DeProgram with John Kiriakou and Ted Rall - Who Will ICE Kill Next? | DeProgram with Ted Rall and John Kiriakou

Episode Date: January 26, 2026

Political cartoonist Ted Rall and CIA whistleblower John Kiriakou deprogram you from mainstream media every weekday at 9 AM EST. Today we discuss: • Minneapolis Crisis: Americans are turning against Trump and his ICE surge against Minneapolis, where agents executed an unarmed nurse, U.S. citizen Alex Pretti—with no signs of a real investigation in sight over the president’s personal Kent State. Democrats are threatening to close the government later this week over Homeland Security funding. Republican politicians are starting to read the room but most continue to defend ICE. ICE offers to leave Minneapolis in exchange for voter records—what’s that about? • Military top brass purged in China. • Rafah border crossing reopened: Will Israel make it a one-way trip?JOIN US LIVE ON RUMBLE!https://rumble.com/c/DeProgramShowFOLLOW TED:https://rall.com/https://x.com/tedrallFOLLOW JOHN:https://www.instagram.com/realjohnkiriakouhttps://x.com/JohnKiriakouLISTEN ON SPOTIFY:https://open.spotify.com/show/2kdFlw2w8sSPhKI8NRx8ZuLISTEN ON APPLE MUSIC:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/deprogram-with-john-kiriakou-and-ted-rall

Good morning if you're not shoveling out your driveway right now. Welcome to D-Program with Ted Rall and John Kirooku. It's Monday, January 26th. Thank you so much for joining us. Good morning, John. Nice to see you. Nice to see you, man, but this snow situation is just not for me. Look at my hair.

And I didn't shave or anything. Yeah, no, I feel you for sure. So, but at least we're not. in Minneapolis where it's hot and cold at the same time. And yeah, we're not in danger so much of getting shot today as we would be in Minneapolis. Probably not. No, probably not.

So we'll be getting into, we'll dig it deep into Minneapolis. Of course, the military purge in China. And some breaking news out of Gaza, Israel has reopened or is reopening the Rafah border crossing to Egypt, what does that mean? The Israelis are not promising that this is a two-way trip if you choose to avail yourself of this crossing. You may not be permitted to return home. John, should we do some questions? Maybe we should just launch into Minneapolis. I mean, I got to say, I mean, so obviously, I mean, in a way, you can't even make this stuff up, right? First, they shot a woman named Good.

Now they shot a guy named Pretty. You know, what's next? Maybe the ice guys start to rename, have to start renaming themselves as like asshole or shithead. Yeah. So anyway, the thing is the, you know, you're starting to see the crack starting to form. I mean, the administration and its allies have been stonewalling,

like crazy for the last, like, few weeks as this crisis has spun out of control. All they've done is added more fuel to the fire by sending in more ice agents to Minneapolis where they are obviously not doing a good job, to say the least. And so now, you know, the usual stonewalling just doesn't seem to be working anymore. Republicans are started in the House of Representatives and in the Senate are starting to make threats about possibly causing a government shutdown on Saturday, January 31st, right? They're going to... Senator.

They wanted to withhold funding. They wanted to a la carte it and just have a vote where they could vote for the whole budget except for Homeland Security, but then they decided not to... The Republican said, no, we will not do that. You either vote for the whole thing or you don't vote at all. Looks like, I mean, I don't know. The way that they caved on the ACA subsidies, who knows. if the Democrats are capable of following through on a threat.

But, you know, the point is you can definitely see the narrative changing. The New York Post, which is Rupert Murdoch's right-wing Oregon in New York, you know, over the weekend, they literally, on a couple of occasions, stopped covering the story in Minneapolis, even though it's obviously the lead story in the nation in every media outlet. And today, their lead story is about Minneapolis, and it's all right-wingers and Republicans basically calling for investigations or saying that I should leave Minneapolis.

I mean, clearly they have lost this narrative. I mean, I think this feels like a Kent State moment for the administration. You took the words right out of my mouth. This is Governor Rhodes and Kent State all over again. And I want to add, too, that if it looks like a cover-up and it smells like a cover-up, it's cover-up. But the thing is, is there's no statute of limitations on murder. And so Donald Trump can pretend all he wants that this guy pretty was the aggressor.

We watched the video. This guy was executed in cold blood in full view of 100 people. And it's on tape. And so Donald Trump's not going to be president forever. Eventually, the state is going to be allowed or be able to conduct an investigation, a real investigation. The FBI is going to be ordered to cooperate. ICE is going to be ordered to cooperate and people are going to go to prison. But it's going to be hard, right, for prosecutors and investigators.

Evidence has been, has disappeared, will have disappeared, it will have been destroyed. Witnesses will have moved away, been hard to locate, will have died. Yes. But, yeah, I mean, so, I mean, by the way, I mean, my take on, what happened here is that, you know, there's basically up to 10 ice guys, you know, basically on top of this dude. He never pulled his gun ever, despite what the, what Republicans keep saying on social media. He just, there's no brand, you know, if you bring the gun and you brand your stuff, the cops, they can shoot you. Sure, agreed, but he didn't. And so,

um, so anyway, the, um, he's, so my take is he, they take the gun away from him. And because these are not cops and they're not trained properly. They don't scream. The guy doesn't, who takes the gun, should shout clear, but he doesn't. There's not, you know, and instead someone, maybe him, maybe someone else shouts, gun, probably another one. And at that point, they all open fire because they think they're under threat. And when they open fire, man, they don't shoot once. No.

They shoot 10. Yeah. The guy's lying on his stomach. You know, he's clearly been disarmed and he never made a move for his gun. I don't think he would have made him, and no matter what, you know, Secretary Nome says, there's no way that he was going to, you know, his intent was to confront law enforcement. You know, his intent, he was there. He was recording, like a lot of other people.

And then he was shocked when an ICE agent gratuitously, brutally, viciously, shoved this woman for no reason whatsoever. She's just standing there. I mean, she's not in his way. He's not trying to get past her. You know, she doesn't bug him. You know, this is for fun that they shove her. And so he's shocked.

And like any red-blooded American man who is raised to defend women properly, he tries to intercede and then they go after him. It's exactly what happened. And, you know, another thing, too, is that Minnesota is a concealed carry state. He was perfectly within his rights to have that gun on him. It is his constitutional right to have a gun on him.

By the way, what is it, is the Second Amendment, is the right now trying to argue that the Second Amendment only applies if you're a right-wing Republican? Exactly. Because, I mean, it seems like that's what they're arguing. Kyle Rittenhouse, you know, showed up with an AR-15 long gun at a protest. You know, he crossed state lines. he didn't even bring his own gun, okay? He didn't have any permit at all to have it anyway, but he's a hero to the right.

You know, right wingers brought guns to the Charlottesville protesters, protests, the unite the right. They argued this is totally, I know it's a little creepy, but it's our right. It's our Second Amendment. So how come the second, I mean, are they so retarded that they don't know that if the Second Amendment can be stripped away for liberals, it can be stripped away for them too? You know, after George Floyd was killed, I tweeted, and I did this, you know, in a moment of anger, I said, I urge every black man in America to arm himself immediately. And the fallout was ridiculous.

Black people threatened. The right to arm themselves? Exactly. It is their importance to be able to. They probably need it more than the rest of us do. But it comes back to your point that for many on the right, it's okay for them to be armed. They don't want first and second amendment rights. They don't want anyone else to have them.

Exactly. But it's either for all of us or it's for none of us. Yes. The state would love to get rid of the Second Amendment. They would love it. Yes, indeed. I mean, you know, right wingers who play that narrative, like, well, don't bring a gun to a, I mean, there's many, you know, there's many possibilities.

I mean, I'm sure lots of people in that crowd had guns. I mean, it's Minneapolis. It's Minneapolis. They're hunters there. Yeah. You know, a lot of people hunt. Yeah. And Minneapolis can be a sketchy city.

There's a lot of carjacking. I mean, it's not a bad idea to carry a gun. You know, my brother once, my brother lived in Minneapolis for nine years. My sister lived there for 15 years. And I used to go up to visit them in the summertime. My brother played a gig one time. This is before he became famous and rich. He played a gig and he stopped at a gas station at like 2,

2.30 in the morning to get gas. And he went inside to pay. You couldn't pay it to pump in those days. He went inside to pay. And there was a woman behind the register and she was just standing there. And she appeared to be very frightened. And there was a guy standing off to the side just kind of standing there. And my brother whispered to her, are you okay?

and she just nodded and he said, do you want me to call the cops? And she went like this. As soon as my brother drove away, that man killed her. Oh, Jesus Christ. He was her estranged boyfriend. She had broken up with him.

He hunted her down at her place of work and he killed her. My brother was identified through the security cameras and ended up having to testify at the trial. And while he was on the stand, the guy just screamed out. from the defendant's table. I should have killed you when I had the chance. That must have really helped with the jury.

Guilty. Yeah, good. I hope he never gets out. Minneapolis is like any other big city. It's got serious problems. Yeah, yeah. By the way, Ron Kuby, the famous left-wing attorney, friend of mine, on my Facebook, he said, you know, I'm thinking that now the Minneapolis police has an ethical duty

to use deadly force if necessary to defend the citizens of Minneapolis against ICE. I mean, if ICE is gratuitously gunning people down, you know, I mean, I think he's right. I think the- I have to agree. I mean, you know, basically ICE, you can't view them anymore as like, well, they're not really law enforcement officers. They're criminals. No, they are. And, you know, it's- They're the rioters here, by the way.

I love how basically Fox News keeps saying rioters. And then they'll show the video of a crowd. And there's no flames. No one's even running. People are standing still. I mean, have they forgotten what riots look like? I know what riots look like. L.A. was a riot.

That's not a riot. Got that right. Yeah. These are peaceful protests. And, you know, the founding fathers gave us the Second Amendment to protect ourselves against tyranny, including government tyranny. especially government tyranny. Especially.

Yeah. All right. Let's show. I know Robbie has a few thoughts about this. He doesn't. And I think we should bring him in. If he wants to talk about it. Who me?

No, never. No, it's not like I have opinions. I was watching a lot of the videos for what happened with this guy. And I know that he was carrying a sig. And most sigs do not have. safety. A lot of them, several models do. Most of them don't. They kind of go along with the Glock model. Yeah, there's even been some lawsuits about this. Well, I mean, it just depends on how

proficient you are with, though, with firearms. But I, I have a Jericho 941. It's the Desert Eagle, know, that, that John wants to get. I've got mine in 40 because of them in Montana. We've got bears. Nine millimeters. It's going to piss a bear off. A 40 will do the job. That's right. the reason why I bring this up is that whenever you carry a simionic a semiomatic pistol, the default once you put the magazine in is that you have one round in the chamber and then the course note the magazine is full. If your gun has a safety, you turn the safety on this is called condition two. If you don't have a safety, you're not acting condition three.

So what means is you pull the trigger, it goes off. It looked like what happens at the ice guy who disarmed. this pretty guy had no trigger discipline. His glove was right there on the trigger guard. He discharged the gun. He shot the pistol. That's the first shot that you heard. Then the ice guys lit this guy up for no reason at all.

The fact that the Trump administration is lying about this, and they are lying about this. And they could have just said if they were properly trained. They didn't give him a chance, like, sir, could you please hand over your firearm? The guy snatched it, right? Well, of course. Well, see, here's a big part of the problem.

I support what ICE is doing. We need mass deportations, like to the scales of hundreds of millions of these people need to go away. That's my, that's my stand. There are not hundreds of millions of things. Figure it out. Millions then.

We'll round it down. Millions then. Fair enough. So if you can be a deportation hawk like I am and not have a militarized police, force if you are if you're a cop but you're dressed like a soldier and you're trained like a soldier beside you're trained at all and if you're armed like a soldier you're going to act like a soldier soldiers don't make good cops that's the whole problem that's the issue and the fact that trump

and his alkaliats on right wing media are going out and saying they sound like gun control democrats well why you can't take the gun to a protest because it's my right as an American citizen. That's why. If you don't exercise the right, you lose it. That's the whole point. And the fact that Trump is pushing this, it's lost some gun owners of America. It's lost him to NRA. He is blowing up what's left of his coalition. And it's really starting to show who are just Republicans and real honest to God right wingers who actually value what the Constitution says. Jack Persobic. is a complete sellout. Matt Walsh, same thing. They go, they pretend like their small government,

right wingers, they want to be me. They're not me. These are Republican sycophants, and you can tell it by their rhetoric. I have a message for the right wingers, right? And I just tweeted this out this morning. Like, listen, I know you don't want to become Democrats to fight. This is a fascist state. It's a state that is rising into fascism. It's feeling and looking like Germany in 1933, 1934. where you still had the veneer of like constitutional law that they inherited. You still have the old judges. You still have the courts, the cops. But you're ignoring those laws because you now want to do whatever you want to do.

That's the rise of fascism. It's state violence, right? Like if you want to fight that and be against that, you don't have to become a Democrat. You have to become a leftist. And they're not the same. But you don't have to become a Democrat. I'm not a Democrat. Become a leftist.

Well, here's the big problem, though, Ted. Is it people on your side of the aisle have been calling people like me on my side of all Nazis. No, we haven't. Not us. That was the Democrats. Okay. Well, then y'all need to do a better job with your branding. Believe me. Here's where we are.

The biggest enemy of the left. They're worse than the right. But see, I mean, here's the biggest problem, though. Is like, for example, let's say we go to the Ted Rolls model. We abolish ice. What happens next? Just great. I'm not saying. No, no, no. Just so you know. Like, if the Soviet Union, you know,

communist you know a socialist country they vigorously defended their borders and deported illegal aliens and you might say nobody snuck in oh people snuck in no they did for sure from places like Afghanistan and they were like and you're not a nation state unless you have you need some sort of entity that does what ice does but just not the way they're doing it i agree but i'll tell you right now the reason why so many people on the right are willing to give people to give ICE a pass, at least up until now before that Trump shows real colors and showed that he's not only a moron, but he's a fascist, is. And he surrounded himself with fascists, which is actually more concerning.

For sure. I mean, he doesn't have anyone that disagrees with him. The issue that we have is, let's just assume that ICE gets defunded, everything else happens. What happens to the migrants that are here? Reagan gave us an amnesty 40 years ago, and things have only gotten worse. worse. If you're if you're on the right like me, you see this as the one chance, the only shot that we have to get mass deportations. That's such a crock, Robbie. Obama deported far, far more people than Donald Trump ever deported. And you guys were unhappy then. Because he didn't report enough.

He deported a factor of how many times more than what Trump deported. I agree with you. And that's one That's one of the things I asked Ted on Twitter yesterday is that where were the lefties protesting when Obama was doing this? Or he'd get a pass because of his skin color. Yeah, no. Well, maybe. Maybe he did. No, I agree that you got to follow the law here. There's a way to emigrate to this country.

And it's got to be within the confines of the law. But Obama was the deporter in chief. And we're not talking about deportations. This isn't a question of deportations. It's a question of federal overreach. No, I agree. Oh, I'm right there with you. But I'm telling you right now, though, this is why that a lot of people...

But Donald Trump has completely... He has shot you in the back in the same way that he shot Alex Prattie because he has discredited the anti-immigrant nativist, you know, nationalist, whatever you want to call it, the idea to put America first. He's discredited that whole idea with the, you know, by the... you know, by basically creating ICE not as a deportation force, but as a goon squad. I agree. And there needs to be major reforms.

This is someone who wants, I want every single immigrant in this country deported. I don't really think Donald Trump cares that much about deporting illegal immigrants. I think Donald Trump cares about, you know, waving his dick around and telling other people what to do and making everyone scared the scared to death of him and his government. And I wish I could say you're wrong, but you're not. I think that you're right. I think what this is is that Trump just wants to whatever reason, he wants to just, he wants a strong centralized federal executive.

That's what he wants. And as a right winger, that's the absolute last thing that I want. And as John pointed out for last week, you know, before the weekend about his meeting with Ilan Homer, you know, the Democrats are salivating.

That's what you said, John. They're salivating to inherit. at this, you know, executive, powerful, imperial executive branch. They won't change anything. Hey, guys, we need to thank some people here. So Don, so don't. Thank you. Thank you for $50.

He says, John Ted, good morning. What would we rebuild public trust for this administration right now? I feel sick to my stomach about this. And I feel so it's going to get worse because of who the president has in his ear. This is true and said. Absolutely. totally, totally completely agree. Well, let's answer his question.

What would we build trust? Well, first of all, as, you know, it's a cliche for a reason because it's true. You know, trust is hard to build and easy to destroy. Look, I think the credibility of the administration is in the toilet. And I think that the crisis management response here would be twofold if I'm advising the president. It would be, first of all, come clean, be JFK after the, the Bay of Pigs, go to the American people and just say, I was rotten. My people and I, we lied. We weren't fair. It's got to change. We can't go after it. We can't treat people like this.

That doesn't mean anything about, but we still, the policy is still the policy, but we're going to do it better. I think also he's got a, some heads got a roll. He's got to probably get rid of the press secretary and Christy Noem. And firmware, thank you for $5. There are per DHS, million so-called illegals in the U.S., 330 million citizens. That's less than 3%. This is a non-problem, but is used to elicit hatred. I have to agree. I don't know that it's a non-problem.

I mean, you know, 3% can really affect the unemployment rate, if you think about it, right? I mean, the unemployment rate, the official unemployment rate is around 4%. Right? I mean, 3% is not insignificant. Yeah, but also consider, I agree, but also consider how many of those jobs are jobs that Americans just simply won't take. I know Robbie has disagreed with me on this in the past. Yeah, I'm on team Robbie here. How many Americans are willing to pick fruit in the fields in California or work in the Purdue plants in North Carolina?

You got to pay them, John. Pay them. I mean, it's like anything. I mean, I don't understand. Like, you know, hey, I would love my own hovercraft, but, you know, I can't afford one, so I don't have one. Well, if, and if I'm an employee, if I want to start a business, you know, let's say I'm a farmer, I want to hire, I want to have strawberries picked. Well, it's like, and I want to hire dudes to do it. I got to pay, I got to, I got to find out what is the minimum amount of money that people will take to do that for me.

How is that, you know, so if you, and if you can't afford that, then you can't afford to farm the end. Yeah, but then it's the same people who are going to bitch you about how. about food prices well i mean prices will go up with uh you know more expensive labor that's inevitable right now though the issue is that prices are going up but wages aren't i mean that's that's the whole issue i don't think immigration is the only reason here i think it's i think it's a tertiary reason at best but it's still you know it's a contributing factor i mean the thing is it look it here's here's a truism right it is my entire life it has always been hard to find a job in the united states of any kind, no matter how well-educated or, you know, or charming or anything you are, getting work

is hard. Getting good work is almost impossible. Getting work that allows you to pay your bills and maybe save, almost impossible, more impossible than that. That's always been true. So you put people in that situation, and people might be like, well, we're all in it together. That's just how it is. But when you start importing foreigners and then you're competing against them, that makes, you people see red. That's why they're so pissed. And one thing I want to point out here, because I see a lot of comments of people calling me a racist. I want to make something incredibly clear here. My stance on immigration has absolutely nothing to do with the color of your skin.

I don't care if you're mass importing people from Poland or from Germany. As long as you have one underemployed or unemployed American wants a job, the last thing you should do is be importing, you know, how many, tens of thousands or whatever, whatever the number is, who the hell knows at this point to compete with those Americans trying to get that work.

That's the whole issue. For me, it's economic. We have Americans living under every single bridge in this country. We have Americans who are under-employed. We have Americans who are working two or three jobs because they can't make enough to... Three of them are right here, by the way.

This has nothing to do with race. This has to do with rebuilding the American worker. Listen, here's the whole issue. NAFTA hollowed out the entire middle of the country. Immigration hollowed out the southern agricultural field. So you have all this, so you have all these people who are coming in legally and illegally. Corporations want it because they want to drive them the wages.

Now, one thing that needs to be, that needs to be brought up, I think if you're an employer and if you hire an illegal, you should go to prison. I mean that sincerely. I don't have a problem with that. Because you are ripping off, you're ripping off everybody. You're ripping the government's up, the government's not getting taxes. He's going to prison for a lot less. I'm looking at one of them right now. So, I mean, this is not just on the migrant.

No, I understand the impetus of wanting to come in and get a better life for your person, that the country that you live in sucks. Yeah, that's my disagree with me, Robbie, is that you seem to not always be sympathetic to the fact that. Because I'm not. Those people are being used. and cheated and exploited just like the rest of us. I agree. And that's why I have no problem at all with throwing the business owners into the gulag.

Maybe send them to the tender embrace of North West Montana or to the Tundra of Alaska. Supply side prosecutingomics. Yeah. I mean, make it happen. But the point of case is that we keep the argument that John, you just made, these are people who are doing jobs that Americans won't do. It's because you're not paying the Americans to do the jobs. Are wages, will prices go up if you start paying people what they're worth? The answer is yes.

But do else you want to go up? Wages. And right now, that's the problem. This is not a racial argument. This is not a racial thing. This has to do with economics. We are importing. How many thousands of coders do you need to have from India to come in, do jobs?

I don't know. That drives me absolutely. Are Americans too stupid to code? That's inexcusable. Yeah. Are Americans too stupid to work on farms? No, they're not. Some of them are just the sin of being over 35 years old, so Silicon Valley won't hire them.

Yeah. And calling me a racist isn't really winning the argument. What you're doing is that you're proving that you can't compete with mine. Robbie, thank you very much. We welcome to see you again. Let me know if we have an ad. Okay, so we got some more comments to get through here. John McIre, great question for you, John.

I see that some ice agents are taking the whistles and words personally. And respond as they would in a bar fight, John, what kind of training did you receive to not take things personally? And it's so true, right? Like, I mean, and that's by the way, one of the facts is the one of the Fox people say like, you know, they call them names. They're under a lot of pressure. Talk about snowflakes. But, I mean, they're babies, right? But it's like, okay, but it's true.

I mean, you've got to get training to be like to let it, you know, let it roll off. like you know like the off the of the feathers of a duck so yeah what what did you did you get training yeah the the training was to run run away seriously they used to tell us all the time get off the x if you feel like you are being drawn into something that could spin out of control or put you in over your head run away and they would just beat this into us there is no shame in running because what's the alternative? You shoot somebody in the head? I remember one instructor saying,

or they shoot you. Or they shoot you even worse. I remember one instructor saying, do you have any idea how much paperwork is involved when you shoot someone? Exactly. That's very true. Yeah, get off the X and get out.

That was the training. Thank you very much for the 50 bucks, John McIre. I should take a page, the IRS, the IRS jails 500 people a year. Every year they could like more money than owed. If the IRS started hauling old ladies in for unclaimed bingo winnings, they would lose their mandate. Paperwork is more powerful than physical force.

And that's how this was pretty much done, right? I mean, until now. I mean, it's not like we, like you pointed out, John, under Obama, many more people were deported. This was handled administratively. I mean, and like you can, if people run away, you know, like you would say, you can catch them. I mean, we live in a surveillance state.

We have license plate trackers. We have facial recognition software all over the place. I mean, most illegal immigrants, you know, commit real crimes at a lower rate than American citizens. So it's like they're not really dangerous to have them out on the lamb. Just like pick them up later when you have the chance. Yes, it's true. Also, another thing is if you're going to deport people, I think they're more deport people. I think they're more deportable if they know, like, you would give them three months to, like, finalize their affairs and sell their stuff and ship stuff home rather than think they're going to be snatched off the street at a moment's notice while their kid is in school waiting for you to pick them up, you know?

Yeah, that's rough. So, thanks for the 1999. The reason why Obama deported so many is because many of them had a final order of deportation. ERO wasn't picking people up from the car wash. they were deporting criminal aliens who had extensive criminal records. I mean, more so than this, yes, although not exclusively by any means. And that was the theory of the Obama policy. That's right.

Why do you think, Ted, why do you think that there wasn't really much in the way of an objection when Obama was due? I remember when Obama was deporting all these people. And people, even back then, were calling him the deporter in chief. And nobody really seemed to care. Why was that? I think there was a lot. I think there's hidden nativism among liberals, too, who feel like Robbie does about like they don't like competing with these people for jobs. But, you know, the victims, the deportees, they were Latino, like overwhelmingly, right? And white America didn't care. And also, look, when a Democrat is the president, the brunch Democrats don't say shit about the abuses or anything nasty that the Democrat does.

They didn't say shit. You know, the same people who are pissed off about the Venezuelan boat dronings gave no shit about the Wazir Astani, you know, car dronings, right? Yeah. They did not care. And so basically, like, when your guy that you voted for is the president, you just basically close your eyes, you turn a blind eye to everything they do. And then you scream about the very same things when the other guy becomes president. It's team politics. I fucking hate it.

I don't know if there's any way to get rid of it, but it's just like we're stuck with it. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Accident. Thanks so much. Is that Swedish, Swedish, Corona? I think it is.

I think it is. I always think is that Swedish or is that Senegalese. Anyway, thanks for the 200, whatever they are. It must be Sweden. As a European working in border policing and a regular migration, I'm quite appalled by what's happening in the U.S. and how ICE operates. Right now, even our citizens. civilian border guards have a longer training than the ICE agents. And, you know, I love the fact that they

chose the 47 day training period because Trump is the 47th president. I'm like, you know, by the way, I wouldn't have a problem if they had chosen 47 months. Four years isn't really too long, I don't think. I mean, you know, you send, you need four years to graduate with an English degree with a bachelor's. You know, I mean, you need three years to go to law school. You need longer training to become a barber. Right? Yeah, that's true. I mean, beauty school requires, yeah, beautician school requires less time. Tarif, thanks for the fiber. I know you touched base on it, but shocked, but how shocked were you with Carney's, Mark Carney from Canada, his Davos speech? Was it lip service to us Canadians, or is it a changing of the tide? I'm really glad he asked that question.

That's a good question. What did you think of Mark Carney's kind of uncharacterious? un-Canadian-like, fuck you to the U.S. It was sharp. I don't think it was just to drill Donald Trump. I think that I think that Carney really is laying out a separate path. I think that the underlying message is that the United States cannot be trusted as a long-term partner anymore. And so it's time for Canada to start looking out for Canada. and if that means closer trade ties with China,

then there will be closer trade ties with China. And don't forget that regardless of who happens to be in the White House, whether it's a Democrat or Republican, we have put all kinds of pressure on the Chinese to essentially wreck their relations with China. I'm sorry, we've been putting this pressure on the Canadians to wreck their relations with China because it's good for U.S. policy. You know, we want the Canadians, for example,

to grab the CFO of Huawei and charge her with some kind of stupid computer hacking charge or whatever it happened to be. And then keep her in house arrest for three years and then say, okay, you can you can trade her for something else. The Canadians are tired of being used as a bargaining chip for U.S. China relations. I also took it as a wake-up call to other. Absolutely. This was a slap at the Americans. And it's about time that Canada took that swing. Yeah, but I thought also it was like to the Europeans and the rest of the world, like, wake up.

Yeah. Things are not the way they've always been. Yeah. We've got to do it differently from now on. All right. We've got an ad, John. So I'm going to go ahead and read that. Still haven't tried 1775 coffee.

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Bold beans, clean fuel, and a morning routine that stands for something just like Rumble does. Okay. firmware 10 bucks thanks much humans react to the gut not the head just to ask edward bernays josephirbles joe mccarthy etc good people like robbie are being used by neo-fascists to create divisions and facilitate evil i don't know about people like robbie i think robbie understands what's going on robbie just disagrees with us that's that's well i think rob he's just like he's he's i'll let robbie speak for himself robbie you correct me if i'm wrong but my my my

take is you want to see mass deportations, but you're not happy about the way this is going, and you're kind of hoping that somehow the mass deportation regime can be saved without, I mean, just, I mean, the hearts and minds of the American people here. Bob Gorell, editorial cartoons, right winger, he was on Facebook yesterday. I was reading, older guy, and very right wing. And he said, look, I remember, I remember Mili. It's like, once the, he's like, I supported the war, but once the hearts and minds of the American people have turned against you, there's.

nothing you can fucking do. And this is one of those moments. I mean, I think that's what you're kind of like worried about here. Yeah. I mean, I want mass street deportations, but not the expense of a police state. I mean, if I got, if I got one of the other, I would rather just let just let wages continue to stagnant and just let the American economy implode and they'll just self-correct. I don't want to live on. Open the borders.

You'll take open borders. Yeah, because at the end of the day. So you're not being used. No, I mean, it's a fundamental disagreement. Of the three people here on this panel, I'm the only one that's probably lost a job due to illegal immigration. I think that's probably fair to say. Although we don't know about jobs we haven't been offered because of illegal immigration, right. That's a great unknown.

That's something that you'll never know. Another thing I'd like to point out is that immigration disproportionately hurts black people because those immigrants are competing with jobs. that typically went to black Americans. Yeah. I mean, that's no work. That's undeniably a fact. I have a black wife. I know that's going to surprise some of y'all who think I'm a white supremacist or something,

but I mean, it is what it is. For me, this is not racial. Which means you live in a black supremac household. Oh, we have some pretty wild discussions. I mean, Ted, you've been here. I have. I mean, it's wild. But, I mean, what the American people have lost.

the ability and and this really really hurts we have lost the ability to reach across the aisle in a populist way and discuss things that actually can it will affect the lives of every single american regardless of race or creed and we sacrificed on the altar of racism and the intellectual dishonesty oh i i won't wait just to go by my son i want to be able to one day be able to buy a house Yeah. You can't do that now. Yeah. I hear you. Listen, if you're trying to push a 50-year mortgage because there's enough inventory and you're importing tens of thousands of people, you know, they'll get me started on that inventory. We don't need to build more houses.

All right. Thanks, Robbie. Anyway, okay. So, Brad Weir, thanks for the fiber. How much does the military industrial complex contribute to inflation and the debasement of our currency? That's a super complicated question. That's a good question. You know, I'm not an economist, of course, and you probably have a better mind for economics than I do. But it seems to me that when the military industrial complex makes so many new millionaires, that is going to fuel inflation, especially in things like real estate.

You know, I've said before that 20 years ago, I was. middle, middle class. My new wife was middle, middle class, and we bought a house in a, in a middle, middle class area of Arlington, Virginia. We tore it down, and we built a nice house in which to raise our family. Well, now, in our neighborhood, the average house, which is the tear down that we bought, is $2.4 million. If you want a house like what we built, It's 3.2 million. My children will never be able to live in the neighborhood in which they grew up. It's not possible.

And it's not going to turn around. It's not like housing prices are going to come down. No. No, if that happens, I mean, I would love that to happen, except for the fact that it would mean we're in a depression. That's right. That's right. So, yeah, it's like as soon as the planes hit those towers and the Pentagon, everybody started getting rich. in the Washington area.

I mean, the problem with, I mean, in a broad macroeconomic sense, right, the problem with military, with militarism is that you're allocating societal resources into products that have very low or negative value added. I mean, you know, like, for example, you sell a car. Well, that's value added. People use that car. And actually, you know, someone who buys a car might make more money because they could, for example, get a job that they can drive that car to.

But you build a predator drone, it's going to go obsolete within a few years. And the hellfire missiles that it fires are either going to be blown up somewhere or are going to, again, become obsolete. And then they're going to go into a landfill and pollute the earth. And then there's obviously to the extent that deficit spending contributes to inflation, which is not 100% true, but it's partly true. I mean, God, I mean, half of all deficit spending in this country is caused by the military industrial complex, maybe more, at least, right? At least half the federal budget. So, I mean, it's for sure it's having an inflationary effect. Hey, you, thanks for the five bucks.

Loved your appearance on tinfoil hat, John. Followed you here because of that. Keep exposing the truth, corruption, and siops. I appreciate you. firmware five bucks. Not true, Robbie. I've lost jobs to Asian immigrants. jobs because Asian labor is cheaper. Very true. True. Unsung Pat, five bucks. Any thoughts on

Macron's agent, agent Smith, impersonation speech? I've been thinking about it and I conclude that he had a he had a Shiner courtesy of Mrs. Macron. I mean you think that's true, huh? It's either that or he has this thing that you know, I have this like sunburn. on the retina thing. But you don't have to have, you don't have to look like Joe Biden with the, with the aviator, dark aviator glasses to handle that. Just like you can just have tinted lens or graduated lens like I have that'll take care of that. Ask an ophthalmologist. So it's like it's either, look, he either has an eye problem or he's got something he's covering up. Those are the two possibilities. So, you know, I think odds of eye problem, low, you know,

We know that he gets hit by Mrs. Macron. I mean, she punches him. She slaps him. He should divorce her ass. And I mean this very seriously, sincerely. He should divorce her ass, make a public statement, and basically create a moment that represents for abused men. And honestly, we need that.

Can you imagine what a scandal that would be? It'd be great. I mean, we need that moment. We need like the, you know, the magic John. I have AIDS moment, you know, which made it like, oh, people with AIDS aren't, you know, aren't to be reviled anymore. Right. Because if Magic Johnson, he's too charming. We can't, we can't hate Magic Johnson, even if we don't really quite believe his story about how he got it. You know, I mean, it's like that, I don't know. I, what do you think, John? What do you think happened there?

Honestly, I think she hits him. Yeah. Yeah. I do. I think she hits him. him. And I never, I never believe that until, until the scene at the top of the airplane steps. It was clearly she was hitting him. It was clear, I should say, that he was hitting him. So yeah, I think he's an abused spouse. Can you imagine you're the president of the, what is it, the Fifth Republic or whatever they called himself. Well, the president himself, he's a major world leader and his wife hates on him. Yeah, not to mention also, he's younger and better looking than she is.

Yeah. though. He's a great looking guy. He's a very, very handsome man. That's right. I mean, that's probably why she hits him, right? So he doesn't like get too big for his bridges and run off with like some, you know, hot like singer-santeuse, which is what he should do. Yeah, that's right.

Chess sniper, 10 bucks. Thanks very much. Robbie's wrong about immigration. I have benefited greatly from German immigrants who taught me a lot about engineering. They had to be imported because the Americans couldn't do the job. or keep up. Look, I love the immigrants that I've met. My mother is an immigrant. Okay. I mean, it's like, that's not the issue here. I mean, Robbie's argument is that it's, it's just that immigration is used to depress American wages. And that's true. I mean, you know, I mean,

I'm, I wish there was a way to have immigration and not fuck over American workers. But this goes back to that idea that George W. Bush had, that he was negotiating, with Vicente Fox, the president of Mexico in the days before 9-11, the months before 9-11, where we would begin granting these nine-month work visas, mostly for menial work, they would pay taxes and have to go back for three months to their home countries and reapply. Yeah. That's, we should be, we should have renegotiated that, you know, over the last. That's a better model.

I have a feeling that people like Robbie would not be. psyched about it, but it would certainly be an improvement. Craig advanced, Ted, you managed not to get into building more houses to fight the cost. Well, get into it at LOL. We rent and are getting kicked out of our house so they can knock down our 1940s bungalow. I mean, all I'm trying to say is there are tens of millions of abandoned units in the United States. You know, they should be seized under eminent domain and given to Americans who need a home.

Maybe I would say I love deals where it's like, you get this house. house for $100. We're going to come back in five years and you better have renovated it. And if you haven't, we're taking it away from you and giving it to someone who can. But, I mean, give people a chance. Like, by the way, no property taxes on that. I mean, we have so much.

It's unconscionable to be building new houses from an ecological standpoint when you've got so much, so many abandoned buildings all over the place. Yeah. Yeah, it's great. Let's see. Robbie, the problem, this is from number six. The problem isn't immigrants. The problem is that billionaires have sold you the paradigm that the immigrants took

our jobs. Billionaires are the problem, fix it. Well, that's true too. That's totally true. Yeah. Okay. Gregory Bada, CFA, there's a lot of high-paying tech jobs that Americans can't do because we don't have the education for them.

The Chinese and the Indians are far more advanced in that sector. We have to import talent. Okay, listen, I don't believe. leave that because we have lots of under-employed STEM graduates and people. But even if that were true, why in China and India, they don't treat college as a luxury commodity like a fucking Lexus. It's like it's a, you know, it's a necessity and it's affordable and it's accessible to anybody who is smart enough to get to pass the admissions exam. We don't do that here. I mean, so maybe make college free or at least very affordable.

you know, before you start, like, it's ridiculous. Like, we don't let people get a college education. So they're working at a fucking gas station instead of at Google where they belong. The whole thing is it's fucked up. So we should hit some international stuff. One question here. Any updates on Iran? We should talk about Iran.

Yeah, we should talk about Iran. The USS Abraham Lincoln Carrier Battle Group is in the Arabian Sea off the coast of Oman. I genuinely fear what's going to happen in the coming weeks. I really do. A big distraction from Minnesota. Big, big distraction from Minnesota and from the Epstein files, which everybody forgot existed. True.

And that was the plan. So I think that I think that the Israelis and the Americans, genuinely smell blood in the water. And they believe rightly or wrongly that all the Iranian government needs is a gentle shove to collapse upon itself. That's not going to be the case. No.

Exactly. There are 150,000 members of the IRGC, the Iran Revolutionary Guard Corps. They are the backbone of Iranian national security. And if the Israelis and the Americans think that once they give Iran this little shove, that people are going to rise up and overthrow the regime, that is not real life. We're going to be seen as invaders and attackers, and it's going to unite Iranians against us and to unite them against their Israeli attackers.

Nothing good is going to come of this. No, I agree with that. We have other stuff to hit to Nicholas Franco's, Ted, would you say Afghanistan is a safer place than Minneapolis right now? Honestly, yeah, under the Taliban. Afghanistan is safe. I mean, really, truly. Yeah. By the way, we should talk about Israel. So Israel has reopened the border crossing between the Gaza Strip and Egypt, the Rafah crossing.

And there's, details are thin. But basically, the Israelis have been asked, like, well, first of all, it's for pedestrian traffic only. Yes. No vehicles. Why would that be? Is that just because that way there's, you don't have to, it doesn't take as much time to inspect people or? No, no smuggling. They'd have to dismantle every car coming in looking for, for weapons and ammunition.

So, and then the thing is that for people leaving Gaza, they're not being given any assurances that they would be allowed to return to the, occupied territory there. You know, if you're Palestinian, you're probably not taking this offer. Yeah, I agree. They don't get anything out of it. Okay, so maybe they get to go to Egypt for the day. What's to guarantee that the Israelis are going to allow them back in?

I would say I'd be highly skeptical. Highly. Thanks for the 20 bucks from John McGuire, 40 years of manufacturing management and C-suite. immigrants legal or illegal are not taking your jobs now. It's automation and AI. I look forward to seeing people protesting robots. Yeah, it's going to happen.

That's the future right there. Yeah. I mean, statistically, it's already happening, yeah, for sure. Yeah. I wish I had glasses that attached to my headphones to be much easier. Robbie the white nationalist says Matthew C. Nobody protested Obama because his policy wasn't violence against U.S. citizens go back to Europe, Robbie.

Robbie, first of all, you better spell Robbie's name, right? It's with a Y, not an I.E. But the thing is that his, yeah, well, I mean, that's true, right? I mean, here's what's going on here. What we need, we need, like, a few rosy, a rosy-faced white, you know, Aryan babies to be killed by ICE, and the whole thing's going to fall apart. I mean, that's what Americans always need. You and I have talked about this for months. People are going to be killed because of the way ISIS comporting itself. They are going to shoot people. They're going to shoot Americans. And predictably, they did. And they're going to do it more. And basically, that's the way American politics works. You have to, you need a martyr to get a cause. That's absolutely true.

And, you know, Renee Good wasn't quite the right martyr at the right time because, you know, their car was involved and maybe she grazed or maybe even hit the day. also she's a dyke so like we don't like that but this guy oh you just know at the White House they're like ah fuck like you know he's like a

nice guy thin like they're happy about the beard I bet I bet they liked that but like otherwise they're like he's a young man and he's a nurse fuck he's an ICU nurse works at the VA hospital helping veterans probably the killer

for them was that video that leaked of him leading the memorial service for a fallen veteran and, you know, at the hospital. And it's like freedom isn't free. He's like reading that whole thing. I'm like thinking, oh, they're done for it. Turn them over. They're done. That's right.

That is right. Desert Fox, thanks for the five bucks. Hey, guys, longtime listener. Praying for your pardon, John. And thank you for your work, guys. What's your opinions on Iran and the drum beat to war? I think we kind of touched upon that. I'm genuinely worried. I really am.

Thanks for the 20 bucks for your friend, John, Mike from Mike and Nottingham. John, did the CIA have any KPIs or metrics that they used to measure performance in an officer? That's a good question. I like it. For operations officers, case officers, the metrics were very simply, how many spies have you recruited to steal secrets? I mean, if you recruited some old lady to be a safe housekeeper and make sure that the place was clean and empty when you wanted it, you know, for a clandestine meeting, all right, yeah, maybe you get a pat on the back, but you needed to recruit genuine spies to steal foreign secrets or genuine penetrations of foreign intelligence services or foreign terrorist groups. That was really the sole criterion. Sounds like a good metric to me.

Yeah. So President Xi and the top leadership there in China is ousting a lot of their top generals. I took note of one factoid that was a great interest to me, parenthetically, where they said that the top military brass has no combat experience at this stage because they're too young to have fought in a revolution. Now, I'm going to deploy that fact the next time. someone says that China represents a military threat, they haven't done a war in so long

that they don't have any generals who know up how to, who have actual firsthand experience at them. Interesting. So, but anyway, so basically the, according to a Chinese Army mag newspaper editorial, basically reading between the lines, it looks like the guys who are on the outs were considered not to have been deferential enough to the president in China.

And that's why they were ousted. He's looking more for personal loyalty over sort of institutional loyalty. How important is this story? I think it's less important in the near term, especially here in the United States. I think it's much more important over the long term for the reasons that you cite. You know, when it comes to planning, military planning, we're going to have to take into consideration that there are no senior generals with combat experience. That's very important.

Just filming, really. I heard with the money that the U.S. sent to Ukraine, they could have ended homelessness three times over. Yeah, that's true. The U.S. spends more money on harming people than helping people. And then this bozo rabbi is crying about immigrants. That is true. Not that Robbie's a bozo.

I'm not going to say that's true because I know that's not true. Matthew, sorry about the current set up for legal immigration is nearly impossible, make an easier and obtainable pathway that doesn't just favor those who can afford it. Robbie is a white nationalist at heart. No, he's a nationalist, not a white nationalist. Definitely a nationalist. I agree. It's too hard to enter the United States legally.

I mean, but we should be careful. We should just be like admitting the good people, you know, honestly. And, you know, I mean, this also, it's so interesting to me the way that Republicans have tried to turn a blind eye to the story reminds me of the way that Democrats ignored the Aurora, Colorado, Trend de Aragua videos of those terrifying men running through, running through the stairwells and knocking on doors and with, you know, long guns inside, you know, basically in public housing or I'm not clear if that was public. housing or a private apartment building.

And it was kind of was like Democrats were like, well, that building's been a piece of shit for years and this is so what. But it's like, but the right was right about that. I mean, it's ridiculous to have like Venezuelan gangbangers running around an apartment building in Colorado. And that should stop. And now it's like Republicans find themselves in the same boat. Like you guys look ridiculous when you're blaming the guy who's just got 10 holes in his back

from ice. You look insane. Agreed. Agreed. Very quickly. Ray, five bucks. Thanks. John bought two of your books. How to disappear in surveillance. Listen to your life story this weekend.

I'm Pennsylvania born and raised too, but on the South Carolina Central side, Eagles territory, praying for pardon. And that will be the last word today on D. Program with Ted Roll and John Kirooku. Please stay tuned. We'll be back to TMI show with me Miller Chan that's coming right up right now. And please come back to tomorrow morning and check

out John and I at 9 a.m. Eastern time for another episode. Obviously we'll be talking about whatever happens from Minnesota and so on. John, always great. Try to dig out of the snow. Don't dig out too much though. It's bad up there. Bye, everybody. Let it go. Bye.