Dhru Purohit Show - Getting To The Root Of Adrenal Dysfunction with Izabella Wentz

Episode Date: March 20, 2023

This episode is brought to you by InsideTracker and WHOOP.  Today on The Dhru Purohit Podcast, Dhru sits down with Dr. Izabella Wentz to discuss the common signs of adrenal fatigue and how to support adrenal function using diet, lifestyle, stress management, and targeted supplements for radical healing. Dr. Wentz shares her experience with Hashimoto’s thyroiditis and the personal protocol she used to reverse her symptoms and take back her health.   Dr. Izabella Wentz is an internationally acclaimed thyroid specialist and a licensed clinical pharmacist who has dedicated her career to addressing the root causes of autoimmune thyroid disease after being diagnosed with Hashimoto’s thyroiditis in 2009. She is the author of three books on Hashimoto’s: Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis Lifestyle Interventions for Finding and Treating the Root Cause, Hashimoto’s Food Pharmacology, and the New York Times bestseller, Hashimoto’s Protocol. Her newest book, Adrenal Transformation Protocol: A 4-Week Plan to Release Stress Symptoms and Go from Surviving to Thriving, is set to release on April 18, 2023.  In this episode, Dhru and Dr. Wentz dive into: -Top signs you might have adrenal dysfunction (1:25) -Long-term consequences of adrenal fatigue (6:22) -The HPA axis (13:09) -Why women are more prone to adrenal stress than men (15:27) -What happened to Izabella before she got sick (19:56) -Dr. Wentz’s personal protocol for supporting her adrenals (27:44) -Supplements for adrenal support (39:23) -Tests for adrenal dysfunction (47:14) -The root causes of adrenal issues (50:06) -Adaptogens for adrenal support (57:12) -Dietary approach for adrenal support (59:53) -Dr. Wentz’s adrenal transformation protocol (1:15:53) -Final thoughts and where to follow Izabella’s work (1:31:24) Also mentioned in this episode: -How to Release Self-Criticism and Find Fierce Self-Compassion with Dr. Kristen Neff (episode #123) -Adrenal Transformation Protocol is available for preorder here.  -Sign up for Izabella’s Adrenal Healing Guide here. For more on Dr. Izabella Wentz, follow her on Instagram @izabellawentzpharmd, or through her website, https://www.thyroidpharmacist.com. InsideTracker provides detailed nutrition and lifestyle guidance based on your individual needs. Right now, they’re offering my podcast community 20% off. Just go to insidetracker.com/DHRU to get your discount and try it out for yourself. WHOOP is a personalized digital fitness tracker and health coaching platform that monitors your physiology 24/7 and provides personalized recommendations based on what your body needs. To get yours, go to join.whoop.com and get 15% off your membership with code DHRU15. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When we have these low levels of cortisol, this could lead to a whole host of chronic health issues, chronic fatigue syndrome, Hashimoto's various types of autoimmune conditions. Welcome to the Drew Prod podcast. Each week we explore the inner workings of the brain and the body with one of the brightest minds in wellness, medicine, and mindset. This week's guest is Dr. Isabella Wenz. She's an internationally acclaimed thyroid specialist and licensed pharmacist who's dedicated her career to addressing the root causes. of autoimmune thyroid disease after being diagnosed herself with Hashimoto's thyroiditis in 2009. She's the author of three bestselling books on Hashimoto's, including Hashimoto's thyroiditis lifestyle interventions for finding and treating the root cause, and the Hashimoto's protocol, which became a New York Times bestseller. Her latest book is all about the topic of

adrenals. It's called the Adrenal Transformation Protocol, and that's what today's podcast is all about. In today's episode, Dr. Wens covers why our adrenals are taxed and more importantly what you can do if you are consistently feeling burnout, fatigue, and low energy in your life. It's a fantastic interview. Stay tuned. Dr. Isabella Wence, welcome back to the podcast. It's a pleasure to have you here. Today we're talking all about adrenal fatigue, adrenal issues, HPA access. Give us the top signs, maybe two, three, three, four, four things, that your health is off and it might be related to something going on with your adrenals. Brain fog is a really big sign that something is off about your adrenals. Having fatigue,

especially fatigue in the morning, trouble getting out of bed in the morning, that's a big sign that your adrenals might be off. And feeling wired but tired at nighttime. So if you're having trouble falling asleep, even though we've been tired all day, that might be a sign. that something is off about your adrenals. Yeah. So let's tease some of those out a little bit more. So brain fog, right? I think a lot of people just normally feel as they get older and the years come, they notice

a little bit of decreased brain capacity. And that could be from a whole bunch of different reasons. But what's specifically going on that brain fog would be tied to adrenales? People with adrenal dysfunction and people with adrenal fatigue, typically they have trouble with things like word finding or they may be walking into a room and they get there and they forget why they got there, they may find that they're just not as bright and not as sharp as they used to be. And so this is a very common presentation and people can be in their 20s and their 30s and their 40s. And sometimes they'll think that, okay, I am losing my mind. I'm losing my brain. Do I have

early onset dementia. Sometimes this could be related to thyroid issues. Thyroid conditions can also cause this brain fog symptom, but many times it has to do with our adrenal hormones that help everything in the body just work better, right? And I think of our main adrenal hormones as helping us be awake and present during the daytime and helping us feel relaxed and sleepy at nighttime. And when the hormones are out of balance, especially when we have low levels of cortisol throughout the day, we end up with feeling like we're half asleep. And, you know, we're not so bright when we're sleeping, right? So let's take a step back. People have heard the term adrenals, but they often aren't really clear what that means. So what are the adrenals? And you talked a little bit about

their function in terms of keeping us present, alert, energy throughout the day, and then helping us when it comes to the evening, but what exactly are the adrenals? So these two little tiny glands and they sit on top of our kidneys and not many people think about them until they have issues with some of the hormones that they produce. So they're known as our stress glands and they help produce our stress hormones that help us survive and thrive in life. And the main stress hormone is known as cortisol. Now, most people have heard that like cortisol is bad, right? So cortisol, makes us fat. Cortisol is a stress hormone and it's it's terrible for our health. Now, the truth is that we

do need some cortisol for survival and we can have excess levels of cortisol, which can get us in trouble. And then we can have not enough levels of cortisol, which can also be problematic and can lead to a whole host of symptoms. The other things that can happen is we can have cortisol imbalances throughout the day. Generally, what our body does is it's tuned into our, to our world, right? And so in the morning time, we're supposed to release a lot of cortisol, and so we'll have this, this is known as a cortisol curve. We'll have a lot of cortisol released at in the morning time, and then the cortisol levels go down throughout the day. And as they go down, we progressively might get a little bit more relaxed as the day goes on

until nighttime when our cortisol is at a low level and we're ready for sleeping. Now, typically people will find when they, when I work with people with chronic health issues, is that there's something off about their cortisol curve. So they're not tuned into the circadian rhythm. They will have a cortisol curve that might be too high. So they are just fueled by cortisol all day long where they have, they wake up in the morning, they're super anxious and they're ready to go. It was like, I drink 10 cups of coffee today. They feel like that all day and they have trouble sleeping and they're wired. Then we have people that have really low levels of cortisol that have trouble getting out of the bed in the morning and they're just drudging along the whole day. And then

we end up with other types of cortisol patterns that can be anything in between that, including cortisol swings throughout the day. And typically people might be anxious throughout that process. So you talked about brain fog being wired and tired. I forgot the other one. It it'll come back to us. And you were saying that these are some of the signs that you might have something going on with your adrenals. Long term, is there something more that can come if your adrenals are constantly taxed, constantly out of balance? Does it make us more likely for other chronic diseases? Absolutely. So in working with people with Hashimoto's, and I've worked with thousands of people now. That's your area of expertise. You're known as sort of like the, you know, the thyroid pharmacist,

and that's a, you have that. We'll talk about your journey a little bit more. You were diagnosed with Hashimoto's and you really kind of created a whole ecosystem of support for people with not just Hashimoto's, but a lot of different, you know, autoimmune conditions. People with autoimmune conditions, chronic illness, Hashimoto's is the one that I've worked with the most. But typically when I ask them a question and it's what was going on in your life before you got sick, a lot of them, majority of them will say I was going through a lot of stress. So whether that was grad school or a divorce or something like having. business issues, having trouble at work, having trouble with their families, something very,

very stressful was happening in their life before they got sick. And so when we're experiencing a significant amount of stress, our adrenals come to the rescue. Initially, they'll fuel our body's stress response by producing lots and lots of cortisol. So cortisol is helpful for getting us to survive. It essentially, when we have a lot of cortisol in our bodies, it's like, okay, we're in survival mode. There's a bear chasing us. Let's, let's, you know, let's not focus on digestion right now. Let's not focus on all of these, let's not focus on all of these extra things like growing beautiful hair and fixing your body. Let's focus on running as fast as we can to get away from that bear, right? And so typically that's what our adrenals are meant to do. They're meant to help us

survive. And, you know, in a perfect world, in a perfect system, it's going to be a one-time short-term stressors where they release a whole bunch of cortisol, and then the cortisol gets worked out of the body, and everything kind of comes back to normal, and then we have a normal stress response. Unfortunately, what I found is that people with traumatic stress or chronic stress, they end up in a chronic state of having these cortisol abnormalities. And initially, they might start off with too much cortisol, and then that can go to a cortisol roller coaster, and they may even end up with really low levels of cortisol. Now, all of that to say is when we have these low levels of cortisol, this could lead to

a whole host of chronic health issues. chronic fatigue syndrome, Hashimoto's, various types of autoimmune conditions, most of them looking at the levels of, looking at their HPA axis dysfunction, most people with those conditions end up with dysfunction in their levels of cortisol and their HPA axis. So essentially it's like a breakdown of their body that is occurring for long term and their body's not going to be repairing itself enough. And so they end up really, really depleted, really stressed, really overwhelmed. And their body is constantly thinking that, you know, they're in survival mode. There's something really unsafe in our environment and people are not

repairing themselves properly. And so people end up with chronic health issues. Usually, you know, people might go through a stressor within one year, five years, ten years. They may end up with a chronic health condition if the root cause of the stress dysfunction isn't addressed. Yeah, and you've gone through that a few times yourself, and we'll kind of break down your different versions of that, which kind of led to you writing your first book and now this book here and evolving this adrenal protocol that you have. But I first want to break down a few things before we go through your story. You mentioned HPA Access. We've done some episodes on this in the past, but can you just break that down for our audience and, and, like,

Like there's always this kind of question about, is it the adrenals? Is it the HPA access? And so can you just clarify that for our audience that has no idea what I'm talking about? Sure. So I know people may have heard that adrenal fatigue doesn't exist, right? And so that, and we can get into that a little bit as well, but the more accurate term for what's happening within the adrenals, our adrenals aren't actually tired. They're able to produce the right amount of stress hormones, but they are, they're communicating with the brain, the hypothalamus, and the pituitary gland. And when they're not communicating properly, then we end up with this adrenal dysfunction where we may not produce cortisol at the right of balance during

throughout the day. And so this is what's meant by the HPA axis. It's the hypothalmic pituitary adrenal axis, some ways to put that together where essentially it's our just, our brain communicating with our adrenals, and our brain is really, really powerful, and we're very powerful, and we're meant to survive. When we've been under chronic stress for a long time, the brain knows that having lots and lots of cortisol is bad, right? So having lots of cortisol on board is like having three toddlers at your house or three rock stars at your house, just constantly throwing a party without ever cleaning up, right? And so the brain knows this isn't. a good thing. And so the brain will pull back that cortisol production, right? And so the brain will

say, hey, I know that you're feeling stressed, but let's not produce so much cortisol guys. Like, this is not good for us. And so the brain will actually provide feedback to the adrenals to not produce so much. And this is what ends up happening. It's sort of like, you know, with insulin resistance, right? When you've got so much happening and so much being released, eventually the body tries to dial that in for us, right? Is adrenal fatigue, just to use it as a general term, but we know since you've given us the breakdown of the HPA access, obviously there's a lot more going on, but it's easier to talk about that this way.

Is problems with our adrenals and our adrenals being out of whack, is there a gender component to it? Meaning, do women suffer from this more often in the literature than men? You know, we know through doing episodes with yourself and other people that are experts in autoimmune, you know, of the vast majority of autoimmune issues are with women. And we can talk about a bunch of reasons why. And then even things like Hashimoto's, it's like, what, 90%? 95% is women, something like that up there. Is there a gender component with adrenals and stress that you've seen in the literature? Are women more affected by this than men? So it's interesting because the literature out there is a little bit tricky. So looking at what I'm seeing clinically, I would say majority women are affected. And my theory is that it has to do something with women being more in tuned to our environment and maybe perceiving those stressors a little bit more head-on than men.

typically I like to think of women's bodies being in tune to whatever's going on in our environment. Generally, for a woman, it probably wouldn't be beneficial to be pregnant during a war or a famine, right? So women, I find that they tend to be more sensitive to it to the stress in their lives and have these symptoms. That said, it affects men just the same. So there are plenty of men. Maybe men aren't seeking out help? Yeah. there are plenty of men with the condition and they may present with sleep issues, right?

And they may present with libido issues and they may present with irritability and anger and trouble getting up in the morning. So I feel like the research hasn't been really out there. I primarily work with women. And I'll tell you that 90% of the women I've worked with with chronic health issues have this. But I've also worked with men that are in the same boat. Yeah. I guess it's the bigger question and there's so many layers to it. Everybody's impacted by stress, but is there something unique about the female biology that the same stress that a man might go to, a woman is more likely, I'm just talking big picture now, right? More likely to realize that that stress is impacting her body. And I think it's a superpower act on it. Go seek help. go look for resources, say that this work environment is not suitable for me. Like, I'm not willing to put up with this situation that's causing all this havoc on my body. Any thoughts about that? That's my just sort of bro-science take on the situation. I love bro science.

So I'm not exactly sure why women, but women tend to be more likely to be the ones that notice when something is off. And I'm not going to speak for every man and woman. out there. But women are... There's all sorts of different situations and people. But women are typically the ones that are bringing up things that are happening in our relationships. So we're typically the ones that are saying, hey, this is going on in our relationship. We need to work on it. I've been married for 15 years. And I'm typically the one that says, hey, honey, I think you should go to the doctor, right? So for men,

I don't know if they're socialized to just kind of put everything aside as much and not be so present and not be so tuned into it. But men, I find, are not as likely to perhaps seek out help, whereas women are more likely to do so. They're more likely and it could be societal, it could be other things like that. You know, there's so many layers to this conversation. And obviously, that's not why we're here, but people wonder sometimes, you know, is this impacting more men? Is it impacting women? But yes, I think there's that classic sort of thing of like, you know, a guy less likely to ask for directions, et cetera, other stuff. But yeah, interesting. interesting to get your,

interesting to get your take on it. Now, I want to go back to this question that you ask all the patients that you work with and the people that you coach and are part of your programs and stuff, you know, what were you doing before you got sick, right? Let's use that question in your life,

specifically, there's multiple chapters to your journey, but specifically the chapter, whichever one you want to start off with, when it comes to adrenal issues. So take us to a time and a place in your life and give us the context of what was going on before you started to notice there were parts of your body that were not working the way you wanted to or were starting to break down. Sure. So the very first time that I started to experience adrenal issues and I, of course, didn't know what was going on and I wasn't diagnosed

until many years after that was following the sudden death of a loved one. And so this person that was very close to me died by suicide when I was in my 20s. And that just, I mean, I was sleeping for days on end. I ended up with like cystic acne on my face. I was constantly anxious. I wasn't able to sleep at night. I was, you know, sleeping throughout the day. My energy was off.

and my brain was just in a different place, right? And eventually, and that was kind of one of the initial big stressors, eventually I sort of got back to life. And then after, but after that, you know, they say, like, what doesn't kill you, makes you stronger. But I think, like, sometimes when you keep things in and you suppress them, they, like, just cause a lot of inflammation in your body, right? And so I ended up, you know, feeling burned out at a certain point.

my health kind of progressively got worse. So I started having panic attacks. Then I started having hair loss. Then I started having carpal tunnel in both arms, allergies, so on and so forth. And eventually I was diagnosed with Hashimoto's. And I think, you know, I really think that Hashimoto's diagnosis, there are certain signs and symptoms of Hashimoto's that I'm aware of now, such as seeing speckles of light in front of your eyes. That can actually be thyroid hormone breaking down. That can cause you to see that. And that was happening after that initial super stressful, devastating experience, right?

And so my first journey into taking back my health, I was a pharmacist. So I was working, you know, like I'm a big fan of drugs, right? And handing out drugs to everybody. I was working as a consultant pharmacist at the time, and I was working with people with rare conditions and trying to find research for them, what can help them feel better. And I was diagnosed with Hashimoto's, and I was like, great, now I could take meds. Yay, drugs, right? The thyroid meds, like, helped a little bit, but they didn't really help me overcome everything.

So instead of sleeping 12 hours a night, I was sleeping 11 hours, like, yay, that's helpful. instead of wearing two jackets in Southern California, I was able to just wear one jacket, which was a plus, yes, right? Because you were cold all the time? I was cold all the time. That's a big thyroid symptom, right? But I really had to dive deep, and I really had to look at a lot of the different patterns that were broken in my body because of being under chronic stress, right?

And part of that was focusing on the health of my adrenalism. The first time I did it, I focused on integrative process. protocols, which were pregnant alone and DHEA and licorice and adaptogens, getting lots of sleep. So this was like the first time. And I was like, I was reading about adrenal fatigue and being a skeptical pharmacist. I'm like, this stuff doesn't exist. Like this reputable website says it's like, it doesn't exist, right? So therefore I don't have it. But yet I had all the symptoms. And then another pharmacist told me like, why don't you look into this? Sure enough, I did. I did like, what you were supposed to do for adrenal fatigue.

I got better. And I had more energy and I was less anxious. And I was like, okay, great. I ended up utilizing this as part of my protocols for people with Hashimoto's to help them. And so many people were like, wow, this stuff does work. This voodoo stuff really, really works, right? And that is just big picture. Yeah.

Some dietary changes, right? obviously the emphasis on sleep. Absolutely. Removal or minimization of stimulants. Caffeine. Yep. No caffeine. No caffeine.

That was the version one. Version one. The version now that you talk about in this book, obviously it's gone through a lot of iterations and it's like more easier to do and we'll get your updated takes on caffeine. So no caffeine. Some supplements that were part of that process, right, to replenish. Anything else like big picture? I think you've summarized it pretty well other than utilizing like hormones.

hormones. So pregnant alone and DHA are some hormones. They can be used over the counter, but I really recommend for people to work with practitioners because they can be pretty powerful things and they can cause reactions if you use too much or if you use them in the wrong person. So those things were all part of your phase one adrenal program. And you used it personally. It made a huge difference. And you started writing about it, teaching about it, and it was working for other people. Absolutely. It worked really, really well for people that could do it. But then I ended up with people saying like, hey, I can't tolerate pregnant alone or I have a history of, you know, I'm worried about like estrogen receptive cancers or DHA makes my skin breakout or I get sick acne from DHA. And so then I started focusing more on lifestyle changes. And so then I started telling my clients, can you sleep for 12 hours a night and cut out caffeine completely from. your life. And just for 7 to 30 days, try to sleep from like 7 p.m. till 7, or like 8 p.m. till 8 a.m. Right. So just try to get 10 to 12 hours of sleep every night. So we find that the, if you go to bed before 9 p.m., that's going to be really regenerative for your body. And then the sleep between 7 and 9 a.m. is going to be really helpful for your brain.

Now, they worked well for the people that did it, right? But then there's, there are people out there that are just not able to sleep 12 hours a night. And I didn't really understand that until I had kids, right? You're like, why isn't everybody just sleeping 12 hours a night? Yeah, yeah. Just do it. Like, just do it. Right. Call in sick to work. Like, no worries, right? And so that was that was the protocol that I was utilizing for people without hormones and just focusing really heavily on life. lifestyle and eating a blood sugar balanced diet. And then I used that same protocol for myself when I was after making a documentary series and writing a book and kind of doing all these things at once where I essentially burned myself out. So I went to like I interviewed over 100 people for my thyroid secret documentary series and was, you know, like on different tons of jet lag, not sleeping well, staying up at night. You know, one of the fascinating. The fastest ways to get.

Cookbook. Everything. Thriving business. All the stuff. All the things that are super fun, but it's kind of like, you know, maybe you don't get the sleep that you should be getting, right? And so one of the fastest ways to get into adrenal dysfunction is sleep deprivation. And so I was trying to meet deadlines. So I was up until like 2 to 3 a.m. some nights just trying to finish things because we had a hard, hard date where things were launching.

and I learned so much about video production that it's not like just one shot and then you're done. You have to like edit things like three times, right? Or at least three times for it to be decent. So that was a time in my life where I felt like my adrenals again got really fried. And I used that protocol where I slept. I took like a month off. I took a sabbatical. I quit all caffeine and I slept for like 10 to 12 hours a night, right?

So that worked really well for me too. And that worked for the clients that I had that utilize that protocol as well, right, that were able to. So fast forward to that. And then I had my beautiful son, Dimitri, right? And for anybody that might have kids, you know that they're not born, like, sleeping 12 hours a night. Like, they wake up like every hour sometimes, every two hours, every three hours and you have to feed them all throughout the night. And as I mentioned, you know, sleep deprivation is the fastest way to get into adrenal dysfunction. So I found myself like eight months postpartum and having a baby that I needed to feed every two to three hours at night, started drinking coffee for the first time in my life and just super sleep deprived. My husband started having some

mystery health issues. My support system that I previously had in college. that wasn't quite there anymore. And so I really found myself in like a super tricky situation. And I was like, okay, my adrenals are flatlined. I'm exhausted. I'm struggling through all these things. But I couldn't take like the hormones because I was breastfeeding. I couldn't sleep. Like I mean, you know, that was part of the thing was like my son was waking up so much. And there was like no way in like hell that I was going to give up coffee or right, like with a young child. So I was like, wow, what else can I do? And I really dove deep into additional reasons and additional patterns and additional things that are caused by being under stress for a long time to help figure out a new plan for myself. And it was very quite humbling because

I had a lot of clients that were like, I, you know, I can't sleep. And that's why I need the coffee. I don't have these issues because I drink the coffee. I drink the coffee because I can't sleep at night, right? So that was, that's kind of how my adrenal protocol evolved. And you laid out fully in the book and you walk people through that story. It's really, you know, beautiful. And obviously people can relate to it if they've been in that same situation. So walk us through how you modified and reorganized your protocol to be easier for people to

follow that have adrenal issues? So it's not just easier for people to follow, but it's also more effective, which I was really excited about. So it helped me restore my energy levels and brain fog and my sleep issues within just a few weeks. And then I tested it with over 3,000 of my clients. Right. You need a big beta test. And they saw the same benefits within just four weeks, where previous protocols would take like, you know, three months to two years to really get results. And so the things that I really focused on was how, you know, what is going on in your life that is letting you know that your body is in a dangerous state? Why is your body in survival mode right now?

What are the messages that you're sending to yourself to put you in that? stressed out survival mode. And what can we do to send out more of those positive safety signals to let your body know that it's safe and that it could repair itself, that you could rest at night, and that you can have lots of energy throughout the day? So I really designed a plan focused on safety signals. And I have 14 targeted safety signals that I focus on, one of them being nutrition. People with under a lot of stress, their hormones, they're just being sent out all insulin, cortisol, all kinds of hormones are being released. And so they end up with blood sugar issues. One of the key things is making sure you're eating more protein and more fat throughout your day

and minimizing foods that are going to be causing blood sugar spikes. That's such a game changer for that 3 p.m. slump for feeling anxious throughout the day. And so one thing is just making sure you're eating protein every two to three hours with a little bit of fat. Yeah, I think along with that and this is something that you know I have family members that you know struggle struggle with this I've noticed with them a lot of high achievers and again there may be you know there's obviously individual differences but I notice that you know there was a period of time in my life where I could go I could drink a little bit of coffee in the morning right and then I don't eat anything until lunch

and I'm like totally good right and then my sister's my wife would try that. And, you know, prior to like, you know, meeting me just on her own. And she would have like a meltdown later on the day. Oh, yeah. And that goes into this whole system of like, what do women especially in their prime fertility years need? We've done a lot of episodes on that. And when my wife like skips the protein and the healthy fat in the morning, she just feels more off throughout the day. And I think that's another way. And you're seeing. more of this because of educators and people like yourself that are going out there is like, how do we personalize health so that we're not all doing the same protocol? And we find out what

actually works for her, what works for us. In my wife's instance, she would kind of plow through and she'd get a big blood sugar drop that ended up happening because she didn't eat anything. And now she has kind of like a blood sugar induced almost anxiety, you know, that's coming. and she would say like, I don't know what's going on. What's what going on? I said, sweetie, did we eat in the morning? Did we have some protein? Do we have some fat?

And by the way, everybody who's listening is like, I might remind her of that, but she reminds me of plenty of things on my life too. So it goes both ways. I got to get her on the podcast so she could tell you all about those components. So even that alone, I love that you mentioned the healthy fat, the healthy protein. It's such an important part, especially for people who typically listen to this podcast, who are a high achiever. are super focused on their health and they want to do so much, but we might be missing out on

the basics, which is like, did you just eat something healthy this morning? Yeah, absolutely. And it's, I know that intermittent fasting is super popular. And it works really well for some people where for others, if you try to do that and if you try to just have coffee in the morning and go through, go on about your day, you're going to end up feeling worse than better, right? and so that's going to sabotage your health. So yeah, definitely we want to make sure everybody tunes into where they're at on their healing journey, right,

and where they are in their life. The other thing that's really just, and I'm like, this sounds very basic, but it works so well, is tuning into the circadian rhythm, right? And so when we're, you know, when we're indoors all day, our body doesn't really know that it's time to be, awake and our body, like, you're indoors and the lights are on. So is it daytime? Is it nighttime? Like, we have these beautiful bodies that are so tuned into our environment. Going outside, first thing in the morning and letting your body pick up on the sunlight, letting your body know that it's daytime and it's time to be awake, time to have energy, time to be out and about

in the world. That can just be a really simple yet powerful signal for you to build up your energy levels throughout the day. And same as that is making sure that in the evening times, you're sending your body messages that it's time to sleep. It's time to unwind. Now, we all love, everybody loves, you know, Netflix and their computers and their phones and all these wonderful, all these, this wonderful technology that we now have in our homes. But if we're watching that after sunset, we're being exposed to bright lights, then our body's not going to know that. it's supposed to produce melatonin, right? So then we end up feeling wired and tired, not being able to go to sleep. We just got a new, my husband and I just got a new home in Austin, Texas. And one of the

first things that I do is I set up the bedroom environment. So I like the bedroom. The bedroom needs to be cold and dark and comfortable and, you know, free of clutter as much as possible, which is always tricky when you've got little kids. But we've set this up. And so one of the things I did is I went around in any like little blue lights that we had from air filters or from any kind of, you know, thermometers and things that you have. I put up little black stickers on them, right, to cover up the blue lights. And that's kind of how you set up your nighttime environment. And then a few months ago, I just started waking up in the middle of the night. And I had no idea why. I'm like, Is it my blood sugar?

What's going on? Why am I waking up? And sure enough, I looked over and I saw that one of the stickers fell off. And there was this bright, beautiful eye shining directly into my eyes. And blue light lets us know that it's time to be awake, right? So these are things that, I mean, they sound like so basic. But for people with circadian rhythm issues that have low levels of energy in the day and trouble sleeping at night, please just try that for, you know, forgive it, give it a week.

and tell me what happens. Like, you can come on my social media and, you know, say mean things to me if it doesn't work, but please give it a try. Yeah, absolutely. Everybody has different levels of sensitivity. And I think what you're really trying to say is that here's a collection of things that you've seen work from a whole range of people. And then individuals can take from that list of toolboxes, they can pick the things that

matter most for them. And they all kind of relate to each other, too. You were mentioning about getting morning sunlight. Well, a big reason that a lot of people don't have an appetite in the morning is because they wake up. And, you know, we have early morning meetings that start at like eight, nine, sometimes people are meeting at seven. And it's very easy to kind of get into sort of adrenal cortisol mode and run off of that. And I notice for a lot of my friends, they may not always have an appetite in the morning and like have a help, like not a big meal. but have enough like protein and fat that like starts the morning off right and helps them balance

their blood sugar later on in the day. And if you don't get morning sunlight, which actually helps signal to your body that we need to start moving the melatonin out of the system, it plays a role in appetite. So if you just start your day, you wake up in the morning. It's sometimes right now, especially kind of like it's February, so it's still a little bit winter and a lot of places in the United States. It's dark outside. The sun isn't out.

and you go right to your desk after making your coffee and you start working, well, your morning is going to be thrown off a little bit. So all these things kind of tie into one another. And I'm glad you brought that up as an example. What are other things that are related to these safety signals of letting your body know that, hey, like everything is okay right now from the 14. So you mentioned a few. Is there any other couple that you want to mention? Absolutely. So replenishing the nutrients that typically get burned out when we're under a lot of stress, these are going to be B vitamins, vitamin C, magnesium, and our electrolytes. Replenishing those can be such a big game changer. So I recommend utilizing electrolytes throughout early in the morning. Having enough just sea salt

electrolytes on board can help us produce healthy levels of cortisol throughout the day. making sure you have your vitamin C and B vitamins. People will say that they tend to be really fatigued, and then they start on some B vitamins and vitamin C, and that's all of a sudden they're like, okay, I'm starting to build up my energy stores, right? This is really, really helpful. And then utilizing magnesium. I typically like to utilize that in the evenings.

Magnesium generally has a very calming effect. And you can take a supplement or you can take an Epsom salt bath. Just getting that little bit of magnesium in your system is going to let your body know that it's time to relax. It's time to unwind. It's so helpful for people that have headaches, people that have sleep issues, people that have pain throughout their bodies, menstrual cramps. It just works on so many different pathways and can be such a game changer for people that struggle with sleep, anxiety issues. All the things that I mentioned that are signs and symptoms that your body is under too much. stress. Before we break down the protocol further, right, and you have this whole section of like

replenish, re-energize, revitalize, rebuild, review, and we'll kind of walk through that. What do you think were some of the biggest bang for the buck modifications you made from sort of phase one of this protocol to now this new version that you used, especially after having your child that worked really well for you and a lot of other people that was easier to follow and more effective. What do you think were the top things that you either added or removed or both that made this so much more effective than it was before and easier to follow? Sure. Some of them are just supplements. So utilizing carnitine, this is a mitochondrial support supplement can be incredibly helpful for balancing the blood sugar, for getting rid of some of the toxic byproducts that we have in our bodies that can

produce brain fog and for resolving fatigue. Another thing is utilizing de-ribose. So this is another mitochondrial nutrient that athletes use, and it's been shown in athletes, to help them recover from like endurance events, right? And so it hasn't been studied in people with like adrenal dysfunction, but when you think about when you're in a chronically stressed out state, I mean everything's an endurance event, right? So like just getting up and like doing your laundry and folding your laundry can feel overwhelming. And so just utilizing a little bit of that D-Ribose and carnitine can be such a big game changer for people when they've been struggling these things. And that, those are two supplements. The third one is utilizing sarcomias as bolardi. And this is a beneficial

yeast. And what it does is it helps us overcome various. things. So whether that you've had gut inflammation, you have food sensitivities, you have exposure to mold, you have candida, various things that can cause adrenal dysfunction. So we talked about sleep deprivation being a cause. Chronic inflammation is another really big cause that when we have chronic inflammation in our body, whether that is from exposure to toxins or infections, chronic hidden infections are what I have found to trigger a lot of health issues. Sarcomyces Boularty just helps our body overcome that naturally, and it gives us a little bit more resilience when we just utilize this beneficial yeast, and oftentimes in smaller doses.

So these are just like supplements that people can utilize, right? And then another part of it is just really looking at transforming some of our beliefs and some, to call them like personal transformation methods and then overcoming the things that that the chains that bind us, letting go of those chains, right? To give ourselves a bit more freedom and to build our resilience. Yeah. What do you think were some of the top beliefs you saw, whether it's through the beta or in your life that hold people back on their healing journey? My gosh, there are so many of these beliefs like let's say I will always be sick, right? So, that is a really, really negative belief that people believe that they will always be sick or that

they don't deserve to be healthy, right? So maybe they did something in their lives and they carry a lot of guilt about that and they feel like they're just not deserving of being healthy. Another one is that your self-worth is tied and your value that you bring to people is tied to your productivity, for example, right? And so you push yourself beyond what you should do. You don't take time to relax. You don't take time for self-care. And then you end up burning the bridge at both ends, right? And those are some beliefs that we really work through. And I have a little workbook section to help people rewrite those beliefs and to help them overcome them. For some people, it's just the messaging that we send to our bodies. Other people may have to work with

therapists to overcome traumatic events, such as EMDRs, is one really powerful game changer. Any one of those beliefs, whether you mentioned it or you didn't, that that you found was kind of for you, something that really required a little bit of work on to let go of. Was it that high achieving one that like I have to do it all? And if I don't, then I'm going to lose out on these opportunities or I'm not going to be good enough. How did you know? Definitely that one resonated for me that I had to like I had to have everything together at all times and I had to be perfect and I had to just be really high achieving. I am an immigrant. And so you, I have these beautiful parents that

came to the United States when I was a child and they gave up their careers, right? And they gave up, they came with nothing. They gave up their family. They gave up so much for my brother and I to have a better life. And I think in some ways that's so beautiful, but it comes with a lot of pressure, right? So it comes with a lot of pressure to succeed. And I was, I skipped a grade. And then I went to, in grade school. And it was, my parents were like, you're so smart. You can skip a grade. That's amazing. And then I got to undergrad. And I was told that you can do undergrad in two years to get to pharmacy school. So I did it, right? I was like, okay, I'm doing it. I'm taking so many classes. And of course, that burned me out. And just, just all of these different things. I was working two jobs

at certain times. And I was, yeah. So that was definitely one that resonated for me where being productive at all times, and it's a beautiful thing to be productive, right? But feeling like you, that is where you derive yourself worth from can be so draining on you. So one of the things I recommend is like just doing things for the heck of it, right? So just doing things because you feel like it, doing things for pleasure, just taking that throughout your day and just giving yourself permission to just enjoy life even though it's not it's not like productive right how important or not important is testing and if somebody wanted to utilize tests that are out there are there ones that you would recommend when it comes to supporting them on the journey of rebuilding or realigning or balancing out their

adrenals i talk a lot about testing and various root causes of adrenal dysfunction But as far as testing the adrenals, there are two tests that I like to utilize. Their adrenal saliva test, ZRT, makes a really good one, and then a Dutch test. Those are very, very popular. Now, I love these tests, and they're fabulous, but to find a practitioner that orders them, not always reasonable for everybody. And to find a practitioner that knows how to interpret them, that's probably an even smaller group of people. So the protocols were designed based on people's symptoms and to resolve

those symptoms. And they can be used with or without testing. So I know a lot of times people are like, I have these symptoms. Should I test for adrenal dysfunction? Absolutely. It can be really, really helpful. Not super necessary because if we know you're in this state, we know what happens to the body when it's under stress. And the protocol addresses the imbalances that are produced. Yeah, that's great. Talk to us about the topic of hormone replacement. Where can it be helpful and where are there maybe some layers or nuances that you might want to talk about of not needing it when it comes to a protocol like yours? So if somebody has Addison's disease, of course, they would need hormones for their adrenal.

So this is an autoimmune condition that affects the adrenals that leads to their destruction. They're no longer able to produce hormones. But that's a different condition that then we're talking about. We're talking about miscommunication between the brain and the adrenals. And so in most cases, I find that people can get better with these particular protocols. Women in like perimenopause or menopause, they may benefit from adding something like progesterone to the mix. and then DHEA and pregnant alone can be helpful for rebalancing the stress response when you use tiny little doses of them throughout the day.

I do recommend that people work with a practitioner when they do that. So if I would say if you're going to do the protocol, give it four weeks. See what happens. If you have all of your symptoms that have been resolved, fabulous. Then you probably don't need hormones. Now, if you're still struggling with some symptoms, I have a section in the book with some advanced symptom solutions that will go through like, okay, well, maybe if you're having issues with libido, maybe that's where we need to dial in some hormonal things, right?

You mentioned, you know, other tests that are there to look at some of the root causes of adrenal issues. Talk about those and what you've seen that some of those root causes could be. I mean, anything that puts your body under significant stress. So people think of stress, and typically they think of like a mean boss yelling at you or. you know, some chaos, some family drama. And those are, that's definitely stressful, right? So there's like chronic stress. And then there's past stress. And these are like psychological stressors, right? And then we talked about sleep deprivation. This is hugely stressful. That's like huge, right? And then we have blood sugar imbalances. They can cause stress in the body. And then inflammation.

So inflammation is like such a big word, right? So many things can cause inflammation. So that could be food sensitivities, that could be chronic infections, mold exposure, toxic infections. It's really, really interesting because studying adrenal dysfunction, studying adrenal fatigue, I feel like everybody has like their own little theory on what causes it. And I'm like, everything can cause it, right? So this is just what happens when your body is sensing stress in our environment, right? It could be like watching too much scary television, right? Any of these things can be issues.

Typically, if you don't feel better and if you don't have all of your symptoms resolved after the four-week plan, I talk about some other deeper root causes. I love root causes of illness, right? So I love focusing on those and figuring out exactly what is that one thing, what's that one specific thing that set your body into a stress response. And sometimes it's purely, you know, you're not getting enough sleep. you're drinking too much coffee, you're burning the bridge of both ends. Other times it might be like a chronic infection or a toxic exposure. What do you think is the reason why some people seem to be so taxed by some of these external stressors?

And right, we've also talked about how stress is also a good thing. There's certain stresses that we want, high intensity workouts in a balanced form. You know, sauna, which I know you're a big fan of as well, that's a good stress on the body. But why are some people overwhelmed by a level of stress where other people, they may not have the same level of symptoms? So why are some people more vulnerable to some of these inputs of stress? What's your thoughts on that? Big picture? I think a lot of it is how some of our early stress responses were patterned. So if we have a history of trauma, these are the things that could hold us back. So if you are our person,

that has, for example, gone through betrayal, you might end up being very suspicious of most people, right? If you've gone through a very traumatic experience, you would almost be tuned in to look for it in other places. And that just really, really weighs us down, right? And so you almost have like a baseline of dysfunction that's already built into your stress response. There are a lot of studies looking at victims of, you know, physical abuse or childhood abuse that they end up having HPA access dysfunction as they go on. And then that's connected to chronic illness. And so I think that's a really important underlying cause that no amount of like positive affirmations may fix, right? So we may need to do deeper trauma work for that and work with a therapist to really overcome some of those like

really deep, integrated, deeply ingrained stressors that some of us might not even be aware of, right? Do you think them when people are missing some of the basics? And you've already talked about sleep. So we already know the answer is yes for that. But a healthy level of activity, which based on the literature that's out there, you know, 150 minutes, right, of activity a week, sweating at least, you know, two to three times a week, preferentially having some adequate amount of, you know, strength training doesn't mean that

somebody has to be doing CrossFit, but just lifting some sort of resistance training, some weights. So sleep, a level of movement and fitness that would be 150 minutes a week, and that's sweating amount. Then we have in some sort of sense of mindfulness, take your pick, right? Some sort of, whether it's Yoga Nidra, a meditation. just some form of mindfulness that you do even for a few minutes a day, a lot of benefits that are there. And if you don't have mindfulness, community, that's typically, right?

I don't think our ancestors were all practicing mindfulness. They had stressful lives, but they had a sense of community where they were reminded that, you know, they were in it with other people. Now we kind of live in a world that's a little bit more, more isolated. And then, you know, probably some sort of temperature component, whether it's a little bit of cold exposure or hot exposure, obviously personalized. So these are some of the basics that people, and then you mentioned sunlight. Do you feel that a big reason that these stressors can show up a little bit more is because we're not leaning into the healthy stressors? Like just by missing out on some of these healthy stressors, which we know from the data, A lot of people don't even have these basics.

They're not getting those 150 minutes. They're not having a diverse diet of plant foods, which in itself is a little bit of a, you know, positive stressors on the body. And so all the things that can affect you do affect you and you suffer from them, you know? Any thoughts on that? Absolutely. So we know that healthy stressors are actually what builds our resilience. So to recover your adrenal health, you don't need to like live in a monastery and meditate for, you know, 20 hours a day. That's not what I'm talking about.

I do talk about getting rid of things that are super stressful in your life. So maybe setting up your life so you don't perceive the stressors as much, but also building your resilience to stress, right? And part of that is weight training. So your muscles are going to become stronger. you're not going to be able to lift like 200 pounds deadlift on your first try, but just giving yourself a little bit more opportunities, slightly heavier weights, slightly more reps, just start where you are and just keep building towards your boosting your resilience. That's going to make you stronger, right? Getting rid of doing trauma therapy, that can be a stressor in itself. But once

you overcome that trauma, you're going to be much more free and resilient and liberated, right? There are various lifestyle things we can do. Cold plunges, right? Going to a sauna, those are things that can be very helpful. I also love to utilize adaptogens. So adrenal adaptogens, it's a class of herbs. And I list out a whole bunch of different ones for depending like, you know, maca if you have libido issues and rodeola, if you have a lot of issues with fatigue and anxiety. We go through and we take these adaptogens and they just make us a little bit more resilient and they make the world around us a little less overwhelming and easier to handle. I always say, you know, the people, whenever I'm stressed out and I used to say, like, if my dog was like giving me trouble and

everybody in my life was just like super annoying, that's a big sign that I'm overwhelmed, that something's going on with my adrenals. And adrenal support, a lot of my clients will say when I take adrenal support, all the people in my life are just so much less annoying, right? Like it's just magic what happens. Yeah, it's so true. It's almost like you can't be too, and my heart goes out to people that are really suffering from things like chronic fatigue and other things where just even you mentioned, like just doing the laundry takes so much effort and energy.

And I think that early on in the days of kind of the world of functional medicine and integrative medicine, I saw a lot more of approach. This was probably about like a good 10, 15 years ago where I would see a lot more providers and practitioners being a little too gentle with people in the sense of don't do anything that can stress you out. Don't do any workouts. Don't do any hot, cold therapy, right? Don't do anything too stressful. But then people almost became a little bit like bubble boy bubble girl syndrome. Right? They were afraid to do anything that was there. And I really appreciate the updated protocols and you talking about your journey because it's either, you know, I have this quote in my men's group that I've shared a few times. It's kind of like either you kick your ass or life will kick your ass. And by the way, life is still going to kick your ass. You'll just be better prepared for it. Right. So this all goes back to you talking about you want to in healthy ways that are not overwhelming your system kind of kick your own ass with these.

positive stressors that you've mentioned, and that will help you start to become more resilient, and you'll be able to take on more in life. And I think that's what we really need, rather than living, like, our super sheltered life. Like, you know, the world is what it is, right? And so we have to become stronger and more resilient to thrive in this world rather than just be in survival mode all the time. Yeah, it's so true. Talk about diet when it comes to adrenal and has your views on dietary,

approaches changed over the years. Yeah, let's talk about that for a minute. I guess when I first started with my introduction to functional medicine, I thought like diet could heal everything. And I think diet is such a powerful tool to healing, but at the same time, it needs to be used in synergy. Like a perfect diet is not going to help you if you're in a toxic relationship, if you are not sleeping at night, if you're driving yourself past what you should be driving yourself. So yes, eating a well-balanced and healthy diet for you is going to be a big, big difference. But I don't want people to become, like, overly perfectionist on their diet, right? So there is something that has emerged in the last few years known as orthorexia where people just think, like,

they just need to be so perfect on their diet for all of their symptoms and all of their healing to go away. and they just lose that intuitive connection with what feels really good for my body right now. And so you've heard of people eating a raw foods diet and they're living like in Colorado and it's like freezing outside when all they could use would be like a really warm soup and that would be really nourishing for their bodies. So I do encourage people to tune into themselves and get rid of the foods that are inflammatory for them. Typically it's going to be different for everybody, but typically this is going to to be gluten, dairy soy, grains, things like that, things that spike up our blood sugar.

And I do encourage people to go on a little bit of a journey to figure out what's works best for their bodies. For most people, I'll say it's making sure you have enough protein and fat and eliminating the things that are inflammatory within your body. Yeah, and even the things that are inflammatory, it's good to see the industry evolve a little bit because even within that, you know, dairy is a big topic, right? And so for a long time, people who have, there's a big meta-analysis. We have a newsletter coming out on this.

It came out in 2017. And I found, you know, dairy for most people that don't have GI issues and I don't have, obviously, not lactose and tolerance, but a food allergy towards dairy. So if you don't have a food allergy and you don't have GI symptoms, dairy overall has been found. to be non-inflammatory for people. Obviously, a lot of people that have autoimmune issues have GI issues. And so they notice that they have a lot of dairy that comes from like cows milk especially and their eczema flares up or their Hashimoto's is worse off or they feel more fatigued or they break out.

I actually got my started, I got my start in health because I went to kind of like a youth group summer camp. And here in Los Angeles, I was visiting. And one of the speakers that was there, the entire kind of youth group community that was part of it, we were all from the same background in India. It's the Jane community, J-A-I-N. And we're all already vegetarian because Jains kind of grew up that way and it's a big part of the tradition and stuff. But they invited this woman to come and speak and she was an animal rights kind of activist. And she was telling us all these people who are already vegetarian, how the one food that they would look forward to, which is dairy.

She was mentioning that, hey, you know, dairy industry is filled with tons of. of animal cruelty and, you know, mentioning all these things, which obviously kids are not, like, super focused on. This is like 23 years ago, the year 2000. But at the end of the speech, she was saying and also dairy can be very inflammatory if you have really bad acne. You should try going off a dairy for a little while. And me, who was totally driven by vanity at that day and age, right, it's my summer of going from my senior year of high school, now getting ready to go college. And I'm like, hold on. Somebody is saying that I can get rid of my acne by going off a I'm totally going to try this.

So I did that. I went off a dairy and I noticed within a matter of a month and a half, my skin completely cleared up. So I got on the whole propaganda train. I would tell everybody, dairy is terrible for you. You know, it causes acne, it causes this because I had my own end of one experience. As later on, I got into functional medicine. I saw there's all these different nuances.

What's the type of dairy? Is your gut healed? Is it not healed? Are there ways to make this food better for you? So that's all a bit of a background to talk about this topic of dairy first on food. Your own views have changed on dairy a little bit over the years. Can you describe that? And what's up with cow's milk?

Sorry, no, camel's milk, which you're a fan of now. So that's a lot. But take us from there. Yeah, absolutely. So I feel like, yes, in the early stages of when somebody is super inflamed, we want to get rid of some of the top inflammatory foods. But as we go on, we want to focus on getting. their body to heal a bit more, right? And so we're focusing on utilizing, what I typically do

with people is the sarcomyces ballardi helps to boost their resiliency in the gut, and then we'll look at other kind of protocols we can do to help clear out various pathogens from the gut and seeing what's missing, what we can add. I personally, when I accidentally stumbled upon this, But when I started taking carnitine postpartum and then I started taking alfalfa, which is a galactagogue, right? So it helps women that are breastfeeding. My dairy sensitivity just went away, right? And so it just kind of changed. You know, kids teach you so many things.

Like you think you have it all figured out before you have them and then you have them. And you're like, wow. So my perspective really changed on that because I realized that perhaps it was. was carnitine helps us move fatty acids into our cells. And so, and people that have like H. Pylori exposure or mold exposure, whole host of things can lead to carnitine deficiency. And so being postpartum, pregnancy can lead to deficiencies in that. And so I was like, wow, could it be that I was maybe missing this particular nutrient?

And some of the, there's a lot of potassium in alfalfa, and I utilize electrolytes with potassium in my adrenaline. Transformation Program as well. So having enough potassium on board can help us with digesting dairy. And I was like, wow, was it that I was just chronically dehydrated and missing a certain nutrients? And maybe that was the reason why I wasn't able to tolerate dairy. Was it also source to?

Did previously you try certain sources? Because obviously it's the animal. Then within cow's milk, there's like A2 dairy. There's traditional commercial milk. What version of dairy did you start to include into your diet? And what was the frequency that you were kind of having it, that you noticed it like, oh, okay, you know, this version of dairy that I'm having now is not, you know, is not problematic to me anymore. Yeah. And so when I started on my healing journey, I got off of dairy and gluten within three days.

My acid reflux was gone and my IBS and my bloating and my carpal tunnel on both arms were gone, right? And that was three days. And that was commercial. Like traditional, just like commercial, like you get a gallon of milk at like regular grocery store. Absolutely, like pasteurized and you don't know what those poor cows were eating and all of that. And so the dairy I was eating was organic and also goats cheese and goats milk. Yeah. And that I didn't have it every single day, but I would have it every now and then a few times a week.

And then a few times, you know, I just had it on accident or I'd have a craving for like organic cottage cheese and I would get that. And I was like, wow, this nothing is happening. Like I don't have reflux from this anymore. I don't have carpal tunnel. And it's just been, I think, you know, my goal for people is always to eat the least restrictive diet that they can that really fuels their bodies and makes them feel strong and powerful and calm. And sometimes that can include dairy if your body's properly healed, if you have the right kind

of cofactors and nutrients to metabolize it. And if you don't have infections in your gut, that could be causing you to react to it, right? And so, and if you're eating the right kind, so I think, like you said, there's a lot of nuances to that. For people that are just kind of starting off their journey and that maybe have, like, issues with a lot of dairy camel milk does seem to be a safer alternative. So it doesn't cross-react as much with the proteins that are found in cow's milk. And so you can utilize camel's milk. And it also, it's been very fascinating that there have been children who were able to actually overcome their sensitivities to cows dairy and other food sensitivities by utilizing camel milk. So I think that's fascinating.

I'm always, you know, I'm always evolving. I've been in this natural health for over 10 years now. And people are like, how is this new message? how is it different than what you've talked about previously? I'm like, it's evolved a lot. There's all this new research out there. I've come across different things. I'm learning from my wonderful colleagues like yourself constantly.

And it's just amazing that we can heal much more efficiently and we can heal in a deeper level with the new things that are coming out. Yeah, and it's good to evolve, right? It's a sign that you're paying attention. It's a sign that you're listening. And, you know, it's okay to change your mind on things. I think for everybody, it's okay that if you resonate with something, you know, there's a lot of people on our team, including myself, that we were vegan for a while. And then that worked until it didn't work. And then we started listening to our bodies and we're like, hey, okay, let's go about it in a different way. Right. And, you know, no offense to vegans, I'm sure there are people that were, you know, eating one way and then decided to go to go vegan too. So I think it's okay to change your mind. And I think it's encouraged and we have to celebrate it and we have to try things. And I think this goes, I want to go back to a point. you made, which is within natural health and functional medicine, all these things,

there's so many tools to help people heal. But if you don't create an off ramp that allows people to now start living their normal life and you don't show how that's possible, people think that they have to eat this perfect way forever. And if they eat one little piece of dairy or gluten or whatever, it's going to throw off their life forever. And it's just there are people that are so, so, so sensitive. And unfortunately, it does seem that.

that population is getting bigger and bigger every year. But I'm glad that more people are talking about the other ways to heal the root aspects like gut health. That would allow people to start getting back to at least introducing some of the foods that make it a lot less restrictive so you can stay on this protocol, feel good, but still enjoy stuff every so often that you enjoy enjoying. So are you eating dairy again? Oh, yeah.

I have, I have, uh, um, I have Greek yogurt that is A2 casing Greek yogurt. I'm always testing stuff. So I have A2 casing Greek yogurt. I might have like one serving in the morning and I'll put a little bit of grass-fed way protein. For years, I would react negatively to weigh. So I took it out of my diet completely.

Did a bunch of gut health stuff and other things. But I think also I found a company, shout out to earth-fed muscle, no affiliation with them. they make a truly grass-fed way. And for whatever reason, like one time I went down to this place down the street called Earth Bar. And great place. And they made me a way smoothie.

And I was bloated. I didn't feel good. And we just had blueberries, weigh protein, not other crazy stuff that I don't eat on a regular basis. And my gut felt really off. And I was like, huh, that's interesting. But I made it at home with my sort of like grass-fed way. And I didn't have that bloating reaction.

And I've done this for a few of my friends. that also have reactions to weight. So I think sourcing matters. And I think that that plays a role. So I'm not going crazy on dairy, but I have it now. And for years, I didn't have it at all. And it's become a part of my protein intake. And I feel very satiated when I have dairy.

Now, on the flip side, if I have too much, like this summer, I celebrated my 40th birthday in Italy with a bunch of friends and family, and I was crushing, like, heavy amounts of, like, different cheeses that they had. And I noticed that probably also because I was up upping my alcohol intake too. We were having like wine all the time. When in Rome, right? Went in Rome, exactly. I noticed that I was getting a lot of dryness on my skin and some of the cracks that used

to break out and even dandruff. Like back in the day when I was in high school, I used to have really bad dandruff. And I would be like, what the hell is going on? Like where is this coming from? When I took out the dairy, all of a sudden I noticed that that went away. And obviously there was some sort of gut irritation, skin irritation that I was having from the dairy. And that came back a little bit this past summer when I went overboard. Like when I went like, you know, cheese at every meal, multiple servings, plus I'm having

alcohol as well too. So that's what I know I've went a little bit too far on one side. But if I manage it, I have a certain amount of dairy that I can, you know, handle, then I'm generally okay. And I love it. And I think the message is to keep everything in balance and to make sure you have enough healthy habits and not overdo it on those things, but still live in the modern world. So my husband, you know, my husband Michael, got me a wine advent calendar for Christmas. And I'm like, if there's a challenge, I like accept it, right? And so for the month of December, I had these little bottles of wine. And I would have lots of my parents and my brother came to visit.

I'd have friends over and I'd be like, okay, we're trying this different wine. And then after a certain time, I'm like, okay, this is not happening. Like I put on a few pounds, right? I was like, this was fun. and you know you can recover from it but like you know that you're not supposed to do those things every single day right so you can have these little things and just tuning into your body and knowing when enough is enough that that's really my message for people is that I hope to teach them how to be like in tune with their own bodies so they know how to properly care for their

bodies they know how to feed their bodies they know when to hey you know what this day was a little bit too much maybe I need to take an hour long Epson salt bath maybe I need to give myself some more of this type of nourishment and also be able to live life, right? So, you know, for me, writing books is never relaxing. Like, that's a stressor, right? So I'm usually up. I'm doing, I'm not like out at the beach meditating all day, right? So we know that we can still perform and function in the world and live a full life, but also know how to properly take care of ourselves, right? So true. Anything else diet-wise that you want to talk about that is shifts that you've had, you've mentioned protein and kind of how like, you know, you're really talking

about the importance of prioritizing protein. I don't know if that's anything new or if that's what you were talking about before, but anything else where there's been a little bit of a modification or you're sort of helping people understand how to be not so rigid with diet, any categories that come up, anything about meat or protein or, you know, any other kind of classic categories or people have a lot of confusion. I think people oftentimes, I mean, there's so much. much confusion. And I know, like, we all try to do a beautiful job and teach people about how to take care of themselves. And it's tricky because you're not, you don't know that person's history, background, current health conditions and so on and so forth. And people are like, okay, I should,

I should do this type of diet. I should do this type of diet. So I have a bit of a section that clarifies, like, can you do a keto diet? Like, is this good or bad for you, right? And so I focus on ways to modify the program. If you want to eat keto, this is what you can do. If you are autoimmune paleo, this is how you can modify the program. My big focus is helping people tune into their bodies and being able to eat intuitively and fuel themselves intuitively. The other thing is making sure that you're aligned with the circadian rhythm. And I think that has been a big shift for me.

So knowing when to consume certain things throughout the day, for example, if you're going to have having a little bit more salt and a little bit more electrolytes earlier in the morning is going to be helpful for you to build that healthy cortisol curve versus having that at bedtime. Like if we have too much salt at bedtime, too many electrolytes of the bedtime, we're going to be waking up in the middle of the night and having to go to the bathroom. So that's another thing that's shifted for me is just really being aligned with the circadian rhythm. I used to think I was a night owl, right?

I thought like, oh yeah, I'm a night owl. That's just who I am. And then I realized that just being out of balance where the circadian rhythm is part of what contributes to chronic illness. My son is almost five years old and he's always like, he always wants to talk about nocturnal creatures. And he wants to know like our cat's nocturnal, our bats nocturnal, our owls nocturnal, right? And yes, there's some animals that are nocturnal and that's when they thrive when they're awake and do their hunting at night and all of that and sleep during the day. Humans, we're not nocturnal, right? We don't have these like cat eyes that help us see in the dark.

We're meant to be awake and eating throughout the day and having most of our energy expenditure during the day. And we're meant to sleep at night, right? And so I think that's been a really big shift for me too. We've talked about the protocol largely, and you kind of walked us through. And obviously there's way more details in the book. And people can find that in the show notes and pick up a copy. Big picture.

do you want to talk at all and you can say no, but do you want to talk at all about these different stages like replenish, re-energize, revitalize, which is how you've kind of organized the thinking around it? Is it worthwhile to talk about that? Or do you feel like we kind of covered that throughout? So kind of I'll leave it up to you. Sure. So focusing on replenishing, we're really going over what do we need to add into our lives to give ourselves a little bit more energy, allow ourselves to sleep better at night. And we start off with really replenishing our macronutrients and micronutrients. So we focus on getting a bit more fat and proteins throughout the body to help balance the blood sugar. We focus on switching up some foods. So we're not eating as much inflammatory foods. We're focusing

on really organic power foods that help to fuel us. And we're also focusing on targeted nutrients that help us get replenished. So I talked about B vitamins. vitamins, vitamin C, magnesium, electrolytes. These are some of the things that get really burned during a time when we're under severe stress. So just giving ourselves the proper replenishment is going to be helpful for us to let our body know that it's safe. So when I think about like our cave ancestors, right, so if they were like not eating a lot and starving or eating things that were inflammatory to them, that was probably a sign that there was a famine, right? So they probably didn't want to have lots of energy.

They probably didn't want to have a really good metabolism at that point. And so I want to, and they were probably in survival mode, right? So I want to send a signal that, like, food is plentiful. You have all of these nutrients, so you're super well-nourished. And that just really brings a safety signal and people feel so much more calm and present and clear-headed when they are well-nourished and well-fed, right? Then we talk about re-energizing. And so with the point of re-energizing, that's when I really focus on mitochondrial health

and focused on getting aligned with the circadian rhythm. So part of re-energizing is also making sure we're sleeping well at night. And I talk a lot about the lifestyle changes. I would say about 50% of people that I've worked with and typically, just the lifestyle changes in magnesium can be really, really helpful for them to sleep better at night. But some people have blood sugar swings that will lead them to have nightwakings. And for them, we've added myoanacetal, which helps with blood sugar regulation as well as carnitine, which allows us to have fewer blood sugar swings.

Other people might have levels of ammonia, which is a toxic byproduct of various bacteria in our bodies or poor protein brain. breakdown, and that could lead to significant amounts of brain fog, muscle fatigue, as well as frequent night waking. So we also utilize things like sarcomiasis bolardi, along with the magnesium and carnitine, and that can help shift and eliminate some of the ammonia out of the body. And so people who were previously waking up a lot throughout the night, they're able to sleep through the whole night. And that is really the comprehensive plan of re-energizing.

I don't have people like quit caffeine cold turkey, right? So I used to say, or you want to heal your adrenals? Just give up the coffee right now. So we actually, I actually don't recommend that anymore. I learned the hard way once. I had like the worst withdrawal when I was drinking coffee during producing the thyroid secret documentary series where I was like feeling so awful just trying to quit a cold turkey. So I first re-energize people.

And if I could just interject, people don't like when I interrupt. but also to put in context is that you weren't a coffee drinker growing up. You didn't start until much later on. So when you were kind of putting these protocols together, you probably, like when you wrote your first book and putting these protocols, were you having coffee at that time? I was drinking like, no, I was just tea. Yeah, just tea. So you also didn't know firsthand kind of like when you get off that drug, you know,

how challenging it is to get off. Anyways, I interjected. So you were making the documentary. And I was drinking coffee. I was drinking this thing called a train wreck, which is, um, It's like a shot of bulletproof coffee in a cup of Yerba Mata and some cacao and, you know, coconut milk. And so, I mean, that was what it took to get through. Were you making that at home or were you getting at a coffee shop?

Yeah, yeah. Wow. Yes. Our whole team was drinking them. It was a train wreck, right? So we were just trying to get everything done on tight deadlines. And so I wouldn't recommend going cold turkey off of things like that. What we do in the adrenal transformation program is I first let people get their.

energy levels up and so that they don't need coffee. One big realization I had, and I used to just feel like, okay, you're not sleeping and you're anxious, you drink coffee, there you go, right? Like, you're welcome. But the big realization I have is like caffeine addiction. I mean, yes, it's problematic for the adrenals, but it's oftentimes not the root cause, right? So people become addicted to caffeine and become, you know, dependent on it because of some underlying issue a lot of times, right? And so solving the underlying issues helps people just gradually and naturally need less coffee and less caffeine, right? Yeah, I love it. So that's part of the re-energize. So then you have revitalize. When we focused on revitalizing, I really, I really want people to

to start sending safety signals to their bodies through like the day-to-day activities that they do beyond nutrition, beyond supplements, beyond circadian rhythm and getting good sleep, is figuring out what are the, how do you make your body feel safe? And I always say, like, if we could only just tell our body that it's safe, wouldn't it be wonderful? Well, we can do this. It's just something very simple that people can do is positive affirmations. And I'm not talking about like toxic positivity where, you know, you're, you know,

You're sitting in a, when you're looking at a dumpster fire and you're like, everything is great. Everything's fine. I'm talking about really talking to yourself in a really positive way and being as kind to yourself when maybe you don't have your best day and you don't show up in the best way that you could, the same way you would to like a little child or a small pet that you just love and adore. So I know a lot of times somebody might say, oh my gosh, I woke up late and I'm a little this job interview and I did this bad. You're such a bad person. You're such a failure. And I'm like, would you talk that way to your best friend? Would you talk that way to your child if they did something,

right? No. And so just talking to ourselves in a much more positive way can be helpful. Part of that, you know, the positive affirmations, if you don't know what to say to yourself, just starting with something like I am every day in every way, I'm feeling a little bit better and better and just being able to believe in that message and say that to yourself or I am worthy of healing. These are just little things, little ways to send positive messages to your body and put your body at ease. Like, you know, imagine how a dog feels when you yell at your dog versus when you say, oh, aren't you such a good girl, right? Like, aren't you such a good boy? And you just see their little demeanor light up and they're so much happier. And like, can we just do that for ourselves, please?

Can we just say these nice things for ourselves? Like, you're going to feel so much more calm. And there's a lot of research behind it, Dr. Kristen Neff, out of, I believe she's in Austin. She's in Austin at one of the universities down over there. She's got a bunch of research, and they even use it for anybody that feels like, oh, man, like, is there really anything behind that? She's used this, and she's gathered a lot of literature that they even use in, you know, military programs for people that have suffered from, like, PTSD. And if it feels too airy-fairy to say something else, literally just you putting your hand on your chest and saying, it's all good, right?

There's something about you touching your chest, the same way that like, just a little bit above your heart and just saying like, you know, you can even say your name. Like, Drew, it's all good. It's all okay right now. And there's been times where I've done that to myself where I've gone through like very stressful situations. And it's just that reminder like, hey, look, the breathing slows down. You know, just take a moment here.

Just let your self know. It's all good. You know, there's no bear chasing you in this moment. You know, you're just worried about this deal not going through or whatever it might be. It's all good in this moment. So, yeah, she's great. We've had her on the podcast before. We can link to that episode in the show notes.

Okay, so that's revitalized. We have three others. Rebuild. We actually have two others. Sorry. Rebuild and review. So tell us about rebuild. And then let's go to review.

So for rebuilding, this really focuses on building up. your resilience. So what are the things that you're doing on a day-to-day basis to make yourself stronger? And part of that is going to be overcoming trauma. Part of that might be working on slowing down your breath, taking up practices like meditation, prayer, chanting. Those are all things that can help us become more resilient going through neurofeedback. I have, you know, muscle building exercises. It's not like a workout book, but I go through how do you rebuild your body and whatever states it's in and figuring out what parts of your lifestyle, what parts of your history you may need to adjust. So for example, if you are

somebody that is super fatigued all day and you have, you know, what I called flatlined adrenals where you're just not producing enough cortisol throughout the day, then doing things like aerobic exercise is actually going to be causing you to break down more of your body versus is doing things like lifting weights or yoga, that's going to be something that can help your body build back up. And then when people who have high levels of cortisol, they're the ones that will benefit more from aerobic exercise. And we go through various things like that to help you tailor the rebuild process to your own body. So if you know you have a history of trauma, giving you some tools and resources to work with. So you had a bunch of people go through this

exact protocol through a beta. How many people total? Did you take the... Over three thousand. Yeah, what were some of the things. Yeah, that's great. Seven times, seven different groups. That's huge. What were some of the things that they saw? Because I think you guys measured through a survey, like reduction in symptoms and a bunch of stuff. So just top line, what were some of the things that people saw and some of the trends you saw from these seven different beta groups?

So I used to work in public health and outcomes research was kind of my jam. And so looking at from a public health perspective when you start an intervention, what happens? Does this help a person? Does the person not feel good? Does the person feel worse with it? And so I created this program initially with a very small group over about 100 people that went through it. And then I would go back into it and look at the outcomes. And then I thought about how do we improve this metric, right?

So do we need to add more exercises for reducing anxiety for brain fog, so on and so forth? Do we need to take things out that people are just not finding to be useful? So that's my process when I go through my programs. And then typically when the programs have been tested with seven groups or so, then that's when I'll write a book about it. I'm like, oh, this is really working, right? And so 92% of people reported a reduction in brain fog. Close to 85% of people had less fatigue, less trouble waking up in the morning. People were sleeping better.

So over 80% was sleeping better. better libido, less pain in their bodies, less anxiety, less mood swings. So those are some of the top symptoms that people really, really respond to. And the thing that's really phenomenal about this is that it happens usually by week three of the program. So during week one, I would have people asking me questions like, oh my gosh, I feel so terrible. This is something I was struggling with forever. Am I ever going to get better? And then by week three, they would be like, hey, you know, my levito's back. This is great. You know, this, this, you know, my, my spouse is loving this. Or they'd say, oh, my goodness, I feel energized. I was like running up and down my stairs and cleaning my whole house. Like, I, I've been like a couch potato for so long. And it's just phenomenal what happens. And something about week three when they start incorporating some of these strategies is when things just really turn the table for people. That's powerful. Well, I'm excited that, you know,

sometimes people who are in the health space and are healers like yourself, you got to kind of break down and have your own journey and then fix yourself and then everybody else gets to benefit. And I'm sorry you went through that so many times, but I'm also happy that you turn that into your life's mission and work because there's so many people that I know personally, including my mother-in-law, who's a big fan of your work too, that have benefited from your work. As we're closing down here, Isabella, anything else that you want to get a chance to get into or for the person that's out there who's listening who's like has that belief that they're stuck on, which is like, I've just not felt good or I don't have energy and that's just who the person I am. Is there any lasting messages that you want to leave that person with? I just want to say no matter how long you've been struggling and if you've had a history of a stressful situation, if you're feeling fatigue, brain fogged like you have mood swings and trouble sleeping and pain,

in your body, just take the time to invest in yourself and give yourself some time and space and focus on your healing because things can turn around really, really quickly if you start sending the right kind of safety signals to your body. So the book is out there. It's available for pre-order. Adrenal transformation protocol. It's coming out April 18th, but again, everybody can pre-order. Any fun things you're doing with bonuses or any other guides or copies or things that people get

get if they pre-order now? I have a guide that I created for people because we're in pre-order mode. So it's Thyroid Pharmacist.com slash ABC. And this is a guide that goes over kind of the fundamentals of adrenal. So I talk about the ABCs, which is adrenal adaptogens, B vitamins, vitamin C, as well as the magnesium, and just how to start replenishing your body. And that can be a really, really big game changer. So that's going to be available on my website for people.

then we're going to have a whole bunch of various bonuses, including something that I had in the program, but, you know, books have word limits. And so I had a whole, whole entire seven different guides on insomnia, brain fog, fatigue, libido issues, anxiety. And I have, I have these guides on these specific symptom solutions, and that's going to be available to people as well. Beautiful. Well, we'll put that all in the show notes. Dr. Isabella Wentz, it's a pleasure to have you back on the podcast. Thank you for sharing all your knowledge with our audience and super appreciate you as a friend and an educator.

Thank you so much for having me. It's truly been an honor. Really appreciate you.