DeProgram with John Kiriakou and Ted Rall - DeProgram with Ted Rall and John Kiriakou: “Dragnet for Kirk’s Killer”

Episode Date: September 11, 2025

The DeProgram show with political cartoonist Ted Rall and CIA whistleblower John Kiriakou gives you the dope on what’s happening across the nation and around the world—deprogramming you from political and corporate media spin.FBI Manhunt for Charlie Kirk’s Killer: The FBI shares images of a college-aged “person of interest,” seen in a stairwell wearing a baseball cap and sunglasses, linked to Charlie Kirk’s fatal shooting at Utah Valley University. A $100,000 reward is in effect, while Trump World frames Kirk as a fallen martyr for their political movement. Authorities recover a towel-wrapped Mauser rifle, its cartridges bearing “transgender and anti-fascist” inscriptions, now under forensic scrutiny. Was Luigi Mangione an inspiration?Bolsonaro Convicted: Brazil’s Supreme Court panel votes to convict Jair Bolsonaro on five counts, including plotting a coup to overturn the 2022 election. Prosecutors say his scheme involved plans to assassinate President Lula da Silva, Vice President Alckmin, and a Supreme Court justice. Evidence shows Bolsonaro’s “full knowledge” of efforts to pressure the military and create a parallel crisis office.U.S. Mass Slaughter on “Venezuela” Boat Was Baseless: Senate Armed Services Committee’s Sen. Jack Reed reports Tuesday’s Defense Department briefing lacked evidence proving a Caribbean boat’s crew were Tren de Aragua members or that the boat was from Venezuela. Briefers note it turned around after spotting a military aircraft. No intelligence confirms the targets were armed or posed an imminent threat. Ted and John discuss this shocking violation of international and U.S. law.• Iran-Contra Coda: Oliver North, a decorated former Marine and onetime national security aide in the Reagan administration, and Fawn Hall, his former secretary, were married in Virginia last month, four decades after they became central figures in the arms-for-cash scandal known as the Iran-Contra affair. Mr. North, 81, and Ms. Hall, 65, were married on Aug. 27 in a civil ceremony in Arlington County. Ms. North, Mr. North’s wife of 56 years and the mother of their four children, died in November at age 80. Ms. Hall had previously been married to Danny Sugerman, a manager of the rock band the Doors, who died of lung cancer in 2005 at age 50.

Afternoon, you're watching D-Program with Ted Rall and John Kyriaku. I'm editorial cartoonist Ted Rall. CIA whistleblower, John Kriakou, is my co-host and my co-pilot in this game we call life. The next hour of the news. Not that there's anything wrong with that. No, not at all. Nothing at all. So the FBI is still looking for Charlie Kirk's murderer.

We'll be getting into that and exactly, you know, what comes next. The former president of Brazil, Jair Bolsonaro, who's in the first name, I'm probably mispronouncing, has just been convicted on all five counts, including plotting to overturn the 2022 election. We'll get into that. I really want to talk to you, John, about this story about the Venezuelan boat air strike. It's just got me fuming. And some news that I didn't think I would ever say, ever again, Iran Contra is back in the news. I know. That's the best news of the day. It is the best news of the day.

It is. I'm liking it. So it is Thursday, September 11th, 2025. Thanks for joining us here on D-Program. Please like, follow, and share the show. Please chime in with your comments and questions. We will get to all of the ones that we can. I've got to say there's a very, the very first one, John, before we get into it, I want to answer this, or I think we should both answer it.

From another wonderful secret, the Republican Party controls all three branches of government. Can they do anything to help us? This was supposed to be their big chance. What happened? Why does everything keep getting worse? Good question. Yeah, you know, the Republicans will tell you, well, we would need 60 votes in the Senate to break clotures, so we're kind of jammed up there, and our majority is so small in the House,

and the Republicans just lost two interim elections last week for the House, so it's tighter than ever, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. The truth is that there's no coordinated policy. And even though Donald Trump is a strong political leader within his own party, he's not quite strong enough to force the Freedom Caucus people to do what he wants. Yeah, I also think that there's a lot more of the old Republican Party baked into coming back to the new Republican Party than anyone including the president would like to admit. And so, you know, it's the country club Republicans still running the show.

They still want to cut taxes to the wealthy. They still want to get rid of social programs. They still want to suck up to big business and defense contractors. They still want to pour money into the military industrial complex. they're not really a different party than they were in 1986. No, you're right. You're right. And that's coming out.

It's like the neocons ran for cover in 2016, and they just started coming out of their hiding places. And they haven't been squashed back down. Sadly. They're becoming more and more bold. But I think you're right, Ted. I think what's happening here, and it's relatively slow motion. It's taken a little bit of time, but I think what's going to happen is the old Republican Party is going to come back once Donald Trump is gone, and they're going to be the ones in charge again. MAGA is a temporary situation.

Yeah, MAGA is a style. That's a good way to put it, yeah. It's not an ideological orientation. I mean, and I can just ask this, you know, for example, if I ask any real MAGA adherent, well, it's about making America great again. Okay, what does that mean specifically? I mean, and I'm not trying to be snodgy. Those are deliberately, it's a brilliant phrase because it's deliberately they. It can mean anything you say.

I mean, you know, if it's like things that, basically it's things that Donald Trump wants to do. Yes. And that's going to get old after a while. I agree. We got a question here, personal question about the show from Jay Herna. Any chance Michelle returns once you start pulling in the big bucks? I doubt it. You know, Michelle and I text each other,

but it's always just interesting articles that we find, or she texted me a joke the other day. She thought I would find funny. But I don't think she really wants to come back. She hasn't said anything to me. Has she said anything to you? No, she hasn't. I haven't really, I mean, no, we're Facebook friends.

I see, it's been doing a lot of traveling. Yeah, she's been doing a lot of traveling. So I think she's, you know, I mean, if that comes up, we'll talk about it, you know. but there's, it's not like there's any dark secrets. And we're certainly, we haven't been keeping her under wraps. She's not in Area 51 or anything like that. No, that's right.

Do we think that the, we have a, thank you for the donation from F. Sousseau. Do we think that the Charlie Kirk assassination could be a deep state false flag operation that we unite the right and get them off their demands for the Epstein files? I doubt it. No. I think this is like, I think this is a, a person, obviously, I'm going to say disturbed because you have to be. You have to be. Right.

Seriously. So, you know, I mean, even if you're not like swallowing your own tongue or whatever, you're still to do this, to go and do that. Oh, Ted. Ted, I'm giving a talk tonight at this 9-11 truth event that I didn't realize was 9-11 truth when I agreed to do it. But anyway, I was, there was a lunch that went along with it today, and I was sitting next to this guy. And he wanted to talk about Charlie Kirk. So we're talking about Charlie Kirk. It is terrible.

It's awful. I can't believe it happened. There's no excuse. They're blaming the victim, blah, blah, blah. And he says, yeah, but he thinks he has this figured out. He says, the shot was perfectly at the juggler from a distance of 200 meters. Who's good at those kind of pinpointed attacks? The Israelis.

This is a Mossad operation. And I just said, stop. Just stop, please. I'm not going to have this conversation. Just stop. You know, unfortunately, look, I love spaghetti westerns, but movies like hang them high and like the good, bad and the ugly where the guy shoots the rope from like,

I don't know, 400 yards away. I mean, you're supposed to under, I think that when those movies were made, most viewers were familiar enough with guns to know that it was kind of a joke and kind of impossible. And now I think people think, that stuff's real. They think that Bob Odenkirk can have the shit beaten out of him and he's not he's not dead or anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're exactly right. Yes. I mean, the thing is,

the guy got the shot off, obviously, right? I assume she fired at the head. I mean, but basically if the shot, you shoot at someone's head and you hit any part of their body, you're going to kill. That's a good job. You did, you know, you did what you came for. You don't get, you can't aim for a specific part of the body like that aim for the for the I mean that's just a I can't say lucky I mean you know but it's a it's a it's a very precise I don't even know it's not precise it's just that that's where it struck yes that's all John Doe and XCI officer attending a conference called 9-11 truth I know man this is killing me I hope there's an honorarium which is the only reason I was doing it it's $500 I didn't have yesterday and then my manager's like what

10,000 okay he said i'm going to strangle you for taking 500 i kind of think you're man i'm on your i'm on team manager here um yeah i don't think it's enough money everyone's got a price and i'm i'm one of those people but you know that price is not high you know i'll tell you a secret you're going to be upset but but in three hours from now you're going to be not happy i you're exactly right besides the fact that it's at nine 45 p.m and i'm usually winded down by that oh fuck i'm asleep by that i know right but I just, I saw something on eBay that I wanted and I thought, oh, here's an easy 500.

I'll just do that. I kick myself. Oh, well. Let's see. Adam Fider says, I think you guys need to address this. People are conflating speaking negatively about Charlie Kirk's opinions and celebrating his death. That's a good point.

I agree with that. Look, I'm probably, no one is probably more faithful. famous in this country for speaking ill of the dead than me. I mean, you've been in trouble for it. I did. I said, I said bad things about people like President Reagan the day that he died. I said, I said he's turning crispy brown by now. Sean Hannity couldn't stop talking about it. He said, you have no soul. I was like coming from Sean Hannity. He just, he wouldn't know his soul if it bit him in his ass. But, you know, Pat Tillman, lots of people. And the point is, And I was kind of famous for my anti, for my anti, um, obituaries that kind of call into question

people who were well, highly regarded and, you know, revisited them like Jimmy Carter and people like that. Okay. So there is no better time to assess someone's life than at the time of their death. And for a public figure like Charlie Kirk, Ted Rall or John Kiriaku, the time of our death is the time when what we've said and done will be assessed and should be assessed. It's appropriate. And it's very different to say, you know, like, look, I'm not glad that he's dead.

And I'm not even glad that he's not, that his voice has been silenced. You know, and I don't agree or like a lot of the things that he said. And I think you should be able to just say, like, you can even say, like, this guy was an asshole. Yeah. And but no one should have killed that asshole. You can say that. I think that's totally fine. Yeah.

Yeah. I agree with that. You know, I've gotten in trouble, too, for obituable. that I've written for covert action magazine. Anytime somebody associated with the CIA's torture program dies, I write a really mean-spirited alternative obituary saying that the world is better off without them in it. And I wrote one three or four years ago

where the guy's daughter called me. Oh, shit. And she was like, shame on you, you monster. And I said, you want to see a monster? Take a look at your father and imagine the people that he murdered. Sorry, but, you know, now's not the time to try to pretty things up. He had that opportunity in 2002, and he elected to be with the bad guys. By the way, Candace Strike, I have no opinion about whether Charlie Kirk was a nice guy or not,

because I literally, the only thing I only knew about him in the abstract. I lost track of him after he founded Turning Point. And, you know, I didn't even know he'd become this big influencer, and he was huge and all that. Oh. Oh. I have no, I had to look him up and be like, and I was like, oh, yeah. Really? He's that guy. You know, I mean, I don't really follow all the people on there, in the right wing, you know, for whatever reason. He's in my TikTok feed like every fourth or fifth short for the last two years. And because I'm, you know, on my knees begging for a pardon from these, these mega people, I've been sort of in the, on the edge of the same circle. and everybody says the same thing that he was a real sweetheart as a as a person he was just a really great guy you know i've not met him never know okay so like bill o'reilly he was a really nice man to me so nice really i thought him to be such a dick

no like and well what happened was he had been a dick and then i was getting all these death threats and i i was on a show all the time i had a i had a frequent flyer pass at box news security And they, and one time before the show, he's like, Ted, I hear a lot of things on my end, really bad things, and I'm worried about you. I think I'm worried that someone's going to do something to you. If you ever want to get out of the city and you just need a place to, I have a house upstate, it's yours for as long as you want, just take it and go. I was like, Bill, thank you so much. Wow. It was really.

I'm astounded by that. I figured you would be. Yeah. he was such an ass to me i i can't even imagine the words coming out of his mouth i know i i mean this was after i'd been on like 20 times and he'd always been a dick to me um but i think there's there was a certain point that he just i think that the the killing the the death threats it just went too far for him you know i was on that bbc show cross talk i think it's called it's like the 60 minutes of of the uk yeah um

I think it's called crosstalk. Well, there was the RT show, cross-off. Not the RT show. Which was a great show, by the way. It was, yeah. But the BBC show, I forget what it's called now. But anyway, I was warned in advance. They're going to just take you apart.

It's what they do. And they did. Man, I went on and I felt just like crying at the end of it. Although I held my own. And then when we finished it, before we went off, the guy says, Hey, I heard you got an award in London, and in the event that you can't come, because I know you have some travel restrictions, I'm happy to accept the award on your behalf. And I was like, oh, okay, you just called me some of the most horrible things that anybody's ever called me in my life. But, okay.

And then I actually was denied entry into the U.K. So I called him. James, by the way, says that this show is called Hard Talk. Hard talk. And I remember this show. I've seen this show. Thank you. It's great, by the way.

the way. And it is great. But you got to go in there ready to... Because they're fucking Brits, man. When the Brits mix it up, they're not, they don't come with any hands tied behind their backs. That's right. They're funny and smart as shit. He went to the, uh, he went

to the event. Actually, it's the one behind me right there. That that glass thing with the blue glass inside the clear glass. Oh yeah. He went and accepted the award for me and then he mailed it. It costs like a hundred and $50 to mail it at his own expense.

I am with Adam Fighter. We are describing borderline personality behavior. I mean, that's exactly what it is. That's so true. By the way, okay, so donation from F. Huso seemed like a professional hit, one shot, and gone. I disagree with that. I think it was a lucky hit, and there was no point doing a second shot. What do you think?

You know, I think that you're right, Ted. And I think that we're making too much of the fact that it hits. his juggler. I think he was probably aiming for the head or the neck or the chest or whatever. He was off just a little bit. Yeah, it was long enough range that he targeted a little high. I think so.

Might have been a little wind. Who knows? Okay, so Jones Jamison, not to be confused with James Johnson, thanks for the donation. What do we think of the House Rules Committee blocking a vote to end selective service? Yeah. Well, the potential for another draft ever go away. And by the way, let me add a question to that for you, John. How the fuck can

America's women live with themselves and call themselves feminists and not insist that they be drafted alongside men? That's an op-ed right there. And you are 100% right. Either we're all feminists to support equality or we're not. And I can't believe this thing. Yeah. My son could be drafted into one of America's myriad of idiotic wars, but his girlfriend can't be? Really? Ridiculous. No. No, I agree. You know, I said something on Facebook about a year ago that, you know, I consider myself a feminist, but the way I was raised, you hold the door open for a woman. I hold the door open for men, too, though. I do, too. I hold the door open for men too. But I feel uncomfortable about a woman paying for a date to the point where I don't know.

I just won't allow it to happen. Well, especially, like, especially a first date, yeah. Especially, but for me,

it's any date. It's, I just can't do it. And then a friend of mine from college, a woman answered, like, how dare you?

I am your equal in every way. And if we ever went on a date, I would demand to pay at least half. And I said, well, what's her number? No,

just kidding. She's happily married with a 20, 25-year-old son. And I said, maybe that's why we never met, we never went out because I, I just wouldn't, you know, but other than that, I think you're exactly right, Ted, either we're going to have the draft for everybody or we have the draft for nobody.

And I don't see how it's constitutional under the 14th Amendment Equal Protection Clause. I just don't. I agree. We got, okay, we got a lot of comments here. And I guess we're, uh-oh. Questions. Okay, from So, so what's your, uh-oh? We have a lot of questions.

Oh, yeah, okay. So, in 2024, John and Ted, what do you think about the, Qatari Prime Minister saying that Bibi is deliberately trying to plunge the Middle East into chaos well I think he's 100% right 100% and do you think more Arab nations will speak out against him

and his government yeah yeah I do it's coming it's coming once one of the big ones does once the Egyptians or the Saudis say something it's going to open the floodgates and I think there's actually pressure on a lot of the big Arab governments from the likes

of France and Ireland and Canada and maybe Australia. So I think that's coming. Egypt would be a big deal. That would be a big one. Yeah. And then Jacob Decker, thanks for the donation. Killing someone speaking a different point of view as an attack on the first man.

Here, here. 100%. Couldn't agree more. Amen. Now, okay, now, okay, here I'm going to be a cynical bastard here. If this had happened to me, I sincerely doubt that Charlie Kirk would have gone on to his podcast and deplore it. what happened to me. I sincerely doubt it. And I sincerely doubt that the president would

have the flags at half-mast for me until Sunday. And I seriously doubt that my dead ass would be getting a presidential medal of freedom. Yeah. I mean, I don't like how this is being politicized. You know, it was meant, it was a political act. And treating it as a political act just validates what the killer did. Yeah, I agree. I agree. I'll tell you another thing, too, Ted, about this poor Charlie Kirk thing. Almost all of my friends, like real friends, not just Facebook friends, people I've never really met, whether they're from the left or the right or someplace in between, everybody is absolutely appalled by this and everybody is afraid of the direction that the country

is taking. You and I were talking about it yesterday after the show. I talked about it with my brother and sister last night. My son was so upset. He called me at 10.30 to say he's just so upset. said about this Charlie Kirk thing and and he's you know at least as left as I am but this I hope this serves as a wake up call for the country and I keep coming back to this it's not because we don't have I was afraid you're going to say that leadership no we don't like literally the person who's

supposed to tell us stop acting like fucking children and grow up and and and and understand the difference between words and violence yeah and and understand that free speech you don't There's no obligation for anyone to speak in such a way that you won't take offense and, like, and, you know, and stop, you know, and like if an American dies from murder, that that's an American who died. It's not a right winger or a left winger. That's right. It's an American. We need someone like that. A young father, which bothers me very, very much. Me too. Two kids. It's right in front of them, by the way. And not to mention traumatizing hundreds of college students out in trying to enjoy a nice day. disgusting and so the point is but Donald Trump is politicizing this and you know I mean I'm not going to go

so far as to say like he's responsible for this because I don't think it works that way no but I do think that he he's not providing the leadership that we need to to be able to have this be a like a snap out of our bullshit moment Ted let me interrupt you for a minute for two things number one Robbie's telling us we have an ad okay but I want to put it up when you're ready, Rob. Chris MZTZ, TC, too. Thank you for the donation. He's got a great question here, Ted. Regarding the New York Times article about the SEAL Team 6 mission in North Korea, how does the story like that leak out? Wouldn't it be a national security risk to expose that? And if in charge, would I approve? Oh, that what a great three questions. So number one, somebody who opposed

it and was overruled leaked that story. 100%. And I can tell you. you that from my own experience at the CIA, 99 times out of 100, the leak came from the Pentagon. They leak like sieves over there, and they're so gigantic and they don't polygraph anybody that it's just impossible to know where the leaks came from. Number one, how does a story like that leak out? Okay, wouldn't it be a national security risk to expose it? You bet it is. Of course, because methods, it exposes methodology. So it's a method. Kim Jong-un knows something now that he didn't know before.

That's right. And you know he's going to be more careful. Yep. Okay, let me read this ad. Looking for a comfortable but unique option for your gaming setup? Check out technosport.usa.com. With a wide array of ergonomic chairs in an array of colors, you will definitely bring your setup to the next level.

Always comfy, never boring. Technist Sport. use code rumble for 10% off your entire order. That sounds good. I want one myself. I like that. I'm a horror for a comfortable chair. You know, I got to say, too, when we got our first ad on YouTube, it was REI.

And I really like REI. I was so proud that it was them and not like, you know, erectile dysfunction. Because you knew that was coming. Or not coming. But I'm bummed. Oh, my God. So, yeah, I mean, okay, so then, and by the way, if in charge, would you have approved of this operation? Absolutely not, because if you compare the upside to the risk of blowback, the risk of blowback, in my view, is too great.

I wouldn't have approved it. Let me ask you a bigger question. Are SEALS Team 6 a bunch of tards? I mean, they mess up a lot, right? A lot. And not only do they mess up a lot, a lot of them get killed in the course of the operation. Yeah, yeah, no. I mean, are they two, I mean, I know you do need people who are badass and brave and willing to do whatever.

Yeah, yeah. But you also want, you want your people to come home. You do. You want your people to come home. Yep, that is right. Robbie's telling us we have breaking news. What kind of breaking news is that, Robbie? Let's hear it.

I bet the suspect's been caught. Robbie? Oh, let me. put Robbie on. Oh, okay. Hey, Robbie, what's going on? So just popped up that Cash Patel, he's in a little bit of hot water for calling

Uncle twice about saying that they had the guy, turned out that they didn't. And so now he is personally in Utah overseeing the investigation. So the clown has left the circus and is now running the peanut gallery. So we're in good hands. Oh, my God. Hi, Robbie.

Well, that's not exactly startling, but it is funny. Oh, it's hilarious. You know, and J.D. Vance and his wife are there, too. And, you know, I was supposed to, I was supposed to fly down to Fort Lauderdale on Monday to do James O'Keefe's show. And I just got a text from him canceling it because Charlie Kirk's going to be buried on Monday and he's going to go to the funeral. Yeah, apparently, Vice President Vance and the second lady are going to escort Charlie's remains. on Air Force 2 to Arizona, I guess from Utah. I guess that's where Charlie Kirk is from, or he's going to be laid to rest. You know, Robbie, you called, by the way, that what kind

of long gun you thought would probably be here. You said specifically it was a 30-odd-6, and it was a 30-odd-6. Why did you think that? And that's what was recovered in the woods near the university. Well, a couple of reasons. One, it's, if you're going to make that kind of a shot, you're going to use a bolt action rifle. 30 out six is a proven rounds, so over 100 years old.

And you can either run them hot or you can run them cold depending on what is you're looking for. And they have a very, they have a very specific report. And so if you shoot a lot, like I do, you get to low what it sounds like. And the people say in the, like that turkey you're talking to earlier, John, about, you've got to be a professional sniper

to do something like this. No, you don't. No, if you're, I have an old Argentine Mouser that was made in Germany back in the 1890s. It's a single shot, yeah? Yeah, it's a bolt action. So what you do is it has a five-round magazine

and just, what's neat about them is that the barrels are milled or not stamps, have really deep grooves. And whenever you're, you can make a two to 400-yard shot with iron sights behind. behind the ear of a deer with no problem at all. Wow. And what it is, it's a heavy bullet.

So what you're talking about is right? What you do is that you aim higher? What is that you're going for because you've got this? Because you've got a drift. Yeah. Well, that's what happened. I think most likely he was aiming for his face. The bullet drifted and it got him in the neck. And the way it's a kill shot. The job is done.

If you're hunting deer, that's what you won't. Hunting a person. I don't know. It depends on how much of a mesh you want to make. All right, Robbie. Thanks for that. I'm sure we'll uh and that was that really was I was kind of amazed that you were able to yeah he called it yeah hey I grew up in the South shooting I mean this is yeah good and by the way I strongly recommend anybody who hasn't heard it yet to go into rumble studio uh rumble premium and watch the uh Robbie interview and by the way John

we're doing that we're doing we're on five tomorrow yeah cool looking forward to that it's going to be all about prison oh question for Robbie I'm going to put that Robbie back up here five dollar donation from U.S. C, triple X, A-Rod, 21. As a person of the right, are you comfortable with people like Bongino and Patel running agencies like this? Good question.

Seems like these guys are always swimming. If I had it my way, the FBI would have been abolished the very first day of Trump's presidency because he, Trump promised to drain the swamp. Well, the way that you drain the swamp is by gutting it. You don't go in but say, I'm going to give you a brand speaking new headquarters.

now that Trump is Trump is just a total blowheart If I had it my way it would be gone The CIA would be destroyed The FBI would no longer exist Another question for you Robbie Sorry to interrupt but it's what I do Tusk PC wants to know

I thought you were blind in one eye How good of a shot are you? Used to be really good Now not so much I'm having to teach myself I shoot left handed Using a 22 So it's the pain

Oh shit It's like learning how to drive using the stick on the left, which... Oh, it sucks. Yeah. But not, I mean, growing up, I mean, I used to hunt squirrels and rabbits all the time using a single shot 22. If you're doing that, you know, she's a deer with a 30-out six. It's not a problem.

No, I mean, the thing is also, God, I remember living in Long Island, you could just drive your car up to a deer, and it'd be 10 feet away from you, and you could just pop it point-blank range. I mean, it's not exactly brave. I beep at them behind my house to get out of the way. I got to go. Yeah, they're kind of like not really that. I saw a big buck the other day. I'm like beeping at the buck flashing my brights out.

I'm like, get off the road for God's sake. Here we have elk walking down the road. I mean, those are big boys. Oh, yeah. All right, Robbie, thanks for that. We'll let you know if we have more questions. I really do love this question from J.R. 99 over on the YouTube. feed, why don't we have, why doesn't security for outdoor events use drones for surveillance?

Oh, yeah. I mean, that's a fucking good question. It is. It's cheap. It's easy. There's no reason not to. No. I mean, the thing is, I wonder how much security there really was here.

Like, I mean, obviously there was a threat. But, I mean, they didn't treat him like he was the presidents of the United States. And I don't really blame them. I mean, you know, he's just, if they, he's an influencer. He's a, still. Ted. Still, Ted, the building where they're telling us the shooter was on the roof, that building closed down for renovation in April and was supposed to be locked up tight. And did it not occur to anybody in the campus police department to just, you know, sweep the building, walk up to the roof, just make sure nobody's up there? I mean, by the way, I mean, where did we hear about something very similar in the very recent past, a gunman kicking around? on the roof, right? I mean, it's like, this is what happened to Trump in Butler, Pennsylvania. You would think by now it would be kind of a standard operating procedure. I got to ask you also,

what do you make of the fact that the cartridges bearing quote-unquote transgender and anti-fascist inscriptions were written, I mean. Has that been confirmed? It's been confirmed, according to the authorities. So I'm wondering if Luigi Mangione was an inspiration. I've never heard of anyone doing that before. Never. Now, that would take work. You know, you can't just go to the gun shop and say,

give me some of those trans bullets, right? It's not how it works. There's work involved. I thought I was a 45, but now I identify as a 38. Oh, my God. I'm a 38 and trapped in the body of a, of a nine millimeter like no that's hilarious i i don't know i don't know what to make of it it's one of i've got to think it's a so this is i i really think we're going to find out this was a luigi thing

and that the person was inspired by luigi i think we're going to find that out similar age this is bad someone in their 20s yeah you know if they catch them telling us if if they get they'll catch although apparently he left which you you we have a photo of someone like that fuzzy but a photo And they're not caught? Oh, no, no. They've further enhanced it about an hour ago. This looks to be as clear as, you know, some kids' high school graduation picture. And besides that, he left a handprint, palm print, and a print from his arm, and his face was sweaty, where he had the gun up against his face.

So he left DNA all over the doggone thing. He threw it in the, he threw the gun in the woods. hasn't rained or anything. The cops found the gun. This kid is an idiot and he's going to get caught. He's going to get caught. Louisi was an idiot. He left a bag of evidence in Central Park. Yeah. Nobody, nobody ever goes there. Right. And then took off his mask so he could flirt with the girl at the at the youth hostel. Absurd. Idiot. Yeah, total idiot. All right. So let's see what else here. So, anyone, yeah, Hamish McKinness is saying anyone who knew the person of interest would recognize them from that photo. Absolutely. I don't think there's any world in which they get away with it. No way. Yeah.

No way. I agree with you. It's only a matter of time. I just hope that when the person's caught, that he's caught alive, first of all, we don't need more death. And secondly, I want to know what the motivation is. The Butler, Pennsylvania thing, we're never going to really know what happened because. he's dead. Exactly. Yeah, exactly. And then they

gave the body back to the families so they could cremate him before anybody ever had a chance to even examine him. Big boss, Bob Ross, is correct. He said Luigi took her off the mask at the hostel because it was required for check-in. Okay, but Bob, yeah, but Bob, he could have said fuck you. I mean, it's Manhattan. Okay, there are hundreds

of hotels. Okay. I mean, he could have gone somewhere else, right? Let's see. We have a $5 donation from Amir linked up. Thank you very much. What's going on with all this UFO stuff? It seems like it's being used as a distraction. Every time there's bad economic data coming out, Elizando seems like a grifter would like to hear a thought. The economic data is really fucking bad. It's bad. And it's a topic that we're not talking about. I mean, you know, John, you and I are old enough to know that, like, job creation of 22,000 is catastrophic. I mean, usually that means you're in the middle of a hardcore recession.

And it would have been, it could have been worse, if not for all the deportations, right? I mean, so, I mean, it does look like, you know, our friend, Mr. Lurea is correct, and that we are headed towards stagflation, which is not good. Inflation with a stagnant economy is really not the worst, but it's a very bad scenario. I mean... It cost Jimmy Carter's presidency, and it took us, what, 10 years to dig out of, eight years to dig out of. It sure did. Yeah, this is...

I would argue that we didn't get a real recovery until the 90s. I think you are right. Because really, the Reagan recovery was a... a false one. Yeah, and it was a false one because you can't cut taxes and increase spending at the same time. And then just hope like magic that the economy grows because all the rich people are spending the tax money that they didn't have to pay. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, at least they're collecting money from tariffs. But as Benjamin Drew Ho says, I like how they celebrate the amount of money coming in from tariffs. Like it isn't a tax on all U.S.

I know, right? Yeah, that's us paying that. It would almost be more honest if they just slammed it Robbie says we've been in a depression here in Montana for years. Fair enough. That's kind of stagnation what they have there actually. High prices. No jobs. Just as we were coming on the air, I got my five days a week, I guess it's six days a week, hyper local news update. And it said that housing prices in Arlington, Virginia, as well as D.C. and Alexandria, Virginia are down 4.1% year over year. This is the first drop in housing prices in close-in suburban Washington since 1991. Can you imagine? This is the urban problem that again, nobody's talking about. I mean, COVID accelerated it, right? But with work at home, you don't need to live in a city, right?

I mean, I mean, I loved living. I went to college as a freshman here in New York in 1980. I mean, think about, like, my first week in school. The first week in school, I was photographed in Time magazine throwing a bottle at Mayor Kutch. I went to see Blondie at the peppermintlet lounge for three bucks with sawdust on the floor. I went to Studio 54, all in the same week, right? I mean, I raged, I lost my virginity. It was awesome. Like, now, if I'm 18 years old, what the fuck is it to do?

What do I get into? Sephora? There's no nightclubs. There's nothing to do. Your job will be from your computer, which you can do anywhere. You know, it's boring and hard and expensive. That's not a, and you don't need to be in a city to date anymore. You know, you have the apps for that.

That's right. So I don't know. I feel like cities are in trouble and, you know, they're going to have to become cheaper in order to adjust. Thanks for the donation, Angela. Much appreciated. Thank you, Angela. yeah i think you're i think you're exactly right my first my first week um at college freshman year abby hoffman came to campus and gave a speech how awesome is that isn't that great yeah

i still remember still think about it every once in while he committed suicide not too long after that but but he was great really great he had gone to one of the uh fraternities earlier in the day and he bought somebody's old TV. And then he plugged it in. Reagan was giving a nationally televised talk for whatever reason. This would have been in August of 1982. And so while Reagan was talking, the TV was just sitting on a folding chair up on the stage.

While Reagan was talking, Abby Hoffman walked off stage, walked back on with a sledgehammer, and smashed the TV to a million pieces. And people were screaming, cheering. It's great. That's so punk rock. I love that.

Speaking of punk rock, I saw the clash that year, too. And the Ramones and the Dead Kennedys. Oh, my God. It was awesome. You know, none of that stuff's true anymore. And it's not like, oh, I know it's all different bands. But the music scene, there is no music scene the way there used to be. No.

Anyway, let's talk a little bit about, we can just check in. Do we care about J.E. Bolsonaro? Yeah, we do. He's convicted. But I think the reason we should care, I'm sorry to interrupt you, Ted. I think the reason we should care is that Donald Trump has threatened already to put sanctions on all of the Brazilian Supreme Court justices, were they to find him guilty? So now they found him guilty.

And not only is Trump now discussing sanctions on the judges, he's talking about sanctions against Lula, which is a really dumb, idea, because God knows Donald Trump has a lot more investment in Brazil than Lula has probably $0 investment in the United States. And what is there to stop Lula from sanctioning Donald Trump and freezing his Brazilian assets? Which he has. There you go. Good. Well, we'll see what happens there. All right, let's get to something that really has me furious. So you remember, of course, obviously, the Venezuelan boat that the administration bragged about on social media. They said it was Trenda-Aragua, quote-unquote, terrorists because they have designated Trende Aragua, a terrorist organization. It was a boat headed from Venezuela, apparently, to Trinidad.

They blew it up with a drone. We now know that it was with a drone. We thought it was for drone. It looked like drone footage. 11 people dead, according to the Defense Department. So anyway, it turns out that finally they've gotten around to briefing the gang of four people, right? So Senate Armed Services Committee Chairman Jack Reed came out of the briefing pissed off. So he said there was no evidence presented in the briefing whatsoever that said that the targets were armed, posed any threat, were members of Trend de Aragua, were carrying.

drugs were headed to the United States, were even from Venezuela. No evidence of anything. These were 11 random people that they killed for no reason whatsoever. And that's it. And so, you know, I'm sure Jack Reed's not lying. If he was lying, the administration would have been quick to point it out. This is really, I mean, I hate to say it. You and I, we knew this was probably going to be true or might be true, but it's like, I hate to be disappointed like this. I mean, I hate to be proven right into something like this. I wanted them to, I mean, it wouldn't have been legal, even if these guys were Trend de Aragua, even if they were drug dealers, it wouldn't have been legal. They should have been indicted them. But it's not even our business. They

weren't even coming to the United States. I mean, the truth of the dad and authorities didn't ask for help. So, I mean, this is, but this is, but this is. No one's going to give a shit because they're brown people, right? Yeah, I think that's exactly right, Ted. Nobody's going to give a shit. And most Americans just take the White House's word for it, no matter or the Pentagon's word, no matter who happens to be in charge. If it fits into the national narrative that whoever these guys were on this boat

were terrorists, were Tren de Aragua, Tren de Aragua, or were carrying cocaine or whatever, they're just going to jump up and down and say, great. Now, I think that the chances are pretty good that these were just fishermen who saw, you know, whatever it was, a ship in the distance or drones in the distance and said, oh, crap, let's get back to port and turned around and started to rush back and then got rocketed. Terrible. Yeah, I mean, that's the thing, too, right? The, you know, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled a long time ago that if you come up to a police checkpoint and then you run away from the cops because. you're afraid of the cops.

That does not provide the police with probable cause. But that's exactly the rationale that the administration used to say that they were right to blow up this boat. They said that the boat spotted the drone and then seemed to turn away from it. I don't know about you. If I saw an armed drone approach me, I'd turn away from it too. It doesn't mean I'm Trent de Aragua or that I'm Venezuelan or that I'm carrying drugs or anything else.

No, that's exactly right. we've had a question about UAPs and uh and Elizondo i forget his first name but he's like mr. UAP these days um you think he's a grifter i've tried to i've tried to walk a fine line on this issue um but i saw what i saw when i was 16 17 years old i've told that story and I don't I can't deny anybody else the account of their own personal experience but I also don't understand why the Pentagon doesn't just release this information or why the White House doesn't just declassify the information why it has to leak out and why we have to have people being called to testify on Capitol Hill as whistleblowers risking their own

imprisonment, you know, were they to be charged under the espionage act, just to say, yeah, I'm a, I'm an F-18 pilot, and I saw this thing moving at a fantastic speed, and it paralleled me, and then it took off at, you know, the speed of light practically, and then the Pentagon denies that any such thing has taken place. For a long time, and you'll remember this, there was worry that if, if the government were to admit that there were UAPs or UFOs, that people would panic. Well, the word leaked out, and nobody gave a shit.

There was no panic. They had more faith in us back then. They thought we might have a pulse. See, that's right. That we might react to something. That's right. Apparently nothing, you know, it would be like,

it would be like not the day that the earth stood still. It would be like the day that the earth kept looking at its phone. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You know, yesterday, Yesterday was the anniversary of the disappearance of this Australian pilot. I'm sure you've heard of this case. There's this Australian pilot in his early 20s.

I think he was 23 years old. He was flying. It was September 10th, 1978. I saw several different references to this yesterday. He's flying and he said that there was a silver cylinder above his plane, flying at exactly the same rate of speed. And then he's radioing back saying, There's this thing, it's right on top of me, and it's, it's flying the same rate of speed.

I don't know what it is. He's describing it. It's silver. It's shiny. And then he came back and he said, it's not, it's not an aircraft, he said. And then there was this loud sound of like electronic interference. Nobody ever saw him or heard from him again. They never found him.

They never found the plane. They never found anything. so why you know why keep that secret why not just say hey look there's some up there we don't know what the heck it is right there you have it i mean that's a thing right originally right unidentified does not mean alien exactly just it's unidentified yeah um yeah yeah so let's see um you know let me let me say one more thing about louise alizando um When I had my show on RT, people used to tell me all the time, you have to have Luis Elizando on.

He's an expert. He's an expert. He's an expert. So I did some research. And what I found was him saying repeatedly that he's an expert. I don't know what the heck he's an expert on. But he sure likes to get out there and be the UFO guy. And it just wasn't, it wasn't a fit for me.

So I have this rule, John. which is that if someone voluntarily says something, it describes themselves as having a positive attribute, they not only don't have that attribute, they are the opposite. So if someone just sort of says, you know, like if I ask you, John, are you a good tipper? And you say, yeah, that's not what I'm talking about.

I'm like, if you just say, Ted, by the way, you know, I tip really great, I'm a fucking great tipper, waiters love me, then I know you're a tight one for sure. and that everyone hates you and they're spitting all of your food everywhere in the DC metro area and that's what if someone says oh you know by the way I'm an expert on blah blah blah

no one who's actually an expert ever says that you know it's like they they just are and people talk to them about that topic and you know no one you know no one has to ask you about the you know you're never saying well by the way I John Korea I'm an expert in this and that

you just are and you know that's how it is like you know like on a date if a if someone said oh you know i'm really good in bed oh man i mean i lay i lay pipe like you you will be fucking screaming you you will lose track of who you are you'll lose scene you'll you'll space time will change that's a lie you know you know you're like dead bed all right let me read this out here yeah ready to level up your game aim controllers is where custom beats um meets unbeatable value and right now it's the best deal of the year we start with official Sony and Xbox controllers fully compatible with console and PC, no functionality lost. Then you go wild with custom features. Smart bumpers, paddles, grips, stick height, custom

buttons, even design your own PS5 snap panels. And here's the part no one else is doing. Lifetime warranty on all modified parts. That's right, Lifetime. What other company does that? Exactly. Normally, a fully loaded setup could run you $400, but during our one-priced promo, it's just $209 U.S. dollars or 182 euros no matter how many features you add use code rumble at checkout and lock it in this is your sign go to aim controllers.com and build the last controller you'll ever need that sounds appealing and i don't even game i want to i want to say one of the thing too i was sitting next to this guy at this 9-11 truth or lunch today and um he was telling me how interested he is in this in this issue and he's talked to everybody who's out there to talk to

and he starts naming people. And he mentioned Susan Lindauer. And so I said to him, be careful of Susan Lindauer. And he asked me why. And I said, honestly, I believe she's a fraud. And he said, what do you mean if she's a fraud? She was the secret back channel to Saddam Hussein. And I said, exactly my point.

No, she wasn't. And I said, I actually confronted her. There was this big whistleblower event. It's the only one that she somehow got into. It was on the roof of the Hay Adams Hotel here in Washington, across the street from the White House. And I was shocked to see her there. And she came up to me and introduced herself. And I was kind of cold.

And I said, oh, yes, I know who you are. And she confronted me. And she asked me why I wasn't friendlier, more supportive. Besides the fact that when she was prosecuted, they actually ended up driving. the charges because she was mentally unable like she was too insane to be tried so they just dropped the charges um but i said to her look i'll tell you the truth you tell everybody that you were the secret back channel to saddam hussein and i know you're lying and the reason i know you're lying is because i briefed the secret back channel to saddam hussein and it wasn't you oh man and

I said to him, he says, oh, come on, come on. I find that hard to believe. I said, you know, I've never said the name, but I'm going to say the name because the secret back channel is dead. He's dead now. So I'm going to say the name. I said, when I was in Bahrain, we got a cable from the State Department saying, David Rockefeller is coming to Bahrain to accept an award from the Bahrain U.S. Banking Society

and give him the red carpet treatment and give him what's called a country team briefing. So a country team briefing is the ambassador, the deputy chief of mission, the head of the economic section, the head of the political section, the head of public affairs, the head of everything. If there's a station chief there, he gets the full classified briefing. So he flew in on a Thursday. The weekend in Bahrain is Thursday and Friday. He flew in, and I was this control officer, so I picked him up in the embassies, you know, giant Cadillac, and there was a red carpet.

And we went straight to the embassy, did the full classified country team briefing. And then the emir had a big dinner for him. The whole cabinet was invited. The entire diplomatic corps was invited. Big, big dinner at the palace. There was a, there was a receiving line. So we shake hands with the emir and the prime minister and the crown prince and Mr. Rockefeller.

So a couple of days later, a day later, he had his ceremony at the Bahrain U.S. banking society. they give him his little trophy, and then he leaves. So Saturday, which was the first day of the work week, I go into the ambassador's office for the morning meeting, and he said, so Mr. Rockefeller got off okay. And I said, yeah, you got off okay. It was really cool meeting him.

But I said, but why would a guy who's almost a hundred years old fly halfway around the world to collect a little trophy from some banking organization, nobody's ever heard of and the ambassador goes john john john you're supposed to be the smart one and i said i said why what am i missing here and the station chief starts to laugh and the ambassador says john he's the secret back channel to saddam hussein this was his cover stop and i was like oh my god i'm such an idiot which is why we gave him the classified briefing and he said Exactly. So I said to Susan Lindauer, it wasn't you, Susan Lindauer. You were not the secret

back channel to Saddam Hussein. Unless she used to be a dude and she used to be dead. So she's trans alive and trans female. Yeah. And another thing too, this was the press secretary. She was the press secretary to a first term congressman from new jersey and she says that the cia secretly chose her to fly out to saddam hussein and tell him listen you better start to toe in the line saddam hussein and i'm like yeah that never happened you know john being it really strikes me like this you know like being in the cia because people aren't allowed to talk about their experiences it just opens up this space for all these liars to basically say that they did that. And the other,

it reminds me of a little bit of the journalists that I knew in Afghanistan. Oh, yeah. Or who would make things up. And they'd be like, no one's ever going to check out my story and fucking, you know, Mazari Sharif. I can say whatever. Right. And it's like, and for the most part, they were right.

I mean, no one ever, you know, never, no one ever knew anything. I had a, I knew a guy who worked for, um, travel and leisure. Sorry, Condi, I'm lying, Kandai Nass Traveler. And he wrote this piece, this flowery piece. Yeah, he wrote this flowery piece. I couldn't get published in there. Flowery piece about taking the train from Ashgabat Turkmenistan to Mashad, Iran, and talked about how beautiful it was, the lace curtains on the windows,

how good the tea was. And I'm like, man, I love to Dick that's fucking train. But that train has never been constructed. it's been and so the reason that he thought it lonely planet guide said it's expected to be constructed to be completed in two years well the lonely planet guide was four years old so the fucker picked up a copy and assumed it must be done by now i called up you know and not cool at all and this shit happens all the time without a doubt hey uh we should we should plug the good people at rumble yes they've been very good to us yes thank you very much rumble umble um

for, well, anyway, please go over to Rumble and watch us over there. That's the main thing because we make more money there and they've been very supportive and we're in the Rumble creative program. And so, and we have Rumble premium content over there. For $5 a month, you can watch us and the Rumble premium content

and you get like a special little doodad when you comment. And for $10 a month, you can see, you can have those privileges for all content over on Rumble. So please do that. Also, USC triple X-A-Rod 21 has, I would say, been patiently waiting, but has been waiting. I don't know if they're patients or not. John, come on.

There's aliens, right? Parts of the government have to know. There have to be. There have to be. I mean, maybe they're just little bacteria. Who knows? But, yeah, I was talking to a guy the other day. A guy who, like, he presents is very serious.

And he was telling me that he's doing a book about Area 58. And I said, Area 51, he said, no, Area 58. It's even more. Plus seven. Plus seven more. And it's that much more secret. And that there's an underground bunker at Area 58. and that is where the alien ships come in to land and we call it the embassy because that's where

that's where we liaise with the the aliens I'm like okay and but you know what I mean I've learned so much about government after having left government that who knows and Algerian corsair forgive me okay you wanted to hear about about this 9-11 truth of thing. And then we have to get to Iran-Contra. We do. We have to get to Iran-Contra. So I've got a friend who's a PR guy and he ran into

some really bad he ran into a really bad period in life. His wife left him. He lost his job. The people that used to work for him sued him. He was arrested. It was just bad. But listen, I'm one of the most loyal people out there. And so

he's still my friend and I wanted to express, you know, support. So he's finally getting back on his feet again. He's still doing PR, but he used to do PR for Julian Assange and WikiLeaks and all these left-wing groups and Ed Snowden. And now he does PR for the far right because they pay him. And the far left walked away, the far left, the left walked away from him. And so he asked me a few weeks ago, hey, on the anniversary of 9-11, would you give a speech

about, you know, what 9-11 meant to you or whatever? I said, yeah, sure. He said, I'll give you $500. I said, okay, great. That was it. That was the extent of it. And then somebody saw a poster for 9-11, 9-11 engineers and architects for truth.org or whatever. And it's featuring, you know, John Kiriaku and all these people who I've always considered to be, like, deeply insane.

And I was like, doggone it, Trevor. you put me with a 9-11 truth organization and he's like yeah well didn't you do your due diligence and i said no i trusted you we're friends you asked me to do it i said okay so my my sister called me she's like what are you doing i said i know i know i and she says you have to withdraw and i said i can't i made a commitment i have to stand by my commitments and i decided i've thought about this a lot the last couple of weeks but i decided that i'm going to give my speech tonight. And of all people, Dennis Kucinich is introducing me. I'm going to give my speech tonight and I'm going to say, look, you and I will never, ever agree on whether or not

Building 7 was controlled demolition. I'll never believe that it was. I will never believe that such a thing as thermite paint exists and is suddenly somehow spontaneously explosive. No, that doesn't exist. It doesn't exist. There is no such a thing. Applied physics major, Columbia School of Engineering and Applied Science. No. Nuclear engineering originally. But I can take a shit on the Saudis

for hours without even taking a breath and on the Israelis both relative to the 9-11 attacks. And so that's what I'm going to do. And the Pakistanis probably have some shitting upon to be done to. That's right. So there it is.

Okay. So let's talk about the This is a funny story. So the Iran-Contra scandal of the late 1980s is back in the news because Ali North has finally married his former secretary, Fawn Hall, who was famously smuggling classified documents out in her bursier. Yeah. I was, if you saw her bra, what was, what she was backing back then, you were jealous of those classified documents. Yes, you were. She was beautiful, stunning.

So they just got married four decades after all of this. It was always assumed that they were stooping. Yeah. But they weren't. Apparently they weren't. They were both loyal to their spouses at the time. Yeah. Colonel North, 81 years old now and Ms. Hall, 65, still young.

We're married on August 27th in a civil ceremony there in Arlington County. Yeah. So Ms. North and Mr. North's wife, a 50, years and the mother of their four children died in November at the age of 80, Ms. Hall had previously been married. I love this part. I was shocked by this.

To Danny Sugarman, who managed the doors. He managed the doors of all things. And he died in 2005, 50 years old, lung cancer. Yeah. But he managed the door. Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun,

come on, come on, come on. Now, touch me, babe. You know, I go through, I, for me, I go through, I have all of their records. and their CDs. I love the doors, but I go through phases where I suddenly am like,

wait, they're kind of hacks and I shouldn't listen to them anymore. And then I'm like, oh, I miss them so much. They're great. And then I have to play them incessantly. Does that make any sense? I mean, you know,

I never liked the fact that Jim Morrison was obsessed with Frank Sinatra and was trying to sound like Frank Sinatra. And Sinatra hated him. Yeah. Well, Frank Sinatra was a very serious person. Yeah.

And Jim Morrison was a fucking mess. Yeah. So he was incredibly unreliable. I mean, you feel sorry for the rest of the band. Speaking of a Doris connection, I'm going to see X soon. And what's his name from The Door is produced the first X album, Los Angeles. Really? Yeah, yeah, Raymond Zerick.

Yeah, he's a producer, big-time producer at the time. He's a musical genius who's very humble and quiet and, and does not really promote his genius. Reid is saying that marshals have been deployed to Utah. I would need more details about that. Oh. Let's see what the inner web said have to say about that. What's for, though, you know?

Wow. Okay. I mean, is this to go out to, I'm not seeing anything. All right. Whatever. Okay. Awesome. Well, lots of news today.

So, yeah, for sure. So anyway, I wanted to say that, like, we talked about this earlier before we went on the air. But, John, you and I both agree that we wish Ollie North and Fon Hall nothing but the best. True love. I do think that's what I don't agree at all with what Olly North did or what Fon Hall did. Right. Right. Nor do I.

Nor do I. But I wish them happiness. I think it's nice. totally totally yeah so uh hey thief uh back off i love the ted name drop the dead kennedy's y'all showing boomers can be cool cool gen x not boomer all right it's just saying all right boomers oh demographically we're boomers 46 to 64 okay but listen the thing is 1961 to 1964 those are cuspical kids we get to choose our generation that's right because and and i'm taking the high i get it from the highest authority douglas copeland who wrote generation x in 1990 defined generation x at that time as

anyone then in their 20s which meant anyone born in the 60s right that's just arithmetic i'll take that i've obviously thought about this so anyway i used i used to be obsessed with generational politics but just because I like the Dora's doesn't mean that I'm not far more partial to Flipper. Yeah, yeah, true, true. All right. So, all right, everybody. Thanks so much for joining us.

We really appreciate you. Really, truly. Yeah, we really appreciate you. And so this is Deep Programme with Ted Rawl and John Kiriakou. We are here Monday through Friday, 5 p.m. Eastern time. We'll be back Friday tomorrow at 5 p.m. Eastern to bring you up to date and deprogram you from everything. Hope that you consider yourself sufficiently deprogrammed, John. I know I do. And like, follow, and share the show. Thanks, producer Robbie, for your assistance and

gun expertise, which we will call upon in the future. Yes, indeed. Ciao. Sponge up.