DeProgram with John Kiriakou and Ted Rall - DeProgram with Ted Rall and John Kiriakou: “Democrats Win, Then Surrender”

Episode Date: November 10, 2025

Like you, political cartoonist Ted Rall and CIA whistleblower John Kiriakou took note of the fact that Democrats won the elections—so why are they surrendering on the shutdown/healthcare tax credits showdown? Explore the exploding civil war within the Democratic Party.Democratic Traitors Join GOP: Eight Democrats, including Sens. Tim Kaine, Jeanne Shaheen, and Angus King, join Republicans in a 60-40 procedural victory late Sunday, overcoming 14 failed attempts to push a House-passed stopgap measure. This breakthrough, emerging from round-the-clock bipartisan talks, amends the bill to bundle three longer-term appropriations, extend funding through January 30, 2026, and guarantee retroactive pay for furloughed workers—which they would have received anyway—while restoring full SNAP and Veterans Affairs funding through September. Though hurdles like House votes loom, President Trump signals optimism upon returning to the White House, declaring the deal "very close" to ending the crisis as early as this week.What Next: The Senate adjourned around 11:15 p.m., reconvening at 11 a.m. this morning amid applause for the motion, with whip notices alerting House members to prepare for votes within 36 hours—their first since September 19. Defector Democrats defend the compromise in a presser, with Shaheen insisting "this was the only deal on the table" and Kaine highlighting secured SNAP relief plus a December vote on expiring ACA tax credits aiding 20 million users, despite holdouts like Sen. John Hickenlooper decrying it as yielding to "strongman" tactics without full healthcare restoration. Will a recalled House release the Epstein files?Election Defendants Receive Pardon: Trump issues "full, complete, and unconditional" federal pardons for 77 allies tied to 2020 election subversion, including Rudy Giuliani, Sidney Powell, Mark Meadows, John Eastman, Jenna Ellis, and fake electors from Georgia, Arizona, and Nevada, as proclaimed by Pardon Attorney Ed Martin. This symbolic shield—covering federal charges only, excluding state cases like Georgia's—frames the acts as rectifying a "grave national injustice" to foster "national reconciliation," while also granting clemency to a retired NYPD officer convicted of stalking for China and MLB star Darryl Strawberry for 1995 tax evasion. Nord Stream Sabotage Probe: German investigators say they have a "clear picture" linking the 2022 Baltic Sea pipeline blasts—aimed at slashing Russia's oil revenues and Germany ties—to an elite Ukrainian military unit under then-commander Valerii Zaluzhnyi, commander of the Ukrainian Armed Forces and now ambassador to London, per a Wall Street Journal report. Tracking boat rentals, phones, plates, and a speed-camera photo identified via facial recognition, authorities issue warrants for three Ukrainian soldiers and four deep-sea divers, including unit leader Serhii K., a 46-year-old SBU veteran traced from Poland (via diplomatic BMW) to Italy, where extradition hearings loom by December. This three-year probe, threatening Ukraine's European support, exposes rifts as Zaluzhnyi denies involvement, potentially straining Berlin-Kyiv relations amid ongoing trials.

Good morning. You're watching the program with Ted Rawl and John Kiriaku for Monday, November 10th, 2025. Good morning, John. Good morning, Ted. How are you? I'm good, but maybe not quite as good as Ghislane Maxwell. The news just broke about a minute ago that a whistleblower exposed that she has asked Trump to commute her sentence and that prison employees say she's receiving, quote-unquote, concierge-style treatment. you know man this is bad this is bad Rudy Giuliani was just pardoned early this morning and all these other criminals who had something to do with with denying the 2020 election this is I don't know and meanwhile here you sit waiting by the phone quite literally I listen I don't want to get ahead of myself but I had I had coffee on Friday evening with I had coffee Friday evening with a cabinet member and he told me to be patient and I said

it's only because you're saying that that I will be patient but you've been patient I've been very patient and it's November I don't know man I have to watch what I say which is another thing he told me yes and we all understand that I and I appreciate it but I have to say that I'm not I'm not sanguine that this is all based on justice no I mean you know like let's face it the the pardon right is something that goes back to monarchy yeah it does that. So it's not really, you know, it's not really a democratic, small D democratic process. No. No. So, and well, you know, we're crossing our fingers. And obviously we, like I said, I'll reiterate that. We all understand there are things you can't talk about and shouldn't talk about.

So, you know, we all want you to get, we want that to come through. Thank you. Thank you. And, you know, Ted, really, for me, the bottom line is there is literally nothing else that I can do. to make a strong case. There's nothing. I've done it. I've done it all. I've been on every show I needed to go on. I've said all the things I need to say.

There's nothing else I can do. No, I would say that's probably true. I mean, you know, it drives me a little crazy because when I hear about, like this morning, when I heard about the pardon when I woke up, I was like, oh, blanket pardon. Baby John can be under the big blanket. I actually read the article.

It was the first thing that I woke up to this morning. I read the article thinking, well, Giuliani's the headliner name. Maybe I'm buried somewhere in the bottom. Because oftentimes what Trump does, unlike what other presidents have done, he'll pardon someone and not tell anybody. And they read about it in the press. Like this finance guy. This finance guy said over the weekend, Ted,

that he never met Donald Trump. He never asked for a pardon. He never even applied for a pardon. And Trump pardoned him anyway. Yes, that's, it's so weird and quirky. Well, we got a lot to talk about, and hopefully one of these mornings we're going to have your pardon to talk about. God, I hope so. Don't forget about the show when you're taking a call because it would be easy to be distracted.

I always think the worst thing, and this is like my warning to you. Make sure you stay healthy because there was a guy, I don't know if you remember him, maybe about 20 years ago, and he lived in New York City. I think he might have been at Columbia, but he could have been at like Brooklyn Polytech. I want to say Brooklyn Polytech, but he got the call from Stockholm that he had won the Nobel Prize in possibly physics or biochemistry.

Anyway, he's a Yale professor. He gets into his car to drive up the Connecticut Turnpike to up to New Haven. And on route, he has a fucking heart attack, crashes his car, and dies. Oh, my God. That's awful. obviously he was so like incredibly excited and overwhelmed it killed him so he got

so yoga well i may if if i get a pardon i may take that day off so i can go buy guns which i promised myself is the first thing i'm going to do you're going to well at least john kariaku is stimulating the economy um you know even if even if even if consumer spending is starting to slow down a little bit all right Let's go ahead and talk about what we're going to be talking about, among other things. And as usual, we always love to get the questions and comments in the Rumble and the YouTube live chats. Much appreciated. All right.

So obviously the big news of the day is what appears to be the shaping, the formation of a deal, possibly it's really a deal related to the shutdown. We'll get into that. Also, there's this pardon that we just alluded to for 77. Trump affiliates, including Giuliani, Sidney Powell, Mark Meadows, and so on. This was all related to the 2020 efforts to overturn the results of the 2020 election. Also, super interesting story about the Nord Stream, the German investigation into the Nord Stream pipeline explosion. It's almost starting to make me doubt my doubt. But we should get into that. John, what are you interested in talking about first?

Well, to tell you the truth, if you don't mind spend in five minutes, I want to talk about something that I posted on Facebook day before yesterday from the Blaze. Literally, nobody else has picked this story up, but the Blaze is reporting that the FBI has zeroed in on the January 6th pipe bomber. That is, that person seen in security footage placing pipe bombs in front of the RNC and the DNC. And that person is a capital police officer who had been on rotation to the CIA doing physical security. Now, this is a female capital police officer, now former capital police officer who was injured in college, in college sports, and so has a limp. And they were able to to deduce from her limp that she was the bomber. Now, when the Blaze sent a reporter over to her house, just to take a look at it, they saw immediately that the house is under surveillance.

And that surveillance is likely the FBI. Now, the Blaze was very clear that this woman has not been charged with a crime. she has not had this case turned over to a grand jury for indictment they just have used this technology to determine that it is likely her and they put that likelihood at 94 percent that's very precise it's very precise and i think they did it you know using computers um but but uh this is a story to watch because if it's true it adds a whole new layer to January 6th. Well, how so? Delve into that a little bit. Because then if it's true that it was her, did she do it on behalf of the CIA?

Or did the CIA know she was doing it, even if she was acting independently? Was this some kind of a task from the Capitol Police? Was she a rogue that it infiltrated the Capitol Police and then asked for a CIA transfer? I mean, who was doing what in this situation? We don't know anything. It does in the weasel words of newspapers raise questions, doesn't it? Yeah, indeed. So, by the way, before we get full on into today's show, I really want to do a little housekeeping.

Please like, follow, and share the show. We appreciate it. We are going to be here tomorrow, even though we sometimes take federal holiday. We usually take federal holidays off, but tomorrow is Veterans Day. and no disrespect to the veterans, but we will be here tomorrow morning at 9 o'clock Eastern as usual and throughout the rest of the week. Also, we really want to send a big D-Program.

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But, you know, but basically he's funded for the month of November. We will be back on December 1st, bugging you again. But basically the goal here is you guys pay $1,000, and John and I each pay $250, and we have a producer. And Robbie will be back full time with us after his notice is over. He's on beginning week two of his two-week notice. at his current employer from which he got doxed next Monday on Monday, November 17th. So you're going to want to be here for that.

And I'm sure Roddy will pop in from time to time as he is wont to do. Anyway, thank you again for your incredible generosity. We really appreciate you guys. And your support is incredible. Okay. So that's a story to watch. All right, I think we should talk about the shutdown deal. What do you think?

Without a doubt. Okay, so. And you called it. You called it, Ted. I mean, we said it last week. The Democrats were weak and they were going to cave and they caved. And for those of us who were dependent on Obamacare, we all got screwed today. That's what I'm one of them.

Yeah. And that is a, so yeah, so basically we have eight traitors, including Tim Kaine from whom I really expected more. Yeah. Angus King, from which I expect nothing. Yeah. And, you know, and a bunch and a half dozen others. But both of New Hampshire's senators, I expected much more from them. Yeah.

Gene Shaheen and Maggie Hassan, so disappointing. Very disappointing. Maggie Hassan in particular. Yeah, I have a personal connection there that I'm not going to get into. But yeah, really, really annoying as hell. And so, yeah, so basically there's a lot of mixed reports. here about how important this vote is. I mean, I'm seeing everything, John, from this is the floodgates have opened.

This will be, this means the shutdown is coming to an end. There's nothing Democrats can do. Obviously, they can't do anything in the House. The Republicans control both houses. But there's also reporting saying, no, no, no, no, it's not done yet. You know, there has to be a few more votes. It's just a procedural vote. It doesn't mean that you get to the 60 filibuster,

Vixie vote filibuster breaking supermajority. Right. You know, so it's a little confusing. And also, so basically this deal says that we get an extension through January 30th. So the government is funded for a quarter. Democrats don't seem to have gotten anything. They seem to have gotten rolled here. I mean, basically retroactive pay for the people who've been furloughed, they would have gotten that anyway.

Yeah. One million percent. That's the law. I mean, no matter what Trump says, right? Restoring SNAP and veteran affairs benefits, okay. I mean, that's good, obviously. But all they're going to get is a vote on the principal issue at hand here, which is the Affordable Care Act subsidies and tax breaks. They're not going to get a good. guaranteed support for it, they're going to get a vote, and the Republicans will just vote no. So if they even get a vote, right? I mean, so this is about maybe getting Republicans on the record as being against the Affordable Care Act before the midterms. I mean, this seems like it does really seem like a surrender. Hakeem Jeffries is actually expressed, you know, displayed emotion of actual anger and seems to be actually annoyed something we don't normally see. But there's nothing he can do about it over in the House of Representatives.

You know, I mean, the House is, the House is controlled by the GOP. What now? That's exactly right. Well, this is an interesting thing. So this deal, this deal that may or may not be on the table today is not what the House passed. And remember, the idea was the House. House passed the Trump budget, period.

And then they went into recess and everybody went home. So the House hasn't been in session for a month. There's nobody on Capitol Hill. There was an article in today's Washington Post saying businesses are going bankrupt because there's nobody on Capitol Hill between the shutdown and the recess. Okay. So the Senate then has come up with its own agreement. That means that the House is going to have to come back and vote on the Senate version.

which is exactly the opposite of what they wanted to do. They wanted to pass the House version and then the Senate votes on the House version. Now it's reversed. Well, Hakeem Jeffrey said last night that he can speak for literally every Democratic vote in the House and every single Democrat will vote no

on the budget that comes out of the Senate. Well, the Republicans need seven Democratic Senate. to pass this thing. The House needs only three Republican congressmen to kill it. So I'm wondering now if attention should shift to the House because this is not what Mike Johnson said he was going to pass. So basically confusion reigns and confusion is the best hope of people who still want to have government-backed insurance. And I'll tell you what, if people if people don't really know how government works you know sixth grade physics ninth grade physics physics civics was a long time ago yeah um watch this this is how the sausage is made and it's

it's not pretty no it really isn't um it's bizarre um yeah okay so um i mean so i think this is a really bad look for Democrats. Let's do some analysis here. I mean, what exactly is up with the Senate caucus? I mean, Schumer is the minority leader. He's the boss of the Democrats in the Senate. He told them all to vote no. He's voting no. Personally, how come he couldn't keep his caucus in line? That's a great question. And the reason is because with a wink and a nod last night, he said, well, I'm going to vote against it, but you vote the way you want to vote. So that's not whipping votes. You know, there's a majority whip and a minority whip because in the olden days, in the

1700s, in the 1800s, they use this figurative whip to get people to vote the way leadership wanted them to vote. So it's become formalized in the position of minority and majority whip. Schumer did not whip votes last night. He told them to vote their conscience, which is very dangerous. That is a concession that you've lost. Yeah. So just go ahead and vote any way you want to vote.

99.9% of the time, and I mean this quite literally, votes are whipped. Nobody is free to vote their conscience. That's the duopoly that we have. John, I don't understand, though. Like, so just last week, I mean, I know. It's like, you know, sort of like Winston Smith, In 1984, you start to question your own memory. But if memory serves, less than a week ago, Democrats just won a stunning series of victories

in these off-year elections. And everyone was saying, like, and then we had a lot of, you know, hand-wringing on the part of Republicans, some of whom are very smart, analytical Republicans, who said, we're about to get our clocks cleaned in the midterms next November. we're in deep shit. The economy is making some, there's some warning, blinking morning lights right now.

I mean, for the Democrats, you're winning. We talked about how the Democrats have a predilection for, you know, snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. But still, even by those standards, this is kind of stunning, isn't it? Right?

I mean, you guys kept this shutdown going for over a month and you're literally not going to get shit out of it because eight douchebags decided to cross over? That is, yeah, that is exactly what's wrong with the Democratic Party. They took their wins from Tuesday and they said, aha, the most important thing was that we won on Tuesday and we flipped a couple of state legislatures and we won a bunch of school boards and we won in Republican seats in Pennsylvania that no Democrat had ever one before. We don't really care about helping people with this ACA situation. So we're just

going to take our wins and go home. And that's what they're doing. Because they don't care about people like you and me, Ted. They don't care if we can't afford our health care policies. No, they really don't. I think they're understating the point, too. When they say, so there's 42 million Americans who receive these subsidies, right? They're saying they're expecting between two and four million people not to renew. I call bullshit on that. I think it's going to be a lot more. I mean, when you go from, you know, the subsidies are going up well over 100% for the average person.

And in many cases, it's, you know, it's a bell curve. In some cases, it'll only go up a little bit. But in other cases, it's going to go up a whole fuck ton. It's going to triple or quadruple. Those triple or quadruple people are not renewing. Yes. You know, especially if they're like under 60 and they're like, you know, I'm just. I'll derp through this.

Exactly. Exactly. This is, listen, if you're, if you're a Democrat, this is bad. If you're a Republican, it's still bad. That's what this comes down to. Yeah, it's going to be a hate-off. Yes. Next, next, in the midterms.

I guess the question is, will the midterms be nationalized? I don't know. They rarely are. Rarely, rarely. 94, 74. Yeah. How's 82? 94, 74, 84, 80. 82, right. 82, 64, only because Kennedy had been killed.

Yeah, yeah. So, bizarre. Yep. Okay. So, yeah, I don't know what's, I don't know where we go from here. I mean, the whole thing is, it's very, very strange. Manya, the cat says, I think they're just putting up resistance for show while the corporate overlords commanded them to surrender. John, do you think this was about the flight delays? You know, you're hearing Democrats say, like, well, they were really freaking out over the idea that they might get blamed for the, you know, the meltdown of the air traffic control system. We have an average, we already, yesterday there were over 2,000 flight cancellations. Yeah. We all know about the very heavy day. You know about the ripple.

And, and, yeah. And, you know, the funny thing, too, is at least according to the New York Times, we've actually been. saved from more cancellations because I didn't know this. One of the lightest travel periods is the first two weeks of November because people are waiting until Thanksgiving to do their travel. Yeah, John, this is actually a really good time for future reference. This is a great time. We're ending a great time to travel.

Yeah. October 15th to November 15th. Yeah. I once flew to Beijing round trip from New York via Detroit to Beijing. to Beijing on Northwest for 400 bucks. Are you kidding me? Granted, it was coach. Yeah, but still, that's pretty incredible.

Yeah, yeah, it's a great time of the year. January is also another great time of the year. Yeah, January is a great time. Like February 8th or so. Yeah. You can go anywhere. It costs nothing. And the weather's often not as shitty as you think wherever you go.

Like, you know, it's France. How bad could it be? It'll be drizzling. It'll be 403. It's still France. The croissants are still good. But, I mean, so what happens now? I mean, to me, I'm thinking about, like, even if the Democrats don't care about us,

which I 100 million percent agree with you, you're right. They don't care. But the thing is, the weakness that it conveys, I mean, it's like why vote for them, right? I mean, it's kind of like, you're winning and you throw away your, you know, all the polls showed that the Republicans were getting their clocks clean in the, in this, in public opinion because of the shutdown. Now, Democrats roll. And I know Schumer's probably really frustrated.

It's like, well, we've got these eight assholes. But were these eight assholes offered anything? I mean, they're only good. I mean, I don't even understand. You got to help me with this. You're being promised a vote. You're being promised a vote that you're going to lose because of the numbers in the House and the Senate.

Why do you want this promise? Yeah. Why do you, like, and by the way, will you get that vote? Is this just about getting Republicans on the record voting against the subsidies so that maybe if they have the balls in October next year, Democrats running for re-election or election can say, you know, Senator John Smith voted against American health care. This little girl died as a result. John Smith hates you. Yeah, that's probably what we're talking about here. that's all it is i think so it's all politics they don't care about us that's the bottom line i mean

i can count on one hand the number of senators that i think truly care about the american people i can count on one finger i think it's bernie sanders i really do yeah he does care um someone's asking real real is asking me but what year was that ted um i don't know what you're talking about real real please clarify um so yeah i don't know it's it's really crazy um looking up transhumanist politicians by state shows you clearly who works for the w eF people like dan krenshaw pete buddha oh don't get me started on krenshaw oh my god trump tulsi gabbard etc crin krenshaw is one of those scumbags that is in a is in a league all of his own You know what? Let me tell you about Crenshaw. So I briefly dated this woman who was considerably younger than I. Very, very attractive, a leader in her field. And we were at her place watching a movie one night. And it was about midnight. And her phone was on the floor.

near me so midnight and the phone buzzes she gets a text message it's from fucking Crenshaw and he says what are you wearing and I'm like it's I said it's Dan Crenshaw he says what are you wearing and she says oh that that asshole won't leave me alone so um so I took the phone and I wrote back I said Crenshaw, this is her boyfriend. Why don't you ask your wife what she's wearing? And he texts back, sorry, scumbag. His wife just had a, they had a 10-month-old baby at the time,

but he's asking my girlfriend, what she's wearing at 12 o'clock at night. And then she told me some of his other text messages. They were filthy. They were filthy. And she saved them just in case she needed to use them against him. Jesus Christ Yeah

He's a scumbag Insane So in 2324 Thank you so much For the 1999 donation Good morning guys Hope all is well

Fuck this shut down My mom was stuck On a plane In Norfolk for four hours Then the flight was canceled We're better We are way better Than this

Yeah well That's undeniably It's ridiculous I mean if we were Molly And we had no money But we're literally pretending tying our hands behind our budgetary hands behind our backs and pretending like we have no money.

Also, thanks for the five bucks for real lump and proletariat. Great show. Can you have a URL in your description to directly send you and Robbie donations? Don't these platforms take huge percent of contributions? Yeah, I'm going to put up the PayPal link. That's the most direct. I know they take part of it, but it's not nearly as much as some of the others. There's deprogram podcast at Gmail is the PayPal donation button, and I'll try to find one that, like, minimizes, you know, the fee, because I know everybody hates paying the fee.

It's like when you donate to a charity and you know they're taking a huge lump off the top. It's just irritating as shit. Again, it's deprogram podcast at Gmail if you want to go over to PayPal. I know some people hate PayPal. And if you want to, so that's much appreciated. Also, you can do it through the YouTube, and you can do it. Oh, you can do the donation through Rumble. They don't take anything.

Yeah, they don't take anything at all. So you can definitely do that. This was a YouTube question, though. So if you're, and if you, once we have Robbie back, he will bring him back on to explain the whole desire, why we do prefer if it's practical for you to watch us on Rumble rather than YouTube, just because we get a lot higher percentage of the money. So thank you so much for that. that. Let's see.

See, this is why we need, I need Robbie back because I'm like so busy like going down the scroll. Anyway, so all right, we have other stuff to talk about here. Are we done with the shutdown? I mean, what do you think? So, okay, what do you think is going to happen here? I mean, is this basically the beginning of the end, have the Democrats lost and is this over? Are these eight traders going to fuck us? Or is there some, obviously nothing's going to happen in the House? Hakeem Jeffreys aside, but is it possible? They're going to cave. I tried to read as much as I could about what exactly this deal is.

And it's little stuff, Ted. First of all, it's not a full year budget. It only gets us to January. And it includes things like a guarantee that federal workers who have been furloughed will get their pay. and it reinstates everybody who was fired by Trump over the last couple of months. And he's decimated the Justice Department. So it's little stuff. The Democrats are agreeing to all these little things, and then they're giving up the ACA subsidy, just giving it up.

And that's the end of the ACA. And, I mean, it is going to drive the health care system off a cliff potentially, right? I mean, because not only is the ACA going to collapse, because it's been teetering on the edge of disaster for years, and now, you know, the whole theory behind this stupid thing that the Heritage Foundation came up with when it was Romney Care was that if, you know, it was all about volume, right? How do we do it? Yeah. And so, you know, you get a lot of people in this plan, and then the plans can negotiate better rates with the pharmaceutical companies and the health care companies. blah, blah, blah. But if you have fewer of those people, then that's not true anymore. And it's also underpinning the private insurance system. And it's the whole subsidies are going to go away.

Prices are going to go up across the board, including for people who aren't even insured. Yeah, that's right. That's right. I told you, I went from roughly 900 a month to 1,900 a month. And I'm not sure how I'm going to manage this. I can't do it. I don't have $1,900 a month for health insurance. No, it's insane. Yeah, I mean, right now, that's more than this show pays. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, that's ridiculous. Okay, so we'll see what happens there, obviously. All right, so let's talk about these. Do you want to talk about Nord Stream or do you want to talk about the pardons? Let's talk about the pardons. Okay. So, as you mentioned, Ted, the president has the legal right, the constitutional right to pardon anybody he wants. And there are stories about Abraham Lincoln staying up late into the night and pardoning people by candlelight, mostly deserters.

Because to desert from your army unit in the Civil War was a death sentence. you were you were to be executed for that and he said that no one should be should be executed for cowardice so he would stay awake at night just signing pardons no president has pardoned as many people in american history as donald trump has and another thing about donald trump is most presidents wait until the period between an election and an inauguration so between early november and january And January 20th, we usually see a flood of pardons. Donald Trump pardons people any time the mood strikes him. But the problem is many of these people, some might even say most of these people,

just aren't deserving of a pardon if you look at why they were convicted of a crime in the first place. And the whole idea of a pardon is that you've committed a crime, you've admitted to the crime and then you've put your life on the right track and you've you know you've writing the ship righted the ship I'd say really Rudy Giuliani

doesn't fit that category or many of these other people well how worthwhile is this anyway right don't most of these people if they face charges face state charges. In Giuliani's case, yes. So then this, and so, I mean, I heard on, this morning on the

radio, someone arguing that even a federal pardon is something that you can take to a state judge and say, and argue and say, these charges should be dropped because the U.S. government doesn't care about them. So why should the state of whatever care about them? Is that true? It doesn't strike me as true. In some cases it is, you know, but like with my state pardon that I mentioned, Governor Terry McAuliffe, I didn't even apply for a pardon. Governor Terry McCullough followed my case and pardoned me just like that. I got this big certificate in the mail with a gold seal on it and the governor's signature. It was all very ceremonial. But I hadn't committed any state crime.

Still, it was kind of a nice symbolic thing to do. And in a lot of these cases, that's what Trump is doing. There was no danger that Rudy Giuliani was going to go to a federal prison. I don't think anybody in America believed Rudy Giuliani was eventually going to go to a federal prison. A state prison, on the other hand, is a real possibility, and it continues to be a real possibility. We should add one thing, too. I had a long conversation with a friend of mine last night who's not just a Republican and a conservative, but like irrationally Republican and conservative, where you challenge him on his beliefs, and he doesn't have any idea why he believes these things. It's just, that's what the right says he's supposed to believe, and so he just

parrots it back. So anyway, we were talking about Elise DeFannock last night, and she announced her candidacy for governor against Hockel. And I said, I can't stand Hockel. But I'm not a fan. I'm not a fan of Elise DeFanick, either. I think that wherever the wind happens to be blowing, that's where Elise DeFannock is on the issues. And he said, oh, at least DeFannock's going to win. And I said, absolutely not this year or any other year. No way. And he came up with this very complicated reason that it's going to be on one single issue, he said.

The issue is that New Yorkers are not allowed to carry guns. everywhere you go, even if you have a gun permit, there are signs that say no guns, no guns, no guns, especially around New York City. Like he said, I can't even carry my gun to the gas station. Like, why would you want to carry your gun to the gas station? And by the way, and that's not true, right? Ever since the, was it, 2018, the Supreme Court decision?

The Supreme Court case. And I, let me tell you, it's like, it's not, there are more signs in Kabul that say you can't carry a gun into an establishment than there are in New York. I mean, there's no signs on the door that say, like, no guns or like a picture of a handgun with a cross through it. That's just not true. I mean, guns are so off the radar in New York City that nobody bothers to ban them from their businesses. Yeah. I'm responding to BIA real quick.

You're putting words in my mouth. Okay. So anyway, he said that, um, He said that New Yorkers are so frustrated that they're going to vote for Stefanik because they want to carry their guns. And I said, that is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard you say. And I've heard you say some really stupid things. I agree. I said, people are going to say, oh, I'm pro-choice and I support the social safety net.

But I'm going to vote for Stefanik because she wants me to be able to carry a gun to a gas station. I said, that's seriously what you're telling me. I said, listen, I'm going to say it right now, where there's plenty of time, at least Stefanik will not be governor of New York, period. No, there's no way. I mean, some other Republican might possibly be. I mean, it's not outside of the realm of possibility. Robert Pataki was governor of New York.

Sure. It can't happen. He was a good one, too, actually. But I got to say, the population of, so in New York State, right, Basically, roughly half the population lives in New York City and is fervently, like, left-wing Democrat. And then half the population lives everywhere else, right? Like what we call upstate, which basically means everything outside of New York City. And that population, so the thing is, though, the population of upstate is like 60-40 Republican.

The population of New York City and on Viron's is probably 80% Democratic. So a Democrat basically wins unless the Democrat fucks up big time. At least Tophonic is not going to be the governor of New York. She just won't. Even if somehow it turns out Kathy Hochle is the Eric Adams of Albany, that still won't happen. You know, it's just the demographics don't work anymore. I'd have to say it's almost like California. I don't think the Republican Party is viable, you know, for statewide office in New York anymore.

The demographics have just changed. I don't think she's running. I agree. The thing is, you know, the lieutenant governor in New York is the person is kind of like it's very old fashioned. It's a separate thing, right? The governor doesn't pick their lieutenant governor. So she could be lieutenant governor easily under Hockel.

That could happen. Ideologically, they're not too terribly far apart. That's true. I mean, Hockel is trying to pivot a little bit over to the left. He's scooching to the left. in the wake of the Mdani win, but she's not. She's a conservative Democrat from Buffalo. I have to be up by the Canadian border.

That's right. I have to admit, too, that I think at least DeFannock got screwed politically. She was supposed to be Ambassador of the United Nations. Trump ended up taking that nomination away from her because he thought it would be better for her to remain in her congressional seat. I think she represents Staten Island and a little sliver of Brooklyn. Oh, breaking news. The Supreme Court rejects a call to overturn its decision legalizing same-sex marriage.

There's a shock. That was not surprised there at all. So Stephanic ended up. Also, the Supreme Court will decide a bunch of stuff is coming out of the court right now. It is going to take a case deciding whether mail-in ballots have to be received. by election day. They should not. They should have to be postmarked by election day because nobody can control the post office, right? I mean, agree completely. Yes. Agree completely. So anyway, Stefanik ended up keeping her congressional seat. Then she had to figure out something to do because

she's not going to be in the administration now. And she ended up just saying, well, I'll run for governor. And I said to him, she's, she's very talented. She was going places in the Republican party. And, um, and I think her political career is done. She can't get elected to the Senate. She won't get elected governor. Another Republican's going to take her house seat. I think she's done. What is, uh, I mean, why is she running for governor? I mean, why, you know, I'm, I'm, I firmly believe in the doctrine that you should never, ever pick. a fight that you cannot win, you know, if you have a chance at winning, but there's no chance here. I mean, okay, maybe not. That's an exaggeration. I think she has like a five to one chance

of prevailing in a gubernatorial race, right? I mean, that's, you don't raise money on five to one. Yeah. Hockel's a terrible human being. I wouldn't lose a minute's sleep of Hockel were to lose that election. But I just don't think, I don't think. I don't think. that uh that she's got a chance no no way no it's so funny uh someone said it wouldn't be an episode of deep programmed without an afghanistan comparison we can't help it we can't we we have to what once you know it's it's a you know i won't go i won't go down that hole um all right so yeah so what so okay so do we want to leave the pardons there oh but By the way, I do have to ask you about Daryl Strawberry.

Man, you know, every time I open a paper and I see somebody's been part of it. See, Daryl Strawberry is another guy who didn't even apply. I mean, Trump loves the Mets. Daryl Strawberry was a giant on the Mets. He ran into some problems with taxes and drugs and a couple of other things. He gets a pardon. Yeah, so there it is. It's, yeah.

I mean, are you at the point now? like you know how do you go through a point where you're sort of like you're hopeful and then like you after a while you give up like I got to that point applying for the Pulitzer year after year after year and in all fairness I have been a finalist which is more than most of my peers can say so I probably shouldn't whinge too much but still you know I got to the point where I really you know I said that I gave up but I didn't really gave up like I sort of crossed my fingers like but I still kind of won it, and I'm still checking. Then I stopped paying attention to who won.

And then finally I stopped applying. Like, where are you out in this cycle? You're still hopeful. I'm hopeful, because if anybody's going to pardon me, it's going to be Donald Trump. But like you, excuse me, like you, I'm at the point where if I don't get it, Well, Donald Trump is president, I give up. It's going to be the end of it for me. You don't think President J.D. Vance will take care of it.

We'll take care of you. I don't. I don't think so. Yeah. All right. So, yeah, yeah, by the way, your friend is totally wrong about at least and about guns. I mean, like New York City voters don't carry guns at all at all. I mean, you know, at all. And like most people in the state don't carry guns. Yeah, that's right.

It's just not a, I mean, I'm not even saying they shouldn't have the right to do it. I'm a Second Amendment person. I just don't think that that's, that's just not going to determine the results of a, of a gubernatorial election. No. And I said to him, I said, I remember when I got my concealed carry permit, they specifically warned me that, The concealed, the multi-state concealed carry permit is not recognized in New York, New Jersey, or Maryland. So don't carry a concealed weapon in New York, New Jersey, or Maryland. Okay.

Fine. I don't understand. By the way, the concealed carry thing. I never understood. Like, so it's like, you're allowed to carry the gun visibly, but not. So, I mean, what is the thinking behind, like, whether society benefits from, from people who are carrying a handgun, carrying it openly versus not openly. I really never understood this.

Yeah, that's a good question. I don't know to tell the truth. I do watch a lot of videos on TikTok, again last night, of guys wearing sidearms and then just standing in front of a police station with a gimbal recording. And the cops always lose their minds and come outside. Hey, hey, whoa, what's going on here? He said, just practicing my First Amendment freedoms. I'm an independent journalist working on a story.

Yeah, well, you're wearing a gun, which is perfectly legal. And then they always say, you're dismissed. They say to the cops. You're dismissed. You can go now. Real Real is asking us about a Russia story. Any thoughts on the Sergei Lavrov situation? Supposedly, Putin's second dog.

is working against him. He's been sidelined from a Security Council meeting and is not going to the G20. Yeah, that surprised me a lot, actually. I told you, when I was at the United Nations, Sergei Lavrov was the Russian ambassador. And so I got to work with him at the Security Council. This guy is a very, very, very impressive diplomat better than most American diplomats for whom I worked. And but he has no political aspirations in Russia at all. He's a diplomat. He just likes to be a diplomat. And he's very loyal.

Very intensely loyal. If there's something going on behind the scenes where he's in the process of being sidelined, my guess is, my educated guess, is that he'll just retire quietly. Yeah, that's it. I would agree with that. Prasmataz is asking me, who would you trust more? You should answer this question to, John, in their palace at their mercy. Rashid Dostom or God Emperor Trump and Ryan?

Like, I've been in that situation, as you know, if you listen to the show. Dostom is a monster. Roshid Dostom. Yeah, Dostom's a monster. He is a monster, but he didn't lie to me. Well, and what he is supposed to me was that Donald Rumsfeld was an even bigger monster. Yeah. Well, that's true, too.

John is asking, you're being asked by Suvda, not Suda. Okay. It's very unlikely, but what if John Brennan has? the power to pardon you. Would you accept it from him? What's the beef between you two? I understand he's a bad guy. My beef with him is that he specifically tasked the Justice Department with prosecuting me, and then they trumped up espionage charges, which had to be dismissed and threatened me with 45 years in prison. It bankrupted me. I lost friends. I lost my family. I lost my pension. I lost my pension, I lost my freedom. I lost everything. That's my beef with John Brennan. John Brennan's

going to get what he has coming to him. That's a big beef. John McGuire has a question for you. Thanks for the 10 bucks, by the way. Is there another angle you can work outside of a pardon that would reinstate your pension? I'm going to make this a two-parter. We also have a question, like, is there anything that from, this is from John Ward? What can we do to help you get a pardon, in my opinion, you should get a presidential medal of freedom. Agreed. Oh, thank you. To answer John McGuire's question first, yeah, there is a second angle. It's called a writ of quorum novice. I happen to be at a dinner party, and I was sitting next to a circuit court judge, and we were talking about this. And I mentioned a writ of quorum

Nobis and she said, wow, she goes, a writ of quorum nobis, I haven't even heard that term since law school. But what it is is the Justice Department would have to go to the Eastern District of Virginia court and say, we made a mistake in prosecuting John Kiriaku, we recognize the mistake, we admit the mistake, and we ask that his conviction be overturned. They're exceedingly rare. There was one in like 2001. There was one in 1986, but they're very, very rare. With that said, you know, the Trump Justice Department hates the legal system as much as I do.

So maybe I stand a chance there. I don't know. We'll see. And then what can people do? Tell you the truth, an email or a letter to the U.S. pardon attorney, Ed Martin, would be very, very helpful. Thank you. Okay, so maybe we should get that address, but just Google, right? Yeah. What's better, snail mail or email? I always feel like snail mail is better. I think snail mail is better. So just Google this. Just Google the mailing address for, again, who is that again?

His name is Ed Martin. Here it is right here. You know what? I'll put it in the chats. Okay, and I'll put it up on the screen. So Ed Martin is the, yeah. is the guy and you know and try to follow like maybe go to AI or whatever and do formal terms of address you know form of address for the letter print it out sign it you know yourself and drop it off with an old-fashioned stamp in the mailbox that's the way to go thank you tarik okay so you know that would that's maybe that's something we should gin up here we should like put put that up every day and you know encourage people to write because honestly if they got a trickle of letters every day. I think it might help.

You know, a friend of mine called Martin the other day, they're friends. And he called to say, come on, man, you got to pardon John Kiriaku. And Ed Martin reportedly said, you're the third person today to call him about, to call me about him. Just tell him to relax. His file is literally on my desk, is what he said. So. Well, that's easy to say when you're not the one waiting for the pardon to relax. Yeah, that's right.

Well, hopefully from Ed's lips to God's ears. Man, I hope so. All right, let's talk about Nord Stream. Yeah. So German investigators, you know, they've launched this investigation that to me, and I think you probably agree with me, seems like a lot of bullshit. Basically, you know, this sidelines the Cy Hirsch theory of the U.S. Navy being involved in going down to to the bottom of the sea and to the North Sea

and blowing up Nord Stream back in 2022, one of the biggest acts of eco-terrorism in the history of the world. Anyway, the Germans say that they're pointing to, not really kind of like, we'd been told this story about the Ukrainian pleasure craft with some like random Ukrainians out drinking a little too much vodka going down to drop,

to blow up the pipeline. Now it look there, it's the German are drawing a bead on the guy who was literally the commander of the Ukrainian armed forces, Valerius Zalugni. He's currently the Ukrainian ambassador to London. Wall Street Journal says the Germans are after him and that this is causing all sorts of rifts between Germany and Ukraine, between Poland and Germany, and so on, not that Poland and Germany have ever had any problems.

So anyway, there's this key guy, Sir Hay. who's a S-B-U guy, that's the Ukrainians, traced by basically a speed camera photo using facial recognition software. And the Germans seem pretty confident that they've got their working theory and that their working theory is accurate and they're ready to start issuing subpoenas and all that. What do you think? What do you make of all of this? I mean, it's definitely a wrinkle that I hadn't considered.

Yeah, this is kind of a crazy development, isn't it? And it's one of the situations, I think, where now in the halls of the CIA and the Pentagon, they just wish this thing would go away, you know? The truth is not supposed to come out in an operation like this. Whoever did it, the result was a sop to the Ukrainians and the West. And the Germans can't leave well enough alone. And so I think that behind closed doors today, there are probably calls going back and forth to the Germans saying, come on, you guys, just let this go.

It's not going to help anybody getting to the bottom of the truth. Why are the Germans? I mean, first of all, I guess the question. is, do you think the Germans are right? And I guess the other question would be two things can both be true at the same time, right? Maybe the Ukrainians partnered up with the U.S. Navy. Maybe Cy Hirsch is still right, but he only had half the story. Half the story, right.

And I think that's probably the case. Not to get too far off the subject, but this is the problem. Yeah, this is the problem with Cy is that he'll run with a story when he has just one source. And so oftentimes he does have that kernel of truth for the story. He just doesn't have the details. I think this is probably one of those cases. It very well could have been a joint operation, which makes more sense. You'd need that kind of expertise if you don't have it in-house.

Right, right. And the thing is, I mean, so what about the legal ramifications, right? I mean, this is an act of economic and ecological terror right in Europe, right? I mean, so can, I mean, the EU has been doing everything it can to turn a blind eye to all this for three years. Yeah. But the Germans are like, these German prosecutors are like a dog with a bone and they're not letting it go. You know, where did it? I mean, at this point, they can't let it go.

So what next? Well, I think that I think that we're going to see people prosecuted. I think that especially this, this Ukrainian. this Ukrainian military person that the Wall Street Journal is reporting on, they're saying that he's going to be in the dock soon. He's going to be forced to testify whether he likes it or not. And I think somebody, probably this guy is going to go to prison. Really?

I do. Somebody's going to have to take the fall. Former commander of the Ukrainian armed forces. I mean, he's the Colin Powell. Yeah, he's the Colin Powell. But, I mean, he's a nobody now. it's all over for for him um we have some breaking news coming out of india there's been a car bombing uh in uh new delhi uh outside of the red fort

a big tourist attraction if you've ever been there to new there are more than two dozen uh injured so far i haven't seen any number on on deaths but it's clearly a terrorist attack the the pictures and video from the red fort this morning are grizzly care to speculate You know, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was Kashmiri separatist groups again. I'm going to get death threats from Pakistanis now, like I did two or three weeks ago, when I say that these groups carry out terrorist attacks. Yeah, they carry out terrorist attacks because they're terrorist groups. Whatever your political point is, is irrelevant.

If you're out there murdering civilians, you're a terrorist. That's period. Yeah, for political purposes. That's the definition. It's the definition of terrorism. So, yeah, I would bet this is probably Kashmiris. Well, we'll follow all these stories coming up tomorrow. As I said, we're here Monday through Friday, 9 a.m. Eastern time.

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You'll, I'm going to be here starting up in just about 30. Ha ha ha ha Thank you. Thank you.