Decoding the Gurus - Gurometer: Dr. K (Bonus Preview)

Episode Date: October 5, 2024

There are many different systems for quantifying a person's essential essence. You could use an Ayurvedic questionnaire to determine your doshic levels, you could consult an astrologer to identify your most auspicious dates and the origins of your personality quirks, or you could even ask a psychologist to take a personality inventory and discover your OCEAN traits.But if you want pure insight, crystallised through something that is BEYOND science, you must find yourself that very rare and extremely precious instrument- a gurometer. Sought after by kings and queens, politicians and CEOs, athletes and inventors, the gurometer is your one-stop shop for quantifying your secular guru essence.Normally, due to the delicacy of the topic and the arcane, and, dare we say, dangerous, nature of Gurometry, we keep these insights locked behind the gilded Patreon gates. Still, sometimes we think the world deserves to know about how the science and art of gurometry are progressing.So, here is a little peek at the beautiful science in action as we attempt to quantify Dr. K according to our 11(!) Gurometer characteristics. Play along at home if you dare but remember Guromancy is not something to trifle in idly.Should you want more details about the art of Gurometry, please see this previous episode for more information and if you want to know more about Dr. K then look at any of our three previous episodes. Also, it is perhaps worth mentioning that Gurometer episodes for ALL previous gurus are available on Patreon.We will be back soon enough for some full-length decodings.

Hello and welcome to the Kodi N the Guru's Gourometer edition, where we pick a guru that has been recently decoded. We measure them up against the Gourometer factors and we see where they land in the Guru constellation. I started mixing my metaphors, but that's all right. That's okay. It's all right. We have 11 factors, 11 factors that we've identified. No longer a nice neat 10, but an uncomfortable 11.

We could combine a couple. We could. That might right. An uncomfortable 11. We could combine a couple. We could. That might happen. I refuse. But I was convinced by your caterwalling to the 11th category. So that's a big spot that I can't be swayed when the argument is right. Let it never be said that I cannot be flexible. I'm so pleased you valued my input. This is great. That's right. So who are we with today? Who is going into the

grometer? Let's see, so it's not Gabor Matta, is it? No, he's already there. He's already in there. It's the other guy. Yuval. Yuval Noah Harari. Is that right? No. What the hell? We done him? Dr. K! Oh, we're doing Dr. K! Yeah.

Oh, there's Yuval. We've done him. Is he what I have to work with? When did we decode Yuval? It must have been like months ago. It was before Destiny. Sorry. Those two guys are on my mind at the moment.

I was just looking at some extra material that they've both put on the internet. And I think we'll talk about it in the supplementary materials. But just suffice it to say, Chris, we were not wrong about either of those gentlemen. There, you could just look at the recent things they produce. And it's all on a par with the stuff that we reviewed. And yeah, I'm going to talk about it. I'm done with that. You're saying we were vindicated yet again. It's hard. We never miss.

We never miss. Never miss. That's right. Never. Never. Infallible. Yeah. Famous last words. That's it. Well, so Dr. K, let's go one by one, Matt, we'll treat them up. I'll start aside galaxy brainness, willingness to talk about a vast array of subjects with great authority, and little hesitation,

willing to link all these concepts in a novel and fascinatingly insightful way. Yes. Well, let's talk about it. Let's have a bit of back and forth before we render judgment. So within the scope of his self-help, clinical help thing, which is pretty broad.

Not therapy. Not therapy. That's not his thing. It looks and smells and quacks like therapy, but it isn't. But it is including spirituality and self-actualization and psychology and psychiatry and a million things. and psychology and psychiatry and a million things within that scope. I would say that he is pretty galaxy brand. Yeah, he is.

And like I've heard him talk about all manner of subjects. And yes, he does qualify opinions about physics a little. For example, on occasion, he says he doesn't know things that well, but the amount of things that he does know very well is quite remarkable. Did he link together some, some sort of observation about physics to his, to his cosmic psychological theories in the material? Yes, many times. Yeah.

Oh, cause for a second there, I was worried I was sort of conflating something that Deepak Chopra did with something Dr. K did, but Dr. K did do it, didn't he? Dr. K did a smarter way of it where he talked about how people do that and it's not valid and you shouldn't do that. And then he did it.

So he was talking about materialization, I believe. I thought what wasn't he talking about how like, you know, he basically misrepresented modern physics, where he said that, you know, basically, consciousness kind of creates the world in its and reconciles like the quantum into He did talk about that. Interdote, yeah, inter determinism. It's about observation, you know, the quantum physics effect. So that shows that the root of the universe is consciousness. But he also said in other content that that is a common misinterpretation of that, which is correct.

But it didn't stop him from doing that. So yeah. All right. All right. Um, quantum is really common, though. Oh, so common. That's really annoying. Yeah, even even some physicists dabble in it when they get older. Yeah, when they get older. When they're too old for the laboratory, they settle back, they start to speculate. All right, well, I'm gonna give him 4.5, just because I'm annoyed, just thinking about quantum woo.

I went for four, a bit extreme there, but that's fine. I agree, that's a reasonable one. I'm in an emotional need. What's next on the grometer map? Cultishness. Cultishness, the spectrum towards acting like a cult leader to some degree. And it can include all kinds of minor forms of manipulation, uh, social

control and group out group stuff. I think Westboro Baptist church, but less extreme, you know? Yeah. Well, so I think Dr. K does do a fair amount to encourage the parasocial attachments. And he also does free him people criticizing him as a, an evil group of people. Oh yes. When he was pre- pre-bunking the criticism, there were haters out there.

You're going to hear stuff, but the thing is they're just filled with hate. Those people, um, don't pay attention to anything they might say about me. Um, I'm just trying to bring truth and light to the universe. Now that, that irritates me. That's makes me want to give him a higher score again. I'm going to give them four for this. There are ways in which I think you could go a bit lower on it, but I, I think a lot of it involves buying into strategic disclaimers and.

Disclaimers which are strategic are not worth the paper they're printed on. OK, people sometimes ask me, how do you tell a strategic disclaimer from a genuine disclaimer? And the answer is genuine disclaimers come with behavioral changes and stuff. If someone says, look, I'm not going to advance a conspiracy theory. And then they don't advance a conspiracy theory. That was a genuine disclaimer. If they say, look, I'm not going to advance a conspiracy theory and they spend half an hour advancing a conspiracy theory. That was a strategic disclaimer. Okay. That's how you tell the difference.

Well, I was just reminding myself about cultishness. And there's a few aspects, I think, which sort of he dings to a moderate degree. And one of them is around that kind of cult of personality, authoritative, or even authoritarian leadership, right? Where you claim the mantle of the authority, you are the understander of whatever it is that the group holds to be super important and people sort of must defer to your, your special insights. And he definitely does that with this clinical thing, right? He's very good at just adopting that mantle in a very friendly, pally kind of way. Yeah, but I am the doctor. I am the doctor.

I am the doctor. You remember he read out the feedback from, I think it was a subreddit or something where they were talking about Doshas just being, you know, like a kind of psychological Rorschach test that you could use to like get insights. And he was like, you know, this is really valuable. This is really, it's wrong. Fundamentally it's mistaken. But I, I so welcome it and it's so, you know, interesting that it's iPhone. So, so good to see you trying like this. Now let me explain how this works.

It was science. Yeah. He's, he's so good at being like the boss, but like, like the friendly, cool boss, you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, so there's that, but the manipulative tactics, I think, you know, we see a lot of it. So yeah, I might give him, I'm going to give him 3.5 on this. That's all right. I'm 0.5 higher, so we're canceled out. Um, next is anti-establishmentarianism, like a reflexive dismissal of the authority of institutions. Yes, yes, you there at the front.

Sir, please sir. Please, please sir. Please go ahead. We heard him many times, basically talking about how, you know, mainstream clinical psychology, psychiatry has just got it wrong. It's missing some massive truths about things. And you know, it's just a whole field is ripe for a complete reappraisal.

Most of those truths are around them, not acknowledging the importance of doges and stuff. But yeah, it was a thing that he hopped on a fair bit. And you know, that is part of his brand, right? Like he's not like your boring conventional psychiatrist. He's got a special bespoke thing that they don't know about. He combines East and West insights and he is up with the kids with the gamer lingo and their online worlds and this kind of thing.

So the, no, some people might point out, well, but he also does link quite a lot to his credentials and his training. So do the rest of our gurus who are anti-establishmentarian. And provides the rebuttal there. Yes, they do. There is a contradiction there if you think about it, but not for them. Doesn't matter. That's right. Doesn't matter for Jordan Peterson or Brett Weinstein to be burning down the pedestal that they have stood upon. But they do. No, I would say though, when I think of like the most extreme version of this, it's the ones that say everyone in every institution is lying to you all the time.

The institutions aren't fit for purpose. They need to go, he's not there. No, he's not there. More saying, you know, yes, it's important. Go to your doctor, see this. There's just these limitations, right? That you should bear in mind. And what we're doing here, you know, if Jordan Peterson reels against the clinical psychology institution,

uh, you know, saying who are they to judge me? But he is much more like they fundamentally have the right to judge me. This is what they're there for. And this kind of thing. And yes, you know, we talked about the various manipulations. So, but so I, I managed to talk myself down from four to 3.5. That's funny. Cause that's exactly where I'd already landed.

3.5 cause, uh, no, you're right. I mean, but part of, part of why he's not kicking it out of the park on this dimension, just like the other ones, I think, is that in many ways he's, he has a light touch, like he's, he's really rather good at this, you know, whereas someone like Jordan Peterson is like a, you know's really rather good at this, you know, whereas someone like Jordan Peterson is like a, you know, a bull at the gate, you know, ranting and raving, exploding and sort of lurching to things. Like Jordan Peterson is wielding a massive long cudgel, but Dr.

K has got a rapier. He is. Sorry. Um, yeah, I'm giving him 3.5, but I think he's got the capacity to do more. Oh, he can go up. He can go up from there. Definitely. Especially if he ends up losing his license or something like that.

I think we may see, or if he starts to feel that he's been negatively profiled in the... Who would do that? Who would do that? Yeah. Yeah. Grievance mongering. So I almost would have been inclined to say, you know, he does avoid this in some sense because of the positive spin that he puts on things.

But that extended section that we listened to about the, what was it? The heat mongers or whatever they were called. Like, yeah, basically, you know, the heaters and losers out there that, and I don't hate the losers. I, I, are the heaters. I just pity them. Yeah. And the other thing that occurred to me was that, that dialogue with his,

with his partner, I remember we listened to it from the very beginning? Now, I mean, it's not, that's not really a grievance, but it did illustrate just sort of how touchy he is. Yeah. Kind of pettiness. Yeah. And everybody has their petty moments, but yeah. And he like with Dr. Mike as well, you know, that conversation is a less and then passive aggressive. Yeah, passive aggression. That's it. That's how it, that's how you describe it. He is, and it's very much his, his modus operandi, right?

He's not aggressive. He doesn't rant and rave. He's not over the top with any of these things. He's quite subtle about it. And the same with the aggression, right? Or when he's wanting to let people know that he's the morally upright one. He's the one who understands this stuff. You don't. He does it in a very sophisticated way.

And I think it could give you the mistake that he's not doing it, but it's just like with aggression, passive aggression is a more subtle way to do aggression. So I still can't give him a very high score, but I'm not going to give him a low score. So where should we put him? I put him 3.5. That's where I put him, but it could go free. Can see that being a reasonable.

Yeah. I was tending towards three, so I'll stick with it given that you've... I'll go 3.5 because I got to keep, we all got to fit into our own dosha categories and that's where mine... Your dosic is 0.5 points above mine. That's right. Usually. Yes. Um, what comes next, Mark?

Number five, that would be self aggrandizement, self aggrandizement and narcissism. Yeah. Like we don't need to define this. We all know what this is. This is, this is a hallmark I I'm giving it giving him at least four for this. I'm good Yeah, okay

This might again this might strike people because one of the things is he's striking a humble pose At times at times right? That's very much. That's right He would like he's always looking for feedback and you know, we're still working this out. We're still working this out together. We're not perfect. No, like, you know, we're doing new material here. We're breaking new ground. We're not always going to get it right.

So if anyone's got some feedback, they can help us correct us. Yeah, let's look honestly, I just don't like below the surface. It's like the passive aggression, right? It's there all the time. Look, one of the things they mentioned in the video is about him wearing the hoodie with the Harvard logo, right? When this was in the disciplinary area. And it would be like me during the podcast with a big ox. That's a choice. Right.

It's the... No, you have to be careful here because you and I do like to mention our qualifications from part of the time. I had been known to mention that I'm a full professor, but when we do it, we are joking. I just, hopefully that is clear that we are joking if we were ever to do that. I do not feel that Dr. K was working. I mean, yes, yes, this is true, but also there's a difference between, I don't

think Dr. K at all for mentioning his qualifications and his expertise. That's fine. But there's a way that you can mention that, which is like self aggrandizing and versus that you want to communicate what your expertise is. And it's like, I feel like sometimes people don't understand this, but like, to me, it's very obvious where the difference is. And I've met many people with many different qualifications and some of them

do this and some of them don't. And it isn't the degree of qualification, but the degree of prestige or that kind of thing. That's right. It's not a simple thing. Like, do they mention this or whatever? Like take take McQuest, right? Oh, yeah. Like he may well I'm sure he does describe from time to time

the vast amount of experience he's had. Yeah, he mentioned Tony Hawk's, the Tony Hawk scheme. I mean, I know that that's not his main qualification. But he should, right? And the way he does it is purely informational, right? Or his experience, yes. But I've seen, you see with Dr. K again and again, him just setting

himself up on a pedestal, particularly when he feels like a little bit under threat. Like if someone's challenging my authority in some way and he'll, he'll do the self aggrandizing. When he talked about the IRB and whatnot, right? Yes. He was talking about, look, I understand many people haven't been through an IRB system and they haven't, they don't understand. Right. And that's true. So like anybody who's been through an IRB could say that, but he took that and presented it like it somehow made him... Well, yeah. Yeah. It somehow makes the topic too complicated for you to understand.

And he does. So just take it. Don't question what he's saying. That was the implication. And it doesn't work in that case with like me and Matt, because we have been through many more IRBs than Dr. K. So it doesn't sound impressive at all. It's like, it's kind of like saying I went to the training course at university and like congratulations.

I did a health and safety course at my university and don't talk to me about health and safety Chris. Yeah, yeah. Or, yeah, or ethics training for that matter. I've completed countless online ethics training things and like, yes, so technically I'm qualified in them. It doesn't mean to be ethically better. No, it doesn't. Honestly, you know, honestly, all jokes aside, even now having done those, like literally, as I said, hundreds of ethics applications, I don't think I'm particularly, I've got a particularly better handle on ethics than anyone else, right? It's not it doesn't help anyway, so yeah, we see him doing this many times

So I'm gonna put him I'm gonna get 4.5 because well look your point 5 up I'm for I'm for just because like my top line is Eric and And Russell Brown. Yeah, well, this is the thing. I think he's subtle about it And I think that's he's tricking he's wanting to trick me into giving him low scores because that's right. That's what he is. That is in our heads now. So I'm reacting against that. Maybe you're overreacting.

Who could say? Yeah, that's right. Cassandra complex. No, I, I didn't get that much of that in the content. Uh, I have heard things where he's talked about, you know, mental health epidemic and low self-esteem fierce by meals and this going on there acknowledged and stuff. But I don't get the impression that a big part of his thing is warning about the, you know, the forthcoming disaster or that kind of thing. No, he's talking about like he's dealing with an issue now. But it's, yeah, it's a reasonable one.

Like, you know, mental health problems. Like I just, I don't get a strong Cassandra complex from him in the content. I'm sure there's isolated examples, but that didn't come through to me. And I've consumed quite a fair bit of his content. Hmm. Yeah. Um, no, I agree with you. I think it's a slightly different thing where like most, most of the guru types,

they do point towards like a deep and threatening apocalypse that is happening. And it could end up beginning to sort of like, maybe I, I want to revise this particular thinkers because like it's a bit specific, you know, the Cassandra getting to sort of like, maybe I want to revise this particular thinker's because like it's a bit specific, you know, the Cassandra thing is about warning about things that are going to happen, but I think it can, like, it's kind of the same thing really, if you're talking about like a crisis or a thing that's already happened, which are happening now, right? It's just, it has the same moral weight behind it.

Well, yeah, but I'm not taking, so I would include if he was very much emphasizing an unfolding apocalypse that is here now. Like I would count that in this category, um, even though it's, you know, about something that's happening now, not necessarily forthcoming, but again, I just don't, I don't get that strong feeling from the stuff that he's saying. So yeah, I can't score him high on it. I'm going too much. You're going too.

Yeah. No, I can't score him that high either. I think there is a thing there in terms of, you know, the mental health crisis. Basically, there's some massive problem that, that the guru is, is here and is uniquely qualified to solve for everyone. AOE healing. Yeah.

Yeah. That's right. Because we're getting too many hit points damage. Actually, Chris, this is total aside. I did something weird. You know, we've never done this before. I just added up the columns. So I was just curious as to which dimensions on the garrometer seemed to get hit the most.

Yeah. I just did it for myself, just for fun. The biggest is anti-establishment terrorism for me. That's I've rated on average. I rate gurus higher on anti-establishment terrorism than anything else followed by narcissism slash self-aggrandizement. How about you?

I don't know. Do it for me. You're in the document, aren't you? Um, I thought for you real quick. Use your Excel competencies. So you're pretty, you're more, you kind of bullshit is the lowest and on mine that is yes that is profiteering is low. What's the highs revolutionary theories Cassandra complex self-aggrandizement anti establishmentarianism is the biggest for you to 195. Anti-establishment terrorism is the biggest for you to at 195. So yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Sorry

So Cassandra complex is fine. Don't you dare? Tinker with perfection. You've already So What comes next month after we should start our own little Wikipedia and you and I can have like dueling edits. Yeah. I'll lock you right. Too many changes. Revolutionary theories. Yep. Yep.

He does this. He does this. Absolutely. Yeah. Cause his whole thing is that he's blending together the insights from east and West in a way that, you know, here to four has only been done by the Yogi's and those that are, you know, with the relevant insight. And it's leading to AOE healing on a scale that we can't imagine. So, uh, yeah, and he's trained in an army of healthy gamers who can go out and act as coaches to spread the theories of healthy gamer Gigi.

So yep, that is my for me. By the way, Chris, that is another point that we should take into account when thinking about his cultishness. Oh, cultishness. Yeah. You know, that, that tiered monetization model, prosettalizing, having little mini. Yeah, the multi-level modeling aspect of it can be. Although, you know, if you want to be kind about it, it is just training criteria.

Because like one of the things I didn't notice, I don't know if I'm giving under your credit here, but I think this applies is like he releases these mental health modules that you can like go online and buy. But for the amount of content, they are like actually reasonable, you know, value. Like you get a, I'm not talking about the content and it's not a subscription model. Right. It's not a 1999 a month to get more Dr. K lectures. And they did talk about, they could have went that way, but they wanted it to be more like that.

And I don't think Dr. K is hurting for income, but I mean, with this probably gets more to the profiteering. But I'm just saying. You can mention that in the profiteering, but I just will point out while it is arguably a valid thing to do, to have a model where you've got your amazing sort of cosmic theory and then your model is to create like a whole little army of practitioners, right? Who then implement your philosophy.

I just have to say, Chris, that I encountered this in my explorations with complementary and alternative medicine several times. Probably the best example of this is color therapy, where there are these companies that basically, you know, preach the gospel of color therapy, where there's all these different colors and they're all cosmic colors and you buy them in these little sort of elixir type bottles. But the thing is the public, the lay people, you and me don't buy them directly. They sell them to practitioners, practitioners of color therapy who will then have to buy like a whole wall of little bottles of essential oils or

whatever, all the colors of the rainbow. And then they can practice color therapy with you and figure out what colors you're drawn to, which colors harmonize with your psychic energies and all of that stuff. So it's just, it is a model that it's a franchise model. It just rings my little alarm bells. Yeah, it is interesting. Cause like, I guess when we're thinking about this in the Twitch streamer

kind of ecosystem, influencer ecosystem, it would be a bit like Hassan or destiny. They would be like them releasing a course where you learn how to debate like destiny or how to. Preact like Hassan. I don't know, but like the policy, learn the political insights of Hassan. That'd be a short course, Chris. Western's part. But like that would be ridiculous, right?

It would be ridiculous, but it's not as ridiculous in Dr. Case because he's, you know, he's a trained psychiatrist and this is, but this is the kind of self-help model that you're talking about where, you know, it's one of the things that people do. So yeah, I guess anyway, we're not changing anything on our scores. This is all just, this is a side track. This is chatter chatter. We were talking about revolutionary theories. And yeah, but you wouldn't be able to have those courses without those revolutionary theories. That's the thing.

Yeah. I mean, you can't do those courses, I suppose, about very mundane, like professional development. Of course you can do courses, but you can't do this bespoke, this is a unique approach, which is completely unlike... Like you could teach a course about CBT, right? And it would be one of hundreds of courses about CBT therapy. He doesn't do that. No, look, getting back to the point, I totally agree with you. He does have a bespoke, you know, meta theory of psychiatry and trauma and, you know, cosmic doshas all melded together with a smattering of conventional psychiatry stuff.

So I'm going to give him 4.5, I think. I'm going to give him a 5 because like, yeah, as you say, no 0.5 higher. Yep. He deserves at least 1.5 somewhere. Pseudo-profound bullshit. No, no, no, no. As we established, I generally don't score people high on this. This is people using terminology. Now it can be genuine terminology, but in a performative manner as a

also citing studies in a performative manner. Okay. Well, if you do that, it's very high. So like, so there's, there's one that I'm going to go down for, which is there's no objection to using some specific terminology and explaining that to your audience who don't have that expertise, right? Saying in psychiatry, we have these three different types of depression.

We assign people based on these criteria. That's fine. That's not pseudo-profound bullshit, right? That's just using technical terminology, but you can do the exact same thing in terms of using exact same terminology, but instill it with this kind of aura of, you know, that this gives you the ability to properly understand what everybody else lacks and your citing studies, you know, not in the way of like, here's a link to this study. Here's the pros and cons of it. And here's the interpretation I would take from it.

Rather like throwing it out. Like I read these studies, we are science based. This is all science. The doshas are science, blah, blah, blah. I see him doing sort of profound bullshit in a very specific way, Chris, because what I remember from him is this pattern where he'll go, okay, so what you probably don't understand is this concept called psychic energy or something. And then you'll be screened to give a little potted description of a thing.

My mind's blanking on examples, but he does this a lot. But he's often referencing a legitimate concept that exists somewhere in the literature, and his little potted description of it is, is kind of fine as far as it goes. Right. Then he goes on having introduced this idea, established his command of it. He then goes on to misuse it and do a kind of a sweeping kind of thing. And, and for me, this is a, a form of pseudo profound bullshit.

Like it's, it is. He actually is using a very sort of superficial and inaccurate version of the thing that he's talking about, but he's using it to invest what he's about to say with a fair bit of authority. When he talked about the history of psychology, for example, that was just completely wrong. But he was referencing terms that are correct and people that actually existed. But it was all in service of this like claim that essentially the key insights of the valid part of psychology came from the Vedic system. Which absolutely is not, it doesn't follow right from any of the stuff that he referenced.

And yeah, I think that's a form of pseudo profound bullshit we haven't, like, it hasn't come across our radar before. He's really quite interesting. He has his own way of doing things. Yeah, I don't, so yeah, I think I've got to give him a relatively high score for this because. But you're going to give them. I'm going to give them four. I give them four.

Good choice. Then we have conspiracy mongering. Hmm. Hmm. Not so much. The anti-establishment stuff covers that a little bit. I, but I didn't, I didn't see him invoking conspiracies. I don't think he'd ever go as far to say, oh, psychiatry, it's all a bit of a scam.

They just try to make money, try to keep people sick. He doesn't stoop to that level. Now, like he implies that the pharmaceutical industry might have too much influence over things, but that's also yes, that's actually true. Right. And various, depending on how far you go with it. So, yeah, I don't I just don't get conspiracy mongering vibes in general. Good news. Congratulations, Dr. Kay. If you're listening, well done. You got a one got a one good good job Good job. See where hides your couplers. I can say that you did a good job with conspiracy mongering specifically

That's right. No The last two months I'll leave them to you. What are the last one last two you can put together and separate the major C fit. All right. You can let me do all the work. Okay. All right. Um, excessive profiteering slash grifting. So that needs no explanation. I think. What do you think about that one?

Well, as I said, I am aware that there are potential avenues for additional profit that he has not dug into, right? And explicitly to avoid excessive profiteering, things like subscription models and that kind of way. So I think he deserves some credit for that. On the other hand, I don't think he's hurting for income for his gamer coach system or, you know, in general, but success is success.

Um, yeah, like, like, like, like on one hand, he does do the extremely click baity YouTube titles and, and, um, things in the bait and switch there in terms of, but you know, that's so common now on YouTube. It's almost like normal Yeah, and there isn't a huge upsell. I I don't think in like a bunch of his material Like not that I've noticed so he doesn't offer some like personal sessions for like $4,000 I don't think so. I think it's beyond that No, but yeah, no, so like a I just I'm sure sure there are going to be people that say, well, I did this and this, but like, I think he's earning lots. He's got that kind of coaching system, which makes me, that's the bit that like

strikes me as the most potential, right. Um, but it's not out of line of what happens in the health and wellness space in general. So I got to put happens in the health and wellness space in general. So I got to put them in the middle, like free. Yeah. No, I'd give them a two. I mean, it's a bit like this, like imagining you got a company that's selling some stupid Inca measure supplement thing and they're promising all kinds of things.

And it costs $19.95 on the shelf right now. Yeah. Like is that excess, Is that profiteering? Is that drifting? No, I don't think it's a good thing. It's not great, but it is what it is. It's business, right? So I think I'd have to give them a two.

Okay, you go two, I'll go three. I'm probably a little high and you're probably a little bit low. Or even night overall. And the last category, I left it for you. Yeah. You and Mr. My squeaky chair.

This is my innovation. Is my, that's true. Cause my brain is revolutionary theory. Someone else's concept, which already exists and just said, we should use that. But I thought of that. That was my idea to put it in the grometer. That's true. That's true. Yeah.

Okay. So this is investing yourself with a special kind of moral authority, like excessively. So I mean, obviously characters like the Pope or something like that sort of do this, but he's allowed to. Yeah, they get a pass. The leaders of religions are moral grandstanders usually, and that's okay. The people that really exemplify this to me are people like Robin DiAngelo and also Jordan Peterson on the other side of the aisle, where there's just a lot of vitriol towards those corrupt people on the other side. And if you disagree with them, then you're probably one of the corrupt people.

Yeah. And the constant invocation of their highest, that they are purely motivated by the best possible motives and like to object to what they're doing would be tantamount to wishing hell on earth. Right. So, yeah, they're, they're kind of on a moral crusade to some degree or another, which obviously has huge guru potential. God damn, it was a good idea to put that into the grometer.

It is, it is. I thought of that. Where is he? Where's he going to go, Matt? Where's he going to go? Um, no, I don't, no, I don't. No, I don't, I don't think he's going to score high for this. I mean, you're saying that I'm going five. I'm going five.

You're going five. I'm right there. He's, okay. Explain yourself, justify that, justify that. That's what he does. His whole, you're like, maybe it's a recency bias because of listening to that thing about like every time that he speaks to criticism or whatever, he invokes that his motivations are pure and that's because he wants to do area of effect. He has to heal so many people, Matt. And that's why, and yes, the heaters will attack

because they don't understand. Like, so it's very much investing his whole thing is based on good motives. It helps people. If you attack that you are like, yeah, like immoral, like us in some respect. Yeah, like immoral like us in some respect and we are immoral very strict guys, but if you say so No, no, but we're like immoral like normal humans. Okay immoral So yeah, yeah, I get some I guess I'm part way along to agree with you there I mean the thing that I was gonna say that I noticed was that the Like he always does present his motors as very pure like Like, he's totally, he's not aggressive. He's not combative. He's totally open to all of the feedback you want to give him.

But he's, that's not quite honest. You know, like we saw that in his interactions with people. Like, he could see that the motivations there are to do things like defend himself from criticism, you know, exert his, you know, moral authority and, and project himself as being just this absolutely great guy who was just trying to do the best for everyone. So always looking to, you know, love, learn, create that kind of thing. But that's, there's just a mismatch between, he's not the Dalai Lama. Actually he's operating.

He's a very naughty boy. He's operating a mismatch between, he's not the Dalai Lama. Actually he's operating. He's a very naughty boy. He's operating a lot. Life of Brian reference for anyone beyond the age of 35. Below the age of 40. Yeah. But no, but like in reality he is, he's somewhat like he was, he'd be someone who is like wanting to shut down criticism or he's someone looking to grow his YouTube channel or whatever. He doesn't mean he's the devil incarnate, but he's not the Dalai Lama.

Now, Matt, let me just put it like this. The other people that have scored five for me, and granted we've only scored this like 10 times, but for me, Lex Friedman, Sam Harris, Hassan Piker, those are the ones that we've looked at. Okay. But I can give to Angela five. Well, yeah, I would give her five as well, but we just haven't covered her. So I'm just saying we haven't got to it. Yeah.

Those are all people I think that fit in the same way. So that's why it's five for me, but don't let me influence you, Matt. I, you know, you go as low as you need to for your conscience. Uh, 3.5 for me. Okay, that's a reasonable one. That's reasonable. So we have his overall score. For Matt converted to a percentage, very precise percentage. He is at out of 100%, 56.25. Only 56?

That doesn't seem high enough. I feel like he warrants more. I was too kind Chris. You might feel that Matt, but the grometer has spoken. You must now be silent. In my case- I wanna go back and add one to everything. All right.

Is it 60? 60% for me, which is not that much higher, right? Just four higher than... So why isn't he crazy high? It feels like he scored pretty high on quite a few dimensions for me. He scored high on galaxy brainness. He scored high on self-aggrandizement. He scored high on revolutionary theories.

He scored high on pseudo profound bullshit. But I guess there's just somewhere he's low on Cassandra complex, low on conspiracy mongering, relatively low on profiteering. So, you know, you know what the problem with the gyrometer is. What? It doesn't give you, it doesn't fit with your expectations. Right. It gives a final score.

Yeah. Well, it has a, that's right. And that's because it has this kind of linear averaging effect across the dimension Oh, you think we're waiting things? Well, that's that's for no Should be like a nonlinear function right where once you get past a threshold on Your on three or more dimensions then you sort of go up into the red. It's an exponential Like functions and things. Yeah, it's like it's a complicated, I can't explain the science of geometry to you right now.

Well, I was going for different when I was going for readings, which is an entirely separate, I mean, waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting, parameter version one night. No, waitings would still be a linear. It would still be a linear composition. I'm talking about something. I know that I know. So I'm saying this is a separate

We do both both amendments. Okay, so this will be in the grometer the full release grometer. We're still in beta Yeah, that's right or better whichever way you pronounce that Um, so with that part just to mention some other people that are Chris Chris I just want to put a beta is spelt B E T A. There's no no beta. If it was if it was beta, you'd be B A D A. No, that's not how it's felt. Let's leave it to the Internet to tell us who is right and not respect.

I don't like the confidence with which you say that. Yeah. Well, you are famously somebody that refers to matrices. respect. I don't like the confidence with which you say that. Well, you are famously somebody that refers to matrices as matrices. So let's see how correct you are in this. Maybe you are right. Maybe you are. Maybe I'm wrong. You know, I invented the matrix. I know. I know, because nobody else says that. That's true. All the people that are around the 60 mark for me, Matt, I'm talking about my scores, are Hassan was at 66, Constantine Kissin was at 64.

He'd be higher now, but this was back when we covered him and Jimmy Wheeler. So there's a wide array of people in that domain for you. People around the 55 mark. If we look up in the fifties, we've got, we've got Hassan and we've got Robin D'Angelo and maybe that's why it was coming up. And we have Gadsad. So there's a couple of people, you know, close in Europe, Russell Brand as well. But obviously Russell Brand, this was a couple of years back, he'd be up now at the tippy top if we didn't, but there you go, Matt. I think that's accurate. Speaking of Russell Brand, Chris, did you see the photograph of Russell Brand

performatively praying with Tucker? I did not. That image is seeded into my brain. I can't stop thinking about it, actually. That would be moral ground-standing in embodied form. Yeah. Yeah, I know. Despicable, despicable people. people but Matt the quickfire right? That's where we're at night

And we need to because before you add more noises to the environment You've got a squeaky chair a microphone now your vip in we gotta get there We gotta get through before you get the time. No. Don't worry. Don't worry, Chris. We'll sort it out in post. It will get sorted out. Well, will we? Let's see. I don't know how much power we have in post, but okay.

So we've decided collectively, but the way that we do this is we ask you if they are there or not, and I merely nod along. Yeah. So you say yes or no, unless you're overruled. Along. Yeah. So you say yes or no, unless you're overruled. Um, so Mono media does he present with mono media? A little bit. I mean, he does talk about the doses a lot. I'm going to go. I'm going to get one. Yeah. Stop mentioning them as much, but I think, yeah, there is a lot to be said for

the Doshi Gensai that he talked about. Yeah. Shilling supplements? Nope. And then notice he does that. Maybe he does. If so, we didn't know. Bro-icity. No. Just say bro. Just say bro. Oh my god.

But he doesn't engage your brain. Yeah, he does do that. And it's really, oh my god, it's so fake. I'm sorry. But when I hear him do that kind of those intimate, there's little, you know, folky all sees is Yeah, it's just it's not it's not authentic. I'm sorry. Um, charisma. I tell I perceive it. That's how I perceive it. It's just my perceptions. You can't judge me for that. So I charisma, charisma, I have to give him a one for that.

He is charismatic. There's no denying that it might not be the type of Christmas of the pitifuls, but it is there Yeah, you know jism appeals to some I don't think so I'm going for no because he he does use words that exist basically whether it's in the comic realm or the psychological realm strategic disclaimers. Yes. Oh, he just broke that. That particular one has smashed off. Um, yes, he does do that.

Uh, rebranding of all those theories as his own. I'll say no. No, he gives credit. I think overall. You said that I just answer and you overrule me if necessary you're giving your Lucretiousness yes. Yes. Oh, yes. Oh, yeah Never admitting error Mmm, that's that's a tricky one because he's clever. He's clever. Right? No, he'll admit error, but never fault

Yes, that's it. So if we said never. But it's kind of the same, isn't it? Like, but the thing is, he does admit. Error, he does acknowledge that he can make mistakes. He's always self-directing. He's always learning, Chris. It's a process. It's a process. Yeah. Yeah. This still just depends on what level you want to take this, this criteria to take it at the stuff to humor.

I'm merely here as a good chorus. I'm going to say yes then, because I think more substantively, he doesn't. He's, he's, he's a good guy. He's always going to be. That's all his bonus points. He got five of them, which is a reasonable amount to get. So, but he didn't score that time out. That's one of the things to recognize.

He is not a top tier, S tier guru. And I think that's because the garrometer does not measure for health and wellness spiritual guru types, it measures for secular gurus. That's what it was designed to do. That's what it's for. And this is why but so you know, I think I think I think it didn't score high because we don't have a nonlinear transformation that takes kind of whatever.

Nonetheless, Matt, this is the essence of science where you have to set aside your intuitions in the face of the hard empirical reality of 60 or 50%. I'm going to consider some alternatives here where someone who scores above four on more than three dimensions, which he did for me, gets up there, maybe not S tier, but you know, up there in the tiers. Just add yourself a little column where you can, that can satisfy you. Then leave the grometer alone.

The grometer can deal with additions map, but it's the holy, the holy aspect of it cannot be altered. It's like evolution, you know, it has to deal with what was there before. Um, so, well, there we go. But he was an interesting cat to cover. All the people's opinions are available. One great thing about the grometer is that you can score him yourself. And there is a, uh,

Official Decoding the Guru scoring sheets are available on our website for $15 each. Get some pack, buy some for your friends. They make for great Christmas presents. Yeah, you know, you said that, nine people actually. Yeah, yeah, they are. Freaking Andrew Golders of the old cliff and say, no, look, they're selling the decoding kits. But this will be, this will be our, our test. So yep. Yeah. Go and purchase your decoding the good kids. Great Christmas stocking fella. So yeah, well, that's it, Matt. We're done. We're out of dark the case piece. He can sleep well knowing we are out of

the doctor K business. We've done three episodes. We've done a Garam a day. That's enough. Banished from the DTG realm. The eye of DTG like Sauron has moved on. That's right. So relax, chill out, go to whatever realm you see fit and, uh, good game. Everyone. Good game. Good. GG. Yeah.

TG, GG. GG. All right. And, uh, and destiny, if you disagree because destiny has famously argued with people about, you know, Dr. K, first you need to listen to the three episodes in totality. It's like 12 hours of content before you, you're entitled to disagree. We demand like Jordan Peterson, you go back through the back catalog, listen to them.

That's the price of entry, the price of engaging with. We don't want to hear it. Otherwise, OK, no benchy because we've done the work. We think we went through all that content. So there you go. That's it. That's just preempting before people start saying that we should discuss it. We're open to discussing that. But you have to have done the leg.

Do the work. Got to do the work. Get to the work. Be better. They better. All right. On the leg do the work gotta do the work Be better Getting crazy map. Okay, stop it here better put the code on it's too late. Good night. Goodbye Everyone. Yeah. All right. Goodbye I'm going to be a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a

little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a You