Democracy Now! Audio - Democracy Now! 2025-09-17 Wednesday

Episode Date: September 17, 2025

Headlines for September 17, 2025; “Single Shots to the Head”: U.S. Veteran, Volunteer Surgeon Sees “Extermination of a People” in Gaza; “Perish or Leave”: Hundreds of Thousands Flee as Israeli Military Invades Gaza City; How Video Games, Discord & Deep Web Influenced Alleged Kirk Killer; Trump Uses “Black Criminality” Myth to Take Over Black-Led Cities: Memphis Rep. Justin J. Pearson; Robert Redford the Activist: Hollywood Icon Was Lifelong Champion of Environment & Independent Film

From New York, this is Democracy Now. But little ones, they scream. We are used to the sound of shelling, to the sound of gunfire. We are used to it. It has become the norm, but the little ones, I cannot bear seeing them like that,

torn apart. Hundreds of thousands of Palestinians are fleeing as a city as Israeli ground forces move in. We'll get an update. Then Utah's formally charged the alleged killer of Charlie Kirk with murder.

Calling case 251-403-576. State of Utah versus Tyler James Robinson. Could you state your name? Tyler James Robinson. We'll speak to Wired reporter McKenna Kelly. Her latest piece is headlined bullets found after the Charlie Kirk shooting carried messages. Here's what they mean.

Then to Memphis, President Trump has signed an order authorizing the deployment of National Guard troops to the city. We'll speak to Tennessee State Representative Justin Pearson. We need poverty eradication, not military occupation. Because of this, because of this, the white supremacist authoritarian dictator wannabe of Donald Trump is using Memphis as a test case for taking and stripping away power from black communities. And we remember the late Robert Redford, in his own words. All that and more coming up. Welcome to Democracy Now. Democracy Now.org, the war and peace report. I'm Amy Goodman. Israel's intensifying its bombing of Gaza City after ordering the evacuation of nearly one million residents. Speaking to Al Jazeera, residents report explosions in the destruction of homes as well as naval boats joining tanks and jets and Israel's assault. According to medical sources in Gaza, Israeli strikes have killed 37 Palestinians today, including 24 in Gaza City.

Here's Mohamed Al-Bayari, who was displaced and sheltering in Gaza City, borrowed a cart from his neighbor to try and pack his belongings, is now preparing to flee the area with his family. The camp is crowded with displaced people from all the families, from Beit Hanun, the camp, Jabalya, Beitla. They all fled. They fled without preparation. The tents were burnt. Most people just fled due to the strike on the bank. It threw us onto the ground. May God make things easier. Only God will help us in this situation. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu arrived in court Tuesday to testify in his corruption trial. He's facing three corruption cases. Yesterday, he was questioned about changing the law on Israelis living abroad to accommodate the Israeli Hollywood mogul Arnon Milchan

in exchange for gifts. Netanyahu also announced he'll be visiting the White House this month again after the U.N. General Assembly. It'll be Netanyahu's fourth visit to the White House since President Trump took office. Meanwhile, Spain's canceled a major arms contract worth nearly $825 million for Israeli-designed rocket launchers. That's according to a document reviewed by Agence France Press, AFP. It comes as Netanyahu held a news conference yesterday, stressing the need for Israel to develop its own weapons industry as more countries sanction Israel over its assault on Gaza. So we are going to produce an independent arms industry, very powerful, very strong,

that can withstand any kind of international political constraints and will provide security for the state of Israel. Meanwhile, thousands of protesters in Jerusalem yesterday took to the streets and marched to Netanyahu's residents calling for an end to Israel's war on Gaza. We are demonstrating here in order to convince our crooked government to stop the war and release the hostages. Very simple. And also to release our country from a crooked regime that is

destroying the country, although they don't have a majority in the public. The Israeli military launched air strikes on Yemen again on the port of Hodeida yesterday. The spokesperson for the Houthis said air defense systems have been activated and prevented an Israeli assault on Yemen. Israel and the Houthis have traded attacks since Israel launched its assault on the Gaza Strip in October, 23. Meanwhile, hundreds attended funeral services and Sanaa yesterday for the 31 journalists who were killed in Israeli air strikes last week. The Committee to Protect journalists told the Associated Press they were still working to verify the deaths of the journalists, saying, quote, the information environment is highly

restricted who the authorities have imposed strict censorship, including a ban on sharing photos or videos related to the airstrikes, unquote. President Trump has arrived at Windsor Castle for his second state visit to the UK. Prior to his visit, images of Trump with convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein were projected onto Windsor Castle last night. Four people were arrested. protesters also displayed a massive banner of Trump and Epstein outside the castle. Protesters took to the streets of Windsor yesterday to demonstrate against Trump's visit to the United Kingdom. His actions and his inactions are causing instability in the world, overturning the world order that we've got used to.

He could have stopped the war in Ukraine. He could stop the war in Gaza if he wanted to. I don't understand why he doesn't want to. He's the most dangerous man in the world. Prosecutors in Utah are vowing to seek the death penalty for the accused assassin of conservative activist Charlie Kirk. On Tuesday, the accused shooter, Tyler Robinson, made his first court appearance by video from the Utah County Jail.

He's being charged with aggravated murder and six other counts for fatally shooting Kirk last week at Utah Valley, University. Prosecutors also released the transcripts of text messages Robinson allegedly sent to his roommate, who was also his romantic partner. In one of the alleged messages, Robinson wrote about Charlie Kirk, quote, saying, I had enough of his hatred, some hate can't be negotiated out, unquote. Robinson reportedly also left a note for his roommate that read, quote, I had the opportunity to take out Charlie Kirk, and I'm going to take it, unquote. In response to Charlie Kirk's killing, the Trump administration is threatening to wage a broad assault on progressive organizations on Monday, Attorney General Pam Bondi, said the DOJ would prosecute hate speech.

But she later walked back the comment after facing bipartisan pushback. On Tuesday, President Trump threatened ABC news reporter Jonathan Carl after he asked Trump about free speech. And what do you make Pam Bondi saying she's going to be? go after hate speech? Is that, I mean, a lot of your allies say hate speech is free speech. You probably go after people like you because you treat me so unfairly. It's hate. You have a lot of hate in your heart. Maybe they'll come after ABC. Well, ABC paid me $16 million recently for a form of hate speech, right? Your company paid me $16 million for a form of hate speech. So maybe they'll have to go after you. President Trump has also filed a $15 billion.

defamation lawsuit against the New York Times and publisher Penguin Random House. The lawsuit is aimed at the book Lucky Loser, how Donald Trump squandered his father's fortune and created the illusion of success, written by two New York Times reporters Russ Bootner and Suzanne Craig, as well as three times articles and an editorial prior to the 2024 election saying Trump was unfit for office. FBI director Cash Patel repeatedly clashed with Senate Democrats during an oversight hearing Tuesday. Patel was criticized for his handling of the Charlie Kirk assassination probe the Jeffrey Epstein case and for his overall record at the FBI. Three former senior FBI officials recently sued Patel, alleging they were fired as part of a campaign of retribution.

This is New Jersey Democratic Senator Cory Booker clashing with Patel. My God. My God. If you want to talk about fighting this. country. It is my time. I follow you on your social media posts that tear this country apart. It is my time to address your facehoods. You can try all you want to not take responsibility for what you have said. Sir, you're making a mockery of this committee. Sir, you don't tell me my time is over. You know how far we've come since you're bad. In Minnesota, a special election was held Tuesday to fill the seat of Melissa Hortman, the former Minnesota House Speaker who was assassinated

at her home in June along with her husband. Democrat XP Lee won Tuesday's election with almost 61% of the vote. Lee's a former municipal council member and the son of Hmong refugees who fled Laos during the Vietnam War. In other news from Minnesota, Democratic Congress member Ilhan Omar is facing backlash over her response to the death of Charlie Kirk. On Monday, two House Republicans introduced resolutions to censure Omar and remove her from her congressional committees.

The House of Representatives passed two bills yesterday to charge 14-year-olds in Washington, D.C. as adults and require judges to stick to mandatory minimum sentences for young offenders. Dozens of Democrats join their Republican colleagues to pass the bills as President Trump continues as crackdown on the city. It comes as President Trump signed an executive order Monday deploying the National Guard to Memphis, Tennessee, while indicating Chicago and New Orleans could be next. In Florida, eight police officers have been fired after the Broward County Sheriff's Office investigated the handling of the case of Mary Gingles, the woman who was murdered by her husband. The investigation found the deputies failed to properly follow up on reports of domestic violence against Nathan Gingles, who carried out a triple homicide of his wife, her father, and her neighbor. The case has drawn fresh scrutiny over Florida's red flag laws to remove firearms from anyone who poses a danger to themselves. and others. A New York judge has tossed out the terrorism charges against Luigi Mangione, who killed United

Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson last December. The other charges were kept in place, including a secondary murder count. The judge's ruling spared Manjone of a possible mandatory life sentence without parole. Judge Gregory Caro wrote, quote, while the defendant was clearly expressing an animus toward United Health Care and the health care industry generally, it does not follow that his goal was to intimidate and coerce a civilian population, and indeed there was no evidence presented of such a goal, the judge said. The Georgia Supreme Court's declined to hear an appeal from Fulton County District Attorney Fannie Willis on a removal from Georgia's election interference case against President

Trump over his effort to overturn the 2020 election. The ruling appears to guarantee the case against Trump will not move forward anytime soon, if ever. A new global witness report finds at least 146 land and environmental defenders were killed or disappeared last year with the majority of the killings occurring in Latin America. Global witness recorded 48 killings in Colombia, 20 in Guatemala, and 18 in Mexico. About a third of the land defenders killed last year were indigenous. In Mississippi, a 21-year-old black student at Delta State University was found hanging from a tree on campus Monday. Local officials say no foul play is suspected in Demartrevia on Trey Reed's death, but his family's demanding an independent autopsy.

The family's attorney, Ben Crump, said, quote, Trey Reed was a young man full of promise and warmth, deeply loved and respected by all who knew him. We cannot accept vague conclusions when so many questions remain, unquote. A second Mississippi man was also found hanging on Monday about a hundred miles away in Vicksburg. Police have identified the man as Corey Zucatus. a 36-year-old white man who was unhoused. Vicksburg police say the two deaths are not related.

Jerry Greenfield, co-founder of Ben & Jerry's ice cream, announced he's resigning after nearly 50 years, accusing the parent company, Unilever, of silencing Ben and Jerry's social mission. In a statement, Greenfield wrote, quote, that independence, the very basis of our sale to Unilever, is gone. And it's happening at a time when our country's current administration is attacking civil rights, voting rights, the rights of immigrants, women, and the LGBTQ community, unquote. Last November, Ben and Jerry's filed a lawsuit against Unilever for silencing its statements in support of Palestinian refugees. Back in 2021, the company withdrew its products from Israeli settlements. And tributes are pouring in for Robert Redford, the legendary Oscar-winning director, actor, activist who died at the age of 89 at his home in Utah Tuesday.

Redford was a longtime environmental activist who served for 50 years as a trustee of the Natural Resources Defense Council. He was also the creator of the Sundance Film Festival, which he helped grow into one of the largest independent film festivals in the world. We'll hear Robert Redford in his own words later in the broadcast. And those are some of the headlines. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org, the War and Peace Report. I'm Amy Goodman in New York, joined by Democracy Now's Juan Gonzalez in Chicago. Hi, Juan. Hi, Amy, and welcome to all of our listeners and viewers across the country and around the world.

Israeli troops and tanks are pushing deeper into Gaza City as Israel continues its full-fledged military ground invasion for a second day, despite mounting international condemnation. Israel's military confirmed its air force and artillery units attack Gaza City more than 150 times in the days before Israel's ground invasion, destroying homes, targeting areas that are densely populated by tent camps, sheltering thousands of displaced Palestinians. Israeli strikes have killed dozens of people across Gaza just since dawn this morning, including children, most of them, in Gaza City. Hundreds of thousands of people have been forced to flee the city where nearly a million Palestinians were living among rubble and ruins ahead of Israel's ground offensive.

Mohamed Al-Bayari was interviewed as he prepared to leave the city with his family. It is an issue of fear. I fear for my little ones only. I do not fear for the army or anyone. Death is death, but the little ones, the little ones they scream. We are used to the sound of shelling, to the sound of gunfire. We are used to it. It has become the norm, but the little ones, I cannot bear seeing them like that, torn apart.

Israel's ground invasion of Gaza City came a day after a U.N. inquiry found Israel's committed genocide in Gaza. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu held a news conference Tuesday, stressing the need for Israel to develop its own weapons industry as more countries sanctioned Israel over its war on Gaza. So we are going to produce an independent arms industry, very powerful, very strong, that can withstand any kind of international political constraints and will provide security for the state of Israel. This is what I envision for the state. It's going to continue to grow.

It's going to continue to innovate. And it's going to continue to provide for our security and our prosperity. Netanyahu also announced another visit to the White House this month after the UN General Assembly. It'll be his fourth trip to the White House since President Trip returned to office. We're joined by two guests. We begin with Dr. Kathleen Gallagher, general surgeon based in North Dakota, currently volunteering at Nasser Hospital in Khan Yunis.

She's a military veteran who served as a medic in Iraq and Afghanistan. She previously volunteered as a surgeon in Honduras and Ukraine. Dr. Gallagher arrived in Gaza. September 2nd is volunteering at Nassar Hospital for a month with the group Med Global. We thank you so much for being with us, even if the sound is a bit difficult and there's a delay to be able to speak to you in Gaza is so unusual. The corporate media in this country hardly goes directly there. We want to hear your experience on the ground, Dr. Kathleen Gallagher, as the ground infensive by Israel has commenced.

Yes, ma'am. So thank you, Amy and Juan, for having me on the broadcast. It's an honor to to share the story here. You know, so we're down in Han Yunus, which is south of Gaza City, and so we're starting to see quite an influx of people evacuating from the north here at our hospital, which is one of two remaining functioning hospitals, tertiary centers in the country. Our emergency room is seeing anywhere from two to 400 patients a day. My surgery, our surgery team and my colleagues are doing anywhere. from four to ten major trauma surgeries every day.

I crunched a few of the numbers of my own operations before starting this broadcast, and it's about an even split, about 52% of the patients that I'm operating on are GSWs, and the other half are explosive injuries. So we're seeing huge amounts of trauma here, and we expect it to escalate as people evacuate the north and have to seek aid at the humanitarian aid sites. And doctor, I wanted to ask you, the Dutch newspaper de Volksgrant quoted 15 international doctors saying at least 114 Palestinian children had been, had a single gunshot wound to their head or their chest. And the forensic experts are suggesting these injuries are deliberate. What have you been seeing in terms of injuries to children?

Yes, sir. So we have crunched those numbers as well. We've got about 40, 40% of our patients are under 20. I would say probably 25% of those are under 12. I can confirm that we are seeing single shots to the head, neck, chest. My partner's down the emergency room who are working absolutely tirelessly to stabilize these folks so they can survive to surgery, have reported to me that two days ago, they lost six children, under 12, two single shots to the head. We have seen multiple isolated neck wounds, and I have operated on four separate people in the last 48 hours with wounds to the chest. And it's a little tree. trouble with your lethal shots. I have not seen

any evidence that non-lethal means are being used on the ground there. And you've worked as a volunteer medic in Ukraine in Honduras, as well as served in the U.S. military in Iraq and Afghanistan. How does Gaza compare? This is worse than anything

I've ever seen. The scale of destruction is something that I couldn't even comprehend before I got here. Everywhere you look, you see buildings, civic infrastructure just completely destroyed. And we're in communis, which is one of the last sort of remaining cities that's still somewhat standing. You look south towards Rafa and there's nothing. You hear reports from Bedit Hanoon and there's nothing. Gaza city is on the way. The mass deep displacement of people is also really, really shocking. You know, everybody from Rafa has already been pushed north to the area around communists, the middle area.

People from Gaza City are coming this way. There is no more room. Everyone is living in tents. Somehow they manage to, the Palestinians are incredible. Somehow they manage to keep water, you know, trucks running, garbage trucks running. They're doing everything they can to maintain. their society. But it's getting harder and harder every day. And I have an enormous amount of fear for that infrastructure as the refugees arrive from the North.

Dr. Kathleen Gallagher. This is worse than anything I could possibly imagine. Dr. Gallagher, our last question to you is about this U.N. inquiry that's found this week. Israel has committed genocide during its nearly two-year assault on Gaza. It's the UN Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Terrorism. they put out a 72-page report that Israel's government's responsible for four of the five acts prohibited under the 1948 genocide convention. Of course, you are not a genocide expert. You are a medical doctor, but your reaction to this report as a frontline doctor in Gaza. Yeah. Yeah, as you said, I'm not, you know, I'm not a genocide expert, but what I'm seeing here is evidence of

of a systematic destruction, as I said, of the civil infrastructure, the extermination of a people in a way of life. I don't know what else you call it. And I, as a parting message to my folks back home and to my fellow Americans, this is no longer a political issue. This is a question of right and wrong. And I encourage everyone at home to use any avenue possible to reach out to your representatives to implore them, to beg them, to do the right thing, to be a source of justice in the world, and to pressure the Israeli government to stop this senseless killing. Dr. Kathleen Gallagher, I want to thank you for being with us, General Surgeon, based in Grand Forks, North Dakota, usually, but currently volunteering at Nasser Hospital in Han Yunus, a military

veteran who served as a medic in both Iraq and Afghanistan, also served in Honduras, and Ukraine, as a volunteer surgeon, Dr. Gallagher, arrived at the beginning of the month and has been at Nasser Hospital with Med Global. This is Democracy Now. I'm Amy Goodman with Juan Gonzalez. As we continue on Gaza, we go right now to Mohamed Shahada. He is a writer and analyst. He is from Gaza City.

We thank you so much for being with us. First, though, I want to get your response to the Prime Minister Netanyahu speaking. You have with Netanyahu, as soon as he started the ground invasion of Gaza City, he asked the court in Israel to reduce his appearances. He said, I cannot testify in court at the same time, and I cannot attend as many court hearings at the same time as we are launching a major operation in Gaza City. So that wraps up the essence of it. What you have is Netanyahu has done over the last two weeks. Three things simultaneously. Invade Gaza City to annihilate the largest urban space remaining there.

Destroy every home there one by one, as he stated, so that people would have nothing to return to and they would leave. And number two, bomb the negotiating table in Doha so that there is no one to sort of save Gaza diplomatically or through dialogue or negotiations. And number three, attack the freedom flutella that is trying to. to bring food and aid into Gaza so that Gaza would be rendered entirely on its own in the face of a killing machine. And what you have right now is basically the IDF literally this morning they were describing it themselves in this real newspaper. They were saying they are swarming Gaza City right now with a huge... Sorry? They are basically swarming Gaza City right now with a huge amount of drones as well as armored persons.

carriers that have been robotized, they turned it into giant bombs. They fill it basically with explosive ammunition to the brim and send it and detonated from a distance into largely populated and overcrowded areas. So my friend, Ibrahim, yesterday, he walked up to one of these robotized vehicles exploding underneath the building where he was sheltering with his family and in-laws, and he started running. Half of the building collapsed. The other half was intact, so he narrowly escaped death and he just grabbed his four-year-old, his wife, and they started running until they reached the south of Gaza.

Ever since he's been calling me every a few minutes to ask, bigging literally, to ask for a tent or for food, and I've been trying everywhere to find him something as simple as a tent to sleep in, and I couldn't find anything. Yesterday we had three people dying from starvation in Gaza, in addition to the 60 people killed and murdered by the IDF throughout the Gaza Strip. What you have is basically right now about 370,000 people lift Gaza City according to Israel. And the Israeli newspaper Yidot Ahranot headlined it with, it's a death march.

It's a literal death march. Like my friend Ibrahim is now sleeping on the street since yesterday, unable to provide any food or shelter for his family. That's why you have the overwhelming majority of people still in Gaza City unable to leave, refusing to leave, because there's basically no place to go that would be safe or where they would be able to find shelter. And you have basically, right now, the internet has been cut off from northern Gaza and Gaza City since this morning, as well as the continuous bombardment. It's like 9-11 style Israeli bombing of high-rise towers throughout the Gaza Strip, especially in Gaza City, to terrorize people into fleeing.

While at the same time they understand that those people cannot flee. yesterday Israel called on a family to flee south as soon as they took a car and tried to flee they bombed them on the way killing every single member of the family so it's just extermination for the sake of extermination and Muhammad Shahada the United Nations inquiry has found that Israel has committed genocide during this two-year assault on Gaza what's the significance of this to you at this moment well it's way long overdue It's not just UN officials, but I've heard it from European Union officials for the last 14 months, 15 months, where they have been saying behind closed doors that Israel has shown a clear intent to annihilate Gaza and finish off the Gaza question once and for all. Last year, around July, so exactly 14 months ago, I met with the European Union leader, and as soon as I entered the room, he circled his tablet, his personal iPad, around the table, to show satellite imagery that the EU has been collecting off Gaza,

neighborhood by neighborhood, and I kept zooming in to try to figure out anything. There was nothing recognizable. And the top European leader, he interjected and said, Israel is destroying and annihilating the orbit space in Gaza. They are destroying everything there so that as soon as the war is stops, people would have no option but to leave, which is the literal definition of genocide. Either you stay and perish or you leave where you cannot exist as a group anymore. And nonetheless, those officials, same officials, would go in front of a camera and say,

no genocide happening at the moment. So what you have now with the UN decision, it makes it way more difficult for those shameless frauds to deny the effect on the ground when you have this wall-to-wall consensus from the UN to Amnesty International Human Rights Watch and even Israel's own positions for human rights

and the largest is really human rights organization, Bits Salem. So it makes it difficult to deny it. But you still have European and Western leaders nonetheless trying to deny it vehemently. Like you saw with Kierstomar, the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom a few days ago, emphatically saying that there is no genocide in Gaza, to which the answer from the human rights community is, just open your eyes and look at what's unfolding there. It's impossible to see what's happening and conclude that there's anything else but genocide

unfolding. I wanted to ask you as well, you were in Istanbul, Turkey, a few days before Israel bombed Doha. While you were there, the entire Hamas leadership in Istanbul took a flight to Doha to respond to Trump's proposal, your response to this Israeli attack on those who were seeking to negotiate peace? Absolutely. So Israel could have assassinated those Hamas leaders in Istanbul the day before they flew to Doha. They could have assassinated them in Tehran when they assassinated only Ismail Hanayah. Or they could have done it right after October 7th. But they didn't do it in any of these instances because the Israeli military was telling Netanyahu, we need someone to talk to. What you

have is basically Netanyahu laying a trap with Trump, Trump issuing a proposal last minute and then inviting and summoning Hamas to congregate in Doha to discuss and study it and articulate a counterproposal. And as soon as they entered into the meeting room, Israel drops the tin bombs on the headquarters, the office of Hamas in Doha, to obliterate the negotiating table. So it was a premeditated, deliberate attack to kill any chance of a ceasefire happening in Gaza. Netanyahu did not want to take the least chance on Hamas approving or saying yes to Trump's proposal. And you have basically a White House that's willing to play along with it no matter what Israel does. So you got reports basically saying that Trump was frustrated with Netanyahu and saying every time there's progress, Netanyahu sabotages it or bombs people.

But at the same time, you had Mark Rubio immediately flying to Israel and saying there may not be a diplomatic solution for the war in Gaza. the military option is the only one, right on the day before Israel invades Gaza with everything they have. So basically, they're giving the absolute green light to the Israelis to turn Gaza into a howling wilderness into this apocalyptic scene that cannot even be described in words, like there is apocalypse, there's catastrophe, there's disaster, there's genocide, and then there is Gaza. It's beyond anything that the human language can capture at this moment. Yes, you have Rubio saying, sometimes when you're dealing with a group of cyber, like Hamas, that's not possible. He was talking about a ceasefire. And you have Netanyahu

going to be visiting the White House for the fourth time since Trump took office this time. And you have thousands of Israelis protesting outside Netanyahu's house. He's being in trial for corruption demanding an end to its war on Gaza, the significance of this. Well, basically, right now, you have the entire Israeli military and members of the government, ministers from Netanyahu's government, saying this is enough, the job in Gaza has been accomplished. Gaza is no more already. What we need to do is basically prevent re-construction in the war now, continue to carry out Lebanon-style assassinations and targeted bombings. No one's going to stop us, and the genocide can proceed slowly, quietly, and without even the public appearance of it, if you just lock Gaza, close it off, and give people only one. option, leave or stay and perish. But on the other hand, you have Netanyahu, who is willing to

burn everything, willing to turn Israel into a ferriah state. He stood up in front of a podium two days ago and said that Israel was becoming Sparta and Israel was becoming increasingly isolated. He saw it as a positive thing, that Israel is now standing against the whole world because he wants to be remembered as Winston Churchill slash FDR, the person that oversaw a great disaster and then managed to achieve victory, or at least an image of victory that would wipe away that shame from his reputation. On the other side, he wants to see the job in Gaza completed to the end. He doesn't believe that if Gaza City remains half destroyed or 70% destroyed, that this is enough to push people out. I have family in Gaza City

who've literally borrowed underneath the rubble of their homes and chose to stay there instead of leaving southwards and sleeping on the street. So basically what you have is Netanyahu is saying, I want to see it with my own eyes, that every single home, every single building in Gaza City is flattened completely, that there is absolutely nothing left there, and that the Gazan population would be overcrowded on the Egyptian borders with conditions of an immense catastrophic disease outbreak and civic collapse so that Gazans themselves would invade the Egyptian borders breach it and cross in on their own. I asked Egyptian officials, what would you do in the event of Israel opening a major hole in the fence and pushing people into

your territory at gunpoint? And they said, we will respond with force because this is declaration of war. And then I rephrase the question. I said, what if Israel creates the conditions remotely that would drive Gazans on their own to open a hole in the fence and cross in, what would you do? And the answer unanimously was no one in the Egyptian military would think about firing at fleeing civilians. So that's exactly what Netanyahu has in mind, concentrate the population there, create conditions for disaster and have them run towards Egypt on their own. Mohamed Shahad, I want to thank you for being with us, writer and analyst from Raza, a visiting fellow at the European Council on Foreign Relations speaking to us today from Copenhagen.

Up next, the alleged shooter of Charlie Kirk, Tyler Robinson, formerly charged with murder. Among the evidence against him, inscriptions written on bullets, we'll talk to a senior wired reporter McKenna Kelly, back in 20 seconds. Since you've been around, oh, since you've been around. Ain't no love in the heart of the city, rendition of Zishan B in our Democracy Now studio. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org. I'm Amy Goodman with Juan Gonzalez. The alleged shooter of conservative activist Charlie Kirk was formerly charged Tuesday by Utah prosecutors.

Twenty-two-year-old Tyler Robinson faces charges of aggravated murder and six other counts. Prosecutors say they'll seek the death penalty. On Tuesday, prosecutors released the transcripts of text messages Robinson allegedly sent to his roommate, who's also his romantic partner, that he's sent after the shooting. And one of the alleged messages, Robinson wrote about Charlie Kirk, quote, I had enough of his hatred, some hate can't be negotiated out, unquote. Robinson also texted his roommate after the shooting that he'd left a message under his keyboard. The message reportedly read, quote, I had the opportunity to take out Charlie Kirk and I'm going to take it, unquote. The messages showed the roommate was shock that Robinson was the assassin.

The roommate now is cooperating fully with investigators, according to the Utah governor. In the wake of Kirk's murder a week ago, the Trump administration's vowed a crackdown on the political left. But the motives and ideology of Robinson, whether or not he acted alone, are still mostly a subject of speculation. Some of the first evidence released in the case were inscriptions written on bullets found with a rifle. This is Utah Governor Spencer Cox reading some of the inscriptions. Inscriptions on the three unfired casings read, Hey, fascist, exclamation point, catch exclamation point. Up arrow symbol, right arrow, and symbol and three down arrow symbols.

A second unfired casing read, oh, Bella Chow, Bella Chow, Bella Chow, and a third unfired casing read, If you read this, you are gay, L.M.A.O. We're joined now by senior writer at Wired McKenna Kelly. Her latest piece is headline, bullets found after the Charlie Kirk's shooting carried messages. Here's what they mean. Welcome to Democracy Now, McKenna. If you can start off just by explaining, I mean, yesterday also in the questioning of the FBI director, Cash Patel, there was this whole discussion about discord.

and he says that everyone that he was communicating with, you know, apparently Tyler Robinson said on Discord, I hate to tell you, I'm the one who did this. They're going to investigate all the people he was talking to. But Discord, the Deep Web, can you explain to people who are not familiar with all of this? And then what these messages, how they may have been misinterpreted and what they mean. Sure, yeah. So Discord has become a huge messaging platform, especially for young people. It operates similarly to Slack if you use Slack at all. So there's options to create a server, which is what your company would use.

And then a separate little channels divided into topics. So a Discord channel operates in the same way. There are different channels oftentimes for groups of friends, like the one that it looks like Robinson was involved in, had a channel for probably memes, had a channel for like a general discussion, things like that. And so the people who use Discord, it's a variety of folks for a variety of different purposes. They could just be kind of a friendly group chat, something that maybe you would have on your messages app on your phone with a little bit more direction or topic and some more niche focuses. But also discords can be used for a bunch of different things. I have friends in

the New York area, actually, who use discord for political organizing and for bringing folks that they meet, you know, on the streets or helping organize voting drives and things like that. And so it's not necessarily a political platform. It is a very like politically neutral platform that people use because it serves a certain purpose. And, but that doesn't get away from the fact that people who are involved, deeply involved and deeply, you know, indebted to the internet who get on it every day, who maybe are accessing stranger forums than you or I do every day, they're able to organize and bring people from those maybe deeper, darker places of the internet, bring them to discord and be in touch with them, basically at any moment every day.

And, McKenna, FBI director Cash Patel during an interview on Fox News said that Tyler Robinson quote, subscribed to left-wing ideology. Can you talk about this idea that his, Robinson's motives may not be rooted in traditional extremism, but constructive from randomness and irony of online culture? Yeah. If you even look at the documents that came out yesterday, the charging documents for Robinson in the text exchange that they showed, these transcripts, he specifically notes that, like, I will die laughing or something like that if Fox News reads some of the memes that I have inscribed on these bullets. So all of these memes themselves are not inherently political. Hey, fascist, sure, that can be read, you know, as maybe being a bit left

as it can also be seen to be maybe ironic. And until we actually get some idea of the communities that Robinson was involved in, then we'll get a better idea of what he ascribed to. But these memes are everywhere online. You would have people using them ironic. people using them perhaps, you know, seriously, but we just don't have enough information to go off of right now to really make any real decision on what it is that Robinson is And McKenna, can you talk about video game culture and the up and down arrows and how they are being misread and how you talked about particular games there from as opposed to a leftist ideology. Yeah. So the first bullet casing that they mentioned in that press conference said,

hey, fascist catch. And then it had an up and then a right and then three downward arrows. At the beginning of this investigation, a lot of folks were saying that those three downward arrows were an anti-fascist symbol. But when you add those additional first two arrows, it's actually just a code that you would input when playing a game called Hell Divers 2, which is this satirical anti-fascist game where you're playing as what the characters believe to be anti-fascist, but you really are the fascists. So it's just a game that folks play. The bomb that that code calls for is like this thing called an Eagle 500-kilogram bomb or something. And it's a meme in the community of hell divers where it's seen as when you call that down, it is a comically

excessive bomb to drop. It will just basically, in the game, it'll solve all of your problems and you don't have to think about anything else. And so instead of looking at that bullet casing and saying, like, oh, this is a leftist ideology, right? You could look at it coming from the community around the folks who played this game, be like, oh, I'm doing something perhaps comically excessive in assassinating this man, fortunately. And trying to send that sign, right? Trying to make it a joke and a meme, something that we kind of saw him reference in the charging documents yesterday. Well, we will, of course, continue to follow this case. I think the funeral next Sunday. McKenna Kelly, I want to thank you for being with us. Senior writer

at Wired will link to your piece as you focus on the intersection of politics, power, and technology. This is democracy now. When we come back, we go to Memphis, Tennessee, where President Trump has authorized sending the National Guard. Stay with us. Come, one day. Deep in my heart, I do believe that's Roger Waters performing We Shall Overcome, accompanied by Alexander Roetton on cello in the Democracy Now, studio. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org. I'm Amy Goodman with Juan Gonzalez.

As we turn now to Memphis, Tennessee, after President Trump on Monday signed an order authorizing the deployment of National Guard and the creation of a so-called safe task force, which Trump claims will address violent crime in the city. Trump's order came as Memphis Police Department reported crime is at a 25-year low with robbery, larceny, burglary, all at record lows over the past eight months. Tennessee, Democrat, gathered in Memphis Monday to condemn Trump's crackdown. We're joined by Justin J. Pearson, Democratic Tennessee State Representative. State rep, thanks so much for being with us.

If you were one of the people who spoke out against the National Guard deployment, why? This is an abuse of power by the Trump administration. It is moving us from a democracy to an authoritarian regime led by a wannabe dictator. We cannot normalize the behavior of the nationalization of the Federalization of the National Guard against our own citizens, against our own communities. If they really wanted to address the problems of crime, they would address billions of dollars of disinvestment as it relates to eradicating poverty. They would make sure that we do something about gun safety laws, but this is not about that. This is about taking away our power, targeting and attacking black-led majority cities and destroying our democracy for. their own political game. And representative on Monday, President Trump met with your governor, Bill

Lee, with two U.S. senators, Marsha Blackburn, and Bill Haggerty. And Governor Lee said, I've been in office for seven years. I'm tired of crime holding the great city of Memphis back. But this is really in contrast to the plummeting crime rate in Memphis at a 25-year low. You talk about that. Yeah, the statistics do not net out for what they are articulating. But Governor Bill Lee has been governor for nearly eight years and has never once presented a plan to reduce and eradicate poverty in Memphis, Tennessee, has not fought for any legislation to reduce gun violence and have gun violence prevention laws against his own party. He has not exercised the political will or the desire to address any of the root causes and the systemic problems that we have. This is giving Donald Trump and this administration more power to take over communities that they disagree with that are democratic led for their own political gains. And this gets much more scary for some folks when it's an election season and the National Guard is going to be posted up in front of our polls.

That's going to happen at the midterms that's likely to happen during the presidential election. This is not what is supposed to be happening in our country. And we all need to be unified and realizing that this is nothing more than a power play for more authoritarianism from this administration. Justin J. Pearson, you've talked about Trump manipulating racist rhetoric to perpetuate false claims of rising crime waves in cities like Memphis. Elaborate. Absolutely. Look, it is no coincidence that the cities that Donald Trump and this administration are targeting have been overwhelmingly black-led cities. Karen Bass in Los Angeles, in Chicago, sought to attack Baltimore, now here in Memphis. The idea of black criminality

is something that has been perpetuated by races and white supremacists like Donald Trump for centuries. And so it is not new to us. It is not unfamiliar that Governor Bill Lee is perpetuating this. Marja Blackburn, Bill Haggerty are also perpetuating the lie about black criminality and not taking accountability or responsibility for taking away access to health care, eliminating snap benefits through the big ugly bill that just recently passed, transferring wealth to the richest people in the world and taking from the poorest people and then dealing with those consequences, they say, well, you all are the problem.

It isn't the policies we push. It isn't the laws that we've done to make it harder for you to live and to survive. It is you. It is you black folks who are in power that are the problem. It is not the policies and the laws and are inaction. That is the consequences that you all are dealing with. And today, we are dealing with the consequences of people who are in positions of power who do not care about our lives, who do not care about our communities, who don't care about

eliminating poverty. They don't even care about crime. They're doing this as a part of an authoritarian regime to take more power and to see how far we are willing to go to allow them to destroy our democracy. And in Memphis, in Shelby County, we are saying no. Well, Justin, Jay Pearson, we want to thank you so much for being with us, Democratic State Representative, whose district includes parts of Memphis. He is also the subject of a new documentary that premiered at the Telluride Film Festival, called This is Not a Drill. We'll be talking about that in the weeks to come about his activism

before becoming a Tennessee state representative. Thanks so much for joining us from Memphis. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org. I'm Amy Goodman with Juan Gonzalez. We end today's show with the late Robert Redford, in his own words. The legendary Oscar-winning director-actor and activist died at his home in Sunday. Utah at the age of 89 Tuesday. In addition to being a Hollywood icon, Robert Redford was a long time environmental activists who served for 50 years as a trustee of the Natural Resources Defense Council. He was also the creator of the Sundance Film Festival, where I would often interview him over the last decade. This is part of an interview we did in 2015 in Park City.

I think the deniers of climate change are probably people who are afraid of change. They don't want to see change. They want to hang on to the way things were. And my feeling about the deniers and a lot of other issues that are out there is that too many in Congress are pushing us back in the 1950s. That's what it feels like. They're pushing us back in time rather than forward in time. And I think, why is the reason? Maybe they're afraid of not being able to be included.

I don't know what it is, but it's kind of sad because it's so polarized. It's so mean-spirited. They also often say that we need this oil to move forward in America. Well, we also need alternative energy, too. I mean, I think that's the future. I don't think oil is the future. I think it should probably stay. And this is going to be an unpopular view, but I think because I worked on an oil field as a kid,

worked in the Chevron oil fields in California. So I've had a lot of experience with oil. I think it should stay in the ground now. And I think that we're so close to polluting the planet beyond anything sustainable. I think we better start, say, let's stop this argument about alternative energy is not going to produce enough jobs. To me, that's a mistake because it would produce an industry and an industry would produce jobs. So I think somebody's got to speak up for the fact that alternative energy is the way of the future, not oil, certainly not coal, and gas. So that's my feeling.

And your thoughts on the oil barons, the Koch brothers, it's just been announced that they and their allied groups will pour $900 billion into the next election, doubling what they did in the last election, $900 million into the next election. Money is the name of the game. I mean, I think money is what moves the ball, and they're moving the ball in their direction, I think it's the wrong direction. It's very narrow-minded, but they have the money to do it. So it's a free country. So some people might be saying right now, why am I talking to this famous actor, an Oscar-winning director, about issues like the environment and money and politics? Well, because I've been in, I guess you could call me an activist since 1969. I've been involved in the environment from the standpoint of wanting to draw attention to what an alternative could be rather than what we've been having. And I remember when I was at a conference in Bale, Colorado, and they talked about where all the energy was going, all the effort and the energy and the money was going to oil, gas, coal, and nothing was being contributed to the alternative energy. And I thought, why this stuff is going to run out? It's not infinite.

It's going to run out. And it's costly. And it pollutes our planet. If somebody doesn't start thinking about what we're going to develop for our survival, because I think we are a development-oriented society, it's going to be a question of what we develop our survival and what we preserve for our survival. And I think there's been little to no talk about preservation because those people that you're talking about, the McConnell's and people like that, they're living so.

far in the past. They're living so much in the past. Seems like they're afraid of the future. Can you believe that the Sundance Film Festival is 31 years old? No. Do you think of it as one of your children? You know, it's interesting. I think of it, because it started, it was a big idea back in 1985. It was a big idea with a small start because there was no support. There was only one theater in Park City. Sundance, the place is not here in Park City. It's 40 miles away, higher up in the mountains, tucked away. It's where our lab programs are. That's where the development process is. That's where our nonprofit Sundance development for the documentaries

and the film and the theater and so forth, music. Park City works out for us because they have something we need, which is theatrical distribution capability. And we give them something they need, which is a venue to attract people. So the first year, there was maybe 150 people that showed up. We had one theater, maybe 10 documentaries

and 20 films. And now it's grown to the point where it's kind of like a wild horse. I can't begrudge it. I mean, that was the dream. It started as just a hope. Then when it became a reality, it started to have its own

momentum. And the point of it, Since you certainly, you know, have great acclaim in Hollywood, you didn't need another venue as all the creative ways you participate in the film industry, as director as an actor. So why Sundance? You had it made. In 1980, the industry began to be more centralized, and they were following the youth market because that's where the money was, which I understand.

But it looked like it was going to be the expense of some of those other films that were more about the humanistic side of cinema, stories about America, American way of life, complex stories. And so in my mind, I thought that was very valuable. I thought that's a wonderful use of film. You can have the big blockbusters. You can have, with technology coming along,

creating more special effects possibilities, you knew that they were going to use that, and that's great. But I felt it was going to be at the expense of giving up those other kinds of films, so that's what led to Sundance. I thought, well, what if we can, started a development process where young artists can have a voice,

but we can help them develop their skills so they can at least get their films made. That was the lab that started in 1980. Then, once that happened, and we started a development process at Sundance, suddenly realized that we were helping them develop their skills so they could get their films made that there was nowhere to go

because the mainstream had not allowed any space for them. And that led to the idea of a festival. So originally it was just an idea that maybe we can have a community of filmmakers coming together and share each other's work. And maybe we're lucky. Somebody will come. Somebody else will come. The Oscar winning director, actor, and activist Robert Redford speaking on Democracy Now in one of a number of interviews we did with him at the Sundance Film Festival in Park City, Utah, that interview in 2015. He died on Tuesday at the age of 89 at his home in Utah. The Sundance Film Festival will be moving after this next year from Park

City to Boulder. Robert Redford served for five decades as a trustee of the Natural Resources Defense Council. Venish Bapna, president and CEO at NRDC, said, quote, the environmental movement has lost a giant. Nobody has done more to shine a light on the most important environmental issues from the dawn of the environmental movement in the 1970s through the biodiversity and climate crises of today. Again, Robert Redford dead at the age of 89, but his legacy continues. You can go to DemocracyNow.org for all of our interviews. I'm Amy Goodman with Juan Gonzalez.