Democracy Now! Audio - Democracy Now! 2025-11-17 Monday

Episode Date: November 17, 2025

Democracy Now! Monday, November 17, 2025

From Belan, Brazil, the gateway to the Amazon, we're at COP 30, the UN Climate Summit. This is Democracy Now. One of the most important thing for me for this COP is the action and the solidarity that we are building together as an indigenous leaders and land defenders for different parts of the world because we know that the answer is us. We know that we are the live alternatives. We have the answers and we have the response for all the devastation and the destruction for the climate crisis.

Tens of thousands of people marched in Belen, Brazil, Saturday. in an indigenous-led protest calling for leaders at the UN Climate Summit to take action to combat the climate crisis and protect the Amazon. We'll air a report from the streets of Berlin, then speak to the heads of Amazon Watch and Oxfam Brazil. The world needs to understand that Amazon is not only a world. It's a real space that are right now facing consequence. All that and more, coming up.

Welcome to Democracy Now. Democracy Now.org, the Warren Peace Report. I'm Amy Goodman. Bangladesh's former Prime Minister, Sheikh Hasino, was sentenced to death by a tribunal today for ordering a deadly crackdown on student protesters who successfully toppled her government last year. According to a UN report, 1,400 people were killed, thousands injured after security forces opened fire on demonstrators last year. The verdict came as Sassina has been living in exile in India. Bangladesh has been rocked by 30 bomb explosions and dozens of arson attacks over the past few days in the lead up to the verdict.

This comes as Bangladesh is expected to hold parliamentary elections in February next year. In Gaza, Israeli forces have killed at least three Palestinians as Israel continues to violate the U.S. brokered ceasefire. Since the start of the truce, October 10th, at least 266 Palestinians have been killed 635 wounded by Israeli attacks. Physicians for Human Rights Israel is reporting at least 98. Palestinians have died in Israeli custody since October 2023, and that the real death toll is likely much higher because hundreds of people detained in Gaza are still missing. Meanwhile, UNICEF estimates more than 600,000 Palestinian children have missed out on school during the U.S., the Israeli assault on Gaza, and only 100,000 have managed to return to classrooms.

Humanitarian NGOs say Israel still restricting the entry of food aid and other critical supplies into the Gaza Strip. This is Zahiyah al-Shambari, who waited in line to buy bread in Khan Yunus. After two hours of struggle at the supermarket to get a bag of bread, thank God I finally got one bag of bread for about eight people. I'm really happy that I'm returning with a bag of bread, and I hope to see. suffering doesn't happen again. Not today, not tomorrow, not any other day. This comes as the UN Security Council set to vote today on a U.S. proposal to establish an international stabilization force to enforce the Gaza ceasefire. The U.S. drafted resolution also mentions the possibility of a future Palestinian state. But on Sunday, Prime Minister

Benjamin Netanyahu outright rejected any path for Palestinian statehood. Our opposition to a Palestinian state in any territory west of the Jordan River, this opposition exists, is valid and has not changed one bit. I have been rebuffing these attempts for decades, and I am doing it both against pressure from outside and against pressure from within. So I do not need affirmations, tweets, or lectures from anyone. Meanwhile, new details are emerging about a shadowy organization called Amaged Europe. That's been taking Palestinians in Gaza to South Africa. The organization reportedly has ties to Israel. Last week, a chartered plane carrying 153 Palestinians landed in Johannesburg, South African

President. Cyril Ramaphosa said, quote, it does seem likely they were being flushed out of Gaza. President Trump said Sunday, he is open to talks with Venezuela and President Nicolas Maduro as he considers whether to launch a unilateral attack on Venezuela. In brief remarks to reporters, Trump did not offer details about the possible discussions, but said, quote, Venezuela would like to talk. Trump's remarks came as Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, designated the organized criminal group Cartel de Los Soles as a foreign terrorist organization.

U.S. officials have claimed without evidence Maduro and other government officials lead the cartel. Trump has claimed that allows the Pentagon to target Maduro's assets and infrastructure inside Venezuela. Meanwhile, the Pentagon said it had killed another three people in the eastern Pacific accused of smuggling drugs by sea, though officials offered no evidence. This brings the reported toll to 83 people killed across 21 strikes since early September. This comes amidst the largest buildup of U.S. forces in the Caribbean since the 1962 Cuban missile crisis involving nearly a dozen Navy ships and about 15,000 sailors and Marines. In Caracas, President Nicolas Maduro warned the U.S. public against allowing the Trump administration to lead the U.S.

into a new forever war in South America. Do we want another Gaza now in South America? What does the people of the United States say? Do you want a new Afghanistan? Do you want Vietnam again? Do you want Libya once more or worse? Do you want a new Gaza in South America? Let me tell you, no.

no, and no. Here, peace will triumph. International law will triumph. In Brazil, tens of thousands of protesters marched outside the COP 30 climate summit in Belang on Saturday to demand urgent action on the climate, including the rapid phase-out of fossil fuels. The Great People's March was the first major protest of its kind in four years, After authorities in Egypt, the United Arab Emirates and Azerbaijan banned large-scale demonstrations at prior UN climate summits. This is indigenous protester, Christiane Puyanawa. We're here today at the Global Climate March. Women, youths, indigenous people, rivering communities, and kilambolas are united to demand social justice and the demarcation of indigenous lands.

Our land and our forests are not commodities. Respect nature and the people who live in the forest. Demarcation now. We'll have more from Saturday's protests and the action inside the COP 30 climate summit here in Belang, Brazil, after headlines. Masked federal immigration officers fanned out across Charlotte, North Carolina over the weekend. Sparking protests as the Trump administration shifted its mass deportation campaign. to North Carolina's largest city. Democratic Governor Josh Stein said the agents were carrying out racial profiling and stoking fear.

We've seen masked, heavily armed agents and paramilitary garb driving unmarked cars, targeting American citizens based on their skin color, racially profiling, and picking up random people in parking lots and off of our sidewalks. Among those targeted were landscapers decorating. Christmas trees and congregants of an East Charlotte church volunteering to tend a garden. In another incident shared widely on social media, masked federal agents pulled over Willie Wender, Isituna Medina, a Honduras-born U.S. citizen, and forced him from his vehicle. No, if you break it, you will pay for it.

If you break it, you will pay for it. If you break my window. Why did you do this, sir? Why are you doing this? Isatuna told reporters he warned the agents he was a U.S. citizen, but that they didn't believe him. He suffered cuts to his arm and neck. He later filed a police report over the broken glass. President Trump's called on House Republicans to approve a measure compelling the Justice Department to release the Epstein files.

Trump's reversal late Sunday came after he unsuccessfully lobbied Republican Congresswomen, Lauren Bobert, and Nancy Mace to remove their names from a discharge petition seeking the files release. This follows months of stonewalling by the Trump administration over. the files release. And after Republican House Speaker Mike Johnson adjourned the House early to prevent a vote on the Epstein files. On Friday, Trump demanded the Justice Department investigate a list of powerful Democrats discussed in a trove of newly released emails from Jeffrey Epstein, but omitted his own name. The list includes former President Bill Clinton, former Treasury Secretary and former Harvard President Larry Summers and Democratic donor Reid Hoffman.

Trump wrote on social media, quote, Epstein was a Democrat, and he's the Democrats' problem, not the Republicans' problem, the president said. The Georgia election interference case against President Trump and his allies will now have a new prosecutor after Fulton County District Attorney Fannie Willis was removed from the case. The Executive Director of the Prosecuting Attorney's Council of Georgia, Speed Scandalakis, is set to take over the case. Georgia State University Law Professor Anthony Michael Kreis told the Associated Press, quote, I doubt anything will ever move forward with the president, unquote. But the case could proceed against 14 other Trump allies, including former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani and former White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows.

Trump's pardon, Giuliani, Meadows, and dozens of other Republican officials and activists accused of helping him overturn the results of the 2020 election. But the pardons only apply to federal cases, not the Georgia election interference case, which is a state-level prosecution. In the Philippines, hundreds of thousands of demonstrators took to the street Sunday to demand accountability over a corruption scandal that exposed how, Top government officials were receiving kickbacks from construction companies responsible for faulty and incomplete flood defense projects. The three-day protest rally comes after typhoons battered the Philippines early this month, leaving at least 259 people dead. Almost 100 days has passed since the process began, yet no one has been jailed. There already is plenty of proof. A lot of evidence has come out.

But our question is, how come no one has been jailed yet? In the Democratic Republic of Congo, at least 32 people were killed after a bridge at a copper and cobalt mine collapsed due to overcrowding. A government agency reports had gunfire from soldiers that the site sparked panic among the miners who rushed to the bridge, causing it to collapse. The DRC is the world's largest producer of cobalt, which is used to make batteries for electric vehicles. A BBC investigation has uncovered new evidence that implicates two U.S. Marines and the killing of Iraqi civilians in Haditha two decades ago. The BBC reports statements and testimony given in the aftermath of the Haditha massacre raised doubts about the investigation into what happened November 19, 2005, when U.S. forces slaughtered 24 Iraqis, posing significant questions over how U.S. armed forces are held to, account. Just one U.S. soldier was convicted of a crime over the massacre. Marine Staff Sergeant Frank Wuderich was found guilty of negligent dereliction of duty in 2012 and

served no jail time. And disability rights advocate and writer Alice Wong has died at the age of 51. When Wong was born with muscular dystrophy in 1974, doctors said she wouldn't live to the age of 18. Despite that prognosis, Wong went on to earn an undergraduate degree at Indiana University and a master's degree from the University of California, San Francisco, before founding the Disability, Visibility Project, an online community dedicated to creating, sharing, and amplifying disability, media, and culture. This is Alice Wong speaking with Democracy Now in 2021. I think a lot of people, in the public, do not know what ableism is.

And if they hear about it, they actually deny that it exists. You know, if ableism is systemic, and it's really bound up with hyperchapalism and white supremacy. And those are some of the headlines. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org, the warrant. Peace Report. I'm Amy Goodman. We're broadcasting from the UN Climate Summit, that's COP 30, from the Brazilian city of Belang. It's the gateway to the Amazon. Leaders and delegates from more than 190 countries have entered a second week of negotiations. On Saturday, democracy now is in the streets of Belang as tens of thousands of protesters gather demanding urgent climate action.

The Great People's March was the first major climate protest at a UN climate summit since 2021. The three previous climate summits were hosted by nations that ban public actions, Egypt, the United Arab Emirates, and Azerbaijan. We're in the streets of Belém, where the UN Climate Summit is taking place. We're halfway through the negotiations of COP 30. It's a Saturday. Thousands of people have taken to the streets. It's demanding urgent climate action. We spoke to several of them.

My name is Giovanni Delprej. I'm from Brazil, from San Paulo. I'm here with all the people from more. We have here, Gator, more than 60 countries here. And we have Gator in UFPI and University, the Rio Cop Summit here, the People's Summit, in the University here of the state of Parah. We have Gator there, 30,000 people from 60 countries.

Here we are denouncing all the false solutions in the COP 30. We are saying that the financial market was in the official COP 30 and the real people and the real solutions were here. We are seen here on the streets. So this is our message to the world. Against the war, against the imperialist invasion, we are seeing U.S. right now just launching a new military attempt against Venezuela, against Colombia, and this is what matters.

There is no peace, there's no possibility of environmental solutions with war, with fossil fuels, and this is what we are here. Denouncing, more than denouncing the problems, but also presenting proposals for life in the peoples, the peasants, the women movement, we have the diversity of all societies here. So this is what we are doing here. Fight for our life. I am an Amazonian woman. I am an activist in the peasant women's movement, and we are here at the global.

March in defense of life, in defense of our territories, and we will not negotiate our rights. Because there is no living territory if we are not alive. We will not negotiate our rights. I am Lucia and Chou, a Maya Kichu woman from Guatemala. I'm part of the Amazon Flotilla, an answer of Festivals Media in Guatemala. I'm staying in the march. indigenous grassroots organizations in Brazil, but also defending and denouncing the eco-site in Guatemala and in the different parts of the continent.

I'm also part of the Yakumama Flotilla. We travel for more than 31 days for the Amazon River from Ecuador to Belang, and we see the echo side there. So for us it's very important to be here and stand together because we have to take action together for the environmental issue. Why is that sense of solidarity so important, especially especially among indigenous leaders from across the region and around the world. Well, one of the most important thing for me for this COP is the action and the solidarity

that we are building together as an indigenous leaders and land defenders for different parts of the world. Because we know that the answer is us. We know that we are the live alternatives. We have the answers and we have the response for all the devastation and the destruction for the climate crisis. And we are making this together. We know that we have the solution. My name is Delma Wellington Drovo from Zimbabwe, a small hortic farmer, a peasant farmer from my country. I'm part of the international movement of Lavia Campesina.

We are here because as Lavia Campesina, we are concerned of the false solutions that you are being given. We are concerned about the power that is still playing. in the Pope. We feel the power is not equal. People are, the corporate capture of the system has gone high. And so we have come to lend our voice to say this is high time it should stop. People should look at the people first, not at money, not at anything, but just look at people and the farmers. We are the majority, even in any country. Therefore, we should be considered. That's why we are here. My name is Errinaldo Rodriguez. I am the chief of the Mierichituba village, and the message I want to tell the government is on this banner. It's for them to leave us the Tapajos in peace.

They take away our food, the food of our children and grandchildren, and that is our territory. That is a sacred place, where we must fight until the end of our lives, until we die. For that river, for the stones, for the rock formations, all of that serves as a symbol of our ancestors. That place is a legend to us. And I want to tell the government to look out for us,

because stop harming us in our region, in our Amazon rainforest. Our families are dying, our territories are dying, our orders are dying in our culture. We and the nature are the same thing. not separate. So our life, our spirituality, our mind, our feeling is totally connected to the rivers. We are the waters, people of the waters, fishmen and fish warm men. Our life is the river. Our life is the ocean. And the ocean, and the ocean's animals have no voice. We are the voice of the water, of the water animals, and they are dying and crying.

Oh, that need to stop and run out. It's just really important to point out that there's a lot of focus in Amazon and the forest, but there's also need to focus on the riverine communities, on the Kilombolo communities, and also in the communities from other areas that are also guardians of our ecosystems that are very important, like the fisher folk in the coast and the fish of folk and the mangroves. So this is the movement they represent them. Tom Goldtoothan, from Minnesota, United States, Indigenous Marimiro Network. We are a global international network of indigenous people.

We're standing here with our relatives from the global south from the Amazon to speak with one mind and one voice and one heart. We're demanding that all these fossil field lobby is being removed. It's very unethical and immoral that there's more there than the indigenous people here from the local region. We have indigenous people here who have to fight to get in. But we have these corporations

that can just walk right in with no struggle. So we're declaring that the rights of indigenous people be recognized and there'll be climate action, action, real solutions and we have that as indigenous people.

We are here to announce the capitalist negotiations in the face of the climate crisis, which never manages to fulfill any agreements for controlling greenhouse gas emissions or establishing carbon sinks. Instead, it's pure capitalist business interests, with no results. We must insist on mitigation and compensation, as well as adaptation. climate justice is also necessary, and that implies compensation for the damaged cause by the climate crisis inflicted by capitalism and global imperialism. And of course, solidarity with the people of Venezuela who are being threatened with the use of force by a thug and a red tie and blue suit, but who only once, not freedom, not democracy, not humanitarian aid.

But to plunder their resources, not only of Venezuela, they want to enter the Amazon through Venezuela, and they're coming to seize all of Latin America. For Venezuela, but they're going to counter all Latin America. Fight for climate justice. Resistance. Fight for climate justice. Resisting perialism. I'm racial Jun-Sai. I'm from the Philippines, and I'm with the peoples rising for climate justice.

We're marching with the people. of Belem today to demand accountability from the world leaders as they attend COP 30 as we can see a lot of wars and occupations has been happening all over the world from Palestine to Sudan to Congo and other regions West Papua and even in Asia and with that the ongoing exercise is something that we should not tolerate something that we should not allow and so we're here demanding for these world leaders for this imperialist nations to stop the US led wars to stop their imperialist domination over these countries to stop the food blockades and to stop violating the human rights of those

people and the environment. Communities in the Philippines are devastated by flooding and corruption and those are things that should have been talked about in the COP 30 and yet we are seeing false solutions. We are seeing carbon markets that do not do justice to the people. Instead of putting the spotlight on the communities affected by the typhoons, it is the world leaders, it is the global North imperialist nation that are taking up space. That's why the most of the most of the spotlight. movement is here to get their space to demand accountability and to fight back against these world leaders who are dominating the space that should have been for the people and for the environment.

Why are we on this risk today? Can we answer that question, please? We are tired of false solutions. We are tired of corporate capture of the system. We are tired of being slaves in our own country. I believe the power is in us to say no. As we stand together, let the Cope know that we are concerned as peasants. Power to the people. From the streets of Belém, this is Maria and Estaracena with Democracy now. Voices from the streets of Belen here in Brazil at Saturday's major indigenous-led climate protests outside the UN Climate Summit, where we are right now. Special thanks to Maria Teresina,

Sam Alcoff, and Trina Nadurda. When we come back, we'll speak to the heads of Amazon Watch and Oxfam Brazil. Stay with us. In Tubaio! It's your bayon. I said that we're going to get it again. He can't evoke your arms. And I go to mark and far. I'm getting caught in a fog,

depending on our path. It's not a fortado, that's in a ritual, there's incandals, no mark the temporal. It's been a foothed, that I got in the ritual that's enchanted,

no mark the temporal. Incocted, no more the temporal. Not a mark the temporal That's my culturedara This is my culturedara See me a mania And tomorrow

I'm a furier And this is macusurra This is maucurara This is my culturedra Oh, I'm a guerrero I'm a tree Mypidae Indigenous protestors

Go back. Go back? Five, four, three, two. Indigenous protesters chanting chanting during Saturday's March on COP 30 here in Belang. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org, the War and Peace Report. I'm Amy Goodman. We're broadcasting from the UN Climate Summit from the Brazilian city of Belang.

It's the gateway to the Amazon. COP 30 comes 33 years after the Rio Earth Summit, which established the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, the UNFWC. Leaders and delegates from more than 190 countries have entered a second week of negotiations at the summit known as COP 30, that's Conference of Parties 30. We're joined now by two guests. Leila Salazar Lopez, as the Executive Director of Amazon Watch, she recently wrote an article headlined COP 30 at the crossroads, indigenous sovereignty or climate collapse.

And we're joined by Viviana Santiago, the executive director of Oxfam Brazil. Earlier this year, she joined the Lula administration as a member of the Presidency Council focused on sustainable development. Oxfam recently released a report titled Climate Plunder, how a powerful few are locking the world into disaster. unquote. Oxfam also submitted a petition of over a million signatures to the Brazilian government demanding that the super rich pay for climate damages. We welcome you both to democracy now. It's quite something to be here at the gateway of the Amazon. Viviana, let's begin with you. For our

global audience, can you set the stage? Where exactly are we? What is the significance of Berlin? Why is the UN Climate Summit. Why did Lula, the president of Brazil, choose to put it in this gateway city? Thank you so much for the invitation. It's really important to us to be here with you. And talk about the importance of being here in the Amazon region. It's talk about the vulnerability that you can see in this region. You can see how poverty affect people here. but also you can see how these people can answer the climate crisis. I think that the whole idea is about what we can have from this environment in terms of resistance, in terms of power connections with Earth and nature,

and how ancestrality plays an important role ensuring that we need to connect with our roots. But at the same time, we can see that this. These people that are fighting for survival, fighting for conservancy, are the most affected people in the world. And it's about climate crisis. And in some way, it's about to talk about climate justice. We need to understand that people that are most affected for the climate crisis are the people that did nothing to this crisis. So how can we act in terms to protect their lives and ensure that the rich pollutants will pay for that? So here we are at the mouth of the Amazon, right, in Berlin, the Amazon, the lungs of the planet.

Can you talk about the impacts of rising temperatures and deforestation? Here in Brazil, and especially in this region, we can see this impact. We can see how the heat is affecting people's health, how it's almost impossible for some children go to school because school are not prepared for this heat, even here in this region. But at a certain point in some months here, the entire country can suffer the consequences. So what we are facing right now is a climate crisis here in Brazil that is affecting the entire country. What happens in Amazon affecting Brazil as a whole? So what we need to do right now is ensure that we will have conditions to adaptations and to mitigate the risk.

Laila Salazar Lopez, put Brazil in a regional context. significance of this country when it comes to climate change. I mean, we just had Viviana saying the people who least cause climate change are most affected by it. And also respond to President Trump, a well-known and proud climate change denier. He campaigned on the slogan, Drill Baby Drill, not sending a high-level delegation to this climate summit. It's the first time in the COPS history. Well, thank you, Amy, for having me in democracy now. Really, this is about democracy, right? You open the segment with saying that we haven't had civil society at COPS in three years. And so that's what we're seeing here in Brazil. We're seeing that because we're talking about

more repressive governments that didn't allow public protest. For the last three years, the COPS have been in Egypt, Dubai, and Azerbaijan. The civil society presence has been very, very limited. It's been inside. And the beauty of the forest cop, the beauty of the people's cop in Brazil, is that civil society is very active, both inside and outside. And as Viviana was saying, it's critical that what is happening here in the Amazon. The Amazon is at a tipping point. It's not coming.

It's here. Why is that? I think we should talk about why the Amazon is at a tipping point, why the Amazon is literally burning. It's because of policy. It's because of industry. It's because of extraction. It's because of continued land grabbing, oil extraction, mineral extraction, land grabbing of indigenous people's lands. And that's why we see the mobilizations of indigenous and local communities. saying we want our land back. We want land demarcation. We want our rights just respected. We want mining off of our lands. We want the Amazon free of extraction. Literally, there is a protest happening right now by a mobilization of indigenous peoples leaving the indigenous village that has over

3,500 indigenous people staying there. And that's why we're saying that this is the indigenous cop. There are more indigenous peoples here in Belize. than at any other COP in history. And that is significant because indigenous peoples are the guardians of the forest. They are protecting the forest, riverine people, Campesino people, Kilambolas. They are protecting the forests from the threats, from the destruction. And they've made a very significant presence here at COP. And yes, there's the absence of the U.S. government as climate deniers.

but the U.S. civil society is here too. We're here very strongly, and whether our federal government denies climate, we're here to also stand with the people and also demand that the Amazon be free of extraction and that we have, you know, there is no mention of fossil fuel extraction and the fact that it is the number one cause of global greenhouse gas emissions. So there's something missing there. When we have over 1,200 fossil fuel lobbyists here, that's more than some entire country delegations.

So we need to come to reality here with the fact that we need to keep oil in the ground. We've been saying this for a long time since the Paris Agreement. We're a lot closer to hearing that here at COP 30. And it is the indigenous people in the local communities who are making that. that known, that we want the Amazon free of extraction. And Viviana Santiago, it is those people, grassroots environmental activists, particularly indigenous, who also face the most threat, not just environmentally, but how many have been murdered in the last years. Can you talk about that violence and who's perpetrating it?

Here in Brazil, we are completely aware that Brazil is one of the most dangerous countries. in the world for civil society activists, especially environmental activists. And the murder of civil society activists is completely related with land, with strativism, with the protection of the forest. People who are right now here in Brazil talking about it are in danger.

And there is not enough conversations about it, not from the entire. society because we understand that the interests that are behind of these reality are completely aligned with fossil fuel, with the new economy, with this model of sustainability. And here in Brazil, we will not face any improvement in this context if we are not open to discuss it with the private sectors, who are really behind. of these realities, because in the ground, people are being murdered because they are trying to protect their lands, their lifestyle, their rivers.

Now, you're really wearing two hats, though I'm the one wearing the hat in this show. Your two hats, you're head of Oxfam, Brazil, and you just joined the Lula administration in his presidency advisory council. Just ahead of COP, Lula's government approved new oil exploration near the mouth of the Amazon River, while Lula has backed a 900-kilometer highway redevelopment that environmental and indigenous groups say would provide access for extractive industries and threaten huge new areas of forest. Can you comment on this as a person who's so often been on the outside, but you're on the inside now as well? Yeah, it was really devastating for all of us these decisions.

We, as civil society, we fight a lot against it. But I understand that in this government, they think that there is a way to finance a transition from fossil fuels. Personally, I don't agree. I completely disagree that it can be a path for us. because this path previously led us on this reality that we are facing right now. It's generating a lot of resistance in the entire country and generating solidarity in the entire world. I think that it's still time to change this reality.

It really affects and really increase the threat against indigenous people and traditional communities in Amazonas. in Amazonas. There is no way that these activities can't generate more impact, more danger. And I think that it is still time to change these decisions. The movement right now in Brazil from civil society is really trying to change this decision because it is impossible to keep Brazil on track with the situation right now. Leila Salazar Lopez, can you talk about the role of indigenous people being excluded from the talks? And you've been here for the last week.

If you can talk about the state of the talks right now here in Belang, where inside COP 30, inside the UN Climate Summit, where these negotiations are taking place. And for people who don't understand what happens every year, the significance of this being called an action summit. The significance of it being called an Action Summit is because we need action for the Amazon. We need action for the global climate and for the communities. We hear a lot of talk about direct finance. There's a lot of talk about finance, but for indigenous peoples who we work in solidarity with, it's about direct finance to indigenous peoples, not only to governments, not only through corporations and intermediaries, but directly to indigenous people

so that they have the sovereignty to make their decisions on what they want to do with their land. And that's why we see, you know, when there are people excluded, we see here in Brazil, people aren't used to saying no. And the Munduruku people who traveled from their communities, from their territories, which are threatened by illegal mining, which are threatened by an industrial waterway to transport soy, which are threatened by a federal growl, the soy railway, to transport soy to Europe and China. When we see them coming in buses, in ferries, in boats, in giant caravans, they're not coming to stand outside.

They're coming to put some pressure and some heat on the governments, the negotiators, and that's what they came to do. When we saw the cop being shut down on Friday, it was a Munduruku people saying no one in, no one out. Why? Because they said, we want our land demarcated. We do not want this federal grail, this soy railway. We do not want this waterway. And the cop president came out.

And Marina Silva came out. And Minister Sonia Wajajara came out and met with them. And that, you know, that wasn't the plan, but that's democracy. And that was what is so beautiful here in Brazil. As a result, you know, the Brazilian government said, you know, we're going to put a hold on this federal ground. We're not going, we're not going forward on this soy railway for Cargill and ADM and Bungi and all these multinational corporations to feed animals, not people. We are going to, we're not going forward with this without people's consent. And that is, that's democracy and that's the power of the indigenous movement here in Brazil.

In fact, there is an indigenous march going on right now, right out. side of cop. But the level of negotiations and the countries that are playing a key role, if you can explain sort of an insider's look as well. Well, honestly, I have not been on so much on the inside. I've been more on the outside. But I do know that from the indigenous caucus, one of the victories is that there are, they are, there is mention of mining. There is And that has never happened out of cop. There is a mention of mining as a cause of climate change and that there needs to be free prior and informed consent.

And there's also a mention of discussions and mention of indigenous peoples and voluntary isolation. That means uncontacted peoples. There are still uncontacted peoples here in the Amazon. And that is one of the major demands of the indigenous movement that the lands of indigenous people in voluntary isolation

in particular need to be free from any kind of extraction. I want people to understand, and let me put this question to Viviana Santiago. Here you are in Brazil, head of Oxfam, Brazil. What isolated communities are? People who voluntarily choose, communities that voluntarily choose, voluntarily choose to be isolated, and what that means, it's a really formal government designation and how the government protects them. I think that isolated indigenous communities are the most beautiful thing in the entire world. Because we can see how these people has decided to live according their beliefs, according their traditions.

They really believe that they don't need this contact. They don't want this contact. And the way that they are framing their cosmovision, is based on their own history and completely connected with ancestrality. Here in Brazil, they are protected by law. They are protected and we can ensure also this protection because they are more vulnerable to disease than the other people and communities.

So avoid and really prevent people from outside to be there is the duty of the government here in Brazil. But their lands are supervalued here in Brazil, and that's why to address mining during COP, it's important, because right now, because of the transitions, we are facing all the time the importance of the minerals, but there's not good mining. So when we are talking about the importance of these minerals,

We are talking about mining, and we are again putting these lands in the center of this process and making them more vulnerable than before. And I think that right now, Brazilian government must ensure total protections, and it can be done by protect their lands. If you protect the land, you protect the people. There are more indigenous people here at this COP 30 than there have been at any UN climate summit. I'm wondering, before we wrap up, if you can talk about President Lula's proposal of tropical forests forever, if you can explain, and maybe, Leila, you can too, talk about Lula's proposal to pay countries not to deforest. I'll start. I can say that in our perspective as Oxford, we understand that it's really innovative.

This mechanism, it's really an innovation from COP presidents, from Brazilian presidents. But we also understand that there would be faster ways to achieve the same result. We believe that a global taxation on wealth and sectors that are polluting the world right now would be more effective and fast. The amount of money that is available for communities, it starts on 20%, but we understand that it would be a start, but indigenous peoples are asked for at least half of them. the fund. So there is a simple way, and we can do it, taxing the rich polluters, taxing the

sectors that are polluting more, and the money, it can be led to the local communities. Leila, we spoke to a Jamaican, a British climate activist when the hurricane hit Jamaica. And she said, rather than naming hurricanes, you know, Hurricane Melissa, Hurricane John, why don't you name them after oil companies? And I'm just wondering, Lela, as we wrap up, the significance of Trump not sending a high-level delegation to this summit the first time American government has not. I mean, there are a number of senators and Congress members who do believe in climate change who are here representing the government but not representing Trump. Do you see this actually as an opportunity that the administration will not be shaping what goes on, or are they doing it in other ways, through the fossil fuel lobbyists, for example? Yeah, as I mentioned before, while the federal government is not here, civil societies here, and subnational states were here. I mean, the California governor was here, various representatives of the state of California were here, and we're very happy to have been collaborating with Senator Josh Becker.

who led an initiative in the state of California to investigate California's reliance on Amazon crude because over half of the Amazon crude that comes out of Ecuador, which has had an amazing election yesterday for the rights of nature and for democracy, half of the oil, over half of the oil that comes out of Ecuador comes to California. So we're looking into, as a part of the just transition in California, phasing out Amazon crude. But we also need to phase out crude in Kern County and offshore in California. And so we need to see, we're seeing climate leadership from state levels, not the federal government, but I'm sure, you know, with Trump's and other countries desire to get every last drop of oil, I'm sure they're supporting the fossil

fuel industry lobbyists that are that are here at Congress. We're going to continue this conversation all week, because we're here broadcasting from COP 30, the UN Climate Summit, the gateway city of Belang and the gateway to the Amazon. Laila Salazar Lopez, thanks so much for joining us, Executive Director of Amazon Watch. And Viviana Santiago, Executive Director of Oxfam, Brazil, now in the Lula government, part of the advisory presidential council. Coming up, Asad Raymond, Chief Executive of Friends of the Earth. Stay with us.

I'ma, yeah, niga, niga, niga, niga, niga, yonkara, yi'gara, yi'gola, y'nga'n'gola, y'ngna y'gna, y'nga'ng'gna, y'n'gariii'iii, y'a y'rae y'an'iiiiiiii Eurriqa, garakir, gharachis, gara ch'arriere, Yan-i-i-a-Ni-a-Ni-a-Ni-Ri-Ri-Ri-Ri-Sahe. Y'i-Ni-Ga-Ni-Gah, Niga, la Niga, Niga, Niga, Niga, Rihara, Niga, Frii-Ri-Ri-Ai-Nan-A-Ni-A-N-Ris Faire. Mutu-Mu-U-Ri-Ri-Ri-Ri-A. Mastapu, mazapu, mazapura, Mnikao, Niga, Niga, Niga, Niga, Niga, and Nga, Nga, and Nga, Faya, Faya. Munduru-Ko, Molduru-Riqo, Munduruu Puro, Munguuuu, Murururur Uriquh.

And Nijara, Niga, Niga, and Niga, and Gaya, Faya, and Gaya, and Gaya, and Gaya, Faya, and Zapaio, Sapajo, Sapajo, Sapajo, and Rurrikeh, Sapajo, Sapajo, and Indigenous protesters chanting during Saturday's March on COP 30 here in Belang, Brazil. This is Democracy Now, Democracy Now.org. I'm Amy Goodman. We're broadcasting from the UN Climate Summit from the Brazilian city of Belang. It's the gateway to the Amazon. To look at the state of the negotiations and more, we're joined by Asad Raymond, the chief executive of Friends of the Earth, longtime climate justice campaign.

Previously, Executive Director at War Unwant. We welcome you back to Democracy Now. Thanks so much for being with us. Always a pleasure, Amy. So you've been here through the summit. Explain what we should understand. What are the negotiations that are taking place? What is the theme of this Comp 30?

So just to take a step back in first, obviously we're meeting here when the very rules-based system, whether it's from Gaza to climate, is under threat. Obviously, we've seen the rise of far-right, authoritarianism and fascism, Donald Trump and climate denialism in being one. And this weaponising of anti-Muslim, anti-migrant,

and anti-climate, being part of the backdrop. And that's been one of the sort of drivers here about how do you celebrate 10 years of Paris, 30 years of COP, to show that actually multilateralism matters and implementation matters. Look, we've heard from the ICJ that there is a legal and a moral obligation for countries to act. Both are mitigation, adaptation. They have a responsibility not only

for the polluter pays in doing their fair share, but also to do no harm. And of course, the ICJ is the International Court of Justice at the Hague. So absolutely. So I would say there are three issues that are crossing every negotiating rumor here. One is fairness. How do the people, whether they're in Kingston, Manila or Gaza, celebrate if impacts are happening to them from extreme weather impacts the floods. What happens in terms of equity? Who's doing their bit? Who's missing? And of course, the United States not doing their fair share, but also rich developed countries not delivering the scale of ambition that is required. And then the critical question of finance. We all know finance is needed. And what we saw in Baku, yes, last year was, you know, a lot of

promises on private finance are mobilising. But really what is required is who's actually going to provide the support. And so the cost of inaction we know is running in trillions, will there be money here? And some of those negotiations, of course, are not happening here in Berlin. They're happening in Nairobi at this very same moment when there is a debate and discussions going on about a UN tax convention. And the very countries that are refusing to pay for climate finance here are also blocking action that would provide the hundreds of billions that are needed. Look, Brazil's government came here and said They've got what they call the FAB for

Provision of finance Making sure that unilateral measures Such a trade measures are equal Can they close the ambition gap And can there be transparency Not only in reporting what countries are doing But also on the pre-cussion of finance We've heard for a long time

Lots of words from developed countries Saying we're providing lots of money But when we lift the hood We know that it's a lot of double counting A lot of that finance isn't very real so we need transparency on finance. The negotiations are still continuing and now ministers will start to meet

ministers from both developed countries and developed countries to close the gap on what is called the seven key issues. Those will be of the global stock take how close are we to meeting the ambition needed on 1.5? The critical issue of global goal

on adaptation, how do we adapt to the fact that the world is changing? Extreme weather, inequality, ecosystems collapsing. What we're going to do about the just transition? How do we ensure we have a plan about the transition that works for people, communities, countries and workers? And then, of course, making sure whether it's in mitigation, technology and finance, including on gender, that there is progress. So those things are going to happen. The hope is there actually some really concrete roadmaps here. We've heard a lot about global goal on adaptation. A critical

issue for developing countries. We had 5,000 indicators. They got down to 1,000 indicators. We're now down to 100 indicators. But indicators without the finance, without the means to implement, will just be meaningless. So what developing countries are saying here is we need a roadmap on adaptation.

On the Just Transition Work Programme, there's a demand. It's been echoed by civil society and by the developing countries, the G77, saying we need a BELM action mechanism. This sounds like a technical term, but really What it means is that there will be not just coordination,

but actually a concrete plan that allows people to plan about how we manage this change and ensure everybody has a right to live with dignity and harmony with our planet. Now, the third thing is on fossil fuels. Now, fossil fuels themselves aren't in these negotiations as such, but there are countries coming here, like Colombia, that's saying, we've got a roadmap. We can ensure that we can move away from fossil fuels. But that, of course, requires us to have finance.

It requires us to understand the diversification for lots of countries who are relying on fossil fuels. And of course, recognising that for many countries, including developing countries, they're trapped in a cycle of debt, which means that they keep having to exploit their fossil fuels. So if we want to end that, we need a plan on that as well. Well, we're going to have to leave it there for today, but we are here all week. We're talking about the climate catastrophe and what people are doing about it. I want to thank us at Raymond, now Chief Executive of Friends of the Earth. That does it for our show as we broadcast from the UN COP 30 Climate Summit in the Brazilian city of Belen, the gateway to the...