DeProgram with John Kiriakou and Ted Rall - Anti-Zionism Criminalized | DeProgram with Ted Rall and Jamarl Thomas

Episode Date: June 11, 2026

Editorial cartoonist Ted Rall and political analyst Jamarl Thomas deprogram you from mainstream media every weekday at 9 AM Eastern time. Today we discuss:• The Trump administration’s policy of criminalizing criticism of Israel escalates dramatically as 8 people affiliated with the University of Michigan are charged with conspiring to threaten campus leaders and others into severing ties with Israel. An indictment unsealed in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Michigan, accused pro-Palestinian activists of crossing the line from campus protest to crimes that included threats and vandalism. The defendants face varying charges, but the indictment included federal counts of conspiracy to transmit threats, witness intimidation and destruction of property to prevent seizure.• Rioters set houses, vehicles and a city bus ablaze in Belfast, torching neighborhoods after a video of a knife attack by a Sudanese asylum seeker went viral, igniting the latest anti-immigration violence to convulse the UK. Men in balaclavas and hoods shouted “foreigners out.” The riots spread from Belfast to towns across Northern Ireland and reached into Scotland and England by nightfall. • The Canadian government introduces a new digital safety proposal that would require users to verify that they are at least 16 to access websites like Facebook, TikTok and Instagram. A new regulator called the Digital Safety Commission of Canada would administer the proposed measures.• U.S. airstrikes destroyed a drinking-water facility on Iran’s southern coast, near the Strait of Hormuz. Water was cut off to more than 20,000 people living in a town and villages nearby, where temperatures are above 100 degrees Fahrenheit. Deliberately targeting civilian infrastructure can constitute a war crime under international law.• “Hopes were fading”: Unless lawmakers act by midnight Friday, Section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, or FISA, will sunset. Democrats are angry, not at domestic spying, but that Trump named Bill Pulte, housing official without any national security experience, as acting director of national intelligence.JOIN US LIVE ON RUMBLEhttps://rumble.com/c/DeProgramShowFOLLOW TED:https://rall.com/https://x.com/tedrallLISTEN ON SPOTIFY:https://open.spotify.com/show/2kdFlw2w8sSPhKI8NRx8ZuLISTEN ON APPLE MUSIC:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/deprogram-with-john-kiriakou-and-ted-rall

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If you want to get more value from your points without becoming a points nerd, visit point. dot me and see what your points are really worth. This episode sponsored by Point Me. Want to know the secret to booking flights with points and miles? Let's say you've got 80,000 points and you're looking at a business class flight to Europe. Cash price? Around $3,000. You check your credit card travel portal, 300,000 points. Way too high. But shh, here's what you should do instead. Go to point. point dot me and run that exact same search. In seconds, it shows you better ways to book that same flight across dozens of airline programs. Now, instead of 300,000 points, you're seeing options closer to 65,000. That's because you can move your credit card points into airline

programs, where the pricing is usually way lower. Same flight, same seat, for less than half the points. And Point Me doesn't just show you the options. It walks you through exactly how to book it. If you want to get more value from your points without becoming a points nerd, visit point.me and see what your points are really worth. Get 25% off an annual membership with code points 25. Can you hear me? One second. Wait, you can hear me? Okay, why can't I hear you?

Hold on. No, it was my fault. Ted, you're muted, sir. There we are. Okay. Okay, I thought I was going insane. I was like, I can. That might be true, but no, you're not.

But you can, but it's my fault. Okay, I thought I was going nuts. I was like, what the hell? Why can I hear it? No, it's, who knows with this thing? Well, you are nuts, J.T. You are, I mean, for every reason, decided to be my friends. So I don't really understand that, how that works.

Yeah, we both have that issue being insane. Anyway, thanks so much for joining us. You're watching Jamarlem-Thomas and Ted Rawley. You're watching Deep Program. It is Thursday, June 11th, 2026. Please like, follow and share the show. A little housekeeping. I'm going to be out for the TMI show this morning with Manila,

but Robbie will be filling in. We will DMZ America podcast, also not happening this morning, but we're attempting to schedule for tomorrow with Friday at 11. A lot to talk about. I'm just going to go through the stories very quickly. If you have a question, comment, whatever, and you're watching live in the 9 o'clock hour Eastern, please go ahead and put your questions into the live chat on Rumble or YouTube and producer

Robbie West. We'll get to them. Okay, so I have five main stories here. We could have had six. It was a busier news day than I expected. The Trump administration's policy of criminalizing criticism of Israel escalating dramatically. Eight people now face federal criminal charges for conspiring to threaten leaders of the University of Michigan. into severing ties with Israel. We'll get into that. The anti-immigrant nativist riots have that began in Belfast in British-occupied Northern Ireland are spreading into Scotland and to England proper. It's very disturbing, basically men in Balaclava's are going door to door and demanding foreigners out. The Canadian government is introducing a new law that would make no one

that would make it so that no Canadian child under the age of 16 would be allowed to use social media sites. The U.S. appears to have deliberately targeted and destroyed a drinking water facility near the Strait of Armoos in Iran, where temperatures are currently over 100 degrees Fahrenheit. That is a war crime. I don't think it really much matters. And then hilariously, the New York Times says hopes were fading that the Section 702 of the 4. Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, which, among other things, permits domestic spying without a warrant on ordinary American citizens, is in danger of expiring. I'm like, not because Democrats are

worried about the domestic surveillance that goes counter to our Fourth Amendment rights against unreasonable search and seizure, but because they're not happy about Tulsi Gabbard's chosen replacement as Director of National Intelligence. They don't think he has enough experience, probably true, but it's just a hilarious story. Jamal, any of that appeal? I mean, the Belfast thing is a little disturbing. The EU thing is also, I'm sorry, the candidate thing is also interesting, this idea of banning social media users under the age of 16. I got to be honest, some agnostic on some of this. Well, let's go to FISA. We can dispose of FISA quickly. Yeah. It should be.

disposed of quickly. Like I'll just take it too late for that. It should be disposed of it's outrageous. I mean and in fact it's a betrayal that the Trump administration wasn't more vigorous and getting rid of it considering they used it just by own Trump. If you remember it's like they're wiretapping me, they're wiretapping. Okay, well Trump is ancient. So he understands it in the context of a quote wiretap as if there's a wire to tap. But he what he's saying wasn't false. They were spine against campaign. They were using FISA as a rationale to do so.

They do peak on American usage of it when they were like, hey, who was he talking to? Well, he was obviously talking to American. What was the American's name that they were talking to? Which is often what they used. And there were cases of, like, agents using this stuff to spy on their wives and spouses and whatnot. This thing is massively out of whack. And one last point. The reconstruction that they use, meaning, hey, we have a case on somebody, but we can't really bring this into the

limelight or into reality. And so what we do is we reach out to police force and tell the police force what we have so they can construct a parallel case against the person. Mind you, the cops wouldn't have had a case if it wasn't for the illegal spying that they were using. For Pfizer, it is not a court. 99.7 percent of the cases bought to Pfizer, quote unquote, court, it gets allowed to pass through because there is no opposition to what is being told to the judge. all of this, this is like the Stasi in the U.S. And we pretend as if it's not like the Stasi. It's insane that they allow this to go through.

Sorry, yeah, it should fail. It should fail. It's like a star chamber, right, to use another reference. Yeah, it's totally true. There's, I mean, basically what these are, are freelance federal judges, earning a little scratch on the side. They meet in private chambers.

prosecutors come in, the government FBI comes in and said, hey, we want to spy on Jamarlemus, you know, here's what we have on him. They can make things up. And there's no, there's not, there's not, certainly your defense lawyer isn't there. You're never notified. And you're, and they don't even have a pro forma person who's there to defend sort of generically to fight against this. There's no one there, like you said. And, and so the judges are very predisposed to granting these because they're establishmentarian and also they're financially induced to do this, right? Because let's just say you had a judge who was routinely turning down these wiretapping warrants. Well, they would stop using that judge, right? And then

they're not going to be able to make their vacation home payments. So it's corrupt. So I mean, I think it's hilarious that even the New York Times, right, which claims to be, you know, the paper that broke the stone revelations that claimed to be upset about Nixon wiretapping during Watergate and all that, that they are totally, and they've had their own reporters targeted under FISA, that they're saying hopes are fading. And the government says, this is how we catch terrorists. There is no evidence whatsoever that any terrorist has ever been caught by doing anything. under FISA. And if that evidence exists, I'd like to hear it. But even if that, even if it worked, efficacy is not a justification. But I don't even think you can point to efficacy. Like, you know,

the idea is kind of like, well, we're bending the law a little bit to keep America safe. I don't think we're any safer. I'm scared. I'm much more scared of the government than I am scared of Islamic terrorists. Yeah. If we have a legal system, what is the point of that legal system if it's not? We used to champion this idea that we don't have Stazis. We don't have those. We don't have these secret police in the way. We don't have secret courts. Yes, we do.

And Jamar, let me give you one low and fat overhome plate that you can smack out of the park. What good are the Democrats if this is what passes for opposition? The only thing they're worried about is personnel, right? They're worried that the relatively weak position of DNI, which Tulsi, which Tulsi, gathered found frustrating and kind of worthless is basically being filled by a dude who's probably underqualified. Okay. How about like defend, how many, this is an opportunity for the Democrats, another one that they're blowing where they could say, we're going to take a stand for the American people who don't like this. When the American people learn about this, left, right,

middle, they don't like it. So, you know, I think FISA, if it were put up for a vote on every, If you woke up in the morning and you had a poll on your phone, it would like, you know, go down like, you know, 94% to 6%. You know. They don't care. I am not at mine that Democrats care. Sure. But there are like 10 things that I can think of that would be popular that the American public would agree with that you would think that they could go to the bat for. But they would never do it.

They don't believe in that stuff. From their point of view, FISA is a necessity. It's something that they want to be able to use because governments don't want to give up power. The Democratic Party, who believes they will be back in government at some point in the future, also want to be able to use these tools and instruments, the F over the American public. So I don't think they care. And when you have both political parties that have conspired with each other to not care on any particular issue, then that issue becomes almost untouchable.

It's this kind of argument that we make where it's like the things that people want are things that both political parties have basically agreed that they're not going to get, in which case they never come up, which means you don't have a choice on that issue. You can choose Pepsi and Coke. You can't choose whether or not the government spies on you, which is outrageous. And by the way, the moment that you would try to do something like that, there will be political actors trying to stop you from doing it. And it's like, so me as representative of the American public trying to change something will get stopped in my pursuit of trying to change it, despite the fact that the American public fundamentally agrees with me on the issue that it needs to be changed. Yeah, it's disgusting. All right. So what shall we hit next?

Shall we do Iran? Yes. The strikes going back and forth. Iran has closed the straight of Ramos. They've effectively said this is closed. the U.S. ran strikes yesterday. Iran retaliated. Apparently, they were eight, I think 16 strikes against the base in Jordan. I don't remember if they hit Iran again this time around.

Apparently, there were attacks on Iraq yesterday at some point. It's, this is a war. I mean, from my point of view, the war never stopped. And from my point of view, Iran should have never stopped firing. It's not about tip-to-attack. It's not about allowing the U.S. to reorganize itself. one of the things that Iran, at least I hope they learned, was that the biggest defender of the U.S. was the mystique of the U.S. that powers the shadow of the wall. And that those bases in the Middle East, the biggest protection that they had was that it was the U.S. and nobody would dare attack the U.S.

The moment that Iran got pretty familiar was like, ooh, I like this. These are tagging the bases, right? Going after the ships, apparently they hit one of the U.S. warships. I guess the interesting thing to me is that Iran probably should have never stopped attacking initially because they were still technically at a war, meaning don't let the U.S. be determining factor of when a ceasefire is in play or not because the U.S. is just going to use a ceasefire to enact war by other needs. This is true in Lebanon. This is true in Gaza. And this is true in the context of Iran. I understand what they were doing.

they want it to take attack, where if you leave us alone, the war ends. The U.S. wants you to stop breathing. They want you to not exist as a political entity. They're not going to stop. Well, I mean, so by the way, I should mention that the Iranians yesterday said that they consider the ceasefire to be meaningless at this point, the one that was struck back in April. And obviously, that's true. I'm going to push back a little bit on your assertion that they should. I mean, that they need to ignore the U.S. moves towards a ceasefire. I mean, a big part of Iranian culture is reasonableness. You know, they have a domestic audience to play to. You know, they like to be, you know, the government likes to say, listen, we're not looking for a fight.

You start it. We'll finish it, but we're not going to start it. And they also have this uncomfortable position of being the only significant Shia majority country in the Middle East. And man, they sure could use some support from someone other than the Houthis, Hezbollah, and Hamas. And they're not getting it, obviously, quite the, quite the contrary. But they've got to play to the Arab street. And part of that, you know, it's a little harder when they're Sunnis. I mean, sorry, she is. So I think that, you know, they need to come off as sort of like, what you kind of want the average Egyptian to say, like, it's like, what? It's like,

well, you know, the Iranians, they're doing everything they can. And these fucking Americans and the Israelis are crazy and they're assholes and they're blowing up schoolgirls. And now they took out a water plant and their shitheads. And, you know, you don't want it to be like a pox on both of their houses. The average Egyptian didn't do anything when Israel was doing a genocide and the Egyptian government sat on its hands and did nothing. The average Syrian did nothing at the same time. average Saudi did nothing. You can't do mass protests.

Even, listen, even a dictator cares a little bit about what the public cares about. Just to be clear. So a few things to deal with the pushback. Reasonableness is not reasonableness when it is considered weakness and it is

preyed upon as a weakness. Meaning if you're being reasonable and I'm not and I'm looking at everything that you're doing expectably as weakness, you invite a attacks. You invite me to be more aggressive. Oh, I agree. It edges me on because I think from my point of view, the reason that they're not behaving in a particular way that I think they should behave is because they're just weak and weak and expand. When they put in true promise one or two, what did the

Israelis in the U.S. do? The Israelis looked at it and says, this is theatrical. They're doing this because they can't attack us. They can't defend themselves. Obviously, people like me were saying that's nonsense. Just because they don't want a war, doesn't necessarily. really mean that they can't fight a war. They just don't want a war. Most people don't want to fight wars, right? Most people want to be left to their devices, especially when you have this predatory nation that is roaming through the Middle East, taking down governments left and right. So I get it, right? I appreciate their pragmatism. Same thing with the Russians, but it invites attacks when people are looking at your pragmatism as weakness. It demands for you to be reasonable to be far more

aggressive, then you may be comfortable with doing. Well, that's the downside, is when you're dealing with a fucking rabid dog, the dog will keep attacking. But, you know, that's also kind of, you know, it's kind of like the civil rights movement tactic of not resisting while the sheriff's, you know,

mean dogs are biting you on the bridge, right? Yeah, but this is different. Because the civil rights movement didn't have the power to have an aggressive, muscular response. Iran does. They demonstrate. Yeah. By the way, hilariously, I should mention that on truth, social, and on X, the White House and all up of the Manga allies are going around saying that the Strait of Ormuse is open. The Iran has been completely defeated, has no military left whatsoever.

Mark Levine Levin, whatever his name is, is saying that, you know, that the U.S. Trump is, Trump is triumphant. I'm like, okay, of course, obviously. You guys know you're lying, but, but I mean, how stupid do you think we are? I mean, we're pretty stupid, but we're not that stupid. You'd be surprised. I think you'd be surprised. I mean, I think that, too. But I've seen Trump supporters be like, well, Trump is fighting for America because we can't allow Iran to get weapons.

And I think, and I'm like, you fucking idiots. Yeah. Well, Iran doesn't want nuclear weapons. So it's like, it's sort of like, I don't know. It's like you're pushing, like, you know, we will force France to start serving croissons in their restaurants. They already serve croissons in their restaurants. And by the way, I just want to make another point. The population of Iran is already radicalized at this point.

We attack them in the middle of negotiations. We attacked them in a war of aggression. And the wild part of our— We assassinated their supreme leader. We assassinated their supreme leader, not to mention Soleimani. And so it's like a population. that wasn't, that didn't live through the Iranian Revolution, that was. And did not care for the government.

And did not care for the government. It's now radicalized. Correct. I would be radicalized. I don't even live there. Me too. I'd be radicalized. Right.

Totally. Other point. All of those Gulf states have just been attacked by Iran. Meaning this idea that Iran is going to get friends in this is nonsense. The reality of it is, all of those bases, all of those bases, all of them, those governments are vassals of the United States. The majority of the populations hate Israel for the genocide that they've committed. And yet the leadership of those governments will say eff off to its own population and still want to work with Israel and still want to work with the U.S.

This is not about the populations. They've already won over the populations by standing in opposition to Israel and the United States. They've won hearts and minds. they've already done it. I'm saying that Iran, I'm trying to make the argument that this is not about reasonableness. This is not about trying to win friends.

This is about preserving the integrity of the state. And what is necessary. The Iranian government is on your, is on the same wavelength as you are now. I think they, you know, they've received the memo. I think they've read it. They understand it.

They agree with it. Yeah. We have a bunch of comments. Let's dispose of those. comments and then we'll read an ad and then be during that while during the ad people can put more comments if they're so inclined. Insight vector, thanks for the dollar. I don't think you consider riots. You can consider riots in unionist areas of north and east Belfast, nativist by definition. They are British, not Irish. Remember, unionists burned nationalists out of houses in 1969.

But it's nativist and that you're targeting foreigners. In fact, In fact, it's not even really, there's a racial component, but a big one, but it's not even exclusively anti-people of color violence. Ukrainians and other white foreigners are being targeted and expelled from their homes as well. So, I don't know. I mean, if that's not nativist, I don't know what the right word is. That is literally nativist.

I mean, that's not even like a white issue if they're doing that to, if they're telling Ukrainians to leave. It's like foreigners out, not black people out or something else. I mean, I don't know. John D. Cockfeller, thanks for the $2. This question is for you, J.T. Unrelated to current topics, you're very open about your love of the Star Trek universe. Well, open. Like, it's not like something to be closeted about.

Are there other fictional universes you are part of the fandom of? Dungeons and Dragons. and L. I don't know what Lot R is, et cetera. The Expans universe is amazing. The books are fantastic. The books are fantastic. I fell in love with the characters. In fact, the TV show and the books are very similar.

And so in the same way, like if you're looking at Dune, Dune is another one. Frank Herbert is a god. He's a living god. The man is astonishing. The way he writes his books, the prose, it is just breathtaking. It's so good.

And Three Body and Dune are radically different books. Like, one is so character-driven, and the way that the characters think is like political philosophy throughout the book. Three-body is scientific triumphalism in a way that is, makes science almost mystical. It's very phenomenal. Yeah, I'm a sucker for this stuff. I am a sucker for it.

All right. Let's see. I think there's one more paid one. Manchild, thanks for the $2. All hail our commander in quefe, bringer of death, destroyer of worlds. The bringer of rain.

The bringer of rain. Yeah. God Emperor Trump, who is failing miserably. Look, he has hastening decline. Like, I would tell you, as a rule in chess, you can't do what you don't have the material conditions to do.

Meaning it's one thing for you to have ideas. Ideas are nice. It's another thing for you to have the material capability to accomplish those ideas. And when you are doing that and you don't have the ability, you fail. You fail. There's a breakdown somewhere. It just doesn't work. The logistics, just don't pan out.

The same thing is true in real life. And I think we're finding that out the hard way with a precedent that can't seem to just. Because if he's making that argument, and if all of them are making an argument, then they should just leave. They say, we won. We're out. We're done. Someone counted the number of times that Trump has said that peace was right around the corner. Yeah, and counting. I mean, by the day, right? Yes. Did we talk, Sean Pat wants to know about the tweet claiming that the Apache helicopter was escorting tankers through the Stereidivormuz when it was downed or that Trump was on. some kind of secret oil mission to get, like, we got a bunch of oil that nobody knows about because we're all a bunch of tards. If only the U.S. government had access to media and was able through, like, let's say, an Oval Office speech to show us things and talk to us about things,

then we might know them, but I guess they don't have that ability. Trump should get a podcast. Then he'd be able to talk to people. It's just so ridiculous. I mean, their narrative, I mean, their war, I'm, I was very, I didn't have Trump derangement syndrome. I don't think I do now. But I think that like, you know, the Democrats were right when they said that basically Trump has declared war on truth itself. And it's in even the idea of truth as some sort of objective standard that we're supposed

to care about. I mean, I don't know if that's his intent or not, but that's the practical offense. perspective, this communication style of just saying whatever, whenever, and just basically it's like, go away, shut up. It's crazy. It's an escalation from Romney. Somewhere along the way, they realize truth doesn't matter in political space. Like, I've met. It's actually brilliant. It's true. I mean, if you remember, Romney would say anything. He just didn't care. And, you know, And even then, though, it was kind of like, okay, he's lying through his teeth. Paul Ryan was the same way. And I remember Joe Biden in a debate with Paul Ryan laughing all throughout the debate. And people were like, why is Joe Biden laughing? He's laughing because he knows he's lying. Right? It's almost like Joe Biden is like in on the joke. I've done politics for a very long time, son. And this guy's lying through his teeth. And this is absolutely hilarious to me because I know that he's lying to his teeth. And people were like, why is Joe Biden laughing all the way through? I'm saying, It's an evolution.

When you get Trump, Trump just didn't seem to care about the truth. It just seems to like not matter. And even when you know it's a lie, he just does it anyway. It's like you're standing in the middle of the rain. It's like, it's a beautiful day out here. Look at the sun is shining. You're like, do you just not care? I have the biggest crowds in the history of crowds.

Do you? I'm the greatest president ever. I did more for this country than anybody. I stopped all the wars. I've stopped all the wars. I've stopped eight wars. They've been fighting for 3,000 years. And it's like, it's objectively false. It falls in a way that is obviously false. I mean, even the WMD stuff, he didn't even like do all the rigamarole that Bush did. No. We're Bush like, well, I'm going to, I want you to stop and we're going to try to get a deal and we're going to do all of this and we take all of this time and the bricks get involved and the French don't want to do it and blah, blah, blah. He didn't even do that. Right? Like, it's weird. And I don't know if this is a new norm. It is.

It's never going back. If Democrats ever come back to power, they're going to keep doing the same thing. I mean, look, Lord knows they were gaslighting us throughout the Biden years about a lot of things, not just the president's state of mind. You know, or whether a genocide was going on in Gaza or whatever. So much bullshit. No, I mean, I think once a society goes down. that path once you find out that something works it's sort of like you know you get the grand platinum effect well you know republicans don't give a shit about stuff like uh you know he's he's ask

their you know their candidates are ass grabby and uh you know rapy and whatever so you know or nazi-ish we don't care so you know like so why should we care and it's a reasonable response you know it's sort of like sort of like you know like we talked about about iran like well the u.s is mean and violent and, you know, they don't honor ceasefires. Why the fuck should the Iranians? You know, it's like, I get it completely. Like, the other side, you know, look, it reminds me of, I was a campaign manager for my old homeroom teacher who ran for a state rep. And I dug up a bunch of shit about the her incumbent opponent. All true, though. And she was like, I feel very uncomfortable about bringing this up. It's like dirty care of. The organization research.

She was running for state rep. She didn't want to, she just felt bad. She was like, it's mean. And I was like, I tell you what, at the debate on community access cable, if he, if he lies, then you'll have the folder there and you promise to use it. But if he doesn't lie about you, about you, if he tells the truth about you, then don't, you know, don't use it. And she was like, okay, deal. And of course, you and I both, you know what, you know what happened. Of course he lied about her.

And of course, she used it and she won. So the point is, like, you know, it's like politics ain't beanbag, right? But, I mean, it's also the, but the, I mean, I'm worried less about the political space than about like sort of the way that the information space has been completely, like, flooded. For example, you know, we've already seen when Maga World, more effectively than the Democrats, That's when they get a talking point. Literally, it goes out, obviously, via email or telegram or whatever. It goes out to all of those functionaries.

And then you start to see that messaging crop up on X and other platforms. Like over the next few days and weeks, almost verbatim, but adjust it a little bit. For example, right now, I mean, you can't get away from like, look how awesome the reflecting pool is. Like, that's all the right wingers are saying right now. And it's kind of like, and it's just like they. what's, what's demoralizing about this is that you're like, can we talk about something else? And the answer is you can't because they've flooded the space. So you have the choice of either checking out and being like, I'm just not going to engage with these people,

in which case they own it, or, you know, you're basically like the, you know, the Greek general who has ordered his troops to whip the waves so that they would stop. And you're wasting your fucking time. I mean, you know, you can't. So, you know, you're just basically, it's, it's, I mean, it's a no-win situation and it's just so toxic. We should also be very clear that just because we move in a particular direction that it doesn't mean it's progression. Like meaning just because something a turn is taken, that doesn't mean that it's necessarily progression. And what I mean by that is, this stuff is cancerous.

Like, it requires. a clear sense of reality to deal with reality. Like, I don't want to get eaten by bear. I don't want to fall off of a cliff. I don't want to go down a pathway that leads me into a desert when I die of thirst. It matters that I can see clearly about what's ahead of me and what I'm doing. And that's doubly so if you're talking about a life or something that acts and functions like a life, such as a society. I find this to be cancerous.

The idea, like during the war, where Obama was doing the search, one of the things that came out in the Washington Posts during its, or let's say during the military assessment, was that you can never really get a clear sense of a war because Obama was gaming the numbers to such a degree that nobody really knew what was actually taking place in real terms. And that's the way the White House wanted it because it wasn't going well. Right. And the same thing is true with this. These guys are out there screaming that they've won a war. war while the street is closed and Iran effectively owns it, which is a new reality that didn't exist before Trump got involved. Well, actually, I would argue that it was always the reality, but the Iranians left it

open. That's all. True. They left it open, meaning it's kind of like, as long as you don't touch it, we don't touch it. Right. When it would you affect us, we're going to exert. This was definitely something that the Iranian planners were like, In case of emergency, break glass.

Break glass, yeah. I guess my feeling, though, or the sense is a country cannot continuously lie to itself and deal with real-world phenomena as it's lying to itself. And that stuff is not. No, I mean, like we can, yeah, no, I mean, for example, are we ever going to get to host the World Cup again? No. I don't know.

Because we're probably because we're doing a shit job. And the American people don't even know it. They don't know that three countries' teams have been illegally turned away from the U.S. border. They don't know that, you know, how bad it is. You know, they hear a few little, you know, tidbits, oh, it's expensive. But it's more than that. We have a few more questions, and I've got to read this ad, and then we've got to move on. Frank Friel, thanks so much for the five bucks.

The Epstein tyrants want to be gods of their worlds. Gods don't see themselves as equal to mere mortals. The Epstein tyrants will never start. stop. There was a time when I would have thought that was overblown rhetoric, but not anymore, not for me. It'll stop. It'll be mechanical. I just don't think we can keep this up. I don't think, like, I don't think, I don't think a society can have the riddled with this many complexities and not really addressing it. And just, it's a society that's incapable of addressing its problems, right? The Colorado River doesn't have water.

you know, the climate change is out of control. It's going to be effectively 100 degrees there in Washington and New York today. You know, it's like there's a, I mean, yeah, it's been hot before, but it's like this is going to be a blazing hot summer because of climate change. Yeah, we can't even consider a problem and even say, okay, well, this is a, it is a problem, but we're not going to do anything about it. We're not even getting to that point. It's just like we don't even discuss it.

So it's like it doesn't exist. Billy is five, thanks for the dollar. Post-truth, he says, is a term to divert blame for the bourgeoisie's postmodernism on the plebs. I like that. I like that a lot. You know, post-modernism, nothing really means anything. Words are all arbitrary, which of course words are arbitrary, but that's not what, you know, Derry Dahl had in mind. Let me read this ad, and then we'll do some more.

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So University of Michigan, eight people, mostly with Muslim-sounding last names, have all been charged in federal court in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Michigan, which is kind of like covers Detroit and that section of Michigan. University of Michigan at Ann Arbor is West, if memory serves, just west of Detroit. And they're accusing pro-Palestinian activists of basically committing a bunch of crimes that boil down to conspiracy to transmit threats, witness intimidation, and destruction of property to prevent seizure.

I've read not the complaint, but I've read the summary of the complaint. And I don't, it's, I mean, it's very chilling. I mean, you know, we can argue about whether these protests, went too far. They went to the president and the provost's house and other university officials and did some pranky things like glued their doors shut, put pictures of dead babies on their lawn, you know, basically harass them at home. And to be clear, I don't approve of, you know, trespassing or fucking with people in their homes. It's extremely disturbing no matter what their politics are. I think it's it's like not cool. And not to mention, it could lead to a tragedy if

someone decides to exercise their Second Amendment rights, you know, in a situation like that. But that said, this looks like an overcharge because this isn't like a RICO case. I mean, it's not a conspiracy in the sense that of the way RICO was originally intended to go after, you know, a vast ranging, ongoing criminal enterprise. This, This would be more like anybody who plots and schemes on a telegram chat to go and fuck with someone could theoretically under this law, under this doctrine, be charged with criminal conspiracy and sent to federal prison for years. I mean, you know, they may get their convictions, but at a very high cost to, you know, First Amendment rights. I don't, I do think you can charge these people with vandalism and trespass under local law. Totally. But, you know, it's like that's not the same thing.

Once again, we're at this make Israel great again with the president that seems to be hell-bent on destroying any notion of norms of legalities in order to defend Israel. That's effectively what this is. It's one thing if you said vandalism, even that I think would be an upcharge. Like jokes or not let's say jokes, protests, in a way to their protests. And yeah, it's aggressive, but they're not hurting anybody, at least not in the way that's been explained. A RICO charge, RICO was supposed to be used for the mafia. And just like other laws that are not used for the purpose that they're supposed to be used for and instead are refashioned in order to accomplish some objective by a particular administration, that's what this is being used for. The idea of you is Rico for this is outrageous. As you point out, if you want to say that they were being vandals, okay.

I guess my question will be, where should they direct their protests? If not directly. These guys are backing, for all in its purposes, genocide, which is the way that they had it, which, from their point of view, justifies somewhat of an aggressive response to the fact that the university won't disconnect itself from the murder. of women and children on a massive effing level. I want to spell it out just so we're clear on what we're talking about. The same country that the administration is affiliated with

has just been added to the rapists because they keep systemically raping other human beings, men and women. And I don't even want to get to the kids part. I'll make my point. I'm trying to make it stark to highlight why they're doing what they're doing. Is it against the law in some cases like Bandul? Yes. But is breaking the law in the context of protests.

As an American as apple pie, I would also say that is also yes. I guess my thing is where should they protest? If Marco Rubio, who is strangling Cuba, who is no issue murdering kids in Gaza and backing his genocide, is able to sleep soundly in his bed, is that a positive development? I mean, those are fair questions, right? I mean, like, if it was 1942 and you had, you know, members of the German Bund who were, you know, Americans who were allied with Hitler, who were supporting, you know, the Holocaust. And, you know, should they be free to sleep peacefully in their beds without people yelling outside their door or lobbying rocks through their windows? Probably not. But at the same time, I mean, the law is.

still the law. And, you know, in America, you are protected from someone trespassing onto your property or breaking your shit, no matter how much of an asshole you are. You know, are these people assholes, you know, who were victimized here? Yeah, they were assholes. But, and they should have been, and like, I guess this is like one of those things where I would say a prosecution might be appropriate by the state, but it should be more of a slap on the wrist, right? Like, we're going to send you, it's going to be six months community service. It's going to be, you know, seven days in the lockup. It's, it's not going to, it's going to be a $1,000 fine. We're going to send you a message. We don't approve of this. But, you know, we're also not sending you to prison for years. Because we know

this is like kind of within the realm of protest. So we don't, the state doesn't have to approve. prove of protest or sanction it. But the state should be measured when it. If I'm in the jury, they're going home. Oh, me too. I mean, to me, well, this is an example to me of an overcharge, right? I mean, they went too far. I mean, what they, you know, basically this is like, I mean, these protesters went a little too far and the state is going way too far. And I'm saying, if I'm going to jury for anything that they're bringing for, they're going home. Meaning, there is no charge that they can be, that if I'm sitting on that jury, that I'm going to accept. My answer is going to be innocent.

I don't care what they did. I don't care what is. Any state can make a law that is in the interest of the people who are committing crimes. They can do it in a heartbeat, meaning it's one thing for a state to say, okay, the state is doing things that is wrong. white administration fully understood that Israel was starving the population. The Trump administration even went to the human rights court in Europe to basically make the argument that they had the right to do so. We have laws to say that we are not going to work with or give military aid to countries that are starving their populations. The Biden administration ignored it in order to continue to give aid to Israel.

We pick and choose. I'm saying that's outrageous. And I'm saying if people are pushing back against government that is effectively using their laws to protect themselves against crimes. And yeah. I mean, I get it. And like there's a strong, I would certainly consider jury nullification. I found myself on that jury also. But I got to tell. I mean, I've had people, New York firefighters come to my home and break down my door over a

cartoon that I drew. It was fucking terrifying. Are you serious? Yeah, they use the axe, you know, to break down the front door. I'm not doing serious. I mean, and it only stopped because I called up my friend who really was brilliant. And it turned out to be an asshole, but I miss him. I wouldn't go be his friend again.

But I miss him because of things like this. He goes, I'll be right over. I'm like, what are you going to do? There's like 15 bruisers here with like, you know, any one of whom can kick my ass six ways till Sunday. He's like, I'll take care of it. He comes over. he was a media photographer with this giant camera and just starts taking pictures of them and their equipment and everything and they're like who and they're just like what are you doing he's like oh

you're going to be on the front page of the new york time smile and they and they all ran what was the cartoon you got to do this cartoon um it was about so it was about in the days after nine 11 people were donating millions of dollars to the fire the new york city fire department and i thought it was hilarious because it was like, the fire department is publicly funded by the taxpayer. I mean, they don't need your money, right? So I get a cartoon about like how they had so much money coming in that they were piling it up in the corner of the firehouses and it was itself causing a fire hazard. That's it. That's all. And they asked your door for that? Yeah, I guess they really wanted that money to keep coming in. So that means they were doing something with that money.

they ain't had no business doing. Oh, I'm sure. They got strongly to it. Oh, they were pissed. Yeah, they were really angry. So certainly people. And they came in a red fire truck, which, you know, I used to be a little boy. I would have, there was a time I would have found that very exciting that the big red truck was coming to my house.

But not that time. And they used the ax on your door. The build for the building, the entire building. I mean, you know, it's like I wasn't the only person who lived there. They were like, I don't know, 60, 80 people lived there. There. All I would say is that there is a gradient. Everything is a gradient.

Meaning even personality, right? From zero to let's say 100. And there's some number in between. Rational people can look at something and come to scale, at least from my point of view. Meaning it's one thing for government to be doing the genocide. It's another thing for you to write cartoon. coming to your house to kick down your door

for a cartoon is pretty outrageous. Well, they wanted to kill me, I think. I get your point, I get your point, that people can see things in particular ways and people can act out in particular ways in protest. I'm saying...

That's it. Them kicking down your door is outrageous. That's just a crime. Yeah, I don't want them to be able to... If I had been able to prosecute them, I don't want to be able for them to defend themselves and say, well, things just got a little spicy,

but we're just protesting. I mean, it's not cool, you know, to come over and protesting the country and what the country is doing. I'm saying there's a radical difference. Those firemen were at their minds. But you can't codify that in the law. True.

So it's impossible to define these things. So let's see, we got some more comments here. I can't believe you did that. Oh, yeah. John D. Cackeleller. By the way, some people say they want to see the cartoon. I'll dig that up. John

anti-Semitism laws curtailing U.S. free speech laws were promised to Israel 3,000 years ago, hilarious. Thanks very much for that dollar. Okay, we should talk about maybe the Canadians, right?

That's not a long story, but I think it's worth noting. So basically, Australia already did this. So I guess this is spreading through the British Commonwealth this idea of making it hard or impossible for kids under 16 to use, you know, social media sites like TikTok and Facebook. I mean, I think we all understand the motivation here, right?

You know, I guess, you know, is this reasonable? I mean, you know, I think it's like if everyone's banned, there won't be that social pressure. I mean, you could still be like, well, we're all banned. I guess we have to go outside and play ball or something. Read a book, watch TV. But I don't know. I mean, I don't think I have a big problem with this, but I don't like censorship.

So I'm kind of torn. I take issue with this. I mean, like the argument that state, by the way, they're doing something similar in Britain where they're like, people need to sign up the porn sites. And it's like, okay. Texas has a similar law where you have to, yeah, you have to. I mean, who's going to look at porn if you have to upload your driver's license and everything

to admit that you subscribe to teeny tiny titty tittyes.com? You know, yeah, you're not going to do that. It's a level of social control. And it's like, what is the point? So you're saying you don't want kids on social media. Okay, does this have anything to do with the fact that Israel is murdering people in mass? And that when people are going on TikTok, Twitter, the youth look at this with a certain and, you know, they frowned upon the fact that you've been murdering women and children.

Does that have anything to do with it? I don't think it's coincidence that both of these things are happening simultaneously. And the younger generation hate Israel because the fucking psychopaths, maniacs and rapists. Like, meaning, if you're looking at mainstream media and very vice taking over various functions like CBS. By the way, apparently she's report, yeah, she's now being reported that she's going to to take over news editing at CNN as well. That's not random. That's not random.

Even the social media thing, the TikTok issue in the United States, again, it wasn't random. You had a lot of people being able to see exactly what his role was doing on its face and see them dancing around as they were doing it. There were videos of them behind heavy machine guns, murdering people trying to get food. These are the psychopaths that effectively people could. see for their own eyes. People like me don't have to just tell you you can watch the videos. And people were watching the videos on TikTok, on Twitter, etc. Hence, you seemingly getting legislation out of some of these countries that seem to be ostensibly under control of, let's

say, a political Zionist ideology that wants to corral and curtail the ability for people to be able to see that content. Now, they can say, well, we're just doing this for kids, because we're we love kids so much. I don't think these people care about their populations at all, about being bluntly honest with you, whether it's in the U.S., whether it's in Europe, whether it's in Canada. I suspect the laws are coming in as a direct result of issues of control, not issues of safety. There's a difference in those things. I mean, you know, I have to admit, I never thought about it that way, but you've given me a lot to think about. Well, thank you. Yeah, I appreciate that. I'll, I will consider

it and think about it and run it in the background of my little brain and I know we're going to be talking about this in the future. And by the way, real quick, even if you take out the science, the element of it, control is the issue. In the old days, things have, what, three news channels. And for all intensive purposes, all that stuff was correlated at times in relationship with a government, whatever that government was. And now you have social media where that stuff is bifurcate. And you have people, especially when they're young.

that can look at all sorts of information. All of these things make it difficult for state to control a narrative. This is about control. This is not about freedom or safety of kids. They don't care about safety of kids. Yeah, no, I mean, I have to agree that that does seem unlikely, given that they don't care enough about kids to keep class sizes low, pay teachers properly, update schools, keep schools safe, etc.

Yeah, they don't care about kids. And, I mean, you know, the mere fact that they want to try kids as adults for crimes, they don't care about kids. Let's talk about the race riots, or I should say, the nativist riots in Northern Ireland and the UK, including Scotland. The, you know, the main takeaway is kind of like, well, you know, kind of like what we were talking about yesterday. It looks like this is a lot about, it's about resentment about people who are from Belfast and these other places. places who are having a hard time economically, you know, no jobs or shit jobs, not enough money, no hopes. And they're, you know, basically pissed off that foreigners are coming in and competing with them for work. And obviously, you know, there's obviously xenophobia and racism, you know,

mixed into this toxic brew. But, you know, this is very concerning, especially when it seems to be methodical where you have balaclava masked goons going door to door and saying like foreigners out like i mean that's terrifying um even if you're you know if you're like you know UK first England first let's not have any illegal immigration even if you feel that way this is not the right approach I mean obviously yeah the sun would never set on the British Empire well it's fucking set completely at this point, right? Yeah. And that's the thing.

That empire is like why you have so many people there, right? I mean, the Japanese didn't bring back a bunch of people when they were trying to empire bill, you know? And the ones they brought back, they have problems with the Koreans. Right. Yeah, this is like the French, right? The French, all of these empires and all of these countries like Africa and whatnot can come to France. I think we need to take this to the level of state for a moment. The British state is a basket case.

It's naturally hated by its own population. And from a standpoint of economics, Britain is nearly a third world country. Put it in context. So you have what used to be an empire that is no longer an empire that can barely deal with his own affairs. And yet it's still agitating for war and everything else. Meaning they have misplayed their hand. And the public itself is suffering as a result of the failures of the British government. Now, I say that to say that that stuff echoes out, it ripples out to the rest of the society.

What about jobs? What about employment? What about the earnings? What about the housing, et cetera? And when those things are not well, people start looking for reasons for why those things are not well. And immigrants immediately come up as part of the reasons. I guess I'm pointing and saying that, yeah, these guys are roaming around the countryside, trying to throw people out of the country, which is, as you point out, terrifying.

But I wonder if the economy was roaring, would these people be doing that? And I'd come to the conclusion of probably no, they probably wouldn't care one way to the other. It may be intellectual, whereas now it's become a material reality. So yeah, this is terrifying. But I place to blame squarely when leadership of the country itself. These guys are two, these guys are still going to war with Russia in 2030. They're not caring about the immigration stuff like that since take a place from the economic devastation that the suffering for.

So. Julius Fob, thanks for the buck. Purpose of, he says, the purpose of banning social media for under 16s is actually about destroying online anonymity for adults since proof of a majority age is needed to access social media. Right. And you'd have to show your ID. That's right.

Sean Pat, thanks for the two bucks. We're talking about the British colony on the island of Ireland, right? That is correct. If you so, will the aliens be anti-Semitic? Thanks for book. I hope not. That would be bad. Antenamid, yes.

Antesomatic, hopefully not. Hopefully not, indeed. Yeah, so we'll continue to watch that story. I mean, obviously, these riots tend to run their course. The government will send in troops and the equivalent of National Guardsmen, and they'll quash these people. I mean, that is what's going to happen,

and neighborhoods are going to be destroyed. but it's quite the look. Thanks everyone for joining us. TMI show coming up right now in about a minute here at 10 o'clock Eastern. I'm not going to be there, but Robbie and Manila will be there with a lighter take on the news. Just another reminder, DMC America podcast, is rescheduled tentatively for 11 from 11 a.m. Today to 11 a.m. tomorrow. Please tune in to D. Program.

We will be back tomorrow at 9.8. am Eastern time looking forward to that JT as always thank you so much for doing this with me and we will talk to you guys later bye