner.

The thing is, they're Formula One people. And while I am very excited to introduce them to this world, I'm worried the beauty of the indie will be lost on them. What are some of the things that will help show them the wonderful world of IndyCar and the 500? We want to go by the pagoda and see the yard of bricks, but are there any special things that you would recommend, checkered flags and milk of choice, Megan.

So, Hank, this is a pretty cool fact. All 33 drivers for the Indy 500 have to choose their milk of choice that they will drink in the event that they win the Indy 500. What's the list of milks? Does they have French milk? No, but some people choose 2%. Some people choose skim milk. It's not brand.

It's not brand. No, no, no, you don't get to pick your brand. You don't get to pick your brand. I think some people choose two percent. I think somebody has chosen non-dairy milk, which is completely defeats the point. Un-American. It's un-American. So you probably don't know the difference between Formula One and IndyCar.

To you, they both look like wheeled race cars. You do. Okay. Yeah, yeah. One goes around in a circle and one does interesting stuff. Incorrect. So the Indy cars also do interesting stuff. They also have street and road courses.

And I don't know. The main difference is that F1 is for rich people. I don't know what that means. is for everyone. Because it was European, F1 was European first. And so we're like, that's the high class one. That's the one that's sponsored by Rolex, and then ours is sponsored by other stuff. Is it more expensive to make an F1 car?

Oh, yeah. Yeah, it literally is. The whole series is more expensive. They also, like, pack them up and ship them around the world, whereas IndyCar travels mostly by truck. Here's my main recommendation. If you ever go to the Indy 500 and you should, it is the largest non-religious gathering of human beings on earth. It is a reminder of what humans can accomplish.

You call it non-religious, but keep going. Yeah, but it, I mean, it's less religious than, for instance, the Hajj. Who's to say that the first mover wasn't an IndyCar? That's true. This is what I mean when I say I'm an atheist. Yeah, we're all going to, we're all going to end up worshipping at the altar of the one true God, the 1996 Bobby Ray Hall, Penske, whatever. Yeah. No, Bobby Rayhall never race for Penske, I don't think. But anyway, that's not the point. The point is my one big recommendation is bring ear protection. And the best way to bring ear protection is to have your ear protection double as a radio

so that you can actually follow along with what's happening because the track is so long. You can't see the whole track. You only see, if you're lucky, you see two of the corners. And then also there's lapped cars, and so it can get very confusing who's actually winning and it can be kind of hard to follow. But if you're listening along, it's 500 laps. It takes a long time. Sometimes they go very slow for some of the laps and that. It's 200 laps, but yeah. 500 miles.

There you go. There you go. You're getting there. 200 laps is still a lot. That's the same. Oh, yeah. No, it's long. It's an investment.

But it's really, really fun. And it's fun people watching. It's fun to see people's traditions and the way that everyone ritualizes the 500. So you're right that it's religious in the sense that it's a highly ritualized event for hundreds of thousands of people. Everybody has their own set of traditions around the 500 and their own time that they like to get there and everything else. So it is highly ritualized. I think, yeah, lean into your particular rituals, introduce your family and friends to those rituals. If you don't have rituals, you got to make some up.

Yeah, they're fun to make up. You got to bring two Stanley's full of milk. Yep. Milk of choice. Choose. It's not just a hot day's milk. And you've got to finish those before the 100th lap. That's the rule.

What other traditions can we come up with for Indy car? Do they have like hot dogs and stuff? Oh, sure, yeah. but you can also bring your own stuff. So I bring my own fried chicken that just sort of sits in a bath of ice with my beer in my cooler backpack. Yeah, cold fried chicken.

It's not bad. I get it from this restaurant down the street. It's great. That's great, though. You could bring your own thing. Do they sell stuff? Yeah, yeah. But why would you buy their $12 beer

when you can get your own 80 cent beer? Yeah. Although the price of, you know, Hank, I don't want to be. this guy. Yeah. The price of Dr. Pepper has risen so much in my, in the last five years. Yeah. A vindy car? That it's really quite shocking. Yeah. No, no, no, not at, not at the, Oh, in general. Inapolis Motor Speedway, just the overall price of Dr. Pepper. You would think that, like, Dr. Pepper is soon going to cost as much as a gallon of gas. Not the way the gallon of gas is going,

but... Oh, that's a good point. I forgot about that. Elected car privilege. I totally forgot about that. I have an idea for a ritual, and I think this is very good. Give it to me. What's the flag that makes them all go? The green flag.

When the green flag goes at the beginning of the race. Yeah. You start your own race. Mm-hmm. It's a corn race. Everybody brings a corn on the cob. Oh, you have like an ear of corn? Yes.

Yes. And you just, And everyone around you is watching the thrilling moment at that first lap when there's so much precarity and excitement. And you're just like, mom, num, num, num, num, num, num, num, just like kernels flying everywhere. Yeah. Or you could do it at the start of the 100th lap, right? Like, you could do it as sort of a low stakes rate moment in the race. Or right at right at the checkered flag, or at the end when you already know who won.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, you're like, congratulations, Alex Palo. Nam, num, num, num, num, num, num, yeah. Yeah. I need you to cookie monster that corn. That's great idea. I love that tradition. Okay. Yeah, so everybody's got their own traditions. You got to, if you don't have traditions, you can invent them and they become traditions over time. Yeah.

And that's really fun. You should do some kind of like rhyming chant that the cousins don't know about? Sure, sure. Yeah. What rhymes with Pelo? Below. What's that? Alex Pallone. He's the most famous indie car driver. He's an important man. Yeah. I'm surprised you don't know who he is. He's like the four-time reigning champion. of Indycar or something.

I didn't know about the New Testament had more than the Gospels. That's true. You do have some lacunae in your education. That's true. All right. What's the next question? This next question comes from Katie

who asks, Dear Hank of John, I'm a choir conductor, and I often get goosebumps when my choir sings beautifully. Why and how does the music in the air translate into bumps on my skin? Keep on singing, Katie. We've got like a little bit of information like there that we've put people in like fMRIs and given them chills with with like good music. And there's some sign that people that get goosebumps more have more connection between emotional centers and auditory centers.

But like, yeah, that doesn't tell me anything about what's going on there or why it's happening. You have this vestigial thing, which is that animals that have hair, they can fluff their hair up. They've got little muscles at the base. of the hair to fluff it up and that has a number of advantages. You can look bigger than you are. You can look more threatening. You can also puff yourself up if it's cold outside and that can provide some extra insulation. So there's reasons why this evolved that are not just like to have goosebumps. But now for humans, they don't do any of those things. They just are there to give you goosebumps. Now you will get a physical chill. And this is, I think, just vestigial. When it's cold out,

your goosebumps will go and you'll be like, oh my gosh, that's so wild. My goosebumps are going, even though I no longer have hair to protect myself from the cold with. And that's just a thing that's left over. But it's also been looped into this other thing where it's about an emotional response to something. And there's almost a sense of like, I don't know I'm having this emotional response until I get this physical response. And also there's like a literal pleasure to getting goosebumps. Like it feels good on your skin. Do you ever get a physical chill, like where you sort of your shoulders go like this?

Not when you're cold, but when you're like horrified or grossed out or upset about something. So this happens to me so often that and it's so out of my control that I'll often be on Zoom calls and somebody will say something that I viscerally disagree with and I'll be like, ugh. And I feel terrible about it. This is why I can never play poker professionally. I feel terrible about it. I don't, but I can't control it. It is beyond my control. It feels that way anyway.

Yeah. I mean, we know that our emotions have physical impacts on our bodies. Like, you can get angry and your blood pressure is going to go up. Your heartbeat's going to be faster. You might get sweaty. But, like, I don't know. There's something about goosebumps that's like, first, because it's such like, it's a nice emotion. You know, it's like a joyful thing.

I don't even know exactly what to call that moment of seeing a beautiful. thing or like a couple of people do something amazing or, you know, all your friends making a lovely noise together. It's just, it's like, it makes me like, oh, God, that's cute. Sometimes there's a reveal in a book that makes like the tears pop into your eyes. Yeah. Oh, that reminds me. Have you read my book? I haven't read your book. God. It's getting stressful, Hank. I mean, I need feedback. Yeah, I know. It's like when you wouldn't make a will. And you got me eventually. Yeah, I'll get you eventually.

And it turned out I didn't need it. Well, I mean, yet. What do you mean you didn't need it? You do need it. I survived, John. I made it this long. I could have put it off longer. You beat entropy.

You did it, man. You're the one. Oh, God. This podcast is brought to you by entropy. I know. And everything else is also. All right, Hank, let's answer one more question before we get to the all important news from Mars and AMC Wimbledon.

This question comes from Judah who asks dear Hank and John, my roommate isn't great with the names of famous people, so she will sometimes call Hank Tom Hanks. This got me thinking. In the grand scheme of things, what's the difference between Hank Green and Tom Hanks, or else, how would you explain the difference between Hank and Tom Hanks to an alien? Thanks. I'm not Tom Hanks, Judah. I don't feel like there's a ton that we have in common.

Yeah, there's not a lot of crossover. Tom Hanks is interested in civics and so are you. Yeah, I think that Tom Hanks was in a movie called The Green Mile, which often comes up when I'm searching for Hank Green. Because there's a character named Hank in it. Because his last name is Hank, and the word green is in the title. Oh, yes, yes, yes. So it'll be like Tom Hanks' Green Mile. Yes, but one thing I'll tell you, I bet Tom Hanks does not Google himself.

as much as I do. I certainly bet he doesn't Google. When he does Google himself, I bet you're not a problem for him. I'm trying to get there. It was such a harder, like, journey for you to get the top of John Green than for me to get to the top of Hank Green.

I have to say, I was invested in that journey for a time, but that time has passed. As it does for everybody who's at the top of their name, you know? It like only matters for the people who aren't there. And then once you're there, that's a good metaphor for how it all feels. Right.

You really want to get to the top of the mountain and then turns out, as John Mellencamp, so memorably put it, ain't nothing up there worth having. Sometimes you get a bit of a reveal. Sometimes you get a bit of a reveal. But the main thing that's revealed was that the pleasure was in climbing the mountain, not in reaching the top. Yeah. And so I keep climbing.

You know how I feel, John? How? Like, I do like this thing where people get names wrong and they just go with it. Yeah. Like I'll never stop calling Uma Thurman, Erna Thulman, which is what mom called her once. Right. That's good. She was like, that Erna Thulman? And I'm like, yes, exactly. Of course. Yeah. Like, what a thing for your brain to have done to recreate Uma Thurman's name from scratch. And it's totally fine. It's totally fine to call Hank Green Tom Hanks. That's totally fine. It's like how in our family we call Timothy Shalameh, Timmy, Chimmy. And it brings me great joy to reference Timmy Chimmy anytime I can.

And we call Olivia Rodrigo O-Rod, which I also love. That's very good. I don't know that we have any of those. O-Rod is amazing. Alice is a big O-Rod fan. Huge O-Rod fan. I mean, huge. And I am too.

I also, I've, I mean, I've been to every Olivia-Rodrigo concert series that she's done. I've been to every one of her tours. So I am obviously also a big O-Rod fan. I think that I may be somewhat following in the legacy of Tom Hanks and trying to be like an approachable middle-aged man. Yeah. Just like fine. Not overly disliked by the public.

Insofar as the public has an opinion on them, it's not bad. I'm sure that Tom Hanks has committed atrocities and people will write us about them. Tom Hanks, there is like a Q&on conspiracy theory about him. Oh, God. I feel so bad for anyone who gets enmeshed in that stuff. Yeah. Oh, yeah, y'all. He got into it. So, I mean, just don't be a public figure is the lesson.

Well, certainly don't be a public figure of that scale. Yeah. I like that movie, Bridge of Spies. Apollo 13. That was a good one. Yeah. He's made some bangers. Big. Big. I don't know. I haven't watched Big and not sure Big holds up. I bet it doesn't. I bet that also may have some problems. If we only talk about movies from the 1980s that don't have any problems, we don't talk about movies from the 1980s. I bet Tom Hanks is like, he's kind of like the hell and hunt of men.

Yeah, I buy that. I buy that. I think he'd be, I think he'd be flattered by that comparison. All right, Hank, it's time to get to the all important news from Mars and AFC Wimbledon. I'm just back from London. I got back. Yeah. You did it. You went to London to watch a game. You knew they would lose.

And boy, did they. It was a disaster from the start. We lost 4-0, but that scoreline flatters us. It was the worst performance I've ever seen from a league one outfit, I have to say. But it didn't matter because AFC Wimbledon had already stayed up. I actually got to give the guys a pep talk. before the game. I went downstairs. And I think that I am responsible for the 4-0 drubbing. Hank. Rarely do I take responsibility for something, but I went down there and I was like,

you did it. The season's over. Congratulations. Amazing. Avoiding of relegation. I'm so proud of you. Everyone's so proud of you. It means so much to us. You did it. You did it. The season's over. And then they went out there and played like the season was over. So my apologies to the boys and Johnny Jackson especially because I don't think I got them up for the game in any way. You're like, number one thing, this doesn't matter. Don't get hurt. Exactly. Exactly. Every time, even after the fourth goal went in, the fans at Plow Lane were singing, Don's going up, oh, lay, allay. Don's staying up. Don's staying up. So the vibes were immaculate. The end of season celebration was super fun. and saw, got to see Marcus Brown, who called me his favorite human.

Oh, my God. Which is very nice of him. That's how I feel about him as well. It's Marcus Brown, then my wife, then Hank Green. That's the order. And in terms of humans. But yeah, it was great. It was a great night.

And I woke up the next morning with a fuzzy head and flew back home. So that's news from AFC Wimbledon. The season has ended, Hank. It is over. We survived. Another season of League One football is ahead of us. And there will be news. every week anyway, for some reason, somehow.

Oh, Hank, I mean, the thrill of the transfer sagas. Oh, man. Johnny Jackson's got his work cut out for him. He sure does. As does Craig Cope, our director of football. As does John Green, their guy that they ask for money. Their primary funder. This is like a Mars news, scientists, this is the thing.

It's happening. They're testing on a new ion engine. So this is like a way to. turn electricity into thrust. They use electromagnetic fields to accelerate ions through a nozzle, and that pushes things, and it can push things quite hard, and also constantly. They use 90% less propellant per amount of thrust that they get, which is great, because they don't have to have as heavy as a spacecraft, but they cannot produce as much thrust in

the moments when they're producing thrust. So you can't use them to, like, get out of Earth's gravity, but once you're out, You can use them to get a long way. And this is why we've got this potential, interesting, nuclear-powered mission to Mars. It's an ion-engine-based thing. The most powerful ion engine on a spacecraft right now is NASA's Psyche mission, which is traveling to the asteroid psyche, and it can get up to about 124,000 miles per hour. Often, ion engines use xenon gas, but this design uses lithium ions, which they tested in a facility at JPL,

and the engine got to 120 kilowatts of power, which is 25 times what Psyche's ion engine can achieve. The goal is just to keep getting even more powerful with the idea that maybe one day we will use multiple ion engines to get people to Mars. So we will have these things that can push really heavy spacecraft really efficiently. But you still won't use them to get out of the atmosphere. You'll use them once you're in space.

Yeah, I don't know if anybody is ever conceived of an ion engine being powerful enough to escape the gravity well with something heavy. But getting to Mars, it could really speed up the transit time, which would be great. What is the sort of minimum realistic transit time? It's seven to ten months. Seven to ten months. To get there and then seven to ten months to get back. That's a long...

I would not enjoy that trip. Yeah. Yeah. What I learned from the Artemis mission is like, those people are going to have to be charming A.F. Oh, yeah. They're going to have to be so nice to each other. We're going to have to be so nice to each other.

They're going to have to work together on a level that I've never worked with anyone. Absolutely, absolutely. And I consider myself reasonably affable in the scheme of things. You are reasonably affable, John. I do hope you know that. I'm glad you know that about yourself. In the scheme of things, I can be unaffable. You're quite pleasant to hang with.

I can be unaffable, but I can... Unless you've got something going on. Unless I got something going on, then I'm a real pain. As long as you're not... Like capable of diagnosing a medical condition. It's pretty fun to hang out with John. This podcast is edited by Michael Polk. It's mixed by Joseph Tuna Mettish.

Our marketing specialist is Brooke Shotwell. It's produced by Rosiana Halsrowh, and Hannah West. Our executive producer is Seth Radley. Our editorial assistant is Tobuki Chalka Vardi. The music you're hearing now to the beginning of the podcast is by the great Gunnarola. And as they say in our hometown, don't forget to be awesome. That was a good one. That was a good.

Don't forget to be awesome, I meant. not a good podcast. Oh.