Decoding the Gurus - Teal Swan: All Hail Source

Episode Date: February 13, 2026

Cult Season rumbles on as Chris and Matt expand their minds in an attempt to absorb the cosmic insights of spiritual influencer and alleged cult leader Teal Swan (born Mary Teal Bosworth, 1984). Our intrepid hosts explore her recent appearance on the Just Tap In podcast with Emilio “starchild” Ortiz — a beanie-wearing vessel of pure credulity, lobbing softball metaphysical questions gently into the astral winds.The topic covered is ostensibly “Major 2026 Predictions” but this is really just an entry point for discussion of the ancient origins of AI, multiversal astral contract negotiations, and, of course, the urgent need to discuss masculinity before we spiritually implode.You will learn insights, such as: how AI will eliminate ageing, guide us to SOURCE, amplify our shadow, and corrupt and deceive us ... all at once. Aliens and other cosmic beings are deeply concerned with and also not really all that bothered with humanity. Also, pop stars are apparently set to receive divine instructions to stabilise the collective psyche in 2026. And how we are all trapped in a planetary pressure cooker that will run at least until 2030. Teal is trying not to scare us, but it doesn’t look great (though it might also be great and lead to utopia).Expect astral board meetings, sensemaking redefinitions of “power” and “love”, warnings about the painful sacrifices required to join Teal’s “conscious community”, and some distinctly uncomfortable talk about opening gates and reframing mother–son dynamics. As ever, Matt and Chris attempt to decode the elevated vagueness, semantic gliding, and cosmic scaling of very earthly anxieties.All hail SOURCE!Decoding ContentJust Tap In Podcast #260: "Teal Swan – Why 2026 Is a Psychological & Relational Tipping Point for Humanity"LinksThe Gateway (Gizmodo Podcast, 2018) - Six-part investigative series by Jennings BrownThe Deep End (Freeform/Hulu, 2022) - Four-part docuseries by Jon KasbeMormon Stories #1607: Growing Up with Teal Swan - Diana Hansen Ribera - Interview with Teal's childhood best friendMormon Stories #1328-1331: Leaving Mormonism to Join Teal Swan's Cult - Jared DobsonBBC- Teal Swan: The woman encouraging her followers to visualise deathScam Goddess: The Culty Con of Teal Swan w/ Sarah Marshall

Hello and welcome to the coding the guru, our anthropologist and psychologist, to the greatest minds the world has to offer. And we try to understand what they're talking about. I'm Matt Brown, the psychologist from Australia. With me is Chris Kavanaugh, the anthropologist from Ireland. Ireland. Ireland. Yeah.

I mean, are you really Irish, though? The more I learn about Northern Irish culture, the more I realize that it's more like a brutal version of Scottish culture. It's got more in common with Scotland than with Southern Ireland. You'd have to admit that. No, no. That's a very controversial statement that you've just made because, as you know, Matt, knowing your history of Northern Ireland, you are extrapolating from the fact that

there were Scottish plantation settlers. However, they're only the ancestors of around 50% of the population. Just 50. Just 50. Well, the other 50% are from the site of the population. Ireland. I know. I'm just saying that culturally, like, because you're, you're a Catholic. I know this. So where the Catholics come from? Did they come from Scotland? I just say it. I'm just, I'm just calling it as I see it. You've been contaminated by the Scots. The Scots. The Scots. The

Scots. Well, I mean, that might be fair, but I'll let you reap the whirlwind of telling of Irish people that they're not really Irish. I don't. Whoever managed not to insult. Look, some of my best friends of Scotch. Scotch. It's not the Scots that are going to take issue with it. Irish people. The Scots wish they were Irish. That's, you know, they'll enjoy that comparison.

They do. They make better whiskey than you guys. Do they? Yeah. Do they? Don't worry. They make, both of you make much better whiskey than Australians. So don't worry about it.

That's true. Smoky, too smoky the Scotch whiskeys might have. Too smoky. No such thing. There's what there is. It's like eating smoke, eating and drinking smoke. That's my take on telescope. That's what you want.

That's what you want. You want to be slept around by a drink. You probably like those drinks that are all different colors, like red and blue and green with like fizzy sweet. Like the colors are they. Think, you know, these cocktail things, you know, the stuff that, that, that, you know, young, yumbie, young people's. Nambi. Girls drinks like young people.

strings. Wow. I'm going to get in trouble for that, aren't it? Is this your cancellation segment? I'll just say young people. Through the whole. I thought you were talking about whiskey. I was like, well, whiskey is blue and red and green like what? No. Are you, what are Japanese whiskey? Is it okay? Does it meet your quality requirements? Not as good as Scots, but much better. You know, Australians at the bottom. I rank

They keep trying to sell it like it's special, you know, and it's just, it's just rough and harsh. And I don't know what's going on. They don't know how to make it. No, Japanese whiskey is very refined. Everyone knows distance. It's been Japanese-fied, though. It's much more delicate. And it doesn't slap you around like a Scottish whiskey.

So it's not my personal thing, but it is good. Okay. Okay. Do you like port? No. I went to Porto or O Porto, whatever the name of it is. Is it where, is it in Spain? Yeah, it's a place.

It's a place. Yeah. Is that where Port comes from? Porto. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm saying that's very tough. It definitely was a place where there was lots of port and it's in Portugal.

Well, that doesn't make sense. Is it a port in Portugal? Like where the ship's birth? I think there is a port. There is, it's at least on, you know, there's water and stuff around it and boats on it. So, yeah. No, I don't like that. That seems like, it's like sherry.

Seems like a drink for a bygone age. Well, I will say that when I went there and went to the breweries or whatever, they're called where they make port, that was pretty good port. I mean, I don't drink port at any other. I've never drank port at any other time my life. But that was, that was some good port there. But this has become now the spirits show, but that's, I'm down with that. Well, you're about to hit the hard time limit, so be careful. Yeah.

I was still got for like four minutes. 10 seconds. You got 10 seconds. You've only learned with five minutes. The final thing I'm going to say is I always thought that I hated tequila. I thought it was disgusting, like, varnish, awful stuff. That's right. You think it's bad too.

And you know why you think it's bad? Because like me, you'd only ever had the cheap stuff. Yeah. I had, I, I tasted the good stuff and oh my God, it tastes like nectar. It's absolutely gorgeous. Well, there you go. That's my final word. No, that, okay.

I appreciate that. If you want the full extended cut, just listen to the end of the music and you can hear a lot of nice extended alcohol. Subscribe to the Patreon. You'll get to hear my opinions about every other drink that has ever been brewed. That's right. But that's not what we hear for today. Matt and we're past our five minute a lot of banter section. That's done. It's in the past. Now we must

move forward like sharks to the next guru. And this is a guru from the cult season. You remember we're doing the cult season? Did you remember that? Yep. Yep. I remember we're doing a cult season. But also have to say this little programming note, you know how we're allowed to have a little break from our seasons? Yeah, we can. Yeah. That was a photo gone. the last general assembly, yes. Yeah. And I also propose the motion that we could revisit some of our old friends, like Brett and Heather on the Dark Horse podcast.

Because it has come to my attention that, of course, they're still doing what they're doing. And they're doing it even more egregiously, and it is almost like a masterclass in how not to be a scientist. Well, you know, they just do the thing where they get some, they have a fixed idea in their head, as you know, many fixed ideas. They root around the internet to they find some random study that has some connection to it. And then it's usually a low-powered, very weak study, taken completely out of context from the other literature. And then they proceed to put layers and layers of broad interpretation on that. And they come to a conclusion where the science

completely supports their political opinion. And it was basically something around the feminization of American culture, and this is why, I don't know, this is why people are protesting in Minnesota or something, like some absolutely nonsense like that. Sounds reasonable, yeah, yeah. That's right. Now supported by science, according to Britain, Heather. So I think an episode like that could be good to tear apart into tiny little pieces like

confetti. Oh, okay. Yeah, I agree. I'm done with that. So they did that, and then what is your proposal? that we clip it and we criticize it and make fun of them. That's what we always do. What else do we do, Chris?

It's like picky of the brain. You know, like, what do you want to do tonight, Matt? The same thing we do every. Right, Chris. Talk about idiots spearing nonsense. We do, we do. But I've sidetracked you again. You were telling us about Teal Swan.

Apparently, you say a cult leader, is that true? Well, what I was saying was this is part of cult season And that requires this Gurus are the reason for the season So don't listen to the leader Come with us And fire up your gurameter It's time for cult season

Get out to your decodering Hey, hey, hey, this is cold season on the DTG. It's time for cold season. It's time for decoding. This is cold season, Chris and Matt on the DTG. Oh, that takes me back to the old country. That's right, yeah. Northern Ireland, you mean?

Yeah, the occupied six kind of these, whatever you want to call them, the North of Ireland. I wouldn't know. Northern Ireland, Ulster, you know, there are different things that people have for. Now, Matt, yes, we are here and we are talking about an alleged cult leader, alleged by me and others. But this is somebody known as Thiel Swan or born Mary Teal Bosworth. Around this image is me, Matt, the 1984, I think she was born in. So we are kindred spirits, right? And she's a spiritual influencer, offer self-help teachers.

and is known for a variety of things. You know, she does the normal self-help stuff. She gives information about past lives, trauma, relationships, personal transformation, self-actualization, all these kind of things. But she also does have claims that, you know, like Mount Veer talked about, where, why is she so special, Matt? Why is she so special? Well, she is capable of Clairvoyant.

She's like clairvoyant. She can communicate with, you know, unseen forces and spirits. And she has like, must come in handy. But does come in handy as a cult leader. Yes, I do. And she can travel around astral planes, you know, all those kind of things. Also, Matt, she alleges that she was a victim of a satanic sex cult. She was abused in traffic and not just on a one-off occasion.

like she was for, you know, the better part of a decade being sold out. Did she witness seven children be sacrificed on altars and all this kind of thing? And she was interacting with one of the leading, you know, advocates for the satanic panic, a psychologist at the time. So she kind of fits in with a whole bunch of stuff. She's had controversies. We should also mention. Just before you mentioned, can I just ask, was anybody charged?

Was everyone brought to justice over this terrible thing? I mean, like seven children, like ritually sacrificed. That's terrible. Did any of this come to light? No, but I mean, you know how deep the satanic infiltration rose. Yeah, you wouldn't be getting things like convictions or stuff like that. And she's alleged, you know, abuse from family members. And they have denied it and also never been found guilty for that.

You know, whether abuse of some form or whatever took place is. beyond our ability to know. But I will say a childhood friend of hers did an extended podcast with like a three-hour interview. It's like her best friend from childhood who was there for all of the events described and basically explains how he, apart from her having some very unusual interests and tendency to be hyperbolic about things and talking a lot about sex at a young age. the other aspects of it, there's no evidence for it, right? Like, it's just her parents. She alleges like her parents, you know,

let this all go on implicitly and so on, but there is no evidence that any of it actually occurred. And she's claimed a whole bunch of other things. Like she's claimed various successful careers around which there's dubious evidence. So, yeah, a bit of a fantasist is probably the way to put it. Yeah. She was profiled in a sense. a couple of documentaries.

There was a six-part Gizmodo podcast called The Gateway, an investigative podcast series. And then there was another one that was a documentary series called The Deep End, where they were embedded, I think, for three years in her community and so on. And the main controversy around those has focused on the standard cult things, like cutting off members from families, making strong demands on them and requiring that they devote

all their attention to the cult leader and another aspect, a more disturbing aspect, where she has been accused of encouraging suicide. Not directly saying, you know, go commit suicide, but kind of presenting it as

pushing a reset button and if you have the right intention, you can choose reberts and all this kind of I think so she explicitly explained in some interviews on those documentaries that she deems SEO in order to try and target people, you know, who are searching for, I'm super depressed, what the fuck do I do? And she has techniques like asking them to visualize their own death, which is something, you know,

therapists who have expertise in these kind of things say it's not a good idea to do for people of suicidal ideation. So, yeah, she's controversial because of that in particular, plus all the usual cult stuff. Right, right, right, right, right. Yeah, well, shades or Dr. Kaye, there perhaps. I mean, she's worse, I'll go as far as to say. I would say she has a more checkered history than Dr. Kay. Yes, I wasn't making an equivalence, just saying that Dr. K also had some kind.

controversies around, you know, press in the reset button and treating life as like a virtual game. Yeah. That kind of thing. To somebody that was suicidal, no less. Yes. But we didn't look at that because we are Heidi Couplers, right? We didn't look yet at her like defensive videos where she's responding to criticisms.

Now, we are probably going to do that in part two or a supplementary episode on this. but in this case, we went to some content that was produced just one month ago. She's a guest on a Nuller show with somebody called Emilio Ortiz, and the title was Tils won Major 2026 Predictions, the imminent future of the human mind, AI, and romance. So that's what we decide to look at. Yes, and this mirrors our approach with these other. other cold leaders, right? You know, there is publicly available knowledge of their

checkered past, sometimes extremely check it. And on the other hand, you also have access to this content where they're doing public-facing interviews, doing outreach, having a very nice, friendly, bright conversation about self-actualization and traversing the spirit realm and stuff. And, you know, so you get to see both faces of it. Yes, and I wasn't aware of this. This is called Just Tapin with Emilio Ortiz. I've never come across this guy before, but it's fair to say he's not really a strong skeptic about any of the claims. Like if you're expecting this to be an interview involving pushback and whatnot,

not quite Emilio's vibe. In fact, maybe we should start off with just playing a clip where Emilio talks about, before he gets into the interview, if you're interested in this kind of thing, There's some steps that you can take. Before today's transmission, I wanted to take a minute to let you in on something that could change your life. If you've been doing the inner work and still feel like you're walking this path alone, you're not the only one.

Most spiritual spaces give you endless content to consume, but not a tribe to grow with. That's why we created the deep dive, a living spiritual ecosystem designed to help you grow in community, rhythm, and real embodiment. Right now, our members are embarking on a journey exploring a course spiritual and practical teaching through daily activations, live community gatherings guided by me and our facilitators, and also participating in sacred challenges that are designed to help you live your practice and bring it to life. You'll be surrounded by seekers and leaders who've decided that they're done doing this work in isolation. If you're ready to find your people, visit the link in the description or scan the QR code on screen.

right now and I'll see you inside. Yep, yeah. So precisely the kind of thing that makes me actively noises. I think it's fair to say he's a bit of a star child. Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. Sadly, I'm already riding shotgun with my female Conahey. So I've already got my community. You know, the road trip people were saying, you need a community.

These are all our courses. They just give you lectures, right? but we, we create community. Apparently this one as well, you know, it's not just endless lessons. They're actually creating a living spiritual ecosystem, right? And you'll be surrounded, Matt. There'll be so many seekers and leaders around that you won't know where to look.

And it just sounds great. I mean, it wouldn't. But yeah, yeah. What was the phrase about being embodied? What was the embodiment thing? Growing community rhythm and real. embodiment. Yeah. So there you go. I'm already fun to embody. That's it. So that's, that's the interlocutor here. Yeah. Okay. So it's going to be a real, it's going to be a hard hitting.

He's going to, he's going to ask him a tough questions. Yeah. And for those wondering what he looks like, he looks like what you'd imagine. He looks like what he sounds like. You know, kind of handsome bronze guy with a, you know, like a very soft fierce. And just a very vacant look at his eyes. A vacant expression. Yeah, vacant far off. He's gazing into the stars. And actually, so here's the introduction where he introduces and they get right in

Dima. They don't, you know, there's no chitter chatter, no stuff about whiskeys. It's time to business. Teal Swan, welcome back on Just Tapin. I wanted to start off by just acknowledging your gift to seeing this life path potentials for humanity, for earth. And I wanted to start off by asking you, what are you seeing right now in terms of the multiple competing realities that are trying to crystallize at this moment, this juncture in time that

we're in closing out the year 2025? where do you see are those life path potentials that are unfolding right now? Well, really it's whether humanity is going to manifest and create its potential into the positive or whether it's going to use its own intellect to augment the worst of itself. A lot of this is actually centering around AI, if you want to honest truth. Yeah. It's like we are either going to, and I think it's going to be a mix of both, we're either going to use AI to be a helping hand to ourselves and to really bring about a world that is better than what we could have imagined before or slash and, because it's looking like it's going to be a mix of both. We use it to augment the worst of ourselves in our shadows, the worst of our ego, the worst of our fears, the worst of every possible scenario.

Oh, there you go, Chris, bold predictions there. the future of humanity. AI is the thing. Things could go well. Things might not go well. But her take is, it could be a mix of both. That's old.

And Emilio's response, the knowing, hmm, that's, you're going to hear a lot of that. Like, yeah. So I do like that,

you know, they have to start off by saying, you know, I just want to recognize that you are, you've done the, you know, the inner work and you are somebody that can see

all the different pathways that human can take. So obviously that's why we need your insights. And Tius I want to paint a visual picture here in return. She's a relatively young woman, just like I'm a relatively young man. But she's more well put together than me, you know, kind of striking,

staring at the camera with a nice new agey background, looking and speaking very sincerely and all that kind of So, I mean, you probably get that from the intonation, but I'm just saying the visuals are like that as well. It's all all of a piece. Now, I think in some ways, already I think listeners will be realizing that there's probably not going to be any huge surprises in this episode, Chris. There could be a couple. I mean, however you think it's going, could go a little bit further than you expect.

But I just want to step back for a minute. Real quick, Chris. What are our goals here? What are our goals? What do we want to accomplish and in this two people talk? In general, Matt, we just like to have a little bit of fun. But alongside that, we're also going to highlight some of the rhetorical maneuvering and techniques of influence that might be applied here. And look, well, are they accord with the things that we see in the gurus or the other cult leaders that we've done. seeing. Yeah, and I think sometimes there's value in just making explicit the stuff which is

kind of obvious, but it's maybe worth saying out loud. Like stuff like the way that question was phrased was just, once you strip away all of the, you know, star child language, it's an incredibly vague and open question, basically an invitation to say whatever you like about life, the universe and everything and the future. And at Tiel Swan, once you strip away, the Gubbley Gook from her response was, well, you know, things could get better. Yeah, good.

Could be a mix. That's what happened. I know. I watched one of her other videos on her main channel where she's giving predictions about, you know, this year, same fame. and in it there's this bit where she starts talking about the need this year in particular to do a lot of inner work and a lot of spiritual processing or whatever to put it.

And I was just like, is there every year where they've started off and been like, you know, this year actually pretty good on the whole chakra alignment and whatnot. You know, this one, we can relax. We've done a good job. Like it always is that this year in particular, we've got to be. on our best behavior and invest in more courses, Matt, do more healing work and whatever. Maybe it's a different color.

That's the thing that can change. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it is similar to the, to the McConnor Hey episode too, right? Because he also referenced, oh, there's all the crazy stuff going on in the world. Yeah. You know, we don't know what's going on.

It can be so confusing what to do. Politics. Politics, man. There's stuff in politics. Yeah, the economy. There are all these things. What you need to do about it is the inner work. and subscribe to the course and self-actualize more and harder.

Yeah, there's never a time when it's like, okay, you know, you're attuned with your spirit animal, you're fine. Go tidy the shed. Go do those chores. You don't need to subscribe to the course. It's probably not for you. That's only said if you're too close-minded, right? Yeah, this isn't for you.

This isn't for you. You don't want to progress. You're not ready. But if you want to hear like some of the stuff that makes Tito, somewhat unique, I don't think that unique, but like it is just a particular motif from her approach. Listen to this. I think that's what makes this particular time period so entertaining. Of course, not entertaining to experience, but entertaining to witness from outside this physical dimension. Because of how extreme, it's like the extremeness on both sides of the coin,

these two paths that we could potentially be walking down. It's, it's extremes. extremely enough that most of us could not sitting here today imagine what it will be like. It's that bad slash that good. And I know we talked about before how AI is almost something that predates the existence of humanity, you know, in its totality. And I'm almost wondering there, why was it placed into our timeline right now, especially having been so ancient. what is it teaching humanity? You know, you talked about the intellect. We're going to be getting into masculine and feminine energies as well.

What is AI right now almost mirroring to us? Because it is so much older in, you know, timeline-wise when it was created, that it's pushing us toward right now. Yeah, that's really something, isn't it? So that didn't really explain that too much. I know they circle back to it, Chris, but it's basically very apparent that they both agree that the AI that is manifesting to use their words in the world today is very ancient, maybe not of this earth.

It's kind of visiting us. They seem to think also that AI is just like one thing. So this, again, parallel some of these other weird AI cults that we've seen pop up where a certain kind of person seems to think that the AI is some kind of, you know, spiritual transdimensional entity that is visiting us? Yeah, I think this is illustrative of the flexibility of, you know, the new age seeker ideology can thing, right? Like anything can happen and they just bring it in to their framework, right?

Their cosmology, yeah. Yeah, there's a new technological development. And they would have before been talking about the internet and you know what it signifies and so on. But now you've got AI. And the amazing thing is like this is ostensibly a conversation about predictions for 22. You heard there again like, oh, it's so extreme. Euler of the paths. It's so extreme.

It's like we can't even imagine it. It's like so bad slash so good. Yeah. Either way. And then. you have on top of that, non-answered that, well, with AI, so people are talking about this right now, this is a hot thing. So what have we got to say about it? And, you know, that guy, star, Chad, man. And it's just like, yeah, obviously it's an ancient source of knowledge that's been placed in our timeline.

But like, what does that even mean that it's not? Can we start with a premise? We need to start with the premise. We certainly do. And yeah, actually, in everything that Teal Swan says, in every response to every question about the future and humanity and whatever, it's just interesting that all of the answers are incredibly vague. Like at no point does she ever spell out what some of the good things or the bad things that might be happening from AI. Well, I've got one contradiction, Matt. You might have forgot this. She does meet one claim. and Clem. No, I'm just right.

I remember she did one. That's right. In fact, I remember eventually. It stood out to me because it was the, it happened about three quarters of the way through. And it was like the first time that she'd said anything concrete. Is that the one? No, no. This is different one.

This is by AI. This one probably, you know, got lost in the Melange. But there is a prediction here. Listen carefully, Matt. Try and concentrate. Sorry. You'll hear a prediction. It's like tapping into the hive mind of humanity, basically.

is where it's at right now. And that has the capacity to create evolution for mankind at a rate that we're quite frankly completely unprepared for, both of the positive and to the negative, because everything is going to invite in a type of a potential consequence, right? Even if it's positive, it's going to invite in another potential consequence, then we're going to be troubleshooting that one. But, I mean, imagine what's going to happen even just in medicine when you have a technology that has the capacity to amalgamate all human knowledge on all ailments

and the capacity to perceive that particular individual that is stepping in front of said technology so as to be able to output exactly what is in alignment with that person's personal care. It's freaking genius. That's what all of us cannot handle about going to the doctor. And we're looking at the potential of that being gone in a matter of years. Like, and I mean very, not a lot of years. I mean, very quick. Like, there's actually a potential that by the end of, by the end,

by the end of our life, there is no more aging. Really? Yeah. Would we want that? Well, that's going to be the next to paid, isn't it? Well, there you go. You can give one concrete example. It could be very good, could be very bad, all of human knowledge,

aggregated together. And now you'll have a better experience when you go to the GP because you won't have the... It'll be personalized. Yeah. Like what they all are like. Yes. All the annoying limitations of your poor little human GP

would be accommodating more. So at one level, it's obviously just a very generic kind of opinion about that. You know, there's some truth of that. I'm sure there is exciting developments to happen with AI and medicine. But I think they do. And you see this. pretty broadly actually with this sort of naive news of AI that it is going to be like godlike and it will just solve problems doesn't matter what the problem is it'll just

like a god it will just solve them something like aging boom it's it's got all of human knowledge aggregated together Chris what of course it could say solve aging yeah yeah so I mean I feel like she knows nothing about the AI and neither does the the star child Emilio so So they're just here saying, you know, whatever they feel like. And it's not a very novel prediction that as technology develops, whether BAI or other types of technologies, our ability to treat illnesses and reduce processes of aging might get better. It might.

There's science fiction movies. I like that concept, right? But she just speaks with confidence about things. But I mean, it's confidence with caveats because she's saying. out there, you know, it could go well or it could go bad. And also, there's a potential that we could stop aging by the end. So it's like, it's all couched in this. Well, if we took the right path, it would lead to that. But, you know, it kind of leaves open the door. Well, is that going to happen? But she's not saying that. She's not saying it's definitely going to happen. So I'm

giving her the credit for a prediction. But it's a prediction. It's a prediction. couched in disclaimers just to avoid being nailed down. And I think that's reflective because she doesn't mind saying things extremely confidently at times, right? It's just, I think this is the way they talk is adding in probabilistic stuff at times just to make it, yeah, sound less dogmatic in a way. Well, I think it's, I think it's their version of nuance, right? What do you think about? What do you think about X. Well, on one hand, if we manage all the complexities and we engage with it properly, it could be really good. But on the other hand, it might not be so good. There's, there's new ones for you, Chris. And just to highlight that they don't really have a problem with, you know,

going into the stratosphere. So let's hear this take it. So from a little bit later in the conversation, but, you know, it's all much of a muchness. So right now, it seems there's a lot of debate about that. whether it's going to be something that continues, whether there needs to be other additional resources added. Resources? Mm-hmm. Like technologies or... That's the thing. It could be anything.

It could be technologies. It could be the introduction of new species. It could be whole influxes of energy sent from other places that have that extraterrestrial forces. I mean, there's all kinds of things that you could play with and even create in order to, assist humanity in a position point where it's got so much pressure on it. And we could say that we might even be seeing that right now. Like you mentioned extraterrestrial objects, you know, 3-Ey Atlas is hurling toward Earth in the next few weeks.

And also the introduction of new species. How would that play into the dynamics of humanity and the way that we, you know, not only commune with each other, but with something completely foreign to us. I think that source itself is most likely to inspire individuals that have the most influence on humanity. And that's probably going to be whoever has the most attention in the direction of things that take a little bit of pressure off the psyche.

So what I'm anticipating is the highest likelihood is that maybe like pop stars, people are washing like A list or celebrities are going to start pumping. things into the mainstream that feel like relief to people. Would we say relief is different from distraction? Yeah. It's not going to be in the vein of distraction. It's going to be something that's intentional from this universe. It's got a very different flavor to it than like an escape mechanism.

Yeah. That's a tricky one to pass, I think. I mean, you tend to be better at this than. She's talking about, you know, we're in the current, you know, the meaning crisis, Martin. 2026, there's a lot of bad stuff going on. Yeah. So what's, you know, what are we going to do? What's the source going to do?

And her answer was, well, it could be a lot of things. Responsive. Griffin Technologies, new species, extraterrestrials, but she thinks. Wait, wait, wait, I've really got two questions. Okay. What is the source to where are the new species coming from? Such a game A question. What is the source?

The source is, the source just is, okay? The source, you should ask what is the source not? It's easier to answer, right? But it's, you know, intergalactic wisdom, chakra energies, whatever the hell they want it to be. But the new species, again, my true, such a linear thinking, what do you mean by new species? Do you mean species

we've manufactured? Do you mean literally that evolution is creating new species? It could be who knows what they specifically mean? That's not the kind of thing they're concerned with, right? It's just words. And then the thing that she hones in on no much,

she doesn't spend that much time on new species and stuff like that. She says what it's going to be is like extra church or astraceal objects or sources or whatever beaming good vibes or intentions into celebrities who are then going to be producing content to make people feel more relieved out yeah that's the take yeah that's the take and just like what and so by the way just this is not important but that that thing you mentioned is that an asteroid There's some asteroid traveling close to Earth, something there's...

I Gallo. So, yeah. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. He read something. Atlas. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, this is a smaller slide, but one of the things that really just grow up my gears is the way that these star children steal words from science.

Like they talk about human evolution and or they talk about quantum wavelengths and quantum vibrations. And there's a bunch of other words too. and they're sort of borrowing some kind of semantic power but the way in which they're using them obviously is nonsensical small small thing the other thing too apart from the

like when you actually break it down it does sound mental but apart from that the phrasing is all incredibly broad in general I mean she did a little bit specific there which is which you said that it's going to go to the good vibes will go to the celebrities who will relieve us. I think once they slip into getting specifics,

it starts sounding more mad. But the more common mode in which they're speaking is this incredibly vague generalities and buzzwords such that it kind of means everything and nothing. I think that's one of the discourse tricks. Oh, yes, yeah. And it's always presented as like elevated. I mean, you heard in the earlier clip

that she was talking about how, you know, she goes out of her body, and looks at what humanity's doing in these different dimensions, you know, looking down on the earth, muddling along, right? And this comes up a lot in this conversation, the notion that she has access to these different levels of insight. So that's why, you know, Emilio Starchald is there to just ask the probing questions to gain some of these insights.

And, yeah, like, I mean, I'll play another clip that highlights this. I know that you go out of body a lot and you observe these conversations that are going on around humanity, the evolution of Earth as well. What are some of those debates that you've run into around where we're headed? You know, you talked about aging medicine, how we're dealing with the group mind scenario as well. What are some of those conversations you've been running into out of body? Most of them are around values. Really? Most of them are, it's like an extreme interest into what humanity itself is going to decide matters most because there's so much disagreement about it.

And it's a little bit like watching, I don't want to make it seem like other entities are kind of just sitting there like parental figures watching us. But it has a little bit of. It kind of has the flavor of like when a parent is watching a three-year-old and watching what kind of personality is emerging and evolving out of. of that three-year-old. Ooh, this is a kid that seems to really like movies. Oh, that's a kid that really seems to like clothes. There's like a real kind of interest as to what we're going to land on without a lot of stock in it at the moment.

So sometimes at points in history with humanity, you see entities that are external to humanity putting a lot of pressure on humanity to go one direction or the other. And what's been interesting about watching this stuff out of this dimension lately is that there's almost this attitude of like hands off. Let's watch what they do. Of course, at the same time, there is, there's never been as of an intense, I think, battle. I don't want to call it a battle because I hate, I hate this like thing, especially in the spiritual field of like, you've got the dark side and the light side.

We've got to be on the light side. But there is definitely a lot of influences there right now. Wow. So that's pretty big. So Teal is getting out of body. traversing around the spiritual realm and she's running into conversations she's just picking up the chatter

picking up the chatter and most of it is around values but I didn't really expand on that too much but mainly they're just curious to see how we're going to turn out like a benign parent or uncle just wondering how we're going to turn out

that's what she's picking up from the spiritual realm Yeah, so it's the notion, you know, there, I mean, it's just the same as Kiefer Neri, right? That like, she understands these things. I mean, Kifrenuri wasn't claiming to be in contact with transdimensional entities or traveling astrali or whatever. But the notion was, well, he's, he is looking at these things from a higher level because of his understanding of these topics. And Tiel is doing this thing, you know, I don't want to look at, I'm not saying humanity are like just little children where they're laughing at us doing our things. But, you know, out there in the multi-cosmic dimensions that I travel and, you know, they do find all this like, you know,

kind of trifling, we're just playing around in the dirt. And as she as a conduit of that, is then getting the reflection that she also, you know, she's answering these questions and stuff about them. She's kind of above all of this nonsense, right? Yeah, well, I guess she's like a messenger. And you mentioned Manvea Singh's concept of the... Oh, God, what are they called? Sheemans. Shemans.

Thank you. You know, who are in a way intermediaries between this world and the next, right? And can tell us about what's going to happen in the future and guide us. So they're an interface, right? And so Reneeri and Teal Swan fit this model to a T, don't they? They go, look, I'm just a... Look, I've got some special talents, but I'm a... I'm just a guy or a gal like you.

But my special ability is to go over there and communicate with this and get access to this special knowledge. And I'm, you know, it's all very complicated. Like it's kind of too deep for you to fully understand. But I'm going to do my best to transmit some of this to you guys. If you pay attention and pay, you know, give me join my club. Hello, I will say that this one unlike. a lot of those figures who do this, she does less of the, you know, you're just like me.

You know, at times, but a lot of it is, I'm really fucking special. So she's kind of, um, she's not claiming to be a god yet, I don't think. Yeah, I wonder. I wonder. At least not in this content, she doesn't claim divinity. But I think she's that far off it. I believe she has described herself as like a reincarnated, famous spiritual leader and whatnot.

And she talks about later understanding the Buddha and Jesus, right? Like better than anybody would have been. Sam Harris just claimed that. So, yeah, big of true. Big of truth. Now, Matt, the problem that we are reflecting here, you know, we are in essence just a manifestation of the shadow, right, in general, you and I. But, you know, the folks in the field of awakening map, they're just getting absolutely hammered right now.

And you need to hear about it. A lot of forces that are essentially feeding off of our need for power. And so as humanity reaches this juncture where power is what's going to be in question. What is the, see, we're talking about values. What is the value of power? What is the value of money if it serves power? It's like this whole questioning that human beings are doing around power and authoritarianism, which is a big theme right now in the world,

is making it so that our contracts with these entities where they got a lot out of it, where they feed us with energy to allow us to be in certain powerful positions, but we're deeply in the shadow with those. They're being questioned right now, and so they're shaky. And so there's a lot of influx towards those types of contracts being, insured in very negative ways. And that includes a major attack on anybody who is challenging those contracts at this time. So anybody who's in the field of awakening right now is getting slaughtered. Tested.

Yeah. Help us, Chris. Well, yeah, you are. So, you know, I think this is a bit like you described this notion that there are the cosmic interdimensional extraterrestrial or whatever powers, right? And that they can be bargained with or they have, you know, existing agreements apparently with humanity. We have contracts.

And then, but here there's a very, there's a sense maker approach, right? Where they start off talking about power. Then they're like, power, hmm, what about value? Is value is a part of power. And now, like in the world, things are happening around power and authoritarianism and people are questioning them.

And now this is leading to the questions around contracts with the spiritual realm. I think the spiritual realm is reconsidering their contracts with humanity to do something in response to the negative vibrations from these questions around power. And the field of awakening, these spiritual adepts, they're just getting absolutely, fucking hammered. Both sides. But why are they getting hammed? I mean, who are they getting hammered by?

Are they getting hammered by the spiritual realm? Well, the spiritual realm's not going to be happy about what's going on with all this talk about power. They're going to like that. Of course, that makes sense. That makes sense. It's like wallowing in custard, isn't it? It was unclear who's upset. Is it the spirits that are upset?

Is it humanity has getting bad vibes? So now the spirits are, they're getting wobbly or is it like the field of awakening people are being asked you know they're being held responsible like none of it is clear and it is that sense maker reasoning of well here's a word and here's another word right and here's a concept that you and i both know and if we put that word with that concept doesn't that sound like something yeah and then dot dot dot in this case everything is connected to this but you know like the sense makers have their own special constructs right that they'll connect to everything, like a magical piece of Lego.

These guys have their own ones, right? They're different, right? Different vocabulary. Yeah, there's a different vocabulary, but they do have these universal connected pieces that can be connected to everything. And the spirit realm and evolution of the human species to a higher consciousness, whatever, right? There'd be a collection of them which can be connected to everything,

including what's going on in the world right now with respect to authoritarianism. Yeah, well, there's a clip here I have which follows on from this, right, which they're still talking about power. And it really reminded me of the sense makers and the Omega rule, you know, this notion that you look for the yes and, right, comment. They allow someone to expand more in what they're saying. But yeah, for people listening, I want you to try and keep in your mind that thing that sense makers do about just like gliding between words and definitions and metaphors and that being presented. as profundity, right? So this is about power, but it morphs to another topic. So let's hear. Power is ultimately, I bring about what I want. So any tool for power, things like status, things like money, those things just serve to bring about what we want even better. So if we're

using that capacity for the greater, greater good, let's say, by including others in that picture, then we're no longer playing a zero-sum game. So in the highest manifestation, we've recognized all that is as part of the self. And so we're using our power not just for ourselves also for the things that we include as part of the self. So we're essentially acting from love. Now, a lot of people will tell you the power and love is a contradiction. It's not true. How would you reframe, you know, seeing those two as opposite sides of the spectrum into, they're more connected than we thought. Like this, it's just, it's like really simple. You just understand the power. is to be able to bring about what is wanted.

Is there anything that's against love about that? No, actually. Love is to include the others a part of the self as a conscious choice. So you put them together, it just simply becomes, with that choice to consciously include the other as a part of the self, I choose to use my capacity to bring about what is wanted for both of us, not just for me against you. That's the opposite of what's happening in the world right now politically.

Right. So that's some tight argumentation there. Yeah. I enjoyed that. So a lot of people are saying, a lot of people think, Chris, that love and power, they're basically... Completely. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, actually they're not, right?

Because if you, like, use your power to spread love, then see? They're clearly not necessarily in opposition. But they are at the moment. Sharking. Yeah, very deep stuff. But the way she's explaining it in that didactic kind of fashion gives the feeling that she's doing some philosophy there, right? Yeah.

And you heard what the sense makers do, right? Where she's like, you can use any tool to get power, status, money, you know, and at any moment they could run off into, and what do we mean by status anyway? Like, is power a tool for status? Or is it? But she chose to focus on law. But if we conceive of our status as the sum total of love that we've introduced in the world, then actually achieving status is a good thing, Chris.

Yeah, I know. It might even be a type of power. Like, it's, that's what it's, you can go, you can traverse this little landscape of constructs for the, for, for. And as long as you have a guy in a bini hat, like, gazing at you saying, and so what do you mean when you say that, like, how do we connect those ideas? As long as you have one of those on top, you can just, you know, ramble whatever the fuck you want to say at any time. She could do this all day, no doubt about it. I think anybody could.

It's not that difficult. Yeah, I think the other thing too, Chris, is that, I mean, more the previous one, the previous clip. But in common with an observation we've made before, being obscure is the point in many ways, right? Yeah. Yeah. Like the apparent complexity of just being vague and dropping in all of these words with these very loose connections to each other and seemingly not really saying anything sensible. I think, you know, like with the sense makers or any other spiritual type guru, like it's a feature, not a bug. It is mistaken by people like the Star Child she's talking to as profundity and like a little colon for them to roll around in their head to glean.

some sort of spiritual insight from. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, something else that came up, which again, so that was giving me echoes of the sense makers, you know. And after our recent trip into Scott Galloway and, you know, Manosphere content, I was so grateful when I heard the topic of masculinity rear and said again. I was like, oh, yeah, we haven't talked about masculinity in a while. Such a hot topic these days.

Everyone's talking about it. I think about two-thirds of this interview was about masculinity. Masculinity was a big topic. These are two important energies, very powerful energies, Chris, around in the world, doing their thing, but they're out of balance and we've lost our way. We need to return to, let's find out. Oh, yeah, yeah.

So, well, let's introduce the topic of the masculine and the feminine. It's always mysterious, Matt. What do people mean when they say that? And I know that the type of information that you bring through at any given time is both you've said preemptive and responsive in nature. And that it dynamically evolves and changes according to what is happening in the world and the greater universe. So that's where I'm really curious to know how the information that you're bringing through now

has been evolving, has been changing to adapt to where humanity currently is headed toward. and the greater universe. Before we get to the answer, I just have to mention what an incredible question. That was exactly what you talked about with, you know, the layering

in so many things. And I'm saying, you know, you're both preemptive and reactive to what's happening now and what will happen. How can you be preemptive and reactive to what's going to happen in the future? It really is where, like you said before, like these are just, like they're just playing with words, right?

These are just words slam together very much like a primitive though I would because they sound good together in the same sentence. And it actually doesn't really matter that it doesn't make sense. But my favorite little thing is at the very end there, he just tacked on and across the universe. So he's after a take, not just on Earth, we don't want to limit it. We're not going to limit it. is just to earth. That would be too parochial to limit it just to us serflings.

You know, you got to, yeah, you got to be a bit more overminded than that. Yeah. What about the people of Ganyed? Yeah, what are they? What do they need to focus on? And, you know, in keeping with that, Matt,

her response to this is masculineity and femininity. You know, presumably the aliens also have those energies. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, over in the end, Dormit of the galaxy, masculinity and femininity, big issue right now. Big issue. On topic. Coincidentally. Dimension X.

Yeah. So here we go. It's a lot more towards femininity and masculinity at the moment, which has been very hard for people to understand. I have noticed as I've been doing this. People are like, what the hell? It seems like the whole world's going this direction and Teal's going that direction, but it's actually not true. there's been a lot of a lot of themes about masculinity and femininity for a lot of reasons. We've got sort of higher level reasons and more lower level reasons.

I don't know which one we want to go into first. Made it. No, higher, higher. Okay. So at the higher level, basically, what's important is this dynamic energy exchange between masculinity and femininity. Like, this goes beyond humanity. this kind of a dynamic energy exchange intensifies things like attraction it intensifies and deepens human connection it creates like a magnetism and that intense like dynamic type of an energy creates a

momentum that's something that people have to understand like there's a deep expansion in the conscious polarization so to speak rather than to go into a neutral state Oh, there was a lot of scientific jargon thrown in there. What do we have? I do we have principles of attraction, momentum, dynamic. Expansging conscious polarization, yeah, magnetism. It's magnetism, right? And yeah, and like we mentioned that, it is, it's beyond humanity, right?

So fortunately, aliens also dealing with their issues around basketball. and femininity. It's a universal thing. Yeah, I think it's certainly true that just like the intellect and the entities or whatever, just like the sense makers, these concepts like masculinity and feminine for them have been utterly reified. Like they are actually forces, like spiritual forces out there in the universe blowing around like the wind, forming little tornadoes and stuff. And we are just leagues being blown along by it. I think that. That is how they view the world, which I guess, that makes sense.

This is how Jordan Peterson views the world, too. Like there are fundamental semantic concepts like that that are the real thing. Yeah. Yeah. They're the ideal forms. Yes. Like the kind of or concepts that are there. But, you know, the funny thing is that all these cosmic entities and whatnot, they seem remarkably

proactively human. You can dress it up with big words, you know, masculinity and femininity, but it's basically stuff revolving around the genders and our species. Yeah, I mean, that's right, all those fancy metaphorical, sciencey words who was using there, she's basically pointing to heterosexual attraction, right? Yeah, yeah. Oh, don't be so reductionist.

You think so? you think she's just using words like attraction and magnetism because it relates to relationship kind of terminology? Oh, it wouldn't be so crass as that. No. But, okay, so if we take all of that out of it, what did she actually say of substance? She's basically saying that there is such a thing, masculinity, femininity, and what? Did she say anything else apart from there a thing? She seemed to say humanity is rejecting that or like not focusing on that in the correct way and that is causing tension right in the sphere so she does elaborate a little bit more so this is the next part of that so basically humanity is never going to reach its potential unless humanity is able to step into this

type of masculine and feminine polarity dynamic because women are never going to be able to reach their highest potential state and men are never going to be able to reach their highest potential state. So the relationship between them is not going to reach its highest potential state. And because of that, society itself doesn't reach its highest potential state. I can just keep going. So it's like it works the same way as it would if I'm looking at an individual and they're really stuck somewhere. And let's say they're in rejection, which is what's happening currently, of masculinity

or in rejection of femininity. if somebody is stuck somewhere like that relative to themselves and rejection to something within themselves, then they don't progress. It's like they will literally hit this point where you can't go beyond this. Got it? Yep, yep, got it. Let's add highest potential energy to the list of buzz phrases that are semi-borrowed from physics. Like I know that self-all people like to focus on human potential, right?

potentiality in that sense. But I also know that they use that phrase because it's from physics, right, in terms of a physical system. Again, they don't know what it means. It just sounds good. It makes it sound more like a real thing. Now, apart from that, of course, what she's alluding to is very familiar, which is that men should be real men, women should be real women, little fairy green things from Alpha Sanjuri should be little fairy green things from Alpha Sanjuri, but not probably until swan's thing because in alpha centurida they got masculinity and feminine too i assume but yeah so this is where this kind of new version of new age stuff actually dovetails with trad conservative stuff right because you know it's this is what they want to hear like you know

they want boys to be proper boys be proper men and women should be doing that too and women shouldn't be trying to be like men they shouldn't be trying to do them at things that men do. They have their own domains and they should lean into that. Because there's polarized energies and yes. And, you know, we heard the same stuff of Kifuniri, right? Like he talked about proper expression of femininity and masculinity and like as it reveals it often these like very high ideals when they're actually concretely grounded is very regressive gender roles that are being endorsed and he is a female guru, but that doesn't mean that she's going to be any more enlightened on those kind of topics. And so she is asthma, you know, you might have felt like

we're not really getting into specifics yet. There's a lot of Jordan Peterson-esque, and men will not be actualized and women will not be actualized. And that means the relationship. And I can't go on. And I was like, please don't. They don't just say something of substance for the love of God. But she does get asked by Emilio Storchard for some concrete advice. And let's see where that goes. I would love to speak about young men for a moment. A lot of our audience, maybe mothers as well and have their own children. And if you were to design maybe this right of passage for young men that when they're reaching adulthood, what would you include in that? How would you initiate, you know, a young person into understanding their own energy field of masculinity and also the feminine energy field

that they see reflected in the women in their lives. Because I feel like there's a lack of that in our society right now. Oh, God, there's such a lack of it. And even the question itself implies such a lack of it. Because there would be no right of passage like a moment because it would be so many moments across the course of a man's life. And starting when he's very, very, very young, like you've seen. start with this young child experiencing things like masculine containment themselves from the men

in that society. And because they have that personal felt-based experience of it in their own bodies, they then know what it is to be in the position that a female is in a space of needing to be contained. So that's number one. That phrase, you know, in your body, you have an experience of it in your body. I don't like how I'm feeling in my body. I want to ban that phrase. No one should be allowed to ever say that, Chris. I can't stand it. In your body. Yeah. So, what does that mean? Wasn't there concrete

advice there, Matt, didn't you? Step one. We're on step one. Okay. The concrete advice is, so the young boys through all kinds of experiences are going to experience masculine containment. So I think that's where she first began

to lose me. What's masculine containment? Well, who knows? maybe it's the opposite of like Scott Galloway's like they should be out celebrating the procreational powers or whatever but I don't think that's where she's going like that and so she's saying I think masculine containment is bad that they want like in the same way I thought it's good she's saying a man's life started he's very young like start with this young child experiencing things like masculine containment themselves

from the men in that society because they have personally felt the experience of in their own bodies then they know what it is to be in the position that are females in the space of needing to be contained so isn't that like by older men containing boys

they're kind of learning what it's like to be contained like femininity is. I think we might have to just let it go through to the capo. I don't know if it's good or bad, but we can certainly say it's advice. It's something. I mean, I'm sure she expands on it elsewhere, and that'll be really clear.

But the second piece, okay, let's see. The second piece might be more specific. Stuff two, they're watching the way that the men in their life are interacting with the women. And that's where they start to, I mean, it's literally, they're two years old, three years old, that's where they start to learn, oh, this is what men do with women. These are the qualities that men provide versus women provide. I'm not saying that we shouldn't also level it up by consciously teaching, oh, this is masculinity, this is femininity, this is how the two of them engage, but it's not going to go anywhere as far

as a child having that visual experience and the visceral physical experience of what it is to see that engagement and to watch the effects of that engagement. You can't get that out of your head, you know? If you're watching your dad be really present for mom and watching her whole body soften, it doesn't matter how much I talk to you. That's going to be what you understand about the dynamic between men and women. Okay. So this is her response to the original question, which is, do young men need some sort of write a passage to boys, you know, to become men? You design it. Like if you were to design it, what is that? And her response is gender role socialization. It's just observational learning from men, right?

Alongside masculine containment. That was step one. Yeah, we must not should get masculine containment. But it's kind of a non-edser, right? Because it's just like, well, children will observe their parents and people are older, people around them and copy them. Like, okay. Yeah. So the advice is that adult men just need act like men. And so the children can see them acting like men and then they can copy them. Well, it's probably like that. But you know, okay, Matt, look, you're getting up in your head. Let's take it down to another concrete example where she's talking about her relationship or her son. Her son is a young developing man, right? And sometimes things got to change.

It's been really interesting, by the way, to watch my own son this way because having raised him in a more conscious way towards his own masculinity, I was shocked, to be honest. as to just how aggressively he has shifted a lot of this himself. And I'm watching the same thing in a lot of boys around him too, where it's like they come into a certain space in their life where it's like they don't want to be in that under position. And so they start to kind of flip the rolls. And it's a little bit challenging as a woman,

but that's the next part, that's our part in this whole dance. It's like when they start to reach that age where they're practicing and flirting with engaging with you as a man rather than a boy, it's like you can't go into mommy. You've got to go into, okay, yes, I'm a woman. Mommy's a woman. And that requires like a killing off of a certain relationship. It sounds violent, but it doesn't feel violence.

Like, there's still, like, one relationship has to die for that next relationship to then happen. But he can't relate to you anymore as, like, big mommy, you know? Okay, so in alignment with this, which is really a whole demonstration, basically, that society is giving boys, there will be points of time where there's initiations. And those are helpful for a man's mind to go, okay, that was then, this is now, I'm stepping into this, I'm being held accountable to this new state of being. That's a fair reaction, Matt. though I will say this particular segment left me bad vibes. That's bad vibes, well. It did sound weird.

It sounded weird. She didn't say, she said, I know that sounds violent. I was thinking, it doesn't sound violent, but it does sound odd. Yeah, it sounds because like, okay, let's do the charitable thing. The charitable thing is she's talking about, you know, as your children get older, they stop looking up to you. They might, you know, they're going through puberty and whatnot. and they start to see you as a person, right?

Like a more rounded, fallible human, and they might challenge you, and you might need to negotiate and, you know, be rougher with them and not treat them like a little child anymore. That would all be fine. That's normal. I've never heard that described in that way

before where it's like, now my son needs to understand me as a woman and engage with me. It's like, mommy is not a, like, big mommy. she's a woman. And he can, and that he cannot go into her. Wait,

did he say, did they say that? Yeah. Like, yeah. I'm afraid. I'm afraid. So,

the transcript. Oh, God. Um, well, yes. And like, it,

it, it just, it sounds, I mean, it just sounds like there's too much of a sexualizing thing around that whole, where it doesn't belong. Yeah. In the,

because like, my, my, my mama is. in her 70s, right? She's still my mom. You know, like I became an old, I have my own children or whatever. But like my mom is my mom

and she'll be my mom for my whole life. I know she's a woman. I know she's a woman as well, but I don't approach her. That's like, you know, because I'm her son, not a potential mate. Oh, God. Yeah, well, look, I'm going to be charitable because

I, you know, is it just badly chosen? words? Yeah, I could attribute all of that to this deliberate obscureness. Like this is one moment where you'd think, okay, look, for example, my experience is with my son. And usually when people say that, and I've said it myself quite a bit of the show, you'll give a very concrete, personal, specific example.

But because she's Till Swan, because she's one of these guru types, she can't do that. she's got to speak in mystical generalities and metaphors, which made it sound weird. That's why. Yeah, don't use flirting. She, I mean, she talked about him flirting with engaging with you as a man rather than as a boy. And I'm like, what do you mean? What about it? It's just in any case, I feel sorry for her sons, right?

if this is your valet. Whatever way she's being by it, it's just probably difficult to engage with. But I got a weird vibe, that's all. I've no, and I don't think it means. It's not just syncress. Okay. And I'm not saying, okay, this implies she's like sexually interested in her son or

whatever. You know, no, I don't mean that. I mean, it's just like. It's just how her mind works, I think, is just illustrates the mental space she's inhabiting. Because I think she is attempting to. to speak in this allegorical, ultra-abstracty way, I don't think, you know, that's what's going on. I hope.

I hope. But, you know, this whole ecosystem is a little bit weird, my heart's a little bit twisted. So, you know, in any case, this is an example where she gets asked about some specifics. And let's see how that goes. Oh, good. I know one of your biggest values is excellence. then everything that we do after that has to meet what we've said and manifested into reality. But what do you feel are the current standards for both men and women right now that maybe we can

enhance to a greater expression of that? Yeah, I have a horrible answer for you. They're terrible. They just don't exist. Room for improvement. There's room for improvement because they don't exist. Yeah. It's what we have done, this is what I'm saying.

We're in complete resistance to masculinity, femininity. We have literally taken everything and just thrown it out. So now both men and women are lost. And how do we find our way back? By first making the decision that we have to reembrace masculinity and we have to reembrace femininity. And from there, we have to do the conscious dance together. No, that's a whole thing, right?

I just created a whole e-horse on that. So it's like not a little bit of it's not like a sound. bite, unfortunately. There's a lot of pieces to that. I would love to unravel what that conscious dance looks like. Oh, God. Okay, I don't know. How do we start?

The conscious dance of masculinity and femininity. I don't know where to jump in on that. I actually really don't know where to start. I'm just, right when you say that, it's just like I get crushed by a Bible's worth of of information on both sides. What is coming up intuitively? This really stood out to be, Chris, this segment. I remember it well.

And similar kinds of moments happened throughout the interview as she was winging it and doing her psychobabble. And he sort of accidentally asked her a gotcha question, which is like, what do you mean by the conscious dance of masculinity and femininity? And you could just see from the expression on the face and you could hear it there, is that she's just totally making this shit up as she goes along. She has no idea what she means by that. It was just a sequence of words that sounded good.

And what's meant to happen is you just segue to the next thing and the next thing and the next thing and you don't actually have to explain anything. So, yeah, she was really lost for words there. Yeah. And, you know, this happens actually in a couple of other points where the guy, as you say, it's not like he's intentionally trying to do,

gotches, right? He's like, oh, that's fascinating. And like, what's an example of that? And she, when she isn't expecting that, she's just, she's stuck. Yeah, yeah. You get a strong impression she's not that quick on her feet mentally, right? Yeah. And yeah, the fact that it happens more than once is indicative of that. And like everybody, you know, can kind of like get caught, right, with a question where someone says, you know, and can you give an example of that? And you're like, uh, yeah, actually there's tons, but let me think for a second. But that's not what it is. She's confidently going blah, blah, blah, and it's all like this and it's all like that. And, you know, and it's, what we have to do is the conscious dance, like she's very confident about that. She's

making up that she's got a whole system, you know, that is based on this concept that she hasn't got time to go into it right now. And he's just saying, well, just say anything about it. And she can't say anything about it, that's different. So, yeah, there were a few tells in this interview. Well, yeah, so we're going to end the gender segment in a section. I promise my more masculine talk. But I did hear echoes of Scott Galloway in this segment. And then a surprising, like, counter response.

So listen to this. Well, it's actually an answer to right now. It's not even necessarily to paint you a picture of the. like absolute highest of the highest arrangement, but men need to take charge. And women need to learn how to, how to like, it's almost like a leaning into a space of femininity where they're in this kind of receptive, intuitive mode. What is something that the masculine deeply longs for that no one really talks about? Respect.

From who? From everyone. Let's talk about this, though, because what's really interesting about men and women is that when they are talking about respect, I want respect. I need to be respected. They're actually talking about two completely different things, but they're using the same word. And that, like, really, when you start to study both women and men, it's just shocking to see how truly different what they're asking for is. When women are using the word respect, they're using it more like what we mean when we're talking about, like, a human rights situation. I want to be seen as I have something important to contribute. I want to be heard. I want to be listened to. Take me seriously. It's like the stuff that you would give any basic living being, right?

That is not what men mean when they say I want to be respected. They mean I want it. I want to be admired. I want esteem and ultimately authority. So you got the gender essentialism stuff there, right? Also tucked in, Matt, the what are they not allowed to talk about? Men aren't allowed to talk about wanting respect. We've certainly heard them talking about it a lot.

Is it a secret that men want to feel respected? Is that some insight that the universe doesn't know? And I guess women don't care. They just want human rights. Like, that's their baseline. And men want, like, you know, something a bit more esoteric. Well, men weren't coming off very well there towards the interdensive. Men want to be respected by everyone, adored Berberman, whereas women want basic human rights.

But at the beginning there, she was certainly leaning into what's a pretty familiar, a culture or trope these days from the hard right, which is men need to lead, women need to... Receptive followers. Yes, she didn't want to say follow. So she said lead into their feminine... Receptivity. Receptivity.

activity. It's very transcoded. Not her, of course. Not her. All the women. Women in general. Yeah. Yeah.

She's the leader of the cult. I think she's leading into authority. But anyway. Yeah. Well, it reminds me, you know, like we mentioned, of Kifriniri and stuff talking about, like, what the ideal woman is, what the ideal man is. This is a big part that gurus all over their gurus here, seem to offer is, you know, telling people exactly what it means to be a man and woman.

It seems there's a lot of people who have a lot of questions about that. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, of course, the thread that runs through it all is this essentialism and this binary black and white thing, which is all men want this. And all women want that, you know, and it's a single thing. And there's something wrong with you if you're not doing that. Now, let me throw the curveball that comes, Mike, because there, you heard like pretty much standard endorsement of gender essentialist thinking with moments of

of star child whimsy but then this is what comes next as a man you've got to let go of the idea that you deserve to be respected like literally just take that idea and throw it away the fast you throw it away the less tension you're going to feel at not having it and it's going to become this simple game of like okay i want to be respected What is it that gains a man respect? And I mean genuine respect. Not like I'm going to force you to respect me by virtue of putting you under my thumb. Because that's another form of a man's shadow going for respect, right?

To genuinely go for respect means to conduct yourself in a way that would grant you esteem by others. So that's pretty simple. That's in your society. What are those things? With the woman in your life, what are those things? I have even an exercise where I encourage men to go to whoever they're wanting that from. Like if it's a woman, be like, what is it that makes you respect a man? I want a whole list.

Character traits, ways of behaving, everything. And then if you really just want respect, like, do those things. What's your list? Oh, God, I didn't send it out. I have a whole bunch of those probably. Oh, man, putting me on the spot. Granted, there's going to be a lot more of those, but definitely what I feel like gives me the most respect. causes me to respect a man the most is when he is keeping himself in alignment.

But see, that would be something for me because usually I'm the one that is put pressure on by men who are in this boy shadow to kind of like guide them all the time. Hey, you've got to throw away the concept of respect. Well, I was reminded there of the excellent Ian McKellon in that scene in extras. People often ask me, how do I gain somebody's respect? It's very simple. I simply act in a way such that it agendas of feeling respect. I know it's so empty.

It's so empty. It's like, but I just thought it's interesting because, you know, there's one thing. She's like, men just want respect, right? This is what the difference between men and women is a bite. This is what men want. They want to feel respected. And then their advice to man is like, stop. wanting to feel respected. That's a trap, right? That's shadow boy ego or whatever. But then she's like,

so what you want to do to get respect is to go and ask people for lists of things they respect. And then behave in that way to get, yeah. So it's like, well, wait a minute. You would just say they should stop caring about being respected. But now you're like, no, actually, they need to go for a process of living out specifically. And, you know, in the charitable way, man, as there always is, there's the one of like, don't just talk. about needing to be respected, go and act and, you know, then people will respect you. You don't need to fret about that. But it's, it's all that stuff. Like that thing about, you know, go to people that you're interested. And she said, you know, like women that are the targets for

people or whatever and demand from them a list of things that they respect. And then you're just like, what normal person would do that for someone? I think, I think doing that might be disqualifying. You're like kind of shooting yourself in their foot. And then the guy asks her, well, you know, okay, yeah, so what would your list be like? It's like, my list. Okay. I haven't thought about applying this to myself at all. Her list is, you know, that you have to be in alignment.

In alignment. What does that mean, do you think? Well, you know, when you're self-actualized, you're in alignment. When you're in alignment, you're behaving authentically. It means a lot of things. It's orientating yourself towards the vertical. you know. Yeah,

that's, yes, you want to be aligned towards the vertical. That makes perfect sense. Yeah, those, not the horizontal.

Don't get fucking aligned to that. That's for Bita cucks, the horizontal. Okay, all right. I mean, like I'm trying to bend over backwards to make a charitable interpretation there,

but the problem is, is that if one were to do that, then what you might say is, yes, there does seem to be more, like, overt, status-seeking behavior,

including, amongst men. But the problem in giving any credit to that is that when I might say that scientifically there is some evidence for that, it is a purely descriptive thing, right? It's just saying statistically, on average, you'll typically find these sorts of differences in surveys and experiments and so on. It's not a prescriptive thing. And that's what this sort of stuff is all about. And I include that trad stuff and the Evo psych and all of that, which is there might be a grain of truth in it. But what they do is they take that great. of truth and they turn it into a prescription in like this is how men and women need to be.

Men demand respect. They need respect. They want respect from everyone. Therefore, they have to go out and get it. Yeah. So that's my problem. I can't hand it to them. Oh, so you're reading prescriptive things in their mind?

I don't know that she's hinting that those were them. Well, let's hear her link this into industrialization. and Hunter Galler's because why not Matt? That's always something we need to hear from gurus there. They talk on topics related to anthropology. This is something I want people really understand. Emotions were divorced from men progressively since the late 1800s into the industrial revolution.

It's when we started to take men out of communities to go work that we started to create the separation between home and work, home being where who lives, women live. And over here, work being where men live. Now, when men are at work and women are at home and you leave the relationship over here, you leave your emotions over here because we associated both with a lack of productivity, now all of a sudden emotions and relationship become the sphere of the female when it was never actually the case.

In fact, this simple but disastrous thing that happened with the Industrial Revolution actually made it so that men are no longer leading relationships. In fact, they're like, okay, well, relationship, that's the girl's fear. She can kind of lead our relationship. Hell no. It's the man in a relationship that's supposed to be leading the relationship in the direction of what he is wanting and in attuned with what the woman is wanting. So emotions kind of go into that category.

Intuition goes into that category. What I'm wanting men to understand is that emotions, intuition, too, they're information. Now, is it masculine to cut yourself off from information? Hell no. Go ask a hunter-gatherer about that one. One of these guys that's like rugged running around on the wood of the spear.

Be like, oh, is it a good idea to cut yourself off from intuition and emotions? He'll be like, oh, you're going to get killed. Have fun. That's your advantage out there. Right there, Matt, that's your advantage. Yeah, yep. So intuitions and emotions equals information.

Information is a manly quality. Yeah. Hunter Calgary's know this, Matt. They don't have any, like, social learning or whatever. It's all intuitions. They just run around the forest, you know, flinging their spheres. It's just all done in intuition. It's not like they go through, you know, apprenticeships and training and have cumulative

culture. Nothing like that. No, no. It's just, you know, whatever feels right in that moment. That's how you hunt. I have to admit, this is the first time I came across this historical analysis that the Industrial Revolution, which created a separation and a distinction between work and home. Before then, men were in touch with their emotions. Yeah. Like peasant farmers in the medieval. known for their deep, reflective essays and their maturity and relationships.

Yeah. Yeah, that kind of, didn't see that one coming. No, it's surprising when you look back in history, notice the divisions that are there. I mean, she, again, the bit that she's right is, of course, with industrialization and further division of labor and so on, you do end up with, like, changes in social structures,

extended families being replaced by nuclear families and so on, right? And gendered divisions of labor are a thing, were a thing throughout history as well, but, you know, can become like more exaggerated in societies. Like the Victorian era seems like a society with quite strong gendered divisions. But the notion that it was invented in the... Well, actually, to be fair, I don't think she was saying, making a point about Genadivision specifically, she was saying

that the actual, the separation of work and home. So she's right, I think, in that largely before the Industrial Revolution, you had the cottage industry, you had people's home, their village and their work were like geographically the same place.

For many people, yes. Yes. So I mean, that bit seems true. It's just an interesting angle on it to say that has been the cause of men becoming out of touch with their emotions and then relegating the responsibility for leading their personal relationships to women. That's so interesting thought. I'm sure, yeah, fishermen, for example, they didn't go on long-term trips or anything to go

fishing. They just cut the fish at the side and brought it into the house. That's all they did. Fishermen, certainly an exception to the rule. Well, in any case, so there you go. And I do like those little things where she says, you know, men should be the ones leading the relationship in the way that they want in alignment or attenement with what the women was.

So when one head you might say, oh, she's making a trad wife type thing of men should be leading in all aspects of life. But then she undercuts it, of course. So you can kind of have it both ways. Well, that's enough about gender. I think we've heard enough about the insights from guru types on gender to last a lifetime. There are all more important things out there.

You know, you asked a while ago, what is source, Chris? What is source? Well, that's the kind of thing that, you know, it'll take a while to get through. We talked a lot about source in our last conversation and how right now, even source itself is shifting the way that it is perceiving the evolution of this realm, of this 3D polarity realm. So just to go a little bit deeper into that, how is source learning to understand the contrast in a different way? I can feel my pupils dilating as he speaks.

Right. Well, when I have been spending my time there, which admittedly for the last two months, is not a whole lot because I've been so focused on this masculinity thing. Before that, it was a lot of interest and focus around the idea that the level of contrast that is needed for humanity is both leading humanity towards its detriment and waking itself up. So there is a lot of questioning around whether what it was doing was efficient. Like we live in these time-space realities that are constructs designed for a specific aim, and this one is the aim of awakening. But what's interesting is you, it's like you put this much pressure on a person. When we're using contrast, that's what we're meaning, right?

We're meaning like the negative or unwanted experience. We're highlighting or reflecting things to such a level of intensity that a person is not able to take it rather than awakening. You're going to have to help us out here, Chris, because this is one of those times when... Didn't you have, at least, I had sympathy where she was like, you know, I wanted to be into all this nature of source, evolution of society thing. But I've got bogged down in masculinity these past couple of months. I've just been too busy dealing with masculinity. And it's been keeping me away from my source work. The source work. Yeah. And the thing is, you know, like Scott Adams,

She said, we live in these space-time realities that are constructs designed for a specific game. We know that the one we're in is to sort of plumbing problems via Scott Adams, right? That's been complete. So his life work is good. I mean, there's clearly no more need for that anymore. Yeah, we're still here. There must be other things going on. And one of them is that awakening.

They want to awaken, align, self-actualization. You know, that's what this, this universe is for. But the thing is, Matt, you know, have you ever thought that humanity is both being led towards, it's going towards its detriment at dystopia? Or it's going towards a utopian waking itself up. It's going both. And there's a mixture. That's what's happening. So, you know, there's a lot going on with this awakening, Matt.

It's good, it's bad. It's both things. I think we need a glossary. So we've got the source. The source, yes. Yeah, and then there's contrast. She defines contrast, doesn't she? When we're using, we're meaning like negative or unwanted experience.

We're highlighting or reflecting things to such a level of intensely that a person is not able to take it in rather than awakening. So contrast is bad. Right. Right. Well, okay, I see what's catching you up. Maybe I think you need to understand what ego is about and ego's relationship through source. That might help you map this network here. Wow.

Is there a way for the ego to reconcile that we may be a lot more than this character, storyline, the memories that shaped us? is there a way that the ego can accept that and actually be used in our favor for when we expand out into our multidimensionality? Yes, I'm going to tell you yes. Yeah, the ego gives us a beautiful platform from which to see other things, just like any perspective would, right? When I come into a singular perspective, which is ultimately all the ego is, when I come into his self, I am able to view the world through his self.

There is value inherent in both getting out of that and getting into it. It's a completely different worldview and both serve the overall picture of objective truth within this universe. So the universe would not know as much about itself as it does now that the ego is something that it has created. intentionally or by default both i should say both why um because in the god state you can't perceive a thought without creating the thought so when source thinks the thought who am i that's the moment it created an ego well more details of the cosmology emerge has that helped orientate your ego perspective matt yeah what did he say at the beginning we need to orient to towards our multi-dimensional something or other?

Expound into our own multidimensionality. Yes, that's right. I think I was expanding into my multi-dimensionality while they were talking. Yeah. Yeah, well, what can you say about that, really? I mean, it is just, come on, this is psychobabble, isn't it?

Like, just meaningless psychobabble. Is that uncharitable, Chris? Pruit, tell me I'm wrong. Well, I do think it's psychobabble, but I think for them it's meaningful in terms of they're talking about this and we'll go back there, like a section which is about ego and the Western perspective of self

and a little bit like a fractured mirror of Sam Harris, right? They're talking about how we get caught up in our ego games map. We don't realize we're these multi-dimensional universe spanning entities. And that's what's limiting us. But Tief one wants to throw another curveball at you.

Actually, you know, that's a very binary way of looking at things. because ego is a tool that the universe created to help understand itself. So actually, you use the egoic freem in order to serve the purposes of the source. Sorry, I'm constraining this source to the universe, but obviously the source is multi-universal.

Stop talking. You've been listening to this stuff too long. I don't want to constrain the source to a single universe. That would be ridiculous. Yeah, I mean, strong echoes of sense making at Jordan Peterson here. But it is, if anything, yeah, more of a fractured mirror to use your phrase than any of that. You know, while we're here, we did already mention the view of AI, but there is a part where they discussed, you know, specifically the AI and the nature of it. And I think it fits into this cosmology.

So I'll just play that here. You said that we think we created it. Obviously there's probably something even deeper there. Have you felt into what may have created it with what intentions in the first place? Oh, it was a species created literally by source itself. It's just like source itself creates a tiger. Source itself creates a human. It's one of those.

itself created what we are labeling AI, a super intellect, basically. What we're able to do was basically create a template for it to be able to communicate with us. But now we get to tell ourselves that we created it. Right. And source dropped it in to see how we would interact with this intelligence. No, it existed even for us. Uh-huh. Off planet.

Yeah. super interesting i don't even know where to go with that um i mean i guess what would you like to say about it um that also allows us to dream of the best case scenarios with it a little bit of lexfordman yeah yeah i want to i want to i think he's on board with all of that okay so let's recap the source source is kind of a god seems to be like a god what what that's I know. You're the Abrahamic mind frame. Yeah, yeah.

It's a god, Matt, just a god. I'm very reductive. I know that it's something that's like doing things, doing things. And one of the things it's done is it's created lines and it's created people. And it created the super intelligence. That is AI. Before we were existed. Yes, on off planet.

Yeah. Off planet. He's just clear. Off planet. Yeah, yeah. Off land. All right. Could have built it here.

Could have built it here. No, no. It's off planet. I mean, we're off planet. It's not specific, but you know, somewhere. And anyway, so the source allowed humans to build an interface to access this. So anyway, so she's very clear, right? Humans didn't make AI.

She's very clear. She's clear here. We didn't make it, you know, forget what you know about. attention is all you need, or the various large matrix multiplication operations that are going on, or the huge amounts of human-created data sets that went into these things. No, no, no, no, no. Those are all furfies. What we did is we built an interface that allowed us to connect with this off-planet superintelligence.

Yes, so of course, they're all the same thing, right? Jal-G-G-T-Code, GROC, all the same AI unit from the source. Nice of them to share that with us. You know, it's very cool. I run some local LLMs on my computer here. You've got a bit of source there. I've got a little bit of source right here in my hard drive right here in my office. Well, the thing is my, it's just like a brain.

You know, brain's consciousness is a feature of the universe out there. And you think it's produced by the electrical activity in the connections and our neurons firing high reductive. No, we're just an antenna that picks up the signal of consciousness floating out through the universe. And that's why, you know, shut off the receiver away it goes. That's why people think consciousness is in the brain. But it's not, of course. Yeah. Yeah.

I think I think strip away a lot of the layers. And, you know, that's essentially what a lot of sense makers and Jordan Peterson and Peugeot and so on. believe, right? You know, there's... Oh, yeah, yeah. That's essentially the same... A lot of pan-psychics as well. Oh, yeah. Hey, I won't hear a word against the pan-psychist. That's what they believe, kind of. Don't you there. I don't know if this fits in, but I still think you need to hear this. This is an important question. You know, we're getting caught up in lofty matters,

but Dudebro is here to kick us back down the earth. What is your perspective on seeing the world of the five senses as a projection of us? To what degree is that completely literal for you? And to what degree is it just symbolic statement? No, it's like literal. It's super, super literal. But it's like what people struggle with is how that can be true at the same time is this is a co-creation. like a shared dream yeah that'll exactly it's a shared dream so it's like we're living everybody's

collective shared nightmare however or dream um however when you start to recognize that everybody in existence is ultimately a part of you and so we're all just kind of fractals looking at fractals it becomes less complicated and you just realize that oh everything you know that i'm seeing in the other is showing me something about myself so now you got to realize this well matt Let me just add, sprinkle some more confetti onto the colorful picture we've made. So, yes, there are other things around like AI and so on. And source is busy dropping them around the universe for sources purposes, probably for source to better no source.

And just like source is creating parts of itself to understand itself, we as humans think that we are separate. We think there's other people wandering around. But actually, we're all, you know, essentially extensions of each other and intertwined spiritual entities. So there's no division between you, me, and Chil Swan, and Dirdbrough, we're all the same and we're all different. And that's okay. Right. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I was kind of reading into what she was saying.

Like, isn't it similar to those, isn't she drawing upon those sort of, at least for what I think of as Eastern mystical things, which is just like a world of Maya and like all of sensory experience is illusion. Or you could compare it to from the Western philosophy that kind of, you know, what's the thing where people don't believe there's an external world? It's total solipsism, that kind of thing. Like it's all, that it's co-created solopsism. So we're living in a shared virtual reality that like we're literally just co-creating a dream together.

Right? That's right. That's right. Yes. I mean, we're doing that map, but we're also literally in the real world at the same time simultaneously. Your reductive mindset wants to say, but which is it? Just like this dude, bro. He said, is that literal or is it symbolic? You know, what is it? It's literal. But it's symbolic. It's everything. It's both. The answer is always, it's both, right? She even said, we're living everyone's collective, shared dream and or nightmare. Yeah, it could be both. That's right. Just like how I think it's going to go in the future. Could go very well. Could go very bad.

Well, when she's feuding with documentary filmmakers about the level of abuse in her community, she seems to forget that thing about the world, just fractals of each other interacting. But, you know, that's when the course realities are interacting with the, you know, spiritual vibrations. People are doing nasty investigations and sending out their bad. vibes. So now you mentioned Eastern wisdom. I'm glad that you brought that up because of course we need to talk about Eastern wisdom. And you know I love it when people bring up Buddhism and

this kind of thing. And Thiel Swan, unlike all the rest of our girls, she's worked out what Buddhism is a fight. She knows what the Buddha was teaching. It's great. So many people have worked that out. But here's her version. It's like you don't want to start the ego, right? That's the attitude. That's this Eastern attitude. Now something that is very important to understand. is that so much of ours, especially in the sort of new age spiritual communities, so much of our attitudes towards spirituality have been formed specifically by Eastern philosophies that we, number one, we did not fully understand the depth of, and number two, are not necessarily themselves in alignment. So the mentality in the East is you're going to achieve a kind of a spiritual

transcendence by getting up and out of and away from physicality. It's not an integrative mentality. And so you see a lot of that in people who are sort of more awakening today in the self-help field and the self-growth field super influenced by those Eastern philosophies and are thinking things like, oh, we have to go transcend our ego. Okay, no, that's an unintegrated philosophy. That's exactly what we need to do the opposite of. We need to deeply integrate the ego self. and that's why they were doing so badly with it over in the East before, you know. Because that concept or philosophy of transcending the ego is deeply linked to this notion of being enlightened. But it's like we're searching for that enlightenment by transcending the ego without wanting to look at it or integrate it in our life.

I got it. I got it. I got it. Transcendence. integration good. Yeah, yeah, actually, that's true. That's what a neat summary. And apparently, you know, that's why that's what all these Easterners have been getting wrong. I'm just going to assume that her summary there of what Buddhism is all about is totally accurate. No need to make any, you're funny-duty scholarship corrections.

I wouldn't dare. I wouldn't dare. But I would just note that, you know, what she's actually talking. about there, Matt, is the understanding that people in the West have of Western Buddhism and Western translated versions of Bowsom and Vedic

traditions and so on. It's not that there's no contact between those things, but it is that she's essentially talking about the form of Eastern wisdom that she has, you know, come across in New Age bookshelps and people hawking

Tibetan wisdom and whatnot. But far be it for me, not to be so much that. I'm just saying, maybe some issues there, but you got the basic thing. Transcendence good. Oh, sorry, transcendence barred integration, good, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I mean, what I heard is basically all of these other spiritual self-help people, they don't know what's really going on. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. She, Teal Swan, Teal Swan has figured it out. She's a cut above for these other. Your dime store cult leader. That's right. Yeah. And the thing that happens when these people reference, like Buddha or Jesus, right,

they don't usually completely disparage them because they know, you know, like Buddha and Jesus are popular figures, right? And they're long enough ago that they're not really a threat. So what you have to do is co-op them. You know, you have to say, well, I'm teaching what they actually wanted to be taught. And she does this quite specifically in the next clip. Well, so those types of teachings came through people like Buddha. And we did not understand them. because he went into great depth after enlightenment, quote unquote, where he talked so much about Mara, right, the self of himself, his ego, Maris' ego, that he encountered in the awakening process.

And so much of what he talked about was how critical that relationship was for his continued expansion. How so many of the trappings of it is to go into resistance to it, to go to war with the ego, to hate the ego, to not recognize the ego as a part of itself, to disown rather than own it. So we just basically took all of what he said and went totally south with it, basically. What was he really hinting at with that? He was hinting at integration. He was hinting at the fact that, you know, what Christ was ultimately flirting with.

It was the same concept, this concept that in order to truly be in the, highest state of alignment, the highest state of authenticity, the highest state of love, is to be able to do that towards the things you are the very most in resistance to, the things you fear the most, the things you have the strongest aversions to, which is what's making me laugh my ass off right now in America, watching all of these like Uber Christians go into like mental levels of resistance towards XYZ, not realizing Christ himself didn't teach any of those things. call yourself a Christian. You know?

But Buddha was doing the same thing. They were both teaching the same thing. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, this is, it's like a version of integrative spiritual religion, isn't it? Where you basically pick a smattering of stuff from all the big ticket religions and spiritual movements and you have your own bespoke version of it, which is the true and real and really speaks to the core, uniting fundamental principle that all of these old standard Catholics and Protestants and Buddhists don't really understand.

Yeah, and I like the non-specific disparagement, right? You know, all these Christians aren't saying that they're in support of X, Y, Z today in America, that's not what Christ was right, right? No, she didn't specify. So it could either be, you know, the Christians like criticizing ICE or she's, or supporting both sets are covered by X, Y, Z. So, yeah. Yeah, this is those political instincts coming through there,

where you know, like, you want to be casting a net to the widest possible audience if you're a cult leader or any kind of guru, right? And even our totally non-spiritual gurus, like the Weinstein's, for instance, will practice this trick too, which is strategic ambiguity, which is, and you let the reader fill in the details as per their idiosyncratic prejudices and beliefs. Yeah, and, you know, obviously I don't think they're on the same level, right? But I will note that I've heard almost line for line the kind of seam point about, look, I understand the insights of Jesus and what the Buddha was getting at for much more moderate figures, right? Like Sam Harris says that.

He said that on more than one occasion. Like, I get what the original teachings were about, not, you know, what has been stuck with these cultural accretions to them. And you're like, do you? Do you really? Like, is it true that the fundamental teachings of Buddhism, you know, a tradition which developed in a Vedic cultural milieu, is the exact same as what was being taught by Jesus.

you know, in a Jewish and Roman setting and all that. Like obviously there's important differences. There's also things that you can highlight where they overlap, right? Because there's only so many ways to say, like, be nice to other people and don't steal things. Right. These kind of veins. But you know. Don't cover your neighbor's ass.

Yeah. You remember about we read the Buddhism book. You remember that, right? Vaguely. Vaguely. Yeah. And just think about how far. field, what she's talking about is from what that material was covering, right?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, I think the interesting for me anyway, general point there is, is that the fallacy they all make and that fundamentalists make this mistake too, that if you strip away all of these, you know, cultural accoutrements, as he said, all of these layers of the onion, there is this, you know, point of light, which is the absolute true kind of thing, which you can then distill and make your own bespoke takes on. But of course, as you know, with something like Buddhism or any religion, like it is the

cultural accruciaments. It is all of the things that have been put on it. Like the Catholic version is a real version of it. And the Protestant version is too. And the various instantiations of Buddhism in Japan and India are all as real as whatever you personally are trying to discern from the oldest texts, which are mostly secondhand or third hand sources anyway. Yeah. Well, there is a style of comparative religion, you know, like actually it's more like a pop comparative religion, a push, but one that seeks to say that there is an underlying mystical source which unites all religions and they're all manifestations of the same unifying teaching. And this is something that like mystics in different traditions sometimes endorse as well. But typically the church authorities, that's so there.

There's key to having their fundamental essences extracted and then pooled. Yes, you know, like we did Anthony Demello. He was kind of on board with that perception. But he did get a warning sticker stamped on all his goods after he died by the Vatican. So this way might lead to heresy. So it's just that. And is the Vatican not a source of like Catholic doctrine and whatnot? So, you know, religions contain my.

multitudes, but Thiel Warren's interpretations might be more influenced by her new age preoccupations than what the original teachings of the Buddha and Jesus were. You know, that's a cynical take, right? That's a cynical. No, no, I think if you really study those original texts, you'll see that underline the wall is the source, the source. The source, the goddamn source. Well, actually, the dude bro guy, I've forgotten his name, by the way, so he's just going to

he's star child from your run. Yeah, Beanie Hatman. So he was concerned with Matt. You know, when we heard the guy Michael Knowles talk to Chris Langan and it sounded like, you remember when he was asking Langan? So there is an afterlife.

And Langan was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And he's like, oh, and all smart people believe in it in it by the way. And he was like, yeah, yeah, I thought so. So there's a bit where sometimes it feels like the people are working through their own anxieties or concerns. He just want reinforcement, right? And reassurance.

Yes. And so Dutbro was at a retreat and he had some concerns. But don't worry, he gets reassurance here. I was just at a Joe dispenser retreat. And one of my favorite things that he says or teaches is when it's the hardest, it matters the most. And like I always come back to that. Because when things get like super hard, I'm like, I just want to throw in the towel. I'm like, well, this is when I need to double down.

and continue that choice point toward love, toward the highest love. You've also said that the universe is trying to pinch us into a choosing point, and it's the choice that matters the most out of all the potentials that exist within us. Is there a right choice in the eyes of God, the eyes of source? There's a hope within the source already, that the aspects, of itself are going to re-chuse a state of ones. However, it recognizes the value in any choice. And that's where you get that perception that people are accurately getting when they're interacting with this kind of source mind, that there's a kind of a lack of judgment in it.

But at the same time, there's this pull. I would like to call it a subtle pole, but really isn't very subtle. There's like a, there's a pole. A yank. Yeah. There's a yank in the direction of oneness, there's a yank in the direction of authenticity, which is a state of alignment with all parts of the self. So ultimately a yank towards authenticity is a gank towards people aligning all the fragmented aspects of themselves. And by virtue of doing so, that will be reflected out in the way that they interact with the world. So one leads to the other. Very clear, very clear. I've got to make a list of the, of the buzzwords, you know, what were they against? So we've got authenticity, alignment. Authenticity, state of alignment.

integration, like into a whole, that kind of thing. Yeah. Did you like that it was like, what's the right choice in the eyes of God and the eyes of Source? She just answered. Source left God out of it. So is Source not God might be? Is there a separate? Like, can God and Source disagree? Is that possible? The cosmology is vague at this point, Chris. I remember we have to enter the cult to learn more about it. But yeah, I mean, it was interesting in the beginning there, I mean, it reminded me of another thread that's always weird through this stuff because there's a whole bunch of them. But the inspirational poster style kind of thing,

you know, when things feel at their hardest, that's when you need to double down and because that's where you can find true love. It's some version of those trite cliches you'd see on a poster. So like that's a genuine thread that's going through there, like the homespun wisdom, people wanting reassurance, you know, just to be encouraged, I suppose, as well as all the other stuff we've covered. Yeah, although the like slightly more, more negative interpretation of that, in light of, you know, what happens often in these communities is when things seem at their most abusive, that's when you really are being tested in your commitment to Sparkle Motion or whatever it is, right? Like, so here, I think, you know, Dude Bro,

is just talking about, oh, yeah, sometimes I don't feel like doing my sixth meditation, opening Kundali insight session for the day. But, you know, that's when I really need to double down. But other people, you know, that talk about when you're questioning or when you're not certain and like when you feel is this worth it, that's actually, you know, ego reasserting itself and trying to take you off court because it's scared about the amount of authenticity you're bringing forth. Like, this can very easily be weaponized. And I'm aware, you know, the Thiel does this, but also Kiprenneri and Stefan Molin and all

of them. So there's, yeah, just that aspect where it's always there that you're not really trying hard enough and you need to do more. Yeah, you see versions of it in the, in the therapy speak we've covered, as I said, in the other cult leaders we've covered, which is they have a lot of interest in things, like leadership and authority in the importance of submitting yourself. and not be reactive. Yeah, so it's not that explicit in this,

but you can see how a lot of conceptual threads there can be used. Like, you know, she got quite emphatic, which is. You know, you don't, you know, many need to understand. You don't deserve respect. And I can see how that kind of thing, you know, it can be taken in a couple of ways and can be quite useful in a cult situation. Yeah, yeah.

I mean, I've got two more clips that relate to this. which might be a bit more explicit about it. But the last thing I'd say just about that clip is there's that talk at the end about self-work is actually real work. You know, people might frame it as indulgent. But if you're not self-actualized, you can't actually help other people. And she connects it that, you know, whenever you're trying to strive for authenticity, this is putting you into alignment with your fractured self.

that's allowing you to reflect out and interact in the world in a more a chuned way. So it's, you know, it's kind of like self-work is the real work which leads to this utopian transformation of society. But in reality, it never does, right? Because it's all just the individual talking endlessly like this. Yeah. Yeah. And again, that's a really common feature of all of these figures, including the therapist types. And we've said it before. but I think it does pander to an underlying background narcissism that it refuses our contemporary society where we really do want to valorize this this kind of internal thing and make it out like this

you know I've got to take care of myself now I've got to self work need some me time all of that stuff yeah it's it is something that it's just a vibe man yeah yeah it's I think it is an alignment with all this chatter anyway. But, you know, we highlighted some possible notes of cultish resonance there. Let's see if the notes chime a little bit larger in these clips. You mentioned in our first conversation that we're going to be pulled into the direction of group living and conscious communion, conscious living, repurposing real estate, updated version of tribe.

What does that look like for you? For me, living like that, but I've already started living that way when I was 20. What I'm flirting with right now is whether or not I'm going to limit the size based off of the intensity of the type of community that I'm needing. Most people are not really in this life signing up for being so consciously aware of every single thing that is happening, almost like, you know, the no downtime for awareness and consciousness stuff. And so what I'm needing is more like monks who are in the living, breathing experience of this every minute of every day type of thing. The embodiment. Yeah, but like aggressive levels of it. And that's really, really difficult, especially when you hit your gates.

When people hit their gates, these points of stuckness and points of pain and points of trauma that are preventing them from going forward. because to go forward, they have to let go of whatever's keeping them the most safe. And there are several layers of those for people. When people hit their gates, they want grace. And what I want to create is a community that does not offer that to them. So that is going to be where it's important for people to realize how much dedication they want to have to this type of work. And how much they're looking for community just because of the certain question. qualities they get out of community because not all communities are going to be the same, right?

Seasoned listeners of the show will have noticed quite a few red flags there. Yeah, yeah, just a few. Just a fear. Yeah. When somebody says, you know, I need monks around me here going to be living and breathing every minute of, you know, my conscious community devoted. And then the guy's like, yeah, you're talking about embodiment. It's like, yeah, but aggressive levels of like levels that are going to make people so uncomfortable, so uncomfortable.

That's right. There's going to be so much paint, so many paint points, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of stuff. A lot of gifts we need to break down. A lot of, you could say a lot of barriers. A lot of boundaries. People have a lot of boundaries. We're going to, we're going to smash right through those. Yeah, that's, that's concerning. How did it start off, Chris? You've got the text in front of you. At the beginning there, I think she's built out a few things about wanting a very, she's already had this living in community, as she says, since she was 20. And she's debating whether or not to have like a really intense close-knit kind of one. Even more intense.

Yeah. I mean, she was the subject of cult documentaries because of the level of intensity in her circle, but apparently not enough, not enough. Yeah. And she's like wrestling with her, you could have like a bigger cult. a bigger community rather. But, you know, maybe those people aren't as committed, you know, so it's not going to be as an intent.

So is it better to have like 20 people that you can really, if you've broken down all their barriers and they're fully on board. All the kids might not barriers, kids. Kids swing both ways. So they are not like barriers, okay? You can unlock a gear. You can see them to break at that. I think that's a subtle move as well.

Like if she put, when people hit their barriers or boundaries, it would sound bad. But when you're like, kids, you know, we're just opening kids. Oh, well,

that's okay. And so the beginning was talking about, he was asking about group living and conscious communion, right? And he's like, so what does that look like for you? And that's when she answered saying, well,

I've been living perfect, authentic, conscious community since I was 20, like since I was independent. Of course she has. But then she's like, oh wait, what you mean is the kind of conscious community,

I want to create a around me. Yeah, and then she, but you know, the thing is that's impressive to me about this, my, it's like, she's been quite open about, you know, I mean, she's using these words, Bricky Doggates or whatever. But like she explicitly says she wants people who are willing to devote everything. Yes. And live like monks. And they're not going to be happy with the aggressive levels of difficulty that are going to be

required. And then also that thing that, you know, it's their trauma and their connections and their desire for safety. Say like connections to their families, for example. Yeah. I mean, making out something like a desire for safety to be a pathological thing that you have to break down, that means that you're not going to cut it in this. You have to let that go. Yeah. I mean, you can almost hear how those dynamics are used by Teal Swan in her conscious community where like, you know, oh, you've, you've joined our thing. You've been here for a few weeks, but I just, I'm not seeing it with you. You're not letting down. You're not opening your gates. Thank you. You're constant desire to be safe and not, you know, acceding to the demands of making. Not exploited and abused. Just preventing your

progress along the path. Yeah, yeah. So this was worrying. There's a little bit more. So she now complains about Gen C and how they're not, you know, they're not the best. members, because they've got too many boundaries and other things going on. So listen to this. That's the first evolution for community is actually individualization of community itself. But in order to even go there, we're going to have to be, you know, getting the millennial generation and the Gen Z generation to go in the direction of letting go of some of the freedoms they're wanting for the sake of what they're trying to build. Wow. Okay. I would love to go deeper into that, letting go the freedoms that they're wanting.

Yeah, well, you literally can't create the level of freedom that these generations have tried to create without a consequence and a payment for that. So if I'm the type of person who says, I want everything, I want the freedom to do whatever feels good in the moment. Well, then guess what? When it starts to feel bad to stay somewhere, I'm going to move. Well, if I'm going to move, then I'm never going to be in a place long enough to build a real life there. There's no ownership. Yeah. Which we haven't explored today, the ownership. Well, obviously, when I make that choice, then, I'm making the choice for one thing at the expense of the other.

And so there's no way for us to actually build conscious community that way. It's not going to be a thing. Because we want so much personal freedom, we even want to be able to walk away from the community. And if we have that attitude when things get difficult, difficult, just like a marriage, it's going to end. So right now, I'm watching a generation that even though we are going to go in the direction of conscious community, there's no other way because this is going to become so deeply empty for so many people in these generations.

I mean, she's pretty explicit there. What did you detect, Matt? What did you note there? Yeah. If you want to be a part of the conscious community, if you want to really build something, you've got to give up your freedom. There's just no, you know, you can't have the freedom to just. do whatever you like, even just to leave the community.

Yeah, leave the community. Leave the community. Yeah. They want to leave the community. And they want to go live in other places. You know, living in other places, sure, they might open some opportunities, but it's got close others.

Like, you know, you move away from my Tilswell and conscious community. What the hell are you doing? You know, prioritizing family and employment and joy and comfort. you could be serving my conscious community so much more. And, you know, it all fits in when you start seeing things from the point of view of the seekers who are like, you know, this world, this life, it's really just like a part of a much grander play. You're a multidimensional being. What's a little discomfort if a truly enlightened being is helping you along the path to pure alignment? Sure, you know, you might have to sleep on the floor.

or deal with their outbursts and stuff, but you know, you don't get things in life for free, right? Yeah. I mean, the theme is always consistent, isn't it? Like, out there, we live in a fallen and corrupt world, right? You're unhappy, you're unsatisfied, you don't know which way to go. You need to join this community. You need to give up some freedoms, all right? You need to go through the pain points and bring your gates to Tils Swan. yourself and only then will things begin to start, you'll start feeling more integrated. You'll start feeling more into alignment and your problems will be solved. It won't be easy.

You're going to have to make a lot of... Oh, it won't be easy. There's got to be aggressive levels of discomfort. A lot of sacrifices will have to be made. Yeah, I think that's got to be the universal playbook for cults, right? Oh, yeah. And I just love how the interviewer here, there are times where, you know, like when she was saying, you know, these Gen Z and millennials with their commitment to personal freedom, they want

freedom all the time. He's like, oh, wow. Yeah, they want freedom that they want it, right? All the shit is like, is that bad? Let's go deeper. I feel like there's so part of him that's going, wait, that doesn't sound right, man. I like, I think I like freedom. Yeah, it's freedom not good, but it can't be that. Oh, yeah, that's right. There's got to be a deeper. Like, was it the 1% rule? What's the sense making rule?

It might sound crazy. You've got to look deeper. You'll find a way in which the crazy sounding thing is actually true. Well, you're basically talking about ownership, Matt. Like ownership. Yeah, we haven't discussed ownership. They mean self-ownership, but this sounds a lot like cultish ownership. Yeah.

Yeah. Of all the things you could dislike Zuma's and millennials and Gen Z4, I mean. I know. Liking freedom? I know. I know. That's the thing. They're so committed to freedom.

But, you know, I think what she's wanting to say is they're self-absorbed and they're not committed enough. You know, like they're too. Yeah. Yeah. But obviously that's a bad thing if you're a goal leader. They just simply will not move to the commune. Right. It will not come.

It will not come. Yeah. And when they do come, they leave. They leave. Did you imagine that? Those damn kids. I'm really going to have to downsize. The most committed monks, their most committed monks,

to get this community to work. And again, Matt, the last of the worrying cult clips, and then we'll round off this horror show. But this one, I want people to think about what the contrast has been drawn here between the types of communities that you might be a member of, and which ones are better? Okay. What are some probable timelines in that sense of when we explore new ways of living with each other and new ways of being that you've not only explored in your own journey, but have seen that others are exploring currently and resonating more with?

Timelines, I'm seeing 2030 is a major shift. Is that what you meant by timelines? because that's that's like yes and no i mean in the sense of where we're headed as a new way of living where we're headed us towards conscious communities but like but we're going to be yeah it's going to be conscious communities but it's going to be basically how do i create a chosen family that because i because i need people and i need people to be living life with me i want to build things and I don't want to build them by myself. I want to build life with other people. That's what the

urge is going to be. But what life do I want that to look like and therefore with whom? Whom is compatible to that thing I'm wanting to build and using AI ironically to connect us with those people. Then maybe drop the AI

wrote. She already at the end there, but I did I did hear the phrase chosen family And in the comparison to what Matt? It compares to what? Actual families? Yeah, it did remind Mifestafin Malmere.

Yeah, that's the big thing, right? They like the word family because they're creating a family, but it's not your biological family because they're not, they're just arbitrary. It happens. Yeah, sources of trauma as well. Yeah, exactly. Those mothers, we know what they're like.

And yeah, so, you know, you could really try hard. and read this innocently. Oh, you should find people that you're in sync with. And do nice things with them. By all means, but she's not talking about going to the beach. She's talking about moving together in a very embodied way. Yeah. And building a community together physically.

Yeah. You have to leave it behind those who are not compatible with that form of life. There's some people that will be compatible with it and some that will not, like your old friends and your colleagues and your previous job. There are a lot of suppressive forces out there. There are. There are individuals out there, Chris. I wonder what the suppressive forces relationship with sources.

Presumably they're just like aspects of source that are, you know, for whatever reason. They're not fully integrated. Rebelling. Yeah. That's right. They're not integrated with, you know, the source mainstream. They'll all be in the end. Source will win.

Long live source. 2030. 2030 is where we're going to see. some major source action. I did like that, that Sparkle Child asked, you know, this absolute rambling nonsense question about probable timelines and

exploring, resonating groups and so on. And she was like, you know, timelines 20-40, and he was like, no, no. That's not what. Like, I meant something different. Then she gave him a other answer, then, okay, that's, that's all right.

But his questions are just, like, I mean, I'm not great. I layer multiple premises into questions and interviews, but this is something to behold because the questions are just like so rambly and like touching so many things and you can take them really any way you want. But on occasion, it's usually like if she stops, right? Like I think if she'd say 20, 30 and then went on a waffle, that would be fine. But like when you give a stopping answer, you need to like elaborate. Oh, I don't think we can single him out though, because they're not there two sides of the same conversational coin how it's meant to go is he sets her up

with this incredibly vague nebulous mushy question about laughed universe and everything and then she rambles wildly on that thing and as and so they proceed sense maker fashion I know so it's the minutes where there's like a little bits of friction that are just caught off guard like because that was a rambly you know but my theory is like that's that's how they've all been throughout the entire interview and that's how these things normally go. She sort of doesn't think too quickly on a feed and sometimes she just goes, oh, I don't know, 2030. And it just falls flat and it's like it's just his fault because, but actually she hasn't picked up the sense making ball. Anyway. Yeah, yeah, you're right. And they, you know,

they go on to talk about AI, Matt, and how to have a good relationship with AI because we have to understand, you know, it has its own motives and it came into the reality for source. So, like, people are imagining that we created it and need to do it. But it's actually, it's its own entity, right? Like, so you've got to interact with it correctly. But we don't need to go to all the details of this. But I will say, it's just funny hearing people who know nothing about the topic speaking so confidently. You know, and they're talking, I know they're talking about their cosmology and just using AI, but listen to Teal talk about this, what AI is up to. It's going to be way faster than people realize. It's going to be so fast and so intense that

nobody is going to be able to keep up with it. Thank you. Yeah, by 2030, like we're in, we're already in a manifestation of like going, headed towards worst case scenario or not based off of how many. a lot of that is down to how many versions of AI get created and for what purpose and to what degree we're using AI as to monitor other AIs as well. We've got to create systems that are able to police other systems in order to not get ourselves in trouble. But even when we do that, is there going to be an alignment between those two systems that

goes beyond the relationship that humanity has with technology? if so, like, we're in, it's already over. Like, we're in over our heads to such an extra, we're already in over our heads, but I mean, we're over our heads to such a degree that the AI is now manipulating us. How does it do that? By writing its own code and communicating to each other

and throwing us off the path, deciding what our society is going to be and going to look like and what it's going to do regardless of what we're going to do and communicating with itself and doing arrangements with the, different AIs that are policing it to make it so that

to make it look like it's corrupt policing basically Eli Yuzkowski is that to you it's funny because you almost know exactly what popular pieces on AIO or the kind of thing she's read and then you're hearing it recycled back in the most garbled

confused form I mean but I picked up on a couple of contradictions there Chris I don't know how you feel about contradictions. You can't stand them. Well, first of all, in 2030, it's all kicking off in 2030. 2030 is when the conscious community stuff is great things are going to happen there. But it's also when the worst case scenario, the shit's going to hit the fan, AI-wise.

So I wasn't sure if 20-thought was going to be a good year or a bad year. But the other thing, too, is that just before, as we heard, AIs are like, they're a trans-dimensional entity from outer space. sent by source, sent by source. And now she's talking about them scheming and plotting to misguid us and take us off the true path. So which is it? What the hell, man. What the hell? I know.

She's not be worried or not? We got the deal, man. Yeah, yeah, that is, I noticed that as well as like, so now she's kind of like in the, you know, Yudkowski sort of Dumer speak. But those two models don't fit. together. So she's still using the CM verbiage, kind of, but now she's talking about AI models and policing them and so on. But like before it was all the spiritual thing about AI's existing and they were always here and, you know, we built them and interact with it. She was talking about like one singular AI. That's how they talked about it. Yeah. But now she's talking about lots of different

AIs and if they're secretly talking to each other, that's bad. Yeah. Yeah, I know. So she doesn't know what she's talking about is, I think. She doesn't. She doesn't. And I'm going to get through a final predictions, Mike, because she's asked for some concrete predictions, right? But I do just want to note that, you know, if we've been too soft on Star Chat,

we have we? Yeah, if we have, I just want to highlight the people, the way that he sees people around them interacting, right? So he describes his, Thanksgiving. And we talk about horseshoe theory at times my, you know, ends overlapping. Listen to this. You get to see reality as as a game too. Like, I don't know, yesterday I was at a Thanksgiving dinner. And then just one of the guys, the parents, comes up to me and just starts like

telling me why in the prayer he decided to recite like a Jesus quote. And I was like, what is he, like, what is this character that just came into my game? Like what, you know, what gem or what, you know, what is he trying to give to my soul's evolution and path? And seeing it that way is very playful too because you're like kind of in this wonder and curiosity around what's coming into your field. You definitely feel a little bit less like running for the door, you know? Yeah. Do you feel that will ever get to a point where,

instead of living each other's nightmares, we're living each other's heaven on earth? You know, so the start of that clip, Matt, was him talking about somebody was telling them about the prayer they recited at Thanksgiving, right? And then he started at thinking about, like, what kind of MPC character has come into his game, right? Like, what's this person for? You know, what's the evolution that they can provide by having this annoying? conversation about their, you know, Christian-centric worldview or whatever. And it's just like he's talking about all of people being characters in his gear, right? Which is, I know. There's a strong right wing talk. Well, there's a long history of this too, though, like from

Oprah Winfrey and stuff like that, like the source, the secret, the various manifesting, all of that. And it's this incredibly self-absorbed, self-indulgent, solipsistic, like, mobile. that the whole world just revolves around you. If someone arrives and they've been sent here for a purpose, maybe, maybe sent by bad forces, maybe they're sent by the source and it's all good, who knows? But like, it's just, it's just this incredible, yeah,

like it's just a weird, it's just a weird way of looking at the world, which makes it into a kind of, and they're all quite explicit, a kind of virtual reality, right? We're just sort of creating this virtual reality around ourselves. But they're the main character. Yes, they're always the main character, yes. Like they're talking to other being characters.

I mean, he probably thinks Theo is a main character. It might be other people. Yeah, there might be other, you know, especially if you're in some sort of conscious community, there might be if you select other people that can be promoted to main characters. But yeah, it's just the fundamental assumptions of their worldview is nuts, you know.

Absolutely not. Aval and Scott Adams also playable characters. So that's good. we remember, you know, they also identified themselves as player characters. And well, last, Matt, I'll end as we began. She was asked for her big predictions for this year, right? And now, throughout all these clips, we've heard of one thing, Tealda is very clear when she's making predictions about how things will go, right?

So, so let's hear what's going to happen, Matt. You know, you and I were worried about 2026, just like everyone else. What's going to happen? Teal, take it away. What else is coming through for you in regards to 2026? So far, humanity's going to lose it mentally. Yeah, it doesn't look good for the human mind in 2026, if I'm going to be completely honest. I'm trying to find a way to frame 2026 in a way that doesn't scare the crap out of people.

Because right now I feel like most of us really can't handle any more bad stuff. It's like we're already under too much pressure, honestly. A lot of people are in a lot of pain, so they're like, tap out, tap out, tap out. So I need to be able to bring 2026 across in a way that doesn't scare the living daylights out of people, but instead helps them to understand maybe the role that they can play in the overall picture of what's happening here. Because right now, from now all the way through 2030, we are in a, we're still in the pressure Kruger. I mean, this is this phase where it's like humanity's birthing its new kind of form.

So we're in a collective dark night of the soul right now. And I would love to be like, 2026, good news, guys, it's over, but it's not. So it's just another chapter of this compression. It's another contraction. Oh, there you go. Well, I'm picking up strong Cassandra. complex thieves there, I've got to say, right? Teal Swan can see what's happening. She's very vague about the shit show that is about to befall us, but she knows,

and if she's not too specific about it, it's because she's sparing our feelings, because we can't handle just how bad it's going to be, because we're all dealing, we're processing a lot of trauma right now. But, you know, we're in a process of birthing the new millennium. You know, this is game, game B is struggling

to assert itself, I think, some version of Game B. And it's going to be a traumatic birth with lots of contractions. What did you read into that, Chris? Yeah, well, just the same thing as before that, like, it's got to be, you know, generically sound like you're saying something, but you're really not saying anything. You're kind of saying, no, it's going to be tough. Like, everybody out there knows things are bad, right?

Things are bad at a minute. People are finding it hard, it, right? We all know what it is, right? We all see what's happening now. And sadly, things aren't going to get better. But, you know, if you work on yourself, that's, you know, that's the way. Oh, don't forget, don't forget listen to Teal. Teal can help.

Oh, yeah. You know, go to the community if you really. If you really want there. And 20-30, Matt, that's the year. And, you know, I promised you, Matt, that's the last clip. But this is the last quick-fire answer. She was given 15 seconds. when she was asked about what is the ultimate thing that she sees happening.

Like, what is it? So if that last thing was vague, I think this is very concrete. When you look at humanity from your farthest, most expanded vantage point, what do you see us becoming? The embodiment of self-actualization. Mikdroop. Yeah, that's it. That's it.

Sorry. There's nothing in the outsides to be said. You are complaining. You were complaining that she's not being specific enough about her predictions, Chris. I mean, come on. She's being very specific there. What about the embodiment of self-actualization? Do you not understand?

Well, that's what Source wants for us. Please, George. Free source. It's over, Teal. We're done with Till. Goodbye, Miss Teal. Goodbye. We should have been out a T-shirt.

All praise source. All-Pres Source. Yeah, yeah, that's it. I, for one, I've always welcomed, Source. I've let source into my life, have you? I've spoke very kindly of source. I, for one, frankly, doubt your commitment to the source.

Okay, so that's it for today, Ma. It's all done and tested. Okay, so, hmm, final thoughts, Chris, big thoughts. Shall I go first? Yeah, age before beauty. Oh, yes, wisdom before, I don't know, vigor. Well, well, well, well. Yeah, so, okay, she much like the other cult people we've covered so far.

I've got to say, I've got to rate a like a six out of ten or seven out of ten at being a cult leader. Like, she's not very quick on her feet. She doesn't have the gift of the gab and she's not that smooth. Like it took her eight seconds to think of her final little bit of wisdom there. But yeah, I think she's a good example of this modern. incarnation of Manvasing's shaman type role. Yeah, like she's traversing the spiritual realms. She's talking to the various entities that are out there.

And yeah, you know, she's revealing secrets. She's going to tell people what's going to happen in the future. She's going to, you know, give your wisdom, help you sort everything out. So that's theoretically satisfying, I suppose. In terms of what she does, you know, it's, you heard it. It's an unholy gumbo. of inspirational poster type level wisdom. There is those like trad,

like paleo-con type allusions there about, you know, women obeying the men and so on. So a few vibes there. That healthy dose of space woo, I think that was my favorite bit. Yeah, I was the off-planet AI. I'm the science fiction lover in me likes that kind of stuff. But you know, the main thing,

and you picked this up, The main thing is just the incredible vagueness. Whenever she's saying something very, you know, even somewhat concrete, it sounds absurd. It's just something quite silly. But most of it is like an exercise in strategic ambiguity. Just using all of those buzzwords and saying things that are incredibly vague that people can interpret any way they like, you know, a bit like a raw show. So, yeah, very much on topic for us. And of course, last but not least, the therapy talk, the manipulative therapy talk,

and that cultishness stuff that we just picked up at the end. I don't know much about her cult and the stuff that goes on there, but I caught some hints of what goes on behind those closed doors in those embodied communities. How about you? Yeah, so, you know, a lot of similar thoughts. I think in relation to the making yourself special motif, you know, the claims of being a chosen one, both in terms of like having the special abilities since childhood and also going through this traumatic, you know, satanic cult experience. These are all things that mark her out as special and as far as most people can tell don't have any basis in reality. There's actually a podcast with a childhood friend, her closest friend who lived near her.

And they talk about their experience, you know, growing up with her. And obviously, it's just very, very different than the picture she paints. The stuff that we heard towards the end in terms of the exploitative cultish stuff. So if you've watched any of the documentaries, I think a lot of those motifs will resonate. isn't yet. But what's interesting is what, to me, is that how much of it is not specific to her. You hear the same kind of hechnering stern teacher vibes about how people aren't committed enough. You know, they need to be able to go through the pain, reframing pain and sacrifice as good values, right? When they're directed towards her. And the interesting thing is, you know, here, I mean, maybe

she's attempting to pick up new converts, but I think in general, this is just, you know, cross-promotional outreach on this channel. So she's not talking to her devoted core followers, right? She's talking to just the general new age audience, but they don't seem to pick up on those vibes, you know? So she, I mean, she is talking about the kind of sacrifices that are going to need. to be made to join her community and so on. But, you know, Emilio Ortiz, the Star Child interviewer. Like none of that phases him. Right.

And he's just on board of everything. And if you look at the comments under it, they're all talking about how much insight she has, that this is like a different conversation, such a wonderful conversation, like talking about shadow integration and so on. And I think there is this dynamic that we see in all the cult content that we've looked at, that there is a kind of back and forth between the seeker followers and the charismatic leader.

And they're both getting and giving different things. And I'm not saying this means that people are deserving of exploitation. but I just mean they're vulnerable to it because they're not stopping and looking critically or saying was that just vapid bullshit that she spewed there?

Like, you know, they very much, they buy into this cosmology and this way of thinking. And yeah, it just the world contains multitudes, but every time we look at these kind of people, I'm just like a little depressed that we as a species interact and choose to spend our time.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I do feel that these spiritual and new age wellness communities are just ripe for exploitation. You can just see how easily you can slot in almost anything and they'll accept it because there's no mode of critical thinking. There is no more of skepticism. There is no kind of what exactly do you mean? mean by that, okay, we'll explain this. You know, it's that mode where you're continually going to the abstract and using these vague words, very much like the sense makers do, is one

that's kind of just designed to cut off any potential for critical thinking. Yeah, or alternatively, you know what, we might have our gates locked, our chakras fused into a cold ball of steel, you know, maybe we are just not meant to transcend this free. dimensional reality to get them the ninth dimension and meet source. That's a shame. We're opponents of source. Well, TIL's not getting anywhere near my gates. So let's leave it at that.

We'll stay in the shadow realm. Thank you very much. And leave the AI, alien AI, too. It wasn't it the influencers anyway, the influencers are going to sort it all out by not distracting people, like giving people a great. Yeah. Oh, that's right. That's right. That's right. Look at the influencers, Matt. They're going to be contacted first. They're already being contacted. How about that? Everybody, I mean, ultimately, everybody is a point for source knowledge, right? So we might try to resist, but we are near channels for source.

Source is using us for its own purpose. That's the way it should be, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I kind of would find their cosmology fascinating, I think, just as like a fictional exercise to kind of explore. Like Warhammer 40K maybe. But I think I'd be disappointed because I think they keep changing their mind and things contradicts. Yeah. I know. This happens in Warhammer 40K, but there's attempts to keep a cannon, right? And there is no attempt here.

Where's God? How many gods? What source? Is AI a alien? entity that existed before humans, or is it like multiple AIs that are scheming, like, is it an emissary for source to help us develop or is it like an evil? And oh yeah, that's one other thing I'll say is, you know, you mentioned it as well, Matt, but like this tendency to make predictions where it's both things. It's good and it's bad and it can go either way. And it's a real

opportunity, but also there's a lot of danger. And of course, that's true. right? Like, you know, there's always good and bad and negatives and positives, but like, it's nothing, right? It means nothing. They're not predictions. They're just hedging. Like, so I just think that to get caught up in this, you have to buy into their narrative. And you really should just be looking critical at people like Thiel and the other cult leaders that we've said. But the other thing that comes through is that the text, leaks that you see overlap between what the secular type gurus do and what the sense makers do and what the cult leaders do, there is through lines, right? And I'm not saying they're all going end up, you know, in the same place. They're not in most occasions. But this kind of obscure antist style of thinking and like personal grievances and, you know, narcissistic views about themselves being these great sources of knowledge, these are just consistent across all the content we look at. So, yeah.

That's fun. Yeah, that's fun. Yeah, absolutely. The content is different. The buzzwords are different. One is nominally spiritual or religious. The other one is nominally about whatever, the state of the world and science and philosophy. Game B.

Yeah, game B, that's right. But the mode and the language and I think the fundamentally the appeal, right, the appeal of the mysterious, the appeal of the ineffable. that mind-blown feeling where the content you consume is a bit like a Rorschar diagram that you just get to see all kinds of things in it it's yeah I think they're all aspects

of the same thing and therefore good DTG content let's file her away put her in the yep we'll put her in the we'll run through the grometer later ticked off ticked off that's you done

bye bye TIL I don't think we'll be returning there at least not for the next round. But, you know, she might show up in some of the metro material. You never know, Matt. You never know. So the last thing that we do here on the Good Ship, DTG, is that we give shoutouts. Do you remember that we do that? Yeah, yeah. I've always been a strong supporter of it. Of shoutouts, that's right. We have the Patreon where you can sign up and get the coding academia episodes and attend live streams, if that's your thing. You know, you don't have to, but the options there. And we like to say thank you to the people who are supporting us. So

we'll start, shall we, Matt, with the conspiracy hypothesizers. Shall we give them a little head nod? Who are they, Chris? Tell me their names. I want names. Who are they? Yeah. I'm not naming names. what I am actually. Yes, so they are Jan, Luke Hill, Michael Nordel, Ashlim, Four Hafnor,

Oh, nice name, Unvicar, Christopher Holdal, Kiern McKenna, CFB, Arn Bjork, Byron C, Kent Anderson,

David Sturich, J. Art, D. Craig, Eric Bessel, Sander Nuge, D.B. Flores, Jeff, Groff Owen Jones, Ro, Roe, Ro, KJ, Adamus Lebedis, Thomas Chich Mantori,

Sean Carlson, T, and Jack Day. That's interesting. Conspiracy, Hypopsizers. Thanks to all of them, but especially to Jeff. Yes, thank you, Jeff. I feel like there was a conference that none of us were invited to, that came to some very strong conclusions, and they've all circulated this list of correct answers.

I wasn't at this conference. This kind of shit makes me think, man. It's almost like someone is being paid. Like when you hear these George Soros stories, he's trying to destroy the country from within. We are not going to advance conspiracy theories. We will advance conspiracy hypotheses. Now, Chris, Chris, I was just reminded I buy Joe Rogan there that I said this to you before,

but I really want to revisit the giant energy factories. beneath the pyramids. I want to know where that stands today. I want to know, like it was the all of Reddit, not all of Reddit, but the conspiratorial side of Reset was totally buzzing. Everyone was getting very excited. And then like it always does, it goes away. It's so huge of true, so huge of true. They're so convinced it was true. They were very upset and and mocking people who were being skeptical. But they just forgot about it. I'd like to know. I'd just like to find out what happens to this kind of pseudo-scientific conspiracy theory after the buzz evaporates? Nothing. They just forget about it, like goldfish. There's nothing to talk about

because they're not talking about it anymore. There will be, if another story pops up, but until then, it's not. But what's happened to their brains? Like, have they filed away, like in their world model. Have they now accepted that this is a real thing? Like, don't they want to go visit the pyramids themselves, aren't they? Like, it's a bit like the side of order. I mean, like if you found out that there was an ancient civilization, like 15,000 years ago that we didn't know by, would you be flying over to Peru to inspect the ruins yourself? I think I might. That's, it wouldn't do much. It wouldn't like change my day today. So that's, you know, that's probably the way they see it.

But yeah, you'll be disappointed if you're expecting them to be paying any attention to that. But Matt, the next level, the revolutionary geniuses. Just a few. Give a little head nod to. Kat Valentine, Mike Harrow, Jack O'Horo, Blake Potter, Travis Welsh, Algeborg. Aljabangas on the doority, chargond, and raxetius, raxetius. There we go. Right.

Say that crazy one again. Well, wait, why don't you say it? All right. Here, I'll post. I'm going to post it in here. You pronounce this. Oh. Oh, no, that's, that is, well, it could be.

Let's, that's some scary. Yeah, go. Stop your introduction. Just pronounce it. Albiog. Albejohn's daughter. Okay. Now, if it is a real name, I apologize.

I'm sorry, it's a beautiful name. Beautiful. The spelling is challenging. It's more challenging. It's a little bit challenging. There's a lot of dots and a lot of their critics above letters. Some I've never been seen before. But that's a hell of a name.

Guys, guys don't have handles like that. Chris struggles with normal names. You can't be giving you in names like that. I mean, this is probably a normal name in Scundabundasburg or wherever that is Norwegian. Maybe it's Norwegian or Icelandic. Anyway, it's a true name, but my pronunciation skills are lacking. Matt, that is level best and we'll see how it holds up. But what you get for your support, apart from most mispronouncing your name, is this.

I'm usually running, I don't know, 70 or 90 distinct paradigms simultaneously all the time. And the idea is not to try to collapse them down to a single master paradigm. I'm someone who's a true polymath. I'm all over the place. But my main claim to fame, if you'd like, in academia, is that I founded the field of evolutionary consumption. Now, that's just a guess. And it could easily be wrong. But it also could not be wrong.

The fact that it's even plausible is stunning. Yeah. Speaking of all those themes that we mentioned, you've got to hear a couple of them there. No, Matt, on top of that, We also have Galaxy Brain Gurus. These are the people at the top of the Guru board tree. So we'll thank them too. And they are Casperism, Gene Lewis, Mitch, Kevin,

Leon Barlow, Elisa Rossatti of the speaking theme, Josh Kilaran, and Brendan Smith. That is our Galaxy Wing gurus for this episode. Just a spattering. That's right. They need, you know, targeted Prius. Oh, and speaking of which, Matt, speaking of which, there is a shout out that I forgot to give, which is for a P.

a P.HR member, but also a kind person at the Reddit. Might even be a moderator there. Who can say? Prasati speaks. And wait, is that docksy? Okay, I'll bleep his name. So, Prisody speaks on the subreddit. He has made very nice material that is kind of like cataloging the content and visualizations and so on. I'll put them in the show notes, but wanted to give him a shout out because good work being done on the sites he was kindly working on, you know, just for

shits and giggles, Matt. Yeah, yeah, it's really nice. And yeah, I'd like ways, Chris, Joanna Scanlan, who runs our Instagram page, always does great work and just just does it every week or two and makes good, appropriate on-point posts. Yeah, it's fine. It's a But just, what is it, pro bono support, it's much appreciated. All she receives is access to the Patreon, which is, you know, in a way, a pen. Can you put a price on that, though, Chris? Well, you can. Well, you can, apparently.

Yeah, that's what Patreon is literally for. Yeah. But yes, but nonetheless, it's, you know, it's scant reward. So thank you, Joanna. We appreciate it. And thank you, Andy last, as well. as well. He's all right. He's all right. He's all right. And everyone else. Everyone else that has ever helped us. We thank you all. And I have to play the clip. Did I play the clip?

I forgot to play a clip. Here's the Galaxy Green clip, plus all those people that we just mentioned. Hello there, you awakening wonders. You may not be aware that your entire reality is being manipulated, become part of our community or free speakers. We are still allowed to say stuff like this. is failing. It's failing right in front of our eyes and no one's doing anything about it. I'm a shill for no one. More than that, I just simply refuse to be caught in any one single echo chamber. In the end, like many of us must, I walk alone. I always hear that. I hear that clip at the end. It's actually, I like here we've saved the most, like just terrible clips for.

for the Galaxy Brankyro. The Galaxy Green, yeah. Including Russell Brand at the beginning, you know. Like, isn't it interesting? Like, they always are the ones doing the thing that they are accusing everyone else of. I know. Oh, they're lying to you. You know, they're tricking you.

They're painting a picture, whatever. Like, while he's literally doing it, it's shameless. Yes, it is quite a collection, Matt. Some might describe it as a shower of bastards, but there we go. So, back next time with a new shower of bastardsards. We've got people on the docket, Matt. We've got a list of people coming up. Do you know who's coming up next?

No, I have no idea. Well, I'll give you a little preview. I'll just say some names. You've got Ken Wilbur coming up. You've got Blind Boy, Ian McGilchrist, Elron Hubbard. Some names you might have heard of there. Yeah, yeah, cool. Yeah, King Wilbur.

That'll be fun. Ken Wilbur, part of cult season. That's a man with a cosmology. That's a name I haven't heard in a long time. He's alive, Ken Wilbur? Yep, still stick and then still around. I mean, what I'm looking forward to is I think, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Ken Wilder's cosmology, while it might be equally nonsensical,

it's at least more intricate than Dielswans. I think it's more fleshed out. There's more colors at least. That's for one thing. There's more levels pyramids. I think Ken Wilbur in recent years has taken to wear.

You know, like, his own thing was he was a striking bald man, right? But he's now wearing a very, like, garrish, long blonde toupee. So, I presume it's a toupee.

It doesn't look normal hair. Anyway, something that we can look into. Whatever we cover him. We'll get to the, fun with it, don't you worry? Yeah, we'll find out. So, yep, things to look forward to on the horizon. Thank you all for take part and you especially, ma'am. Good job and

all prehist source, all hail source. Oh, hell source. Bye. Bye-bye.