DeProgram with John Kiriakou and Ted Rall - DeProgram with Ted Rall and John Kiriakou: “Hamas Won”

Episode Date: October 7, 2025

Political cartoonist Ted Rall and CIA whistleblower John Kiriakou get into the second anniversary of the Oct. 7th raid by Hamas, Supreme Court’s decision to decline Ghislaine Maxwell’s appeal, France’s political crisis, and Trump refusing to negotiate with Democrats despite the government shutdown.Gaza War Enters Year 3: It’s been three years since Hamas launched its attack on Israel. John and Ted break down the current state of the conflict.Ghislaine Maxwell: The Supreme Court rejects Ghislaine Maxwell’s appeal, upholding her 20-year sentence. Maxwell’s argument that a 2008 Florida non-prosecution deal should protect her fails, as prosecutors assert it doesn’t apply to federal charges based in New York. Her only hope now lies in potential clemency from Trump. Will he come through?France’s Political Crisis: President Macron assigns deposed Prime Minister Sébastien Lecornu to leading talks to resolve the mess. With markets reeling and opposition parties rejecting compromise, Macron faces pressure to call snap elections and/or resign. The turmoil threatens France’s economy and the EU’s stability, with no clear path forward. U.S. Government Shutdown: President Trump refuses talks with Democrats, who demand Obamacare subsidy extensions for 20 million Americans to save the ACA. The Senate’s vote on a Republican funding proposal stalls, with the administration warning of mass federal layoffs. Meanwhile, air traffic control towers are short staffed.

Good morning. Good morning. Welcome to D-Program with Ted Raul and John Kiriaku. John, I hear you're getting blown around out there in the western hinterlands of North America. This Hurricane Horatio was supposed to miss us by a lot, by like 130-something miles. And it just took a turn and clobbered us overnight. We're in a lull right now. We're on generator power, so forgive me if I drop out. Furniture everywhere. Wow. And I know it's probably silly, but when it rains heavily,

that's when all the tarantulas come out of their holes. That's not silly. So I have that to greet me today. Do they come inside looking for shelter? The last couple of days, there was one in the dining room last night. And you have a bunch of liberals there, so you shoe them out rather than... There was a moth in my room. the size of a sparrow, not even a sparrow, a robin.

It was like this, bigger than a sparrow. And I killed it, and it got that powder everywhere. You know how a monster are. Yeah. And everybody jumped on me, that it's one of God's creatures, and I should have captured it and taken it outside. I said, I've killed two of them in my room already. Not to even talk about the family of mice that's in my dresser.

That's why I'm still using suitcases back here. yeah you don't really you can't really clobber them because they make such a mess not if that's even assuming you can catch them they're they're like grease lightning they're they're crazy yeah it's the tarantula situation sounds like to say at least is it is it is the rain knocking the mosquitoes out of the sky yeah for the very first time the rain is helping with the mosquitoes ted it is so oppressively hot and humid here i feel like i'm melting and everybody keeps saying oh it's very unusual. This is the weather for

early September, not early October. It is just stifling. I'm so sorry, John. I mean, I hate to be more than the movie. The star arrived a couple days ago. Are you at liberty to say who the star is? Yeah, it's

Jeff Fahey. He was in Motorcycle Man and Lost and a whole bunch of stuff. Oh, what was he? I was a big fan of Lost. Do you remember? Oh, yeah, he was all of copped pilot oh that guy's great yeah he's great fantastic i can't wait to see it oh that's so cool i've never acted before and it's hard and it's intimidating but all these people are professional

actors and so that's what has made it so much easier for you very helpful i'm enjoying myself very much are they are they giving you hints and anything yeah wow that's awesome i love Yeah. It's a fun time. When I got into talk radio, Mike Gallagher, the conservative talk. Oh, yeah, yeah. Sure. He basically taught me everything I know about talk radio. And it was, I don't, people, others will judge whether that was worth knowing or not. I'm going to go through our rundown and then we'll bring in Robbie in for a little business. And then we'll get to it. So it's the third anniversary, it's the, sorry, the second anniversary of the October 7th Hamas attack. As I put into the thumbnail, Hamas. I think we've talked about this, and I hope I think we'll probably agree on the idea. Hamas appears to have won. We'll talk about the future of the conflict as it enters its third year. Ghislane Maxwell's appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court was denied.

We'll talk about whether Trump plans to pardon her or give her clemency or whatnot. Also, we've got the political crisis in France is dead. deepening, unsurprisingly, after Sebastian Le Corneux stepped down. The stock markets there, La Boules is just completely roiling. The French economy is kind of on the ropes. And even his first prime minister is urging President Emmanuel Macron to resign. I think we're going to see more calls for his resignation in the coming hours and days. The government shutdown continues of pace, John, you might be better off not flying around the United States, even there. Just, I was laughing because, and in horror at the fact that a pilot at Burbank Airport, north of L.A., called the control tower to get instructions from ATC, and basically got,

it's like, no one's here to help you due to short staffing and the government shutdown. I mean, he did manage to get off the ground, I guess, with instructions. from LAX, but still, that's pretty crazy. So we also should bring in Robbie. We had a little bit of disconcerting financial news that we're going to bring you up to speed on. And thanks everyone for watching us here. We really appreciate you. Robbie.

So good morning. It seems like every time that the producer comes on, it's always bad news. That's not true. And then I know, okay, that's not true. But I do want to kind of rub your nose into this, John. here in monta here in montana it is currently a steamy 24 degrees and we got frost everywhere so while you're there sweltering in mexico as much to let you know i am very much enjoying the fact we actually have seasons here in montana

so there is that but no let's just uh gone into the news so first and foremost youtube has demonetized us yes y'all heard that right so for those of you who watch us on YouTube. We appreciate it. But I just want y'all to know that YouTube thanks you very much because they are directly benefiting from your watching, but John and Ted are not getting a dime from what y'all are doing. We have, we've launched an appeal.

There's some things we're going to try to do, try and get the situation rectified. Is that going to happen or not? Listen, I don't know. YouTube is a part of the beast. It's a part of the machine. It is what it is. I was worried this is probably going to happen and here we are. So if you all want to support John and Ted and I encourage you all to do that because for the show to continue, they've got to earn money.

I mean, they got bills to pay. Let's just be honest. That's how our society works. If you want to support the show, please, please, please watch us over on Rumble. and I know that the morning show is inconvenient for some people so going forward starting today I'm going to start streaming the

morning show at the old time 5 p.m. Eastern 3 p.m. mountain time for the people in civilized America where I am. So you're going to be able to have the morning and the afternoon show if you want to support the show on Rumble you can

you can of course donate you become channel subscribers cost you $5 a month if you do that then you get to see the premium episodes they're they're going to be dropping with John and Ted

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Rumble is one that's thrown us the lifeline watch us on Rumble they pay us off of watch hours you can donate become channel subscribers because, I mean, me being the good capitalist that I am and the right-wing capitalist of that,

I don't like the idea of working for someone for free. And that's what we're doing right now on YouTube. And I know there are a lot of people who don't like this option, but this up, and for you, PayPal is an option. PayPal is an option. Here's the PayPal address. Deprogrampodcast at gmail.com. It's deprogrampodcast at gmail.com.

Okay, Robbie. you so much for that and and a big shout out to scott over there on rumble uh thank you for what you do fuck youtube and i wholeheartedly agree with that message fuck you youtube all right robbie we'll see you later all right let's get to it um what do you want to talk about first you want to talk about france shutdown uh jisleine or uh or gaza yeah and actually if you don't mind i'd like to talk about france because i have a question i think probably a lot of people have this question. In my memory, going back to George Pompadou or maybe, you know, maybe even before, I don't remember a French president ever resigning. What happens when a French president

resigns? They have fixed, what is it, eight-year terms, 10-year terms? It's long. It used to be seven. Seven. Now it's five. So the current term is. The current term is to end in two years. So I'm not sure what time of the year it is. But what normal, I mean, so the last time it happened, I believe was Charles de Gaulle in his third time as president after the May 1968 student and union uprising that almost caused a socialist revolution in France.

And basically what happens is that there's new elections. So is it just to fill out the remainder of the term or does a new five-year term start? No, I think, yeah, no, I think that's just to, that's, I think, you know, that's a good question. I have to look that up. I don't know the answer to that, John. I think it's to finish the term, though. And then, and then they can run for re-election. There's currently a term limit.

You can only serve two terms. So I don't, I think it's analogous to ours in that, like, you could, if my, Macron stepped down, the person who wins could run theoretically two more times and be elected. So it would work like that. But I have to look into that, and I don't know the answer. But it's, you know, the situation's very, you know, very fraught. You know, Macron's been just trying to play the same game over and over and over. And, you know, all the French political observers from far left to far right and everything in between kind of agree that this just can't go on.

I mean, he basically just keeps putting up these moderate, centrist, corporatist prime ministers who can't form a government. I mean, and the way that the French political alignment is now, everything has grabbed. Basically, what you have is you have a mushy, small minority party in the form. of Macron's party. Then over on the right, you have a unified right, under Marine Le Pen, right, and Jordan Bardello, her protege. Then over on the left, you have an alliance of convenience of left-wing parties that all told add up to the biggest plurality party. And so in the last snap election that was held in April of last year, that was called the New Popular Front. That's hearkening to 1936 and the old French popular front, which was, again, a front of the socialist

and communist and other related parties. And they elected back in 1936, famously Francis first and only Jewish president, Leon Blum, who also instituted, he was the FDR of France. He instituted the French social safety net, as we know it today. So this is very resonant. So we don't know if the new popular front could reform. I think they will. And so the question is, when will Macron see reality? John, there is no world in which Emmanuel Macron finishes his term. It's impossible. I mean, I think if he lives to see, if he makes it to Christmas, he's lucky.

I don't think so. Wow, Christmas is right around the corner. Yeah, I don't think it's, you know, I mean, he's really on the ropes. Look, it's, I understand it's, it's like, it's disgrace. In the French system, it's even more of a disgrace to step down as president than it is for an American president. It's bad. Like, it's a blot on, you know, on you in history. It's just like, what kind of fucking scandal-scarred loser are you?

And, you know, I mean, you know, de Gaulle had it coming. He was just exhausted. He was so old by then. And he was so out of touch with the youth and everything. they all he was hated and reviled and basically he just died shortly after resigning right Macron's a young man you know he's he has his whole life really ahead of him and so you know it's he's got to be just like his head's spinning i don't think he can process it i think his little brain is little he's like the little disc on your computer circling he can't he just can't believe this is

happening he went from having total control of the french parliament to and you know and the elizant Palace and being, you know, the dominant leader in Western Europe to being like hated and reviled. It's, it's crazy. But, you know, they've got to do something. Yeah. And, you know, also another thing that's true is that the corporate interests are not going to get their way this time. You know, sorry, yeah, you guys want like austerity and you want to roll back the social safety net and you want a low, you want a higher retirement age and all that. You may get it, but you're not getting it this time. The far left and the far right total probably account for about 70% or more of the vote

and the French people, and not to mention cities are going to burn. So it's just not going to happen. So, you know, mechanism is finished. Now this becomes a struggle between the left and the right. And if they're smart, what they'll do is they'll put together some kind of populist kind of you know, accommodation where, because there's a lot of stuff that they can agree on. I mean, the right, unlike here in the United States, the right in France believes in a social safety net. The right believes in climate change and thinks that it's, that it's actually

happening. The right cares about the environment. So they can do a lot together. And they also put, they also believe they both agree in putting domestic interests first. Ted, what do you, What do you assess as the chances for violence? The French, one of the things I've always liked about the French is that they're very quick to go out into the streets. We saw the yellow vest protests. I mean, look, going back to 68 and the student protests of 68,

do you see that happening again in the short term? The proclimate, I mean, I think the chances for violence are better than 50-50. The question is how far will the violence go? I mean, there's already been violence, right? I mean, there's been running street battles between the Surite and the protesters. There's, you know, trash fires. There's like, there's been strikes that's been suppressed really violently.

You know, the French cops, you know, the national police, they're goons. They're mean as shit. And they just tend to raise the temperature. So they're, yeah, I mean, I think violence definitely is going to happen. The question is how far will it go and, you know, how much, How far will the government be willing to go to suppress it? It could, I mean, honestly, I don't really see the limit just yet. There's got to be one, but I don't know.

The French are, you know, like you said. Mistello Matsirati, John, is saying, I will also help donate and stay in touch through RT. I have Sachs and McGovern on speed dial. frog enthusiast 235 says I think you underestimate how much Macron will do not to resign I always love these like nicknames that people have on the internet I was never able to come up with good ones

no no it's like I'm always just like Chiariaku Ted Raul in 1963 right like no it's I'm a boring person that way Yeah, someone once was making fun of me and calling me Tokyo Rose, and they called me Kabul Ted back during the War of Terrorists. And so I took it for myself. I thought it was hilarious. But, yeah.

Hey, John, do you worry about Kimberly Guilfoyle in Greece? That's a question. No one wants to know. Greas, yes, yes. Greeks are worried about Kimberly Guilfoil. Yes. They're being very nice about it. They're not being too terribly public about it, but they don't.

like her they believe that she's a lightweight they don't care if she was once an assistant u.s attorney does not matter to anybody um you know the greeks the greeks are used to having um professional diplomats as american ambassadors every once in a while there's a political appointee but they tend to be greek americans wealthy greek americans who already have close ties to the greek government and so that's fine too um but But this is something the Greeks are not happy about. I will say she's probably smarter than we generally give her credit for. So, I don't know.

She needs a better rhinoplasty expert, though. Yeah. That was, I mean, you know, the Dead Kennedys, one of my favorite bands, had an album called Plastic Surgery Disasters. I always think of that title whenever I look at her. Yeah, she needs the doctors from botched. Yeah, no. I mean, maybe it's like the $6 million man. We have the technology. We can rebuild her. Maybe. Okay. So, all right. So is that enough, is that, so, so that's it for France, maybe. What do you want to talk? What should we do now? Shut down? Well, yeah, we should talk about the shutdown too. Donald Trump made a statement yesterday that was just so, so typically Trump and so. silly. He said that, okay, he's willing to talk about Obamacare subsidies, but only after the government

reopens. That's the point of the shutdown. Right. It's shut down because you can't agree on Obamacare subsidies. So what he's saying is he's willing to talk about Obamacare subsidies if the Democrats walk away from them. Right, which is ridiculous. Ridiculous. I mean, here's the thing. I mean, to breath to even say it. True. Now, the thing is, though, Donald Trump, even though the polls are running against the Republicans on the shutdown, the thing is that the Republicans, I mean, the Democrats, I mean, sorry, the Republicans do have one major thing going for them, which is that the Democratic messaging has been shit on this. And so, I mean, all the Democrats need to do is say,

look, today's October 7th. On October 15th, millions of Americans are going to start getting kicked off Medicaid, because that's the deadline for 2026 health care. They missed that. The subsidies aren't in place by October 14th. In a week from today, then the system's going to start to collapse. And by November 15th, there's another round of deadlines for the non-Medicaid, for the people who are like middle class and just need a government subsidy, those people are going to be kicked out of the system, or maybe not. They'll just have to pay a shit ton more. So, you know, instead of paying, you know, $200 a month, they might have to pay $1,000 a month or more. You know, some of the basic plans here in New York City are $1,400 or $1,600 a month.

And that's what's like $10,000 deductibles and stuff. Yeah, I pay $9.83 a month. And I told you, my doctor said to me, when I went to the doctor last time, he said, why do you have this shit insurance? Well, that's, that's Obamacare. $1,000 a month. Yep. Yeah.

Yeah. It's by county. It's a very, very, it's a shitty system. But the only thing worse than a shitty system is no system at all. And that's kind of like what the Republicans want. So the Democrats haven't been messaging. They haven't been running any ads on social or on TV. So there's, you know, they're not getting their message through.

Nobody really knows basically we just, it's, you know, what this is really about. It's frustrating, John, because I think the head, I think the deadline's going to elapse the way things are going. And then the thing is, it's. if millions of people who are kicked off the health care system are no longer in it, by next year, it's not like Humpty Dumpty is going to be put back together again by next year. I mean, not with this president, not with this Congress. So the ACA will just crumble. The Democrats can't go along with it.

They just can't because literally, I think, I mean, John, I've been thinking about this. I think this is a grave crisis for the Democratic Party. I mean, they're already in deep trouble. If they let this go, they will be blamed for the end of the health care system. If they, they can't give those seven Senate votes to Donald Trump. They can't. So the government stays shut down. I mean, obviously Congress could pass some kind of work around that says,

we're changing all the deadlines. But that's more work. That's going to be, you know, that's going to require almost something that feels like a grand bargain. hard to imagine between these two political parties at this time. But the Democrats, I don't think the Republicans know that the Democrats can't go along with this. This is something, you know, when you negotiate, you have to know what the other side needs and what they want. The Democrats need this. They have to have it. I don't know if the Republicans understand that. Yeah, I think they don't. I think they don't. But I agree with you, Ted, that Democratic messaging is as bad as

I've seen it be since the 1994 Republican contract with America. I kept waiting in 1994 for the Democrats to say something to come up with some proposal, some policy, and it was nothing. And that's how it is again this year. They don't stand for anything. Tammy Landengren says the Dems can effectively complicate a wet dream. Indeed. I think we've got an ad, Ted.

We're ready for it, Robbie. Whenever you're ready to put that up, I'll blast through it. Okay, so, yeah, so I think this goes on. We should talk about Gaza. Yeah, we should. So it's been two years since the October 7th attack. Okay, we'll hold that there. Here's the ad.

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just like Rumble does. Okay, so, obviously we all know what happened on October 7, 2023. I'm not going to revisit all that. We all know what's happened to Gaza. But right now, as we're talking, you know, it looks like Trump secretly behind the scenes was really pissed off at Bibi Netanyahu. And he embarrassed, Netanyahu embarrassed him by bombing gutter. That was the breaking.

That was it. That did him in. That's why he was like, okay, you're going to call and apply to the cutteries, apologize to the cutteries and promise to never do anything like that again. And hilariously, Donald Trump has now personally given a protection packed to the cutteries. Like, I will protect you militarily in the event of an attack. Presumably, that would involve it maybe against a. an attack by the ITF.

I mean, that would be an attack as an attack, right? That's the attack that happens most recently and therefore most likely to happen in the future. And so, you know, and then he, when Hamas cleverly dragged their feet and said, you know, like, okay, we'll give you back all the hostages. Donald Trump said, pieces at hand, peace in our time, Neville Chamberlain, we're done, we're good, everyone come home, you know,

like victory parade, Nobel, Nobel Prize. And now Netanyahu is between a rock and a hard place, he can't say no, but he has to say no. So he's going to scuttle things. I agree with you that he's attacking Iran or something like it, most likely Iran, is going to be his way out. Or at least so he hopes. I don't know if that'll work with Donald Trump because someone around the table has to have told Donald Trump, this is what BB is going to do. And so Trump's going to have seen it coming and not like it. I think that the Hamas won the war.

Hamas carried out one of the most brilliant, you know, raids in the modern history of warfare. I mean, they were outmatched militarily, economically, certainly in terms of diplomatically. every way and they waged asymmetric warfare and they and they've prevailed and like you could say okay well you know tens if not hundreds of thousands of gossans are dead as a result and that's true yes but they're going to end up with something that feels like a Palestinian state and I don't think it'll be a demilitarized bantustan I think it's going to be the real fucking thing and I think it's going to be sooner rather than later. I think that's probably right.

Something is going to happen in favor of the Palestinians. Ndhanyahu has put Israel into an untenable position. When your only choices are to continue fighting in an unpopular war, and we talked yesterday about tripling in the number of IDF soldiers who are committing suicide, or your second choice is to bomb Iran again, unprovoked again, those are not winning combinations. And you don't have to love Iran to put your foot down this time and say, look, enough is enough. You can't just bomb your way out of this, right? They bombed Gaza. They bombed Lebanon. They bombed Iran. They bombed Iran a second time. They bombed Iran a third time. They bomb Yemen and kill the prime minister. and it hasn't gotten them anything.

So it's time to negotiate a settlement. And I agree with you, Ted, that anything the Palestinians get is better what they have than what they have now. Yeah. And better. And I would argue better than what they had before 2023. They were living in misery. Well, they had, what, two hours of electricity a day, five hours of water, or maybe I got it reversed. hyperinflation, you know, every staggeringly high unemployment.

The, you know, the Israelis would sometimes let workers out, you know, but then on a drop of a hat, like if they had an itchy ass, they would like, they would close the border. You know, I mean, these are two, I mean, I think to me, all eyes are going to be turning to the West Bank. That, to me, is the really sticky wiki now. You know, if I'm, and of course there's the question, I guess Hamas gets to keep Gaza and Fatah gets to keep whatever's left of the West Bank. But, you know, I mean, what do you do about these 700,000 colonists in the West Bank who have no legal basis to be in, you know, on Palestinian land? Yeah, well, they've got to go.

But, I mean, you know, you know the argument, like, they're not going to go. go. Yeah, they're not going to go. It's like they, yeah, they're the facts on the ground. These are children who were born here and raised here. This is their homes too. Why can't the Palestinians share? Why are they so churlish? Yeah. You know, that's why that's why people are just now beginning to talk about a three-state solution, right? The West Bank is independent Palestine. Israelis get to keep Israel plus whatever settlements they're able to negotiate, and somebody administers Gaza. Well, that would solve one problem, but it would create at least one more, right?

So we would solve the issue of the fact that you have two non-contiguous territories, right? Yes. There was always conversations about how there needs to be some kind of corridor, like a highway that's protected between the two that goes through Israel. But that, you mean, you and I both know, like from history, non-contiguous territory causes trouble. Yes. East Pakistan and Pakistan and so on.

So, but it creates another problem. I can see how Gaza can be viable. Gaza can be a tourist attraction, you know, not necessarily Trump's vision in his AI video, but it can be beautiful. beaches, stunning beaches, beautiful, beautiful climate, great place to visit, good food, what's not to like? They've got oil, as we've talked about, so, you know, they can, so between tourism and

natural resources, Gaza can make it. The West Bank doesn't have anything, right? I mean, I don't think it's economically viable. It would be like Lesotho. It would be a landlocked, cut off from the world, no natural resources, desperately poor. I mean, here, I don't want to sound like some Zionists, but some Zionists just have suggested that that should go back to Jordan. And I think maybe that's right. Could be. But that's a deal, I guess, that the West Bank authorities could

negotiate with the Jordanians. Maybe they become like a Kurdistan kind of autonomous zone. You know, they have autonomous status with the way that Waziristan does with Pakistan you know it's it's part of Jordan that taxes the Jordanian army comes in when there's a crisis but not generally right yeah half the population of Jordan is Palestinian anyway yeah well that that could work yeah yeah I mean yeah it'll be interesting to see how it all plays out John do you think Donald Trump will be the person who who is able to negotiate this three state or two and a half state solution? No, I honestly don't. Donald Trump is definitely not a detail guy. You know, I've got this story that I've told a number of times, Ted. A friend of mine

was at Camp David in the final week of the Clinton administration. He was the senior director at the National Security Council for Middle Eastern Affairs and talks between Israel and the Palestinians were taking place under the direction of Vice President Gore, who was very much a detail man, as was Clinton. And my buddy said that on the last day, they had this enormous map of Jerusalem on the table. And with the Sharpie, they're literally dividing Jerusalem block by block. And when they finished, Gore said, my God, we have peace.

and Yasser Arafat said, I can never sell this to the Palestinian people. And he walked out. Gore ran out after him. And he said, wait a minute, you can't just walk out. If you don't like the deal, then we can renegotiate whatever it is that you don't like. And he said, I can never sell any deal to the Palestinian people. And that was the end of it.

And then Clinton said in his memoir, his first memoir, that he was, wished he had spent that week not trying to negotiate peace between the Palestinians and the Israelis, but instead trying to open diplomatic relations with the North Koreans. You may remember maybe you don't, but

I do. Madeline Albright, the Secretary of State at the time, was not at those Israeli, Arab Israeli talks because she was in Pyongyang trying to convince the North Koreans to open diplomatic relations. So, instead,

of you know walking away from one to to strengthen the other and then come out with a victory we ended up with two failures that sucks so my point is gore and clinton were detail guys trump is absolutely positively not a detail guy so if the detail guys couldn't work out the details then the guy who just says make peace or else he's not going to I mean, it's been mentioned, right? But, like, you know, Trump is a, you know, I think it comes from Trump's business background. When you do a real estate deal or a big financial transaction, you have a deal sheet with the basic points that's usually a single piece of paper and has like a set of bullet points that basically says, you know, Kyriaku Corp is, you know, selling 40% to Rawl Corp. And, you know, we're going to have an exchange of this many shares and this office will belong to you.

and that's how it's belonging to me. But it's just very basic. It might just be a few hundred words. And then all the details are hashed out by the lawyers and then, you know, ultimately codified in science. And that's what he's used to. He's not used to, you know, like a Paris, Versailles 1919 kind of, you know, conference where you're sitting over, pouring over a map of Kurdistan,

trying to figure out what part of it goes to Turkey and what part of it ends up in Iraq and where Iraq should be and why and like somebody called the British yeah of course British cartographers have never caused any problems

so yeah no I I see that but I mean but a weird part here is we are somehow closer to something than we've ever been is that due to Donald Trump or is that due to Hamas or is that due to

to both. Yeah, I think it's due to Hamas and I think it's due also in part to the historic overreaction of Benjamin Netanyahu. Well, that was his big mistake, right? I mean, imagine, I mean, first of all, I just want to hand it to Hamas strategically, right? I mean, they literally, they played this long game probably for at least five to ten years they created the you know the Gaza subway right they created this massive structure infrastructure of tunnels so that they to prepare for this future when there would be an another Israeli onslaught even bigger than anything they'd ever seen before and then they launched the raid and they to provoke this reaction which they wanted a big blockbuster reaction.

The most, the worst, from the Palestinian perspective, the worst thing could have happened would have been for the Israelis to treat this like a, like a crime, to ask the, to ask Hamas to arrest the perpetrators, close, reseal the border, ask Hamas to extradite anyone who's guilty, maybe just do a pinpoint like commando raid into, into Gaza. That would have absolutely like killed them. They would have been in Qatar like, fuck, they didn't fall for our trap. Yes. Yes.

I agree completely. But I think they're all like toasting each other. Like, yeah. Like everything came up Hamas, you know, like that. Like in The Simpsons, everything's coming out Millhouse. It's like, I love that. And it's like, this is not, by the way, to praise. I'm, you know, I have nothing in common with Hamas.

their ideology or their religion at all. I would not like to live under their rule. I'm just saying, like, good job tactically, though, really. Very good job tactically. So let's see. Oh, yeah, so Philip Blair 9511 says the Germans were emptied out of Koninsberg, families who'd lived there for centuries. That's true. I mean, certainly there's been mass displacements of people many times. Look, there was really settlers in Gaza, and they were forced to, they were kicked out by the IDF before. And Sinai. Yeah, and a lot of them, yeah. A lot.

Whole towns. And just recently in Nagorno-Karabakh, right, the, the Azeris kicked out the Armenians, ethnic Armenians. So, I mean, you know, you can have mass displacements of people. And, you know, these are people who shouldn't be there. so when we're talking about the West Bank Settlers. And the numbers are just so crazy. I mean, they possess 60% of the West Bank in terms of the land. So it's crazy.

I mean, it's like, what the hell? You know, a little breaking. Oh, no, you have breaking news? A little breaking news, Robbie just put it up. New York Times is reporting that gold is now at $4,000 an ounce amid turmoil. and, you know, nervousness and anxiety in the market, in the securities markets. Yeah, $4,000 is one of those psychological thresholds that's never been met before. So that's at a record.

Silver has moved even more strongly into record territory. And now people are predicting that Bitcoin will soon follow. Well, at least gold's got inherent value. Yeah. The thing is, you know, I'm old enough to remember. when gold had a fixed rate of $35 an ounce in 1973. Yep. Man, I wish I'd say I'd put, I'd used my paper route money to buy gold.

Yeah, I wish I had. It was like, I remember those days. Yeah, $35. Nixon changed it for everybody. Yeah, he did. Yeah, he, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I have to, I do understand the gold bug thing completely. I mean, there's something very like,

you know primal about like like i want to be like a bridge troll i want gold gold it's so beautiful but it is it is never tarnishes i want those uh i i lust for those $20 gold pieces i used to collect coins avidly now it's just i don't i don't do that anymore i like paper currency better it's it's really affordable and it's and it's cool yeah the graphics and everything I always keep my euros when I come home from a trip to Europe, always. I miss the French Franks. Do you still have Franks? Yeah, yeah, with the, you know, with like Molière and stuff.

Oh, sure. So beautiful. I have a lot of old drachmas. Anytime I encounter an old drachma that's made out of silver, like pre-1964, I buy it and just toss it in a bag of, you know, hundreds of other drachma. Well, I mean, it says something when, you know, like I tried, I explained that to my kid, like, you know, so you understand, like, if you want to know what this, what happened to this country, dimes and quarters were 90% silver until 1965. I mean, that tells you a lot about a country. You know, if you go back and look at, you know, World War II currency, like V-sheet coins, they were aluminum. And they had a whole punch to the middle because they couldn't even afford the, the, you know, the World War II currency, like V-sheet coins, they were aluminum. And they had a hole punch to the middle because they couldn't even afford the, the, you know, the, the, you know, the aluminum or the tin that they used to make them. Yeah.

How embarrassing. It is embarrassing. Well, you know, John, they don't even, you know, like when they redesigned, you know, the $20 bill to its current iteration, I don't know if you read this, but, you know, it's obviously it's an incredibly ugly bill. It's like, it's just, it's, it's, it's, it's off, the proportions are all off wildly. And it just looks like someone who, you know, was dropped on their head at birth. like designed it, right? And then if they were interviewed, I think it was in the New York Times, they called the Mint, and they said, the Mint said confided that they had not hired a graphic designer to do this. For literally the U.S. $20 bill is the most widely circulated bill in the world,

right? It's the standard, like people keep 20s and hundreds like, you know, all over the world as their savings. And like no graphic designer had anything to do it. They said they're only concern was anti-counterfeiting measures. They did not care what it looked like. And it's like this is a, you know, it's like a step four. You know, meanwhile, it's sort of like what happened. I don't know if you remember this incident like with postage stamps, but about, I think, 10 years ago, one of the forever stamps with the Statue of Liberty had on it, it turned out that it was a photo of the Statue of Liberty on top of the New York, New York Casino in Las Vegas.

It was not the actual. And so it turned out that the post office had paid $8 to a company that has stock photography for the rights to this photo, and nobody bothered to check whether it was the real thing or not. So they literally put out a stamp that had the wrong Statue of Liberty on it. And back in the day, if there was a fuck up like that, the Postal Service would have shredded, recalled the run. treaded them all and they would have become highly desirable like they're like eh keep printing

on whatever meanwhile like back in like the 1930s oh if you if you engraved just like a little stamp that was like a one percent a two cent stamp that was like had a picture of like Andrew Jackson on it or something you those guys literally got $100,000 to engrave a stamp like that. In the Depression. In the Depression. Tariq, thanks for the donation. Bosnia, he says, is the ideal solution for the country, is divided up to accommodate three ethnic groups. Dayton, peaceful, but not ideal. Yeah, we've talked about that. Well, we've touched on it a couple of times. Bosnia, I think, would have to be the model. Because if you look at a map Bosnia, it's got all these little islands of, you know, of not Bosnia, whether it's

Republic, I always hated that name. Yeah, me too. Public or whatever else, whatever else they were able to negotiate, that is Serb. It has worked against all odds, and maybe that's the model that the world needs to be thinking about. Could work. Hey, real quick, Ted. Yeah.

We only have about 11 minutes left. So I wanted to raise this whole Galane Maxwell thing. Please. You know, Trump said something yesterday that was very, very disturbing. Somebody asked him if he was going to pardon Galane Maxwell. And he said, disingenuously, he hadn't thought about it. Oh, I haven't heard that name in a long time. He said, yeah, that's a question.

God, the lie. lying. And he knows, I mean, he must know that nobody believes him. But anyway, and then he said, oh, a lot of people ask me for pardons. And then the reporter followed up by shouting, are you considering pardoning her? And he said, well, I haven't heard that name in a long time. I'm going to have to take a look at it. This is a convicted child molester and sex trafficker, child sex trafficker. Let's say he doesn't even partner. Let's say he commutes her sentence, which is just as good, right? Pretty much. What does that do to Donald Trump among Republicans? Because remember, it's the Republicans who think that the government is made up of child molesters

and sex traffickers. Right? And there's this secret cabal that, you know, eats the hearts of children or whatever. What does that do to Trump and his coalition? Robbie, I think Robbie and I agree. Robbie just texted, nothing will destroy Trump's coalition faster than him pardoning her. I agree. I think he's really playing with fire here and maybe he just doesn't even realize it. I think he realizes it and that's why he's dragging his feet. He's rolling Hamas style on this. You know, he's definitely, he knows it's going to fracture. his coalition. He knows it's really, it's fraught. But let me flip this on the other. Let's look at this Rubik's cube from the other side. What happens if he doesn't pardon her? What's the downside for him?

Or commuter sentence? The downside is that somebody out there, and I'm just making this up, somebody out there has documentary evidence that he committed a crime. Let's even assume that the statute of limitations has expired. There's documentary evidence that he was somehow involved with Jeffrey Epstein and it's released. That's the only thing I can think of. Well, she's been transferred to that minimum security facility. Minimum security, despite the fact that if you have been convicted of a sex crime,

you are not eligible to be sent to minimum security. So why? Why did that happen? That was a personal favor. First of all, only the attorney general can order that, right? Or the attorney general on behalf of the president. But the attorney general makes that decision. So, I mean, the obvious answer is there has to be some sort of quid pro quo. It feels like there's some kind of, there's something hanging over Donald Trump.

We don't know what it is. We can guess, but it's, I mean, he could just say, I mean, if there wasn't, why wouldn't he just say, Fucker. Lock her. You know, she's locked up. Throw away the key. See you. See you in 20 years. Bye. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you real, real for those kind comments. I wanted to, you know, I did want to ask you, John. I was very curious what you'd think about this. So I read with great interest in some considerable detail, her appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court. Yes. This was denied yesterday, day before. Which was denied. Frankly, I thought she was wronged. I think she made a good point.

I mean, she was arguing, so basically back in 2008, when Jeffrey Epstein was, you know, basically cut a deal with prosecutors down in Florida for sex crimes, and they agreed not to prosecute him or any of his associates who were involved, that would include her. she claims that she should have therefore been covered on these charges in New York. These are all federal charges. Her lawyer's argument was, if you make a deal, if I, Ted Raul, make a deal with federal prosecutors here in New York City, and I say, and like, I'm, you know, I'm, I'm free to go, you know, you can't, you can't prosecute me for this, that crime, that federal prosecutors

in Oregon shouldn't be able to touch me either because it's one country, it's the United States, it's the federal authority is over the entire country, and the Oregon and the Oregon prosecutors can't say, well, we're the, we're the Oregon district. Like, no, like, I made a deal. You guys made a deal and you said I could walk. I think she's right. She may be, well, she may be like philosophically, but this said no. Yeah. So this is, I mean, to me, this was a political decision on the part of the U.S. Supreme Court. I think they were, they knew, and that's why they didn't issue a formal opinion. Yeah.

It's just sort of like, it's just sort of like, just no. It's like you and I have talked about how we had certain decisions in our cases that basically came down to, if your name is John Curiacu or Ted Raal, this law does not apply to you. So if your name is Ghislane Maxwell, this law does not apply to you. I don't know. I mean, every time something like this happens, John, it always makes me wonder, why do people make deals with the feds? Why do they trust them not to like renege? I mean, look at you.

They reneged with you. They said you were going to a camp. They said you were going to Club Fed. Then you arrive and they're like, fuck you. You're going to the real clink. I mean, everybody hears about these stories. It's like, why on earth? It's like, if I were ever arrested, I'd be like, I don't believe a word you say.

You guys are liars. That's right. That's right. I can tell you why people take a deal. And it's 98% of federal criminal cases end in a plea bargain. And it's because of something called federal sentencing enhancements. So if you turn down a deal and go to trial and are found guilty, they add time to your sentence for what they call failure to accept responsibility. Ridiculous.

Yeah. Isn't that unconstitutional? Because it's punishing you for your decision to avail yourself of your constitutional right to defend yourself. That's right. Yes. You're exactly right. I assume that's been adjudicated, unfortunately. Hey, so Robbie's bringing up another interesting point.

He said we're forgetting about Thomas Massey's bill forcing the release of the Epstein files. Massey announced on social a day or two ago that he has the 218 votes necessary to force the release. And that the real reason that the Republicans are letting the government stay shut down is because that way the House isn't reconvened and and that that's not going to come up for a vote. Wow. He's got the 218. So what we're talking about here is his what's called his discharge petition. These things only come once a decade. When the when the House leadership has a bill bottled up in committee or subcommittee and you wanted to go to the floor of the house for a vote, you have to file a discharge petition which discharges it from the committee usually the rules committee

the rules committee decides what goes to a vote and what doesn't but then it's complicated it used to be that the rules committee was the most powerful committee in the in the house and now it's the speaker that decides what the rules committee releases so but anyway thanks to new gingrich Anyway, if Massey has 218 votes, that's all Democrats and five Republicans. And that means the vote will be likely 218 to 2, I guess it's 16 now because there's still a vacancy. And all of those Jeffrey Epstein documents will be made public. You know, Massey is one of my favorite members of Congress. this guy doesn't give a shit if he gets reelected or not that's great it's great it's it's got to be

liberating oh totally only in getting the truth out there john it's time to wrap things up but before we do let's bring in robbie for one last reminder and push for people who are just joining us hey robbie we see your shoulder it's a beautiful shoulder i love your shoulder it's the best shoulder yeah sorry i was getting tmi ready to go speaking of tmi we are building a network so if you are here on rumble just stay tuned we're going to be rating the tmi show where you get to see more ted roll less john karyaku but you do get to see the beautiful manila chan so it's no there's a win and a loss there's a little toss up there we'll just call it what it is but the biggest reason why i wanted to just come back on is that over on youtube we currently have 225 people watching us on youtube for those of you who tuned in late YouTube has demonetized, deprogrammed. John and Ted get nothing from YouTube anymore. Dangerous content.

We are trying to appeal it, but I mean, let's just be honest. YouTube is big because it's supported by the people who silenced John and Ted in the past. So I am asking you, if you want this show to continue, please follow them on rumble they are fully monetized on rumble they are rumble partners you can donate there you become channel subscribers for five bucks a month see we have started to get money we have started to see money from rumble they have but we need y'all's help because for every one person that's that's watching on rumble there's two or three of you that are watching on youtube we need y'all's help i am working for these guys for free because i've refused to take a dime from them

while they cannot pay their bills and so if i'm able to do that the least you can do is go over and watch here here thank you very much roby west all i've got to say and uh just one quick thing just about epstein will go away if trump wants to destroy the republican party all he has to do is release uh maxwell that will end the republican coalition that will destroy the republican party i promise you as a creature from the right and on that i got to go to t m i okay and so do i we'll be back tomorrow here with uh with d program with ted roll John Kiriaku at 9 a.m. Eastern time, John, watch out for the tarantulas, the snakes, and the mosquitoes, and the hurricanes. But otherwise, it's paradise, yeah?

Yeah, it's wonderful. Wonderful. Bye. Bye-bye. Thank you.